Jossed Out · 6:21am May 21st, 2017
If twitter discussions with show staff are to be believed, all comics are supposed to be canon. Of course, saying that simply means they don’t understand the question, because occasionally, irreconcilable differences arise.
In expanded universes like that, we generally consider one of the mediums the primary source, while everything else is secondary, and in case of contradictions, the primary source takes precedence.
I’m going to keep this post around and update it as a running tally of all secondary canon sources that the primary source has invalidated enough that they can’t be treated as depictions of events that actually happened.
If you think I missed anything, please leave a comment.
Completely jossed
Friends Forever #14
What: Spike has an adventure in a dragon ghetto in Fillydelphia.
Why: According to Gauntlet of Fire, nobody, not even Celestia and Luna, knows much of anything about the dragon culture, which makes the existence of such a ghetto patently impossible.
Micro-Series #10
What: Luna gets to replace Celestia for a day while Celestia gets a vacation day. Luna finds the day anything but easy.
Why: A Royal Problem depicts the sisters having and resolving just such a conflict, and there’s no way to learn this lesson twice.
FIENDship is Magic #4 (Nightmare Moon)
What: The story of how Celestia battled Nightmare Moon repeatedly in the dream realms is told.
Why: A Royal Problem conclusively states that Celestia cannot normally perform dream magic at all.
My Little Pony #34-37 (Siege of the Crystal Empire)
What: The story of King Sombra’s redemption.
Why: This one has been on the thin ice ever since The Crystalling when Flurry Heart, who doesn’t feature in this story, was born. The final nail in its coffin has been hammered in by The Beginning of the End, where Sombra gets resurrected and then killed for good. There is no longer a stretch of time where this story can exist.
Questionable
My Little Pony Annual 2013 (The Fall of Sunset Shimmer)
What: The story of the quarrel between Sunset Shimmer and Celestia that resulted in the former escaping to Pedestria.
Why: The second page of the comic depicts, in the same panel, Sunset Shimmer, pre-cutie-mark Twilight, young adult Minuette, young adult Twinkleshine, young adult Lemon Hearts, and what has to be, but looks nothing like, young adult Moondancer. Twice. Amending Fences makes it quite certain that these particular background ponies are very close in age to Twilight Sparkle, and therefore the entire scene cannot happen, making all of the Equestria story in this issue highly suspect, since the scene is not framed as anyone’s narration. The Pedestria story of the issue is not affected.
Micro-Series #4
What: Fluttershy attempts to get into art through knitting on a massive scale.
Why: According to Fake It Til You Make It, Fluttershy can’t knit worth a damn. While in the comic, she does take some effort to hide her hobby from her friends, you’d have to assume she is far more devious than she usually is to accept that she is deliberately knitting badly to make sure nobody thinks she can knit exceptionally well.
My Little Pony #17-20: Reflections
1. In a Star Trek sense
What: The Mane 6 have adventures in a mirror universe.1
Why: The plot opens up with Celestia leaving for an extended stint in the mirror universe, and Luna replacing her for a week. A Royal Problem requires Luna to think that replacing Celestia would be easy, which would mean she has to have no prior experience doing it. This wouldn’t be a problem if Reflections were to happen afterwards, however, it’s a unambiguously a pre-Starlight era comic. This storyline is referenced by the comics numerous times later, and simply pulling it out of the comic continuity is impractical.
It’s also important to note that chronologically, there is little to no time remaining for this story to happen: Twilight has at most a month after being crowned with the Element of Magic before she gives up that crown to save the Tree of Harmony in Princess Twilight Sparkle
My Little Pony #27: The Revenge of Everfree
What: This comic deals with a civilization of deer living within Everfree forest.
Why: As Filli Vanilli and later, Fluttershy Leans In imply, deer are not sapient enough to form a kingdom. Unless two radically different kinds of deer exist, sapient and non-sapient, this comic cannot have happened.
Friends Forever #33
What: Applejack meets Calamity Mane and Buffalo Bull.
Why: In The Last Roundup, Applejack confirms that she saw Calamity Mane at the Equestrian Rodeo in Canterlot, however, in this comic, she claims she has not seen Calamity Mane perform since she was a little filly. Either Applejack uttered an explicit lie in The Last Roundup, and a particularly odd one at that, or this comic actually managed to joss itself.
Friends Forever #38
What: Luna and Celestia participate in a Sisterhooves Social.
