The Common HiE and Me... · 5:29pm Jun 23rd, 2012
You know, I'm getting sick and tired of hearing people whine that HiE fics are always the same, what with Brony getting to Equestria for no reason, and fucking the next mare that comes their way with no cohesiveness whatsoever.
Here's what I think an HiE fic should be...
1) The human should NOT be the first ever to exist. Why? Somepony was ALREADY THERE.
Say hello to "Megan" the first human to ever exist in MLP at all. So when people say their "Original Character" is the first, GUESS AGAIN.
2) The human CAN have a marefriend...BUT! It should have consequences.
"Geon! What do you mean?"
Well first off, what do people think when they see "Furries"? They often get hated on, cussed out, and sometimes, even hurt! Now, it's usually the same for gays, too! Even lesbians! Now think about this: What happens when two COMPLETELY different species date, or even you-know-what?
SHIT HITS THE FANS.
I'm talking about ponies flaming on the human, calling him/her a devil for corrupting a mare/stallion! And the Mare to be called out as "Betraying her pony kind". This may not be earth, but by Celestia's Mane, these ponies act practically like US.
3) The Brony/Pegasister should NOT be able to "call upon the elements of harmony" and use it like a fucking super saiyan. Holy shit, this goes far overboard. First off, your character isnt powerful. It's a human with (more than likely) No weapons, no way to defend himself whatsoever, unless given a gift that is explainable, and not bullshit. I dont need to see
"And then they Kung-fu fighted".
That's the dumbest hunk of shit I ever saw in a fic. UNACCEPTABLE.
This is just the TIP of the iceberg that should be changed in my view on HiE. Please, comment below, tell me what YOU hate in common HiE lore!
Well, luckily for me, I have yet to encounter all the crap that people complain about when talking about HiE's. That might be because I avoid Romance tags like the plague, especially when there is also a Human tag. But still. All the HiE's I've read have been pretty solid.
How the human is more than likely accepted almost instantly by the general pony populace.
191641 Good thing too.
I've been seeing less and less of, well, Up there, and actual thought process involved.
Of course, I've yet to see a Romance Human fic that has actual depth. It would be nice.
191643 ooh, that IS a good point!
I mean, I can understand them getting accepted, but there should at least be some protest or something, like:
"Oh! Mommy! Look at the silly monkey!"
"What IS that thing?"
"That come by my house, I kill it!"
YOU HEAR THAT GUYS?
LISTEN TO HIM!
HE KNOWS WHAT MOST OF YOU DON'T!
191649 Pfffffft! hahahahahahahahahaha!
You deserve a hat, boy.
191650 Do it. Lemme hear it.
I want to write an HiE now.
I feel like some of my faith in humans has been restored.
I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT'S GOING ON.
191657 Do it.
images.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/10064681.jpg
191660 DUCK SEASON.
191664
images.cryhavok.org/d/13224-1/Rabbit+Season+Animated.gif
191663 I'll try, but I'm not that great an author. I still don't have Internet on my comp, so. I have ALMOST no distractions.
I'll get started later. After I get something to eat.
The Brony/Pegasister should NOT be able to "call upon the elements of harmony" and use it like a fucking super saiyan. Holy shit, this goes far overboard. First off, your character isnt powerful. It's a human with (more than likely) No weapons, no way to defend himself whatsoever, unless given a gift that is explainable, and not bullshit. I dont need to see
Why can't a human use the elements?
191643 The same way they accept a fucking Minotaur!
191685
different as in being--I dunno-- smaller, weaker, hell of a lot quieter and completely lacking in horns
We're not that special and not that scary, generally.
we're just hairless apes (not monkeys)
Ironwill managed to get up on stage and deliver a seminar. Nopony lost their shit over how he had hands or walked on two legs.
That's all fan overeaction.
I don't write HiE and I never will...I don't give a fuck about it.
I just don't like the completely irrational stances people take on both sides of the fence.
Stop Draining My Beliefs From My Head You Slug Brain Dragon Dead
um... what about my HIE fic?
191698
fur.
really?
fur?
Spike is a dragon with Scales
Pinkie Pie's pet is an alligator.
Rainbowdash was best friends with a gryphon. A flying lion with an eagles head.
and they're supposed to be scared of a short hairless,hornless,hoofless ape that at best is kind of cute and at worst kind of ugly.
