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My take on a scene that probably should have been in My Little Pony: A New Generation. Pipp Petals and Zipp Storm finally hash things out before going on to Bridlewood.

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Comments ( 31 )

This just in: Operation "Make Pipp Petals Lovable" is a smashing success!!! :pinkiehappy:

Seriously, though, I feel like Pipp's insecurity and Zipp's cockiness were not emphasized enough in the movie. If this scene were in the movie, it would have been a very meaningful lesson for children and adults alike. Just because you're internet famous doesn't mean you have to be a superficial person with plastic emotions.

The writing style is good too, it's hard to pull off a story with mostly dialog. I can just picture the two of them talking in the night like a TV drama.

Believe me, I know about tough spots in stories.

And this was great, and yeah, it would have been nice to have a scene like this in the movie, the two sisters talking. You did a really good job here. :twilightsmile:

11016562

Thank you! Zipp is actually my favorite of the G5 cast and Pipp, well, isn't let's just say. But I do think it's unfortunate she really wasn't given a chance to shine and win people over, hence why most people seem to place her near or at the bottom of the G5 rankings. Plus we didn't really get a scene with the sisters hashing things out or giving Pipp a motivation to want to take part in the group.

For what it's worth, from my take, I wouldn't say Zipp is 'cocky' so much as she is certain about how she thinks things should be. She is reportedly very scientific and technical-minded and as the movie showed, very frustrated with the lies her family perpetuated. This makes her very driven and focused on the truth, which is good, but maybe isn't as aware of the importance of addressing feelings as she might be.

Pipp is the opposite. She knows how to get ponies to like her, knows how important feelings and catering to the feelings of others is--but is so fixated on that side of things that she misses the bigger picture.

Zipp did all the right things for all the right reasons. But her blase responses to Pipp's not unjustified anger and her overall lack of concern over stuff like the arrest warrant out for them (or responding to her mom's arrest with nothing more than a gasp) showed that she might have difficulties adjusting to or taking into account the wants or feelings of other ponies. I.e. If X is the problem, then Y is the solution, so we'll do Y, feelings be damned. It makes for a good scientist or a good, honest person, but not necessarily the most sensitive of ponies.

Pipp is the opposite. She's very in tune with other ponies' feelings which is why she can connect with them and get them to like her ... it's just that her motivation for doing so is pretty limited, shaped by her mom and the society she grew up in which was pretty dang shallow. Her reactions to all the things that happen to her are pretty understandable...it's just that she's more focused on her wants/needs than on the bigger picture, which is where Zipp comes in.

So my thought was that this was sort of an ongoing issue with them. Zipp undoubtedly has the better sense of priorities, but her go-it-alone, this-IS-the-only-answer regardless of feelings approach can make her be seen as arrogant, while Pipp undoubtedly cares about what other ponies think and feel---but cares too much to want to go against that, even when it's what's necessary to do, which makes her seem shallow. I don't think either description is really accurate or fair, but it's understandable why this perception can arise.

That's my take, at any rate.

11016571
Thank you!

Trust me, I know what you mean--but you're nowhere as far behind as I am.

Hey you!
This is amazing! I love the way you write and actually doing Pipp and Zipp some justice with their personality. I think you nailed them. Sad that some parts are cut out from the movie due to time limit.

11016627
Thank you!

I don't know for certain that there was a scene with the two that was cut or anything ... but it really feels like there was, or at least that there should have been one.

Oh this is really nice! I love a good PippFic and you really got their personalities down and I agree that this definitely feels like it should be part of the movie. Grats!

Dan

Zipp is best new Princess. She understands truth and working for the good of all. I want to send her a copy of Ta eis heauton.

I see the difference between Zipp and Pipp as something like his: Zipp is a being who understands logic, while Pipp is a being who understands pure emotion.

Zipp is a being of logic, and that's why she hates having to lie about her family's situation: because to someone who seeks truth, lies are poison.

But Pipp is different, in that she understands emotion: she succeeds because she knows what the public wants and knows how to deliver. So yes, she lives a lie, but it is a lie that is more in line with what the denizens of Zephyr Heights want.

