Let's Discuss Why Equestria No Longer Exists In G5 and What I Think Might Have Happened · 7:20pm Aug 13th, 2021
NOTE: ALL ART IS NOT MINE
So as we have learned both during and before the trailer of MLP: The Next Generation, The Kingdom of Equestria doesn't exist anymore. The three ponies races have separated into different communities that fear each other, and there are no alicorns to unite them. Worst of all, the three races seemed to have lost their magic with unicorns being unable to use magic and pegasi being unable to fly (Save for a few it seems). Naturally, the one question on everyone's mind is...What happened that caused this? MLP Friendship Is Magic ended in what seemed like a new golden age not just for Equestria, but for the world as all races and creatures seemed to be united in friendship under the wise teachings of Princess Twilight Sparkle? So what happened that caused this?
Well, let's talk about it and come up with some possible answers.
First, I would check out the G5 trailer if you haven't already:
So let's first recap what happened in the last two episodes of G4. The Mane Six, along with every friend and ally they ever made, helped defeat the Terrible Trio of the villains Chrysalis, Cozy Glow, and Tirek and turned them into stone. Twilight finally was confident and ready to become the new ruler of Equestria as Princesses Celestia and Luna retired. And the last episode showed the various characters both older and happy with their new lives while Twilight took on a personal apprentice while the School of Friendship opened itself more to other creatures and more students showing that Twilight's vision for not just the school, but Equestria, had come true and was working out.
It was a heart warming ending.
So what went wrong?
Well, first let's take what we know from G5.
1. We know that this takes place long, and I mean, LONG after G4. We don't have a set amount of years, but the years of G4 are said to be called "Ancient Equestria" meaning that it has to take place a thousand years minimum or even longer then that. Technology had advance to the point that it is very much how modern society is today. There are cellphones, electricity is more advance, greater scopes of art and architecture, television, and so forth. this is most likely due to the fact the other races needed to compensate for the lack of their magic, but more on that later.
2. There are no alicorn ponies. It's typically seen that alicorns are the rulers of Equestria due to the fact that they have the traits of all the three races, powerful magic, and long lifespans. While most of the time it seems that the position of royalty is given via master and apprentice as was the case with Twilight earning her crown from Celestia and Luna, there is also natural bloodline heritage as we can see in one of the easter eggs of the final episode of MLP where it is hinted that Flurry Heart, Cadence and Shining Armor's daughter, inherited the throne of the Crystal Empire.
We know that there are two ways to make alicorns, the first is by inventing a new kind of magic/magic finding you worthy of becoming one. And the second, and rare one, is being born as one. So what happened to the alicorns? Did they die out? Were no other ponies worthy of becoming alicorns? Twilight was training an apprentice, but was she qualified to become an alicorn as well? Or any future apprentice for that matter? Also, did Twilight have children? Or did Flurry Heart? What if she had also siblings? We sadly don't know these things, but it does help show that alicorns are very much needed for Equestrian society to continue onward.
3. No Wendigos, so why no frozen wasteland. In G4, it's shown that if Equestria is not united their old enemies, the Wendigos, try to freeze everything. Well, nothing is frozen now and there are no signs the Wendigos exist. Did they also die out or did Equestria defeat them for good? Or maybe the rest of Equestria is a frozen wasteland save for this small area? It's very much hinted that while these three communities of ponies exist separately from each other, they don't make ALL of Equestria. They make a very small part of it. Are there other separated communities of the various pony races? Maybe that's what the future G5 show will be about after the movie? Uniting every separated area of Equestria and making it a united nation once again starting with the three shown in the film. Not to mention each new area would help give clues as to what happened to their land? If that's true, I look forward to that.
4. Twilight and her friends exist in memory and tales so what happened to them? We know this is a continuation of G4 and it seems that The Mane Six have faded into legend. Whether anyone really thinks they exist or they are a myth is unknown, but there are enough clues that show that his is the same universe as them. Obviously, due to not being alicorns or the long lived creatures, everyone from Applejack to Gallus has passed away at this point. Which leads to the question of what happened to those who are long lived such as Twilight, Spike, Celestia, Luna, Smolder, Ember, etc. Even if Twilight wasn't ageless or long lived like the others, that still begs the question of what happened? And are any of the remaining long lived creature still around. There are fans hoping a more elderly Spike will make an appearance, but who knows.