I don't follow how the human body is supposed to appear as a some kind of ALIEN ABOMINATION when there are far worse monsters in just the Everfree than anything living on our Earth.
use comparative reasoning...
What do you think of the HiE stories where the human becomes a pony?
191675 Because they were never chose--ooooh I see what you're doin'.
191714 HATE IT.
HATE HATE HATE. IT IS THE WORST NO! NO I DONT ACCEPT!
DKSFNLDFKHJGP:DJFKMLHRPOKDG:PKD:GL:!!!!!!
191713 For that question: I say it's ONLY because they normally dont have our species on their planet. I mean, yeah, We dont know how long Minotaurs have been accepted, or How.
For us, we've only been seen once, With being Megan up there. I mean, for all they know, we could have laser vision.
IDK, It's all about seeing something for the first time.
191719 What am I doin' ?
I know all too well of this shit that has plagued the Human Tag for all too long. So I shall begin my rant from beginning to end, from the worst to the ugliest. So let's get started.
1. First off, I am sick of random human guy magically appearing in Equestria. That bullshit has gone on for too long. There should be a coherent reason the human got there whether from dimensional portal, energy discharge, magical portal that is actually called upon, some godly being sending them there, ect. Not one minute he's on Earth and then he's mysteriously transported to Equestria and the reason is never explained. That's just author laziness right there.
2. Next up is romance issues, and this is where my hate is at its highest. For one thing, they're frickin cartoon ponies, which is only one step closer to a horse. You know, horses, those smelly animals we use for farm work and some humans eat. I don't care if they're cute and can talk, you're still fucking a horse, unicorn, or alicorn, your choice. But you say they're intelligent and have a society just like ours? Well if your dog one day can talk and has human intelligence, would you fuck it? I'm pretty sure no, and that goes for every animal on Earth. Ponies, no matter how cute you think they are, can be classified as animals, even if they can fly or use magic, which makes you a horse fucker and furry right on the spot.
3. Now we move on to the human magically transforming into a pony. This, by far, is completely retarded. First off if you do get transformed, you're missing several basic human functions right there. You don't have fingers, and after using them all your life I'm pretty sure it'll take you more than a day to get used to not having them. Just try for one day not using any of your fingers, and you'll see how much it sucks. And even if you turn into a unicorn and could just levitate stuff using your magic, you know how much of a pain having a horn ontop your head would be. First off you could poke someone's eye out with it if you aren't careful, you'll constantly rip holes into things like your pillow when you're asleep, any clothes you try to wear (yes ponies do wear clothes, just ask Rarity), even resting your head on a table can be difficult. Plus you'd be naked most of the time, which will be pretty awkward for anyone who isn't a nudist.
4. Think for a sec if an alien suddenly appeared in your town. You think people would be chill and think no big deal? Hell no, they'll call the army and try to hunt you down with guns and chainsaws. So if a human appears in Ponyville, the inhabitants would most likely hunt down the monster and capture or kill it. Or some type of pony military force will come in and capture you and lock you in a dungeon for questioning or testing.
5. What has pissed me off for a long time now is the power of the Elements of Harmony. I can sort of accept that the power of friendship can defeat evil (still think the power of love defeating an entire Changeling army is complete bullshit), but how powerful are the damn things anyway? Are we talking death ray or nuclear bomb here? And no, humans can't use the Elements to go all super mario and kick evi's ass, mostly because we can't use magic, and also because that is stupid.
Ok done here, although there is still some crap that completely ruins many HiE stories. I can see why many people avoid it, but some of them are pretty good, mostly the Crossover stuff. And if you have read this massive block of text, have a moustache Spike as an award!
191726 I ACCEPT THIS AWARD ON BEHALF OF MYSELF.
All of this is WONDERFUL reasons why most HiE is bad. You deserve a Medal, you crazy you!
This is what My fic Hopefully changes, all of these flaws need to be cast out the window!
I'm still all for that whole "marefriend" thing, but as stated, MUST HAVE CONSEQUENCES!
191668 SMUCK SEASONFIRE.
Good things in HiE:
>>Having it take a while for the human to get accepted
>>The human having to deal with shit reasonably. Not by shouting out "I have a Katana!" Katanas are HARDER to use than a Saxe, a Baselard, A Bastard Sword, a Broadsword, a Scimitar, butterfly knives, a quarterstaff, or even a glaive. Katanas are a specialty weapon. THEY REQUIRE MORE ARDUOUS TRAINING THAN ANY OTHER WEAPON IN THAT LIST.
