Mag dodged through a flock of chattering young officers on the way to the bathroom, none of them old enough to drink. They all looked so busy and purposeful, like people with credit scores and five-year plans. Many of them also had visible weapons, but this was less intimidating than the sense of earnest industriousness the staff conveyed. And every single one of them was younger than her. Mag didn’t belong here in any sense. One would think being allowed to wander free in a secret military installation would be interesting rather than irritating and dispiriting.
The corporal wasn't helping. She kept up with Mag without effort, blank of face and eyes fixed forward. Luckily, Mag had spent the past few days learning how to not be intimidated, and the “self-absorbed babbling” approach seemed to work as well here as anywhere. The corporal's lack of conversational contribution only allowed Mag to build a full head of steam.
“—and that's why it's so interesting that the species of louse native to gorillas is so similar to human pubic lice. Do you get it? It's because Early Man fucked a gorilla. Do you see? You probably see. But enough of that. Would you like to know how incredibly annoying it is to be around a sun goddess all day? The answer is a lot. She never seems to get dirty, even her mistakes are graceful and classy, and she's always right, even when she's wrong. And did you read that report? She can catch bullets. It makes me wonder what you guys are even for, to be honest. Don't try and take a bullet for her, by the way, if that wasn't already clear. Just step to one side and let them bounce off of her. The washroom is around this corner? Yep, cool.” Mag walked in. Some secretary-looking girl saw Mag in the mirror, recognized her, and bolted past Mag into the hall, insofar as bolting was possible while wearing heels.
“Five minutes,” said Luna, as per their standard agreement. Luna's aura mostly disappeared. She hadn't told Mag where she usually went. One more question Mag hadn't had time to ask.
“See that? I walk into a room and everyone flees. God, other people are so freaking weird.” Mag flicked a toilet stall open and went in. “That's the problem with public bathrooms. You've got a special room in the building set aside for us all to express one of the fundamental truths of humanity, that we are weird and gross. Have you ever thought about it? We try to cover up our dark secret with enclosed stalls, air fresheners, and floors of temple-like white tiles, but there's no getting away from the existence of butts. Speaking of butts, I'm just going to come out and say it. Celestia has the giantest damned butt. You know how I keep looking behind us? That's not because I'm watching for terrorists or Georgia; that's because one of these times I'm going to catch somebody having a look. I just know today there's some poor boy in this building having a sexual identity crisis because there's a gorgeous naked lady wandering the building, but she's some kind of horse monster thing, and he can't make it work in his head. It raises questions, though, doesn't it? I won't enumerate them, but let me just say I told her where the bathroom in my house is and then I never saw her use it. I'm not going to ask her how all that works because the truth may be some kind of Lovecraftian nightmare involving alien geometries and violations of the laws of thermodynamics, but one wonders. Is that butt for show? I don't know, man. I will say, though, that sooner or later someone is going to say something awkwardly sexual and then nobody is going to know what to say, especially me. What do you think? Don't worry, it's a rhetorical question. I suppose I could always start yelling about chauvinism, but let's face it, Celestia will know exactly what to say. And that, corporal, is why I know how you feel about being assigned to protect an invincible being. There's no point in feeling protective of her. Protect her from what? How? I think I may be the only person on this planet who found a way to help her, and I'll bet that's rare, because how much help can she possibly need? I don't think she needs any of us, not the likes of you and me, anyway. If it weren't for her sister living in my head, I would probably just get out of her way and go home. But no, the other pretty pony princess is in my head. It's a shame none of you can see Luna. Her butt isn't as big, but she makes up for it in style.” Mag flushed and came out of the stall.
Soap, cold water, scrub. “I don't mind telling you that this suicide watch is really annoying, not that I blame you personally. And hearing about it right after watching her crush some dork's dreams? Man. That was horrible. Were you watching that? I forget whether you were in the room. No, of course you were. Was she right or wrong to pull that stunt? I don't know. Normally whenever someone says something, I assume they're wrong and then work backward from there, but I can't seem to do that on Celestia. But Brickley, or Bradley or whatever—did you see his expression? Jesus. I don't know what to think right now.” Mag shook water off her hands and wiped them on her pants. “But I can't say that to Celestia's face. How? What if I say something, and then it turns out she can't change my mind? She always knows what to say, so on the day she doesn't, it'll be that much worse. Well, whatever. Good talk, corporal.”
