Silver finished playing with, and changing, his foals and emerged to find Samantha writing busily in a journal of hers. "Everything alright?"
Samantha perked an ear. "Would it be proper for me to report on the current status of NefNef and Night?"
Silver blinked at the pointed question. "Just how much do you monitor? Telling me they're alright and where they are should be alright, but not what they're talking about, if you can do that, unless you think it's extremely important."
Samantha pointed out to the hallway. "They're both in NefNef's room, condition optimal. Are you staying for the evening?"
"Can't." Silver moved over to kiss Samantha's cheek. "I have to see some ponies. Prince or not, there are things to do, forms to fill, and ponies to be alerted. I want to do this right."
Samantha returned the peck. "Go ahead then. I'll catch up with my work, but when you get back, I want to examine those wings of yours." She said words of science, but her tone implied intimacy, leaving Silver confused, and blushing mildly.
He nodded and slipped from the room, trotting past Nefertari's door with a momentary urge to see what they were doing, but he went on past it. The first pony he'd see didn't have an illustrious rank, but was still important. He opened the door to his office to see that pony sitting there. "Hey Tumble."
Tumble whipped his head around, looking over his shoulder at the young alicorn that easily met his eyes where Silver had been shorter. "What..." He stood up on shaking legs. "What happened?"
Silver turned one way and the other, letting Tumble see all of him. "I walked right into it, and I'm making the best of it, but we're not here for that. We're here for you."
"You're a princess!"
Silver peeked under his barrel briefly. "No, definitely not one of those."
Tumble colored at the peek. "Y-you know what I mean!" He approached Silver slowly, eyeing him with wide eyes. "You're royalty now, right?"
Silver stilled, allowing the examination. "I declined that. I'll earn it, through action, not just because I have some extra parts. Speaking of which, have you figured out what kind of truck you want?"
"You were serious?" Tumble circled around Silver before pausing. "Why do you have one horseshoe? Did you lose the others?"
Silver brought a hoof to his face. "Oh that's right! I have the other two in my pocket, one's on Night Watch, and I should have already given one of these to Samantha."
Tumble shrank a little. "I guess the other's going to that diamond dog?"
Silver raised a brow at that. "She's a jackal, not a dog, an anubian to be specific. Calling her a diamond dog seems an interesting way to challenging her to a scrap. She hasn't joined the herd, and nopony is until I've earned that title properly."
Tumble glanced around suddenly. "Does that mean... I have a chance?"
Silver started at that, even as he chastised himself for not seeing that coming a mile away. "There are specific steps to take, which don't begin with me. Night nominates new members, then we all have to agree, and that's the basics."
"Oh..." Tumble flashed a hopeful smile. "But it's not impossible, right?"
Silver returned the smile. "Not impossible, but, Tumble, I'm not the only one for you. You don't need this kind of complicated mess in your life. Let's get you on the path to independence. So, did you pick?"
Tumble sat on his haunches and rubbed his forehooves together. "I picked a few... I didn't think you were totally serious about it, so I just kinda picked what I'd take if I had millions of bits." He produced a magazine on the newest and greatest innovations in automobile technology and set it down, pointing at a beast of a machine displayed across two pages. Unlike Earth, there was no promise of 'available at your nearest dealer'. Only one had been built, and only one would be sold. The industrial revolution simply hadn't happened the same.
Silver let out a long and low whistle when he saw the price and all its many zeroes as his magic pulled the magazine over to look at. It was an enchanting machine, literally, powered in no small part by magic. Though it'd run faster with a unicorn powering it, it claimed to support a battery of sorts that a unicorn could charge up for mobility without one around. "Not bad at all, but I can't help but think you'd do better with one not magic powered."
"Too expensive?" Tumble sat beside Silver. "Like I said, I just kinda went for the best one."
"I'm not even looking at that. You're not a unicorn, which makes this not the best one." Silver flipped through the magazine and found another a few pages in. It didn't report as high a maximum speed, but it ran on a burning engine, the sort you could put in coal, wood, or even ,apparently, gasoline. How it managed to take such a wide variety of fuel was beyond Silver, but there it was, claiming to be efficient and powerful. "Look at this one. I think this is better for you, specifically. No matter how far you go, you can grab some fuel and keep it moving, but if you're in the middle of nowhere with the other one, you'd be stuck."
"Huh..." He leaned over a bit, pressing his side to Silver. "Guess you have a point there, but this one's expensive too."
"I'll talk to Celestia about it. You're going to put it to work, right?"
Tumble started faintly. "Princess Celestia?" He caught himself and laughed. "Oh, right. Ambassador, alicorn, I guess you can talk to her whenever you want."
"You avoided the question." Silver put a leg around Tumble and squeezed him gently. "What will you do with it?"
Tumble licked over suddenly dry lips. "I'll... drive it. I'll..." Suddenly something clicked. "I can move big things."
"How big?"
"The biggest!" Tumble flipped through to a picture of a huge trailer that could be attached to one of these vehicles. "Big, heavy, and long-distance, just the kind of thing that'd tire out a pegasus.
Silver smiled, not because it was a new idea, but because it was an old one he had heard once in his dream. He felt certain Tumble could make that work. "That sounds like you could make a niche for yourself, and do something that's not done much right now."
"So, is this serious?" Tumble turned to face Silver. "I mean, one hundred percent?"
"I'll propose the idea to Celestia, but I think we'll manage this, but did you remember the conditions?"
Tumble leaned forward suddenly and exhaled in Silver's face. It smelled of Tumble, but not of booze. "I'm clean, promise! Look, you do this, and I'll swear off the stuff forever!"
