Jul
25th
2013
- Member Since 11th Jul, 2011
- offline last seen 3 hours ago
Aquaman
Prithee and well met, thou tempestuous witch of storms, to alight so delicately upon the jet streams of the cerulean sky. Welcome to Spirit Airlines.
Aquaman
Joined 11th Jul, 2011 ·
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I must say, looking through the unfiltered titles, "Only Bone Deep" was not my bet on which was not the mature story.
To be fair, F:E an't clop.
Still freaken funny, though.
Maybe Fimfic is in its dark and moody teenager phase?
I think it has to do with post pony season depression.
They don't have enough pony in their lives so they concentrate the amount of pony they can get.
In defense of Maiden's Day, it's more about the worldbuilding than it is about the clop. Maybe 2-3k of a 27k word fic. Well worth the read~
Solution: never, ever have "View Mature" checked.
i been away for a while, so i cant be blamed for this
1236036 It must age in dog years, then. That would make it, like, 18.
Uhhh... From your Unfiltered Box screenshot I see four Not-mature stories.
Beauty and Her Spike (E), Marvelous Rainbow (T), Only Bone Deep (T) and Harmony Theory (T).
So if I turned off the immature content filter, I would see in the feature box stories with titles like, "Sercw Me Sneselses Tiwlghit" (dang, that was hard to type)?
I'm reminded of why I have the filter on. I mean, I already knew why, but yeah.
1236036
It's been in that phase since its inception, hasn't it?
Also, incidentally, I tried Fallout: Equestria once. Didn't make it far. It was well-written, but I quit when I realized I'd been reading about twenty pages of the narrator explaining why she had a video game interface strapped to her foreleg.
1236207
All but Only Bone Deep are story updates. Those flash in and out so quickly that I don't count them.
1236305 That seems.. a bit... arbitrary...
Why are you surprised? This is hardly the first time the featurebox has been overwhelmed by porn.
1236207
The last three are recent updates, not features.
1236319 From where I stand anything in the Featured box is a Featured story.
1236329
Even though they are chosen via a different algorithm?
If you want to keep thinking that way, then just look at it as "only one story in the popular recent submissions right now is not mature."
Plus, most clop stories are oneshots.
And FO:E is the only one where the mature elements are part of a story rather than the point of the story.
1236031
It's full of addiction, sex, gore, rape, and zebras being dildo raped with the horn on a severed unicorn head. It is less explicit but it's content subject matter is worse than any of the other fics in the box right now, except maybe the one where Twi mind controls and rapes Dinky.
That said, at least it is a real story.
1236117
What if I don't mind the clop but dislike the wierdass worldbuilding?
1236329
Those are formerly featured stories that updated, not currently featured new stories. We are talking what's hot now, not what's being pinged by an update.
1236405
>and zebras being dildo raped with the horn on a severed unicorn head
Wait, are you shitting me right now? Does that actually happen?
Holy shit, I'm glad I quit reading that when I did. Dial it back, Kkat, damn.
1236433
It was in PP's vs posts too.
Porn. Porn everywhere
I am proud of you Internet. I am proud
1236118
Listen to him kids. Wear protection.
lol. I'll admit, I WTF'd at the Maiden's Day bullshit. But the Bone Deep story is a story I think would be worth a gander for now. I'll update you if ti's horribly stupid.
1236405>>1236433 Oh, come on. Let's not exaggerate. Only one zebra is raped with the horn on a severed unicorn head.
But that sort of stuff isn't what's most disturbing about Fallout: Equestria. What's most disturbing is the main characters being repeatedly put in situations where they have to kill innocent people in order to survive and save Equestria. It's practically a motif of the book. The inverse, situations where they get a chance to kill someone evil but can't for pragmatic reasons, also happen, though not as often. The book is a long series of horrible ethical dilemmas, and "there is no such thing as karma, and justice can lead to disaster" are major themes. It is an epic fantasy that aims to shake the reader's confidence rather than bolster it, and that's a rare & precious thing.
1238692
I wasn't complaining about the disturbing nature of the content. I was complaining about the gratuitous level of graphic content. When the MLP adaptation of a game is more gratuitously graphic than the original game, you are relying on darker and edgier content more than dark and thought provoking themes. Those moral dilemmas would not have had any less impact with a more restrained level of content.
If it was an original work, then there's more leeway, but with the crossover sources this has, the balance is out of whack.
1238743
1238692
DPV basically said what I would've said. There's a point at which excessively violent content negates an overarching theme like that. You could very easily write the exact same motif with almost no graphic violence whatsoever, so the fact that said violence is so very prevalent in the story is pretty telling of the author's true intent. It's part of the reason I've consistently argued against the notion that FO:E is a paragon of literature.
I'm nine chapters into a crossover with BioShock, a game that's at least equally as violent and dreary as Fallout, and thus far only three ponies in total have died during the story's events. You don't need a bodycount to make a point.
