This story is a prequel to The War for the Sun & Moon.
Twilight and the bearers have been missing. When they return, Celestia has to deal with how her student and friends have changed. Will she be able to, when they now possess as much power individually as the Princess of the Sun?
I would like to thank everyone/pony/ling/hyperintelligent shade of the color blue who reads this, and my sister, who attempted to be the editor for this story.
Tags: Adventure for some globetrotting, Dark because... well, look at that cover art!
Comedy for general Pinkie-ness.
[A/N] The cover art is one of my favorites from the comics. It doesn't have much to do with the story, or does it?
Chapters (5)
I started reading because of cover art but uhh you have my attention
Now gimmie more! >:( MORE CHAPTERS!
the placement of the cliffhanger is far more of a turnoff than something that piques my interest
5377336 just wait. I have raisins behind my apparent madness.
But yeah, I can never resist a good/decent cliffhanger. Nothing brings people in more than wanting to know what's next. I had two choices in my mind for cliffhangers this chapter, either the alicorn reveal or the one I currently have.
Hi my brother! I'm really glad to be the editor here and I hope this story'll be epic!!!
5382032 Okay, that's enough. Now get back into your Editor's Cage, You very well can't be doing work if you're not in there!
Yeah, like I said in the A/N, I wanted to get this out in prep for the next part. This next part'll dive into my own personal opinions on how Celestia has acted throughout the majority of the show, and how the Six might react if this was brought to light
5384350
oh, so this is going to be Celestia bashing. Thanks for the warning
5385171 well, yeah, if you put it that way. Should there be a tag for it?
although, it won't be from me or the Six. It'll be from some on the outside, looking in. Ones who aren't under Celestina's influence.
5385460
I would, but then my response to someone trying to punish Celestia for how she acts on the show is "You want to punish a saint?"
5384114 Awwwwwww.... *Goes back to the cage*
If you just thought about it you wouldn't have to get it off your chest.
It took the Elements of Harmony to banish Nightmare Moon, Celestia couldn't use them. It took the Elements of Harmony to defeat Discord, Celestia couldn't use them.
5387793 Wow, you read fast.
My main issue is that Celesita did abso-freakin-lutely nothing to assist them at all. She may have known that these threats could only be countered with the Elements, but then why didn't she tell her student she would need them to defeat NMM? Why didn't she stop Discord from having fun while the Six were trapped within his maze? Why didn't she appear to give hope to the Crystal Ponies, and help defeat Sombra?
It was basically "Here's a bit of history. Go have fun!"
5387805
I admit to mostly skimming. Now, onto your comments
because you can't force friendship, Celestia had to hope Twilight could forge those bonds on her own.
Because her ability to counter Discord is limited to non-existent and we don't know how much his powers are able to affect her. The only time she was ever able to do something to counter them was protecting the Elements from him when he was released. As some fans have pointed out that was a total asspull by the writers since he was able to mess with them the first time. But who knows, perhaps since they were able to counter him, once they'd been screwed with once Celestia was able to find some way to adapt it that time.
Celestia has a duty to all Equestria. There's a repeated roleplaying type thread on the mlp 4chan boards(Princess Applejack) that points princesses are not beat cops. Also considering the presumed power levels of alicorns who says having multiple ones there would be reassuring to the Crystal ponies, as opposed to panic inducing. Also if they had their memories Celestia and Luna's attack on the Empire would be about the last thing they remember.
5387841 Please stop me if I start to sound like a snobby asswipe, but I'm working off of my own headcanon here. I can see your point about NMM and the bonds of friendship, hell, there wouldn't be a show without it.
The others are unknowns. If she was a real ruler, and wants to protect her ponies at all costs, then why didn't she try anything against Discord? Hundreds, maybe thousands depending on his reach, of ponies' lives were ruined by Discord. they might have been redeemed by the Element's power, but who's to say their emotional strife was cured?
Also, what is 4chan? Some kind of new virus? You are trying to use other's headcanon to counter my headcanon. You say the Crystal Ponies might fear alicorns for what happened one thousand and whatever years ago, then why did Celestia put Cadence in charge of the Crystal Empire?
Finally, note my use of the Alt. Universe tag. this is in no way concurrent with the show other than the aforementioned events. I set this about mid-S3, before Magical Mystery Cure, but after Discord Reformed.
5387956
she didn't try against Discord because she'd face him in the past and knew what he was capable of.
because somebody had to be in charge. And I'm suggesting the Crystal Ponies might be scared of her and Luna, not Alicorns in general
And this is the thing I'm talking about. I just really feel that to many expect Celestia to be a soldier not a ruler, it's a good point even if you don't subscribe to all the other stuff that's said here
>So, wait, why am Ah a princess again?
