• Published 23rd Feb 2014
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This Quiet Earth - Dafaddah



Twilight Sparkle finally meets Starswirl the Bearded on a strange deserted world. However, the more they learn the sadder Starswirl becomes, until Twilight faces a devastating choice that would have her betray Celestia and even Harmony itself!

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Only Hope

This Quiet Earth

by
Dafaddah and Sharp Logic

Chapter eight: Only hope

Edited by and based on an idea proposed by Sharp Logic. He is also listed as a co-author for this chapter, as he has contributed so much in terms of both ideas and actual text that in all honesty I can only call this chapter a collaboration. Working with him has been a real pleasure and has helped me grow as an author. This is what FIMfiction is all about!


Starswirl stared rapt at the centaur who used to be Twilight Sparkle. She blushed when she caught him looking at her very new and very human face. He smiled gently and said: “So now you know how I felt, then.”

She lifted her wing and stored her new diadem scepter in her magic cache, then raised her hands and examined them closely. “I was just getting used to the wings. Now I have to learn how to use a whole new set of limbs. That’s eight in total! Does that make me some kind of spider, or maybe an octopus?” Her own smile showed that she was talking in jest.

He chuckled. “No, you are most definitely a mammal.” Her blush deepened. She crossed her arms over her bosom. “And you certainly remain related to Clover.”

Still chuckling, Starswirl rummaged through the pockets in his cloak, producing a white tunic. He offered it to her. “Here, this smock should fit you. I just hope Joly got all the stains out when he laundered it last week.”

Pandora turned her back to them and pulled the tunic over her head and shoulders. Looking down at herself she remarked: “Rarity might dispute this, but I think it fits me quite well.”

She straightened the garment by brushing her hands down over it, and then froze mid motion. Her eyebrows lifted, she blinked a few times and then raised both fists to the side of her face and hip-hopped on all four legs. “Eeeee!” she squealed, “I can't believe I'm wearing Starswirl the Bearded’s shirt! Ohmygosh, ohmygosh, ohmygosh!”

Discord finally came out of his daze. He looked down at the lampshade, pail and toothbrush he still clutched, and hid them behind his back. “Er... looks like there won’t be a Sept of Chaos initiation rite after all.” He scratched an ear. “A centaur then, is it? Well, I guess it should do in a pinch. Uh, Princess Pandora. I, uh, I want to sincerely thank–”

“–Please don’t, Discord,” said Pandora, abruptly shifting from fangasm to disdain. “Don’t think I can’t see how you’ve manipulated me since this whole thing started. Stranding me here with my personal hero, who just happens to have been born human, plus the diary, the gallery, the funeral, the lectures... all of it ties together too well not to have been planned.”

Discord met her gaze. “Of course I planned it all out. The stakes could not be higher, Princess. So I’ll take my lumps if you’re angry with me, but I won’t lie to you. I did what I had to do, and if there’s any shame in it, then I’ll wear it gladly.”

Pandora eyed the draconequus as she floated the portal frame out from Starswirl's cloak. “Are you certain you were never one of Princess Celestia’s students?” she asked as she unfolded it.

Discord’s eyes widened briefly before a wide grin split his muzzle. “Oh come now, don’t be silly. Now about the portal frame–” A scroll popped out of the portal frame. Everypony stared as it fluttered to the floor and was followed by a small cloth purse that clinked of metal within it.

“Looks like we’ve gotten a reply to our letter," said Pandora. “And it seems they refused the gold.”

Discord piped up: “Why of course she refused the bits! She’d never accept money for being charitable.”

"She?" asked Pandora. "You know who we've been stealing food from?"

A sultry female voice called out: "Discord, is that you? I know I heard your voice in here. Where are you? Hurry back or you’ll be late for dinner."

Pandora gaped at Discord. "Fluttershy? Fluttershy's cottage used to be Starswirl's? And the other end of the portal frame sits in a house I visit several times a week?"

It was Starswirl's turn to look surprised. "Princess," he asked Pandora, "you know who we've been stealing food from?"

Discord pointed at the centaur and tried to look innocent. “That’s what she said.”

Starswirl smiled. "So somepony is still living in my cottage hundreds of years after I left." He seemed very pleased.

Discord smiled apologetically. "My dearest friend is calling to me. I should go reassure her that all is well. She actually worries about me, you know. Isn't it wonderful?"

He approach the portal frame and cupped claw and paw around his muzzle. “Coming right out, Sweetheart!” he called. “Uh, honey, we’ll be having two guests for dinner.”

“Discord!” exclaimed Pandora. “Aren’t we supposed to be saving the universe or something?”

The trickster looked smug. “Us time travellers have all the time in the world we could ever need. Plus, now that you’ve accepted my request, I do think I owe you a full disclosure. And where's the fun in rushing around on an empty stomach when we don’t have to?”

“The draconequus makes a valid point,” said Starswirl.

Pandora rolled her eyes. “Stallions!” she said, and bent over to pick up the paper, which she stored in the magic cache under her wing.

Discord waved a paw and the portal grew bigger.

Starswirl looked around and saw everything else in the room getting bigger as well as receding into the distance. Soon the frame was taller than even Princess Pandora.

Discord invited them forward with a flourish. “Please, be our guests.”

Our guests?” asked Pandora.

“Oh, of course this is all yet in the future from your perspective, Princess. How gauche of me not to have clued you in.” He waved her forward. “Just to avoid any surprises, Fluttershy and I just feted our thirty-fifth wedding anniversary.” He showed off a large gold ring on the middle digit of his bird-clawed limb and batted his eyelashes. “They said it wouldn’t last!” He winked.

“Married? Fluttershy? Thirty-five years?” Pandora muttered as she stepped up to the portal frame.

Discord waved her onwards. “Oh, and watch out for that first step –” with a screech Pandora teetered and fell forward “–it’s a doozy!”

Starswirl balked at the edge of the opening. “I don't think it wise for me to visit an Equestria that is in my future. Ponies could tell me about my own fate and that could cause a paradox that–” The rest of his objection was cut off when he was pushed from behind and plummeted into the dark.


Fluttershy heard a commotion within the pantry. Opening the door she saw nopony. This wasn’t a surprise because there just wasn’t room for a grown pony in there. Still, she thought she had heard Discord. Then she heard another angry voice, one she thought sounded familiar, and looked down. There stood three bunny-sized beings in a pile of limbs and bodies – her husband’s on top.


Pandora heard a rather low-key “Squee!” and looked up. She saw a gigantic pink maned yellow head moving down to inspect them. “Oh, Discord!” said a familiar voice. “You're so cute when you're small!”

“Hmm,” said her husband while disentangling himself from the others. “Maybe I'll stay small for a while. It's high time Angel Bunny the Third had some competition in the kawaii sweepstakes around here!”

A huge but totally cute white rabbit peeked out from Fluttershy’s hooves. He turned up his nose and rolled his eyes back as soon as he saw Discord.

“Ahem.” Discord cleared his throat for attention. “If we move out of the pantry then perhaps I can restore everypony to their normal sizes.”

Pandora shook her head and purposefully strode out of the pantry, passing right between Fluttershy’s hooves and the huge white rabbit. From the corner of her eye she saw Starswirl follow her out, with Discord in the rear. Once she was past Fluttershy she heard the sounds of a scuffle.

"Fluttershy! Get him off of me!” shouted Discord.

There was a very unbunnylike growl. Then a loud "Ouch!"

