“So, where are you taking me, Twi?”
“Would you please stop calling me that?”
“I like nicknames.”
“I don’t.”
“You didn’t mind before! Anyway, I’m pretty sure it says somewhere in the rulebook that the pony you’re dating is supposed to annoy you in subtle ways, Twi.”
“And how is that supposed to be romantic?”
“I never said it was romantic. I said it was required.”
Twi rolled her eyes and lightly shoved Moon Dancer in their carriage as it headed into the depths of the southern sprawl of Canterlot City. This part of the city was older than the rest. The architecture wasn’t quite as polished and shiny, but there was still plenty of white and gold. Hey, this was still Celestia’s city, after all. Canterlot ponies loved their motif.
“So, where are we going?” Moon Dancer asked again.
Twi rolled her eyes for like, the hundredth time. “It’s a surprise. How many times do I have to tell you that?”
“Enough times that you stop saying that and just tell me the truth,” Moon Dancer said with a smirk.
“Ugh, you’re impossible.”
“Why thank you!”
“You know, I don’t remember you being this snarky when we were fillies.”
“Blame Sunny,” Moon Dancer said with a little shrug. “She rubs off on you after a while. Kinda hard to resist.”
“No kidding,” Twi mumbled.
Moon Dancer couldn’t figure out how to respond to that. An awkward silence descended upon them for a block or two. Despite the last week, one question still burned in her mind. She’d tried to keep it to herself, but in the end, she had to know.
“You still sure about this, Twi?” Moon Dancer blurted as the carriage driver rounded a corner and they entered the southern civic district. “This whole… you and me thing?”
“Why wouldn’t I be?” Twi looked really confused.
Moon Dancer stared at Twi. “You’re kidding me. You’re smarter than that.”
Twi dropped the act. It had been a good act. A cute one. But still an act. She sighed and shrugged.
“I won’t pretend this is going to be easy. Not for any of us. Sunset made her decision though. We both know it. She helped make us happen. She wants this to work.”
“Do you?”
Twi’s expression of shock wasn’t an act. “Of course I do! I never would have agreed to the second date if I hadn’t. Or the third, fourth and fifth!”
“But you’ve got this whole… shared life thing with Sunny.”
“I’ve got the same thing with you,” Twi said as she snuggled just a little closer to Moon Dancer. For some reason, ever since the second date, Twi had taken to public displays of affection way more eagerly than Moon Dancer had expected.
Probably read a new book on mating practices of the ancient unicorns or something. Not that I really mind…
“It’s not the same thing,” Moon Dancer insisted to the snuggly pony beside her. “We both know it. You two… you shared your souls… or something.”
Twi looked up at her through her glasses. A flash of sunlight made them to glitter for a second before they passed under an archway.
“She saw my life,” Twi murmured. “And I saw hers. I won’t lie. It was… an intense experience. But the Princess said that this sort of thing is rare. Even married unicorn couples don’t often experience it. It takes just the right set of circumstances to make it happen.”
“I know all of that,” Moon Dancer muttered. “But it’s still not making me feel much better, Twi.”
Twi giggled and rolled her eyes. “But that’s the thing! It’s not like Smart Cookie, Clover the Clever and Private Pansy ended up falling in love after Hearth’s Warming Eve.”
“Heh, you should read some of Coco’s books. From what she says about them, they tell a different story entirely.”
Twi rolled her eyes again, shoved Moon Dancer over and righted herself. “I’m talking about reality. Not fiction.”
Moon Dancer just smirked.
“You were there from the beginning, Moon Dancer. You forced yourself into my life. You kept up with me. And you tried harder than anypony else to keep me around, even when I shoved you away. Just because I didn’t have some magic mind meld with you doesn’t mean I don’t care about you.”
“And Sunny?”
“Sunset’s a friend,” Twi said with conviction. Moon Dancer couldn’t tell how strong the conviction was… but it was there. “She’ll always be a friend. And I’m looking forward to working with her on the Spire project and all the other things the Princess wants us to do. But right now, I’m here with you. And that’s what matters.”
“What happened to the stuttering, terrified Archivist I remember meeting last week over dinner?” Moon Dancer said as they came out from a tunnel. The carriage began to slow as they made one more turn.
“She realized she didn’t need to be terrified anymore,” Twi said with a smirk of her own. Well… at least as close to a smirk as she could get.
Twi didn’t have as much practice as Moon Dancer, after all.
“So, you’re not afraid, huh?”
“Oh, I’m totally freaking out,” Twi laughed. The laugh bordered on maniacal. “I keep expecting to wake up to find this was all a dream. But right now… I don’t know… I feel…”
Twi swallowed as the carriage stopped in a roundabout alongside a rather nondescript building. Moon Dancer’s heart hammered in her chest as she watched Twi search for the right words.
“I feel wanted,” Twi whispered, staring down at her hooves.
Moon Dancer wrapped Twi a tight hug. Twi responded with a surprising ferocity. As if she’d been alone for a lifetime and now that she’d found somepony, she never intended to let go.
Almost a minute passed like that before the carriage driver coughed politely.
“Sorry!” Twi squeaked as she disentangled herself from Moon Dancer and hopped down off the carriage. As Moon Dancer stepped down, Twi floated a hoofful of bits to the driver, enough to include a sizable tip. “Keep the change.”
