Jul
27th
2020
"Interview of Aryanne" appreciation page · 9:41pm Jul 27th, 2020
Seeing as the story's comments got shut down, I made this page for people to comment on it. Have fun ^_^.
Schorl Tourmaline
Joined 10th Jan, 2014 ·
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Good story as well
.
Well, that certainly didn't take long. Anyway, like I said, it was a great story and a really fun interpretation of Aryanne.
Eyyyy that was pretty good. An insightful take, and an actually good story to boot.
Welp, censorship strikes again. A shame.
I applaud you, Schorl, the story was brilliant! Aryanne's monologue felt like a big fat Fourth Wall Break, so much so that it could be applied as a real argument in a debate, without altering even just a letter, and at the same time, it succeeded in staying within the framework of fiction! I dare say I've never read anything that screamed "real life" so obviously, so loudly, yet didn't feel forced!
Anyway, I'm blabbering now. Allow me to say that you've earned a Fave and a Follow, friend!
I found to story to be so poorly thought out it misses the point.
But Aryanne is a nice pony, so its an anti-racism story. *shrug*
5323907
That's fine. Not everyone has to like the story, and I'm not some amazing super writer.
And to everyone who has left more positive messages, thank you for your support and comments.
Seeing as every story, I think, that has that character in it has this done to them (good thing too), then there's no problem.
I honestly can't read any story with that, pony shaped infection, in it. I usually just look for the shitstorm in the comments, and whatever excuses the author can think of to justify the story's existence at all.
5323921
So I take it you didn't read the story? Shame that you allow presumptions guide your hand, because then maybe you might have known not to judge this particular book by its cover.
5323907
I would like to hear you go into what you think the point is.
Sorry your story which made it into the feature section got cock blocked by SJWs.
5323952
It made it into the featured section? I didn't realize that. Awesome.
5323956
Wait, it might’ve not been the featured. I found it under the popular now thing. Sorry if I got your hopes up. I don’t know if those two are the same thing or not, just that your story which is being censored made it into the popular page which I kinda funny to me. I can’t see the flare next to the ratings because they got disabled.
5323961
oh yeah, I noticed it there. And agreed, it is a shame people can't at least vote it up or down, but then again we can't have people supporting something like a nazi pony. Not when their are child molestation and rape fictions that need those upvotes instead (nothing against either of those, but shows a bit of hypocrisy).
I'm sorry, but this felt ham-fisted in the worst way. Like, I get the intention, and it's a good one, but the story's just... it's not great.
The horse puns are hilariously on the nose, but because the story's not an out and out comedy they become eye-rolling very quickly. But then you don't really hold them all the way through. There's Germaney, an obvious choice (and one I've used myself), but then there's just British? I hadn't realized the British Empire managed to stretch between dimensions.
And a zebra named Daryl Hayvis? On the nose at best, questionable choice at worst.
But what really kills it for me is the world-building... or lack thereof. The mish-mash of the history of Equestria with our own has less than zero thought or effort put into it. So Equestria had a WW2? With their own Hitler?
Did Neighpan get involved as well, perhaps launching a surprise attack on the naval forces at Haywaii? Did Equestria convince Neighpan to surrender by splitting the atom and dropping a pair of nukes on them? If so, then why doesn't Equestria still have nuclear power? Or were the bombs magical, and Celestia just committed mass-murder with her own hooves for the greater good?
But that was World War 2, so that also implies that Equestria had a World War 1. Was it kicked off by the assassination of Arch Duke Ferdineigh? Was an entire generation of ponies traumatized by the horrors of trench warfare? Who won the battle of Gallopoli?
Just... I get it. You've got something to say. Your intentions are, I imagine, pure. But if you play fast and loose with world-building like that, it takes some folks out of the story entirely.
This whole thing didn't feel as thought out like your other stuff. It felt like you had an idea for an Ayranne interpretation and you wrote this as fast as possible to capitalize on the controversy.
5323946
I think the point was "the zebra" and "the pure white mare"
5324039
Good take. I pretty much agree with all of that.
5324039
Ham fisted? Oh absolutely, but in the worst way? I'm not so sure. I might have a bit of bias, being the writer, but let be see if I can't address your issues here. Please realize I'm not trying to belittle your opinion, just give my own approach to what you had to say.
