And the winner is......

The Secret of NIMH

To the uneducated pones that dare overlook this gem, here's the skinny:

To save her ill son, a field mouse must seek the aid of a colony of rats, with whom she has a deeper link than she ever suspected.

Based on the novel Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH by Robert C. O'Brien, the film was supposed to be a potential film by Disney. But because they thought the story was too dark, they turned down the rights in 1972.

Later on, the company Aurora Productions bought the rights from director Don Bluth and producers Gary Goldman and John Pomeroy, but would come at a price...

Aurora only gave them a budget of $5.7 million and about 30 months to make the film, which is about HALF the cost and HALF the time it took to make an animated Disney film at the time. Bluth, Goldman and Pomeroy were so tight on the money that they had to mortgage their homes so they could boost the budget of their first animated film to $6.4 million.

To work with the really tight schedule, the crew had to work long hours and even some animators had to at home.

Oh, and I forgot to mention they cannot waste any precious time either.

The crew's goal for the film was to make this feel like an animated film from the Golden Age of animation by not only focusing on a strong story and characters, but also using old animation techniques as well like split exposures and diffusions to make the reflections and shadows, rotoscoping, and back-lit animation for both water and fire effects.

Don believed that it's not only a way to lower costs, but it's also a way to save animation...

But on the other hand, it's harder labor which makes it more time consuming, so that idea is both forwards and backwards at the same time.

For the music, they brought in film and TV composer Jerry Goldsmith, which makes it the first animated film he worked on. He would later state that it was his personal favorite film he worked on, so much so that he volunteered to work three more weeks to polish the score.

This would be the last film Elizabeth Hartman, the voice of Mrs. Brisby, and Hermione Baddeley, the voice of Auntie Shrew, ever did before they unfortunately passed away.

But on a brighter note, this was the first film for Shannen Doherty, the voice of Teresa, and Wil Wheaton, the voice of Martin. So, I guess you could say the cast had an equal amount of ups and downs.

During post production, there was a huge emergency.

In the books, they always refer to the main character as "Mrs. FRISBY".

I'm not joking, that's actually the problem.

The crew had to find a way to change her name from Frisby to Brisby so they could avoid getting sued by Wham-O, the company who made the frisbee. But there was one problem...

The entire cast had already finished recording their lines and all said Mrs. Frisby instead of Brisby.

The solution?

The sound editors had to cut some other recordings where they said "Brr" and put it over the "Frr" on the magnetic dialogue tracks.

You have no idea how it was a close call.

When it was released on July 2nd, 1982, it was the largest non-Disney animated film released at the time that appeared in up to 700 theaters. Critics praised the film for its fluent animation, great story, and how it felt like a Disney film back in the Golden Age, saying:

"The Secret of NIMH is a dark, well-told tale that respects its young audience enough to not tone down its subject matter."

As for the box office though, they only managed to get $14 million. They did make money off of it, but not enough to be considered a success.

The reason for it being a failure was that there was barely any promotion for the film, the release dates were totally different in each region, and the fact that it was against major films like E.T. The Extraterrestrial. Other films that had this problem at the time and even posed as threats to NIMH were Jim Henson's The Dark Crystal and Disney's Tron.

But on the bright side, it did win a Saturn award for "Best Animated Film".

In 1998, there was a direct-to-video sequel to the film called The Secret of NIMH 2: Timmy to the Rescue......

It sucks balls.

That's all I'm gonna say about it.

Over the years, The Secret of NIMH would slowly but surely grow a cult following from both animation fans and Don Bluth fans and they both, even Don Bluth himself, regard it as the best animated film that he ever made.

A fun fact: the guy who sings this song is actually the same guy who voiced The Penguin from Batman: The Animated Series. Now you can't unhear it ;)

And for our next poll:

Gumby the Movie =

OR

Mary and Max =
Look them up if you haven't heard of any of these.

7347697
Sounds rather like the story of Toy Story 2's production.

This movie has aged very well over the decades. Still worth a watch to this day! Highly recommended!

It was an excellent film.

Read the book too, if you haven't. There's a lot of background there that's not in the film iirc.

7347697 There will never be a greater animated film than this one right here.

7347697
I've only seen the movie once, but it was so dark and depressing. Even by Don Bluth's standards. However, the movie was such a delight to sit through and I hope to watch it again someday.

For the poll, I choose:

It was animated? THE BOOK WAS AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It wasn't that dark of a book. What did they do to it?

7347714
It was probably judged that way by people thinking that animation is for kids.

7347697
A fine movie.

7347721
The darkest thing in the book that I recall was that the rats were stealing electricity... I have no idea where swords and daggers are coming from!

I have very fond memories of Gumby, so

The animation type was in the first few Land Before Time movies.

One time I, along with my ex-writing partner, wrote a crossover featuring 'The Secret of NIMH' and one aspect we decided to do with it was make Mrs. Brisby's first name, Elizabeth. We did so to pay tribute to the late Elizabeth Hartman, who tragically committed suicide due to the depression she suffered at the end of her career. Sometimes I wonder how different the industry would be if her suicide was prevented.

7347697
It remains one of my favorites, esp the end title song by Paul Williams, "Flying Dreams:"

It's also the first major animation film that had a curse word in it.

Don believed that it's not only a way to lower costs, but it's also a way to save animation...

I don't know much about animation, but I do know about work. And I'll tell you one thing, there's no such thing as a shortcut. Only the illusion thereof. You only ever have two options: a lot of easy work, or a little bit of hard work. At least, to achieve the same end result. I imagine that's what Don was thinking.

Secret of NIMH gave me nightmares when I watched it, that's how well made it is... Wowie, that was a wild ride. I was 4 when I first saw it, and I haven't seen it since. It's been 10 years, and that was a memory I never suspected would ever come back.

