Chapter One
The wind whipped through Celestia’s mane as she flew to the furthest corners of her realm, past the hills and over acres of apple trees. The leaves rustled softly as she flew overhead, juicy red apples bobbing in the breeze. They would be ripe for harvesting soon, but she doubted they would ever be picked. None of the ponies in the village nearby dared to venture this far, and Applejack wasn’t quite ready to care for them yet. The crop would be left to rot this year.
She shook her head and flew on. A shame, really.
Webs of sparkling magic filled the sunset-orange skies as she neared the castle, ready to ensnare any pegasus who got too curious and careless. Celestia broke through them with ease, snapping the spells without slowing down. They were there to keep most ponies out, but Celestia was here on business, and she wasn’t most ponies. There were other measures in place to keep out the truly unwelcome guests, and she didn’t qualify as one of those—not yet, at any rate.
The castle was a stony gray, almost black against the setting sun. It was slightly smaller than Canterlot Castle, and much blockier, but it had been designed for safety more than beauty, surrounded on all sides by thick walls and tall, dark towers. Imposing, but nothing else. The magical defenses, though...
“Where, oh where,” Celestia muttered to herself, looking for the forcefield she knew to be there. It took a few moments to spot it—a faint, almost invisible shimmer hanging in the air—and a minute or two more to push past it, even with all the proper counterspells. She stopped for a brief rest on the castle’s balcony, just long enough to catch her breath.
It hadn’t been too much trouble on the whole, but every break-and-entry took a little more effort, and she wasn’t getting any younger. Immortality notwithstanding.
When she’d finished resting, she opened the balcony doors and stepped into the castle proper. She’d landed at one of Rainbow Dash’s rooms, if memory served, and the mess that greeted her inside could only confirm that. Graying Wonderbolts posters covered the walls, marking piles of Wonderbolt action figures, baseball caps, and other merchandise. A single bookshelf stood in the corner, lined with those ‘Daring Do’ novels Rainbow Dash had always enjoyed so much, waiting for the day when she’d read them again.
Celestia nudged a few piles of junk off to the side and made her way quickly to the door. The nursery wasn’t all that far away now, and the sooner she could get there, the better.
The halls were dark but clean, as she’d come to expect. The door to Rainbow Dash’s room shut behind her as soon as she was clear of it, and an enchanted broom soon arrived to sweep up the dust she left behind. The corners of her mouth curved just slightly upward as she walked on, the broom swishing in time with her hoofsteps. Neat and efficient, as always.
Some things never changed.
The door to the nursery was made of plain walnut, marred only by a few scribbled doodles and scratches—the marks of childhood. Celestia opened it as quietly as she could, hardly bothering to break the spells on it. She knew she had to be tripping a dozen-odd magical tripwires and alarms in doing so, but it was as good a way as any of grabbing Twilight’s attention, and she didn’t want to wake the babies.
She crept softly through the darkness of the nursery, stepping lightly past scattered party hats and Mare Do Well action figures. She stopped at one of the cribs—Pinkie Pie’s, she supposed—and smiled down on the sleeping filly tucked beneath the covers. “Don’t worry,” she said, running her hoof through Pinkie’s little pink mane. “I’m here now.”
“And what are you doing here?” a voice whispered from behind her.
“I’m only visiting, Twilight,” said Celestia, turning to face her former student. It was hard to see much of Twilight in the dimness of the nursery, but she could tell that Twilight was tall enough now to stare her straight in the eye. So much had changed in so little time. It wasn’t all that long ago that Twilight had looked up to her.
In a manner of speaking, of course.
“The Summer Sun Celebration is coming up soon,” she said, “and you didn’t respond to any of my invitations, so naturally I thought I’d come down to check up on things.”
“I don’t respond to any of your letters anymore,” said Twilight. “I thought I’d made that clear last time.”
“Hence my concern.”
Twilight paused. “Well, as you can see, we’re fine,” she said curtly. “Now back off from her.”
“If you insist,” said Celestia, stepping well away from Pinkie’s crib. It wasn’t worth arguing over. Not that she was strong enough to argue with Twilight in the first place. “I was only—”
“Doing what you always do when you break in,” Twilight finished.