“You need a drink.” Mag looked at the corporal. She stood against the wall near the entrance with her feet apart and her hands behind her back, just as she had when they came in together, and she still stared straight ahead.
“You're talking now?”
“No,” said the corporal.
“Fair enough. Can I get a name if I promise not to use it?”
“Bittermann.”
“An actual last name? I haven't heard one of those in days. I'm Mag Wilson.”
Corporal Bittermann didn't answer.
“Fair enough.” Mag reached for the door handle, but the door opened by itself. Mag found herself face to face with a baggy-eyed and surprised Georgia.
“Nope,” said Mag, and bolted down the hall.
***
The book was back where it had been.
“Did I miss something?” said Mag.
“Bradley and I have talked,” said Celestia, “and I now realize that I took neither your culture nor the nature of your species into account earlier.”
“You caved?!”
“I did indeed. One of my chief concerns is keeping hazardous items, knowledge included, out of my subjects’ reach. But I now see that their needs and values are different than the needs of humans, and I’m going to respect that. The book stays, and I apologize for not trusting you, Bradley. Again, though, this book is dangerous, and I simply can't guess at the level of damage it's capable of if misused.”
“Just don't read it,” said Mag.
“Why not?” said Bradley.
Oops, now she had to come up with a plausible reason that wasn't “this century's atom bomb.” That’d just make them more curious.
Screw it. “Because it could end up being this century's nuclear bomb,” said Mag. “This is a book on dark magic, or that's the impression I got. Is that right?”
“You could put it that way, though I think it's more complex than that,” said Celestia.
“Sure. But that's the thing. Here's an image for you. Imagine a human bomb, some kind of soldier who studies black magic and becomes a human weapon at the cost of his sanity, but it's marketed to the public as something other than black magic, like “war spells” or “regulated magic.” Imagine the government putting a project like that together and then threatening other nations with it. Fox News talking about fighting terrorists with our new weapon. Other countries start studying magic now that they know it exists, and soon we've got another cold war at best, and the thing is, I don't know where the limit to all this is. What can you do with black magic? How far can you go? Any opinions, Celestia?”
“Only that you're thinking small. Among your magic supersoldiers, a single genius could become a tyrant queen or king with no resources but magic. I can tell you many stories along that line. Sombra, Tirek...”
“Sauron,” supplied Mag.
“Actually,” said Bradley, “Sauron was a rebel Maiar and so was never a mere mortal to begin with.”
“The Witch-King, then. Gollum? I don't care about any of this, actually. Seriously, you caved?!”
“Sometimes I change my mind.”
“I can confirm that sometimes she changes her mind,” said Luna. “Shall I assume this ‘Sauron’ is another character in human folklore?”
“Well—”
“I didn’t even know you were allowed to cave like that.”
“What about the time you convinced me to take you to Equestria?” said Celestia.
“It’s different when it’s me getting you to cave,” said Mag.
“Stop saying ‘cave,’ and who is Sauron?” said Luna.
“I’ll say all the caves I want, and Sauron is some nerd thing. We can watch the movies the next time we have 10 hours to spare.”
Bradley went pale. “The movies? I mean, that is to say, what about the books? I’m sure their majesties would prefer—”
“The books suck. Do you really want to argue about this now, though?”
“No,” said Celestia, “because Bradley has mentioned something interesting. We are now officially in a hurry, so I’ll be succinct. We need to crash a meeting that could use my input, but which I, by some oversight, was not invited to. It was a pleasure to see you again, Mr. Bradley. Mag, shall we go?”
Mag trotted after Celestia. “We can’t teleport?”
“I would prefer not to teleport my new guards without their permission, and I can’t ask their permission without intimidating them, so we’ll be walking for now. They’re also there to make me more conspicuous, which allows others to prepare themselves for the sight of me. Why not let them?”
“You like having guards.”
“As a matter of fact I do. I have always traveled with guards when I could, and now, though they’re not quite mine anymore, I can almost let myself imagine... but enough of that. We are late.”
“Could you do me a favor?” said Mag. “Next time, instead of giving in when someone tries to change your mind, would you mind just being right the first time?”
“I’ll do what I can, but sometimes you’ll have to forgive me for being right the second time instead.”
“No promises.”