5. No magic. It's gone. Not just the Magic of Friendship, but magic in general. Unicorns can't cast spells. Pegasi can't fly (Save for a few it seems) and I don't know what the Earth Ponies lost, but they seem to be affected too. It also looks like Cutie Marks are lost as well, so ponies have to find their own jobs and careers in life without knowing their special talents and destinies. Since Equestria was a society that ran such things, could it have collapsed when something costed them all their magic? Could they have blamed each other for it? We saw that in the Hearths Warming Eve episode that the three races blamed each other for the endless winter, whose to say they would do such a thing again? Especially if there are no alicorns to mediate it all? Or what if an alicorn was to blame for it all?
6. Where are the other races? If this is G4's world, and it's very heavily implied to be, then were are the other races? The Changelings, Dragons, Griffins, Zebras, Yaks, Hippogriffs, Kirins, Diamond Dogs, Crystal Ponies, Abyssinian, and more. They haven't been seen yet. Are they gone as well? Did they leave for their lands again once Equestria fell apart? Or do they exist in Equestria in their own separated communities? If the Ponies of Equestria are now afraid of each other, I imagine they are even more afraid of non-ponies which could mean that their acceptance of other races has fallen apart and xenophobia could be the new norm.
Alright so there are a few other things, but these are the main ones that we've come to find in the G5 information we've been given. While I am sure everyone has their own theory, and you are free to give it down below, this is mine:
My Theory: The Lack of Alicorn Royalty
Now, I know its kinda unfair to compare how human civilization works compared to a fictional one like Equestria, but let's keep in mind something. Every Empire, Nation, and Civilization meets their end. Some a lot sooner then others. The average time for a nation to last before its decline is typically around 250 years, but they can still survive around that. The longest human civilization/empire in history, from start to finish is the Pandyan Empire of India from 500 BC to 1350 AD. That's 1850 years. So it's not impossible for a nation to last 1000 years, which Equestria was doing so around the time of G4.
However, the one constant thing about Equestria was that it was run by a specific group of rulers: Alicorns. It's implied that Earth Ponies, Unicorns, and Pegasi tried to create a democratic council of some sort at first for Equestria, but it wasn't working. They needed a unified leader to keep them united that could share all their traits, thus Princess Celestia and Princess Luna. Both alicorns, both able to wield the sun and the moon, and both trained by the various heroes and sages of Equestria to give them the wisdom and strength to rule equally.
Now, one thing we Westerners sometimes forget is that while Democracy and Republics work well for us (most of the time), it doesn't always work well for other cultures. Some nations are just better of being Monarchies or other forms of government. Equestria seems to be that kind of same mentality. After all, having a near ageless benevolent monarch is probably one of the best governments you can ever get. And it seems that the trend was going to continue with Flurry Heart becoming the ruler of the Crystal Empire, and Twilight as the new ruler of Equestria as a whole. However, there are no alicorns in G5, or at least we haven't seen one. To become an Alicorn, you need to develop new magic, be choose by destiny, or be born as one. What if, at some point, no other pony was found worthy of becoming an Alicorn? This would cause the entire government of Equestria to fall apart. Maybe at some point the ponies wanted to try ruling without them, but there was corruption, scandals, and bickering that resulted in the nation falling apart.
So what caused there to be no more alicorns? It could be that nobody was really just worthy and the ones that did died out. Ponies got lazy, arrogant, and maybe became to prideful that they didn't think that they could fail. Arrogance comes before the fall and many nations who believe they will last forever often get suddenly silenced and fall apart. It could also be that they just died out. While there is a possibility that Twilight and Flurry Heart's bloodline could continue after their deaths, that doesn't mean that they are alicorns? After all, it's very rare to the point that Flurry was the first one to even born an alicorn. Whose to say that such a thing didn't happen a second time? Just because Twilight had an apprentice doesn't means he might be worthy of becoming an alicorn as well. It could be that, after Twilight died, there was just nobody worthy enough to take her place so they tried to make a new form of government, but it failed.