“Well—”
Twilight’s horn began to glow and the air around her hummed softly. Celestia gasped, the breath forced from her chest by the pressure of Twilight’s power. She used a little of her own magic to push it back, just enough to keep herself breathing. It was impressive, in a way. Twilight hadn’t been nearly this strong the last time she had tried to intimidate her.
She always had been a quick study.
“I think you should go now, Celestia,” said Twilight. “Don’t you?”
“I haven’t spoken with your friends yet,” said Celestia. She grinned weakly. “I’d like to hear what they think first.”
“They don’t want you here either,” said Twilight, her horn glowing steadily brighter, the hum pitching up to a dangerous whine. “I told you that last time. They told you that last time.”
“I’d—” Celestia groaned as the pressure increased. She could feel her legs shaking, her knees threatening to buckle out from under her. Beside her, Pinkie Pie whimpered and squirmed. “I’d like to hear it again.”
“For the last time, no!” Twilight hissed. Sparks of magic crackled around her and the room itself started to shake. “You aren’t taking them from me. They don’t want you to. I won’t let you. There’s nothing you can say that will change any of that, so go away already!” She stomped her hooves on the floor. “Now!”
Suddenly, Pinkie Pie burst into tears, wailing as loudly as her little lungs could manage.
“Eep!” Twilight gasped as the other foals also started to cry. “Now look what you’ve done!” The lights switched on and Twilight darted to Pinkie’s crib. “There, there,” she said, taking the little foal up in her hooves. “No, don’t cry, Pinkie. I’m sorry. I wasn’t thinking.”
“Weren’t you?” Celestia muttered.
Twilight ignored that little remark, her attention focused entirely on the wailing Pinkie. “Look!” she said, levitating a polka-dotted party hat up from the floor. “A party hat! You like these, don’t you, Pinkie?” She put the party hat on and dangled another—rainbow-striped—up in front of Pinkie’s face. “You can’t have a party without them, right?”
For a moment, Pinkie stopped crying, her gaze transfixed on the rainbow party hat. “There we go,” said Twilight, smiling. She put it carefully on Pinkie’s head, making sure it didn’t catch on her bouncy pink mane. “It’s party time. We’ll figure out what we’re celebrating after I’ve cleared everything else up, okay?”
Pinkie, for her part, simply giggled, and made no further protests as Twilight lowered her back into her crib. “One down,” Twilight sighed. She looked back to Celestia. “And I hope you’re happy with all this.”
Celestia shrugged. If only she were.
She waited patiently as Twilight ran from crib to crib, soothing each of her friends with their favorite toys. A glittering blue sapphire for Rarity, a shiny red apple for Applejack. Soon enough the room was calm and quiet, save for some idle babbling from Pinkie Pie.
“Tia?” she gurgled, looking up at Celestia with wide-open eyes.
“Yes, Pinkie,” said Celestia, smiling down on her. “You may call me that, if you’d like.”
“Party?” She pointed to the rainbow party hat on her head. “Hat?”
“Well, I suppose I could party too,” said Celestia, picking up a silver-and-gold foil party hat. She looked to Twilight, on the other side of the room. “That is, if your caretaker will allow me to stay.”
“Which I wouldn’t count on,” said Twilight, setting Rainbow Dash back in her crib. “She’s not invited, Pinkie. She’ll be leaving in a few minutes.”
“But... But...” Pinkie’s face screwed up, her eyes starting to water. “Party!”
Twilight grimaced. “Okay, okay!” she said, rushing over to comfort Pinkie. “Don’t cry, don’t cry! Of course she’s invited too. Everypony’s welcome at a Pinkie Pie party.” She glared again at Celestia. “For now, anyway.”
“For now,” Celestia agreed. “Why don’t you show me around, Twilight? Before the party, that is. It’s been such a long time since we’ve talked, you know.” A long time indeed, she realized. How long had it been, exactly, since they’d last spoken without threatening each other? Decades, certainly. Was it already pressing on centuries? “And, of course,” she said quietly, “It will give your friends some time to rest.”
