If I May Brush Horsewords Aside for a Minute... · 9:51pm Feb 2nd, 2023
So something happened. To be vaguely specific, someone I shall not be naming came out. I saw this and I had… feelings about it. This led to a conundrum: how to react? I sat at my desk for probably a good fifteen minutes thinking on this. I wrote two or three attempts at a statement, but aborted them each time. I reloaded the announcement a few times to see what other people were doing, just to get a grasp of how my own response might be taken.
In the end, I chose not to react at all. I did this for multiple reasons. The first is that this was their day – heck, their week – and I didn’t want to be that guy, you know what I’m saying? There’s a time and a place for these things, and someone’s coming out blog is neither.
Yet this also posed a second problem: I didn’t react. If you go to the blog in question you’ll find literally hundreds of people rushing to congratulate this person on coming out. I did not, and both aspects bother me.
I am aware that what I am saying can be wildly misconstrued. Please, let me explain the big picture. I can do so by citing a theatrical example: Deadpool vs. The Beast. Let us step into the bloodthirsty arena of "inclusivity".
It’s 2017, and Disney has just released the live action reboot of Beauty and the Beast. I thought it was fine. Inferior to the original in almost every way, but still okay. But there was one thing that really rubbed me the wrong way, and that was the treatment of the ending. Let’s ZOOOOOOOM in on that gay couple, let’s ZOOOOOOOM in on that interracial couple, let’s ZOOOOOOOM in on all these things that are different. This is Disney saying “Please look at it, look at it, see how inclusive we are, don’t hate us, we swear we’re woke, we’ve got our brains fixed, give us your money, don’t hate us!”
It was insulting. To me, a cis-white male, but every person in the LGBTQ+ community should feel insulted too. Putting a spotlight on that which you consider weird and freaky and not normal is not inclusive. It’s a bunch of people uncomfortable about their own phobias and trying desperately to make everyone around them believe they aren’t, in fact, phobic.
Fast forward to 2018. Marvel and 20th Century Fox release Deadpool 2, a movie that is intended to be over-the-top nuts and maybe even a little offensive. I certainly thought the self-inflicted demise of Deadpool’s new team was excessive. But then we get reintroduced to the character (and I’m not making this name up) Negasonic Teenage Warhead. She’s got a girlfriend now! How does this play out? To summarize:
“Who’s that?”
“My girlfriend.”
“Alright then.”
No zooming in. No spotlights. No music. No curious or awed commentary (well, except for the lulz). It wasn’t treated as a special event. On the contrary, it was treated as normal.
I ask you, isn’t that the very definition of inclusive? That it’s normal, nobody cares, and we all move on with our day?
Now let’s get back to that person who came out. That was my reaction. “Alright then.” That’s a problem, and the fact that it’s a problem is also a problem.
It’s a problem in that, apparently, a lot of people care. The person who is coming out? They care. To them this is a big deal, presumably marking a large change in their life. Nobody can argue that. But then you get all these people falling over themselves to congratulate and celebrate this person coming out.
And that’s where I hesitated. In celebrating this stuff, are we not outright declaring “this is not normal and so it needs to be highlighted?” I don’t want to discourage LGBTQ+ people when they come out, but at the same time I don’t want to treat it as anything new, unusual, or special. I don’t think it should be special. When someone walks up to someone else and says “I’m gay” or “I’m trans” or whatever their identity happens to be, the response shouldn’t be “Oh, wow, that’s so cool, congratulations!” It should be a shrug and an invitation to play video games (or whatever your thing happens to be).
And yet, by not wanting to celebrate these things, I am aware that I can come off as the bad guy. Everyone wants to jump for joy and fire their party cannons. Meanwhile I’m not saying anything because I want to be polite and inoffensive, but in my head I’m thinking “You’re all doing it wrong.”
So I am at an impasse, one that I feel obligates me to explain my position lest people get the wrong impression. There’s a lot of nuance here and it puts me in an awkward position. I get why this is a big deal to the person coming out, and I get why everyone wants to be encouraging. The last thing I want to do is make this person feel like I don’t support them. But if I go out and celebrate this thing like everyone else, I feel like I’m only perpetuating the problem. It will always be “not normal” so long as everyone treats it as “not normal”.
