Persona Supplementary #2: Wait, so God is evil now? · 5:56pm May 13th, 2019
I didn't know what I wanted to cover in my next supplementary blog, because the Persona series is such a convoluted series. It's great, and as I've said probably my most favorite series of all time right now, but I'm gonna be real with you. This series doesn't explain ANYTHING.
Thankfully, I'm a lore obsessive whore when it comes to fandoms I absolutely love, especially when the series involved has such a meaty lore that I can get full almost immediately and still be ready for more.
That... came out so wrong... Or right...?
Thankfully, Persona is one such series. So allow me to explain something that kind of gets explained, but not really in Persona. That being Gods, deities, archetypes, how all of this is related, why in every Persona game (except for Persona 3) the final enemy is a God or Goddess of some sort that decided to destroy all of humanity today, and why it's kinda sorta ACTUALLY humanity's fault this keeps happening.
Also, be advised again, spoilers for just about everything Persona related save for the Persona 6 duology.
(Seriously, read Persona 6 Reflect guys, he doesn't have the same writing style as me, but his story is really good, and I helped come up with some of the ideas for his story, so it gets my seal of approval.)
So remember our good friend Carl Gustav Jung? Well, he proposed that in the collective unconscious the things we know, believe, and hold dear to us are all centered around archetypes within the collective unconscious. For example the fact that a lot of heroes in ancient stories seem similar is based on a certain hero archetype, which is the basic template that all heroes draw from. Same for the ideas of what a Mother and Father are, and the roles associated with such. Think of them as starting points for everything you know to branch off from.
In Persona, we see the archetypes most commonly associated with the Tarot motif, which is actually pretty accurately portrayed. In Persona, all of the major characters you associate with are given a particular archetype in the form of one of the 22 major arcana in Tarot (and sometimes special arcana found in other tarot decks, such as the Jester/Hunger arcana for Tohru Adachi in Persona 4: Golden, and the Aeon Arcana for both Aigis and Marie in P3:FES and P4:Golden respectively).
Now, I get a lot of flack for my choices in Arcana. I'm serious, my first attempt at a Persona fanfiction got railed on hard by this one reviewer because I made Diamond Tiara the Tower Arcana, and I imagine a lot of people are really confused about my decision to make her the Priestess Arcana in Persona 6: REM. This is because of a misconception that the Arcana are based on personality. They're not. They're based more on the personality traits of the individual and where they are in their life in relation to the various protagonists. For example, the Magician Arcana represents someone like a performer putting on a show, both in how Trixie in Persona 6: REM is a performer in training, but also in the performance she puts out concerning her personality to hide how traumatized she is. Likewise, the Empress Arcana represents the most basic archetype for a mother, like how Ms. Tia is a mother figure both to the girls in the Starswirl Dorm and the students of Canterlot High as a whole. In fact, when you look at her, she kind of seems like a mother figure to just about everyone she associates with.
I'll cover the individual Tarot archetypes individually in different blogs (since I'm already biting off of Nenilein's style already 
) since each one could be a topic in of itself. Besides, we're here to talk about why Persona games always have you fight God at the end (except for Persona 3).
See, in Persona, Gods aren't the creators of the world like we all believe them to be. In fact, they didn't make us at all. In Persona, we made them. Each deity is an archetype in and of itself, representing collective beliefs within humanity. Whenever a new collective idea is formed by humanity, a new deity is made to represent that idea and enforce it. This means we have a sort of symbiotic relationship with the deities in Persona. We create them, but then their actions within the collective unconscious influence what goes on within humanity's psyche. Sometimes to scary degrees too.
For example, Yaldabaoth in Persona 5. He represented humanity's desire for someone who could tell them what to think. His influence is seen most prominently toward the end of the game, where Shido is openly shown by the Phantom Thieves to be a scumbag, but all of Japan still vouches for him even after hearing the truth from a trusted source. It was only after Yaldabaoth was destroyed that people started to question whether or not Shido was good after all, showing that his influence was taken away. Humanity can now think for itself.
In Persona 4, we get Izanami, who represented Inaba's collective desire for a protective and wish fulfilling mother. She created the fog because Inaba didn't want to see the truth of the world. They were perfectly content to live in a world shrouded in fog so they could just live in an illusion and believe what they wanted to believe. Mind you, unlike Yaldabaoth, she didn't directly control humanity, nor was she actually malevolent like said Demiurge. She was corrupted, and following what her archetype told her to enforce, but she wasn't actually evil per say. That's shown in the end if you complete Marie's Social Link, where it's implied that she came to represent Izanami as a whole, and is actually a really good entity.
I mean, seriously, am I the only one who actually likes her? I mean, granted she's a tsundere at it's finest, but I don't hate her for that. Then again, people say I can be kind of a tsundere too...
I keep mentioning that Persona 3 is an exception, because the final enemy of the main game scarily enough isn't a deity, despite being named after one. It would take another blog entirely to explain what Nyx is, and that will probably be the next blog I write, but just know that she's something completely different and existential, and is probably my favorite subject in all of Persona. What I can mention however this terrifying thing right here.