“Well...” Twilight looked to Pinkie, who only nodded in approval. She sighed. “Well, fine. If it’ll keep you from bothering them.”
Celestia stood by the nursery’s door as Twilight kissed each of her friends a quick goodbye. “Don’t do anything too crazy while I’m gone, all right?” she whispered as she passed by Pinkie’s crib. “And don’t put that sapphire in your mouth, Rarity,” she said, chuckling quietly as she passed by Rarity’s crib. “That used to be part of your favorite dress, remember?”
When she’d said all her goodbyes, Twilight dimmed the lights and met Celestia at the door. “Come on, then,” she said, shutting it gently behind her. “Let’s get this over with. I’m running out of patience.”
Celestia smiled. “Didn’t you tell me once that you’d always have time in your schedule for me?” she asked—only half-joking.
Twilight frowned. “Didn’t you tell me you’d always support me, no matter which path I chose?”
“Ah,” said Celestia, her smile evaporating. “I suppose I did.”
“Things change,” said Twilight, beckoning her along. “Everything does, given enough time. Unless you’re a princess, that is.”
“Unless you’re a princess,” Celestia agreed quietly. “And sometimes not even then.”
She followed Twilight down the corridors in silence, looking occasionally off to the sides. She’d never paid much attention to it before, whenever she’d broken in, but the castle was filled with various souvenirs, keepsakes, and portraits. Memories, she supposed, of all the years Twilight had spent with her friends. Rainbow Dash’s old flying awards. Pinkie’s ancient macaroni art. A faded pink scarf, woven with butterfly patterns. Years and years of friendship were kept on these walls.
Far, far too many years.
Twilight broke the quiet first. “I don’t know why you keep trying,” she said as they walked down the stairs to the second floor. “You have to know you can’t take them from me. Not anymore.”
Celestia raised an eyebrow. “Can’t I?”
“You can’t,” said Twilight simply.
“No,” Celestia admitted. “I can’t.” Maybe if Luna had been there, it would have been possible to fight Twilight evenly, but—well, perhaps not even then. “I should have put a stop to this a long time ago. You’ve improved much faster than I could ever have guessed.”
“I had a great teacher,” said Twilight, giving her a rueful little smile. “And I still appreciate everything she did for me. I just don’t understand why she hates me now.”
“I expect she’s just disappointed,” said Celestia. “You showed so much promise.”
“Showed?” Twilight asked. “Past-tense?”
“There was a time when I would have given anything to see you fulfill that promise,” Celestia sighed. “But you do have to learn to let go.”
She stopped to look at a picture of Applejack, aged and elderly, hanging on the wall. Beside it hung a picture of baby Applejack, cuddling her very first apple—a granny smith, if she wasn’t mistaken.
“She still grows the best apples,” said Twilight proudly. “I’m going to teach her how to handle the orchard, when she’s ready for it. She’ll be a pro again in no time, and once we start harvesting, I can teach Pinkie about apple pies again, and—”
Celestia nodded absently, listening vaguely to what Twilight was saying while she studied the two Applejacks on the wall. They both had Applejack’s bright green eyes, sparkling with honesty and good-natured cheer... and in both pictures, those eyes seemed very tired.
She couldn’t help but wonder if it was the same Applejack staring out through them.
“And maybe once we’ve done that, we could set up another Iron Pony competition between her and Rainbow Dash,” Twilight continued. “We haven’t had one of those in a while. It’d be a great jump start on rediscovering their friendship, and I could even—”
“Do you ever think about what you’re doing to her?” Celestia interrupted, reaching up to take the baby Applejack’s picture off the wall. Almost immediately, a sharp, stinging sensation bit into her hoof and she was forced to draw it back. Even the pictures were protected by magic, it seemed.
“What I’m doing for her,” Twilight corrected, without missing a beat. “For all of them. They’re happy. I’m happy. The only one who isn’t happy about this is you. And don’t you ever forget that.”