I suppose the best I can do in this situation without violating my principles is to confirm to this person, who I still will not name for privacy reasons (but I bet most of you know who I’m talking about anyway), that I support them. I won’t be vocal about it because I feel that’s the opposite of helpful. Just know that me being silent is not a sign of disapproval. If anything, it’s normal for me.
Isn’t that the point?
Leaving this here, because it amuses me:
I feel like the best way to approach this is for the impacted person to dictate how big a deal it is. I've had several friends and family members nonchalantly share their sexual or gender identities and I just filed it away. But when someone chooses to make an announcement out of it, I'll happily share in the festivities, especially if it's the culmination of a lot of soul searching and self-discovery.
To be fair, I go through a similar mental debate every time someone comes out, of wanting to acknowledge it to show my support but also not wanting to treat it as anything that needs to be highlighted at all. Accentuated by my relative lack of experience with LGBTQ people, which makes me a bit uncomfortable saying more than a polite, courteous reply, as it doesn't feel as right given I'm not that and barely know or get it. Or something.
Though I too remain equally disgusted at companies foregrounding their inclusivity for style points and 100% agree the best they can do is have it the same as a straight couple. Or something. I'm no expert!
But that's what feels right to me, I assume it's what those folks would want too.
I'd like to think that what we (or I, in commenting) were celebrating wasn't the announcement itself, necessarily, but the culmination of a lot of soul searching, as FOME put it. I understand the double-edged sword that comes with making a spectacle about what really shouldn't be spectacular, but I also understand the need to announce - to claim this as "true" once it is put out there. If someone makes an announcement of that sort, then, my mindset is just, "Hey, congrats on coming to this part of the journey," and then moving on.
Ironically, I think making a spectacle about not making a spectacle about a spectacle is... well, as you say, it still runs into the same trap. But if you feel pressured to defend your silence, that's not on you, that's on the people pressuring you, especially if you already support the person making the announcement. I guess I'm saying that we shouldn't feel obligated either way to say anything, but we should want to celebrate the good things, in the ways that make us feel good, without stepping on each other's toes. If you want to do that by not commenting in the post, that's perfectly fine, too, and like you, I'd like to live in a world where that's more of the norm.
It may not be a thing that needs to be highlighted at a societal level, but as you say, it absolutely should be at a personal level. And that's where I saw all the congratulations as coming from: a personal celebration of a personal epiphany.
Suppose that, instead of it being a coming-out, the blog in question was about someone announcing they were engaged. Is that a big deal? Absolutely not--at a societal level. It happens thousands of times a day, it's as banal as can be. But at a personal level, it's one of the biggest days of someone's life. And if they made that post, it would absolutely be flooded with well-wishes, for exactly the same reason that the coming-out blog was: because even if it's not a big deal for everyone, it can still be a big deal for someone, and that's worth celebrating.
There's nothing wrong with not congratulating someone on their coming-out blog, just like there's nothing wrong with not congratulating someone on their engagement blog, or their graduation blog, or their birth-of-a-child blog. But just like any of those, I think it's both wholesome and appropriate to offer a hearty "good for you!" to the particular person whose life is changing.
On a personal level, reacting as if it's just normal news like a sports team scoring is definitely a good thing. Some of the, "I already knew," and, "It's about time!" reactions I personally received were wonderful.
The big thing, though, is that it still doesn't feel normal to most people, including us coming out. We know it is, but we get nervous about it. Getting affirmations about it help make needing to tell others feel easier, more normal. Now I don't feel a need to tell people I'm trans unless absolutely necessary. If they ask, I'll answer, sure, but to others it's as important as my height or age or favourite food.
There's also the celebration of figuring oneself out which is a big deal. Some of us take a while to get over personal hangups, or to get that courage. Getting a positive reaction helps us know we made the right decision.
FOME's comment is also a darn good one.
FWIW I don't personally think there's anything wrong in your not commenting. If this is who I think it's about, it was in a public forum, and you weren't personally engaged. As good as it is to affirm or celebrate it, you are not obligated to do so. But it can be a nice courtesy, as Chris said.