The carriage driver nodded, tipped his hat to them and trotted off back the way they’d come. As his hoofsteps faded away, Moon Dancer looked around. A large fountain dominated the middle of the roundabout. Sparkling water sent waves of rainbow light across the cobbles. On the other side of the street were some offices and a few small government buildings. There was almost nopony around, save for a single amber unicorn reading a book down the street outside a small cafe.
“Well, Twi,” Moon Dancer said as she surveyed the scene. “I wasn’t expecting this. You really outdid yourself.”
“Ugh,” Twi groaned. “You’re impossible.”
“You said that already. And here I thought somepony working at the RCA would have a bigger vocabulary.”
Twi nudged her and gestured for her to turn around. Moon Dancer did so with a roll of her eyes and looked up at the wooden structure that dominated this side of the roundabout. It was a least a couple hundred years old, if Moon Dancer was any judge. Older even than the Cosmo. Still, it had the air of a place that had been lovingly cared for. It radiated warmth. Something about it drew Moon Dancer like a magnet. She couldn’t help herself as she stepped forward toward the small unassuming door on the side.
“What is this place?” Moon Dancer asked in a hushed whisper. She didn’t even know why she was whispering, but it felt right.
“Apparently, it was going to be the surprise we were promised last week. But… it’s a little different now.”
Twi took a deep breath as Moon Dancer turned to face her.
“You told me how sorry you were that you weren’t there when I came back after that summer,” Twi said, poking at the cobblestones with a hoof. She was suddenly acting shy again and Moon Dancer couldn’t figure out why. “You promised to be there for me now.”
Twi gently knocked on the door as if she were requesting access to some sacred temple.
“Yes, yes!” came a slightly cranky voice from inside. “I’m coming, I’m coming!”
“I decided it was only fair to show you where it all started for me.”
Moon Dancer blinked as Twilight pointed up at the sign above the door.
“Royal Canterlot Archives… South Repository…” Moon Dancer read aloud, barely able to believe what she was seeing. “You mean…”
The door opened.
“Yes, yes, who is it?” An older mint-green unicorn with a blonde mane blinked in the afternoon sunlight before her gaze landed on Twi. Behind her rectangular reading glasses, her eyes lit up and an enormous smile appeared on her face.
“Twilight!” she cried as she darted forward and swept Twi into an enormous hug. Twi actually coughed a few times, her eyes bulging behind her glasses as she fought for breath. “Oh my, dear! I haven’t seen you in far too long! I knew you were coming, but didn’t expect you this soon! How’s my favorite librarian doing today?”
“I’m wonderful, Jade,” Twi said once the mare had released her and Twi managed to learn how to breathe again. “I actually brought somepony to meet you.”
The mare’s eyes narrowed as she studied Moon Dancer. “Twilight Sparkle, you know how I feel about fanfillies!”
“This isn’t a fanfilly, Jade,” Twi said with a smile. “This is my…”
Twi turned to Moon Dancer, suddenly at a loss for words.
She’d been wondering when this moment would come. When Twi would have to introduce her to somepony new. Or when Moon Dancer would have to do the same. It meant that they needed to ‘define’ their relationship, something neither of them really wanted to do. Moon Dancer knew Twi wasn’t ashamed of her. And Moon Dancer wasn’t ashamed of Twi.
Just putting a label on it… seemed… well, daunting.
Sunny would probably be laughing her tail off if she knew how nervous we were about this!
Moon Dancer then realized Sunny wouldn’t have done anything of the sort. Not at all. That stung a bit.
So, she decided to do what Sunny probably would have done in her place.
“Marefriend,” Moon Dancer said with a small smile at Twi, hoping that it would be good enough.
To her relief, Twi’s smile blossomed into something much deeper and much more appreciative.
“Marefriend… Moon Dancer,” Twi continued. “Moon Dancer, I’d like you to meet Jade Singer, the current head of the South Canterlot Archives and author of—”
Moon Dancer’s heart just about stopped as the name finally registered in her head. No way.
“Yes, yes, yes,” Jade Singer said with a shooing motion at Twilight as she stepped over to eye Moon Dancer critically. “I’m sure she knows who I am. Anypony who would associate with you would have to know who I am.”
Moon Dancer desperately tried not to squeal. It was a very hard battle, but one she just barely managed to win.
Jade Singer adjusted her glasses with her magic and studied Moon Dancer as if she were some trashy pulp fiction novel about vamponies that had been dumped in the donations box.
“Hmmm… padding on the glasses shows she’s more concerned with comfort than appearance. That’s reinforced by that ridiculous topknot…”
“Hey!” Moon Dancer protested, even over Twi’s giggles.
“Mane’s in good condition, tail too. And don’t think I missed the coloring, Twilight, dear. I daresay she almost looks like a recolor of you.”
Twilight just giggled some more while Moon Dancer suffered the ‘abuse.’ She wondered if Twi’s parents were going to be this bad.
Wow… I just thought about meeting her parents. I guess… I guess I am taking this seriously.
Gah! I shouldn’t be freaking out like this! Freaking out is for Sunny and Twi! Not me!
Finally, Jade Singer lifted up Moon Dancer’s right hoof and studied it critically. She mumbled to herself for a moment or two before dropping it and staring intently into Moon Dancer’s eyes.