>>An EVOLVING relationship, if one is necessary at all. Not a freaking fuck-fest. HEY, ALL YOU FUCK-FESTS! GO BACK TO THE 70s ERA OF PORN!!!
>>Actually talk about the daily things, not just the big things. Does the human need to hunt in the forest to get meat, do they just eat fish, or have they gone vegetarian?
>>The human character has failures. If the human's a freaking God with no bad parts to them, then fuck your shit, you're a Gary Stu.
Things that should just go die:
<<FUCKING ALICORN POWERS
<<FUCKING AN ALICORN
<<FUCKING FUCK YOU
<<FUCKING SUPER POWERS
<<WHY THE FUCK IS IT ALWAYS FLUTTERSHY OR LUNA?!?! TAP DAT APPLE ASS!
<<FUCKING any and all characters, just for the sake of fucking
<<Shut up, we have no back story. I didn't give a fuck about you when you got your dick bit off by the Manticore, because lo and behold, you grew it back ten times as long and fucked the Manticore's shit. Why would I give any more fucks about you now that you suddenly have a tragic past on Earth?
Alright, I need a break from ranting. I think I pissed myself off enough to CLEAN THIS FUCKING ROOM, GOD, DAMMIT!!!
191726>>191719
I think The alien would have to do something bad to cause all of that commotion.
Even for something new...all of that overreaction wouldn't just happen...because on our own
WE ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL NOR ARE WE THAT DANGEROUS.
They have seen far worse shit than a human in jeans and a shirt!
then again...they did flip out over zecora...
How the hell did they accept Ironwill!?
welll....I guess they got better as a society.
191729
Meh, the whole marefriend thing could work, but there would have to be a shit load of stuff leading up to it. Just don't jump into romance like a two dollar hooker which many authors are doing nowadays. Take it nice and slow, with lots of intervention and other stuff like that so the love can really grow. I usually hate romane stories like the plague, but when an author takes his time to actually flesh out a romance between two characters, then I'm in for a good read.
191742 They probably would but then they get used to it...shit would get old and nopony would care anymore.
HiE writers have it that equestrian society would implode.
there would be a negative reaction but all of the shit about sex and death coming in is just hilariously inane.
191738
Or they're really racist on Zebras.
As for the not that dangerous part, we are. We have committed genocide against entire races just because they look different than us. We have made countless species extinct and damaged our environment with pollution and removing anything that can be used as a resource. You stick one crazy guy in Equestria with a gun and he could do some serious damage. What makes us special is our ability to come up with a plan to kill just about anything. We humans have been doing that for thousands of years.
191752
Allow me to clarify past statements.
I said on our own.
I am well aware of human history and the atrocities of the past. We have a tremendous capability for wanton destruction and evil.
But I'm talking the usual HiE premise..
The person wakes up in Equestria with nothing but the clothes on their body.
The protagonist is usually your run of the mill non-violent earth denizen moved over to ponyland...no serial killer/rapist background...just average 17-25 year old joe/jane schmoe.
just one to three humans....all relatively nice folks and completely unarmed.
that's what I meant. pretty harmless.
yes we are capable of that...but seriously? is that the most LIKELY outcome?
The most NECASSARY outcome? with just one to a few people?
no.
Hellz NO!
191756
Good point there, but think how they would be freaking out. Suddenly they're tossed into a completely different world filled with talking ponies, magic, and unexplained situations where the laws of physics are broken (Pinkie Pie). That there person or people would probably be freaking out (unless they were a brony, who would be crying in joy). Just remember, perfectly normal people are still capable of freaking out and going on a killing rampage. Or they could just accept it and no big deal.
191759
191755
Actually, Psychology and Anthropology (the actual science not the fic) prove that most instances of violence,on both an individual and mass scale, are completely planned and reasoned out.
War is a result of politics and mass manipulation of information and resources via government/organizational power. Crime is the result of a deliberate reaction to opportunity or circumstance.
What goes into a human comes out through their actions.
the average human...decent creature.
actually...ponies ARE human beings since we function on the same level of reason and plane of logic.
war exists in Equestria. as do monsters and Villians...
