convo 25?? · 11:52pm Apr 25th, 2016
More important: convo 25 got sent to the editor. So far he likes it better than the previous version, mainly because things actually happen. Don't know how long it'll be before any of you actually sees it, but it's coming.
Less important: I've been watching the show, and yo, I'd forgotten how many liberties I took with MLP canon. This morning I watched the sisters get chumped by some weather. In terms of visuals, the show sisters are way more down-to-earth and not particularly godesslike, which makes me suspect that the first chapter of ANS is kinda eye-rolly for how intense it paints the Celestia Experience (c) with all sorts of dramatic line breaks and resplendent adjectives. I toned that down a little in the alternate version of the first chapter that I wrote a while back, but we haven't gotten around to finishing up on that, so for now that's just how it is. Fuck.
[Alternate Universe]
No problem, man. People aren't here to read about Hasbro's Celestia, they're here for your Celestia. Give yourself more credit.
3896595 By weather, AA. They got chumped by weather.
3896712
I don't buy it and you can't prove it because not only will I refuse to look at any evidence of this, I will flat-out refute that any such evidence exists. So stop that.
You present Celestia as a goddess, and the audience will treat her like one.
3896732 Real question, do you still watch the show?
3896725 In fact, same to you. Same to anybody. Do you still watch the show?
I don't mind most of the post-S2 canon, but I can't deny that some of that is maybe not what I wanted. I'm still not down with Twilight-as-alicorn, and worse, the execution doesn't do much for me. The only thing to change is that now she's more bland and her position in society is murkier.
At the same time I think it's an interesting challenge to fanfic writers. I've accepted it into ANS, personally; Twilight wasn't a regent and neither was Cadance, but they WERE paragons, demigoddesses maybe, ponies who'd earned the direct support of the aether for the purpose of defending and nurturing their world.
3896754 Yeah, I hope so.
3896766
Dude, real talk time; I never watched the show. I watched the season premieres and finales up until the end of season three, watched half of the regular episodes in season one, and watched one or two episodes in S2. I'm only here because this site has a better layout than any other fanfic website. All told, I might have watched 20 episodes, but probably not. Closer to 10-15.
3896766
I actually agree with you on a lot of things you've put down here but I'm actually glad they've toned down the whole 'Lightbringer of the World' aspect of Celly. Maybe it's my inherent distrust of worship or power but I've never really liked how goddess-like some writers make her. I can read your story because while she is powerful and is a Goddess, she's more a fish-out-of-water and we haven't really seen her power. The only things she's done thus far is some light magic that a relatively powerful pony can do, manipulation - which can be just an aspect of her being long-lived - and withstanding an Elder Thing that can break human brains - again, something that can be chalked up to experience or just an alien physiology. Hell, give a random schmuck of a dragon a staff and they'd be able to do most of the things this Celestia has done.
I'm probably going to have trouble once Celetstia Sola Invicia comes into play, honestly. But that's entirely on me and in no way on you as an author. As Beautiful and Terrible as the Dawnbringer may be, I've stuck around despite my general distaste for it so that means you write well enough for me to forget that aspect, ya?
3896778 It really does knock the socks off fanfiction.net.
It is interesting on how different fanfic communities receive "OOC" (or what they perceive to be OOC). I have written some pieces for Ranma 1/2 on FanFiction.net and that community is strident on OOC. On the other hand, on the same site, the Harry Potter fandom is so laid back they are horizontal.
I think MLP is more on the HP side of things rather then Ranma. It might be because of the multiple writers' different takes on the characters, but it is all good. Your Celestia is a goddess as called for by the story you're telling. Another person may need a flawed Celestia (She certainly carries the idiot ball more than her fair share in canon) There is room for both.
Still watching the ponies.
3896712
I don't really like this, sorry. For one, it's hyperbole (they were hardly helpless), second, it's acting like the series is somehow innately wrong for not fitting your headcanon.
Celestia in the show is clearly not as powerful as in your fic. That's fine. But I don't think it's a flaw in the show; it never claimed she was that powerful, either. I still watch the show, and quite enjoy it. The fact that it doesn't fit the lore in your fic doesn't matter; they're both their own stories and I judge them on their own merit.