***
Corporal Bittermann opened the boardroom door for Celestia. Interesting—she'd never done that before, and now she’d done it in front of some very important people.
Celestia walked in, all confidence and stateliness, and Mag followed her into a room with a number of excellently dressed old men around two plastic folding tables set end-to-end. A projector sat in the middle of the tables, and it projected an image of Celestia’s achingly beautiful face across the opposite wall. Five aides lined one of the other walls.
Nice suits and cheap tables. This organization aimed to be intimidating, but sometimes it seemed slapdash. The consequence of always being in a hurry, maybe.
Most of the men stood up in alarm at the sight of the real-life Celestia walking in on them. She beamed at them. “There is no need to be alarmed; it’s only me. I’d like to introduce myself, though it looks as if you already know of me. My name is Princess Celestia.”
One man stood up to his full height and adjusted his suit coat. “Good morning, Princess. How may we help you?”
“I’d heard there was to be a meeting to write your statement to the public regarding my nature and intentions. I assumed, for reasons which I imagine are obvious, that my input would be useful—after all, I have managed my own public image for thousands of years, and you will want to know how I plan to present myself in public. I apologize for being late.”
The man remained standing. “Oh, you don’t need to worry about all that—”
“No apologies necessary? That’s very kind of you. I take it you haven’t started yet, then. In that case, shall I give my own presentation first, so you all know what you’re working with?”
The man smiled. “No, no, we’re doing just fine already, thank you. I know I speak for all of us when I say we’d prefer it if you took the time to rest from your journey, and, as I said last night, we invite you to explore the facility and speak with whoever you like.”
Celestia smiled back, and hers was better. “Oh, but I insist. I find meetings quite restful, my exploration has led me to all of you, and at the moment, you are all exactly the people I’d most like to speak to.”
Mag made two decisions at this point. The first was to take her place among the other aides against the side wall. The second was to keep her mouth shut.
“You insist?” said the man.
“Yes, I think you’ll find me extremely insistent, Mr. Joseph Gradely,” said Celestia.
“Joseph is fine. In fact I don’t think I introduced myself by my last name in the first place.”
“I like to be formal in settings like this,” said Celestia.
“So that’s why she asked me to find his last name in dreams,” said Luna.
Celestia turned the projector off with magic, stood next to the back wall, and projected an image of her own, an old-timey photograph of herself hovering over a crowd of ponies, wings spread, the rising sun directly over her head, gazing down at her subjects with an expression of queenly benevolence. The image was met with silence, though someone did scoff under his breath.
Celestia laughed. “Yes, it’s rather silly from a human perspective, isn’t it? But I can see I have something of an impact on humans—I’m old, not blind—so my usual approach to public relations may be very salvageable, so long as I allow for the human attitude toward, well, whatever it is I represent to all of you. The real question, as I see it, is how I might make the best possible impression on humanity in the following press conference. I'll be holding a press conference, by the way, and I look forward to seeing how you arrange it. Before we discuss image management, here is everything I expect to discuss at my press conference...”
Luna yawned theatrically in Mag’s head. Mag saw her point, but chose to pay attention anyway. What, exactly, were they doing here?
“Humans attach importance to clothes, and use them to interpret a person's social status and temperament. I will therefore wear nothing except my crown and collar. I don't believe I can learn to speak in the language of human clothing in time to say something coherent or tasteful, let alone something that accurately expresses how I would like to be seen in human terms. It would be best to present myself in nonhuman terms, and in those terms, I am already in one of my best outfits. Questions so far?” She didn't pause or look behind her, and no one raised his hand in any case. “Excellent. I expect the following questions there, but I don't mind other questions so long as I can decline to answer without offending.”
The first picture of Celestia changed to a picture of herself behind a wooden podium, looking approachable. Then the picture lost color and contrast, and a long list of questions in small print rolled down.
“In the interest of time, I won't answer all of these for you right now. Your scientists and officials covered most of these yesterday, if you're curious. I also don't expect anything like all of these questions to be asked, particularly the trap questions, though one must be prepared. Now we come to image management. Let's discuss proper terms of address.”
Proper terms of address. So that was the point—showing everyone who was boss.
***
Twenty minutes later, Celestia wrapped things up.
“... and that should do for the press pamphlets. Does anyone have anything to add? No? Excellent. Thank you for your time.” She let the final image disappear, a heraldic picture of Luna and Celestia in profile, and turned the projector back on. She sat down next to Joseph Gradely, shifted into a comfortable position, and looked around the room. “Who'd like to go next?”