“Not bad, Twilight,” Jade Singer finally said as she stepped away. “Not bad. Definitely a bookpony. You don’t seem the RCA type, though.”
“Cosmo, ma’am,” Moon Dancer replied.
“The Canterlot Cosmopolitan Library?” Jade Singer said, her eyes going wide. “That I wasn’t expecting. Fancy yourself a social pony, eh?”
“Hardly,” Moon Dancer scoffed. “I just… I don’t know, I feel like I can help more ponies at a public library rather than the RCA.”
Jade Singer’s face was impassive for a long time. “Is that right? Well, my little Twilight here isn’t an elitist if that’s what you’re getting at, young lady.”
“No!” Moon Dancer said. What was with this mare? “That’s not what I meant, I just…”
“Oh, you so can’t even say what you mean? Then how am I supposed to believe anything you say?”
“But—”
“I won’t tolerate that kind of behavior toward somepony who waltzes in here and claims to be my Twilight’s new marefriend! I have standards, young lady! You’d better make sure you’re ready to meet them, or by Celestia, I’ll tan your hide!”
Moon Dancer gawked at her, trying to figure out what just happened. One moment, it seemed to be going well, now she was being threatened with a ‘tanned hide?’ What was wrong with this pony? Why would Twi even want to introduce her to—
That’s when she realized Twi was going red in her desperate attempt to keep from cracking up entirely. The moment Moon Dancer noticed, Twi lost her battle and collapsed, gasping for air as she laughed, her legs flailing in the air. Her near complete inability to breathe did dampen the laughter a bit, though.
Jade Singer cracked a smile a second later, the thundercloud that had been her face breaking like the dawn.
“Twilight, dear,” Jade said in a bemused voice. “You’re going to hurt yourself if you don’t breathe.”
“But… her face…” Twi squeaked as she clutched her stomach. “Her face…”
“Yes, it was quite priceless, wasn’t it?” Jade Singer smirked at Moon Dancer. “I can see why you like her. Though I suspect she’s usually the snarky one.”
Twi nodded as she finally got control of herself and pushed herself to her hooves. “Yeah… but… she needed to be taught a lesson I think.”
Moon Dancer just gaped at the two of them.
“This was planned?”
Twi’s eyes sparkled. “After all the teasing you do to just about everypony I know—especially me—you had it coming, Moon Dancer.”
Moon Dancer couldn’t help but laugh. She sat down and slowly clapped her hooves together.
“Well done,” Moon Dancer intoned. “Now, the student has become the master.”
“Hardly,” Jade Singer scoffed. “I had to do all the work. Twilight just suggested I give you a hard time. I wasn’t expecting you to make it so easy.”
“It’s not everyday a pony meets a living literary legend,” Moon Dancer pointed out with a faint huff. “You cheated.”
“Only been dating her a week, hm, Twilight?” Jade Singer asked with a sly grin. “I think you’ve already got her pegged.”
“We’ve known each other for a long time,” Twi replied with a shrug. “We’re just now… getting reacquainted.”
Twi smiled at her. Moon Dancer smiled back.
“Well, as long as you don’t get too ‘reacquainted’ in my Archive, you’ll be just fine.”
“Jade!” Twilight squeaked, instantly turning red.
“Oh, Twilight,” Jade cackled as she turned and headed into the depths of the Archive. “You should have known you’d get it just as much as her.”
“This was your idea,” Moon Dancer pointed out.
“Don’t remind me,” Twi muttered. “I’ll probably end up regretting it.”
“Well, I don’t,” Moon Dancer said with a smile as she bumped against her marefriend. “So, let’s just enjoy it and see where it goes, huh?”
Twi’s blush actually deepened at that. “Okay… I think I can do that.”
“One day at a time, Twi.”
Twi nodded. “One day at a time.”
They walked inside together, both grinning like idiots. And Moon Dancer loved it.
“You’ve been quiet today,” the Princess of the Sun commented from her large cushion in the middle of her study. “Far quieter than usual for a one-on-one lesson.”
Sunset glanced out the window, unable to meet her teacher’s gaze. Philomena fluttered down and nuzzled her just a little. Sunset stroked the bird absently. She didn’t have anything to say, really.
That wasn’t true. She didn’t trust herself to say anything.
That was an entirely different problem.
Still, she couldn’t just ignore the Princess of the Sun. Even if Celestia did already know the answer to her own unasked question.
“It’s not important, Princess.”
She’d forced herself to go through the motions of normalcy. As if nothing had changed. In reality, nothing had changed, save for one thing. One very special, very important thing. But it didn’t affect her. It didn’t impact her.
It shouldn’t impact her.
“Sunset,” Celestia repeated. “For the last week, you have been so quiet. Don’t think it’s escaped my notice. Please. Would you talk to me about what’s on your mind?”
You already know what happened, Princess. What am I supposed to tell you? That I did exactly what you asked me to do? That I even went so far as to successfully…
Sunset looked back down at A Study on Chaos Theory. She hadn’t turned the page in over an hour. Of course Celestia had noticed. Celestia wasn’t a fool.