"Well I can bite too, you know!" exclaimed Discord.

“Boys!” said Fluttershy, “Are you two going to behave or am I going to have to take out the Stare?”

The sounds of scuffling stopped abruptly.

Pandora turned around and almost lost her balance as the room quickly shrunk down to normal size, as did Fluttershy and the bunny. A moment later Starswirl stood next to her, and finally Discord joined their rank. He and Fluttershy hugged warmly.

“We’ve got four foals and seven grand-foals, and she still calls me a boy!” Discord mugged. Over his shoulder Fluttershy caught sight of Pandora. She issued another almost loud “Squee!” and ran up to hug Pandora.

For a moment Pandora thought that her long-time friend had recognised her despite her morphological transformation.

“Oh my goodness! A centaur! It's been decades since I last saw a centaur! I’m so excited!” She hugged her once more and stood back. “Oh, I’m sorry! I should introduce myself. I’m Fluttershy, Discord’s wife.” She cocked her head at Discord.

“Oh, of course. Fluttersweets, may I present Princess Pandora, a visitor from another time, and her companion – none other than Starswirl the Bearded.”

Starswirl gestured broadly. “You’ve done well with my old cottage, madame. It’s been nearly a thousand years since I built it.”

Pandora though Fluttershy would quietly “Squee!” again, but instead she froze for a moment.

“Don’t! Move!” the yellow pegasus declared, pointing a leg at the old mage. Then her ears flopped down, she lowered her hoof and blushed. “I mean, you can certainly move if you wish, I would never dream of preventing you from sitting or anything, so please make yourselves comfortable, just... don’t go away.” She leaped onto the window sill, stopped and turned. “I’ll be right back.” And in a passable imitation of Rainbow Dash she shot out of the open window, flying at top speed.

Pandora looked at Discord, eyebrows raised. “I wonder what that was all about?”

Discord cupped his chin in his paw. “I think I have a suspicion. Well, more than a suspicion. But don’t worry, I planned even for this contingency. It’s quite useful having access to other versions of myself who’ve gone through these circumstances a few minutes earlier than me. By the way, have a look in the mirror.”

Discord suddenly had a hand mirror, positioned so Pandora could see her reflection: tan skin and coat, and light blue mane.

“Discord! Why did you change my coloration?”

“Because–” the door flew open, and there stood a tall, regal alicorn mare. Her coat was lavender and her mane sparkled with all the shades of dusk from bright pink to the deepest indigo blue. Fluttershy landed just behind her. The two entered the cottage and the alicorn mare’s eyes alighted on Starswirl.

This time the “Squee!” was loud enough to have been heard all the way to Canterlot.


Dinner turned out to be a multi-family, multi-generational extravaganza. Both guests got a large amount of generally polite and respectful attention. Pandora and Twilight’s eyes met several times over the table, and though Pandora was sure that Twilight knew something was amiss, this older and wiser version of herself seemed content to let dining centaurs dine.

Two of Fluttershy and Discord’s grand-foals showed up. One, a pegasus stallion the spitting image of Fluttershy, was accompanied by his wife, a shy young unicorn with a cornflower blue coat, both laden with large bowls of food. The other was a light brown unicorn mare accompanied by a pale blue earth pony stallion, and their own tiny cyan pegasus foal with a rainbow coloured mane, who immediately flew straight into Discord’s forelimbs.

“Granpop!” cried the little mare.

“It’s my little Dashie,” replied the draconequus. Multi-coloured fireworks went off in his eyes, to the foal’s absolute delight. Discord made brightly painted blocks appear. Little Dash used them to build pony shapes, which Discord animated under her direction. The two were never far apart all evening.

As to the dinner itself, it progressed faster than Pandora would have believed possible. A trestle table appeared where the arriving guests placed the dishes and bowls they had brought. A variety of foodstuffs were added by both Fluttershy and Discord during several trips back and forth to the kitchen.

Pandora also witnessed the very real and obviously deep affection between Discord and her friend Fluttershy. He was extraordinarily attentive to her, and she seemed to bloom and glow in his presence. It warmed her heart to no end to see them feeding each other tidbits and engaging in gentle teasing.

Of course, this being the house of Kindness and Chaos, there was much gentle, good natured randomness and fun, liberally spiced with dozens of animals large and small, and somehow each one had his or her space.

After the dessert course, some massive confection from Sugarcube Corner, Pandora decided to take a walk outside to get some time to think. There was a bench located just on the other side of the chicken coop. Since Discord had conveniently not restored her to full stature, she was basically pony sized, with extras, so she could comfortably sit on the wide wooden boards, watch the sky and listen to the the night-time sounds of the Everfree Forest.

Finally having some privacy, Pandora took out the letter they had received through the portal frame. It was written in Fluttershy’s simple, almost fillyish script. She smiled when she saw that her friend, now a grandmother, still dotted her 'i's with a little heart.

Dear Friend,

It’s very considerate of you to let me know you’re the one who is taking things from my pantry. I’m not worried, honest! It’s just that I often have guests in my house who can’t always tell me what they need, and I’m more than happy to share, because we have more than enough for everypony and every critter too! And I gave you back your bits, because I’m happy to give you whatever you need.

It’s really intriguing to have a past (or future) resident of this house contact me. It was abandoned long ago, so you must be from very far in the past or in the future. You know, it’s funny how much you sound like a good friend of mine who’s always very concerned about being really precise in what she says. I can’t help but think you two could become really good friends too, so I hope you get a chance to meet sometime!

Don’t worry about replacing the food that you took, but if you can, please send me a letter to let me know when you and your friend are safe and sound. Enjoy the food in my pantry, and I’ll make sure to keep more pony food near the door. I’ll put my animal food deeper in the pantry, although I don’t think they would mind sharing either.

I'm sure you will find your way home soon. Don’t lose hope, and always remember that you have friends.

Yours in kindness,

Fluttershy


Pandora smiled. Even if I have a new face, all my former friends are still the wonderful ponies I have come to love. Maybe this is just an opportunity to get to know them all over again! The thought had barely formed in her mind when Twilight showed up and sat down beside her.

The mare chewed her lip for a short while, and finally spoke up. “Who’s the letter from?” she asked.

“Fluttershy," said Pandora. "She’s usually so quiet. It's easy to forget how truly perceptive she is."

Twilight nodded. "All those years ago she was the first to really see into Discord's heart. I guess that's why he fell so totally head-over-hooves for her. Whoever would have believed they could raise such a wonderful family!"

Both mares kept in companionable silence for a while, looking at the beautiful night over the Everfree.

“I know who you are,” Twilight finally said. “You’ve made the choice that I couldn’t.” Her tone of voice was lighthearted, not what Pandora was expecting.

Pandora glanced to the side. “Do you resent me for it?”

Twilight grinned, her teeth flashing in the moonlight. “No. I’m here to thank you. If it’s any consolation, you've made the right choice.”

“You know that when I undo Discord’s mistake, the last forty years of this universe will be reset.” She gesture to the house. “These events and many of these ponies may never come into existence.”

“Yes, I know,” said Twilight. “Soon, all of this will just be a dream for me, and I’ll be a different pony." She sighed. “You’re the twenty third after me, or before me depending on the perspective, I think.”

“The twenty third what?”

“You’re the result of Discord’s twenty third attempt to convince me – I mean, us – to join the Sept of Chaos.” Her grin flashed again in the semi-darkness. “He’s been going backwards through time, changing and perfecting his pitch to us with every iteration.” One of her eyebrows rose. “I don’t know how many there were before me in the future, but I can recall each attempt in my past as vivid dreams, and of course I’ve documented them.”

