Sep
2nd
2017
Points of Canon: S7x17 - To Change a Changeling · 5:23pm Sep 2nd, 2017
Watch them mess up the changeling canon yet again.
- While this episode features little to none of the usual chronology markers, it has several solid hard locks – it has to follow Triple Threat where Thorax first complains about Pharynx, and it has to follow All Bottled Up where Trixie learned to teleport, not to mention A Celestial Advice. Even though she doesn’t actually teleport in this episode, Trixie at least attempts to.
- Since there’s no reason to believe that newtype changelings have any earth pony abilities, a substantial time had to have passed since the events of To Where and Back Again – the land surrounding the changeling hive has recovered enough to produce at least bushes.
- We don’t know how many teleports did it take Starlight to get to the changeling hive exactly. The comment regarding “12 steps” may or may not mean that the actual number of jumps was 12. However, we know that Starlight can teleport, together with Trixie, often enough and far enough to actually make this a preferable mode of transportation.
- Thorax has been sending letters. Starlight never elaborates just how did he do that.
- Starlight connects the regrowth of plant life around the hive with the change in changeling diet. There are problems with this supposition: If there was love in plants, changelings could have subsisted on plants indefinitely. I’m pretty sure she’s just mistaken.
- New changeling diet does include plants. Otherwise, the dread moleworf (sp?) eating them would not be an issue.
- I do wonder what exactly was Pharynx disguised as, because he just appears next to Trixie. Whatever he was disguised as never entered the frame.
- You’d think Starlight would learn at least one target-seeking spell for anti-air after that duel with Twilight, but evidently not.
- So Thorax’s throne is right out there in the open? Doesn’t it rain around here?… Or do changelings have any pegasi powers to prevent unplanned rainfall?
- Prior to this episode, other renegades beside Pharynx existed. Actually, seeing how even the little Pharynx is so different from other changelings, he’s probably a mutant just like Thorax himself.
- “Pharynx is my elder broodmate.” I.e. changeling eggs were laid in relatively small batches, since otherwise, every changeling would count as Thorax’s brother.
- I don’t really get the point of Pharynx chewing the scenery in a literal fashion. If he wants to change the decor, as he says, he could find a more efficient method to do it.
- “The only thing we did before was hunt and patrol.” Hunt for what exactly? And how far – and for how long – did the changelings have to hunt to maintain their numbers, anyway?
- “A once-a-week potluck lunch” If anyone can identify the stuff the changelings are bringing to the table, please do.
- “What enemies?!” Pretty much anything that isn’t as soft-hearted as ponies?…
- “Pharynx used to be head of patrol.” Chrysalis-era changelings had such a post.
- Notice that Thorax refers to the changelings as “everyone,” not, say, “everyling” or any other species-qualified term.
- “I’m thinking good pony, bad pony.” Good cop / bad cop tactic is known to Trixie.
- “Do you know who Twilight Sparkle is?” “No.” Pharynx not knowing this defines the limits of briefing the changelings for their jobs: Need to know for everything. It also defines the limits on the weak hive mind. Yes, it still has to exist – see Starlight’s speech later on.
- “And I used to be a dictator who ran a village with an iron hoof.” See The Other Sith Theory – Starlight didn’t quite do that, did she?
- Newtype changelings have deep-seated identity problems over what their natural state is supposed to be. Down to needing a rather pathetic imitation of a support group.
- “He teaches little changelings to growl and hiss.” So those exist. Where did they come from?
- “My soup’s too hot!” Soup. Also, this particular changeling is quite stupid, isn’t he?
- Pharynx has been listening to the resulting scene disguised as a stone. I expect that’s the primary way the changelings gather information, because, as we know, they can’t act their way out of a paper bag.
- “When I was little, every young changeling wanted to be like that.” The subsequent flashback shows changelings transformed into a “little grub” baby state from the previously seen larval state. Do you want us to believe changelings never ate solid food before the newtype transformation, Thorax? Really? Even with the way they dismember their pony dolls? Never mind that flashbacks don’t seem to be particularly reliable this season… Pharynx later corroborates this story, but says “when we were young” rather than “little” instead. Little-baby-changeling form still needs to actually exist, because Pharynx “teaches them to hiss,” but there’s no guarantee they look like babies, or, for that matter, look like babies for long.
- Pharynx transforms into a winged spider that has to weigh multiple metric tons, increasing his mass about ten times.