A golden glow encompassed the book. With a faint application of magic, Celestia closed it and moved it onto a nearby table. She took a deep breath and let it out slowly before getting to her hooves and stepping over to the half-built model in the center of the room. After the latest accident, they’d temporarily moved it up to Celestia’s study—which happened to have the strongest wards and shields in the castle. Gemstones and sigils lined the circumference of the crystalline castle-like object. Sunset watched as Celestia slowly walked around it, studying it with a critical eye.
“I’m proud of you, Sunset.”
For the first time in a very long time, Sunset didn’t get the happy warm surge she usually had at those words. Instead, they were just… words. Nothing more. Dull and flat.
Philomena nuzzled her again.
Sunset stared at the model.
“It’s not done yet,” Sunset replied woodenly. “I’m… I’m not sure if I can finish it anymore.”
“I wasn’t talking about the Spire.”
“I know.”
Celestia stepped over and settled beside Sunset. She gently draped her great white wing over Sunset’s body.
“Just a few days ago, you were in the laboratory with Twilight and Moon Dancer working on the Spire. Talking about unified harmony magics and chaos theory. You seemed to be enjoying yourself.”
“It’s easier when we’re just talking about magical theory or constructing arcane leyline taps,” Sunset said with a shrug. “At least… until a pause comes along. Or when Twilight smiles for… ‘no reason.’ Or they both blush at the same time.”
Celestia watched her for a long time, not saying anything. Sunset couldn’t help but wonder what she was thinking, but she couldn’t get the energy or the courage to ask.
“I don’t think I’ve ever seen you like this, Sunset.”
Sunset snorted. “I’m sure you’ve seen plenty of ponies in my position, Princess.”
“I didn’t say that,” she chided gently. “I said I haven’t seen you like this.”
“It’s just hard right now. I’m sure… in time, it’ll get easier, right? What’s that saying? ‘Time heals all wounds?’”
To Sunset’s surprise, Celestia actually flinched. She stared at the Princess as the alicorn seemed to search for the right words.
“So many ponies misquote that,” Celestia said in a distant voice. “They remember that single statement as simple folk wisdom. Words meant to comfort… but in reality, they mean little.”
“Princess?” Sunset asked, her ears flat. A chunk of fear rattled around in her chest. To see the Princess of the Sun react like that to such an off-hoof statement… It was…
It was wrong.
Celestia closed her eyes and took a deep breath. “The Countess Shamrock Rose said it best: ‘It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scars and the pain lessens. But it is never gone.’”
Celestia opened her eyes and met Sunset’s gaze. Sunset’s heart started hammering in her chest, though she felt oddly cold for reasons she couldn’t explain.
“The thing to remember, Sunset,” Celestia continued, her voice still little more than a whisper, “is that this isn’t necessarily a bad thing. It’s a lesson you’ve already learned time and time again. A lesson that everypony learns. The trials and difficulties we go through in life—the decisions and the consequences of those decisions—they make us what we are. Who we are. If we forget them… if we allow them to simply pass from our minds and our hearts… then we are diminished.”
Sunset gaped at her. She’d never seen the Princess look so… vulnerable. But more than anything, this lesson felt wrong. She needed to know. One question that didn’t work with the rest of this.
“But… then how do I forgive myself for the things I’ve done?” Sunset whispered.
“There’s a difference.” Celestia smiled wanly. “To Rose’s point… time allows us to cover the wound and move on. If you don’t learn to forgive yourself, if you clutch at that guilt… it’s forcing the wound to remain open with no protection. Such an action will always cause more pain. Indeed, such a wound could have dire consequences.”
It’s what you deserve, you freak.
Sunset flinched at the sudden venom from the voice in the back of her head.
“Do you want to talk about them?” Celestia asked. It wasn’t a demand. It was barely a question. It was more like a suggestion. An offer. A shoulder to cry on.
“No,” Sunset said with a cracked smile. “No, I really don’t.”
Celestia’s smile was as gentle as the morning sun on a spring day. She knew what Sunset’s real answer was without her having to say it. As usual.
“They seem happy.” Sunset shrugged. “Really happy. Well, at least until they found out. They were a little… um… miffed… when they discovered we’d been spying on them. At least… until I reminded Moon Dancer that I had pretty much told her we were going to.”
Celestia raised an eyebrow. Sunset knew the expression. It was designed specifically to admonish her without saying a word. Sunset just sighed. She felt no shame in watching the beginning of their date. After all… she’d been pretty involved.
Well, she felt no shame for watching it. She’d had plenty of shame for… pretty much everything else.
Still, there was a faint glimmer in Celestia’s eye that told Sunset the Princess would have likely have done the same. It helped a little.
“Apparently, it was after midnight when they left the Carriage House.” Sunset sighed. “Those two had a lot of catching up to do.”
“Time and distance can be a hard thing to overcome.”
Sunset nodded.
“And?”
“And… I’m actually happy for them.”
A tiny little sliver of you is. The rest of you is either jealous or dead inside, Sunset.
Celestia paused before nodding. “As I said… I’m proud of you.”
Something cracked inside Sunset.
“You shouldn’t be,” Sunset snapped. “You shouldn’t be proud of me, Princess. I tore them apart.”
“And you put them back together.”
“But they lost so much time.”
“And now they’ll make up for it.”