Also, do Gumby the Movie next, I loved that one! That was my happiness away from digital TV, as I've never had cable in my life.

7347697
Which reminds me of

7347701
What does “iirc” mean?

7347697
Secret of Nimh was a great movie. I've always enjoyed it. I've been meaning to watch it again one of these days...

As far as animation lookbacks in the future, how about this one?

This song's kinda amazing, though rather dark...

--Sweetie Belle

7348042
IIRC: If I Recall Correctly

7348076
Thank you

All Right!

I have a little history with this:

I remember back in middle school in class reading the book & then watching the movie the day after.

I didn't know what to think of it back then until I saw on YouTube Brerdaniel's take on it with his "Pooh's Adventures" series.

I liked it then I saw the movie again years later and now here I am.

I loved the movie then (when I watched it again) & I still love it today.

You know, if the sequel had mostly been more focused on the 'actual' follow-ups of the books, it probably would've done a better job.

Instead, they made the sequel more colorful, some of the characters and their decisions were questionable (Despite the talent they had), and the fact they made it another animated musical as some other follow-ups to Bluth's work and well... Let's face it:

The sequel was doomed to fail from the very beginning. And now there's all this rumor about a remake of the first movie and folks are definitely right to be worried.

7347697

Such an underrated movie.

Great thread.

7348414
Underrated? Yes. But one of the most 'popular' underrated films? Absolutely.

Heck that sequence where Mrs. Brisby takes the stone and uses it's power to lift her family home, when it sunk in the mud and nearly drowned her kids... Not only is it a captivating shot but it demonstrates what she is willing to do to save her family even the sensation of the stone's magic proves overwhelming by the end. You can see how much it takes out of her.

Knew the Molina Brothers and Mr. Spaford who edited and animated this show,
Derk the Daring video game too - I still have a flip book of the Princess giving Derk a smooch
This was eons ago . . . I was the inspiration for a character on a later movie Rock A Dootle Doo (The Helicopter expert!)
Dave & Dan Molina we're fans of the Marx Brothers - Funny set they were.

You know speaking of 'Dragon's Lair', which features Dirk the Daring, word on the street is that Don Bluth wants to return to animation by developing a motion picture based off his popular 'Dragon's Lair' game.

Man, I was obsessed by this film when I was younger, Wrote a massive prequel and an almost-as-massive sequel that ended up collapsing under the weight of its own pretentiousness.

7348171

You know, if the sequel had mostly been more focused on the 'actual' follow-ups of the books, it probably would've done a better job.

I dunno. Racso is every annoying pre-teen protagonist rolled into one, Margaret isn't much better, and I cannot comprehend how R-T can be done in a way that isn't cringe-worthy--much as I would love to be proven wrong. But everything else in those two stories was pretty good.

7358359
I never read the books so there's no way I can argue about that.

Are you 'sure' there isn't a way around the 'flaws' that those aforementioned characters had in the original source material?

You sound like a big fan of 'The Secret of NIMH' overall, figured that creative mind might have ideas.

7347697
I loved the Secret of NIMH since I have memory. Even if it was dark, the plot was original (well, not based on the book, but original) and a classical non-Disney animation.

7358373
It was this very movie that put Don Bluth on the map, since he was barely involved with Disney apart from a few projects. I dig the direction the movie took combining fantasy with science. Plus, Miss Brisby is one of my favorite female protagonists, a mother, who despite being timid, will risk everything to save her family (Especially her ill-stricken little boy, Timmy).

7358621
I know. That mouse earned a place within my favourites female characters; running into the owl's territory, getting into the rat's home while beign chaced by that brute guard, holding against Janner... I believe she represents some moms in real life - a fighter in her own.

Tough she never get a name save for her husband's last name (I always wondered why). Also, there were some rumors about making a live-action version, not sure about liking said idea.

7358644
When I did a crossover on this movie with my ex-writing partner, it was my idea to name her 'Elizabeth' as a tribute to Elizabeth Hartman (As this was her final film role before retirement... and committing suicide after a severe depression).

I've heard talk about the remake and I heard what they want to do with it and...

I'm not exactly confident about the remake myself. Especially since I feel it's a step down from the 'dark' material.

I will say this about Brisby. She doesn't have to be the bravest, the strongest, or even the fastest, but she has a strong heart. And let's not forget she did jump right onto a running tractor even though she didn't know how to stop it.

ONE COMMENT IS ENOUGH. THIS IS A PET PEEVE OF MINE.

I kind of liked Timmy To The Rescue... though not all of it was good, it told a tale about coming out of the shadow of a legacy... and two of its songs stuck out at me.

I Will Show The World tells a story about a child aspiring to come out of their father's shadow, which is a deep theme in the story; helping your family out of their insecurity. I mean, look at Martin's progression.

On the other hand, Magic Mystery Tour is just whimsical. In some ways, it's like Flim and Flam (it is a con job, after all,) but it keeps a sense of whimsy that keeps you hooked into the song, even if you don't buy a thing that's being hawked about the Great Owl.

Just Say Yes, I admit, told Martin's backstory in an engaging manner, but the song wasn't all that catchy, and at this time, it gives too many creepy vibes.

I mean, not all straight-to-video sequels are good, but another STV I enjoyed somewhat (probably out of a similar lack of the first movie for comparison) was FernGully 2: The Magical Rescue.

In contrast, I've watched both Space Chimps and Zartog Strikes Back, and despite the 0% on Rotten Tomatoes, I found it wrapped up the "frozen Zartog in a garden" plotline nicely while providing quite a few funny things like Jagu's dancing, Kilowatt's head shorting out, and that voice issue with the remote.