“Actually,” said Joseph,” I think you've given us all a lot to think about.”
“And do,” said Celestia, “if it takes as long to arrange an international press conference on Earth as it does anywhere else. That's sensible, though I was looking forward to hearing what you all had to say. May I have all of your business cards before you go?”
Of course she could. They gave her everything she wanted and then left, along with their aides. Mag watched the latter carefully in the hopes that she'd learn something, but didn't get much out of it. Four stayed a respectful distance behind their employers, but one of them strode to Joseph Gradely's side and offered him a handkerchief. Gradely took it and mopped his brow. Then the door closed behind them, and Celestia, Mag, Corporal Bittermann, Celestia's nameless guards, and arguably Luna were the only ones in the room.
Mag adopted her best mother-Galadriel voice. "Don't bully them, Mag."
“Yes, well,” said Celestia.
“Kidding,” said Mag. “That was fun.”
“It loses its charm the hundredth time you see her do it,” said Luna.
“She does that a lot?”
Celestia filled several dixie cups from the water cooler in the corner and passed them all out. “It's something I like to do when somepony arranges a meeting in my own castle, then tries to keep it a secret from me. I show up just as it starts, seal the exits, and give them a speech about, oh, gravitational mechanics, the history of the tea trade, whatever I think would interest them least. That's what I normally do, anyway. This time I thought I'd make better use of the situation. I hope they found it informative.”
“I'm pretty sure it's my job to serve water,” said Mag.
“Oh? Oh yes,” said Celestia. “That reminds me. You did well.”
“I didn't do anything. Unless you count staying out of your way.”
“You reinforced my bid for authority by taking your place by the other aides. That was the moment I knew this would work.”
Mag scratched her head and wondered if she was being slow. “How did my walking to the other end of the room tell you this would work?”
“It was in the way they reacted. They hardly noticed you, and yet your move helped them understand what I was about to do, helped convince them it was a forgone conclusion that I'd be joining them.”
“I have no idea what she's talking about,” said Luna, “but you may as well accept it. She's decided you helped.”
“But aren't they just going to have their meeting somewhere else now, maybe in another building? We're not doing that again, are we?”
“Once was enough,” said Celestia. “They'll have their meeting, yes, but I've entirely changed their tone. Now they realize that, however cooperative I've been so far, I will also be making my own decisions in how I interact with humanity. I've also convinced them to arrange a public press conference for me, which lets me begin to form a rapport with news agencies and the public, independent of their influence. And yes, I'll get my press conference. They haven't learned how to ignore me yet.” She sipped her water. “Mm. Cold.”
“'Yet,'” said Mag.
“Yes, I have no doubt they'll learn quickly if they wish to.”
“This seems kind of...”
“Manipulative?” said Celestia.
“Warlike,” said Mag. “It's like you're teaching them to fight you.”
“I may be speaking a bit overdramatically. I don't think they see me as an opponent, only as a nonentity who doesn't need to be consulted about how her own business is to be carried out. Today I taught them better, while arranging for a bit of political capital in the form of a press conference.”
“You're very proud of that press conference,” said Mag.
“As a matter of fact I am,” said Celestia. “I'm looking forward to it. It's been quite a long time since I've made friends with a planet.”
It's a little bit of a shame; editing this wonderful story means I can neither be surprised nor excited when it updates.
Still worth it to see such a great finished product, though.
>everything bad about this fic is now officially all his fault
;p
It was probably all my fault even before I started reading, to be honest. Everything's always my fault.
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Well, that was certainly an update, I suppose. If that's what you had in mind when you talked about increasing the pace of the story, then I'm not really sure I like it very much, though. The writing felt incredibly frenetic and hyper during the whole chapter, but at the same time there isn't actually much more being accomplished under the bottom line than in any of the previous ones. Less, kinda, because most of it is Celestia's (unicorn-)powerpoint presentation, and those don't count as real productive work as a matter of principle.
6034972
I'm sure you're looking for a more substantive response than this but right now all I can think about is:
"In my defense, I am both Powerful and Pointy, so it was only a matter of time"
I probably should have saved that level of comedy gold for the fic itself rather than spending it on the comment section, though.