Why: A Royal Problem insists that Celestia was unappreciative of Luna’s dream work and definitely did not perform it herself while Luna was in exile, which is contrary to the statements in this comic. Just like Micro-Series #10, it depicts the Sisters learning essentially the same lesson, and while this contradiction isn’t quite as strong here, it requires a lot of narrative trickery to reconcile.
Yeah, at this point, I kinda treat the various comic continuities as 'official fanfic'. Like *Star Wars* novels, someone at brand management paid the writers to come up with something, and it has the Hasbro imprint, but the core stories don't really take any of it into account. The only difference is that the showrunners are free to raid the 'official fanfic' pantries for snacks and ideas if they feel like it, although in practice it's probably still a legal headache and may result in writers' guild 'story by' credits and other union headaches.
I'm gonna keep trying to reconcile these contradictions as best I can, because I'm a stubborn bastard, but Christ if these people don't make it difficult.
I'm very grateful for this list, because it will save me money when I start reading the comics again.
I think you should add MLP 1-4 (Season 6 finale of the changlings kingdom josses pretty hard the idea that the changlings are wandering band of marauding nomads who hole up in the nearest castle). Fiendship is Magic Chrysalis issue may need to be jossed, but it's far enough back in time that there is wiggle room.
MLP #5-8 Should be jossed by the S4 opener, which shows Luna turning into nightmare moon on her own and being banished, not engaging in a lengthy and epic fight with the aid of nightmare forces. Same for Nightmare Moon's Fiendship and whichever comic had the evil apples caused by a meteor from Celestia and NMM's original lengthy battle.
MLP #26-28 should be jossed because we have now twice seen that deer are non-sapient. They're right there in Ponyville too, and physically look identical to Aspen's deer.
4543661
Not really. The Changeling Kingdom setup could simply be very recent.
I don’t remember it being so reliant on a lengthy epic fight, but I’ll look into it.
That one should only count as questionable…
Same for this one.
OK, why's Reflections so clearly a pre-Starlight comic?
And how do we know that all deer are nonsapient?
4546199
1. Luna summons the Mane 6 and Spike, and completely ignores the potential Starlight. Which wouldn’t be enough, but later…
2. Starlight and Celestia discuss the events of Reflections.
It’s not exactly a hard lock, but it would work a lot better if it predated Starlight.
We don’t. We just know that all deer that turned up on screen so far are non-sapient. This does not preclude the possibility that a sapient subspecies of deer exists, but makes it rather unlikely, because there are no observed non-sapient species of minotaurs, cows or ponies.
Which is why both of these are listed under “Questionable,” and not “Completely jossed” – they can happen, but you need mental gymnastics to reconcile them.
4546204 Okay, so the comic in (2) is noncanon while Reflections is?
Alternatively, it happens sometime like the week after this, and Luna's still holding a bit of a grudge against Starlight?
(I've long since given up on trying to make all the comics canon; I'm just wanting to put in my favorites. Like Reflections.)
4546205
Er… “2” ?
If you want to keep Reflections in, the easiest way to do it is not to move it forward in time, but to assume that Luna actually understood that she can’t stay disguised as Celestia for longer than a few minutes, and canceled all of her appointments that involved appearing in well-lit places, which was almost all of them. If so she has never actually experienced them and could still believe they would be easy to do.
If you want to keep The Revenge of Everfree in, you have to assume that in addition to the non-sapient deer seen, sapient deer exist, but are, mysteriously, referred to as “deer” anyway. Or, which is somewhat less silly, that sapient deer have some different word to denote themselves and are annoyed that ponies don’t use it. (primates / humans)
If you want to keep Friends Forever #38 in, you have to dismiss most of Kibitz’ opening monologue as ramblings of an old stallion whose memory is failing.
4546211 (2) being the comic in your point (2) where Celestia and Starlight talk about Reflections.
Re "deer," perhaps the difference between the two words didn't survive Translation Convention from Equish to English? But I really like your idea about the ponies not bothering to use a different term.
Was just re-reading this post for reference's sake, and it ocurred to me that by the standards of "jossed" you're using here, Siege of the Crystal Empire probably belongs on this list. Flurry Heart pretty clearly seemed to not be a thing in that arc, and as I'm sure you remember, it ended with King Sombra being reformed, but IIRC Shining and Cadance still refer to Sombra's return as a possible threat in The Crystalling.
I think the intent of the answer was that the comics contradicting the show should be treated as equivalent to the show contradicting itself. While I don't recall any specific cases of the latter happening, adding any that have to this post feels logical.
Honestly I'm surprised this list isn't longer
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Late, but: "the" answer?
5679175
The twitter discussions with the staff that he mentioned.