"That would make me happy. Tumble, I know you have a hard time believing this, but I know you can be so much. You're a special stallion." Silver rose to his hooves. "No time like the present, besides, Celestia's waiting to introduce me to some other ponies along the way. I'll be sure to get a letter to you either way with updates. If we can't do that truck for any reason, we'll find another. We'll make this work."
Tumble rose up on his own. "Yeah... I believe you..." He began trotting for the door. "So, Night first, huh?" Then he was gone.
Silver softly sighed, imagining Tumble clumsily propositioning Night. He wasn't sure if he should wish the stallion luck on that particular venture. "A nice husband that isn't a vortex of confusion would be ideal." He trotted from his office, closing and locking it behind himself before he went to meet with Celestia.
As he went, a pony tried to dash across the hallway and they bumped softly. "Excuse me, miss." He tilted his head, realizing it was Carrot Plate. "Oh! Hi there, Carrot. How are you?"
Carrot flashed a soft smile, glancing off. Silver heard a faint but harsh hiss. He let his magic spread and feel around. An older pony was watching them and was the source of the hissing. "So, uh, hi! We seem to be running into each other a lot." She gave a false laugh, as obvious as her nervousness. "We should hang out on purpose just once."
Silver leaned in a little, considering how to speak to her subtly. "That would be nice." He flashed a bright smile. "I know just the place."
Carrot blinked with obvious surprise. "Really? That quickly?" Another soft hiss came from the watcher. "I mean, sure! That'd be great!"
Silver put a hoof to her snout. "Go on and do what you have to do. I'll pick you up later and we can catch up."
She wandered off, and the watcher retreated back into the hallway they were hiding in. Silver snorted softly. He would visit Carrot, but it would be in a place no voyeurs could witness. A smile spread across his face as he moved alone, soon arriving at the room Celestia had asked him to visit. He clopped a hoof once on the door before opening it gently and proceeding inside.
Celestia sat with a scholarly-looking unicorn. That unicorn perked his ears with curiosity, eyes shining with amazement. "In the flesh... So it is possible for males to ascend..." He rose to his hooves. "Please, pardon my rudeness. I'm Sharp Quill and it's a pleasure to meet you, Silver Watch."
She smiled gently. "He's here to take notes and see the history that's been made. This is all new, so it seemed prudent to be thorough. Sharp, this is Silver Watch, as you know."
"Pleasure to meet you." Silver dipped his head a little at the scholar. "What's your specialty?"
"Oh? Oh! I specialize in noble etiquettes and laws, Your Highness."
Silver raised a hoof at that. "I'm no prince."
"But..." He tilted his head slowly. "Are you a princess then?"
Celestia hid her snout behind a hoof. "I think he would find that title a bit troublesome."
Silver settled beside the table. "You're a good pony to ask. I want to earn the title of prince 'properly'. I don't think ponies will accept a prince so easily, at least not like this. I mean, there's Blueblood, but he got it by birth."
Sharp frowned thoughtfully. "An interesting conundrum. The easiest solution that comes to mind is to win the favor of a noble house and be formally adopted, which would make you nobility and your title far less jarring."
Celestia smiled at the idea. "That seems feasible. Surely we can find one that would eagerly seek such an arrangement."
A chill ran through Silver and he thought back to the seemingly-coerced Carrot Plate. Was she noble? Was that how they hoped to get him, and others may as well. "Would marriage work?"
Sharp blinked and nodded. "Oh, yes. Marrying into nobility would serve much the same effect. You would have a claim to nobility then, but I'm to understand you're already a member of a herd?"
"Would that stop it?" Silver spread his wings a little. "I'm just exploring options, not suggesting that's the best way."
"Well, technically, no. Having a noble as part of your herd, antiquated as that is, would make the herd a part of the noble family. Please forgive the asking, but how did you come to end up in such an outmoded legal construct?" Sharp tilted his head, eyes shining with curiosity.
Silver waved a little. "Long story, but I think the first pony that mentioned it to me read too many bad romance novels, and the second was just old-fashioned and here we are. If it makes a difference, the world I came from was mostly monogamous pairs too."
Celestia quirked a smile. "You've come a long way."
The path to Alicorn and Power is ruddled with typos. Have some inspirational music.
It's kind of the farthest thing possible from what he announced upon his return. Though I could see him doing it as the means of officially accepting his title, after 'earning' it to his satisfaction, if the right candidate were to present themselves.
I am just going to take a moment to imagine Nef, Tumble and Carrot all entering the herd in one big public ceremony, doubling their numbers.
Come on, don't marry her, she sexually assaulted you of her own volition for protecting herself, go for luna, she will jump at the idea, also you should become a lunar one to show raical diversity and that the lunar race can do great things to
7209334
Replace Tumble with either Celestia or even Luna and get rid of Carrot and you have a better herd.
Tumble has so many issues and seems to only like Silver, and Carrot sexauly assaulted Silver. Both probably shouldn't be admitted into the herd.
7209379
*In a whiny voice not much different from Rarity's*
But a lunar Alicorn would be scary.
Good chapter, but both new ponies that seem to be vying for entry to the herd are poor candidates.
7209334 umm, carrot is a sexual ofender who molested him out of spite and tumble has more problems than i care to count.
others may as well. - others may as well?
*****
I enjoyed reading today's chapter, it's truly heartwarming to see how Samantha has calmed and integrated into the family, yet still has the traits that make her Samantha.
The slow and deliberate waltz of court politics and intrigue begins. It's fortunate that Silver already knows some of the steps to this dance. Will he move in time with this particular harmony or will he attempt to change the beat?
Couldn't resist, could you?
Travel safe, and I hope you enjoy your time in Seattle!
I like how Silver thinks that an extra set of body parts are not automatic qualification for a leadership role.
7209555
Tell that to the unicorns in Canterlot that think because they have a horn, they are superior to the other tribes.