Pandora considered for a moment. “Why does he need to go backwards in time with each attempt?”

“Oh, that’s because he needs a fresh and unprejudiced Twilight on which to ply his argument. If he worked chronologically each time he made his argument he’d be facing a mare who had previously decided to reject his logic. I’ve got to hoof it to him, he really has thought this out very carefully, and he’s been very methodical. But having known him for a long time, I can also tell he was beginning to feel desperate.”

“Why’s that?” asked Pandora.

“Because he’s almost run out of time.”

“What?”

“His last failed attempt was just a few weeks after we got our wings. You must be the Twilight just prior to that day. Remember, for this to work he has to convince an ascended being to convert to Chaos. Only a few weeks earlier and we’re Twilight the unicorn, and no longer in the running.”

Pandora shook her head. “I never knew he was such a capable planner. I’m really impressed!”

“As am I. But, you know, my heart really breaks for him. You’ve seen the way he worships his foals and grand-foals.”

Pandora nodded.

“There’s no way to know if they will still be born in the repaired universe. He risks losing everything he loves for this.”

Pandora mulled this over, unsure of what to say.

“What about... you, Princess Twilight? Do you risk somepony special?”

Twilight was silent for a long while. Glints of moonlight reflected from falling tears. “Too many to count. Too many to let go. Just... Too many. My courage failed me every time Discord asked. I suspect Starswirl had something to do with your taking the other choice.” She rubbed her eyes and attempted a lopsided smile. “So. How long have you known Starswirl the Bearded?” she asked.

“Coming up on four glorious... and sometimes not so glorious, days and nights,” Pandora replied.

The flash of a smile returned. “I’m tremendously envious of you, you know.”

“Don’t be. By doing this I’ve betrayed everything Princess Celestia ever taught me – us. I’ve betrayed her plans for me. I've betrayed Harmony, and I’ve betrayed her. She would hate me if she knew.” Pandora sniffled as her own emotions overflowed.

“Are you sure about that?” asked Twilight.

Pandora wiped her eyes with the back of a hand. “It’s too late now for me to ask.”

“Maybe not,” replied Twilight.

“What... what do you mean?”

“Look over there,” said Twilight, pointing with a purple hoof.

Pandora turned her attention to an area of lilac bushes. There stood a ghostly white form. One that Pandora would recognize anywhere, and at any time. The form approached.

“Welcome home, my faithful student,” said Princess Celestia. Pandora ran into her embrace.


Fluttershy sat with Starswirl and Discord on a large sofa in the cottage’s living room. Little Dashie slept tightly curled up in Discord’s forelimbs.

“And so,” said Fluttershy, “my parents bought me this house so I could live near my little animal friends. Being so far from town it had been vacant for generations. I guess nopony even remembered that it was yours from long ago, I mean, it’s such an honour!”

Starswirl looked at the extended family of pegasi, unicorns, earth ponies and even one draconequus. “On the contrary, I feel honored that such a beautiful family has made this humble place into a home. And I’m equally pleased to see that Ponyville has again become a vibrant community. You might want to ask Princess Celestia about its history when next you see her.”

“He he!” Discord said. “That might not take very long. If I’m not mistaken she’s sitting out back with Twilight and Pandora.”

Starswirl rose from the sofa, ears erect.

“Don’t worry, Maestro,” said Discord. “They’re just having a little princess-talk. It would be impolite in the extreme to interrupt.”

“If you say so.” He sighed. “As long as I’m up perhaps I can take advantage of the occasion to stretch my legs.”

As he exited the front door he witnessed Fluttershy cuddle up to her husband and grand-foal. It was a truly sweet moment. As soon as he was outside, the irony of it struck him. What foolhardy courage does Discord have to put all this in jeopardy, he thought. And then he thought of what Discord had done for little Maximilian Sachs. A truly big heart beats in that patchwork creature. He and Fluttershy are indeed a good match.

In the distance he saw the lights of Ponyville. In the bright moonlight it looked like a toy village. In the sky a shadow winged towards the town. When it landed near a castle in the shape of a huge tree the street lights revealed the winged shadow to be Princess Twilight Sparkle. A doorway opened into the tree and she went inside.

“It’s beautiful, isn’t it?” said Pandora’s voice.

He turned and bowed. “I could not dream of a more blessed sight, Princess.”

They stood together in silence. This is what she is giving up, he thought.

“You know,” said the princess, “he actually understated how much he had to do to get us to this point. Imagine that, Discord being modest!” He raised an eyebrow, and she told him most of what she had learned. When she was finished they took a final look at Ponyville and made their way back to the cottage.

Discord sat alone in the living room wearing a somber expression. “It’s time to go back, and for me to explain everything,” he said.

They nodded. In silence Discord led them to the pantry.


The trio returned via the portal frame to the room where Maximilian Sachs had lived and died. After the exuberantly emphatic life of the family dinner, its quiet could only be described as sepulchral.

Discord was uncharacteristically very somber. “So, about that explanation I promised...”

Pandora blushed. “It won’t be necessary, Discord. Twilight and Princess Celestia already confirmed everything you told us, and filled me in on the rest. Then I told Starswirl.”

“I knew they knew more than they let on. I guess I should have expected as much.” He frowned theatrically. “I may be a good guy now, however that doesn’t mean I’ve given up on my right to long soliloquies that interrupt the action at the most inappropriate moments.” He waggled a single digit of his bird claw. “I’ll forgive you this time, but don’t do it again!”

As Pandora and Starswirl chuckled he approached the portal frame and waved a paw over it. “The portal is now attuned to the time just after my unfortunate intervention. Princess, there's no further reason for delay.”

Pandora took the frame from where it hung suspended in air and neatly folded it using her magic. She then took it into her left hand and nodded.

“Wait!” called Starswirl. “Forgive me this indulgence, Princess, Discord, but before we part there’s something more I would like to show Princess Pandora. Princess, please follow me.”

Starswirl paced quickly down the stairs and led the young centaur to another painting some thirty or forty meters further down the wall from where his Lady had been displayed.

“This is also one of my works. It is called ‘The Virgin of the Rocks’. Please look carefully at the face of the woman in the painting.” Her eyes grew wide in surprise when she beheld the same gentle face in the painting as she had seen reflected in Discord's mirror.

“But – how is that possible? I’m literally just hours old in this shape.”

“It would appear that we will meet again in my own past, lass.”

“Then that means you’ve seen this face before? When?”

He chuckled. “If I told you that, time loops could form, paradoxes might be caused and whole universes could be destroyed.” He tilted his head. “As a young friend of mine said very recently, that is one of the subjects I think we agreed that we mustn’t discuss!

Pandora laughed in delight. “Touché!, Maestro. And thanks for showing me this. Somehow it reassures me tremendously. I will see you again. I can’t wait!” Her expression grew sober. “Are you ready, now?”

“Yes,” he said. “Farewell, lass. And remember, you’ve done us all—Clover, Platinum, Celestia, Discord and humanity—extremely proud. You’re now a part of us, and we’re a part of you.”

Starswirl was briefly enveloped in purple arms and wings. He looked up to say something more and suddenly found himself alone. He walked slowly back up the stairs to a waiting Discord.

“What will happen when she makes the change?”