Glad to hear you rocked those exams in the face, mate! Looking forward to seeing more from you!
And knowing that Celestia shows up unannounced and then hijacks meetings she's not invited to in her own castle makes me smile.
a super good chapter good work I don't think I need to say more about that.
Arcanist Ascendant I know what you mean as I am now helping with to love a queen witch I am enjoying a hole bunch but as you say when the new chapter's come out it is not quite the same as I helped with the lay out and editing of them.
I will go as fare as saying good team work to you Ranger & Arcanist Ascendant.
Harts Fire
Everything about this chapter was great, really, but this here is brilliant. Very nicely thought out and shows exactly how Celestia always thinks a little deeper and a few more steps ahead than the people she's dealing with. Including Mag, though Mag is beginning to close the gap it would seem.
Editor's presence is much appreciated and noticeable. The story just got even smoother, well done.
Well... since I'm not going to quote the entire chapter back at you to praise it I'll just stop here :)
Do carry on.
6035213
I still think Celestia is in the wrong keeping the book from the researchers. An epic feat like bringing back a destroyed world will probably require doing some things forbidden, and others which are not if only because no sane individual would ever consider them in the first place.
6035448
I'm glad to see I made a difference! Ragnar's prose is great without my help; I wish I could take more credit for how good this, heh.
6035484
Well then, it's a good thing she's not keeping it from them, isn't it?
Congratulations, kids. You just played chess with the Grandmaster and got schooled.
6035679 360 noscope checkmate? XD
6034864 XD Joseph looks a little nervous in those pictures. Maybe Celestia should have offered him some water in a dixie cup before he left.
Is it Bittermann or Bitterman? You keep switching.
6035774
SHIT
This is the sort of thing I'm supposed to prevent.
It's Bittermann, we should probably fix that.
"Okay, why are you going to see a madwoman that insist that it knows you?" Mag asked
"Public relations, also it could be that she actually knows me."
Mag paused, thinking about it for a moment, "So, is another Sovereign?"
"Maybe, maybe is a Wanderer. A Wanderer is a being that travels among worlds regularly. Is quite dangerous to do so, yet they still do it for one reason or another."
"Oh my, this is quite interesting, so little Luna is inside your assistant head?" The madwoman said, it was still in the other side of the building, yet Celestia, Mag and Luna could perfectly hear her.
"Discord." Luna hissed, while Celestia just smiled.
"Yes and no, little Woona is not the only one who can piggyback into someone's head, but again, visiting a dead world tends to be dangerous, as whatever killed it might still be there, right darling? Oh you must absolutely let me give you a makeover Mag, you are Princess Celestia aide, you should look your best."
"Do you know hat happened to Equestria?" Celestia asked, the smile gone.
"No, but if you ask me, it was very disappointing. It was like someone just had decided to turn off a switch, what a boring way for a world to end. "
6034864 I figure that's the one true downside of editing, other than the time expenditure and the comparative lack of glory to be had for something that really is very difficult.
6034972 This isn't me speeding up the pace; all that's change is that I have a more clearcut policy of making sure something happens in every chapter that people will actually remember. It sounds like the problem is in the prose. Are there any passages you can quote that demonstrate your point?
6035213 lol who is this amusing man?! sounds handsome
6035422 Thanks! And I hoped that'd be funny to someone.
6035424 Glad you're enjoying this, and it sounds like Arcanist Ascendant is sticking around, so I hope that means it's worth it to him.
6035448 I'm trying to write Celestia as a politician who pays attention, understands people, thinks everything through, has genuine integrity, all that kind of thing. People joke about politicians in the same way they joke about lawyers, but Gandhi was a lawyer and Nelson Mandela was a politician. On another level, Celestia is the product of those communication classes I took. Everything about her interpersonal style is touchy-feely as fuck and that's how she likes it.
As for our great leader editor and his influence... you can see the difference, but you have no idea.
6035451 You're god damn right
6035703 Water? No, I don't think so. Water is for winners. Get out of my boardroom, Gradely.
6035774 Fixed, thanks. I'm going with two Ns because it's more German that way, so the word "bitter" is now German and therefore means other things than the English.
6035861 It's always fucking something.
6037053
Also, create a gdoc for the next chapter and share it with me, then PM me with the link.
6037106 Gotta work outside until sundown in this furious goddamn heat, which will probably happen at midnight for you, and then write some, and then you'll get that PM.