An enchanted broom passed them by, swishing across the floor as if they weren’t there. Twilight coughed. “They still hate you, you know. For trying to take them away.”
“Pinkie seemed rather happy to see me this time,” said Celestia, nursing her injured hoof.
“Pinkie’s still too young to know better,” said Twilight. She shrugged. “She’ll grow out of it. She always does.”
“Mmm.” Celestia remembered her last visit only too well. How desperately they’d all kicked and screamed. How they had yelled for Twilight to save them from the awful Princess Celestia, come to take them away from their very best friend. Where had they heard that about her, she wondered? “Well, perhaps someday she won’t.”
Twilight snorted. “Is that what you’re waiting for?”
“In a manner of speaking,” said Celestia. She turned away from the pictures of Applejack, both old and young. “I suppose I’m still hoping you’ll change your mind. It’s not too late to stop.”
“There’s no reason to,” said Twilight, following close behind. “You keep treating this like it’s something wrong. Like it’s evil.” She stomped the floor, stones cracking from the force. “I hate that.”
“Not evil, per se,” said Celestia, careful not to upset Twilight too quickly. That, perhaps, would have been unwise. “But aging is natural. Age spells aren’t. You didn’t have to cast them on your friends.”
“No,” said Twilight darkly. “I didn’t. But you taught me to never give up on them.”
“I suppose it’s my fault, then, if that’s all you learned.” Celestia sighed. “I’d hoped I was a better teacher than that.”
They entered into what could have passed for a throne room, if it weren’t lined with bookshelves and occupied by a large bed. Twilight’s, Celestia supposed. She stopped by another ornament, kept beside the bed on a nightstand: a purple dragon’s scale. “Did Spike ever approve of your little foray into age magic?”
“He was asleep before he ever found out.” Twilight took a breath on the scale, and polished it until it shined. She smiled fondly at her reflection in it. “He’ll wake up someday, though, when the hibernation cycle ends. And when he does, I’m sure he’ll side with me on this one.”
“Would Fluttershy?”
Silence.
“Hm?” said Twilight, turning slowly toward Celestia. She set the scale down on the nightstand. “What was that?”
“Would Fluttershy agree with you?” Celestia repeated.
The air began to spark and crackle again with that familiar magic charge. “What do you think you know,” Twilight whispered, “about Fluttershy?”
“I’m only asking,” said Celestia calmly. “Haven’t you thought about what Fluttershy would have wa—”
“Don’t ask about things you don’t know anything about!” Twilight snapped, her horn glowing bright. The entire room began to shake. Books fell from their shelves and the floor itself rumbled beneath Celestia’s hooves. “You weren’t there when she died. You didn’t see...”
“No, I didn’t,” said Celestia. “I’m sorry, Twilight, I didn’t mean—”
“She was so tiny...” Twilight whimpered. “I could see her ribs through her skin. She couldn’t do things for herself anymore. Almost like a baby... It wasn’t fair. She was so old.”
“Twilight—”
“I couldn’t just let that happen to the rest of them. Even if they didn’t want—even if they couldn’t see—they came around, eventually. It only took a few tries. They were happier starting over. We were happier starting over...”
“Twilight, please, listen to yourse—”
“You be quiet!” Twilight shouted, and the room shook again. “You aren’t going to take them away from me!” The shelves themselves tumbled over and the floor cracked. The castle would fall, if this kept up. “What do you know about friendship, anyway? How many friends have you ever had?”
“How many?” Celestia repeated quietly. She took a step forward, struggling to keep herself steady in the face of so much power. “I’ve had many friends in my time, Twilight. I’ve watched so many of them succumb to age. More than I’ve ever spoken of, and more than you’ve ever known.” Another step. She was standing now almost in front of Twilight. Just a bit closer...
“Then where are they?” Twilight demanded, cracks running up the stony gray walls. “How many did you save? Or did you stand back and watch them all die? Is that why you can’t leave us alone? Because I didn’t?”