7209576 I agree with your sentiment. Their is an awful lot of tribalism(racism) in the show isn't their. Like I said I am glad that Silver is trying a new path.
Hmmm our pony in the shadows is getting more bold...
Keep going! ;)
7209576
7209661 kind us, after all a fully trained unicorn can be as strong as a earth pony and have strong magical capability's, we have not seen this yet because celestias army is just a bunch of peace keepers. in all reality, if luna had troops thy would have twilight's strength but in full offensive capability, this means that earthponys are trash because a unicorn can get as good as them and easily kill them, pegasis are a little better but no one is going to let them get close with a cloud and use their only attack which is thunder, so as i said, unicorn is master race
7209743 how can a unicorn be as strong as an earth pony? Earth pony magic gives them strength, and look at Maud, she is crazy strong and can do a form of geomancy. I think earth ponies are under rated overall.
7209890 The only official word on what's special about Earth Ponies is that they have 'strong hearts'. Apparently this allows them to live for 300 years, like Granny Smith.
(that said, ridiculous feats of strength have been shown for Earth Ponies and Pegasi both... I can't think of a unicorn example but that might just be coincidence as opposed to an actual unicorn handicap.)
Im hoping Celestia has a worthwhile collection of supporting race members working in the background. Maybe her Noble house tracking team is headed by Grey Clerk, and Lunas Nobel house Auditing team is headed by Dark Clerk.
The multifuel extenal burner has a collecion of designs over teh decades. Best I saw was a steam based one with a super compact flash boiler capable of cold to operation in 4 seconds.
7209890 yes but thoes are only the ones that worked on rock farms, after that its proven that Pegasus can be strong evening tho biologically speaking thy would be weaker and there bones are more brital so thy wont have as much mass and be able to stay in the air, unicorns don't have that set back, thy are just weaker phisicaly due to lazy ness, but being said if a black ops unit was made thy would be as strong as an earth pony, and lets face it big mac's strength to pull a house was exsaserated and in real life my little pony example would not happen unless that house is just made of staw and ply wood and not bolted to the ground, wait a minute that is the same kind house he pulled, anyways, but ya lets finish off on the fact that magic is just OP because thy could just hold that earth pony there with telecenesis which is the most simple spell or thy could always snap there neck or evening pinch a nerve in the brain, after that thy could trow pebels at a high velosity and with the right spell could proboly make hard light bullets
7209921
Flat-out untrue. From the transcript for Twilight's Kingdom - Part 1:
By contrast, the term "strong hearts" doesn't appear even once when searching the transcripts.
7210010 only thing about them is thy can get stonger faster and proboly be evening stronger but you can atleast get the unicorn to be a bit stronger than the average earth pony
7210023 Yeah, no. You're making stuff up, despite a total lack of evidence regarding how these things are actually shown to work in the source material.
7210029 im taking biology into perspective, there is nothing wrong with the unicorn biology, earth ponys are naturally stronger but that does not mean that a unicorn can't get as strong as the average earth pony. in order for Pegasus to fly (pluse magic) thy would have to have a lighter body mass and hollow bones like birds. all in all evening if thy can't get stronger, there magic could very easily kill the two other tribes and thy could also enhance there own bodys
7210048
No one is suggesting that anything is "wrong" with unicorns. I don't disagree that an earth pony, or for that matter a pegasus, that pushed themselves into intense physical conditioning could conceivably become stronger than your average earth pony; Bulk Biceps is the obvious example of this. But that's not really a relevant point, since an earth pony could undergo the same conditioning and receive greater results since they'd have their natural magic in addition to the results of their working out.
No, they wouldn't. The fact that pegasi require magic in order to get off the ground directly undercuts this premise.
Again, you're making this up based on absolutely nothing; there's no evidence from the source material that suggests that unicorns could "very easily kill" anyone with their magic, let alone "enhance their own bodies."
Not only is there nothing in the show to suggest that this is correct, there's actually circumstantial evidence to suggest exactly the opposite. It's notable that the only unicorns that are able to use any magic beyond very minor effects are those that have cutie marks that directly reference magical ability: Twilight, Starlight, Sunset, etc. Unicorns with cutie marks in other fields are not shown to be able to use any magic beyond meager abilities, such as minor telekinesis, gem-finding, etc. So the entire idea of unicorns being "overpowered" is one that's far and away more "fanon" than canon.
7210070 well most unicorns don't care about that stuff and as Davids story suggest, such spells are illegal and violence is frowned apon which is true. if magic can make them fly than ge golly thy could throw a pebel really fast or a knife and kill them that way
7210090
I'm not sure which specific point(s) you're referring to as "that stuff," but while spells that are actually designed to cause damage are illegal in this fic, that's still more permissive than in the source material, where they're virtually non-existent (about the closest we ever see, beyond several instances of horn-based energy blasts from Twilight or Princess Celestia, is Trixie trying to use a spell to make Rainbow Dash "writhe in agony" in Magic Duel...and without the alicorn amulet, all it does is tickle her).
Again, this is something you've made up. The inherent magic of pegasi lets them fly, and for those pegasi with exceptional abilities this flight can be extremely fast and agile (though this might be related to having the proper cutie mark, such as Rainbow Dash). This is not the same as spellcasting, however; Twilight was only able to conjure up extremely fragile wings for Rarity in the first season's Sonic Rainboom, and they didn't have anywhere near the speed necessary to make a thrown projectile into a bullet, which is what you seem to be suggesting. That's also true for Starlight Glimmer's telekinetic flight in season five's The Cutie Re-Mark. Finally, if you're referring to using telekinesis to project something that fast, well, that's also something that's never demonstrated in the source material.