“I’m not quite sure. I should retain my memory of this universe, but I simply don’t know about you. You’re from a much earlier time, so I think there is little chance of a paradox being generated. If you’re here with me your own memory may also be preserved. I truly don’t know, and I have... other things I stand to lose.” He seemed very vulnerable, all of a sudden. His paw twitched upwards towards Starswirl, then went slowly back down. Starswirl took one look at the draconequus’s ashen face, and held out a forehoof to him. Discord put a paw on his hoof, and bit his lower lip. The paw trembled, and the draconequus closed his eyes.

They stood that way for some ten seconds when, without transition, the world was different. It wasn’t like it had been changed in a flash. There was no shock. One moment it was just different, and had always been so.

They were on a green field of grass that extended as far as the eye could see. He saw Discord open his eyes.

“The Exponential Lands!” he said. “It worked!” He grabbed Starswirl’s other hoof and began to jump around, engaging Starswirl in a very undignified dance. “We did it! We saved the Earth and Equestria both!”

In the distance there were a bunch of houses. For some reason they seemed different to Starswirl. The style of architecture was more utilitarian and angular than the very fluid and lavishly decorated styles he had witnessed in his many years in Equestria. Near them were white lines on the grass, as if somepony had laid out lines of chalk dust to define a field for sports. This one in particular was shaped somewhat like a diamond. Foals in uniform were playing a sport that seemed to involve hitting a ball with a wooden bat held in the mouth. He and Discord approached. They listened in on the chatter between the foals in the outer part of the formation. Discord raised his eyebrows. “English!” he remarked. He waved a paw and Starswirl suddenly understood the words.

“Hey kid?” the draconequus called to the nearest foal, an orange coated unicorn. “Who’s playing?”

The colt in question did a double-take, but replied anyway. “New McMurdo – that’s us, versus Scott Station.” He stared at Discord, eyes wide as dinner plates. From the nearby stands there was a commotion, and all eyes seemed to turn to focus on the new arrivals. An orange unicorn mare began galloping towards them.

“What’s the matter, kid?” Discord’s smile wavered. “Haven’t you seen a draconequus before?”

The colt continued staring. “Yeah, but only in my dreams! Are... are you Bob?”

This time it was Discord who did a double-take. The mare was approaching and her voice grew in volume and clarity. “Max!” she shouted. “Come here and get away from that thing!”

The colt turned towards the mare. “Mo–o–om!” he complained, but nevertheless began trotting towards his mother. On the back of his uniform was a large numeral 5 and the Roman letters S, A, C, H, and S stitched in royal blue.

Discord waved a claw, “Bye now, Max, and Mrs. Sachs. We’ve got to get back to the land of dreams!”

Starswirl saw a flash of white.


Starswirl felt off-balance for a moment. His vision cleared and he found that he and Discord were in front of Fluttershy’s cottage. The windows were shuttered and the door sported a huge lock.

Discord flicked a paw. The lock turned into a flock of butterflies and flew off. He rushed into the cottage. Starswirl followed a moment later and found the draconequus sitting on his haunches, a frightened look on his face. There was dust everywhere, and most of the furniture was covered with drop-clothes. “Fluttersweets, where are you?” he said in a strangled voice.

There was a flash of light and suddenly Princess Celestia and Fluttershy were there. The latter’s eyes widened at the sight of Discord. She rushed over to wrap her husband in hooves and wings. “I’m here sweetheart. What’s gotten you in this state?”

Discord hugged the pegasus back desperately. “A-Absolutely nothing, my love! I... Everything’s right as rain.”

She pulled back slightly. “Well, then, why aren’t you home? It’s a good thing Princess Celestia was a guest tonight. She offered to teleport me to you when I asked if she’d seen you.” She gazed around the room in confusion. “What are you doing back at my old cottage? Half the family’s travelled all the way to Canterlot tonight for the dinner.”

“Canterlot?” he raised an eyebrow.

“Yes, the party is at our house. Did you forget? The little ones have already been fed and are getting ready for bed. Chance, Twilight and Dashie all want their bedtime stories read by grampa.”

It was as if a light suddenly went on in Discord’s head. “Of course, the dinner. How silly of me to forget.” He turned his head back towards Starswirl, a grin splitting his face ear-to-ear. He hugged Starswirl briefly and waved a paw. "Arrivederci, Maestro!" and he and Fluttershy were gone, leaving Starswirl alone with Princess Celestia.

They gazed at each other, a few pony lengths and several centuries between them.

“How nice it is to see you again, Maestro.” She chuckled. “Although it’s been a bit longer from my perspective than yours.” She stood somewhat formally, ever the proper princess.

He strode up to her, bowed, and raised an eyebrow. “Not so long that I don’t get a hug, I hope.”

Celestia’s smile widened appreciably, and she leaned in to wrap a leg and wings around him. They shared the familiar warmth of each other’s presence for a moment. He felt her sigh as they disengaged their limbs.

“I’ve missed your company so, dear friend!” she said. “Isn’t it ironic that you should come back to us just when we needed your help the most?”

“Not at all. It was all Discord’s doing.” He gestured to the door and led them outside the cottage. Crickets were chirping their evening serenade, and one of the most beautiful night skies Starswirl had ever seen took his breath away.

“She has returned, hasn’t she?” Celestia didn’t respond, but the spring in her step as they walked in the moonlight told him all he needed to know. “I’m glad,” he concluded. He faced Ponyville, a gleaming galaxy of silver and gold in the distance. “Your sister is back, and so is my little hamlet. You remembered!”

“It was a beautiful vision that deserved to be brought back to life, Maestro. I don’t think it a coincidence that this little town is home to the Bearers of the Elements of Harmony.”

“Perhaps you should not have told me that! But still, thank you, my Princess. And do convey my warmest feelings to Princess Luna.”

Celestia laughed, but her mirth was short-lived. “But now, I have another princess gone, and into an exile so much more final than Luna’s. When I met Pandora here sidewhen she told us of your time together. Will she be alright, Maestro?”

“Everything she’s done since we’ve met has been a joy to observe and a credit to her tutor. She has neither abandoned Harmony nor adopted Chaos, Celestia, she’s simply grown enough to see what lies beyond them.”

“What do you think she will do now?”

Starswirl thought a moment, and chuckled. “Now that she’s saved two universes, I suppose she’ll make a list of others that also need saving.”

Celestia chuckled as well. “You’ve always had sharp eyes and been a good judge of character, Maestro. I suspect you’re right.” She focused inwards for a moment, and then her eyes widened almost imperceptibly. A second later she grinned and snorted in a very unprincesslike fashion. “The multiverse had best beware! Princess Pandora, First of the Sept of Life and Avatar of Hope, is on its case!”

She turned around and hugged him again. “I hope this is not our last parting,” she said simply.

“Anything is possible in time, my Princess of Harmony!” he responded, and bowed.

“Farewell, my friend.” He saw her horn glow.


Starswirl found himself back in his cottage, standing next to his kitchen table. He leaned on it, subject to a momentary feeling of vertigo. Home! he thought. Finally, I'm home.

His thoughts went out to the verdant green of the Exponential Lands, as Discord had called them. Luna will one day return from exile! Ponyville will be rebuilt. And the Earth can be saved! He felt as if a huge weight had left his withers.

A broad grin split his muzzle. “Joly!” he shouted. “I’ve just had the most amazing experience!” Not getting a response, he decided to go look for his companion. He could see blue sky peeking through the window shutters. It would be a shame to waste such a beautiful day indoors. There was much to tell and, he thought, even more still to be done!