Celestia took another step forward. “Do you want to know why I think this is wrong?” she asked. “How I know it’s a horrible burden to wrest your friends from time’s grasp?” Twilight’s magic was approaching hurricane force now. Books and shelves flew in a spiral around the room, colliding with the bed and Spike’s purple scale. Still, Celestia took another step forward, until she was standing face-to-face with her former student. Together in the eye of the storm. “Do you really want to know how many friends I saved?”
She reached out a hoof and brushed it gently through Twilight’s mane.
“One.”
Instantly, the storm grew calm, books and their shelves falling to the floor. Twilight’s horn burnt out. Her eyes widened as she slumped back. “I—no... You didn’t—”
And in that moment, it happened. A spear of pure light shone from Celestia’s horn, straight through Twilight’s heart. Too fast for a counterspell. Not that Twilight had been in any state to cast one.
It was over.
“I’m sorry, Twilight,” Celestia whispered as Twilight fell to the floor. “It’s my fault.”
She looked back, briefly, at Twilight’s body as she left the room—but not for too long. A minute or later she left Twilight behind and set out for the nursery. Twilight’s friends had waited for her long enough, and it wouldn't have been fair to delay any longer. She’d spent too many centuries grieving for her own mistakes, paying penance for the burden she’d placed on her most faithful student. Watching, waiting, hoping that she wouldn't have to...
Well. It was time now to let go.
The castle seemed strangely empty and quiet with Twilight gone. The enchantments on the brooms had died along with their creator, and the corridors lay in ruins from Twilight’s wrath. Celestia stepped quickly over the rubble, avoiding anything that had fallen from the walls.
She wondered briefly if that had been one of her own letters she’d seen, framed on the wall, but she didn’t stop to look. It was too late now for any of that to matter.
The nursery was in no better shape than the rest of the castle, but it seemed intact, at least, and Twilight’s friends were all unharmed. Which was what mattered.
“Twilight?” asked Rarity, peeking up from her crib when Celestia entered. The rest of the foals looked up too, eager to see their old friend again. “Twilight back? Twilight back?”
“Twilight...” For a moment, Celestia’s breath caught in her throat. “Twilight is taking a very long and well-earned rest,” she told Rarity. “It’s my job now to take you all home.”
“Oh...” said Rarity, uncertainly. “Twilight back soon?”
“You’ll see her again someday,” said Celestia. “I... can’t say much more than that now, but you’ll see her again.”
The fillies all nodded. “Promise?” Pinkie asked.
“Yes, of course,” Celestia put on her bravest smile for them, blinking her tears back before they could see. And they would see Twilight. Not for a long time, perhaps, but someday, without her age magic to keep them young... they would all find themselves together again.
“I promise.”
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if this is another "immortality as a curse" thing I'm downvoting this to oblivion
Ew gay
3833862 Oh, waaahhhh.
Read Tuck Everlasting for a less angsty and frivolous "Never Dying Sucks" story.
3833872 Much yeahs. Lots fuckity~
You, me?
Well I personally liked this one a lot.
I disagree with your opinions, although I'll note I was pleasantly surprised. Not enough to not down vote, but still.
You wrote a nice fic
Interesting concept, the twist was fun, but Celestia's solution was...out of sorts. There were so many other ways she could have broken the cycle without resorting to executing Twilight, so...I like the story, but I can't upvote it.
3833896
Thanks for reading at least.
Interesting read but that ending came out of nowhere. Celestia's saying that she can't handle Twilight on her own a few times and then she kills her in one hit?
And another thing that bothered me is the way how... A lightning spear through the chest while she was distracted? Sorry but you didn't save anyone Celestia...
But other than that, it's a well written story. That has to be said too. Can't be too negative, can we
3833876
I'm actually opposed to the genre in all its forms, regardless of their quality.
One thing that nobody I've met understands, is that aging and death aren't natural, hard coded laws of the universe.
Lobsters don't age; neither do some jellyfish, and neither do turtles. [1]
Aging is a subproduct of the fact that natural selection operates on how many offspring you leave in your wake...not how happy, successful or virtuous you are.
If a gene which makes you die by the time you're 30, but which makes you breed like a rabbit...then, hell yes it's gonna be passed on.