7210111 why would thy not be able to?, its clear that celestia has tried to make her nation the most peaceful place ever. so she will definitsly ban the practive of harmfull spells, and why would it need to be shown to be real, its a spell, hell the alicorns move the sun and moon which thy are moving them thousands of miles and hour at too. after all it is magic, why would it be imposible to create a spell that makes hard light and fires it at a high velocity?
7210159
Why would who not be able to what? We're discussing multiple points here, so I'm not sure what you're referring to without more specificity.
This is not "clear," by which I take it to mean you're saying that your point is self-evident. I say that because Celestia hasn't been shown to be proactively pushing an agenda of peace; she doesn't need to, since her ponies seem to be naturally inclined towards peaceful cooperation and coexistence anyway, even without her guidance. This is a point that was driven home in Hearth's Warming Eve, which is the story of Equestria being founded on the principles of harmony and mutual coexistence. Even before that, the three pony tribes might have been insular and suspicious of each other, but they were still working together (e.g. the earth ponies were sharing food with the other two tribes, etc.).
As such, there's very little impetus to say that harmful spells even exist in the first place. While we have seen Twilight and Celestia shoot magical blasts from their horn, that seems to be about it. The idea that such combative magic is prevalent enough to require a law to be enacted (with all that that entails, including a wide-ranging police organization to enforce the law, a court system to try offenders, as well as a system by which punishments are handed down), simply doesn't match with what we've seen in the show; other than the royal guards (who do very little), law enforcement and similar protective services are extremely rare that we've seen.
This line of reasoning seems to be operating on the premise that spells can be easily invented. I don't believe the source material shows that to be true, hence why Twilight and co. were looking for a spell to fix the Crystal Heart in The Crystalling - Part 2, rather than trying to invent one.
This assumption strikes me as being on extremely shaky ground. Given the sheer number of ways that even basic cosmological principles are different in Equestria than they are in the real world (e.g. Twilight moves the sun and the moon around wildly in Twilight's Kingdom, with no resulting tidal movement; we see that Nightmare Moon has created a kingdom of eternal night in The Cutie Re-Mark - Part 2 and yet the world hasn't frozen and died, etc.), then using real-world cosmology to draw any conclusions about Equestria is extremely untrustworthy.
Just because it's magic doesn't mean that everything is possible. Magic, like all other aspects of a setting, are still subject to issues of internal logic and self-consistency. If you want to make an affirmative postulation regarding why something that doesn't exist could (or does) exist, then the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate that. So far, there's nothing to support your assertion that such a spell could exist, particularly since what few spells deal with anything like this (e.g. moving things at a given speed) are not shown to operate in a manner at all like what you're suggesting.
7210010 Found it. It's from the chapter book 'crystal heart spell' and it was the 'strength of a good, true heart' so I guess I mentally paraphrased it.
And 'without their strength' doesn't necessarily mean that they have special strength-granting magic, given that no one else was able to even stand after being drained. It's consistent with that but it's also consistent with earth ponies having no magic at all.
7210199 to go back to celestia is peaceful, than why are her royal guards useless, the changeling invasion happens and all of them are defeated, after that thy have very weak armor (unless magically augmented) that is made of gold and thy still use bows and spears when thy have (persumerably clean ) coal trains city's and lights, hell 6 mares did more than any of the guards could do and decided not to kill any of them. going threw that logic, she only uses the elements of harmony so she can always find a peaceful solution.
going back to the magic thing, the planet did not freeze over under lunas rule because the sun still existed, just on the other side of planet, it is cannon that the sun is not just magic because in the book of the sisters it states that the sun existed before her.
with the other magic thing... star swirl the bearded created over 200 spells yet we only see a hand full of them, hell i can evening tie this back with peace because twilight only has the common shield spell untill she confronts twilight. as we learn, starlight has been in the restrickted area and stole multiple spells, one highly offencive and one highly defensive, aka that shield and her lazer attack, as we saw she was about to kill the people in our town because thy did not side with her while the horn blast that twilight and celestia used wheir the same and could only incapacitate things, it was clear that starlight used a lethal spell while celestia the peace keeper she is opted to use a non lethal spell during the invasion and did not evening try to teach twilight anything lethal,
going to what you said about trixy, with the same idea that lethal spells are illegal and hard to get... she was actually using a tickle spell but with her magic amplified by the amulet the tickle spell would stimulate her nerves so harshly that it would hurt,
in the battle with tirek, both of them use highly lethal spells and try to conserve energy, tirek blew up twilight house, she fired a death laser that destroyed the ground and could be made to be bigger, there attacks together made a large explosion. going along and back to peace, the spell twilight used was probably just the horn blast but unstable and much more power full while tirek was clearly using harmful spells aka that explosive fire ball (Silver would be proud) twilight, if she had known other spells or if she existed could have defeated tirek
oh and back to the changeling fight, why did't celestia use the horn spell as strongly as she could, she used the spell with the same strength as twilight when she was a unicorn evening tho it has been shown that 4 alicorns are stronger than the entire nation + discord
7210233
7206865 oh and david, i can't remember if or when you said this but you said that celestia was originally a unicorn but in the book of the royal sisters there is an entry that starswirl comes up to celestia and ask her to take on the role of rising the sun because he believed that alicorns where stronger than unicorns implying that she was always a alicorn because she gains her mark (and immortality~unknown if cannon) after she moves the moon.
7210233
Can you put that into context? By itself, that doesn't say very much.
It does indeed mean that they have special strength-granting magic, since we're told flat-out that Tirek is draining the magic from earth ponies, and that as a consequence of that they won't have the strength to work the land. That also dispels the idea that earth ponies have no magic at all.