There is also the possibility that Twilight, or whoever was its last ruler, had to stop a greater villain then ever before via sacrifice. One that caused so much devastation and destruction that Equestria just couldn't recover as a united nation and fell apart, especially if it affect their magic. Equestria was balkanized and each separated town now had to rebuilt themselves again with history lost save for the tales that they grew up on. Or a villain manipulated events to the point where the entire separation of Equestria was there idea. It could even be that a future alicorn princess did so on purpose. There are darker ways to become an alicorn, we saw that with Cozy Glow, and its possible that they were sealed but at a great cost, maybe the life of Twilight or whoever was the last alicorn, and this villain still lingers waiting to strike.
And then there is the big possibility.
War.
War is inevitable. It happens. A war so devastating that it changed everything. Equestria falls apart, blame is given, creatures and races flee to different lands, history is lost, government shattered, and the world is changed. The war could be against anything. It could be a civil war of some kind in Equestria, a world war where peace between the races was shattered, or it could be an invasion from creatures from a different land or even dimension. Maybe even the ancient evils from Tartarus were unleashed upon the world. Regardless, wars have a way of resetting the world and much can be lost or forgotten. It could be that everything that was taught and gained was lost as a result of this war.
Overall, this is what I feel is the most likely scenario that caused Equestria to fall apart. The lack of alicorns. How that came to be, there are various ways, but this is what I think to be the strongest theory. What do you think? Is there valid claims to this? More evidence that I missed? Or do you have a different theory?
No war and non of the weird stuf you described, just after twilight passed the torch to, for the lack of anypony else lets say Luster, when Luster passed down the torch they had a problem with the new ruller and so either discord or screwball, because I think she is just the next spirit of chaos in case Discord expires, helped them to deliver or they themself delivered revenge on the idiots that ruined the leadership of equestria, it may or may not involve Heaven and it may or may not be continued by that grey unicorn with the arcade, Heaven realy keeping the royal title because she may have been friends with the last alicorn and feels that this is her duty, but it also could be what you just said, tough I have to remind you that even if a country changes it's political system and basically becomes a new one, case in point pick any European country, they still exist trough their people so...
That sounds like a sound theory. I could see the nation of equestria falling apart from a lack of alicorns.
There being a Pillars of Equestria type deal, where the Elements or the Princesses being forced to sacrifice themselves, but not die, seems like the most likely scenario and the most in-universally consistent. Having Equestria disintegrate due to lack of strong leadership and a failing democracy or a war is a very good explanation when you apply real world logic, but you cannot apply real world logic to MLP and the two hypotheticals that you have listed, while they are logically sound and maybe even likely, they seem too grim to be the in-universe explanation. Unless Hasbros is gearing this generation to a more mature audience.
The most interesting thing to me is that their world seems to have developed more, have to wonder if it's actually better in the long term that they lost the alicorns. It kinda hints that they had some role in keeping their civilization stuck in technological stasis.
I think the most likely scenario and/or the most logical one would be a great evil/apocalyptic event that required immense sacrifice. IE maybe Twilight/the alicorns/elements died to some evil that caused magic to cease functioning. Considering how vital natural magic is to the g4 era that along with the central leadership of Equestria for thousands of years dying out that could easily cause a dark age where individual parts of Equestria simply devolved into nation states.
I feel like war or a political failing of democracy is a little too mature for MLP unless they decided to fully lean into an adult audience. A legend about magic and hero characters sacrificing is a standard tried and true plot scenario that isn’t excessively mature for a young audience while also have enough wiggle room the be interesting for an older audience.
Okay so I got a wild Theory but hear me out. What if when Fluttershy dies Discord loses his mind again and destroys all magic I mean he is a self-proclaimed God of Chaos after all And I do mean all magic. that includes chaos magic which means it would be a form of suicide. That also means no changelings they run on Magic no ancient dragons their longevity is due to Magic.