1238791>>1238743 Citation needed. If you can make similar points as emphatically with less violence, name a story that does so.
1239093
Redundant. One can skip every scene of explicitly graphic violence and every mention of rape and lose nothing of the story.
In addition, while the number of casualties is relevant from an ethical standpoint it is not from a moral one.
The presence of the inherent violence is not as problematic as the fact that it is all explicit rather than implicit.
1239120
"Redundant. One can skip every scene of explicitly graphic violence and every mention of rape and lose nothing of the story."
If that's so, point to another story that manages to do this without graphic violence as an existence proof.
>In addition, while the number of casualties is relevant from an ethical standpoint it is not from a moral one.
I have no idea what you mean by that.
>The presence of the inherent violence is not as problematic as the fact that it is all explicit rather than implicit.
I don't see a big distinction between explicit & implicit violence. Don't know what the word "inherent" means in that sentence.
1261087
What it means is that it is pointless to find "similar situations" in another fic because every fic is unique. What matters is whether a version of FoE that is Teen rated would be able to deliver the same impact, not whether there is a different Teen rated fic out there that can.
Inherent refers to the basic plot and events in the fic. I am not saying that the fic should remove the violent events and scenes within, just that it should be less graphically explicit within those scenes. I don't agree with censorship of an idea or event, but gratuitous graphic content, as well as excessively sadistic aspects are unnecessary to the plot.
There may be occurrences in the story where "toning down" the content would lessen the story, but I guarantee those are very few and very far between and very few scenes would alter the story if changed.
Case in point, the zebra Xenith. Having been a slave already implies cruelty and mistreatment. Being a mare already implies rape, and the statement of such is in line with inherent factors implicit and explicitly stated in FOE's wasteland and an explanation for her personality and quirks. There is absolutely, positively no factor that is enhanced in any way by having it explained to the reader that she was raped with the horn on a severed unicorn head, and none that is lost without that. It's like saying she was raped, but worse, but it's not really worse, it's just way more squick for the reader. There's no value in that.
1261284 I disagree on two points. First, if you're complaining out the violence in a story, that means it affected you, and that means it's a tossup whether to call it gratuitous, or to say that you have an artistic disagreement with the author. Maybe it made you sick to your stomach or gave you a disturbing image that you can't forget. Well, that's what art does. In the specific case of the unicorn head, I don't consider it gratuitous. It is painful and visceral and that is the point. If kkat erred in using it, it wasn't in picking that particular image, but in the entire setup of Red Eye's operations as inefficiently violent and as not being the kind of organization that someone with Red Eye's character could plausibly keep under control.
Second, explicit isn't more traumatic than implicit. My story "Twenty Minutes" is about a pony who gets raped all night every night by different zebras. What's worse, some of the zebras are being forced to do some of the raping. But the story doesn't mention rape at all. Everything is implicit. I didn't write it that way to spare the reader. I wrote it that way to hurt the reader more. Something terrible that is left implicit is a threat that the reader can feel looming over them, that keeps drawing their thoughts down some dark alley, where they see glimpses of horrible shadows and run away until it draws them in again. Describing something graphically relieves that pressure. Leaving something implicit can make it more traumatic.
Of interesting note, there are now no Mature stories in the box.
1265205
2nd point first: What? Are you agreeing with me? Not sure. We both agree that implicit or at least less graphic depictions can hit harder and are just as dark as graphically explicit ones.
So how does this contrast with my opinion that FOE would be just as effective if it was less graphically explicit?
Or are we using different definitions here?
1st point:
Actually I haven't read the story. Just the wiki. So I have no emotional investment in the events at all. I am stating what I objectively consider to be a universally applicable opinion. Taste and tolerance may vary.
No, that is what our emotions do based on stimuli. ANY stimuli. You talk about something sad, people will feed sad about it, regardless the medium that it is expressed through. The art is in the creation of settings, characters, and the writing of the plot. Not in the recycled anecdotal formulae of specific scenarios. More blood = more gross out (affected by tolerance). That is not "artistic" that is an equation.
No, her error was going darker and edgier than anywhere near advisable nor conducive to the story.
If you really think that nothing implicit or less graphic could achieve what "horn-raped with a severed head" could, then you need to ask if what it achieves is actually a boon to the story compared to what the story has potential for without it, or if it goes beyond the point of it's own effectiveness of imparting what matters.
And this is nowhere near the only instance, just one of the most obviously overboard ones.
1265330 No, her error was going darker and edgier than anywhere near advisable nor conducive to the story.
If you haven't read the story, you shouldn't make confident assertions like that. The only thing you can actually mean, given that you don't know the story, is that there is no circumstance imaginable in which a severed unicorn head rape can be a valid story element. IMHO that claim is too obviously wrong to argue with.
> More blood = more gross out (affected by tolerance). That is not "artistic" that is an equation.