Are the horse puns out of place for something like this? Oh certainly. The idea of trying to mix cartoon horses with something like a political statement, which this story could perceived as, is in itself a bit cringey.... which is exactly what people are doing when they inject their own personal beliefs into a gag character like Aryanne. The puns exists in this story because it's part of the point, that trying to mix these things in general is silly and, as you put it, incredibly ham fisted. On another approach, it makes the story silly because it SHOULD be silly. I'm not sure if you've ever watch the Youtube series "Rainbow Dash Presents", but the person who made those videos once did a lets play of a fan made "Pony Remake" of Final Fantasy 6, and at one point talked about how because the game was pretty much unedited save for some dialog cuase that was the easiest thing to change, that it really didn't feel like how a pony parody of a game should have. He explained that he wished that there was just something completely stupid off to the side like a gorilla in a Top Hat to show that this was all silly and off set the originally serious tone of the game, because just making all the characters in the game popular MLP characters is a silly premise to begin with. The puns are my gorilla. (BTW, I did make a "Britain" pun, because I called it "Bitain", but I could see that as being easily missed).
Daryl Hayvis is a play on real life black activist Daryl Davis, who likewise confronts members of the KKK in manners similar to the zebra in this story. Is it a lazy pun? Absolutely. Does it get the point across to anyone who knows who Daryl Davis is? Absolutely. Then again, for "lore" reasons (like that matters in a story like this) if a zebra was born in Equestria, I see no reason they couldn't have an "equestrianized name", especially since in the show we see that ponies can change their name on a whim if they want (Ms. Cake, AKA Cupcake, once being named Saffron Swirls). Thinking that they have to have a name like "Zebronica" or "Shachala" actually seems a bit racist, if one can be racist to a fictional race, which you can't be.
World building, there is none, and there was no intention to be any. The story was about how some people for some reason see Aryanne as a real Nazi, and for that to be the Nazis had to exist, and since I'm not going to write some epic narrative on how ponies went through the great Apple War, I'm just going to use real world examples, since the Nazis have not in any form existed in MLP. Does it conflict, yes, but as I said before the idea of people placing politics into MLP and assuming that gag OC pony actually supports the ideology of Nazis also conflicts.
In the end, this story is the way it is because of your last point, that it is something I typed up in a week to toss my hat in on the subject of the "Controversy", the silly, silly controversy that only came up because some group of silly, silly people suddenly thought that Aryanne was offensive and wanted to raise a stink about her, mostly because she's "popular". No one should put that much thought into her, or any other silly fan OC like her, and the fact that I had to put even this much thought into a story to try and tell people "You realize this is a cartoon horse, and not an actual nazi, right?" is in itself ridiculous. No one should have to tell someone else that something made to be joke... is supposed to be joke, and the very idea that Aryanne, if real, might have to sit down and explain that her character is just that, a character, would be hilarious if it weren't so asinine.
All that aside, thank you for at least reading the story and having an informed opinion about it, which is more than I can say for people who would just downvote it without giving it so much as a glance, and sharing your (as I hope I expressed) very valid opinion.
i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/029/960/quality.jpg
Loved the story especially Aryanne’s line about getting rid of all the offensive things in the world because that is the truth
Your remarks in the Author's Note of the story are all valid.
I'm not sure what is better - the Author's Note or the actual story
We allow non-consensual rape stories of fillies on this site.
Yet, your story of racial equality was nuked of comments because it was offensive ?
A decently written story too, I might add.
I honestly did not know what to expect when I started reading.
Again, your points are all valid.
5324147
TVtropes has a trope called "Some anvils need to be dropped." I think that this story falls under that category.
I think that should be "can't," there.
That said, this was a fun little story with an important message. Kudos to you for writing it.
I find being offended offensive, and as a bisexual am part of a protected class, pay me money and tell me what a brave little soul I am
I also find your lack of being offended on my behalf and failure in browbeating your no doubt racist and sexist parents, friends, random people you know from your various doings about town doubly so and demand you pay for my rampant college debauchry and learning underwater basket weaving
So, just finished reading this. I have to ask...Given the frequent terror attacks from the Boogaloos, Atomwaffen, etc. how do you know that Aryanne is a joke and not actual Nazi propaganda? Could you explain the jokes, such as "I hate ziggers."
5327138
OK, sure. Well the first thing you can do to see that she was intended as a joke is look at her "Know Your Meme" page and see the words of the original creator, a Mr. "Ass Stalker".
Link: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/aryanne
And Quote: I used to draw on Flockmod before. I was still a noob. I drew Rainbow Dash and Applejack often that time. Because of my poor style, people and I cannot recognize what pony I drew. So it combine both of them and then my friend made a joke and added a "nazi" symbol on it
Secondly, the very fact that your example is the use of the word "Zigger", a parody of the real word that disparages black people, and not the real word, says to me that you are just slightly tone-deaf on the joke. If it were REALLY supposed to be an offensive statement against blacks, people would just use the real word, but instead they use a word that disparages a fictional race of "african ponies", which just happens to so easily fit the theme of the joke (Aryanne's Nazi politics believing in silly ideologies such as a "Master Race" and "White Supremacy"), by tilting the N sideways. Honestly, if you're going to make an MLP joke about racism (A.K.A. showing how stupid racists really are), you couldn't ask for things to line up any better.