I consider myself to be something of a being of logic: I seek the truth that isn't blinded by emotion, folly, propaganda, and outright lies. And I seek to spread it because I feel it will improve society. But the sad truth is this: emotions can win over truth in many circumstances. Just because I tell the truth doesn't mean I will win or that people will accept what I say.

In one example, not get political, I asked a relative of mine, who believes the 2020 election was stolen, to give me an unbiased source that proves this. He proceeded to...go apeshit on me yelling. So yes, telling the truth isn't always proper, since not everyone has the ability to put aside their feelings.

Pipp understands this very well: yes, she has built a career on lies, but ultimately that's what has brought her and her family enormous wealth and fame. She understands, unlike Zipp, that PR and good marketing, mixed in with some falsehood, was a good money maker.

The problem here is that emotion and logic were applied in terrible ways.

The rulers of Zephyr Heights preferred fake emotion and built a myth that they could fly, rather than trying to solve the magic problem, and were trapped in a web of lies.

Zipp tried to undo those lies with logic but did so in a very hamfisted way that nearly destroyed her family's well-being.

Thank you for making this story; because I really felt this was an elephant in the room that needed addressing.

Dan

11016735
If thou findest in human life anything better than justice, truth, temperance, fortitude, and, in a word, anything better than thy own mind's self-satisfaction in the things which it enables thee to do according to right reason, and in the condition that is assigned to thee without thy own choice; if, I say, thou seest anything better than this, turn to it with all thy soul, and enjoy that which thou hast found to be the best.

11016744

Truth is good.

But today, and especially in our social media-addled society, people don't want to listen to the truth, and me saying truth can lead to retaliation.

That's why we call it "post-truth" politics. Our former President succeeds because he plays to emotion and not reason.

11016735

As I said in reply to another comment, while I think Zipp is a supporter of the truth (scientific truth, historical truth, personal truth, etc.) and using that as the foundation for her decisions, and Pipp much more about connecting with ponies emotionally, the way you framed it feels a touch overstated. Truth and logic are not the same thing, nor are Zipp and Pipp Spock and McCoy, with Zipp totally blind or oblivious to the role of emotion or Pipp a volatile mess. There is something to the dichotomy between the two, but I'd be wary of overstating the case.

11016769

I never said the two are defined by any specific ideal. Since you are such a good writer, you've given them enough emotional depth to not be simple caricatures.

I'm saying their predicament is largely because they didn't apply their ideals in a strategic manner.

“Those Wonderbolts you went on about? Would they have hung a teammate out to dry?”

Zipp closed her eyes. She swallowed a lump in her throat that threatened to choke her. When she spoke, her voice was hollow. “My friends needed that crystal.”

“A-and I-I needed my big sister…” Pipp sniffled, tears trickling down her muzzle.

Straight through the heart. What a nice and compelling dialogue between these two. I wholly agree it should've been in the movie!

11016906
Thank you! Though I did feel mildly hypocritical writing that first line since ... yeah, the Wonderbolts have totally hung out a teammate. Multiple times, in fact. Buuuut given how long ago it was, I didn't think that would be common knowledge. And sometimes the idea of a thing can be better or more inspiring than the actual reality.

But yeah, I really wanted to amp up the feels with these two since there wasn't much in the movie.

11016769

As I said in reply to another comment, while I think Zipp is a supporter of the truth (scientific truth, historical truth, personal truth, etc.)

So Zipp is Captain Picard?

i.pinimg.com/736x/56/35/eb/5635ebb21cace8e2c0cee7b5582e2542--star-trek-jean.jpg

11016591
Interesting take on Zipp and Pipp's characterizations — as was the fic itself. It's definitely something I would've like to see more of in the film, that's for sure. Nicely done!

On a related note: I've mentioned this gut feeling once or twice elsewhere, but I definitely got the sense that the screenwriters were afraid of mishandling Pipp's quote-unquote "influencer" status right out of the gate and getting the entire film — and, by proxy, G5's entire launch — castigated as "cringe" in the process. Now that they've tested the waters, here's hoping they'll have the confidence and mental wherewithal to give her some good development in the series itself.

Also, was this story meant to be marked as incomplete? EDIT: It's been fixed.

Ri2

“Those Wonderbolts you went on about? Would they have hung a teammate out to dry?”