3897007 I should clarify that I was making fun of the huge power levels gulf between the show and my story. No, there's definitely nothing wrong with the show not matching my fanfic.
If I have a complaint, it's that at this point I feel like we can assume that, if Celestia tries to contribute to the situation, the best she can hope for is a standstill. This isn't important, but it does feel a little artificial sometimes. The narrative acknowledges that the sisters are strong by frequently having them attempt to do the heavy lifting (fighting climate change through sheer force, trying to scrap with Chrysalis, locking away Nightmare Moon, locking away Tirek, and the list goes on and on) but then it works to minimize the practical impact of that power by either having these things happen offscreen or by having her FAIL at all this heavy lifting.
Is this worth complaining about? Actually, no. This is a common situation in fiction; if you want an adventure and you want a side character to be at least as powerful as the heroes, then you've got to always find ways to relegate her to the sidelines. Sometimes it gets awkward, but that's the cost of doing business unless you're some kind of genius.
I guess the other reason Celestia's impact has to be so limited is that she's a static character, and every conflict in the show is solved when one or more characters change and grow. Celestia is allowed to struggle but she's not allowed to change, which means she's not allowed to solve central problems except by supporting someone else. That's fine. I guess.
Thankfully the comics can go in different directions than the show can. The Reflections arc, for example, uses the sisters to great effect.
3896861 I wonder if this has anything to do with the age of the respective IPs. Maybe the early fanfics have something to do with it as well, like Fallout: Equestria and Past Sins.
3896778 Have you seen Lesson Zero? Because if not, you are basically the worst.
3896810 Seems like a completely unshameful reason to not enjoy a story, really. Glad you like what you've read so far.
3897049
Ah, my apologies that I read too much into it. I guess I've just been burned by too many people hating on the show for not matching their headcanons.
I still watch the show, pretty much as soon as an episode comes out - of course I'm in the wrong hemisphere, so I usually have to wait a few hours before a chance rolls around.
I'd say without hesitation ANS is one of the premiere stories on this site.
The Celestia you depict isn't the Celestia from the show. It's the Celestia we imagine, or the one we want to be in the show, but Hasbro won't give us, because Celestia is not a main character. If you take away the kiddy filter, hell, your version of Celestia is a lot like what I'm hoping she'll be in Guardians of Equestria.
Aside from that, your writing is excellent. I feel like I'm reading Neil Gaiman's American Gods. The fact I can read for free seems like a crime.
3897065
Of course. That was one of about two episodes I watched from the regular season. It was excellent.
3897230 I mentioned the Reflections comic book arc as a good example of Celestia as major supporting character, almost a main character, and I think it's interesting that she's not at all a goddess there. She's more an adventurer than anything. I hear she's similar in at least one of the books, though I haven't read those.
Mostly I wonder why Celestia and Luna are alicorns in canon. The books say they were born that way, I hear. I think they come from an entire species of alicorns? It's kind of an interesting slice of idea space. What happened to the others, right? What's their biological relationship with ponies? idk.
I've heard that phrase "kiddie filter" and I don't know if I buy it. The kiddiness is an innate part of the show, I would say, and talking about removing the kiddie filter is like talking about removing the grimdark filter from Warhammer 40k, the McFarlane filter from Spawn, or the po-mo filter from Homestuck. Kiddie-ness is a part of the IP's DNA.
I mean, you can still use MLP to play with complex or kid-unfriendly ideas, but I'd say the real reason those can work in such an interesting way is because the optimism and sincerity of MLP is going to shine through, even if it's just through the ironic juxtaposition (sorry) of MLP and something darker. And it's legitimately hard to extract said optimism and sincerity.
I prefer your versions of Celestia and Luna and like to imagine that they intentionally let themselves get owned or fail in order to stop those around them from becoming complacent and not seeking to do for themselves. :p
3898684
In the Diary of the Two Sisters, Celestia once refers to her ancestors as 'the Alicorns', but the implication is that they are no longer around - either deceased, or 'moved elsewhere'. They are both Alicorns before they get their sun/moon marks, however, Kim Possible has a youtube video up somewhere questioning these order of events.