Every story element is something drawn from real life that affects people emotionally. If you kill off a character, or you say the protagonist is an orphan and lives in a ghetto, or you say he has a hangnail--these all cause an emotional reaction, and introducing a hangnail is qualitatively no different than introducing a severed unicorn head. It is a thing with a predictable emotional valence that can be used well or poorly. The reaction it causes in you may be exactly the reaction the author intended. There's nothing inherently wrong with horrifying the reader.
Gratuitous use of character deaths and sexual attraction is far more common than gratuitous violence, and more off-putting to me because it breaks the story more.
>2nd point first: What? Are you agreeing with me? Not sure. We both agree that implicit or at least less graphic depictions can hit harder and are just as dark as graphically explicit ones. So how does this contrast with my opinion that FOE would be just as effective if it was less graphically explicit?
If it would be just as effective if it was less explicit, and if less-explicit depictions can hit harder than more implicit depictions, then there's no reason to wish it were less explicit. It would have the same effectiveness, and not be any kinder to the reader. Why do you prefer implicit violence to explicit violence?
1266181
Incorrect, I am stating that for the sake of Xenith's characterization, which I have looked into in depth, nothing relevant to her depiction or characterization would be affected in any way by not explicitly stating how she was raped in unusually cruel ways. I am saying that the specifics of the scenario do not warrant it and that is what makes it gratuitous. Just like overfilling a glass, overeating, or over inflating a tire, etc. there is an effect but it goes beyond what is appropriate, needed, or useful and into excessive or wasteful. I am not debating that there is an inherent impact in such things, I am stating that adding more grimdarkness than is actually needed for the effectiveness of the story is gratuitous by definition.
But if you feel that the "audience shock/thrill" effect is in fact a valid and valuable part of the story, then we have nothing to talk about because we view this in completely different philosophies.
I don't have a problem with violence. I have a brain that tells me when any element of a story, in any medium, is being overdone. I do not have a problem with a story gut-punching me or having reasonably terrible things happen to it's characters. That is personal preference and if that was my argument I would be saying "this is too dark for FiM", which is in fact the reason I do not read this story, but is not in any way what I am talking about here. I am not saying the story is to violent or the depictions are too dark, I am saying the story is excessive to the point that the content exists for it's own sake since is goes well beyond it's own effectiveness on the plot and characters. It is redundant in it's graphic gratuitousness. The story would not be changed if much of the explicit darkness was implicit or if some of the more severe scenes were toned down, or if some of the more horrific things were focused on less. It would still be the same story with the same effect, just better written and less reveling in how sick (in the original and slang senses) it is.
I don't know if you watch anime, but you can wiki or whatever.
It's like comparing The Guyver to Apocalypse Zero. They are very similar, but while the violence in one is simply not shied away from, but not excessively piled on, the violence in the other is ramped up as far as it will go and genuinely serves only to either shock or thrill the viewer (depending on taste) and does not enhance the story in any way, in fact making the story borderline satirical due to how overboard it is. It's not the violence that is the problem, it's how overboard the depictions go.
1266272 But if you feel that the "audience shock/thrill" effect is in fact a valid and valuable part of the story, then we have nothing to talk about because we view this in completely different philosophies.
It can be, in some stories, but not in FoE, so we agree on that.
I understand what you're saying. I guess I'm just not convinced the violence in FoE was too much. I also have a kind of knee-jerk reaction to people complaining about too much violence, when they rarely complain about any of the other ways authors cheat to manipulate our emotions. It's just one more way of manipulating people.
1266507
I don't have problems with emotional manipulation in media. As long as it is plot related, believable, and not blatantly overt. AKA "cheap".
To me what it comes down to is 2 things:
1: FOE is a Fallout adaptation to FiM crossover that is more graphic and violent and dark than Fallout. Meaning it is inherently an unbalanced as an adaptation/crossover in a meta sense.
2: The violence and darkness within is gratuitous, going well beyond what serves the "meat" of the story and into overt shock and thrill, existing for the audience rather than the story at that point.
As for personal emotional based opinions, the very fact that the events in your FOE fic, implied or otherwise, are plausible based on FOE's canon as a "serious" story concept, rather than laughable darkfic, trollfic, or fetish fuel means it's so grimdark as fuck that I find it impossible to care about in terms relative to the FiM fandom.
1266542 The events in that story are drawn from real life, not from the world of FoE. If it's grimdark as fuck, so is reality.
1266708
I did not mean plausible at all, I meant plausible within FOE's canon universe. Because there are some real things that shouldn't be applied to FiM settings and characters.
You know as well as I do that believability and realism are not tandem concepts, and in fiction, only one of them matter. Your suspension of disbelief being higher is not a valid argument. This is why I am using general concepts as points rather than subjectively stating "This is bullshit, who could take this seriously as ponyfic?"
1266985
1266708
I'm all for intelligent debate and all, but if you guys wouldn't mind shifting this one to someplace other than my blog, that'd be tight.
1267030
What a