>Because you seem to be the only goddamn one of those ponies who gets that a Princess need to do actual work regarding maintenance of the kingdom. You know how much city planning or trade negotiations Twilight or Luna have done? Fucking nothing. Everyone is obsessed with the world ending threats they think I should fight, but the minute I point out the free healthcare I have to work to maintain everyone goes quiet. And don't even get me started on Cadence, who can't even manage a basic meeting with the Equestrian Games representative. Fucking annoying. Go do actual princess stuff, because apparently everyone else got the pamphlets mixed up or something and thinks "Princess" means "Beat cop."
Not to mention the fact that she didn't bother checking Tartarus to make sure Tirek or any other inmates didn't bust out or how she didn't mention having a previous student, and lets not forget about the Dazzlings. Honestly, I think Equestria is better off without Celestia and Luna (as much as I am a fan of hers).
5388001
Eh 4chan threads aren't really the best source for defending or critiquing the series, as even the princess applejack thread kind of forgets that Celestia is never really shown doing any kingdom maintenance either, unless you count the comics, and even that's mostly attending parties or defending Equestria from a shadow army and cockatrice army (she's much more of a badass in the officially licensed IDW comics).
Still, I overall agree with the point, a lot of these critiques seem to be based on the idea that the princesses are useless because they aren't extraordinary fighters or because they leave saving the world up to the reality hacking unbeatable artifacts. Which seems kind of unfair to expect the princesses to be these powerhouses, when every indication seems to point to the princesses being more powerful than the average pony, but not really anything compared to the big bads out there, even Twilight isn't shown as stupidly powerful without the reality hacking artifacts backing her up. There seems to be a lot of expectation for the princesses to be frontline soldiers which is kind of an unfair judgement when 90% of the big conflicts in the show rely on magical artifact trump cards or the mysterious power of love or something like that.
The problem with this line of thinking is that is generally holds the character being criticized up to a more realistic standard of behavior without realizing that almost all the characters in the entire show tend to fall apart when held up to similar standards. Holding the villains to these same standards show that Nightmare Moon was largely toothless after her plan for stopping the mane 6 from getting to the castle was laughably childish. By the same token, Discord could have easily won on multiple occasions but failed because he was basically a giant joker rather than what we would think a spirit of chaos would actually do. Chrysalis' whole plan was insanely stupid, had tons of holes in it, and she failed by basically being a massive moron, her return in the comics isn't much better as her plan wasn't much more thought through. Sombra was basically a non-entity until the end and his traps were barely speed bumps. Tirek probably had the best plan and that was only because it was so straight-forward.
Similarly, all of the Mane 6 can be accused of similar lapses in judgement, and held up to the same mirror as celestia, likely wouldn't have fared much better. It's basically holding the princess up to a standard of behavior that doesn't exist in the show for any characters because its a slice of life (no continuity) kid's show where Celestia is a tertiary character with less screen time than the CMC. The comics do a better job of showing how she rules since she gets issues actually focused on her and the Luna issue shows that Celestia is an integral part of running the country as an accomplished legal ruler and politician. Even in the show, it can be surmised that she has kept the country running for over a millennia, with friendly relations with other nations, so she is shown as an effective ruler even in just the show.
5388518
Tirek was the only one with anything more than a half-assed plan (mostly just because it was straight forwards steal all the magic and blast everything). There was no reason to mention Sunset as she was considered to not be threat, a student storming off after disobeying their teacher isn't really worth setting up in the previous three seasons of slice of life episodes, and even then, her plan turned out to be ten tons of stupid, and a high school of possessed teenagers wouldn't have posed much of a threat to the country in any sort of realistic scenario. The Dazzlings are also another case of there being no reason for Celestia to bring them up, they were gone, and if it weren't for Twilight having friends in the human world she wouldn't have had any reason to deal with them, unless they came back, but there is nothing suggesting that they wouldn't have just been re-banished again right away because their plan basically consisted of amassing enough power to go home with no idea how to deal with anything else.
As for Equestria being better off without Celestia and Luna, that's only true if we hold them up to a unique standard of behavior as we have no idea what leadership would be like without them, the government isn't the focus of the show, so we have no idea what kinds of things or threats lurk offscreen. The comics would suggest that Equestria would fall apart hilariously fast without Celestia doing the ruling and major day to day decisions, and that she regularly defends the land from threats, and the show itself shows her as a beloved ruler likely for a reason, considering the alternative is ponies like Blue blood, there's little reason to believe there are any better candidates in the canon universe.
5388518
the Dazzlings were banished by Starswirl the Bearded, and Celestia doesn't need to tell Twilight everything. "I had another student in the past so watch out for her." Why tell her that?
I remember that Lauren said celestia was imprisioned in sun by NMM when she came back.
5389115 Because she's afraid of confronting her own mistakes and would have someone else do it for her.
Thats nice plot twist especially with your description about cover art
I liked the previous chapters. This one, not so much. It feels a little too much villian cliche of Twilight, and the whole previous queen schtick was just overkill. IMO things were just fine with Twilight and gang just being changeling Alicorns.. I also thought they still identified themselves as still ponies at heart. This chapter makes them all sound like changelings vs ponies, unless they were just messing with Celestia's mind.