6037870
~Ragnar
~Ether
6037930
Count yourself lucky. I had the same problem, except with Through the Well of Pirene, while I was sick. There are worse fics to be compelled to binge read. This is much easier on the eyes.
6037053
I suppose the big "toilet monologue" at the beginning would be a good start. It set up this whole "breathless rambling" style that didn't quite seem to leave again for the rest of the chapter, to my impression. Lots of words, but all of them very skippable because nothing much is really said.
6038442
Nightmares are a superstitious and cowardly lot. </Bale>
You know, right now I am this close to removing this from HaS again, because this kind of comment is getting way too common.
6038512 Huh. Well, fair enough, though I'm still not seeing how that same style continues after that bit. BTW, all jokes aside, that monologue was my idea and Our Glorious Editor didn't touch a word of it. All the glory and all the shame belong to me.
Actually I think that critique could be leveled against this entire fic. You sure you're not getting dissatisfied with the overall style?
6038537 Is this about the guy directly beneath your comment who flies into a rage because Mag is a misanthrope? Hell, I'm delighted to see it. It tells me exactly why I have another thumbs down. I will now post a gif in celebration.
http://i.imgur.com/12VW9Ep.gif
Wait, what's HaS? I can't find it anywhere.
6038736
I don't... think so? Maybe it's just me. There are a rather a lot of very long paragraphs this time in the dialogue, though, and something about them gave me this impression of "talking them to death" that I always read as very fast, rambling speech.
Like this:
When I sound like that during a presentation, it's because I don't want questions, which means talking too fast to give anyone time to think about what I'm actually saying. Might just be me, though. Thinking about it again, the middle part of the chapter wasn't really a lot like that at all, it's just fairly short and wedged between two long sections of this. Maybe that's why it didn't stick with me as much.
Also, HaS is that group I added this to, remember? They tend to get a bit obsessive and kneejerky about their favourite word like that, it's what I was talking about when I PM'd you.
6038803
Flashbangs intentionally don't do permanent damage, but otherwise yeah, pretty much. Do enough of that and you get actual retina burns.
6038736
Admittedly, though, I also just really hate reading about politics. Not the general concept, just the actual things involved in actually doing them. I realize that Celestia interacting with the governments of the world is something the story was planned to involve from the beginning, but I was hoping it would be more of a "broad strokes" kind of thing, not something that's shown in detail. It's always very dryy and uninteresting to me and it doesn't really seem like it would fit the general style of this story very much to dwell on the specifics of it.
6038821 Oh, right. It didn't occur to me you were talking about a group. I thought it was some kind of setting in the control panel, or something.
Well, my response when you asked about that group was "Fuck it, let's see what happens," and I still don't particularly regret it. If you decide A New Sun and HaS aren't a proper fit for each other, though, then go ahead and do what you feel needs doing.
Long paragraphs in dialogue is a trap I sometimes catch myself falling into, and if people are beginning to point that out, it may be time to keep a closer eye on that.
I will say this about the speech at the meeting: Celestia neither wants nor expects to get questions. She had no intention of ceding any ground.
As for how A New Sun deals with politics, it's like this. The fic has always been interested in social interactions, flow of conversation, conflicting narratives and so on, and much of politics comes down to exactly that. Also, in the context of this fic, those exact things are Celestia's specialty (both understanding them and manipulating them), so I want at least some nuts-and-bolts politics in here.
Plus I like that kind of thing.
Welp, just consumed this overnight (Arcanist pls). Very interesting. I like the way you've written Celestia--even without her 'goddessness', a magical being with thousands of years of social and political experience should be quite capable of plowing her way through whatever political bullshit the US (or any) government could try to build up around her. The telling thing will be how she proceeds from here on out re: not being a bully and not treating us like her subjects, now matter how much she wants to 'help'.
Like the Eldest, I can see myriad possible futures/directions in which this could go, but I'll keep it all to myself for now.
Also, I envy your skill with some of this dialogue.
6039062
rekt
6039775
6038519
Mag doesn't hate humans as much as she says she does, she's being facetious. There aren't any humans in the story that act like cunts.
How misanthropic of you.