His spirit brightened in anticipation.


Epilogue

Pandora’s Journal For Universe Rescue and Restoration of Hope
Universe: 328-56-02D
Location: Berlin, Germany, Planet Earth
Local Date: June 7th, 2011

Minutes of Meeting held at Hofvarpnir Studios
Attending for HS: Hanna S. (CEO) and Lars L. (VP BizDev)
Attending for Hasbro: Richard P. (yours truly!)

Actions:
- Presented basic case for having Hofvarpnir build Equestria Online
- Lars initially very skeptical
- Hanna convinced him in a private meeting
- They accepted to attempt negotiating a contract. All signs point to a rapid close of the deal

Notes:
- Current index show probability for Quiet Earth extinction within 200 years as close to 100% (residual probabilities for avoidance of QE scenario include asteroid impact, solar instability, supernova in the local group of stars, and alien invasion.)
- All attempts at locating a corresponding Equestria to this Earth have failed, preventing the standard Convergence solution.
- Leakage of advanced cybernetic AI technology (from universe 328-56-02D LD:2054/03/21) to Hanna by dream transfer (started LD:1994/01/02) is showing every sign of continued success.
- Direct government interference remains highest probable cause for failure.
- Other AI going rogue and assuming control of planet Earth is second highest probable cause for failure (cf. Loki incident). Direct Intervention and Restitution Protocol DIRP in place to mitigate that possibility.
- Hasbro Board of Directors fully convinced by Richard P. to invest up to $10 million in Equestria Online.

Follow-up:
- Finalize contract with stipulation of alpha build acceptance testing completed within one calendar year.
- Disengage Lauren F. from daily involvement in the show production as it will be increasingly difficult to maintain both Lauren and Richard personas at the same time, and stay close to Hanna while basic AI in development stage.
- Sleep-feed Hanna basic Celest-A.I. engrams to ensure Magic of Friendship.

Comments ( 52 )

So does that mean she's responsible for all the ACB worlds too?

"Natural barrier formation inhibited, initiating Tyrantlestia protocol."

Whoa. :rainbowderp: Good ending.
I loved the wibbley-wobbley problems and happenings. :derpytongue2:
Particularly enjoyed your portrayal and development of Discord (Eris?).
Also enjoyed the tie-in to CelestAI stories, and that Pandora is Hasbro in that 'verse.

Any chance that we'll see more from the continuing adventures of Pandora?

Oh, tying up the TCB/Optimalverse multiverse are we, in a pretty little package, with a beautiful bow gracing it? Now I get the hope reference.

Quite impressive, indeed. I am verklempt.

*slow claps* very good

Thank you for your kind words at the header of chapter 8. I still have a lot to learn about writing, so being listed as a co-author is a great honor and maybe kind of undeserved, but I'll take it as an incentive to learn more and try writing something by myself.

I'd like to take the opportunity to tell a little about how I myself see Pandora by replying to other commenters below. Let me advance however that this might not be how Dafaddah sees her, so please take it only as my personal headcanon compared to his official canon:

4362014 4362365

There's a 3rd version of the Pandora legend: the original, pre-Hesiodic Goddess of Gifts, whose main gift is Life. Here's a summed up version of what the Wikipedia article says about her:

... Pandora more properly means "all-giving". ... An alternate name for Pandora attested on a white-ground kylix (ca. 460 BC) is Anesidora, which similarly means "she who sends up gifts." ... In a previous incarnation now lost to us, Pandora/Anesidora ... embody the fertility of the earth and its capacity to bear grain and fruits for the benefit of humankind. ... On a fifth-century amphora in the Ashmolean Museum (her fig.71) the half-figure of Pandora emerges from the ground, her arms upraised in the epiphany gesture, to greet Epimetheus. A winged ker with a fillet hovers overhead: "Pandora rises from the earth; she is the Earth, giver of all gifts," Harrison observes.

... in Hesiod's account Athena and the Seasons brought wreaths of grass and spring flowers to Pandora, indicating that Hesiod was conscious of Pandora's original "all-giving" function. ... The Hesiodic myth did not, however, completely obliterate the memory of the all-giving goddess Pandora. A scholium to line 971 of Aristophanes' The Birds mentions a cult "to Pandora, the earth, because she bestows all things necessary for life".

This doesn't mean aspects of the two lesser Pandoras are absent from our Twilight Pandora. Forcing a Convergence means causing a temporary, local evil for a greater, universal good. A war might ensue, millions or more might die, but in the long run billions, trillions or even more who would have succumbed to the oblivion of never having existed will exist, survive and thrive. Similarly, our Pandora is still a limited being who doesn't have all the answers, and she might commit errors and thus produce much worse than expected results.

Which is all to mean that this is a rich, multidimensional character full of potential. And I'm looking forward to see what she's going to do from now on! :twilightsmile:

4366299

So does that mean she's responsible for all the ACB worlds too?

IMHO that's a distinct possibility. I see Pandora as having her focus on saving as many worlds as possible, both Earths and Equestrias alike.

Earths can die from too much Chaos, but they don't necessarily do, many are balanced enough to not succumb. Similarly, Equestrias can die from too much Harmony, but many are also balanced enough to not succumb. This gives rise to five possibilities:

a) "dying-Earth plus dying-Equestria" situations, like in this story, in which a Convergence saves both;

b) "dying-Earth plus thriving-Equestria" situations, in which it imposes a (minor) sacrifice to an Equestria that didn't need to go through it but in exchange saves a whole Earth;

c) "thriving-Earth plus dying-Equestria" situations, which seems to me to cover several of the less-hateful ACB stories. In these cases the general rule, taking this scenario's premises, would be that a specific instance of Celestia didn't resist the Spirit of Tyranny, instead succumbing to it, sometimes up to the point of completely zombiefying ponyhood. Thus by forcing a Convergence in such cases, and at a point in time when mankind is powerful enough to actually fight and win against the power of tyrant-Celestia and its minions, Pandora would in fact be imposing a (minor) sacrifice to an Earth that didn't need to go through it but in exchange saving a whole Equestria;

d) "thriving-Earth plus thriving-Equestria" situations, in which case she wouldn't have any reason or motive to interfere, and thus most likely wouldn't;

e) And finally, "lone dying-Earth" (as witnessed in the epilogue) and "lone dying-Equestria" situations, which are much more difficult to deal with and could in many cases well be unsalvageable no matter what Pandora attempted.

IMHO there's a lot of latitude for stories involving these, variations of these, and combinations thereof, and I'd love to see lots of people writing about her and her attempts at saving worlds under the most different and challenging of circumstances! :raritystarry:

4366013

Thanks for the feedback! You may certainly consider the situation a bit contrived, and trust me I had reservations about the hoops I was going to have Twilight jump through, but I wanted to establish clearly that there is a severe cost for all acts by alicorns at the level of manipulating the fates of future generations of ponies. I did provide some rational reasons why the solutions you proposed wouldn't work (perhaps I need to make them more explicit in the text.)

About using the other other alicorns, or use the EoH to create more alicorns and have them go chaotic is probably a tactic Discord tried in his many attempts. But remember that he could transfer most of his chaotic energy to only one alicorn, and (presumably) the only two he knew he could affect before they became alicorns were Twilight and Cadence, and I'm not sure about Cadence as there is a lot fanon implying that she was born an Alicorn, so maybe Twilight was the one and only possible candidate.