And if you're still not convinced; if we accept the logic of - once people reach their time...well then yes, we have to let them die - then why in THE FUCKING HELL ARE WE CURING CANCER PATIENTS?!?
Apologies. This is a topic which leaves me...incensed.
Anyways: please, please, to anyone reading this: debate me: tell me why you're not convinced.
I want to argue and to have a discussion, but not in a negative way; in a way that, hopefully, will leave us both with new information, because I just don't frigging understand this kind of thinking.
[1] Reference: http://www.cracked.com/article_20055_6-unassuming-animals-that-are-secretly-immortal.html
I like this. I like this a lot.
I'll be re-reading this, so that it impacts me better. I like to think of Twilight as partly insane with her immortality, and you've made it so heart-breakingly close to realization. I shudder to think how many cycles now, how many years of life she's forced these ponies to endure...and if their minds remain the same...
Just...Wow.
And she was even beginning to change their behaviors toward Celestia! How low she has fallen..
I shudder to imagine the possibility of the age spells reversing along with Twilight's passing. Her friends would age to dust. A beautifully tragic end.
A good take on how alicorn-hood has driven Twilight insane. Awesome job.
The ending is terrible. I want Twilight to continue raising the babies and end it with that sort of creepiness. That bittersweet ending didn't work out too well. I would've favorited, if not for that ending. She could always use her awesome magic to make a new Fluttershy and raise her. Twilight should continue raising the little main five. I did like the rest of the story, though.
3833922
The idea there was more or less that Celestia isn't really a match for Twilight on even grounds anymore. A surprise attack, on the other hand, is a bit harder to stop. You might not be able to fight an invincible knight in battle, but maybe if you ambush him while he's asleep. It's all she could hope for, I guess, without any other way to take Twilight down.
Interesting take on a tried-and-true premise. Excellent, as always.
Ha! That was a good one. Not super sad but very good nonetheless
3833950 That's true. I just didn't like it. Seemed a bit too underhanded for Celestia. And it makes me wonder if she was planning to kill Twilight or not
3833925 Honestly, I find the idea of immortality a daunting one, indeed. I mean, seriously. If I had to choose between watching my wife and kids all grow old and die, and dying before my kids reached the age of ten, I'd more than likely pick the latter. Sure, I could read every book ever in all of existence with an infinite amount of life, but I think that I'd just become so callous to others as a result. Especially since I wouldn't want to have wife after wife and kid after kid that grows old and dies while I stay in my mid twenties or thirties. That'd suck. As for why we're curing cancer patients, it's human nature to want to be the best, and to be the top of the food chain. Cancer is something that's trying to knock us down a peg, and as a race, we don't like that. It's how we're wired, and how war comes so naturally to us.
3833963
Fair enough. To a certain extent the story is sort of about Celestia's guilt for her part in what Twilight's become, and how her inaction has enabled Twilight to keep her friends timelocked. A lot of the moral is learning to let go, and to some extent that asks Celestia to do what she thinks best for Twilight's friends, even if she's guilty for what's happened to them in her own right.
It's... ambiguously moral, honestly, but it's the sort of question I wanted to ask with this story. I'd like to think I succeeded in posing it, but I guess that's up to the readers to decide.
Nicely done
3833980 That does make sense. And I do love a story that makes me think about morality
I like this for what it is: a disturbing foray into immortality and the trappings it may have. I can't fave it, though, because it's just too damn creepy.
Personally, I thought that until the last scene it was more about the importance of change than letting go proper. In fact, in the state they are in now, Twilight's friends aren't much better than zombies, condemned to simply repeat the actions of their past lives. Twilight's crime, if there is one, isn't making her friends live forever, but make them relive forever. They aren't free to become ponies in their own will, only in Twilight's - the mention of "tries" makes me imagine that a Rarity that wouldn't care for sewing, or even a more athleticism oriented Applejack would never be allowed in Twilight's vision for her friends - makes you wonder how she would react to the change in the group dynamics due to Fluttershy not being there.
Also, while I believe the ending was unwarranted in the way it happened, since it could have been better set-up, it made sense that things would go that way.