I think part of the "Look at us, we're being inclusive!" thing we get from Hollywood etc can be seen as a kind of positive, in that it is now commercially helpful to take that stance. That was not the case when I was a teenager in the 1990s, at least here in England. Maybe that's why I tend to be a little less cynical about commercial exploitation of LGBT stuff -- for example the "rainbow trains" several rail companies have running around the network here.
As for treating someone's sexual orientation or gender identity as just one of those things... I think that's something that would be great... in a world that was more equal than the one we actually have. I guess it's relevant for me to say that the LGBT bunch includes me, and that I would be very happy if it were treated as something no more important than the person in question would like it to be. (I very much like how 5711830 puts this.) We're just not really there yet.
I don't see that there's anything wrong with staying quiet if you find it awkward to say something, and I don't think people should infer bad things from that. But really, I think my view on this particular coming out was "I'm really glad that, by coming to this point, you're happier now" rather than anything flashier or more complex.
Is this an American thing? Where I'm from no one cares if you're gay. Hell I remember in 9th or 10th grade, my female gym teacher casually mentioned she had a wife while I was in her office, and I'm pretty sure I didn't even acknowledge it, I just continued with the convo then left. I'm not trying to virtue signal or anything, that was my legit reaction.
I'm roughly on the same page as 5711830.
I think, that regardless of who it is, or even how I particularly feel about them overall, when that person has gone through several days, weeks, and even years of soul-searching and doubt, and let's face it fear of how society, friends, family and even themselves will deal with such a deep change in their lives... it takes courage to go through that. It takes courage to examine yourself, face all of that and come to the decision to
be who you really are, even if it is something different than what others expect. That deserves praise, in my book... and when that person comes out and shares that, I think it's only fitting to not only celebrate who they are now, but worth telling them and acknowledging that you can be happy for them.
I say my congratulations because not knowing yourself is a pretty terrible prior state to have been in, especially for most of your life. People aren’t always supported, believed, or even humanized in these situations. I know what it’s like to be ‘out’ and the suffocating state prior to that. I know what it’s like to say something like that to total strangers online, or just many followers and friends who have known you for years and are capable of reacting harshly or putting messages that can be nasty (intentionally or not) there. The present makes things very terrible right now, especially when it comes to being trans in particular, though not being heterosexual has its own varying burdens too.
So I say congrats because it’s harder to speak up and say the truth, even over something so mundane. Maybe it’s for more reasons than you would be sure to say hello to a new neighbor, but deep down I don’t see it as that different. Everyone should be told howdy once in a while.
Don't balk at the response length as I am here to tell you I understand and empathize. There is no TL;DR though, so apologies in advanced.
I do understand where you're coming from, also I'm an ace cis-white male. I generally choose to support coming out as whatever as validating their breaking of norms because of the pressure exerted on society for them not to. A company like Disney is going to follow the money to make as many people feel welcome as possible by both pandering highlights that have the added benefit of easily being cut out of the story for more LGBTQ+ hostile areas of the world.
I get the urge for things not to be a big deal. People should be allowed to express themselves in the way that they desire. It shouldn't be a struggle, but it is. They're not the "norm". They're breaking with old and firmly social constructions. That is scary. I suppose that's why people announce they're having children or are moving to a place. It's scary. Sure, folks tailor it as a celebration, but it's a huge life decision. Public announcements can show solidarity for others that do the same thing and help themselves validate something their doing. I'm not making a mistake and people support me in what I'm doing. I get that.
But to turn this back to specifically coming out as something or someone else, and wishing folks wouldn't make a big deal of it. All you as an observer should feel the need to do is ask "So what am I calling you now?" and keep going. They're still the same person, and I hope their decision benefits their life. I never came out as asexual. I just kinda stumbled across it and told folks when it came up. It's the same reason I don't tell folks other things about me like I write MLP fanfiction, I'm a Christian, or that I'm a pacifist. Blending in and not having to think about those things is nice, and I can decide to do that. Those that stand out, trans that don't "pass" as their expressed gender, LGBTQ+ couples, racial minorities, really just pick a category to focus on and go: they don't get to do that whether they want to or not. It's outside the "norm". It's pretty aggravating that we as a society still have hangups, but that is also because it makes me think about them and what that means to me and for me. It’s admittedly a little out of context to use the quote in this, but I think the spirit behind it still applies here when Ian Danskin of Innuendo Studios says, "the boundaries are not policed from the inside."