- “I switched the trail of plants to lure the moleworf here.” These have to be some rather special plants, because otherwise they would be entirely uninteresting among all the other surrounding greenery.
- …And Spike expected this kindergarten to go to war against dragons?…
- “It’s your choice. But remember, when you didn’t have a choice, when you were forced to obey Chrysalis.” If nothing else, I’m pretty sure Starlight believes in some for of hive mind theory – otherwise, there would have existed a choice to obey or not to obey Chrysalis.
- “If he wasn’t my brother, I don’t think I’d be here.” So how many brothers does Thorax have? You would expect at least ten, seeing the flashback of how he was born, so what happened to the rest?
- So why does Pharynx detransform from his spider form?
- Pharynx consistently refers to the group of changelings as “swarm.” Notice that in Triple Threat it was “pack.” Unfortunately nobody else refers to all the changelings in the episode, so we can’t say if this is a Pharynx-specific word usage or not.
- Just for reference, compare the number of changelings seen in the hive – tens – to the swarm that attacked Canterlot – hundreds, if not thousands, just on screen.
- Trixie tosses a stone that should weigh somewhere between 300 and 500kg.
- Nobody comments on why Pharynx’s newtype form is so different from regular changelings and so similar to Thorax.
That was far more childish than it should have been. And my newtype changeling explanation needs a few minor revisions.
Thankfully, nothing particularly drastic.
Post1: ownnotes
❧s7e17 to change a changeling
Starlight teleport: far, but not that good at targeting.
❧Pharynx = red-maned purple-bodied changeling [I missed its transform flame = green later]
❧
a sack, somehow preventing teleports? (…not perfectly implausible; silk does insulate magic. But htis really doesn't look it.)no, she's intentionally, nvmthat hive matches the new aesthetic (it's hideous)
♪"convinced all of them to change but one" they wasted a perfectly good plot.
❧I agree with Pharynx, hive/lings looked better before.
♪"Now that we're not feeding on love, the plants grew back" --somehow I doubt it, unless they were in fact feeding on nonlove (magic itself? Friendship is magic, I always headcanon'd them technically being thaumovores.) I suspect some is Chrysalis defensive and hiding measure defoliating the surroundings, and the anti-magic throne most likely had something to do with it…
❧Changelings!:
broods are not large enough that siblinghood ignoredcovered…parenthood glossed over.❧Even changelings had sibling torment.
❧theater, [biped-]swing dance, potluck (etymology? did they get it from bison?)
♪"we're peaceful and there's no need to patrol" uh thorax you missed a memo of national leadership [the episode's lesson] (more on this later)
❧Trixie seems to have lost a few developments of ego-curbing.
❧"Feelings forum"
changelings have spectacles? Or maybe they took them from back when marauding/replacing.
♪"living a lie" is now a concern for a changeling
Some have tri-gems, some have single? or is that the angle?
❧nuchangeling uses hoof to carry/lift soup rather than horn-levitation..huh.
Forum moderator is incapable of commanding their attention even with a gong. Discipline is just plain out the window.
❧young changelings had flimsy cloth dummies to beat up
❧Pharynx actually variant color then, odd.
changelings can transform to big combat forms before, too
❧what is that winged arachnid monster type then?
❧…Starlight fucked up even without his leaving. Should really lead both to a remote…oh, that wouldn't earn hive loyalty, nvm.
❧Changelings not doing the meteor-thing nor offense beams, though
[icon]power[/icon]maul-werf is magic-resistant to Starlight's cutterbeams, so it makes sense they don't bother with offense shots.
❧(pharynx changes) nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
❧black-and-red +purple wingcasing nuchangeling with a full rack like Thorax ticks the OC box
Okay, this episode just underscores again and again that Thorax had the stars fucking align for him to become
KingLeader. He won the transformation lottery (non-uniquely as we now see), the plants started growing back almost instantly (and love-sharing brokke thermodynamics for the nuchangelings) so he didn't have a famine to deal with breaking his rule, Chrysalis broke most rebellious spirit so nobody would rebel, he had a strong left-hand man in Pharynx whether he knew it or not to prevent any that did from actually rebelling (as they either aligned with Pharynx in rebellion and Pharynx didn't actually want to hurt Thorax, or Pharynx dealt with them otherwise…), and no large threats up until now noticed the huge change and took advantage.Of course, the question is, who's lining up the stars this time?