3834025
One thing I did try for here was to keep the set-up for the ending subtle, to make it surprising at first, but less so in retrospect. I'd suggest taking another look at things now that you know how it ends, with a closer reading on Celestia's dialogue, and see if that changes your perspective on things.
You know, killing Twilight seems a bit over the top. This is the land of magical ponies, there should have been another solution.
But a great story nevertheless.
3833966
...wouldn't it be a better option to try and make them immortal too?
Plus...I'm going to sound horribly callous, but...grief is something that people overcome.
I don't know if you've already had a death in the family, if your parents are still living or not, but...life goes on. Your children will probably have grandchildren you'll want to look after, you will make new friends, etc.
Which actually brings me to my next point: in option a (you live forever) you fell the pain and grief of your family passing. In option b, (you die in ten years) your wife and your children feel the pain and grief of YOU dying.
Which is the best option? Because...it seems a bit selfish to me wanting to die so that I don't have to deal with people around me dying.
I must say that this is another great story from your hands. you are very talented.
thats all i wanted to say.
3833925 \
Cancer patients don't want to die, they want to keep living longer, they want to live a happy normal life and die old, they don't want to die because of cancer. I will not have a debate with you, but I wanted to say why we are trying to cure them.
Just got done reading TER and jump straight to this.
My mind is in too much shock.
Just... This was twisted, dude...
...I'm off to curl into a ball in a corner. See you all in they asylum.
~Skeeter The Lurker
3834090
Haha thanks
3834103
See you there.
3834069
Besides all the problems like your brain simply not being able to handle immortality (your memories would be compressed until years seem like minutes), being old sucks not just because of dying.
I don't want to have a debate with you, but I don't think you actually know what you're talking about, or are very old yourself.
I've worked with a lot of seniors, and they all say the worst part is when everyone you know is dead. It's maddening, to belong to a different time period and have no one else to share it with. Yes, we get over grief, but eventually, when there's no one left that can understand and care for you like only someone your age can, it becomes hard to keep going. Believe it or not, that's why the rate of senior citizen suicides is fairly high if they don't have people to be around.
3834109
You're a strange one, Obsy. To glimpse the vast, colorful expanse of creativity your brain heralds is equivalent to gazing upon the Holy Grail covered in graffiti spelling, "I got swag."
3834069
It's not that you die to avoid people around you dying. You die because your body is old and frail and can't support you anymore. The grief might hurt for a time, but I would rather have die than be immortal, because when you're immortal, you don't just experience the loss of your family. You experience the loss of your friends, of the new friends and family you make after that, cycling constantly, a new period of grief and loss every 75 years or so. You see civilizations fall, the very civilizations you happily considered yourself part of. Perhaps you manage to witness an extinction level event or something. The entirety of Humanity gone before your eyes, a single person left grieving for an entire species. If you're immortal, you won't die out with them. I'll leave you to consider that thought.
3833925
Why are we curing cancer patients? Wow, you are a dick.
You wanna know why we're curing cancer patients? Because, while we don't want immortality, we wouldn't mind increasing our lifespans. Eradicating diseases like cancer is one means of doing this. Not only that, but cancer doesn't just hit old people who are going to die in a few years. It hits children, who have barely seen the world, young adults, mothers still raising children who can't do basic arithmetic. If we abandon trying to help those people... well then what's the point of living in the first place?
However, there's something called ethics. If someone doesn't want to have their lifespan extended, then you should honor their wishes. It appears in this story that Twilight was doing this to her friends against their will. That's absolutely unethical.
3834110
You are right, I'm not old, and I do acknowledge that yes, the brain does eventually get full (although a lifespan of two hundred years seems still like something much better to strive for than simply eighty years).
And I actually am in favour-or rather, I acknowledge that it's a right-of choosing when to die on one's own.
And yes, Twilight in this fic is a very morally reprehensible person.
But still!
I just don't understand why everybody seems so opposed to immortality when it's literally one of the main goals of the human race[1]!
[1] this is what lifespan extension-which has progressed incredibly far in the last two centuries, let's not forget- essentially is: a way to try and make everybody not die.