I'd recommend if you haven't, checking out Philosophy Tube's video "Social Construction" as well as Innuendo Studio's on "The Cost of Doing Business". The second isn't about the topic at hand, but observations from the second reinforce the firsts for me in looking at myself and how monumentally important it is to my sense of self that what I can be unimportant. Of course, that comes with its own hangups with self worth. My current writing projects have made me explore self-loathing in a visceral way.
While I can understand your logic to some extent, I think it's a mistake to conflate personal declarations of orientation or identity with soulless marketing made by big corporations.
When Disney announces that Lefou is going to be their first out gay character--Lefou, the bumbling villain sidekick portrayed by Live Action Olaf whose name literally means "The Fool"--and proceed to have one shot at the end of the movie where he dances with another man which will inevitably be cut out for the release in China and other international countries, that's just pandering to draw in LGBT+ audiences. And oh how much more could be said about the live action Beauty and the Beast and Disney in general, but we don't have all day.
The situation that you described with a person expecting to be given special treatment just for being gay...isn't really a thing that happens? Sure, I can't deny that some may have done that, but on the whole that's a gross hyperbolization.
As has already been said here, the point with an announcement like this isn't merely the expectation of being treated differently for some aspect of one's identity, it's for making a breakthrough in one's life that will represent a significant turning point. Coming out is a big deal in a society that continues to be aggressively heteronormative, it takes a lot of courage to admit that you're going to try to be something different.
A while ago, youtuber Keith Ballard came out as gay (and a furry) at the end of a video essay about the queer theming in Beastars. This was later followed up by another video essay about the thing which made him decide to do that in the first place, the visual novel Adastra, in which it is illustrated how society oppresses those who attempt to be different with only the merest scraps thrown to them if they play along. Coming out is an enormous effort, and if you wait to do it then you will have no way of knowing when it may be too late.
I won't say it's wrong to be silent on something like this, though if the person making the announcement is someone close to you then I'm sure they'd particularly appreciate it. I will say, however, that the brony fandom continues to have a problem with being wishy-washy on many subjects; it's far better to pick a side than try to be neutral and ambivalent. If you're fine with it being normal to be gay/trans/whatever then you can just come out and say that, no one (or, at least, no one worth caring about) is going to think less of you for that.
I rarely join in the public well-wishing,, but I do contact the person, assuming it's someone I know well enough to do so, and chat with them a bit about it, just asking a few questions about what this means for them. Not too much different than if I'd learned they got a new job or something, and I just enjoy a quiet chat with them. Maybe it looks to the public like I haven't said anything, but that's not whose opinion matters.
Like everything else in life, it depends on how you do it. If a friend came up to me and announced that he'd just won the regional junior pokemon lavender tournament, I'd congratulate him on it, despite having no personal stakes or interest in the matter. The important thing was that he thought it was worth announcing, and I'm being supportive of my friend.
I agree with you that Disney et al calling attention to themselves through egregious virtue-signaling is the absolute wrong way to do it (even if sincere), but that doesn't mean there isn't a right way.
I'll echo what others have said in that it doesn't matter what the exact life event is. When something important and exciting happens to a friend and they make in known, it's natural to share in the joy.
5711843
I can't speak for America, but here (the UK) I think being gay (or bi) is pretty widely accepted nowadays. For example, same-sex marriage is politically uncontroversial except on the fringes. Being trans is still a bit short of that "treated as ordinary" status, I think, though I'm not trans so not qualified to say how it feels to trans people here.
As someone who really doesn’t care about socializing and despises acronyms to an almost extreme degree. The only thing I can really say is it’s up to each individual.
Unless you personally know the person making the announcement, you are not obligated to react. You’re not even obligated to engage on social media. If you want you can simply congratulate them and move on with your day.