Maybe there's a little bit of love in them, enough that the changelings destroy everything for that tiny little bit they get from foliage. Like what happens in famines where even treebark gets stripped. Alternatively, Chrysalis's throne was toxic to plant life. Note that the old wasteland extended as far as the effect of the throne.
Taking out his frustrations on inanimate objects instead of the other changelings? If I were subjected to 'feeling forums' on a regular basis, you'd find me kicking holes in walls, too.
Also, I suspect that the big monster forms that Thorax and Pharynx can take require massive amounts of energy, and can't be sustained for very long. Probably pseudo-mass rather than real.
I dunno, the Discord-imitator was pretty good; Chrysalis fools everyone but Twilight [whom the narrative follows], they can do a perfect Mirror Gag with someone they've never practiced on before…
I dunno what kindergarten you attended, but little kids can be vicious (rather unlike these).
She's a showpony, of course she does.
Eh, dictatorial power is a thing. Given that she managed to have three-plus nines of obedience, she had to do a fair chunk of things right.
Maneuverability, maintenance cost, or simple disruption of concentration…though the last raises "how did changelings never get caught and be wholly unknown pre-wedding".
4655896
I think the most obvious explanation is that most plant species on the planet are in one way or another dependent on ambient magic. The throne simply sucked everything away, including that.
Notice I am not wondering about the holes in the walls, but rather why isn’t he using shears. :)
also, Pharynx gets black paint in sufficient quantities to repeatedly coat other 'lings in it. I wonder how.
4655898
Chrysalis is far more capable than any regular changeling for obvious reasons. And mirror gag is a pretty specialized skill: Imitate what you see right now quickly enough.
Compare to the Mane 6 impersonators, who were really obvious.
Given that the exchange was "We still have to walk."/"It's like twelve steps away," I'm pretty sure that referred to how much distance was left.
Maulwurf (or Maulwürfe) is literally just German for mole.
Given the rate of vegetation recovery in what had been a wasteland, I think they've at least been able to arrange greater rainfall. Unless they were somehow sucking love out of clouds...
Derpibooru has a screenshot of the potluck lunch. We have a beetle prepared like a roast pig, several instances of either seeds or eggs, grubs prepared in several different ways, and sauces that I'm guessing are derived from nectar and/or insect vital fluids.
How much do you think he knew about their combat readiness? Moreover, how much do you think that knowledge would matter given his state of mind at the time?
That sure was an episode.
I have no idea how Thorax's rule has lasted this long, or why the changelings have not been conquered already.
Though notably, a different kind of mutant. Thorax's mutation apparently affected his ability to connect with the hivemind, but Pharynx is just differently coloured. Unless there's some other quality to him we're not seeing? We know that Chrysalis assigned him a position of high importance, so maybe his mutation is something actually beneficial by old changeling standards.
In Paul MacAuley's book, The Quiet War, Greater Brazil gifts a biome to a city-state on the Jovian moon of Callisto, as a show of friendship between the two nations. Would it not be possible for Equestria to gift plant life to the new changeling hive as a sign of friendship?
Thank the Fates for small favors!
Special couriers, presumably. I imagine they'll have things like telegraph lines once they modernize enough. They clearly have a ways to go, since they've only just figured out what a Defense Minister is, (that is, if Pharynx had a title under the new regime) and don't seem to be using money yet.
As far as he knew, they were still potentially ferocious. Notice how Starlight and Trixie are initially unaware that the changelings have actually overcompensated in the other direction.
Sheer force of habit, as often happens in real life. An example is the Alexandrov Ensemble, which some people still call the Red Army Choir years after the Red Army was decommissioned.
Come to think of it, there are other comparisons to the Soviet Union. The 'lings are going through a tough adjustment period, just as former Soviets did after the Iron Curtain came down.
Killed in the invasion of Canterlot? Lost during combat patrols? Eaten by Chryssie? Take your pick!
Either that, or she means "forced at horn-point." I have a saying: "All political power proceeds from the point of a horn."
On that note, how about a little music?
You can't mess something that doesn't exist. At this point, I'm pretty sure that there is no lore or stable canon in MLP. Any writer in general write things that he or she want.
4656130
"Everybuggy" and "anybuggy" are great, though.
Standard disclaimer: flackbacks are fiction, and the depiction we see is generally in the mind of the listener.
My theory is that a 'swam' refers specifically to a group of changelings that go out to attack, defend, hunt etc. It isn't what they call their society as a whole (the pack), or a fixed settlement (a hive).
