The Dusk Guard and The Dusk Rogues - A Retrospective on the Two Teams of the Dusk Guard Saga · 2:07am Jun 18th, 2016
The Question
It took all of three days from the time The Dusk Guard: Beyond the Borderlands first appeared on Fimfiction for someone to make a comment wondering and predicting when the Dusk Guard were going to show up.
To be fair, it wasn't exactly an unexpected reaction. After all, to date, fan's only experience with The Dusk Guard Saga as a whole were with the titular group themselves: The Dusk Guard. The first story, all but one of the side stories to that date (and to be fair, that one was more just a connected story than an actual side)—all had revolved around a crew of ponies that had been introduced, grounded, and built up in an adventure that did share their name. So when the full sequel arrived, it wasn't too surprising that readers began inevitably asking "Where's the Dusk Guard? Where's Steel and the rest of the gang?" as they read chapter after chapter following anti-hero, Talon-for-Hire Blade Sunchaser, who had been a character in Rise, but not a member of the Dusk Guard ... and for that matter, not even a protagonist, but rather an antagonist whose battle with Steel had been one of the climaxes of the first story.
It was, for many, a bit of a shock, especially as the story moved on and they were introduced to a whole new range of characters caught up in Blade's journey, and bit by bit realized that the main character of this tale was, in fact, none other than this new cast, with the Dusk Guard themselves nowhere to be found in the core adventure. So sure were readers that there was going to be a big twist, that the team they were now following wasn't the main cast, that even halfway through the story, at the midpoint climax when the real foe stepped out of the shadows, so to speak, to confront Blade's crew, comments still suggested that this was the turning point, that the next chapter would start with the Dusk Guard themselves coming in, and that there would no longer be a focus on Blade's rag-tag band of "heroes."
This idea persisted even further—right up until the final battle, in fact. Commentators expressed thoughts that Blade would back down, contact the Dusk Guard, and then they would finally arrive to take center stage and take out the big bad once and for all. Comments in that vein lined the chapters right up to the end, where the Dusk Guard finally did reappear as expected ... but in the final chapter, after the climax, and as part of the resolution.
Now, by this point, many were fine with the way the story had turned out. The focus on Blade had been a surprise, to some an unwelcome one, but as the story had moved on many had found themselves getting sucked into the personalities and motivations behind Blade, Alchemy, Hain, Frost, and Barnabas just as they had Steel, Nova, Sabra, or any of the other members of the Dusk Guard team. But even as satisfied as they were with the story, there were still quite a few wondering why there had been such a drastic change in protagonists between the two stories. To this day, in fact, in fic recommendations for the series on 4chan's /mlp or elsewhere, you can find commentary from even those who recommend the series warning newcomers that the second story does not star the same cast. They'll prop it, they'll speak its praises, but there's no doubt that of the many surprises found in Beyond's pages, one of the most memorable seems to be that the story would follow not the shining, armor-clad Dusk Guard, but a bunch of ruffian rogues almost competing to break as many laws as possible.
And, even after Beyond was said and done, its status switched from "in progress" to "complete," there were many who wondered "Why?" Some even went so far as to complain about the shift, reject the story, or even contact the author (myself) seeking an explanation. "Why?" was the question on reader's minds. Why had the story jumped away from the characters that gave it its title? Why should they care about the story if it wasn't going to star that same cast? Why had I made the decisions I had? Why had I called it a sequel when, in their minds, it clearly was not? And, last of all, why should they expect to read any more of the Saga if Steel and the rest of his team weren't going to appear?
All questions stemming from one bold, crazy change: making Blade Sunchaser, the antagonist of Rise, the primary protagonist of Beyond the Borderlands.
And today? To all those readers, I say this: you're getting your answer.
The Beginning
The truth is, Beyond the Borderlands never was planned to star the Dusk Guard. Stepping back through the years all the way to the summer of 2012, when I first got into MLP and started puzzling away at the groundwork that would become The Dusk Guard Saga, it was clear to me that the story was going to be big. Bold. Grand. It was going to be a fantasy epic in every sense of the word, and as I started to lay out the pieces that would make up the story from start to finish, it looked good.
Of course, there were a few snags in the overarching plot, little hangups or unanswered questions that I simply couldn't answer without actually having more of the saga written out, but they were bumps that I knew to be surmountable. I wanted to write a grand epic that could be part of the fandom for a long time to come, something to give back for all the hours of music and art I'd consumed. And so, even with these hang-ups, I set out to lay the first pieces of the saga, starting with Steel Song. I put together some outlines, did a bunch of research—I was ready to do it.