7210296
I honestly have no idea what you're trying to say here; your original point was that Celestia is "trying" to make Equestria peaceful (and so would have banned dangerous magic). I pointed out that Celestia didn't need to enforce peace as an extant component of Equestria because peace had already been achieved before she came along. I honestly don't know what you think citing the royal guards' uselessness proves, and you're not explaining this point very well at all. Equestria is a peaceful nation, and was so long before Celestia was on the scene; that alone would explain why the guards were so useless, since they'd have no opportunities to gain any experience or develop practical tactics.
Again, you're assuming this is true based on nothing at all.
We saw in Princess Twilight Sparkle - Part 1 that Luna, when she became Nightmare Moon, caused a total solar eclipse. Now, there's nothing to say that this is still the case in the alternate future where she's taken over, but there's nothing to suggest otherwise either. That's leaving aside the issue that if you isolate the sun to the opposite side of a world, the side without sunlight would still freeze.
The Journal of the Two Sisters is not canon in the slightest. Moreover, just because something existed before Celestia and Luna in no way establishes that it is or is not magical.
You're wrong. Again. First of all, Star-Swirl having created hundreds of spells doesn't speak at all to the contents of those spells. We know this because Starlight did know dangerous magic before she stole the time-travel spell, hence why we see her use an attack spell at the end of The Cutie Map - Part 2. There's nothing to suggest that she got that from Star-Swirl's spells
Except that's not what we learned, because that's not what those episodes tell us. She doesn't steal Star-Swirl's spell until after the events of The Cutie Map, where she already had those spells.
You're presuming that this spell would have been lethal, with no basis for why you're presuming that.
This is also a presumption, and one that we know to be false. Twilight blasts a gas-spewing plant that was about to attack Pinkie in Princess Twilight Sparkle - Part 1, and that shot destroyed it.
Except we've been able to poke holes in your theory, since you haven't established that Starlight's spell was more dangerous than what Twilight or Celestia used.
Which speaks not at all to the actual spell, since that was a harmless spell that was amplified by a cursed magic item.
Leaving aside that you completely made up "trying to conserve energy" as a point, this is entirely irrelevant, to the point where I honestly think that you don't even know what point you're trying to make anymore. Neither Twilight's temporarily-enhanced state nor Tirek are indicative of anything about the normal state of how magic is used or what spells are developed, since both of those are unique cases. The idea that "Twilight could have defeated Tirek if she had known other spells" is a postulation that presumes that such spells would have been more effective, when there's nothing to state that that's the case, given how much power both combatants had at the time.
You're presuming she didn't. Stop presuming.
You don't know that. You don't know what the relative strength of Celestia's magic is compared to Twilight. Even if we accept that those are the same spell, that doesn't mean that Celestia and unicorn-Twilight were casting it with the same degree of power.
No such thing has ever been shown. Twilight wasn't able to defeat Tirek in that fight, and even then the idea that the aggregate totals of magic must have been equivalent because Twilight and Tirek weren't able to instantly defeat each other is one of the more eye-rollingly fallacious ideas that fans have adopted, despite the highly questionable nature of that assumption.
7210558 As a consequence of draining magic, all ponies also lost their normal, physical strength.
So, earth ponies have magic to drain, but it's not clear that they can do anything with that magic or that it's giving them extra strength above what unicorns and pegasi get from it.
(I think it's highly likely that at least some of them can do something with it; eg Pinkie Pie) (also, they show Applejack growing a plant instantly at some point? But I think that was during a play so it could have been special effects)
The quote was talking about what Twilight got by virtue of being an alicorn.
even, apparently,
7209576 7209661 B- But, they're nobility!
7210621
Not sure where the ponies got fossil fuel but I could see them crafting ethanol from crops. The stuff would still be outrageously expensive without some serious infrastructure, not to mention special containers that could take a beating from transport (no paved/smooth roads outside major cities).
7210612
And earth ponies lost the magic that gave them strength beyond that of normal ponies, otherwise there wouldn't have been a concern about working the land to begin with, since otherwise they wouldn't have been any stronger than other ponies.
Yes, it is clear. Otherwise Princess Celestia would have had no cause to mention that "without their strength," the land couldn't be worked. She deliberately phrased this as being something that would be lost if earth ponies lost their magic.
What you've cited with regards to Pinkie Pie and Applejack is a function of the magic of their cutie marks, not the magic they have as earth ponies.
7210603
let me stop you there, peace was not achieved, harmony between the tribes was achieved, generally racism was removed, did not really have to do with peace.
No that really does not. just because there is really low crime in an area mean you don't train your police men, forget the police men because thy are royal guards meant to protect the seemingly immortal ruler. in manehatten there is the mob as seen in the episode were pinki rarity and maud go to manehatten and pinkie rapers her leg around one of the pony's before realysing it was a bad idea, also he has a cinder block cutie mark with a chain attached falling and thats hard to make an excuse for
well actualy it would not, expecialy if magic is involved, going with your idea that the sun is magic and only there because of celestia... who is not to say that the moon does not radiate its own light and heat since thy are both magic? night mare moon wants to rain eternal, after all if she could survive on the moon she can make a planet habitable without the sun but thats just saying its magic, now if the sun was on the other side of the planet 24/7 than the ocean on that side would start to boil and some of that heat will transfer to the cooler side assuring it does not compleatly freeze.
your opinion is not fact. what can be considered fact tho is that it most definitely a ritual as stated in the book and that there Needs to be 6 unicorns, after that it can be assumed that not any ol unicorn can participate but only the elite, the reasoning that thy lose there magic is because the ritual puts a lot of strain on them and most likely takes some of their magic or life force, going magic wise, the nature of magic destroys your argument in your opinion based essay, for all we know this ritual has been passed down for generations by god, going along with this, in tvshows and anime's, you need 8 to 5 people for ritual circles. and can't add more people to it, the reason for 6 is that there are 6 elements to harmony and him trying by himself stole his energy and life span but that is just a theory magic wise.