I fail to see how I was being misanthropic there. I was giving an example of how telling a visiting alien that humanity is evil could get all of humanity and the idiot who thought it was a good idea to say such a thing killed. This hypothetical misanthrope, even being facetious, told a being belonging to a civilization capable of star travel that his own people were murderous bastards, not giving a single thought of what kind of trouble doing such a thing could lead to.
For all Mag knew, the horse alien could have been planning on using her planet to restart her civilization; making it a new home for her people. Do you think an powerful alien with such intentions would be okay with having its kind living in close proximity with murderous bastards?
Basically, if Mag didn't have anything nice to say, she shouldn't have said anything at all.
Christ, can everyone already stop abusing the word misanthrope like it's some kind of linguistic punching bag? It is not some sort of synonym for jerk, no matter how much you want to be able to stealth-insult people without getting banned for it. Schopenhauer was a misanthrope. Hitler was not. It's not this convenient "bad person" quality that everyone even vaguely snarky and critical of humanity's penchant for slaughtering each other at a drop of a hat has, even if they annoy you.
6039775
Easy: Meg isn't a bastard. None of the humans that have appeared so far is a bastard. The Elder is doing his limited best to keep the real bastards from destroying the billions of non-bastards.
Saying that humans are murderous bastards was 100% in character for Meg, that's all there is to it really.
If that would have led to the annihilation of mankind... well... really bad luck the alien asked Meg first, no?
42.
6038961 See, I loved those long and rambling dialogue blocks in this chapter.
They convey exactly the feeling the situations most likely are like:
- Meg being her usual self, this time extra annoyed by the situation she's manoeuvred herself into and determined to extra annoy back. How better to do that than this... that snarky rambling dialogue is exactly what made me feel sorry for Bittermann. I guess that was the intention after all. That's just how Meg is; it's a major source of comedy gold.
- Celestia being the manipulative politician commandeering a meeting and basically showing the others that she isn't willing to let others determine how she will go about her project. And setting them up to make them show the rest of the world how benign Celestia is by trying to fight her. Which she'll probably kill with merciless public benevolence and understanding.
To sum up: these paragraphs work really well to bring across the actual situation that is rather breathless and purposefully kept that way by the protagonists. "Any questions?" "Uh..." "No? Thank you very much for your time and willingness to participate in an open debate. Have a nice day."
6038961
6040410
These are all one of the few times where rambling is what you should be doing. It's much more acceptable in dialogue, because people don't always talk like they know what they're talking about.
6041068 I forget why I even started doing that. I know it's a habit I picked up from my old job, where I'd literally have been fired if I left out the double spaces at the end of every sentence (transcriber for a circuit court), so maybe it became a habit?
Whatever, it looks okay to me. It also makes it a little easier to edit, at least on my end. Easier to catch them comma splices.
6040410
I don't disagree, but if there's one thing I'll definitely stand to, it's the opinion that doing something annoying intentionally doesn't mean it's any less annoying for it, at least as a reading experience. Style that detracts from the enjoyment of the writing is something I'd hesitate to call good style, even if it's used to make a solid piece of characterization. Part of the reason I really think James Joyce can go choke on a Riverrun, whatever the critics say.
6041225 Counterpoint, Finnegans Wake is insane fun and Ulysses is the greatest book of the 20th century, and I'll happily pull quotes out of either or both of those books to show how I came to those conclusions.
This might be one of those arguments that come down to fundamental differences in writing philosophies. I don't mind annoying the reader in limited amounts--if I did, Mag would not exist. You could argue that that's really not the reaction I want from a reader if it wasn't intentional, I guess.
6041394
Until you actually try to read it, anyway. Then, Nabokov appears from the aether and sets it on fire with the power of his burning hate for awful grammar and nonsense prose that would embarrass an expatriate former Politbüro employee. Not that he would know, of course, what with him not being the greatest author of the 20th century.
Anyway, though, I suppose that's true. I can't really say I find her annoying, but still. As a general thing, I intentionally try talking from purely the subjective reader perspective when it comes to stuff like that, so I actively disregard everything about the intent behind it that's not directly related to how much it affects my own enjoyment of the story. When I mean annoying, I really just mean "more than I personally thought it was also fun to read," so take that sort of statement in general with a grain of salt.
6041461 AHA! Behold, a quote from Nabokov:
He disliked Finnegans Wake too, but has this to say about it:
Then again, he also said Chesterton is for children and didn't love Borges's House of Asterion enough (miniature minotaurs?!), so clearly no one is safe from being Wrong and everyone's opinions should be taken with a grain of salt, except for mine.