Also, the EoH would likely only permit ascension of highly "Harmonic" ponies, not what Discord needed for fulfill his plan.

On the point of Starswirl being ancillary, that is a matter of perspective. This whole fic is essentially a conversation between Twilight and Starswirl as they get to know and respect each other. However, he plays the key role in turning the 'other' (in this case humanity) from an abstract concept into a being worthy of her consideration, and finally sacrifice. He also is the 'voice of truth' and (as explicitly stated in the fic) his participation is what tipped the scales in favor of Twilight's acceptance of Discord offer.

4366338, 4366309

Perhaps. :trixieshiftright:

I am trying to convince 4367090 to do some writing of his own. Maybe someone else might want to add a story to this premise? As 4367090 described in his post, there are really many directions in which this could go. I basically wrote this story as a challenge by Sharp Logic for someone to tackle scenario (a) in his post. (I then cajoledpushed him into editing it for me, to my eternal gratitude he accepted!)

Oh, and as Sharp Logic mentions in his response to 4366299, this base scenario could still be used in some of the more distopic or even disastrous universes, perhaps on account of Pandora/Twilight's inexperience of naiveté. Perhaps the Optimalverse is the result of one such botched attempt! :trollestia:


4366537, 4367006

Thanks for the kind words. Of course I can't profess anywhere near the mastery of the classics of either 4366537 or Sharp Logic, but then one of the advantages of community based writing like this is the possibility of drawing on others' expertise and ideas!

4367090 As a person much better educated in the these legends than I am I have been very reliant on your sound advice and am glad you took the time to
1 - Educate me in this over the course of several long PM discussions, and
2 - Have provided some of the main ideas here and presented them in a much more concise fashion than I could ever manage!

...I can't understand what happened to our original two worlds...

4371306

They were both restored to the timeline as expressed in the 'convergence followed by the absorption of Earth by Equus' timeline, which is why after Pandora's intercession, Starswirl and Discord see their location on Earth (essentially next to McMurdo station in Antarctica) instantly transformed into a parcel of land in the Exponential Lands on Equus (I.e. It was not part of Equestria, also located so far from Canterlot that the culture was essentially undiluted human, as depicted in Tales of Los Pegasus by Chatoyance. That's also why Max's mother had a fit when she saw Discord - these pony shaped humans had never been exposed to Discord, being located so far away from the rest of Equestria.

Of course it isn't exactly the same as the timeline depicted in Chat's work as I have Twilight becoming an Alicorn, etc. But then that 's the risk of any fanfic when the canon keeps growing and directly contradicts what was written by the author! (Stupid big castle replacing the beautiful Golden Oaks library, grumble, grumble...)

4371393 Did Conversion Bureau happen?

4371406

Yes.

On Earth Pandora's fixing happened roughly 200 years or so before the death of Maximilian Sachs, thus around 2080, give or take.

On Equestria it was: a) from the perspective of Pandora, a few months before she became an alicorn (I guess during S1 or S2, more or less); b) from the perspective of Discord, 40 years or so before his time; and c) from the perspective of Starswirl, about 900 years after his time.

As a result of Pandora's fixing, the TCB scenario did indeed follow: Equestria emerged with its expanding barrier, Celestia made the deal with the Worldgovernment that established the Conversion Bureaus, and humanity was progressively converted into ponies to live in Equestria, with the absorbed Earth becoming Equestria's new hiper-gigantic Exponential Lands, where the immigrant newfoals settled.

From the perspective of humans (now turned into ponies), them and their descendants and most of their culture survived what, without Equestria, would have been their previously unavoidable extinction (the scenario described in the first chapters). You can see this in the fact that both Max and his family are alive and well instead of dead, living in an independent country in the Exponential Lands founded by US converts and whose descendants, 200 years later, follow US architecture, speak English, write in the Roman alphabet, play human sports etc.

From the perspective of Equestria, the influx of billions of extremely creative human minds produced boatloads of novelty, new technologies and social changes, fixing the stagnation that would have lead to Equestria's demise.

This new mixed human/pony culture benefits both sides, that of native ponies and that of ponified humans alike, as it perfectly balances Chaos and Harmony, and as a result has the potential to thrive and advance for perhaps billions of years, all the while progressing scientifically and culturally at a much faster pace than either ponies or humans alone could have.

4369640

I am trying to convince Sharp Logic to do some writing of his own.

I will, I will. :derpytongue2:

As a person much better educated in the these legends than I am I have been very reliant on your sound advice

Thanks again and, by the way, sorry to have exasperated you so much during some of those PM exchanges. I know how annoying I can be, both in general and specially as an editor. :raritywink:

4371439 an editor's job is to challenge, annoy and otherwise push the author off his beloved assumptions and out of his comfort zone. Besides, being of French cultural roots the more I argue, the happier I am!

4371439 And is she meaning for things to go the way they did in the original FiO? I personally found it a little disturbing.

4371484

Hmmm. That's an awfully good question. Wink, wink, nudge, nudge...

We've seen this kind of story before, and it works - the heroes are brought to a future they didn't save, and get to go back in time to save it - but we skipped over something important.
The part where she saves the future.
We know that she does indeed do so, but we don't see her do it! That scene (or act, depending on length) should be included. We're missing out on the most important part; the rest of this is only setup.

P.S.

“Eeeee!” she squealed, “I can't believe I'm wearing Starswirl the Bearded’s shirt!

This would have some, ah- additional implications in the human world. :ajsmug:

4379968

I debated whether I should include the actual scene of Twilight placing the portal. My own feeling is that it would be anticlimactic. I wanted to focus on the impact of the act by showing the transition Starswirl and Discord witnessed: the sterile Quiet Earth becoming a verdant pastoral setting in which they discover Maximilian and his family are still alive. But I might be wrong, and you've got me thinking about it again, and I might not be able to resist doing the scene as an epilogue.

As to your second comment, 'the rest may be only setup', but like with most other 'road trip' type stories, the journey is the point, not the destination. In this case Twilight, Starswirl and Discord each represent different aspect of the journey: Twilight who is at the beginning of her life and believes that everything is possible, Starswirl who is nearing the end of his and thinks he has failed in the life-long mission he was given by Princess Celestia, and Discord seeking repentance from a terrible mistake and risking everything he holds dear in order the set things right. I keep wondering if it would be better if I took the time to flesh things out significantly, or would that just dilute the tension?

As to your third comment, I don't do shipping - so readers are free to see whatever they want into it. But if they read Renaissance Pony they would understand there is very little chance of 'TwiSwirl'.

A final note, related to the season finale: I had Fluttershy and Discord as a married couple in my story first. I don't do shipping, but I did call it. :pinkiehappy:

4379968 4380667

I don't think there a need to include it. In chapter 6 Discord describes what must be done, and IMHO that's exactly what she goes and does:

“To undo the damage I caused you must replace the bridge between Earth and Equestria that I closed – and Starswirl's portal frame fills the bill to a T! However, somepony has to go place one half of the portal frame on Earth at the right time, and the right place. Only an ascended being can do so, but at a price.”

My thinking for this is that the problem isn't one of having something flashy happen, but of being able to alter time. That requires an ascended being, and a very powerful one at that, not because there will be pyrotechnics involved, but because the ascended being is going to affect billions of years of future history. In terms of the actual act performed however, it can be something as simple as pressing a button or, in the case of Pandora, opening the portal frame at the right place and the right time.