Yes. Absolutely. Just ask Soarin'. And Rainbow, more than once.

11017363

Trust me, I KNOW. There are, literally, no characters in the series that piss me off more than the Wonderbolts, and I'm including the actual, official villains in that.

Buuuut given just much raw emotion we saw in Zipp's face when she looked at that old poster, I couldn't ignore how much they, or at least the idea of them, clearly meant to her. Plus the series is (seemingly) set far enough in the future that the ugly realities of the Wonderbolts would be forgotten in favor of the more optimistic legend.

This was a wonderfull conversation. They both explained their problems, used logical arguments and while they stood still to their views, neither of them accused of other being (not completly) wrong and then talked things out. And finished with a sisterly banter. Because every sibling conversation had to a little bit of that.:rainbowlaugh: This was great. Show a lot of depth of the characters, making them likeable. Though, in the defence of Zipp, she might have known that telling everyone the truth would bring disaster, but the truth went out she just had to keep going. Their plan was to just steal the crown, everything else was an accident. But I'm not saying you're wrong, just speculating. We really are just getting to know The Mane Group.

The mention of the place being calming was great touch. The Devil is in the details.

And this might out of the topic, but I think Zephyr Heights' Royals might actually be quite competent at acually running their City/Country, with the lie notwithstanding. I mean, the City itself is pretty clean and everyone seems happy. Also the Guards were quick to defend Haven when she was insulted by Alphabittle. Plus, Haven managed to escape from the dungeon, pretty fast, so she must know what she's doing. Little details, that might mean something

11017543

Thank you!

And yeah, that's a thing that's worth noting. People are already speaking of Zipp and her dislike of the Big Lie as making her comparable to Applejack. But while later seasons (inanely) tried to portray Applejack as someone who never ever lied (which was just untrue), Zipp was okay with being sneaky and exercising good judgement. She didn't just blurt out "My mom's lying to everyone, we can't fly!" or something dumb like that.

I don't believe Zipp did anything wrong per se, just that she might not have shown sufficient sensitivity in dealing with Pipp's pretty understandable ire over how everything shook out. Zipp, I think, was so focused on the big picture that she didn't take the time to say a few words that might've unruffled Pipp's feathers and gotten her onboard.

The moment of leaving Pipp hanging was clearly an emotional one, and something done in the heat of the moment. There are good, valid reasons for Zipp to continue on with Sunny and Izzy and not stop to help that can be made--but that's not the focus of this story. The reality is that regardless of whatever Zipp's reasons were, and even regardless of whether they it was the right call to make or no, it did have the affect of hurting Pipp's feelings, which felt like that really needed to be addressed in the movie at some point, but never was.

This is quite a nice story and the issue between Zipp and Pipp needed to be adressed. I also note that it's stated that the lie about the royals being able to fly is generations old which I've seen multiple times. I am unsure where that idea came from since it's never stated in the movie.

11018373
Thanks!

And no, it's never said when the pegasi royal family started the lie, but this doesn't feel like something just cooked up by Queen Haven. How else would it work? That for however many years and generations, no pegasi flew at all and then all of a sudden Queen Haven said "Oh yeah, by the way, the royal family can still fly and has been able to fly all along but we just didn't feel like mentioning it until now" ? I can't see how anyone could possibly buy that. The lie had to have started at least some time ago, maybe not the instant the pegasi lost their ability to fly, but at least far enough back that no pony would think twice about it by the time the movie starts.

Thank you for this story. We really needed this in the movie, not that they just glanced over it, but it really was a big deal. Leaving your sister hanging like that, it really was the big sore thumb in the whole Zipp likability for me.

It was a good and fair conversation, with them both having good and bad points, and it felt real. Really good work. :eeyup:

11019566
Thank you!

For me, it wasn't so much the act of leaving Pipp behind that I felt needed resolution as Zipp's reaction when Pipp caught back up with them. There's arguments that could be made about the idea that Zipp leaving was the right choice: that if she stayed she could've been detained or the crystal (the entire reason that mess came about) could've been confiscated, etc. Plus the fact that it was a split-second decision and all.