in the nature of the show it's self, no im not wrong. it does not tell us she just so happened to know it or this was her first time to the restricted area, knowing that the guards are really bad at their job, she mostlikly got the spell to take the marks from there and in a sick and demented way, she got her mark because she really enjoyed taking them and was so good at the spell that it became her mark, that being said, how is it that the princes of magic does not know the spell until she sees it or the attack spell and as you said
and pry tell how and why the element of magic that also has a cutie mark for magic can not make such spell but yet a pony who only has a mark for using one spell suddenly pulls 6 spells out of her but (flying throw levitation, stealing cutie marks, leathal horn blast, stronger force shield, enhanced time travel
Well except for the basis being that she is a communist and she was already brain washing them and clearly was using this spell out of anger an melishuse intent which is why twi used that stronger shield which as starlight said, took her months to learn (how did she learn it but not twilight who went to magic school and studied under celestia)
just because something is not leathal does not mean its not harmless, example? my BB gun can't kill you but will hurt like hell and ripp holes threw plants, pluse she has alicorn buffs
i did not make up trying to conserve energy, when Tirek attacked, he could have just made a nukelike explosion but instead opts to throw an fire ball and that other thing is just assuming that thy have an energy limite,
well from what you say, unless thy where having a pissing contest and not going all out, than thy must have a lot more power. also why would thy be fighting half heartedly which them there was no point to the battle and im positive that a few unicorns could not do that much damage andand have energy for more, as Tirek stated, thy had so much energy that it would be a pissing contest so he gave her an altamatum that he would kill her friends unless he got the power.
7210856
Peace is a necessary component of harmony, so by definition peace was achieved.
Yes, it really does.
On the contrary, that's exactly what it means. When the "really low crime area" is the entire country, that's exactly what it means. The royal guards most likely have some sort of qualification to join, but that's irrelevant to the fact that they're ineptitude can be, in large part, chalked up to how they're serving a function that isn't very necessary to begin with.
Again, you're reading into this; the presumption that that background pony was a part of an organized crime syndicate is your interpretation, with nothing to suggest that that's at all correct. (A more apt character to cite would be Caballeron, but even he seems to be the exception that proves the rule.)
First of all, you were the one suggesting that cosmological physics in Equestria was comparable to cosmological physics in the real world. Subsequent to that, you stated that the sun being isolated to "the other side" of the planet would mean that the side left in eternal darkness would not freeze. I simply pointed out that this was not correct.
Leaving that aside, even if you posit that "magic is involved" - which was not your original position - that doesn't mean that you'd still be right, since "magic" doesn't necessarily mean "anything I make up is plausible, because magic."
Finally, the idea that "the sun is magic and only there because of Celestia" is "my idea" is complete nonsense. If you want to attribute something to me, use a quotation.
Again, if you want to suggest that something is a certain way, you need to meet the philosophic burden of proof. It's not enough to say "well, nothing says that it couldn't be this way." Something needs to say that it actually is that way for your argument to have any traction. This is a basic prerequisite for debating ideas.
That's leaving aside the fact that "the sun and moon are themselves magical" is another instance of baseless speculation.
There's nothing to suggest that Nightmare Moon could survive on the moon; the show states that she was the mare "in" the moon, rather than walking around on its surface. Likewise, your postulation that the superheated side of a planet that had one side perpetually facing the sun would heat the side that faced away from it enough to prevent freezing is fallacious; some heat would be transferred, but not nearly enough to prevent it from freezing (as opposed to "completely" freezing, whatever that means).
Coming from you, this is highly ironic. It's also a good demonstration that you didn't read the link I provided, since that demonstrates quite clearly using logical inquiry and rational examination why the book isn't canon, rather than opinion.
Leaving aside semantic questions of whether or not it's a "ritual" - which is a pointless distinction - the issue of needing six unicorns is just one of the many logical failures in that book. After all, why not use more than six unicorns, so as to distribute the strain involved to a greater number of individuals and so reduce the burden upon any one unicorn, thus preventing the severe level of damage that costs them their magic? This is just one of many reasons why the book isn't canon, since it introduces basic problems which it then is unable to solve.
That's your assumption, and it doesn't spring from anything in the actual material.
Which again brings up the question of why not use more unicorns so as to reduce the burden? Why not spread the day/night cycle out longer than twenty-four hours, and/or leave the sun lower on the horizon rather than higher in the sky so as to reduce how much and/or how often it needs to be moved? Or work with the pegasi to use heavy cloud cover to blot out the sun rather than sinking it below the horizon when you want to create darkness? Or any of a hundred other possibilities that would have prevented this problem from occurring in the first place. There's only so many failures of logic that can be countenanced before the entire thing makes a mockery of itself.
That's leaving aside the issues of it contradicting the show on several points.
As I've shown above, I've just destroyed this assertion of yours.
And now you're postulating deities that have never been stated to exist in the source material. Do I even need to say that this argument is invalid?
Leaving aside your lack of citations, this is irrelevant. What happens in one continuity has absolutely no bearing on any other unrelated continuity. Saying "it works this way in series X" has nothing to do with how it works in series Y.
Again, making stuff up is not a counterpoint. Moreover, even if they couldn't have more unicorns, any of the other alternative solutions remain viable, which still undercuts the supposed problem ever happening to begin with.
You absolutely are wrong, since you confused when Starlight broke into the Star-Swirl the Bearded wing of the Canterlot library with when she used her attack magic.
Again, you are the one suggesting that she got that spell from the Star-Swirl the Bearded wing, whereas the show is silent on the issue. As such, it's incumbent on you to provide evidence to support your point. You haven't done this, so your point remains unsubstantiated.