Trying to ignore the author's intent is just good practice, so far as I'm concerned, except with allegories or satire, and even then it depends on how you feel about the intentional fallacy (sorry for reference-dropping some poindexter lit crit shit in there, but this is exactly the kind of thing that matters to this particular nerd).
As for Mag, I see she mostly doesn't annoy people, except for those hard-of-reading individuals who took her "bastards" line at face value, for which you may as well forgive them. This general tolerance for Mag surprised me. She's got all the makings of a Scrappy Doo. But hey, I'm not complaining.
6041633
See? What would he know. Totally said so.
And I figure that since her dialogue is actually funny and she meaningfully contributes - and even if it were only by things like making the scenes involving the Eldest really sting (“Where the fuck have you been?”) - she still matters as a character and her personality isn't just some kind of weird audience appeal kind of thing, which makes really all the difference.
6041225
Ah, all good I guess. I enjoy exactly that style when used purposefully as it is in parts of this chapter (not if the entire text is written like that - that'd be extremely tiring and indeed annoying). Since you can't really argue matters of taste we'll just have to agree to disagree here. I do see the logic in your argument though.
6042941
That's really all I'd ever ask for, anyway. I always just give my opinion here, not some kind of argument seriously intended to change anyone's mind, so polite disagreement is really as good as it gets.
i.imgur.com/1OEYAYt.png
absolutely blazed...
until i commented and made it 421. hah. where is your god now?
6056453 Where is god? You mean right this second, in between chapter 17 and 18? He's lying in bed in a
BolivianNebraska hotel room, smoking a joint, arranging a 6:37 AM wakeup call with room service over the hotel phone.“The books suck." OH MY GOD GET THIS LADY A STRAIGHT JACKET SHE IS CLEARLY INSANE OVER THE TOP LOOPY CUCKOO
6064023 Her only experience of the books was a page or two from the middle of Fellowship after opening it randomly in a library one day. Does that make it better or worse?
6065232
i.imgur.com/9kfqXq5.gif
6066216 "We'll be right back after these messages!" A commercial begins. It's an empty white background. Mag moonwalks onscreen and then begins to do a sassy, cocky butt-dance for 27 seconds, ending with a clumsy breakdancing headspin and falling over. Words overlay the screen in comic sans.
"Mag Wilson (C)! Sending people to the angry dome since 1988. 'Now that's the authentic Mag experience!'" The next commercial begins, something about Arby's.
You google it online to figure out what the fuck you just saw. It turns out it's for a nonprofit organization dedicated to, according to the magwilson.org About page, "Irritating all the nerds and parents and political throwbacks. Donate today." There is no donations page.
6067562
Eh, I'm just not feeling it anymore.
...also, rereading Conversation Seventeen, I am wondering about whether Mag's rambling has deeper meanings than making noise.
I mean, it's been established, Celestia is everyone's idealized Mom--kind, wise, generous, decent, merciful, and compassionate to a fault. But she is also a magical talking pony with terrifying godlike powers. She is an adorable Lisa Frank rainbow unicorn, all eerie impossible grace and unearthly, elfin beauty, while simultaneously having height and proportions that carry the implications of "woman" rather than "little girl," with a badonkadonk bubble-butt (imagine your favorite John Joseco/Butch Hartman/Stephen Silver art here) and the power to shatter worlds. She is a pony-shaped Dr. Manhattan with Butch Hartman hips.
That's not a combination that works for everyone, but the magic of the Internet, and something called "Rule 34," suggests that at a minimum a few people might feel a certain--let's call it "curiosity." Mag may well be correct when she speculates that someone may be starting to get curious about... let's call it "pony biology." But given the stream-of-consciousness nature of what's coming out of Mag's mouth, I'm wondering whether Mag has just confessed to a schoolgirl crush on the New Goddess in Town ("Will Sempai ever notice me? Am I cute? uguu~").
I am, of course, possibly entirely wrong about this. I'm just speculating.
On a wholly unrelated note of speculation, in chapter 19, I am wondering why The Maker didn't just magic Luna out of Mag's head and magic together a body for her, maybe a talking wooden puppet or something, since he seems to have terrifying godlike powers even if he's more of a "big picture" guy than a "details" guy. I'm sure there's a reason for it.