Somehow I don't quite believe that Celestia would make a whole town move so that she can have her new palace and forget. The public outcry that the changelings could make against Celestia and didn't is also something that I don't like. It's a bit OOC I think but if there is still more to say about this I am all ears.
5390222 yeah, I thought the fight would be the most fun to write, but it was the hardest. My take on the six: they still identify as ponies, but with the power and strength of a changeling queen.
5390334 Then why did she have Canterlot built? why did she abandon the Castle of the Two Sisters after banishing Luna?
And, yeah, 5390222 , it might have been overkill, but I felt it was necessary as a final blow to Celestia
5391053 Was it?
5391078 Sorta. Like I said, those scenes sounded a bit better in my head, but I tried to make them work. the whole mindbuck scene with Chrysalis and the other queens was complete spontaneity on my part. it was originally going to be just Chrysalis, saying she helped Twilight and her friends along this path once Twi absorbed her soul. i got it into my head as i wrote it that it would be interesting that Chrysalis did what she did, both here and in canon, because of transgressions a millennium ago.
5391053 The leaving reason is believable I give you that. The "GTFO I WANT THIS PLACE FOR MYSELF TO BUILD A NEW CASTLE WHERE I CALL MELLOW OUT." thing is... that's not something that Celestia would do. I mean imagine for a moment if Celestia came to your house and said "Get out of your house I want to weep for my sins. Oh and btw get a new house cause I'm gonna tear it down and build a new one." the only words anyone would utter would be WTF? Sorry I don't mean to mock you. I just feel this is the case.
5391097 I see.
But now with Twilight in power, not all of Equestria is not going to take 6 very likely.
Just saying. I for once feel quite uncomfortable with Twilight in power.
And you were making a sequel?
5391104 I will leave it to your imagination, but think of it like this: Celestia can't cope with the loss of her sister. She needs a scapegoat, because it obviously wasn't Her Royal Plotness who caused her sister to go crazy. She schemes up a betrayal plot which she uses to kick Gomorrah and her changelings out of her kingdom. Only Celestia holds all the knowledge.
5391111 Exactly.
5391168 Ok then.
5391168 Oh I see... she hides more than she lets in. I see...
So, now that it is over, what are your thoughts? what did you like, what didn't you like, what could I improve upon for later works?
I only ask that you do not flame me for something that is canon that I butchered. Note the use of the "Alt. Universe" tag.
And yeah, the first line of the Epilogue? Say it with me, CinemaSins: "Hey, let's have your character eat an apple in this scene. It'll make you look like even more of an asshole."
5391320 Well. It is good. But I want to free Equestria from Twilight and her friends. Cloudsdale is my first target to liberte.
What the word?
it was ok, a little rushed but nonetheless fine. Now I'm sure you offended a lot of people with this because i, for one, happen to like celestia and now she's the protagonist whereas the mane 6 is the antagonist. 3 words. Sequel, Twilight overthrown. Make it happen Maxes.
5392020 I Like Celestia as well, just, for me, there are a few things in canon she cannot account for.
5391974 I could possibly say the same about your profile pic, not that it's bad, just...weird.
i also think it was rushed but i liked it and i dont mind celestia being the victim here i dont like her that much anyway (shes too manipulative) although luna is best princess and hope she can be converted into the fold
5392623 I'm glad some liked the thought of Celestia being the victim. At least I didnt go with my other idea of Pinkie warping her magic to change Luna back into Nightmare Moon. Hey, it was her most powerful form, and Twi needed all the power she could harness
People, there will be a sequel eventually. I'm just going to take a bit of time, and try out some other ideas. Don't worry, I will not forget the Empress Twiliverse.
can you make a prequel of fall of celestia. like what happen to mane six before transformation.
5391320
overall I think it was terrible and illogical, and her justifications in the end make no sense. Starting a war with nations to avoid seeming weak? If they thought Equestria weak why weren't they starting wars
5547738 I'm sorry it took so long to reply, I just kept forgetting to.
In a word: magic. none of the other races has the manpower (or ability) to take on a nation so centered on something that cannot be stopped.
Think of the treaties that escalated WW1 and WW2 into world wars. those were in place to prevent war, but they were just pieces of paper. Also. OOC is a thing, and Twilight is no longer in character of the show. Once she got the power high from taking down Celestia, she had to continue eliminating foes to get that high.
... I got off track there. the other nations saw Celestia as weak, but the armies of Equestria were anything but. they knew if they pissed off Celestia or Luna, they would bring about the full might of the pony nation on their furry asses.
5600128
why would a weak leader build armies she wasn't strong enough to lead or at least use? It's an eternal monarchy, or diarchy. It's not like in a government where the head of state changes and may have different policies on the use of force and size of armies.
Is... Is that a Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy reference in the description?