“Do you really think it’ll be that simple?” Sunset demanded, staring up at her teacher as she fought back the tears that threatened to overcome her.
Celestia squeezed Sunset with her wing. “No, Sunset. Of course it won’t be that simple. It could never be that simple. Friendships are rarely easy. Indeed, they’re often quite difficult. Romance… even more so. But do you know what I see when I look at you, Sunset?”
“I know what I see,” Sunset mumbled, staring at her hooves again.
A broken-down wreck of a pony who doesn’t give a damn about what she actually deserves. A pony who is everything I wasn’t. You could have been so much more. You could have been me. Now… you’re just you. How pathetic is that?
“I see that my prized student put the feelings of her two friends above her own,” Celestia said gently. “And in the space of two days, rebuilt a long-abandoned bridge between them. You put aside your own desires. Then, you did what you believed was best.”
Sunset frowned. “Don’t you mean ‘what was best?’”
Celestia hesitated for a fraction of a second before she answered.
“No. Because I cannot tell the future, Sunset. I don’t know how this will turn out. You, of all ponies, know that I make mistakes. I have done so in the past and I will likely continue to do so in the future.” She placed a naked hoof on Sunset’s chin and lifted it so their eyes met. “All any of us can do is the best with what we know at the time.”
For a moment, Sunset was a filly again. Back when Celestia had been the entire world to her. Back when she’d been so wise, so knowing, so kind…
Back when Celestia had been her mother in all but name.
Back when things had been simple.
She missed simple.
“Even when it hurts?” Sunset asked in a tiny voice.
Celestia leaned forward to nuzzle her. “Especially when it hurts.”
Philomena took to the air and looped around the half-completed Spire before she settled down on the edge of the table, watching over the two ponies lost in their thoughts.
Another often misquoted saying is, "'Curiosity killed the cat', but satisfaction brought it back."
8979422
We finally know the answer to Schrödinger's Cat thought experiment now!
These last two chapters resonated and left me a little speechless. I know in all honesty the whole story's done that to some extent but I really like the... numbness you transmitted here. Not apathy but rather isolation, especially with the contrast of warmth from the same selection.
Novel, you magnificent, wondrous, despicable writer. You manage to fill me with joy and pain. You seem to be fluent in the art of torture for the heart.
You did a great job on both chapters. Now for another week nursing my insatiable need for more.
So...should I still blame Celestia for this or not? Because, not gonna lie, I'm still rather angry at her for more or less pushing Sunset into this. Or it feels like it, anyway. Did she think this would somehow help Sunset? Because I'm not really sure how this has done anything but make her even more miserable.
8979663
There's got to be something particularly detaching about making a life-changing and self-destructive decision like that based on somepony's advice, and upon asking that pony for confirmation of the decision being told "I have no idea if it was the right decision. You know I've made lot of mistakes and am going to make lots more and this could have been one of them."
I love the chapter, mind, and the entire mood was wonderfully painted throughout the whole of it. I just think Celestia really could have worded that a little better (not that it is particularly out of character for her not to).
Absolutely splendid job on this chapter. The exchanges, characterizations and future chapter set-up are all well done in all the right places.
I particularly liked Twi introducing Moon to Jade (that was as funny as it was sweet, which is to say "'very'" on both counts) as well as Celestia's chat with Sunset concerning how much the latter is hurting concerning how she helped Twilight and Moondancer get together despite her own feelings for the former.
I'll most assuredly be looking forward to more of this story.
8979765
So, basically:
Celestia: Sunset, I'm not sure you should get too close to Twilight. It might be a bad idea.
Sunset: I think I might be in love with her, but I have a ton of self-esteem issues and guilt complexes so that sounds plausible. Okay.
*several chapters of gut-wrenching despair, self-loathing, and heartbreak later*
Sunset: It's done. She's with Moondancer now. I'm even more of a broken shell of a pony than I already was, but at least I did the right thing, right?
Celestia: *shrugs* I'unno.
Sunset: *starts crying and screaming*
8980374
last line should be "continues crying". And well, you rather miss out on Celestia comforting Sunset and helping her feel slightly better.
Celestia doing double duty talking to both Sunset and herself at the end there...
Can't say I have any firm idea of what's going to happen from here on out, aside from maybe one respect. This just isn't the sort of story I'm used to, in terms of the emotional development. I want all of them to be happy, but I do not see the way forward for that path.
Still... good work on all of this. Seriously, be proud of yourself.
Everyone so far is commenting about Sunset in this chapter. I find Twilight's behavior far more telling. Sunset is about where you would expect but given how you wrote Twilight I get the feeling she isn't in nearly as good a place at it may seem. I look forward to seeing how both her and Sunset continue to deal with their changing circumstances.
This 'blame Celestia' line of thinking only works if you:
1. Consider Sunset a child incapable of thinking for herself, AND
2. Actually think her current misery is more about giving up Twilight and not guilt over the perceived damage she did to the relationship between her and Moon Dancer in the first place.
Blaming Celestia is calling Sunset a lump who only follows orders. That's... not who Sunset is even on a bad day. Hell she's not following orders now, since Celestia never punished her for her past actions. Clearly crippling guilt was never the order of the day, and yet here Sunny is, being her usual maverick self. Unless of course you assume Celestia has chessmastered all of this to make Sunset suffer as punishment for all the misery she caused while tutoring at Gifted Unicorns. I mean... she did kind of get out of that without even a slap on the wrist... (pastern?). But that is me being facetious because Celestia has given no evidence of being that devious or punitive.