191772
Yes, but would that make ponies more dangerous than us? They can use magic and some of them can fly, so they already have abilities for killing right there. Or are they more peaceful and weaker then us? The reason we created tools for killing was because of food, which quickly grew to create tools to kill each other. Since ponies are herbivores, they never needed tools to kill prey, and basically have never killed any creature for food. I'm sure Equestria has sick people just like on Earth, but does our ability to kill for survival make us more dangerous then any pony. If it came right down to a pony versus a human, death match fight, will our instinct to kill prey give us the upper hand to a pony whose only instinct is to stay in big groups like a herd for protection.
This is not related to humans being more dangerous or whatever, just me rambling.
191781 There's a lot of factors that go into a psychological break. it takes more than a certain subset of stimuli to trigger the particular behavior witnessed in your average pony slasher.
The people who write those stories don't study criminology or social theory.
nor do they study the evolution of human civilization.
They want the shit to go down in their stories because they want to be read...
They don't have the wit to textually realize a completely rounded character to insert into a dynamic environment.
That wouldn't yield the result they wanted.
Humans have a vast suite of coping mechanisms built in to their psyche's. That's how we managed to adapt to so many of environments on this earth.
We also have high capabilities of acceptance...civilization would never have formed without this.. because we all have common origins we only break away through distance.
Close mindedness and violence towards the "other" never really arose as something natural to humans it's taught to us by society ruled intellectual and political elites who make the laws and build the schools...
191740 O U.
191726 ok. I'm going to bitch at you.
Look at the last part of point 2.
"....which makes you a horse fucker and furry right on the spot."
1). Not all furries are into beastyality.
2). Horse fuckers and furries are grouped together way to often. They are different.
3). Fuck you if you think that they are one in the same.
4). I'm sorry, but it FUCKING PISSES ME OFF when people think that furries and furfags are one in the same.
Sorry for bitching at you, but you hit a nerve with by saying that.
191752
No one I'm aware of has committed genocide just because somebody looked different. The rationalizations are more complex than that.
191800 "Close mindedness and violence towards the "other" never really arose as something natural to humans it's taught to us by society ruled intellectual and political elites who make the laws and build the schools..."
And how did the intellectual and political elites get such notions if they're so foreign to humanity?
191866
I know there's a whole bunch of more complex reasons we commit genocide or kill each other, whether from different beliefs, cultures, races, or political reasons. I just choose the first one off the top of my head, like racism. The main point is we use hate against a group and completely massacre them because of that hate.
The thing about Megan having been there first only applies if we accept the notion that G4 is in the same universe as G1. That G1 is G4's ancient history happens to be my head canon, but the actual shows are very different from each other and can be considered separate universes.
I could see a lot of possibilities in human-pony interaction. Everyone going ballistic and killing each other seems just as extreme as, and no more realistic than, everyone getting used to each other instantly.
This difficulty is one found in sf and fantasy generally, not just MLP fanfic, though the problem may be more pronounced here simply because the writers are amateurs and many are inexperienced or writing blatant wish-fulfillment stories. I remember an sf short story I read some years ago, which, though it was quite good overall, depicted a sort of half-reptile, half-squid kind of alien see a human woman for the first time, look at her chest, and say, "Ah, a mammal!" Even if we accept the idea that mammals have evolved independently on different planets, an alien, even one with a lot of knowledge of biology, looking at a woman's chest, when she's wearing clothes even, and correctly identifying mammary glands is unlikely. We're used to ourselves, so coming up with a halfway believable concept of what we might look like to another species is not easy.
My earliest work of MLP fanfic, which on the whole isn't very good and which is floating on some other website somewhere, has a human character that I consistently described, to the best of my ability, from a pony point of view. The comments I got indicated that the readers couldn't even tell he was supposed to be human!
Even more difficult than imagining alien appearance is imagining alien thought. I can't help but notice that most alien races in science fiction tend to have some exotic trappings but still, in the end, think and talk like modern southern Californians.
191866
People can learn to discriminate or Choose to discriminate.
This is the point where deliberate action and natural tendencies can be confused. Where it is learned.