But even if (and I freely admit this point is debatable) that leaving Pipp behind was the correct move for Zipp to make in that situation--her nonchalance in the face of Pipp's ire when she next saw her was another matter.

Pipp Petals: "Somepony seriously needs to explain why this thing was so important that you had to ruin my whole show over it!"
Zipp Storm: "Trust me. It was."

And she wasn't even looking or sounding apologetic over it, just smiling--not at Pipp's situation, certainly, but so relieved at getting the crystal back that she didn't seem to take Pipp's feelings into account. Ditto at the very next exchange right after this, when the arrest warrants are put out for them.

Pipp Petals: What?! "This is not happening! This is so not happening!"
Zipp Storm: "Pipp! Forget about all that. We think we can bring back magic, but we need that crystal."

This really doesn't do anything to address Pipp's emotional state or her concerns. Zipp's so focused on the task at hoof that she let all that slide when she really shouldn't have.

Let me be clear: none of this makes Zipp unlikable and it's perfectly okay to show that the characters are not perfect. Being motivated, driven, and focused at the task in-hand are all find qualities. But occasionally they need reminding about things they overlook in the heat of the moment, things that may not seem as immediate in the necessity to deal with, but are still important nonetheless.

Likewise, Pipp needed a scene to explain how she went from grumbling about her ruined show being all their fault and arguing with Zipp to being on board with their quest. All we got was Pipp liking Izzy's color for her, then taking part in a group song, and helping Sunny with a tip for a dance contest. That was it. There was no reflection on the way she was back in Zephyr Heights, showing any change of attitude towards her family's deception or why things needed to change. That's a bigger omission so I tried to tackle both at once.

Indeed it seems like Zipp's main issue is her having a very hard time understanding what motivates others. Her goals are noble, but she's... self-centered about it. She doesn't mind as much leaving that old princess life behind, because she didn't like it, and she doesn't undestand why Pipp would be upset about the same because she, Zipp, isn't.

The Wonderbolts story shows it as well. To Zipp, it's a truly motivational tale... but she seems to believe that because she found it motivational, everyone else should as well, and when Pipp asks her whether they, the Wonderbolts, would've left a comrade behind, she can't actually counter that point. It didn't fit into her personal experiences or emotional state, so she failed to notice the contradiction.

And I would argue, this is something she should work on, because I know folks who mean well but thoughtlessly pushed other people away their whole lives. Fortunately, her new group of friends appears rather robust.

11020413
I don't think it's self-centeredness or her not understanding what motivates others. I see more as possessing a certain myopia that comes when you've fixated on a goal for so long that when you finally have a chance to realize it you aren't always as aware of other things, like how Pipp feels about the fallout of that goal and what it cost her personally.

That said, Pipp didn't exactly wow us with her empathy towards the regular pegasi with her breezy (no pun intended) comment about how of course they'd help ordinary pegasi if they could. Given that degree of flippancy, which I imagine is not a new thing, I can well imagine Zipp getting used to tuning out Pipp's more self-involved statements and comments---which left her less sympathetic to Pipp than she should have been now that Pipp actually has a pretty justifiable reason for being upset, which Zipp didn't seem to acknowledge.

Congrats, reading this made me forget part-way through that I'm reading a fanfic and not a cut portion of the script

We needed something like this in the movie, Zipp and especially Pipp got practically nothing the Zephyr Heights part of the film was done. :eeyup:

Yeah, the film definitely needed something like this. (On the other hand, if it had had such a thing, you likely wouldn't have written this, so...)

I'm always a sucker for some good Royal Pegasisters content, and this is no exception, good stuff.

Regarding some of the conversation happening in the comments, i really like the concept of zipp being very focused on Truth, and pipp being very focused on Emotions/connection. They bith have a blind spot for the other's strength, which can make some interesting stories.

In myers-briggs terms, it feels very much like Fi (introverted feeling, basically about My feelings, values, goals, etc.) Vs Fe (extroverted feeling, basically about Other's feelings, connecting with others, keeping the peace). And as someone who uses Fi and enjoys science, i really relate to Zipp

“Yeah, wow. Somehow that must’ve slipped my mind,” Zipp drawled. “Thanks for the reminder.”

Now i cant help but try to add a southern drawl to Zipp's voice, lol

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