Goodbye, My Friend, Goodbye

Adeire #1 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 2 · ·

They main char will probably never realize she already had one, for a while...
Might have to read again, because I feel like some parts may have a different message after the first read.

Changeling404

Changeling404 #2 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 1 · ·

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..................................... there are 37 dots here. For any of you who know the significance of death and the #37. Wallow in regret with me now... for it was a comedy-tragedy, unlike any other at the time. Goodbye Carl, goodbye ALL!

Ice Star

Ice Star #3 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 1 · ·

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This doesn’t feel like it should be rated as teen. It might be a side effect of your writing being very descriptive but multiple points of the story are fairly explicit about the results of the mauling that’s happening, and it’s usually the details about those that push a story as mature-gore instead of telling the reader about the actions or teasing a bit here or there.

I would suggest pumping the rating up. There’s also species character tags if you wanted to add them.

darf

darf #4 · Mar 5th, 2020 · · ·

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10116501
Howdy. Thanks for the comment. I both agree and disagree. My main point of contention is my deliberate avoidance of pushing this into mature by poetrying up the descriptions of gross stuff and leaving as much ambiguous as I could about the actual act of what's going on. It's also not meant to be blatant as to the result of the encounter either.

I think I probably could change it, but stories like this don't seem to draw much attention, and I'm also not sure that it would necessarily improve reader retention. That being said, I really appreciate the feedback.

I added species tags too, now that you told me about them. Thanks again <3

Ice Star

Ice Star #5 · Mar 5th, 2020 · · ·

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10116881
Passages like this taking up most of the story once the action start don't really strike me as teen content though:

A collection of platelets and dead blood cells. Interstitial tissue. Mushy, peeling flesh, surrounding the outside of an interlocking crater in the skin. Black, red, and festering.

"They can see me again!" the changeling screamed. Her legs thrashed, her wings sputtered and flickered and ached to come to life, but fell damply under the weight of the accumulated blood and tissue. "They're outside, they're hearing me, they're going to come in and let me out..."

This one, so large, it must have been a rash, a chafing, so shallow, we can just shred, we can scratch like a matte surface, tear up little flecks each time until the whole thing is a carpet of blood and weeping sores—
This one, the back of her neck, big, bulbous, protruding, need to crunch it tight together like a ball so we can push it out from the skin, then find a hold, then crush as you yank, take the whole thing in one go—

These particular highlights really had me raising an eyebrow reading. There's a lot of poetic prose in here, but it isn't really centered around the injuries themselves because they're given a very detailed, obsessive focus that really contradicts the discretion that comes with the site's policy for T-rated gore:

Gore
The gore tag, when used with a teen rating, is used as a warning that the story contains (generally somewhat vague) descriptions of violence, bloodshed, or injuries. We will generally allow a decent bit of violence here, but if a ton of people are dying or you’re describing gruesome injuries, you’ll need to move it to mature.

Nothing comes across as vague or implicit. You aren't really telling me that someone's head got hacked off with a sword here, you're describing every bit of blood and bone related to it. I have no problem with mature-rated gore, but it's not really the point; aside from mature-rated gore content having fewer readers (sadly) I don't feel like there's a good reason to keep the story rated teen because it would be dishonest and breaks site rules. How do you feel that passages like these could be considered teen-rated?

darf

darf #6 · Mar 5th, 2020 · · ·

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10116894
I guess I'm thinking mostly back to the stuff I wrote and read when I was a teenager. For some reason The Things They Carried is a touchstone here, I remember reading that book in high school and learning about things like Vietnamese spike traps and prostitution and people drowning in quicksand and being blown apart with mortar... and that wasn't a particularly visceral depiction of these things that I hadn't seen worse before, in war movies or things like Schindler's List.

I think, as a debate, you win without contention. I just don't know that it's a matter which can be objectively determined. I read stuff much worse than this when I was a teenager, and don't find it particularly disquieting or upsetting at all. I think the point about a 'ton of people dying' is moot. 'Gruesome' injury definitely fits the tagline, as that's the entire premise of the story... Idk. I just feel like because it's so intimate and personal it doesn't vacation into the abstract of "there is so much awful death and gore in the world that I physically can't comprehend it as a teenage person".

Like... I'll change the tag. I don't really get anything out of it either way. I just don't know that it's very important for a story this unpopular that's an experimental attempt at boundary pushing anyway. I wrote it in the same vein as And to Ashes which arguably has gory and even sexual themes in it but which I think maybe I still rated teen? or I'm gonna go back and find out it was mature and shoot my entire argument in the foot.

Idk. I just feel like this is a very serious deal for you, and it isn't for me. I could pick up a YA novel with much more graphic depictions of violence and sexual assault and not waffle at the tag. That all being said, I feel like I pretty much agree with your interpretation. I just don't like the idea of changing a very specific content thematic that was important to the story, namely the idea that I would keep it restrained from directly transcending into anything sexual or specifically fetishistic. I mean, it is a fetish regardless of the context of that word, but it didn't feel during writing anything like my more salacious material, and frankly it pretty directly resembles a short story I turned into my High School Creative Writing class. So Idk.

If I hear from a few more people that it's a big deal, I'll change the tag. Otherwise I'm content to die on my tiny anthill and let the thing wither into obscurity anyway.