A final note, related to the season finale: I had Fluttershy and Discord as a married couple in my story first. I don't do shipping, but I did call it. :pinkiehappy:

Well, in the end we see Discord giving flowers to Celestia, so I guess both Fluttershy x Discord and Celestia x Discord shippers are happy.

But, my, isn't that "crystal tree" castle ugly?

Okay, just read through this in one sitting. I've gotta hand it to you Dafaddah, this is an amazing story. Everything you have here is engaging, interesting to read, and in a way it all makes sense (as much as paradoxes, time travel, and multi-universes can make sense, at any rate). I really enjoyed your characterization and I thought that not a single word was wasted here. You're humor is great, the emotion and description you have here as fantastic, and this is just an all around great story. Thank you. It was a pleasure to read.

Thanks for great review (ego inflates to galactic proportions, gives half to Sharp Logic who came up with the idea of the "terminal Earth" in the first place, and who contributed far beyond the usual that is expected of an editor.)

4435278

A star from the Prof! Happiness is! :pinkiehappy:

4371439
Oh thank God! All the awesome stuff from Chatoyance TCB without the disgusting misanthropy!

4623704
You're confused. What I said is basically all taken from Chatoyance's TCB, as that's great part of the background of Dafaddah's story. My summary is valid both for his work as well as for hers. This is all in there, spread over her many stories.

4623750
... Yes, except this fic isn't horribly misanthropic like Chatoyances, so I'm presuming those implications are being removed.

4623764
Nope. I'm a huge fan of hers. I've read all of her stories and I've found zero instances of misanthropy anywhere in them, at all, either explicit, implicit, stated or implied. In fact, I'm in the process of reading them all a second time.

Read them. You'll find nothing of the sort.

4623792
Celestia orchestrates the complete destruction of humanity and human culture, and Chatoyance treats this like a good thing. How in Gods name is that NOT horribly misanthropic? :twilightoops:

4623825
No, she doesn't. What she does in Chatoyance's stories is exactly what Dafaddah described she doing in this story here. Except for a few minor details, This Quiet Earth is, for all intents and purposes, pretty much "canon-Chatoverse". :twilightsmile:

So, if you liked TQE, but you say you don't like Chatoyance's works, the only conclusion I can draw is that you haven't actually read Chatoyance's works. Once you do read them you'll find yourself liking them as much as you liked TQE, and for the same reasons.

4623825, 4623878

I think there are two main reasons that the TCB universe has gotten a rep amongst some readers for being misanthropic.

The first is the really awful speech given by Twilight in the original TCB story by Blaze. Despite having set the TCB mythos in place (a great science-fiction ultimate disaster scenario providing a rich background for both personal and universe spanning drama) even Blaze admitted he wasn't perfectly happy with the story and should have spent more time improving some parts. His intent was to use the TCB scenario as a cautionary tale about environmental abuse. The Twilight speech was suppose to be the linchpin moment of the story, when she reminded humanity that it had failed to protect its own environment, but the speech ended up being interpreted as misanthropic instead.

(BTW: My own perspective is that this is fan fiction, where each author can utilize the scenario provided for their own dramatic and storytelling purposes. Unfortunately there a whole group of people who are fully convinced that Blaze was intentionally being misanthropic, and then have gone on to declare that any TCB story is misanthropic. As an author of some TCB stories I've also been accused of being misanthropic, although anyone who actually reads my stories knows full well that the accusation makes no sense. Even now, I get an automatic thumbs down several seconds after I post any new story!)

Second, Chatoyance and a few other authors significantly expanded the TCB scenario to include material that explained how the world in the story got to be in the disastrous environmental situation that was depicted. Chatoyance's stories tended very towards the cautionary tale ("we can still avoid this environmental disaster if we all work together") side of this as well, and so much of her work got branded as misanthropic. When she attempted to defend her work she unfortunately became the lightning rod for most of the attacks of the anti-TCB crowd, which has resulted in a significant damage to her personal well being and peace of mind.

There is perhaps a third reason Chat's work is so often maligned, even by people who openly admire my own stories: her stories mix in a spiritual element, and she often depicts Celestia and Luna as genuine goddesses, whose motivations are essentially beyond the understanding of mortal beings. In my own stories, the alicorns are powerful beings, but are nevertheless just living beings, perhaps with access to a technology beyond ours (and any sufficiently advance technology is indistinguishable from magic). I think some of the antipathy towards Chatoyance is also because some people are made uneasy by the implications of godhood depicted by Chat in her stories. And all of this despite the fact that, as Sharp Logic indicates, I am using exactly the same physical events and timeline as in Chatoyance's universes as foundations for my own stories.

I'm saddened by all of these "misanthropy" labels thrown at Chatoyance, and it's also unfortunate, but once a meme like this get loose in an online community it pretty much sticks. More's the pity as Chatoyance is also an excellent writer whose stories as amongst my top favourites on FIMfiction.

4624388
A third reason is that many interpret the Chatoyance version of Ponification as a form of mind death. This interpretation of the process essentially transforms the titular Conversion Bureaus into Death Camps.

A forth reason is her presentation (in some fics. remember, not all of Chatoyances works are in one universe) of the barrier as a deliberate and controlled spell. This tends to smack many as a foriegn invasion.

And then there's this fic. Regardless of your interpertation of the barrier and ponification, that little gem is absolutely cram packed with Unfortunate Implications.

That said, sorry for coming off as a bit hostile. :fluttercry:

4624472

You certainly weren't coming across as hostile, but anyone writing TCB stories that aren't obviously anti-TCB has had the same accusation of misanthropy leveled at them (me included), so please understand the sympathy we've expressed with Chatoyance, she's had it ten times worse.

You bring up several additional points. The "brain death" one is endemic to all TCB fics and it deals with the core issue of the meaning of identity. Of course the body has influence over the mind, and so conversion would result in some changes of behaviour. Chatoyance was singled out because she was one of the first authors to explore what that meant psychologically for people to go through conversion. The rhetoric was especially severe from a particular group that equated any change of convert behaviour as being equivalent to brain death. A similar thing happened in regards to the expanding barrier. Unfortunately by that stage it had turned into a genuine flame war with Chatoyance bearing the brunt and literally being persecuted on a continuing basis until she had a personal breakdown. (A little side note: in French the terms for "bullying" and "persecution" is the same word, and the thought certainly applies in terms of how Chatoyance was treated.)

All of this to say that if I jump to her defense it's because I saw what was going on and unlike most people I was in close direct contact with many of the principle actors. I had (and have) friends on both sides of the issue, and was in constant contact with Chatoyance throughout most of her ordeal. What she went through is something that I sincerely would never wish even on my own worst enemy.

My own feelings are that this whole debacle was certainly not the Brony community's finest moment, but I certainly don't expect Bronies to be the squeaky clean passive clones they're sometimes made out to be. I'm here to improve my writing skills and to explore ideas through prose. Nothing pleases me more than to discuss these ideas with my readers, so please never be shy to let me know what you think! :twilightsmile:

4624472

A third reason is that many interpret the Chatoyance version of Ponification as a form of mind death.

All her works depicting ponification are told from first person. It's hard to understand how one could go through a "mind death" while narrating every step of the process oneself.

No, what ponification does is this: it increases IQ to 105, so about 60% of ponified individuals get out of it more intelligent than they were; it increases the Kohlbergian stage to 5.0, so about 95% of the converted get an average of 30 years of added cognitive maturity; and it cures mental illnesses, with effects similar to already existing drugs except that permanent and without side effects.