It's easy to want to place blame... but it's not going to address the real issue at hand. ...So what's that, then? I've touched on it before, but basically... agency. Sunset has plenty of things to feel guilty about in her past. A lot of wounds, to use the chapters wording. Trouble is, she's picked at them to the point where they're all one big, raw, red, infected... you get the picture. She can't tell one from the other because it's all one big sore. So she's missing that this particular thing wasn't even her fault; it was nothing she chose to do. She was there, being friends with Moon Dancer and company, and Twilight was too intimidated to join them. Feeling guilty about that is like feeling guilty for scaring Fluttershy. Would you? Probably, for a moment... but you wouldn't hold onto that guilt like an old, tear-stained teddy bear that you cried all your childhood pain into and is now infected with so many triggers it's the Typhoid Mary of plushies!
Blame Celestia? What, you want to blame the only pony actually talking to Sunset about this, when her friends have apparently given up because 'oh gosh even Minuette can't make her smile'? Overly cheerful people can be extremely grating when you're depressed. Minuette is the last pony they should've sent. Cheerilee is too obvious a balm and would be deflected as such. Rara has missed the point and lost my faith. Coco. Send generous, kind, adorable, sweet, Coco Pommel. But they didn't. Instead, Celestia is trying to explain to her that we do the best we can, and we make mistakes, and we have to live with those mistakes, and grow from them. And that doesn't mean picking at them and forever obsessing over them. If we do that, the wounds just stay there forever, and worse we spread their pain to those around us. It's not about whether you think you deserve that, Sunset. You don't, you made mistakes and you grew from them. You're not the selfish, self-absorbed trash the ALP wants you to be. But it's not about that. Hurting yourself, and your friends... that's what it's about. That's what you feel guilty about, why you deserved to be punished? Well then... one suggests you stop doing it. If it's such a crime... cut it out. Easier said than done, of course.
With that in mind... let's focus elsewhere a minute. 'Wat? Sunset's suffering isn't the only thing happening?!' Nah, there's this whole cute bookpony dating thing going on in the B story. Yeesh, I actually took notes while reading that section. I never take notes. I abhor note taking. And yet...
I have to praise Twilight's portrayal here. Too many authors focus on her flaws, because it's easy. They nod to the intellect, and perhaps the adorable, earnest enthusiasm. Some even play up her snark (and bless them for that). ...And then they go watch Lesson Zero again and wax poetic on her obsessions and various shortcomings. Because it's easy.
I rarely see mention made of her adaptability. She moved to Ponyville and adopted a completely different life than she'd led in Canterlot (or so we're led to believe). No more castle, no more big city, no more giant library, no more princess next door, and she did great. She went from reading about slumber parties to learning about friendship from having just one... and in the midst of some serious property damage. Most folks I know would've been so miffed about that part that the friendship bit would take a backseat, at best.
So that's canon, and only a couple examples. But we rarely see it. Here? We see it. Five dates in a week?! After the first half of that first date... five in a week?! Stars, kiddo, dive in the deep end, why don'tcha? But that's exactly what her character does. That earnest enthusiasm I mentioned. This is Twilight (moon) dancing, and she doesn't care if you think she looks silly. The prank with Jade, the cuddling, all of it. This is Twilight... making up for lost time. And that's time she gave away, no one else forced it.
Sunset isn't going to realize that, or that nothing's really been lost, on her own. The only one she's really hearing when she's alone does not want to help. And as much as I don't blame Celestia for this, I don't know that she can help either. This isn't the sort of problem that gets solved by your centuries old teacher/ruler. She needs therapy... but this isn't that sort of story, either. So I guess... we'll see where we go next chapter.
Soo...how much success do Twilight (and Moondancer) have with the attempt to make it work? Is it the grand prize or only a participation award? Because that first part of the chapter sounds more like they are still trying than actually being together.
This is at least partially a lie. The decision was strongly influenced by Celestia herself, what she believed was best. And she seems to reconsider now. And on Sunsets part, it was also influenced by her guilt and thinking she doesn't deserve anything, not just "what is best".
Celestia actually was a good influence on Sunset in this chapter. Not sure if it was enough, though. Sunny is down in a deep dump
Sunset had to confront her Twilight memories. Is Twilight going to confront her Sunset memories somewhen?
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You're kind of aggressive towards opposing oppinions. All of that could have been formulated with a lot less snark.
That's two logical fallacies there, whatever they're called. (a) You make up an extreme opinion that no one else actually has. (b) you pretend the only other option is to agree with you.
1. Just because Sunset has her own ideas doesn't mean no one else is involved in her decisions. And Celestia is heavilly involved.
2. That reads like the "giving up Twilight" part is unimportant. I think both parts are important. (But thanks for pointing out the lost friendship part, I seem to ignore that a bit.)
Being there isn't her fault, but Twilight was afraid of Sunset's past, and for that she is to blame a bit. Though i wonder why Moondancer never mentioned to Twilight that (her relationship with) Sunset was improving, what with the tutoring and all.