Groundless guesswork.
More conjecture with nothing to remotely prove that it's true. That's leaving aside that nothing about her cutie mark at all suggests that it's related to taking other cutie marks.
Maybe because she's not the princess of magic, but rather the princess of friendship?
Why would any of those things be true? You're positing that Twilight, due to her nature of having a cutie mark for magic (which Starlight also has) and her connection to the Element of Magic, should be able to create magic easier than other ponies...based on what? That you think that's how she "should" be, despite the show not supporting that (e.g. she needed help to defeat Trixie in Magic Duel)? There's no inherent guarantee that Twilight should be able to whip spells up on the fly; multiple references are made to studying them, rather than inventing them, and there's no reason why Starlight shouldn't know spells that Twilight doesn't.
Which has no intrinsic (or even presumptive) connection to "studying deadly magic."
Which doesn't suggest that it was deadly.
Using a shield to protect someone from harm does not inherently mean that that harm was deadly in nature. Likewise, Starlight said that she studied that attack spell for years, not months. Moreover, your last question seems to presume that going to Celestia's School for Gifted Unicorns, let alone being her direct pupil, would necessarily result in learning that spell, which is an assumption with no basis. Particularly since she already learned another "zap it" spell, which could very well be just as powerful.
Yes you did. That explanation is never offered in the show; it's your interpretation of what's going on, based on extremely flimsy reasoning, as shown below.
Even if you're right (and there's no guarantee that you are), then the fact that he held back could just as easily be explained in other ways, such as his not wanting to potentially kill the pony with the magic that he wanted to drain.
At least you're admitting that you're assuming this.
That's not what I said. I said the fact that they traded a few blows and then stopped without coming to a decisive conclusion is not a surefire indicator that the magic of four alicorns is equivalent to the magic of all ponies in Equestria plus Discord.
They clearly had more power, since both seemed like they could have continued; this does not mean that they power that they had was equal.
Again, having more energy in reserve does not mean that they were fighting halfheartedly. It just means that they could have kept going, and so we didn't get to see which had more magic in total.
No, what Tirek said was that they were at an impasse. That means that neither of them was able to score any decisive blows on the other; it doesn't mean anything about who could have outlasted whom had they kept going.
7211022 in stead of continuing this, i'm just going to drop it here because its a wast of time to argue (on something i started) about the semantics of the show when we do not know everything about it since most of our stuff is just speculation instead of fact since thy have not out right told us that there are no such spells, best we can assume is that during Tireks' fight, neither had spells that drained up much of their power or thy simply regenerated it faster than their spells used it, what we can say is everything is just theory.
i have heard that the comics are canon unknown if true
from what we know is that the unicorns did used to move the sun, how thy did this is unknown since it is true that many unicorns can't lift heavy things. (example? it was hard for twilight to lift the Ursa minor) unless the sun there is easy to move i don't see how six could accomplish the feat if one that has been shown to be very good at magic has a hard time lifting some things. it could be said that it is easier since it is in space but the sun (at least here) is much larger than the planet and it is much more probable that thy spin the planet and maybe move the moon. that still being said the objects still have much more gravity so its questionable. now since we know that tarturas exist (or maybe its the inside of a volcano) we know that cerberuse who is immortal is there on guard, who or what made this place? if there are higher powers, higher than celestia and luna maybe there could be rituals which is why so few unicorns can move the sun, it is said that only unicorns can do it but thats only because thy have magic that being said, how did the first unicorns know to move the sun and who did it before thy existed (assuming that evolution happened and the planet has not been there for infinity) who know.
7211022 oh and one last thing because this is annoying
based on the fact that she has the cutie mark for the element of magic which has always looked like that, also her cutie mark is on the tree of harmony showing its her destiny which auto maticaly makes her better than everyone else and if she was not that good at magic than the royal guards wizards should have been able to repel the changeling invasion. after all, she can make a spell like here brother so why is there no other court wizards who are as strong as her, you would assume that there is at least a hundred or more royal guards and all of them want to help so at least one should know some destructive magic, after all from what you have said is that the spells that starlight learned where not restricted or illegal so it would only make seance that a magic guard would also know these spells, evening if it was one guard, in the least thy would be taught how to make some shields to protect others
7211091
No one's denying that this is speculation. What's under debate is the nature and scope of the speculation to determine which are more rational, and thus which operate under a more firm basis of credibility. Just because something isn't known doesn't make all speculation about the unknown subject(s) equal; there are methods of reasoning and problem-solving that can be, and I believe should be, utilized in this regard, especially when comparing and contrasting two or more different ideas.
Again, not all theories are equal, particularly insofar as it comes to interpreting aspects of the source material that are less than completely explicit in what they present. (That's not even getting into areas where the source material contradicts itself.)
This is highly unlikely, considering the sheer number of things that the comics have put forward that the show has directly contradicted, such as saying that Twilight's mother writes the Daring Do novels, or that Luna gained her "ethereal" mane when she overcame her guilt about being Nightmare Moon, or that the destruction of the Crystal Heart would unleash a horde of umbrum. The comics have been wrong so many times that it's very hard to see any situation in which they could be considered anything more than officially-licensed fanfiction.
Unicorns did indeed used to move the sun, and the intricacies by which this works are less than completely clear at this point, since the show has made it clear that issues of cosmology are different in Equestria without feeling particularly inclined to explain precisely how that is or to what extent these changes are to be found. That's fine; the show's first priority is to entertain, after all, and I doubt that the show's writers want to burden themselves with remembering a body of rules about how the world works in addition to trying to make each episode fun to watch. Nevertheless, these details do matter to those of us who want to understand the world better so as to deepen our appreciation of it, and so their absence is off-putting, even if it is understandable.