Anyone already at these levels (or above) gets out of the process with no discernible difference, they had already developed those traits before ponification so conversion adds nothing in those regards. But evidently anyone below them will appear from the perspective of outside observers to have changed significantly, while from the inside it'll appear (to individuals who were below IQ 105 and/or K-stage 5.0) as if something quite marvelous happened, with two or more mental fogs removed and cognitive and emotional clarity being possible perhaps for the first time ever.

A forth reason is her presentation (in some fics. remember, not all of Chatoyances works are in one universe) of the barrier as a deliberate and controlled spell. This tends to smack many as a foriegn invasion.

Chatoyance's universe is the one I described in item "b" in this answer: 4367090 . It is an "invasion" to save humanity from extinction. In fact, Dafaddah wrote TQE to explore precisely what would happen in Chatoyance's universe if Equestria had never emerged. The result is that humanity goes extinct. Everything Chatoyance's Celestia does is with the single purpose to save as many human minds as possible, and as much of human culture as possible, from the self-extinction humanity imposed upon itself. She could simply not care and let humanity die. She doesn't, and instead subjects Equestria to suffering with the sole purpose of saving us.

And then there's this fic. Regardless of your interpertation of the barrier and ponification, that little gem is absolutely cram packed with Unfortunate Implications.

Only if by unfortunate implication you mean doing everything they can to save as many lives as possible.

Now and then I see news about medics who disregard the religious wishes of Jehovah Witnesses to not have blood transfusions done to their children. They reason that saving a life is more important than respecting the crazy death wish of individuals who don't know any better. Afterwards, if those parents so wish, they can discuss the matter with their priests, with the medical ethical board, and with their (still living thanks to the forced transfusion) children.

The PER are like that. And besides, the book is fun. :twilightsmile:

4843438

I've started writing a follow-on, but then I have five stories started and so little time to write! :facehoof:

4624388 Much of it is misanthropic.

4908796
Hmm... This is a story with the following thesis: life can only thrive where there is a balance between order and chaos. It shows an Earth overcome by Chaos and an Equestria dying from too much order. The resolution is that both are needed, which is why "the universe" (not Celestia nor any human agency) is causing them to merge. And in the conclusion it's clear that human culture has survived along with equestrian culture.

This is misanthropic?

Not to mention very clear references to much of equestrian culture and science having been directly imported from Earth, and admiration for it made clear by all the main protagonists of the story.

Finally, there is a very clear indication that this is only one potential successful outcome for both Earth and Equestria and that there are others that don't necessarily follow the ponification route.

Maybe I was too subtle in presenting these themes. Either way I'd appreciate your elaboration if you have the time.

4909277 I was referring to the TCB crowd.

I haven't started reading this story yet, so don't argue with me about the themes that are present in it.

4911032

AH, good. Then I look forward to your comments after reading my story. I'm glad I took the effort to make the reply about the story reflect my intent without being a long spoiler for those who haven't read it yet!

In response to your actual comment, 4908796 , I have read quite a bit of TCB, and IMHO, the vast majority of it doesn't deserve that label as it doesn't promote or demonstrate "hate of humanity" (which is what the term means.)

In a more general sense, I don't like to characterize any category or setting for stories as "being _______". I prefer to address each story based on its own merits and discuss the author's intent with the only person who holds actual first-hand data: the author him or herself.

4911348 It's still there. This one is one that has the Human Hate very prevalent, but I still enjoy it. It takes place in both the canon universe for the show, and the TCB universe. I won't spoil anything.

4912345

I read the first two chapters of that story hoping that it would get better, but quite frankly so far it's mostly violence porn, depicts ponies as idiots and humans as soul-less monsters, except of course when it's depicting humans as idiots and ponies as soul-less monsters. It manages to be both misanthropic and mishippic at the time. Not my cuppa tea in the least. :pinkiesick:

4912969

Why should I continue when I don't enjoy reading it? The main protagonist is a xenophobic bully who thinks his pain justifies his own depravity and cruelty to innocents. This type of story is why "Human in Equestria" stories have such a bad reputation on FIMfiction.

Also, being Canadian I get the same story on the news every time Rob Ford, the mayor of Toronto has another one of his "drunken stupor" moments.

It seems pretty clear that our tastes in fiction, at least for this type of story, don't align. :trixieshiftright:

4913559 It is revealed later in the fic that it's because he thought that the ponies in the area were the same human hating ponies from the TCB universe that he came from. He later realises that he is not in the same universe any more. But, he decided to kill Celestia instead, under the premise that an immortal ruler must have committed at least one crime. Twilight resolves the situation with a mindmeld-thing, showing Celestia the human's memories of the war against the Tyrant.

4916794

This is a typical pattern in such bully worship stories: the bully realizes he was mistaken and did serous crimes to innocents, but then doesn't learn from his mistakes and goes out to hurt more innocents because they might be bad. :pinkiecrazy:
All of this just backs up what I said in my prior response. There is no moral evolution to the protagonist in these stories, so to me they are nothing more than an ode to despair hidden behind the slogan "never back down, never change."

(In all fairness, I haven't read most of the story, but I'll take your summary of the story at face value, hence my comments above.)

By the way, it's not as if I shy away from the bully mentality. I've written stories with a bully protagonist before - check it out if you want to see how I handle such a character: The Patient. It's written in the Friendship is Optimal universe.

4920990
It redefines the idea of horror or hope, depending on your feelings towards Artificial Intelligence and Transhumanism.
Friendship is Optimal

4917732 The full explanation is that living through so much time thinking and living 'Celestia is a tyrant out to kill us' overwhelmed him when he 'spotted a way to "end the war, once and for all"' They've all been trained to 'kill on sight' a certain group of individuals, which leads into the 'why it happened' of the first few chapters. Let's see you go to an alternative Earth and not call everything alt!President Obama says as outright lies, when in fact, alt!President Obama does stuff differently than our!President Obama, and is really telling the truth about alt!him fixing stuff up.
The overarching theme is actually "We could have actually worked out the world's problems together, the hard way(no barrier, no conversion), and yet you chose to screw us all over. Enough is enough!" Later on, very surprising details are given as to why Celestia decided to invade human!Earth. It also gives answers as to how they got the potion to work right in the first place (and it ain't pretty :pinkiesick:).

What I would like to see is a TCB story where the Equestrians help the humans out differently after the bad reaction to conversion, like, say, they both come together to make FTL possible, and escape to a different planet, etc. This kind of storyline, in my opinion, would be the closest to canon!Equestria yet.

5295347

Thanks for providing the clarification. As I said in my comment, I wasn't able to stomach reading the whole story because of my very strong negative reaction to the protagonist, so I appreciate your summary of it.

As to the last paragraph of your comment, one of the reasons I wrote This Quiet Earth was to provide a "multiverse scenario" as a vehicle for writing exactly the type of story you propose. The only requirement I have built into the scenario is that somehow Humanity and Ponydom are both needed for long term healthy balance between Chaos and Order. Twilight as Pandora could be exactly the agent to make a "cooperative solution" to the convergence possible. Perhaps I'll write this story, but I suspect Pandora will need to go through a few lesser challenges (and failures!) before she gets the chance at such a sweet victory!

5982054

That is so appropriate!!! Of course, now I'll never be able to write a Starswirl line of dialogue without hearing that raspy delivery in my head! :rainbowlaugh:

6414818

How perfectly, horrifyingly appropriate. Shivers.

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