And so, in the fall of 2012, I sat down and started writing what would become Rise.
And by about a third of the way through, I knew how Beyond the Borderlands was going to go. I knew that the saga I'd outlined, the story I'd set out to tell, could not be told solely through the eyes of the Dusk Guard. There were simply things that they couldn't do, or places they couldn't go. Avenues that the characters would not walk. They needed a counterpart, a second voice, a set of characters that would take that path, that could go where the Dusk Guard could not, and could explore other themes that mirrored those of the Guard. The story as I envisioned it, to work, needed another side to the Dusk Guard's coin.
And thankfully, I'd already left myself open for such a necessity. I'd already introduced Blade, laid the groundwork for her character and used her as an additional window into the culture and history of the Griffon Empire. Despite being Blade's friend, she was already a partial mirror of Steel himself—cut from similar cloth, as it were. And once that realization worked its way into my head, the answer presented itself: Let Blade take the stage for real, and move from supplementary to primary.
Two Sides of the Same Coin
Even with that decision, made less than halfway through the initial draft of Rise, that Blade would indeed come back, but as a protagonist instead of an antagonist, there were still a lot of questions I needed to answer. Thankfully, I had time to work on it, and as I pushed through the rest of Rise I spent a lot of time going back and forth on how to actually carry things out. At one point, Blade and her "team" (I hadn't yet figured them out past "a mentor griffon, a combat specialist, etc) were to function as a background event—something that took place entirely off "camera" to the main storyline until the very end, despite playing a heavy part in it. I even toyed with this as a way to set up a "side series" rather than adding it into the saga. By the time I reached the end of Rise and canonized the last few chekov's guns, however, I'd already discarded the idea. First of all, I was worried too many people would see writing a whole "mirror" set of stories as milking it. Sands, I considered it milking it! And so I discarded the idea. It was too risky, there was too much time commitment.
Worse, it would be locking away a number of important plot developments for the series to something that I might never actually get around to writing. It was, essentially, committing to a companion saga when I hadn't even released the first book of the actual saga yet. That didn't rest right with me. Nor did the fact that it could "cheapen" the core saga by just dropping in this other half of the story, these other elements, into the lives of the Dusk Guard when it was convenient without any real buildup outside of background for the readers. And that wasn't good either.
In the end, I knew I had to do something like it, however. I had to split away from the Dusk Guard—which was fine, the series was, after all, titled The Dusk Guard Saga (emphasis added) as a whole, not just The Dusk Guard. It was a grand story that was wrapped up in the titular guard ... but by no means limited to effecting them. Anyone and everyone who got caught up in the core series of events that made up the saga was, then, fair game. And make no mistake, Blade was definitely caught up in it by the end of Rise (I'd made certain of that), her fate now linked to the rest of the DG—a mirror, as I'd wanted.
I still was hesitant. At one point, there was even an attempt to combine the second and third books of the saga into one—one chapter following Blade's team, and another following Hunter—where they could both share an adventure that would then collide in the end ... but it didn't work. The DG's call wasn't the same as Blade's, not in the two parts of the saga. The logic was missing, the resultant story would have been a result of "Because I say so" rather than any amount of "Hey, this make's sense." And I wasn't prepared to make that sacrifice. Even if I did waffle on it for a while.
But eventually, I bit the bullet. The two stories would stay separate, but occur at similar times (you can actually see shades of this in both the side stories and Beyond if you pay close attention to the timeframe). No matter how I tried, I couldn't make the two stories one.
And I couldn't just delay one and throw the Dusk Guard into the place of Blade. Here was where I was running afoul of my other issue: realism.
See, I was writing an epic. Epic stories tend to be vast in scope, vast in planning, and vast in effect. Politics, nationalities, technology, culture ... all of these things would be explored and impacted over the course of the story in some way. And where Rise had been the introductory piece of the Saga, getting the reader's feet wet and setting up what was to come, Beyond the Borderlands, initially titled just 'Beyond,' was exactly that: A story designed to step past that introduction and view the greater world at large. A sort of "You've seen Equestria, now get a good look at everything else!" vibe. A chance to widen the scope of the epic and show some of the other places that were going to be affected by the story. And I had a serious problem. I couldn't do that with the Dusk Guard.
Rise had established a living, breathing universe, one that played by some very hard rules—including that of a certain level of realism and accuracy in both the team and in the saga's politics, diplomacy, and international relations. Which meant that despite needing to show the world outside of Equestria, by making the main cast of the saga a group of quite-active Guard division, I'd closed off whole segments of the world to them barring special circumstances. The DG was, quite literally, a special operations force, a team of commandos funded by, sponsored by, and acting on behalf of a government.