And I'm not saying that some people haven't tried to take this joke and use it as an actual racist symbol, but that just shows that those people missed the point of the character just as much as the people who get offended by Aryanne in the first place. They both see her as something that is offensive towards certain people (Minorities and jews), lumping these two opposing factions of people into the same category of "completely missing the joke". Actually, I could even see some of the people who use her to be offensive only doing so because some people got offended by Aryanne. If everyone saw her as a joke, then she would simply be a joke, and you'd take away any power people had when trying to use her offensively.
Let me ask you this, if the nazis, THE REAL NAZIS, not these watered down versions who assume anyone who is white is better than anyone who isn't (I know it's more nuanced than that, but I don't want to list every sub division of white people who "don't count" to the so called Neo Nazis), would actually appreciate Aryanne and her use as a representation of their ideals? No, not at all, because the nazis had no concept of humor when it came to their faction and ideals, and being depicted as a cartoon horse would only piss them off. If that's the case, then why are people so offended at something that would have only offended this faction of people they rightfully hate? Answer: They shouldn't, and they just hate Aryanne because she "represents a nazi" and don't understand that she is a silly character that doesn't glorify them, just acknowledges that they existed and mocks them with her own existence.
5327154
That is evidence of it being a joke, at least at first.
So why do you believe that, and what would be different if you were wrong? Even accepting that people just don't say the quiet parts out loud, it seems to me that there are a number of utilitarian reasons to dog whistle, not the least of which is to get you to defend them by proxy. It also seems to have some prior probability. source: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Atwater#%22Southern_strategy%22>
So which is it? Is this a joke that no one could mistake as racist, or is it a joke that's been co-opted by racists? I agree that if everyone saw her as a parody, she would no longer be a racist symbol. But that's reclaiming or re-appropriation. It implies someone to reclaim the word from.
I don't think there's any dispute that *if* that is the case, then Aryanne is devastating Antifa propaganda. What is different in the world if that's the case? Nazis won't adopt Aryanne, ofc. But that's what's in dispute. They also won't adopt other things they are similarly mirthless about. What do Nazis hate more than ponies? In rough order it's Jews, Russians, communists, Ernst Rohm, socialists, gypsies, and then queers.
Some of these things are not like the others.
Old school WWII era Nazis have a hell of a track record of surface level embracing of people they later put long knives into.
5327366
OK, I wrote some of that when I was a bit tired, I meant to put a "would" where that if was, and then went back to what I originally wanted to write after my tangent, but you got the point. The Nazis would have never accepted Aryanne as a symbol for them.
As for clarification of what she is, she is a joke that should only be seen as a joke, that some people have percieved as some sort of offensive icon to the point that other people caught on to and started using her as a tool to annoy them/support their own stupid ideals. Again, if no one saw her as an actual nazi symbol (which she isn't), then there would be no issue here. No need to "reclaim" anything, cause she was never that thing to begin with. If I take a bar of Hersey's Milk Chocolate and start saying that it is a symbol of white supremacy, does that make it so? No, of course not, and that's stupid, especially if people actually start believing that white chocolate somehow actually does support white supremacy.
I hope that addresses your issues.
5327410
I think we both agree that she should be a joke. I'm just not convinced she is a joke. You keep saying that Nazis would never accept her. What would change your mind? As far as I can tell, it's exactly what Nazis would do.
Similarly the chocolate thing doesn't match my understanding of history. White chocolate is neutral, a pun at most. The swastika would be at least as offensive to historical Nazis as brightly colored ponies.
5328019
.
"Chocolate is natural" Apparently you haven't been paying attention to recent events, because even viruses can be racist these days
Why does my mind need to be changed? I have an opinion, you have an opinion, if they don't match it's not the end of the world. When it comes down to it, in my opinion, the people who see see Aryanne as legitimate nazi propaganda are those who get butt hurt over their coffee having too much cream in it, and those who want to exploit those people's outrage. If that's all it is, then it is as I say and Aryanne is just a joke that a minority of people can't handle, like that Pepe meme, which I don't even know the context of that one and I can tell you that there is nothing racist about it.