If this wildness actually turns out to be correct I don't even know what to say other than shit his parting words would probably be this.
I’m gonna drain your heart dry.
I'm going to lap up every drop of hope and love and feel it run down my chin.
I’m going to turn stallions into beasts and ruin their Mares and spit poison into their fole's
I’m going to scorch the earth with proper Old Testament despair
And teach them that the Gods are there to be feared
And everything you love will die,
And everything you’re scared of will come true.
I bet something happened at Canterlot somewhere between 1,000 to 2,000 years while Princess Twilight is still on the throne, despite that her closest friends and family are all nothing but a distant memory. Maybe a mysterious incident occurred at Canterlot that cause the last ruler of Equestria to disappear completely, resulting in the downfall of Friendship all over the pony lands and the complete loss of magic. In addition, the other races were being forced to leave Canterlot due to the fact that Equestria's friendship society was collapsing. Who knows? It's just my guess.
My theory is that the event of FIM were fiction/had many details lost to the ages, thus the setting never really got the lasting happy ending portrayed in S9. It would explain how it's supposed to be the same setting as FIM and Pony Life despite being separate continuities (the claim was made by a spokesperson who may not get how continuity works) and the absents of alicorns and other races (who would at least be in their stories and myology unless there's a deliberate attempt to censor history).
The decline of nations/civilizations and related is a level of politics/realism the show never had, but it was high-quality enough we could project such. I'm not seeing anything to suggest that's changing given it's still targeting younger audiences, nor explains the change from G4 that's the hook for older ones.
I'm hoping that G5 creates a more mature and serious storyline like the one you described, without it coming across as too morose and preachy.
I think magic just completely disappearing would be a good way of setting the scene for the new Equestria, and while a bit dark so they’d probably never do it if that same magic is what keeps Alicorns living such a long time then in one day Equestria would look all it’s magical enchantments, it’s ability to control the weather, the magic EPs use to grow food so fast and it’s leadership.
Not to mention all Pegasi who would be flying/on clouds at the time would fall from the sky as well as cloudsdale itself. Ponies would starve, turn on each other and the other races who has once been there allies. No more weather control would lead to uncontrollably crazy weather that would do who knows what to their cities.
Btw I’m one of those fans who wanna see Older Spike, be a great way to connect the who generation
My theory is that Hasbro got lazy and decided that the easiest way to create conflict for their new show was to make everything Twilight and the others did ultimately amount to nothing because f*** you give us money.
In one of the episodes (I think season 7), it showed that discord could actually fade if he didn't cause enough chaos. I wonder if the other alicorns faded too somehow?
I could see Discord wanting to fade / die along side fluttershy or soon after, and for Celestia and Luna fading after giving the ownership of the sun and moon to twilight, but I wonder what happened to the rest of them?
The crystal empire didn't seem like it would have collapsed any time soon, and twilight would have planned for some contingencies if she bit the dust or have spike run things in her stead. But we don't see any of them at all.
Also, in the absence of the alicorns, who is moving the sun and moon?
One thing I don;t think anyones concidered, regarding the magic loss is, if you've seen the Equestria girls films, you'll remember that magic was leaking out of equestria and onto the earth it was linked to and it seemed that the ponies were in no hurry to plug that leak.
Tireks actions show that magic was possibly finite...it could be a simple case that so much magic leaked through that the magical field on equestria couldn't sustain itself and failed.
By the time anypony realised the problem, it was too late.
It also brings up the thought that, if this is the case, earth on the other side of the mirror might be in dire straights themselves from all the magic. The EqG films already cover a few incidents of that nature and the leak was barely a trickle. Imagine the mayhem once there was enough mana on earth to start causing real mayhem.
I think you're on the right track. The entire Earth Pony town freaked out over a singular unicorn. Pegasi live in zephyr heights, which used to be the Unicorn city of Canterlot! Futhermore, Unicorns are relegated to a backwater forest.
My guess is that after Twilight's time, the Unicorns started getting uppity and the other races banded together and stopped them. The ensuing war while successful against the Unicorns, drove a wedge between the other two races. This would explain why Unicorns are the worst off, and actively and literally demonized.