You might be able to see the conundrum I'd put myself in. See, in the real world, you can't just drop an active military force of any size inside another nation's territory. Not without permission, certainly (unless you want a war ... and even then you're supposed to announce that beforehand), and that permission is hard to come by, sometimes even among allies. While Hollywood has embraced the idea that anyone can just go anywhere without repercussions, that method usually hid under either a special circumstance like the world ending (and history has proven that not even that would matter to some) or by handwaving the consequences away as "off camera and after the conclusion."
Problem is, those consequences can be severe. Trade embargo/lose-your-rank-drummed-out severe. And I'd already established that Equestria as a nation was very carefully balancing it's capacity for worldwide calamity (demigods with control of the sun and moon? Superweapon) and not at all the type of country to just say "Excuse me" as they sent an active military force across borders or ignored an agreed upon treaty. The tone I'd set for my story made it abundantly clear that the DG were not going to make it into the territory that was The Ocean of Endless Ice without setting off a wide array of international incidents and repercussions.
I needed someone who didn't care about international politics quite so much. Someone with plausible deniability. Someone who'd already shown to have a bit of a disregard for the law if their contract came first. Someone with a connection to the team. I needed them for the story, and likewise, the DG needed the same for the same reasons.
And I had one. The Dusk Guard had one ... and a character smart enough to make the same logical jumps (Hunter). I either rewrote the world, broke the setup I'd already established, or ... I used Blade, and gave her a story of her own. Let her grow into what she'd already been trying to become: a mirror to Steel, a counterpart with her own team of misfits.
Now, believe me, Rise wasn't even fully released yet and I was still going back and forth on this decision. I could have gone back and rewritten swaths of it before it released, changed the story, changed the world, but ... I didn't want to. The story I had was the one I wanted to tell. And Blade fit neatly into it, solving a chorus of other problems you'll probably never know about related to the rest of the saga in the process.
I had to do it. It was the best way to tell the story. And so I went back to the plan I'd had since I'd hit save on the last page of Rise. The next story, Beyond the Borderlands, would star not the Dusk Guard, but Blade, leading a group that would mirror the DG in their adventures and provide a window into the areas they couldn't touch or go to. The Guard could stay concerned with Equestria first ... and the Rogues could be concerned with what lay outside of it ... as well as who had the most coin to offer.
The Result
I've got to say, even with all the questions as to why I made the choice I did to have Blade take center stage in Beyond, I'd never go back. As a storyteller, I've succeeded ... even if, due to there being a few more books, you may have to just trust me on that for now. At the end of the day, however, all I wanted to do was tell the saga in the best way possible. And no matter how I worked at it, putting Steel and the rest of his team in the center of what took place in Beyond just didn't work. They needed a different outlook. A different motive. Well, rather, the primary characters did.
The Dusk Rogues gave the story that. Here was a set of characters who answered to nobody but their own consciences and their senses of right and wrong. A crew driven by vastly different goals and objectives other than "Orders said to come here, so we did." They were characters who hadn't made the same choices the DG already had, and were therefore able to explore avenues unavailable to them, such as Frost's explanation and justification of her actions during the chapter Bombing the Behemoth. They put a different spin on things that the story needed. Beyond starring Steel and Co. would have been a very different story, one with a lot less challenge and never touching on the concepts, or even having the same overall tone that Blade and her crew did.
And while it may have been confusing for readers at first, as the story neared the end (and hit it), a lot of the pieces started to come together. There's been a lot of questioning from those who haven't read the story, or have only read the first few chapters, as to whether or not it should be labeled a "sequel" (some have even written me to express this belief after a chapter or so—some even being so determined that it wasn't such that they declared their intent not to read it), but among those who have finished it, there's no doubt how tightly it all comes back. Make no mistake, The Dusk Rogues are as much a part of this saga as the Dusk Guard, and they'll play their parts ahead.
As I said, I wouldn't change it if I could. The Rogues are everything I'd hoped for and more, just as the Dusk Guard are. And as the saga moves on with Hunter/Hunted and Fires of the Earth, you'll see both parties return once more to fill their respective roles. And yes, those roles will become more intertwined as the saga moves towards its conclusion. That's not a spoiler.
It's an assurance.
The Close
So, I guess, there you have it. At long last, I've answered one of the more persistent questions that's been asked by readers since finishing Beyond, and hopefully, now that I've said my piece, you understand.