5328076
Well, personally I want my mind changed because I value believing things that are true and not believing things that are false. More importantly, I value being alive. Saying that it's "just my opinion man" is fine if it's something that only affects yourself. If I believe that driving drunk is safer than driving sober, or that mask wearing poisons you, or that Nazis should be free to say "wink wink nudge nudge wouldn't it be awful if someone shot up that synagogue" then being wrong in either direction kills people.
If that's not motivation for you, then that's fair. But not having a school/church/etc. I attend shot up again is motivation for me.
5328313
Well I will have to disagree with you on the point of people being able to say what they want, because I support free speech, even if the speech is something I would whole heatedly disagree with. Thing is, when people say something really, REALLY stupid, such as racist remarks (real ones, not something that people just state is racist because they don't understand "nuance" is), then they usually are called out on it, because no one in the vast majority would agree with such. This isolates such behavior, and makes it so such people have to remain in their remotely small groups where their unpopular opinions don't really hurt people. Sure, one might go nuts and cause some destruction because of their beliefs, but that's true of literally anyone alive. One does not need to be racist to be an unstable individual, nor does being racist make one unstable. It is simply undesirable behavior that will eventually die out so long as people treat it as undesirable, and until then, if all they can do is talk, then let them talk.
5328339
Is this the free speech absolutism argument? Is it okay to shout fire in a crowded theater, show kids porn and ISIS recruitment videos, tell a mobster that someone needs to sleep with the fishies? If not, then what's the difference other than the color of the flag and how much you personally feel it's effective?
5328399
I think that I just explained this, but ok, I'll try again. You are free to say whatever you like, but in the end if you say something stupid you will suffer the consequences for it. Yell fire in a theater, that is inciting a panic. The speech was free, the chaos you incited and the damage done is not, because if for some reason yelling fire doesn't cause a panic, no one cares, no laws were broken.
Making an ISIS recruitment video is an act of terrorism/treason. The speech is free, but the actions that lead to potential loss of life and damage to city property is not. You can say things all day about hating America, a right people are using very frequently these days (just to prove that you can), but the moment it becomes a threat on the nation's soil is the issue.
If you are talking to a mobster (for some reason) then you are free to do so, but the issue is that in your scenario you are involving yourself in conspiracy and murder. You can talk about wanting to kill someone all day, but it's when you actually become a danger to others that's the issue.
Not exactly sure how showing a child porn is covered by "freedom of speech", but maybe that's something you have experience with. I mean I was pretty early when I discovered it myself, with no adult supervising me on the matter. Anywho, seeing that "Sex talks" are a staple of parenting at a certain age, you can talk to a child (specifically your own) about sex all you want, it's when you try to coerce them into sexual activities that is the issue.
I think I already talked about a little thing called "nuance", and everything you tried to use as an example had other circumstances outside of the actual speech that made any of it an issue. Seems like your strawman needs a little work, but that aside, is there any point to all this, or are you just yammering incisively because you don't like that I already proved my point that Aryanne is just a gag character that some people take way to seriously, such as yourself apparently.
5328708
No, I think I see your point. ISIS propaganda is not allowed because ISIS are criminal terrorists, and that's bad. Nazi propaganda is allowed, either because you don't believe in Nazis or because Nazi terrorism isn't criminal and is good. Either way, in your mind no laws were broken and no action was taken.
So in this case, I agree with you on everything other than reality. Since you have no desire to update that on facts and evidence and have none to present me to change my mind there's not much more to discuss. Thank you for your time.
5328937
I guess as a final word from me, I have to say that I believe the Nazis existed and in no way were good, and if any real ones do still exist they are old men with one foot in the grave (world war 2 happened in 1939, getting close to 100 years). The "nazis" today, aka Neo Nazis, are not Nazis. They are just your typical racist individuals who co-opted the name cause they believe the name "Nazi" has some form of power. Most, if not all, of them would have been seen as repulsive by real nazis.
Of course Nazi propaganda isn't good, and I would thank you to not try putting words in my mouth
. But seeing as propaganda is defined as "information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view", I don't see how Aryanne, especially the Aryanne from my story, fits that. She is just a character, nothing more, and as we have proven, she doesn't even promote nazism. She's a joke, and if you are going to talk about nazis in this day and age, it might as well be in a manner that mock and ridicules them for the terrible ideals they had and deeds they did.
And again, I have no need to change your mind. Honestly, that would be far too much effort to me and I would get nothing out of it, because I really don't care what you think, random person on the internet. If you want to believe cartoon horse is offensive, then I guess it's offensive... to you. Meanwhile, we over here in sanity land will just go about our days, not being affected by something that is, very clearly, a joke.