The difference between that and supporting the skin deep diversity is that for corporations it’s disingenuous. People especially on Twitter only support it because they’re looking for something from said company or want to feel morally superior. It’s why a lot of journalists who write about it ignore the fact that these concepts are removed when sold abroad. To them writing about diversity is a way to get advertisement money. It’s just a scheme to make money while appearing in the moral side of the issue
5711989
Up to a point, maybe. Is it true that some companies pay lip service to equality just because it looks good in the media? Undoubtedly. Is it true that all companies who advertise their inclusiveness are uncaring about it in reality? No, and I have personal experience of that. (I'm in the UK, so what happens in the USA may be another matter.) Some companies are better than others at this. I dislike the "all corporations are evil, end of" stance as much as I dislike the "all corporations are good" stance. That kind of absolutism, which I should be clear I'm not accusing you of, is a big reason I stopped using Twitter a while back.
5711995
As a Us Citizen it’s just how I see it used in marketing and presented by the media. I’ve grown rather jaded towards companies over time and did not mean to have absolutism drip throughout my response.
As a nobody to this community who knows nothing of what is transpiring, my opinion is largely irrelevant. But it is an interesting thought experiment I'd figured I'd give my two cents to anyways.
The way I see anything in life is that old adage. "You are the protagonist of your story." I'm an adult now, and I don't have the time or energy to give anyone the satisfaction of my undying presence in the way that could be truly meaningful. In a way that's more than empty pleasantries. And I personally dislike that emptiness, so I'd rather not reciprocate it to anyone else. Even a simple "Congratulations" when I don't mean it from the bottom of my heart is not worth uttering. Because of that, my existence is ephemeral in the lives of anyone close to me. My friends and even my family. Everyone outside of that? Well, I may as well not exist.
We can't fight wars endlessly without rest. We can't be eternal paragons always fighting the good fight. In this world, this very real world, we can only try and protect the things closest to us and the things that matters most to us. I choose to see life in the most realistic depiction of what being a protagonist of your own story may mean. That means fighting your own battles, in your own world.
It doesn't mean I'll put people down for overcoming their battles. It doesn't mean I'll hinder their progress either. I often preach "the pursuit of the goodness in the heart", so it's not in me to breed such contention. I'll participate only in the capacity I need to, but from there, me and mine take priority. The world can burn, but I will save my own.
My commander always said "if you're not going to do porn with it who cares".
You're right, the response should be to treat is as normal and neutral. In an ideal world, being LGBTQ+ wouldn't be seen as "not normal."
But a lot of people don't think it's normal. And they don't react the way you say they should (neutrally) or the way you say they shouldn't (positively). They react hatefully, angrily, and sometimes violently.
When I came out to my mom, I was so hopeful. She's never been a kind or sweet person, but I really was hoping that she'd respond neutrally, or even positively. After all, when I was little, she told me several times that she'd accept me no matter what—"gay, straight, or whatever," was how she put it.
Then, when I'd spent months building up the courage, invited her over, and told her I was gay, she told me "I didn't raise a queer," and more or less disowned me on the spot. She spent the next two years doing everything she could to make me miserable, including threatening to take away my cat, actively trying to starve me to the point where I only had something to eat if someone else sent it to me, drunk-dialing and yelling at me about being gay, even telling me that if I wanted to kill myself that I shouldn't bother calling her for help. She was pretty horribly abusive throughout my entire life if I'm being honest, but when I came out, things got so much worse. All because I was naive enough to come out to her, thinking she would accept me for who I was.
The reason it's so important to react positively when someone comes out is because people like my mom exist. It takes real bravery to be open about yourself regarding something that could very likely get you a lot of hatred in response. The way I see it, the responses to that blog were less celebrating the person's identity being what it was, but rather celebrating that person's bravery in deciding to face the world and say, "This is who I am," fully well knowing that they might get slapped down with vitriol and cruelty and death threats.
The sad reality is, being LGBTQ+ does mark you as being "different," at least in the eyes of society as a whole, where people generally assume that you are cishet unless you explicitly state otherwise. And being "different" is scary. It's risky. So when someone faces that fear and takes that risk, it's important to let them know not only that they're accepted, but appreciated, and that their courage hasn't gone unnoticed.
That's my take anyway, but I'm just one angsty lesbian from the deep south. I can't speak for anyone else, only for me, when I say that my experiences have taught me some harsh lessons about assuming others will always be as kind and understanding about this stuff as you think they should be. And if me leaving a supportive comment congratulating someone on coming out means they won't feel totally alone and despised the way I did after I came out, then it's worth doing every single time.