4656123
It would be, but wouldn’t then Starlight refer to this as the origin of the vegetation, rather than cite “not sucking love” as the reason?
4656156
Or Derpy. Just Derpy.
See also all the reasoning evolved when discussing To Where And Back Again: Unless you assume a weak hive mind theory, changeling newtype transformation requires just about everyone to be blindingly stupid.
4656194
See the topmost post in my blog index. :) There is an emergent property we can call canon, even though individual authors are of course unaware of it.
Something occurred to me watching the episode, but I haven't gone back to check it. It seemed like all the male changelings had horns, while the females didn't. We only get a clear indication of gender when they speak though, so it's hard to be sure. And horn style varies for no clear reason.
If true, a scan of the background changelings suggests more males than females.
In fact, is this the first confirmation that there are female changelings other than the Queen?
4657091
1. There’s at least one case where the changeling has a horn, but I’m sure the voice is feminine – the scene with the black paint.
Changelings with horns do seem to be paired to changelings without horns. However, considering that I can’t identify changeling voices as masculine or feminine clearly at least half the time,1 and considering that we saw much larger numbers of changelings previously and all of them were identical, I think it’s more of an idea of adopting a gender identity when previously they never needed the distinction, as just one more thing they could be different in. They certainly have a lot of identity issues!
Of course, a year later some idiot writer will try to foist a changeling baby with a family on us anyway.
4657095
Do you watch in English or Obscurian?
It's not unknown for translations to change gender, especially when a character's gender isn't clear on screen.
4657098
Of course I watch in English. Does pony come out in any other language on the same day as the English original?…
4657091
I remember making a list of "interesting things about changelings, and which were removed by TWaBA". At the time, "winged & magic horned ponies" wasn't threatened (or I didn't notice).
Royal purple. one more down.
4657075
Oh, good point. Will have to read up on that when I have time.
Not my theory, but I think it’s interesting:
4657075
And... we've somehow been shown evidence that anyone other than Chrysalis and potentially Pharynx was ever an intelligent changeling? As seen in this very episode, some of them don't even know how heat works.
A lot of the old-style changelings who didn’t want to change were actually sneaky about it. Instead of openly disagreeing with Thorax, they disguised themselves as rocks and furniture within the hive. And they fed off their fellow changelings’ love for the hive.
Back from a convention and eager to assay some caballus. Fun episode with interesting parallels with the Regal Sisters, though I think Trixie was finally more annoying than funny in how much of a jerk she was this episode.
We do know that they have to be on the opposite side of the planet from Ponyville though, since in S3 when they teleported they moved from night to day. I now suspect Trixie and other ponies refer to the entire planet as Equestria, whether or not it is under the rule of the Diarchy.
Agree, and here's why:
"Starlight Glimmer: Right. [clears throat] So... not a big fan of the vines, huh?
Pharynx: They're a safety hazard. An enemy could hide in them or use them as weapons. I don't even know why they're here."
I think Chrysalis had all remove plants around the hive to a certain distance, for the same reason Pharynx articulates, but when the entire swarm was doing it, they were actually effective at it. Pharynx on his own can only get the plants right in the central hive now.
Sure, but remember moles also bugs, so I think that is their primary fear.
I don't think that concept really exists in MLP, they haven't really thought of radar yet.
Not sure, but it must rain around here, since most of the plants we see are broad-leafed, the kind that flourish in heavy rainfall.
This is true. We could also guess this just by looking at the size of Chrysalis versus the size of an egg.
Good question. Presumably creatures to supply love, but could it include animals, or only sapient beings? Also pretty direct confirmation that changling "civilization" didn't really exist, they were pretty much cavemen.
Ok, feel like I've got a pretty good grasp on how things played out with Phalynx. Under Chrissi the hunters were infiltrators for the most part. "Patrol" guarded the hive. Who did the guard against? Reprisals for victims of their hunting, raids to rescue captured cocooned victims, etc. As far as they are from Equestria proper, I suspect ponies were rarely part of the changling diet.
It also establishes that Pharynx stayed behind during the Invasion, probably in charge of hive defenses while Chryssi was gone.
This fact might explain a lot about Pharynx. Thorax has turned the Changling Hive into a small liberal-arts college, and most of the changlings love it and fit in easily. They are basically all trying to be "like ponies." Pharynx however, has no real experience with ponies, so he lacks a whole frame of reference for everyone else's behavior.
See above on where they are getting their identity from.
Could have been laid by Chryssi before she left. Or, Thorax might have changed himself internally to have the necessary royal Equipment.