I agree that Nazism is bad. I don't agree that Neo-Nazis are not Nazis in any meaningful way. As for your proof, I must have missed that. I haven't seen any argumentation or evidence outside blank assertion. Nor would it have made sense for you to provide one if changing my mind or the minds of other random people on the internet wasn't worthwhile to you.
edit: Oh, and I'm not offended by Aryanne anymore than I am offended by malaria or cancer or ISIS beheading people on camera. These are all just harmful things that need to be cured and prevented.
5329266
Soooo.... you're super offended by it? Kinda giving mixed signals dude.
5329291
I don't really get that vibe from them, but I also don't really see why that would matter.
5329309
It matters because they made it matter. The entire point of this exercise was about how things only mean something to someone because they make it mean things. If a drawing of a pony is perceived as something that "needs to be cured and prevented" (as ludicrous and impossible as that really is when it comes to a drawing of a horse), then he must REALLY care about it, and people don't get that much care about this sort of stuff unless it offends them.
5329353
That wasn't what I meant. What I said was: I don't see why it would matter in the context of this conversation whether anyone here is offended or not. After your reply, I still don't see why it would matter.
5329359
It's ok Tarv, I get that there is a lot that you don't understand. I won't hold it against you.
5329363
Yeah, I admit that. I'm kinda stupid, there's lots of stuff I don't get. That's why I don't stop asking for explanations. But it's okay. If you can't give me an explanation I can understand, I guess I have to live with that.
5329291
No, not offended at all. Lets use a different example. Say a drunk driver hits your kid and sends the kid to the hospital. Are you triggered? There's a lot of emotions I might feel there- sorrow, anger, vengeance. I might be coldly out for justice or boiling with a thirst for blood. I wouldn't call any of those emotions offended or triggered.
Similarly, if there's an outbreak of malaria and we have to spray down the mosquitoes in an area, I wouldn't call that being insulted by the mosquitoes. Some might hate mosquitoes and lay into it with an unholy fervor. Some might even like mosquitoes and think they're important parts of the ecosystem. At the end of the day, though, nothing about the mosquito or anyone's feelings about it matters. The only thing that matters is saving lives, and the only way to save lives is to squash the vector until you can contain the infection.
5329393
So your example is "Nature be damned, let's kill off something entirely because it offends us". I won't go into devastating your analogy by explaining the reasons why that would that would be a stupid idea if it played out IRL, sure you could look up the terrible consequence of that insect genocide yourself. This is, however, a great analogy of how people shouldn't attempt to "eliminate" something just because they don't understand it, because the repercussions of doing so could be far more harmful than just taking the "live and let live" approach. Thank you for providing such a great example to my argument.
5329430
See, there's that offends word again. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. And I was talking about local mosquito control measures, not global. But if you can rigorously tear apart the argument for either then there's a Nobel prize in it for you. Here's a cited article that goes over the scientific consensus for the latter, if you want to learn more.
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2018/09/mosquito-target-malaria/570937/
5329622
You know, it's funny, I thought you were done with this conversation 3 posts ago, but I suppose people need to defend their offense (and yes, I'm going to keep calling it that, because you have not proven it's anything else by saying "OMG, I'm not offended, gosh"). Anywho, I don't even get what you're saying anymore. We need to deal with "local" pests, but not on a global scale? So to equate that to your overall argument, we only need to deal with racism and facism locally, and not on a global scale, like in the places of the world that still have slavery? I don't see how that gets rid of the problem at all, and in fact only sounds like ignoring the problem "with extra steps". Then again, I suppose the places that have those problems are "Over there", and over there needs to take care of itself.
Hate to say it, Random guy on the internet, but I'm beginning to think you're full of crap.
5329643
In this case, it's not pests but vectors for the disease. So yes, we should ban Aryanne (at least when she's being used as Fascist propaganda) and the people who use her as Fascist propaganda the same as we would ban the equivalent from ISIS. We shouldn't ban all art. And we shouldn't ban subversive art like JOJO Rabbit or The Producers, even if that someday reclaims Aryanne.
I can't weigh in on all art in all fandoms, but I can do my best to fight Fascism in the fandom that I'm in.
5329729
She doesn't need "Reclaimed" and honestly that's such a stupid term. The problem you have is that you don't seem to understand what banning something implies. You assume that people can differentiate a "good" use of something offensive compared to a "bad" use of something offensive, when the removal of the comments section of my own story indicates that is not the case. Yet, when someone asks you "when will it end" you're only response is "somewhere", like that means something.
But ok, you know what, in this case I'm willing to put your idea to the test. I don't usually do this, because I absolutely believe that everyone has the right to say whatever stupid thing they want, but let's do a little social experiment. Let's implement your policies and see what happens when we remove the ability to express yourself however you want, just because I "don't like the things you have to say".