This, right here, gets into one of the basic questions regarding the setting's cosmology - do Celestia and Luna actually move the sun and the moon themselves, or do they rotate the planet? Given what little we know seems to fly in the face of how things work in the real world, there's no easy answers to these questions...which doesn't mean we can't critique fan-theories that are put forward.
Putting aside for a moment that we don't know that Cerberus is immortal, since the show never established that, this question has no clear or immediate answer. Given the complete and utter lack of information on the setting's in-character genesis, this is completely open to virtually any interpretation, including that it wasn't "made" at all but instead always existed.
Emphasis on the "if."
Given that you seem to be acknowledging that this is speculation, I don't feel that it's necessary to point it out here. That said, I personally don't find these particular questions very interesting, simply because the complete and utter lack of contextual clues in the source material to try and interpret in hope of forming some answer makes the endeavor largely pointless. When every explanation could be considered equally valid, the entire exercise becomes meaningless.
7211128 I just wonder what Silver thinks of all of this as he watches from his tower between time.
7211118
Right back at you.
So far so good...
...and here it all falls apart. You haven't established that Twilight is "automatically better than everyone else" when it comes to magic. In fact, the show indicates exactly the opposite of this, since Starlight was able to fight her to a standstill in The Cutie Re-Mark - Part 2. The idea that Twilight has to be better than everyone else at magic is therefore clearly not the case (and that's without getting into comparisons between her and the other alicorns).
Leaving aside the unfounded assumption that the royal guard has wizards, how does it follow that "if Twilight were bad at magic, therefore, the royal guards should have defeated the changelings"? These two ideas have no logical connection between them that I can see.
She can't make a spell like her brother; we're flat-out told this in A Canterlot Wedding - Part 1:
At this point there's no indication that there are "court wizards" at all.
No, you wouldn't assume that, because that's clearly not what we're shown in the source material itself. We've never once seen a guard casting a spell that I recall. No assumptions are needed when something is made self-evident in the show.
Strictly speaking, what I said is that Equestria is already a peaceful land, and so there's no real impetus for Celestia to have created laws - and the resulting systems of enforcement - to outlaw particular spells.
No, it wouldn't make sense; the show has already made it clear that this is not the case, because it's never once made this known despite having several situations in which it could have done so. That's leaving aside issues of ability, e.g. Starlight has a cutie mark related to magic, which likely plays a considerable role in her ability to learn stronger spells.
Apparently not, since we never see that happening. Since that's shown to not be the case, then the underlying presumptions that postulate that it should be the case are flawed.
7211150 Given that he abhors conflict, I doubt he cares for it.
7211162 So long as this is a peaceful debate, I have no issue. Not all debates have to be heated and personal. I love a good debate, and good friends and even good friends having good debates.
7211160 how would it not make sense that there would be no court wizards, starlight after all assumed that her friend had become a court wizard
jumping to twilight and her magic.its clear that she is better at magic than the average unicorn including trixy who only bested her when she had a magical artifact. that being said, she has erected shields that keep things out. yes starlight has a cutie mark for magic but the question is how and why is it stronger than unicorn twilight because twilight ( most likely) gained a bit more magic when she became an alicorn.
personally i feel that in the show thy stretch things just make ends meet, i wish thy gave much more knowledge and that thy gave an actual story for sombra but instead thy just make him as a random villain that comes out of no were and enslaves them all, personally i like both of Davids ideas for how sombra should have been.
7211172
7211162
would you guys mind sharing a mine craft server or playing guild wars 2?
7211432 well that sucks, whats your connection speed?
7211880 well that's the problem not wear it connects from but that your internet is awful joking aside, you should at least try to get better internet, in the next few years. that internet speed is going to be seen as dile up is seen nowadays
7211222 I don't play MMORPGs. I mean at all. I think that such games, like most of the rest of the internet, would be a lot of fun except for the other people who play them.
7212013 well ok. what about minecraft
7211210
No, she didn't. The word "court" never appears in either part of The Crystalling. She simply thought that he was an "important" wizard; more notably, she was completely wrong about that.
Yes, since magic is her special talent, and even more so since the series drops fairly unsubtle hints that she had power beyond that.
Which is different from Shining Armor's ability to layer a city inside a force field for long periods of time. The only other pony we see that can do this is Cadance, in Return of the Crystal Empire (which would seem to suggest that she learned how to do this from Shining Armor).
The idea that Twilight "gained a bit more magic" when she became an alicorn is murky. She says in Twilight's Kingdom - Part 2:
So she has "alicorn magic" of her own, but she's only starting to learn how to control it at that point. Other than that, the only magic she seems to have gained is a proficient degree of control over the magic that allows her to fly.
Insofar as why Starlight is stronger than Twilight was as a unicorn (if we grant the premise that she is) that could be as simple as Starlight being more talented than Twilight was. That's not unbelievable, since there's nothing that outrightly states that only the most powerful unicorn could be connected to the Element of Magic.
Sometimes they do; as I said before, the writers most likely care about continuity far less than they do about creating something entertaining. Nevertheless, what's in there is in there, and any theories about how things work need to account for that to the best degree that they're able.
I can understand wishing we knew more about his character, but I personally thought that his minimalist presentation did a pretty good job of being intriguing for what it didn't say. Alone of all villains, Sombra defies easy classification as to whether or not he's an ordinary pony that gained extraordinary dark powers from somewhere, or if he's a monster that simply happens to resemble a pony. Moreover, his dark magic is shown to not be a corrupting influence, unlike most depictions of dark magic in the show; that's why Princess Celestia and Twilight are both able to use it without any ill effects. He's a character that leaves us with more questions than answers, and I appreciate how that invites the audience to imagine their own answers.