Granted, I know that there are those of you readers who have a critical eye for these things and already had figured out bits and pieces of this, or maybe even all of it. And in that case, I hope the recollections of me figuring this all out were at least interesting to you.
To those of you who still feel a bit betrayed, well ... look at it this way: If you had gotten what you'd wanted, it would have been sub-par. Sure, it would have had the DG kicking butt ... but it would have been weak. Trust me. The way things are is better. For the saga, and for the readers.
So, like I said, I regret nothing. Blade, Frost, Alchemy, Hain, Barnabas, and all the other characters they ran into ... all of them are important to me the same way Steel, Nova, Sabra, Sky Bolt, Hunter, and Dawn are. Or Jacob Rocke. Samantha. Alma. Hawke Decroux. Annalyne Neres. Salitore Amazd. Each time I write, I work hard to make the best story I can. And the Dusk Rogues are the product of that.
Right, last words for all of you who made it this far. Hmmm ... Of course!
The Dusk Guard will return in Hunter/Hunted
You can count on it.
Thanks for reading, guys. I hope you enjoyed this look at things.
Oh, and by the way ... there are still a few secrets you guys haven't discovered. Cheers! 
So, my question is, will you use material that has been brought forward in the last few seasons? Wither in passing or acknowledgement as you continue writing.
My example for that is Yakyakistan, which due to its isolationist stance would not feature in the story, but could be used as a road block for avenues of travel. I do not see why there territory can't be north of the Crystal Empire, but south of the Frozen Oceans proper. In fact, due to their isolationist stance, the Dusk Rogues could use this as an avenue of revenue, smuggling goods into and out of their borders.
Anyway I was in the camp of the DG showing up somewhere in the story. But I realized that their priorities and duties would have them leave Equestria's borders. At-least beyond its proper borders, since the Crystal Empire isn't part of Equestria but an ally with needs for reinforcements.
Blade and than her DR have the fluidity of morality and purpose to do things and go places the DG can't. Although the name might lead to problems for the princesses. People might make a connection and claim that they have rogue officers gallivanting in other countries. I wonder if Blade as picked up any new members.
My only true complaint is that the next book hasn't come out yet.
I loved both stories and how I could see some of the overlap in the roles. Just curious if you were planning on writing side stories for each of the Rogues like you did for the Guards.
As for complaints, I'm with Charedfirescale:
Another reason I expected the Dusk Guard to be in the sequel was due to the side stories. A few of them ended with the DG being mobilized and prepping for cold weather. The description of Beyond pointed to Blade being the focus of the story, and I didn't expect Steel and Co to take over, but I did think they'd show up in some way. Perhaps helping in the background or having the occasional chapter with them as the focus.
When Blade's group saw the aurora from the Crystal Empire's return, I figured that the DG went there so weren't likely to show up in the story. I still enjoyed it and Fav'd, but there's still that little disappointment due to expecting them. Oh well, just means I get to enjoy them more in the next story!
Just gonna say, I was totally on board with the idea of not every story in the Dusk Guard setting focusing on the namesake team. It's always a bit of a disappointment to me when you see a really neat, creative setting devised, with so much "space" for different stories and perspectives...and then you just get the same people, over and over, who somehow wind up being the crux of everything significant that happens there. Or only slightly better, you see characters with a lot of similarities, or with the same backgrounds in story after story. It's nice to see an author actually "fill out" a setting with different characters pursuing their own goals, instead.
I admit, with the way Dawn's side story ended, I was fully expecting Steel and Co. to come in and do some tail-kicking at some point during Blade's foray on the Ocean of Endless Ice, but honestly, I can't say that it was disappointing that they didn't. I was already pretty heavily invested in Blade's team, so much so that by the time they assaulted the Vault, I had practically forgotten all about the Guard.
I guess that's just a further testament to just how well you're doing your job.
And to keep the trend going, I agree with 4030309 in that my only complaint is that we have to wait for you to finish the next book!
I actually much preferred the Blade gang to Steel and Co, and think that choosing characters who originally are from, and have history with, the region was a much better choice than just dropping Steel and Co. into another nation for no practical reason.
The original story I feel was a bit strange with a kind of morality see-saw between 'Equestria as a utopian society' and having what is essentially a Special Forces team roaming around- the less utopian, more run-down and gritty setting in 'Beyond' matches better with the storyline and characters that you choose.
I am perfectly fine with the Dusk Guard not appearing, or appearing but as not the primary focus, in the third story, and would support whoever you want to add to the universe, even a third team or some-such.
4030309
I believe the official map puts the Yaks north-west of the Crystal Empire, and I always felt the Ocean of Endless Ice was north-east of it.