Be fair, Spike hasn't seen the hive recently.
Cadance and Shining Armor's true love, probably.
See above.
Trixie is learning special tricks from Starlight. She's probably imagining a giant teacup. Remember, even back in S1 Trixie is still a lot more impressive magically than the average unicorn, which is why she got into the CSfGU.
Maybe it's common knowledge that Thorax is a mutant, and Pharynx obviously is, so they're not surprised at this connection?
Why did Pharynx not follow Chrysalis into exile? Or straight-up challenge Thorax for the throne? I'm pretty sure flying giant spider beats bear.
The biggest mystery of all is that it's been 48 hours, and I haven't yet seen a single double romance between Thorax and Pharynx with Celestia and Luna.
4655897
Agree completely. Also, what love energy has Pharynx been eating recently to power this transformation?
4656156
I think it was that. I still think they have some sort of empathic-level weak hive mind, but definitely not telepathy. If you could telepathically ask your King to make the really big scary mean guy leave instead of saying it out, wouldn't you?
4657098
4657103 Pretty sure it is simulcast in the Chaos Dimension though.
4657706 That's a solid theory, makes a lot of sense to me.
4657869
We would also have to think that no intelligent changelings appeared across a thousand years beside Pharynx. It makes more sense to assume that something extraordinary did happen and that Thorax was able to trigger it because of his unique experiences, rather than attribute the newtype transformation to chance.
4658870
Some might. But, say, Applejack sings “We sing our song ’cross the pony nation / From Equestria and beyond” in Pinkie Apple Pie.
The usage of “Equestria” similar to “America” (Remember there’s a South America, by the way, and it’s not part of the US at all?) is not random, just like the syllabic structure of these words matching probably isn’t entirely accidental either.
Thorax the Wet King of the Changelings!
Or Wet Leader, that’s even worse.
Fandom frequently assumes that providing changelings with a steady supply of puppies to care for would solve the changeling food issue.
I find that highly dubious, because, no matter how cruel Chrysalis is, she is also clearly rational enough to think of adopting this solution as a stepping stone to greater power – make sure your swarm isn’t starving so that you can have a bigger swarm to attack a bigger target. If an easy non-abhorrent solution for more power existed, she would have taken it by now.
Actually, I think that Starlight and Trixie just don’t care enough, and regular changelings assume that the transformation should express their identity – whatever identity they managed to build – so whatever Pharynx looks like now, that’s what he is. They don’t transform for everyday tasks, even though this would make a lot of these tasks much easier, precisely because finding and keeping their self is so important now.
Fandom’s winding down? There was no major spike in new activity on the site upon the start of season 7…
4659057
Whipporwill was actually a changeling infiltrator? And now that her 'puppy' Riley is old and no longer a playful pup, she can't get enough love from him? Then the changelings have to keep returning the adult dogs to the pound and check out fresh puppies or starve.
4659057
Season 7 also had like, the slowest start of any season. It was an awards ceremony and an entirely normal episode. Every other time, we've had a brand-new cataclysm and usually a new villain to ship with everyone.
4659057
Yet in “To Where and Back Again”, Starlight Glimmer and Thorax show Chrysalis a solution to the changeling’s ongoing hunger problem. They offer a way for Chrysalis to remain ruler of the changelings and lead them into a new, less evil era. And Chrysalis rejects it immediately, because the information came from a pony and “a mewling grub”.
I think Chrysalis really is at least a little Stupid Evil, and the argument “If it’s such a good idea, why didn’t Chrysalis try it first?” doesn’t hold weight.
4659761
This would be an acceptable solution if Chrysalis cared for the welfare of her changelings and did all that conquest for them. I am pretty sure that is not the case, and therefore it is not an acceptable solution for her. The source of the information doesn’t matter at all.
4659985
So the newtype changeling transformation was not exactly happenstance. It was a process that could have happened at any time. But Chrysalis, hungry for power, held back any research that dared to suggest changelings could feed without conquering their neighbors.
4660305
Because she’s a Chrysalis supremacist, yes. :)
4657075
Perhaps, but she didn't specifically say the changelings were sucking love out of plants, either. All she said was that since they'd changed their behaviour, the plants had started to grow back. This could mean that their feeding habits were impacting on fauna that would have provided nutrients to the plants, or kept away some fauna that would have overgrazed.
Apologies for the delay in the reply, but I've had no internet access for a whole week.