8983222
It could have been formulated any manner of ways, but snark is one of my coping mechanisms. As to aggression, don't project. I didn't downvote or directly respond to anyone (not that I'm saying you downvoted me but someone felt offended enough by my opinion to do so, which is okay!). You're the one responding to me and telling me how to formulate my arguments. I posited my opinion on the matter, based on what I'm seeing in the story and discussion, nothing more. You, on the other hand, singled out my response to argue with. And that's fine, by the way. I don't like being told how to talk, but to the rest of what you're saying: you have some good points.
To the argument itself: I do not believe you can blame Celestia for this mess without assuming Sunset to be lacking agency of her own. This is not because Celestia did nothing, rather because assigning blame is a waste of time, nothing more than catharsis. It won't fix what's wrong with Sunset. No pony's an island, of course Sunset's issues have many contributing factors. Examples:
No one's yelling at her parents, but I can point to several places in her inner dialogue across Wavelengths that show those two really messed her up. Why not drag them center stage?
What about Moon Dancer? It was established she preferred stallions all but exclusively (previous fic in the timeline); this crush on Twi didn't really come to light until Sunset dragged her back into their circle. If Twi was so important to Moonie, why was Sunset the catalyst? But I don't read any of that... just threats and the like at Celestia, all over a single line of dialogue. That's all it took to turn her into a Death Eater. And you call my argument a Straw Man? Speaking of...
a) You're thinking of Straw Man, I think, though the second fallacy I don't know.
b) No one has to agree with me. I put forth my opinion on the matter. If you don't agree, so what? I think you're wrong. So what? You think I am. So what? That's all fine. It's a debate over a divisive story. We don't have to agree and that doesn't mean I don't respect the other opinions here, even if I disagree with them. No worries.
1. Yes, Celestia is involved. Many ponies are, as I touched on. That doesn't mean she's to blame, though. I'm sorry; I don't get what your point is here, or how it helps address the conflict.
2. I didn't say disregard either part. I said I find one to be more important than the other, based on Sunset's reactions to what she saw while spying. You find the other part more important? Okay. Based on Sunset's reasoning for giving up on Twilight romantically, I don't agree. Her guilt needs to be addressed before we can get to what that guilt has led her to do. Giving up Twilight is the symptom, not the illness. How is blaming/attacking Celestia going to address that guilt? It won't. So I disregard such actions. You find them both equally important? Well, that's reasonable. However, I'd say addressing the relationship is just triage. Without the root cause being handled, the wound will stay open... because Sunny keeps picking the scabs.
Yes, but her guilt over once being horrible is nothing new, and it's never crippled her to this extent. Occasional panic attack, sure, but this sort of melancholia? Nah. What I take from that is that Sunset sees what happened in the following manner: 'Even when I'm trying to be good, and make friends and socialize and be a better pony, I'm still cursed to ruin lives and friendships. This was after I'd started trying to be better, but... I can't escape who I was, ever.' As to the communication breakdown between Moonie and Twi... yeah I agree that's on them, same as I felt about Starlight and Sunburst. So something drew them apart... they still let it happen when they didn't have to. There's blame to go around.
Twi and Moonie acknowledged that and reconciled at dinner. Because they were willing to hear each other, though it was close. That's when Sunset broke down... upon hearing their own near breakdown over why they'd lost touch. Now, do you honestly think that Sunset simply lost it at that point because they were working out? Her facade finally dropped because she realized the date wouldn't flop? I don't believe that; I don't believe her motivations for giving up on Twilight were that disingenuous. I give her more credit than that. That in mind, her guilt is the root cause here, the only thing worth blaming and attacking. Celestia? Moon Dancer? Her parents? Her other friends? ...Philomena??? ...Red herrings, one and all.
...In my opinion.
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Well, Celestia is one of the things to blame, even if not the thing. I quite agree with your list of others to blame. But she did help causing this situation by making sure Sunset and Twilight don't get together by advising against it and then later pushing Moondancer in. I'm not saying she's a bad pony because of it, she said it herself up there: She did what she believed was best. Even if we don't know what exactly she wanted to achieve, and how. It just turned out very bad for Sunset.
Yep, pretty sure this is what hit her so hard. She was already feeling bad because she gave away Twilight, and then that old story comes up, wich is something she pretty much already knew but suppressed.
I'm not sure what can help Sunset overcome her crushing guilt at this point. My best bet is that Twilight is somehow involved. She's in a position of knowing Sunset extremely well, even if she too suppresses that. She's more neutral than Sunset herself about this and could use it to talk to her.
And i don't mind a discussion with differing opinions, you point out some good stuff. But the tone makes the music, so yes, i downvoted you entirely because of the aggressiveness. I very much prefer civil discussions.
8983374
As I said, folks can downvote all they like; it's nothing I'd ever worry about. All it says is: someone disliked what you said or how you said it. I'm okay with that. I don't go out of my way to get it... but I'm okay with it happening.
I'm not so much defending Celestia (though I am, no point denying that) as saying 'blame' is a secondary concern, yet one far too many people prioritize, both here and in general. I made that list (including Philomena as my joke entry... or is it...) to make the point that yes, I can think of several who bear some responsibility for her current mental state (though none so much as herself). Deciding which one is top, or even just listing them to her, wouldn't mean a thing right now, and that includes blaming her, which I do without malice. Identifying the shooter doesn't extract the bullet. Work the problem.