3834091
Dude, a century ago cancer WAS dying of old age.
3834069 Yeah, choosing option b is fairly selfish, not only would my wife have to raise x amount of preteens on her own, but they would all probably feel betrayed or angry with me for dying so early in their lifespans. But the alternative is to stand and watch as not only my wife, kids, grandchildren, great grandchildren, and so on and so forth all die, but everyone and everything else as well.
3834150 said it pretty damn well.
3834173
well now it isn't.
3834173
Actually no it wasn't. That being beside the point, honestly, there's something called "modern medicine". You may have heard of it? It has drastically improved our lifespans. Also see my above statement about how cancer hits ALL people, of all ages and walks of life. It's non-discriminate. Are you saying we shouldn't try to cure the three year old girl who has leukemia? The three year old girl who could possibly live a happy and full life, if we use medical science to help her? That's exactly what you're implying.
We don't want to live forever, but we do want to extend our healthy lives as long as possible.
I personally would not mind living until I'm 120-150. However, I don't want to live for thousands of years. Nope. No thanks. I'll pass.
3834168
For one, we've really only been trying to make people be able to die peacefully of old age, not live forever. That has been the goal of very few people. And for another, as I said, there are some impossibilities of being immortal, such as total memory. Not even to mention that the probability of getting killed in an accident goes close to 100% the longer you live.
Wow. Wow wow wow.
Your writing continues to impress me, Obs. The amount of emotion you pour into your words is unreal. This is one of the best stories I've read on Fimfiction.
Keep up the incredible work.
Guys, much as I like philosophical debates as to the inherent nature of immortality, I'm kind of hoping we can move that away from the comments section of this story. It's cool to discuss immortality within the context of the story, but if the argument's primarily about cancer patients and society at large, I think we've kind of stepped beyond the purview of a Fimfiction comment section.
Thanks.
3834065 She should have turned her to stone and set her up in the garden next to Discord, who probably went rogue again after Fluttershy died.
This earned its tags fairly.
On the core of the story:
It's not about immortality being a bad thing; it's about stasis, and how that is a bad thing. If Twilight had been content to give her friends a new leave of life with those age spells, letting them grow and change and explore new things, she would not have had to sequester them and herself in a faraway castle hidden by layers of defensive spells, nor Celestia would have had to stop her in such a final way. At least she managed to save one friend from herself: Twilight Sparkle.
3834054
I felt that there was plenty of set-up for her being ready to attack/fight Twilight. She paid a lot of attention to the smaller details of her magic, on how to get past her defenses, get close to her, etc. What I felt was lacking was in Celestia being in the mindset to do what she did. It felt like she was thinking more in the lines of "What should I do to make things right", than a "What should I do, I created a monster!". In a way, it felt strange that she would forget about Twilight's fate, instead deciding that nothing would become better while she lived. I think that would include much more resentment towards Twilight's actions than what she was showing here, where it seemed she was focused on her regret.
3833925 I kinda agree with you, although I don't see what's wrong with this genre. Sure, it's completely overdone, but that doesn't mean the story can't be nice (I know, you allready said this was a nice fic). And if the information in the story clashes with what you know, ignore the stuff you know! It makes reading fiction a lot more pleasant. But... I still kinda agree with you. Doesn't stop me from faving it and upvoting it.
Very good.
3834091 3834150 There's a principle for civilized discourse that says you take a few seconds before responding to consider the possibility that the person you're responding to isn't a complete moron, and what he might have meant in that case.
He knows why we cure cancer patients. His point is that if you don't want immortality, you shouldn't want to cure cancer patients. Aging is just the accumulation of many diseases--atherosclerosis, osteoporosis, arthritis, alopecia, neural plaques, demyelination, mitochondrial inefficiency, insulin resistance, sarcopenia, and cancer, just for starters. To say that you are in favor of curing each of those diseases by themselves, but don't want to cure the collection of all of them, is literally meaningless. It means you don't even know what you want.
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I suggest you start a thread in the LessWrong group if you want to keep talking about it.