Yeah... you remember in my last blog, where I mentioned that this was the worst possible thing EVER in Persona? Ladies and gentlemen, I introduce you to the biggest issue in all of Persona. This is Erebus, humanities collective desire to die. See, in the end of Persona 3, you fight Nyx, or more directly, Nyx's main Avatar, because you can't actually fight Nyx herself. You'll understand why in the next supplementary blog. However, the reason why she's fought is to prevent something called the Fall, which is a terrible event where all of humanity's shadows are separated from their hosts, killing everyone on the planet. However, it's revealed that Nyx isn't even the problem, as she's not the one trying to bring about the fall. She was beckoned to do so, by Erebus. He exists for the sole purpose to beckon Nyx to bring about the fall. Yeah, that's it. That's his sole purpose for existing. Think about that.
See, turns out that... yeah, humanity kinda wants to die. At the very least, enough of the collective of humanity wants death, or is at the very least tired of living. Now, if you think that's bad enough, consider how deities are formed in the collective unconscious. If enough people ask for their existence, then they will come to be. Izanami came to be because Inaba was afraid to face the real world. Yaldabaoth came to be because humanity was tired of thinking for itself and wanted someone else to think for them. All of the deities in Persona exist because humanity wants them to, and defeating them doesn't outright destroy the ability to want that again. This means that if enough people in Inaba wish for Izanami to return, or enough people in Japan wish for Yaldabaoth to return, then these entities will return, and they will enforce their archetypes again. Not because they're evil, or because they outright want to, but because humanity asks for it, and their purpose is to give humanity what it desires.
Likewise the same can be said for Erebus as well. He is humanity's collective desire to die. This means that so long as even one person is tired of living, Erebus will always return if he's destroyed, ready to once again beckon Nyx to bring about the fall.
"But Azure, you lovable, sexy beast, if Erebus is begging Nyx for the fall, then why are we still alive?"
That's because of this right here:
I'll go into what, or more precisely who that is in the next supplementary blog. Just know that if not for that boy's sacrifice, we'd all be dead right now. So be ready for the next blog as I tackle EVERYTHING concerning with Nyx, Erebus, the Great Seal, and why all of this is relevant to Persona even today. Till then...
Pleasant dreams~
Okay this actually makes sense.
I don't know if I want to make a Jojoke or a Kingdom Hearts joke, both would fit very well.
Humanity's. Also, that would just be high schoolers during finals and college students.
Jesus Christ?
Joke's on you, I don't remember my dreams! So HA!
5058102
Yeah, the games never really explain this, so I understand your initial confusion. I too thought that Izanami or Yaldabaoth could be turned good in the end, but once I learned what they actually were in the series, it made sense. Glad I was able to clear that up for you.
5058104
Scarily enough... you're not too far off technically. That's not Jesus Christ exactly, but when you think about it...
Know what? You'll find out in the next supplementary blog.
5058108
Excellent. All is going as I have foreseen.
5058108
Makes it easier for my idea anyways, AKA saves my ass from a bad idea, so thanks.
5058110
You're welcome. Thank you for reading and enjoying my work.
5058114
No prob.
5058109
Calm your tits Light Yagami.
5058117
I was actually aiming for Palpatine. I have never seen any Death Note. I probably shou,d one day.
5058118
Eh.........
5058119
Not a big fan I take it?
5058121
It...... I can see the appeal.... but I don't really enjoy it that much. Only so much I can take from a villain protagonist before I go "WILL SOMEBODY SHOOT HIM?!"
5058122
You would not like Overlord then. Since the protagonist is a lich. Or Archlich rather. Also OP as shit.
5058123
Oh no that's different. That's fun.
5058124
While I certainly agree, especially with TFS Cooler voicing Ainz, I'm more than a little curious as to how exactly it's different.
5058125
Death Note is dark, dreary, and is written with an asshole as the protagonist. Overlord at least in this case it's awesome looking.... Death Note is more Noir based.
5058128
To be fair, Death Note is a Noir style story, Overlord is an isekai. Very different types of stories.
5058129
Yeah.... still. Death Note could've been a bit more tolerable.
5058104
I'm gonna have to correct you on the Kingdom Hearts thing. It's not that the series doesn't explain anything, it actually explains most plot points within the game those points occur. It just doesn't explain things WELL or in a clear manner the first time.
Case in point: Time Travel. When the concept is first introduced in Dream Drop Distance, it's not explained that well, merely that there needs to be a version of yourself existing at the time you travel to, without elaborating further. But in the mobile game? It actually fully explains the rules of Time Travel in Kingdom Hearts.
To shorten things, the main requirement to time travel is one must first abandon their body, becoming a disembodied heart. Becoming a Heartless and even dying counts for this (explains the game over screens, huh?). After doing so, they can travel to any point in time where a version of themselves exists. Once at that point in time, one is forbidden from rewriting pre-destined events, except for very rare exceptions. Upon returning to one's original point in time, they lose all memories from when they traveled, but the memories themselves are etched into their heart.
And that's the basics.
5058133
So it's less Kingdom Hearts doesn't explain, and more it explains badly.
5058134
Yeah. Pretty much.
5058108
And from what I know of Inzami in mythology the Persona version is a lot NICER, IE she doesn't want to kill at least 1K humans every so often to spite her husband Izanagi
Ahh yes, P3rotagonist. He turned himself into a doorstop for our suicidal thoughts.