Example... and we'll use Celestia since she's the easiest target here. What's the gripe about her? Right, that bit of advice, that one line of dialogue. It wasn't an order, it was advising caution. In the past, Sunset was more than confident enough to weigh Celestia's advice and even her orders and disregard them as she pleased. Even in Royal Prerogative, well after her attitude adjustment, she knowingly overstepped her bounds accepting that there'd be consequences. This time? Following to the letter... and beyond. Why? Nothing changed about Celestia (she's pretty old, not likely to do so too much), so that's not it. Only other player in the mix is Sunset. Twilight would've said yes a couple chapters ago, had Sunset asked her out. The 'caution' advisement had been more than heeded; they hadn't just jumped into
beda relationship. So Sunset's the problem here... and her issue is with the possibility of damaging those around her by getting too close, particularly those she's already hurt in the past. Granted, in Twilight's case, only incidentally. For the real deal, see Raspberry Tart, or Lemon Hearts. Now Sunset can hide behind 'doing what you said' all she wants... but the reason isn't blind obedience. The only thing that would compel that from her is... the very wound that needs mending.8983581
But...but...playing the blame game is fun! And there's plenty of blame to pass around!
But yeah, the core of the problem is Sunsets guilt complex, and as that mental health issue is the result of her reforming, the only thing to blame is the lack of psychological care. Do they even have psychologists in Equestria?
8983633
Depends on the fic... the show doesn't need them because they recover immediately from everything... so sometimes fics throw a ton of psychological trauma at the characters without the logical supply of professionals that would meet the demand said trauma creates. Now... whether that's the case here or it simply hasn't occurred to any of them to send Sunny to talk with a counselor or whatnot (setting aside whether she'd go, also)... that I can't answer.
Although...
Word of God confirms Philomena true villain!*Runs away from Novel, laughing maniacally*
The only thing that lessens the sting of pain — whatever the source — is distance, and no distance is more final than the distance of time.
Cherish the pain you feel in your life along with the pleasures; the sorrow along with the joy. We experience each of these only as moments, and with every moment that comes, the one before it is gone and you will never know it again.
Dust in the wind.
I hope Sunset can overcome this.
I wonder if she's still convinced that she didn't make one in allowing Sunset to force Twilight away due to a misconception that she not only refused to clear up, but actively encouraged; that being that the after-effects of the harmonizing mind-meld event had not yet faded (It had, months ago even) and because of that they couldn't trust their own (completely genuine, uninfluenced) feelings towards each-other.
I'm still convinced that this all stems from some subconscious to be punished for her role in Luna's fall, which she is attempting to realize vicariously through Sunset. It's been a nearly thousand years, she's had a long time to bury those feelings deep down inside herself, she might even think what she did actually was for Sunset's own good (because nothing says "emotional stability" like being told by your mentor and mother-figure that you have to cast aside your heart's desire because it is your heart's desire) but like she so tellingly quoted, "[the pain] is never gone."
It's funny (in a cosmic sort of way) how perfectly it all lined up to mirror what she regards as her greatest failure:
Sun-Pony and Moon-Pony are best friends, like sisters even.
Some-Pony comes along whom both Sun-Pony and Moon-Pony desire the attentions of
Some-Pony is, due to circumstances beyond the control of all three, drawn to Sun-Pony over Moon-Pony.
A thousand years ago, Some-Pony (In this case referring to Equestria at-large) was allowed to react naturally to those circumstances (being a diurnal species) and focused their attention largely on Sun-Pony (Celestia) over Moon-Pony (Luna). Things got somewhat out-of-hoof, and as a result Moon-Pony (Luna) fell to darkness and jealousy.
More recently, Celestia (no longer the relevant Sun-Pony) noticed the circumstances (the harmonizing mind-meld event) that would lead Some-Pony (Twilight Sparkle) to choose Sun-Pony (Sunset Shimmer) over Moon-Pony (Moondancer), and took actions to counter (by revealing information that caused them to mistrust the feeling that arose from it) and invert (by withholding certain details in such a way that they maintained that mistrust far longer that was actually warranted) them. Things have gotten somewhat out-of-hoof, and as a result Sun-Pony (Sunset Shimmer) has fallen into guilt and self-loathing.
In both cases, Celestia's actions or lack-thereof causes significant emotional distress for somepony she cares for, and while there is no way to truly know how things would have gone if she had acted differently, I would hardly call the results she did get ideal.
tl;dr My feelings towards Celestia have intensified from "whap upside the head with a rolled-up newspaper" to "throttle like a rubber chicken" because she seems to be unconsciously forcing her own guilt and self-loathing onto Sunset. Perhaps she should make sure her own wounds have been properly treated, before trying to "help" others with theirs.
Whoa.
That's vicious, even for Evil Sunset.
Up till now, it's always seemed like Evil Sunset's browbeating was linked directly to her efforts to convince Sunset that they should return to how they were.
But there doesn't seem to be any higher motive here.
This just seems... spiteful.
LMAOOO I'm cracking up because of this chapter AHAHAHAHHA AND SO IS MY HEART HAHHAHAHAHAHA