I figured from the blurb that BtB would not feature DG proper, for some of the same reasons you pointed out. And from storytelling perspective I fully support your decisions.
All that said, I have to admit that BtB, in my eyes, was very much a letdown. I just couldn't get into it. I felt almost nothing for the characters.
Blade, which is strange for me because I generally love amoral but honorable stereotype, was uninteresting, and since so much of the story centered on her it dragged the entire BtB down like a ten ton weight.
Hain had the potential to maybe be an interesting character but I felt he was massively underutilized, so he too ended up unengaging.
Frost - came out somewhat one and a half dimensional, so yeah - uninteresting again.
Barnabas - might have been interesting, but was not in the story long enough for me to form any kind of lasting impression. Even his death was telegraphed so far in advance that all the reaction it engendered in me was tick it off the list of expected clichés and move along.
Alchemy - now we are getting somewhere. Al was an interesting character with interesting backstory, engaging motivation, and alltogether great dynamic. And then you kinda jumped the shark with his death and rebirth. I am not saying it was not an interesting development/twist. I just say that I kinda felt it came out as rushed and lacked the proper buildup.
And finally best for last
Anubis - the one character that pulls the story from 2/10 into unashamed 4.6/10. He is everything I love about a villain and you performed him masterfully.
So to cap it off, I'll just say that I've reread Rise 3 times by now (and am probably gonna do it once more by autumn, unless book 3 starts before I begin), most sidestories at least twice. I don't see myself rereading BtB even once.
I reiterate that this is just my opinions and not meant as anything but an honest personal critique.
I admit that when I first started reading BtB, I was just waiting for the Dusk Guard to appear. As the story began reaching it's midpoint, however, I began to see how the Dusk Guard would have a very hard time fitting into the setting for some of the problems that you mentioned here. After I read Remembrance and Trust, I figured that the Dusk Guard must be in the Crystal Empire, which makes a lot more sense for them to get involved then if they interfered in the Ocean of Endless Ice.
I loved the the Dusk Rogues, though personally I felt that the Dusk Guard had more well developed characters then the Dusk Rogues. However, I think that may be influenced by the fact that the side stories have given us a more detailed, individual look at each of the Dusk Guard members' personality. Besides, Anubis more than made up for any of that.
Overall, I enjoyed BtB a little more than Rise, but I think the side stories bias my opinion a little bit in favor of liking the Dusk Guard more. I'm excited to read any of the next installments featuring either team. (It would be awesome if they team up in some future installment like Book 4 or 5)
Must...Find...SECRETS!
4030309
It depends on whether or not it works with the series as a whole. Yakyakistan, for example, I absolutely despised in the episode it appeared. The whole thing felt ham-handed, forced, and incredibly poorly written. Canon-wise for the DG, no such country exists—the Ocean stretches most of the length of the north past the Crystal Mountains and Equestria's border.
As far as other developments, most of that depends on the timing of the series. Book 3 takes place shortly before and during the season 3 opening, and then the series moves logically forward through the timeline from there, but definitely will be concluded before even getting close to the modern seasons.
I honestly was thinking of them as the Dusk Guard Bravo Squad by about halfway through. I wasn't sure until Blade started assembling her own team if she was going to do recon and call for the Dusk Guard once she knew enough. Once she started looking for ways to solve the problem with direct application of personnel, I knew what I was in for, but there were aspects of the team itself it took me time to grow to like.
4031433
The concept of having "modern seasons" is a strange one to me. Have I really been watching this show for over five years now?
Anyhow, thanks for the enlightening look behind the scenes at the development process of BtB.
I was one of the people who was totally convinced, even up to the final ending, that the DG were going to show up and help out at some point. I guess I just wanted more of those characters I loved so much! I had a tendency to ignore clues that they wouldn't be there in favor of hoping. The tone of BtB was much different than Rise, and I'd been hoping for more Rise, but once I adjusted and got into it I came to like the characters quite a bit. It was a really enjoyable story. I look forward to more adventures, and the increasing intertwining you mentioned. That should be a blast. It will be fun to watch the DG and the DR play off each other!
EDIT: If there's one thing I would have liked, it would have been some sort of really obvious warning that things were going to be so drastically different in the second book. I was completely taken by surprise, and it made the beginning of BtB really hard for me to get into. No, I don't know how this could have been done anymore than it already was attempted. I just thought I'd say.
Ohhhh, So excited! I'm so glad that we'll get to see more of Dusk Guard and Dusk Rogues! And I'm glad you wrote the stories separate like you did. Blade is my favorite character!