I think the catalyst to this whole thing can be summed up with a single question. Who controls the sun and moon? If we can assume Sun and Moon Butts are also long gone, then that duty/power would reside with whoever had control of the gadget Twi was given.
In short, after Twi passed, the gadget became a war macguffin, and left with the only race with the ability to craft the necessary magic to operate it. The power went to their heads and.... yeah.
But hey. It's just a theory. A PONE theory!
I'll see myself out.
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Has it been established that Zephyr Heights is Canterlot?
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A video by Dr Wolf pointed two things out.
1) it is a city jutting out of the side of a mountaintop, like Canterlot.
2) We've only seen rudimentary maps so far, but the locations seem to match.
Nothing official by any means, that's my current headcanon and I'm sticking with it.
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I still stand by another interpretation that, chances are, I might be alone in this one.
Suppose that in this modern Equestria, ponies would look at Twilight Sparkle, her friends, and her adventures in the same way that we see King Arthur. Someone that there are many tales and stories about where each generation changes them somewhat. After all, for all we know with all the toys and merchandise, Twilight is seen as a fictional character of a supposed historical figure from long ago. And our main characters from this new generation are trying to live up to those ideals, regardless if it's real or not.
It just occurred to me, no Alicorn successor to Twilight (or even Celestia and Luna for that matter) and all Unicorns lost their magic right?
Who/what is keeping the sun and moon spinning?
I have a series of events I think would be cool to see in G5. This is not a prediction or anything, just a concept I think is neat.
Equestria balkanized after a great evil came, which caused the alicorns to fail, flee, or be banished. Perhaps Celestia and Luna were divine beings, though not gods, and sacrificed their bodies to balance the cosmos, creating the cycles of day and night. Perhaps this was done after the magic began slipping away, and was a last ditch effort to bring another tomorrow. This is juat a simple backstory that could be plausible in the series.
As for G5 itself, I would be pleased very much so if there was an overarching storyline that was advanced toward in certain episodes, much like Season 4 of FiM was. It would be really cool if, throughout the series, the efforts of the main cast caused magic to begin to bleed back into the world. It would probably take a long time for ponies to realize, as they don't even try magic anymore, but eventually as the magic bleeds back, spells become a thing again, ponies can fly again, and cutie marks become more and more common.
This would also awaken the ancient evil, eventually, and the ancient and modern worlds would have to join together to defeat the force of evil once and for all.
Anyway, I just find this concept pretty neat.
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Perhaps there's an ancient machine because Twilight Sparkle wanted to be able to sleep in...
This is more of a headcanon than an actual theory, but it was a concept I had in mind since Gen 5 was announced and I think it could be a very interesting direction to take the story.
So, are any of you familiar with Malekith from Warhammer Fantasy? Assuming you're not, here is a summary of his story:
Malekith was the only son of Aenarion and his second wife Morathi. Aenarion was a great hero and ruler of the Elves, who led the war against the Daemons of Chaos invading from the North and South Poles (long story). During the war, Aenarion's first wife and their two sons were massacred by Daemons (the sons, Teclis and Tyrion, actually were saved by a bunch of genocidal tree people but that isn't important), which sent Aenarion on a path of vengeance, marrying the gold digger Morathi and becoming influenced by the Elven God of Murder Khaine. Eventually, Aenarion sacrificed himself to help create a giant vortex to filter out most Chaos magic out of the world.
Malekith, who had grown into a handsome young man highly skilled in diplomacy and warfare, believed that he, as Aenarion's last remaining son (Tyrion and Teclis were still hanging out with Hippies and Nazi Ents in Vietnam), was going to become the next Phoenix King of the Elves, but the nobles collectively agreed that they needed more of a Bernie Sanders than a Ronald Reagan so they elected someone else as the Phoenix King and politely told Malekith to cancel his coronation party. Malekith at first accepted it like a champ but over time his jealousy and entitlement were stroked by his mother until he eventually had enough and started a full-on civil war over the crown, splitting the Elven race into the Dark Elves and High Elves (three guesses which group supported Malekith, and the first two don't count).