I really do enjoy the level of passion in your comment though. You're one of my favorite fimficers to look forward to comments from. :) <3

Ice Star

Ice Star #7 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 1 · ·

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10116904

I guess I'm thinking mostly back to the stuff I wrote and read when I was a teenager. For some reason The Things They Carried is a touchstone here, I remember reading that book in high school and learning about things like Vietnamese spike traps and prostitution and people drowning in quicksand and being blown apart with mortar... and that wasn't a particularly visceral depiction of these things that I hadn't seen worse before, in war movies or things like Schindler's List.
I think, as a debate, you win without contention. I just don't know that it's a matter which can be objectively determined. I read stuff much worse than this when I was a teenager, and don't find it particularly disquieting or upsetting at all.

I'm not familiar with The Things They Carried but high schools have been including adult books in their curriculum to shake things up.

I think the point about a 'ton of people dying' is moot. 'Gruesome' injury definitely fits the tagline, as that's the entire premise of the story... Idk. I just feel like because it's so intimate and personal it doesn't vacation into the abstract of "there is so much awful death and gore in the world that I physically can't comprehend it as a teenage person".

'Tons of people dying' is a really weird qualifier to have for the difference between content. I tend to boil it down to 'explicit' vs. 'non-explicit' since that one is more easily categorized and objective regardless of who the content audience is. I've certainly read more mature material as a teenager, but by then I was usually deliberately going out of what counted as teenage fiction.

Like... I'll change the tag. I don't really get anything out of it either way. I just don't know that it's very important for a story this unpopular that's an experimental attempt at boundary pushing anyway.

I usually think it is always best to tag things correctly because it ties into presentation and aesthetics. If something feels like it was sorted in a way that came across as impulsive, sloppy, or dishonest from little things like description and whatnot and can negatively impact the perception of a work and an author.

I wrote it in the same vein as And to Ashes which arguably has gory and even sexual themes in it but which I think maybe I still rated teen? or I'm gonna go back and find out it was mature and shoot my entire argument in the foot.

I'm not familiar with that story either, so I couldn't judge it.

Idk. I just feel like this is a very serious deal for you, and it isn't for me. I could pick up a YA novel with much more graphic depictions of violence and sexual assault and not waffle at the tag.

YA fiction is a weird label because it's essentially anything not for kiddos or adults and merged with teen fiction at one point. So, yes, you could find YA fiction with this kind of content because it covers anything from 12-18 as a general idea. You would probably have to use an older YA book to find content like this, though. I spend too much and not enough time in bookstores and reading about these kinds of classifications. FIMFic is nice in that it has strict categories for ratings, but not nice in that it doesn't have a YA rating that acts as a middle ground between mature and teen, but FIMFetch does. Otherwise, I would agree that this would be YA, at the least.

In general, I just think that because we're all on a site that presents rules and searching mechanisms to sort through fiction that offering the correct means to do so is courteous and such. There are tags for much more now, and sorting through stories that haven't been tagged right/labeled complete or not/properly re-tagged/can't be because authors aren't present can be frustrating. It also can clog searches. I've had to deal with people who refuse to tag stories featuring rape in the summary, lists, and so forth as rape because they've believed rape is a "gray area". Some people really don't like the rules and such.

That all being said, I feel like I pretty much agree with your interpretation. I just don't like the idea of changing a very specific content thematic that was important to the story, namely the idea that I would keep it restrained from directly transcending into anything sexual or specifically fetishistic. I mean, it is a fetish regardless of the context of that word, but it didn't feel during writing anything like my more salacious material, and frankly it pretty directly resembles a short story I turned into my High School Creative Writing class. So Idk.

I don't see it as mature = fetishy so much as mature = explicit content. You've clearly crafted something very interesting and non-sexual here, it's just that I felt the rating had dissonance with the story's actual content.

If I hear from a few more people that it's a big deal, I'll change the tag. Otherwise I'm content to die on my tiny anthill and let the thing wither into obscurity anyway.

I'd probably ~~just add it to some more groups~~ spam relentlessly because groups are really the best way to get your story across the site nowadays.

I really do enjoy the level of passion in your comment though. You're one of my favorite fimficers to look forward to comments from. :) <3

Aww, jeez. Thanks. I had no idea I stood out that much.

darf

darf #8 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 2 · ·

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10116967

Aww, jeez. Thanks. I had no idea I stood out that much.

You definitely do! You're one of the most articulate and enthusiastic commenters I've seen on the site. Any time you have something to say about my stories or blogs, I get excited to read what you've written, because it's obvious you've put a lot of thought and effort into your words.

I'll plunk the tag over to mature, just because I feel like you argued your point so well, and because it probably won't have an effect on story popularity by this point anyway. :p

Ice Star

Ice Star #9 · Mar 5th, 2020 · · ·

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10116977

You definitely do! You're one of the most articulate and enthusiastic commenters I've seen on the site. Any time you have something to say about my stories or blogs, I get excited to read what you've written, because it's obvious you've put a lot of thought and effort into your words.

Oh dang, really? Guess everyone else must be slacking because I didn't think I commented that much. :>

darf

darf #10 · Mar 5th, 2020 · 2 · ·

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10116984
Well, I've seen you on a few of my stories, and for some reason the combination of that avatar plus your commitment to proper spelling/grammar makes your comment stand out. Like, one of those faces you just recognize, y'know? I have a feeling I'll see more of you in the months to come! :)

Ice Star