So, how is any of this important to Gen 5? Simple. I believe the MLP universe had its own Malekith.
According to this theory, there existed a descendant of Twilight Sparkle (Twilight's own child, Flurryheart's, or maybe even Spike's child) who, for the sake of simplicity, I will call Prodigal. Prodigal, being directly related to Twilight by blood (or via adoption if we're going the Spike's kid route), would believe that he was entitled to the throne of Equestria by birthright, but, like how it was implied in The Last Problem, Twilight would elevate Luster to Alicornhood and set her up to take her place. Recognizing what was going to eventually happen and feeling betrayed by his mother/aunt/grandmother, Prodigal would then gather up a bunch of allies and followers and attempt a coup that would then become a devastating civil war which would cause the downfall of Equestria.
This could explain some of the reasons why the world in Gen 5 is this way, like:
1. Why are the pony races divided? Earth Ponies, Pegasi and Unicorns could have fought for different sides of the war, leading to hatred naturally developing as a product of differing loyalties, and/or Prodigal could have spread propaganda pitting the three pony tribes against each other to weaken Equestria.
2. Why is there no magic? Since the Loyalists would've 100% had all of the princesses, Discord and the Elements on their side, Prodigal could have succeeded in casting the same spell Cozy Glow attempted in School Raze to even the odds.
3. Where are the other creatures? Depending on how they decided to approach the civil war in Equestria, they could've either A) Joined Twilight's side and they had been genocided by Prodigal's forces; B) Joined Prodigal's side and were exiled from Equestria; or C) Stayed neutral and left Equestria as to not be affected by the conflict.
4. What happened to the Alicorns? Since all Alicorns would most likely join Twilight if that type of civil war happened, and Prodigal's anger would have been directed at Twilight and Luster specifically, they would have been top priority targets for assassination attempts, maybe even before the rebellion fully began.
5. What happened to X character? War is a bloody thing, and no doubt there would've been many casualties on both sides if something like that happened. And if Prodigal won, many characters who most likely had supported Twilight would be probably executed or at least imprisoned for a while by the new regime.
Now, the question remains, which side would have won the war? I'm personally leaning in the direction of a rebel victory for the story potential. That while Sunny and friends are adventuring in Maretime Bay and Zephyr Heights, deep in the north, in the great city that once was the Crystal Empire, there exists a kingdom ruled over by a bitter prince, haunted by the ghosts of friends and family members he killed for the crown atop his head.
Edit: Found a song that perfectly represents this
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Yeah, here's hoping for more serious villains and are actually a real threat. Because MLP G4 villains were some much pretty a far cry from the more dangerous and threatening villain of other IPs. Due to keeping it rated G or PG. Just saying.
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The alicorns might be hiding in exile and keeping things running.
After seeing the movie, it's amusing how this thread puts more thought, logic, and speculation into what happened between G4 than G5 than the actual movie does, because it says exactly nothing on the subject.
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Yeah, I loved the movie myself, but it's clear the writers don't want to talk about the inbetween stuff at least as of yet.
Also am I the only one who is wondering where the hell did the Alicorn Crystal come from?
I have two theories on what happened...
01: The G5 setting is on a colony world. Since Equestria has a magical mirror linking it to a high-tech human world, it's only a matter of time before they get high-tech into their world. They would have built spaceships. Since they can combine tech with magic. Using this "magitech" breaking the light barrier would have been easy.
Thus, they could have sent ships out to colonize the galaxy. And maybe beyond. Into other galaxies.
The G5 world is a lost colony world. That lost touch with Equis. And their magitech degraded without replacement parts. Go ahead a few millennia... You have Sunny Starscout's world.
02: The G5 world is a colony on another part of Equis. Something happened, and they were trapped in a bubble that accelerated time inside. This also had the effect of dampening magic.
When Sunny Starscout "brought the magic back", she broke the time bubble. And ended the magic dampening effect. Twilight and her friends are alive and well, since only a little time went by for the outside world.
And that's my two theories on what happened to make the G5 world happen then.