Hatred of the "other" is neither natural nor foreign.
for instance children can and do pick out differences as reasons to mistreat or avoid one another.
disabilities,skin color, different language speakers...however, through the psychology of play and communication children easily outgrow that discrimination.children get over differences quite easily, unless, they're taught to discriminate.
Remember. There's a lot discrimination that can only be taught.
anti-semitism for instance.
You can look at two people. a Swedish-German and a German-Jew. They both speak the same language and live in the same country. Hell. to person of african descent like myself--were I inclined to group people by skin color-- I would just consider them both to be white and leave it at that.
but..were it say 1939, during the political radicalization of that time, those two would be profiled and treated differently. based on an idea of racial/cultural superiority deliberately formulated by the then government/ social organization. The National Socialist Party of Germany
Do you discriminate?
I once did. That was because I was told to by my peers. But I overcame that with reason.
If it can be dismantled with reason than it some point it had to be put together with reason...flawed reason...but still reason.
I've always kind of wanted to read/write a story where a human ends up in Equestria... and then spends the rest of the fic desperately trying to get out instead of throwing parties/screwing Fluttershy/living it up like most HiE fics. I might love the show, but if I were to get thrown into the universe with no way to get back out, with all of my friends and family back on Earth, and in a society that is in no way accustomed to my species, Celestia knows I would panic.
191928
I prefer to use "discriminate" according to its older meaning, so I'm tempted to intentionally misread your question. My original question to you was unclear in its intent and may have been based on a misreading of your comment. I was under the impression that you were claiming that human misbehavior was the product of a sort of trickle-down effect, originating not from within ordinary people, but coming only from their leaders, who had somehow invented them even though they're somehow inhuman. That's apparently not what you meant.
My experience of children is different from yours. I've not known young children to care a whit about skin color unless they were taught to.
If you want a good HiE go find My second life. I think its finished at just over 600k words.
192252 Or just...look at mine. XD
191908 I prefer they weren't different universes. That's to apply everything that I know about the show, would be a waste.
Think about it like this, I'm playing a game, Like street fighter 2, and I';m used to its controls, then I go through the other ones, Alpha, MVC, MVC2, then I get to say Tatsunoko, which they throw a curve ball, and nothing stays intact, but it's still the same. Confusing? It is.
What do I mean by this? It's basically this: G1 happened, then G2, G3 (Sadly) then G4 erases the history of everything I've learned, and it doesnt help that they brought earlier ponies, stories, and other things from the earlier series.
191955 Well, for that, that would be cool. I'd like to see something like that. Still, I'd like to stay In Equestria, Where I know I wouldn't have to deal with my old life, wheras it was full of lost family, and pain and misery. (Inside my story, I literally put my whole life in a shellnut. you'll see)
192411
All I mean is, putting G1 and G4 in the same universe is up to the whim of the fanfic writer, since nothing in canon forces him either way. He can make G1 out to be G4's prehistory (as I do), or he can make Firefly out to be Rainbow Dash's mom (though how Dream Valley could turn into Equestria in one generation is unclear to me), or he can import G1 elements on a whim (which the show itself does, except when copyright prevents), or he can ignore G1 altogether. None of those is accurate or inaccurate because nothing in the show constrains him.
Personally, I'd like to see more "Megan returns to Ponyland in G4" stories. With allowance for all of G1's flaws, Megan is a pretty cool character, and a competent young farm girl really seems to me to be a better fit for a world full of colorful talking ponies than a teenage brony/embittered soldier/whatever human is getting stuck in Equestria this week. Come to think of it, I'd kind of like to see more HiE fics featuring young girls instead of grown men. There don't seem to be many of those, which is ironic.
192431 Well you can make a storyline that works, like mine. You'll see it in my story.
Dream valley is just another place, who says Equestria has to be smack dab in the middle? :3
I dont care what people say, she's a COOL character. She had the fucking Rainbow of light, which in my eyes, were a fragment of the Elements, or a predicesor (I cant spell...). She faced Tirek, one of the coolest villains to exist in my eyes. (Sorry, Grogar)
Actually, I'm making a Story that DOES star Megan, along with Graham.
The idea, you can say, was inspired by...
blue-wave.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Sonic-Generations-game-play.jpg
It's a big storyline, one with Dr. Whooves involved, so I cant exactly say many details, but I can if you're interested. :3
I also think there IS a fic about a young girl...who's Blind.
192438
Graham . . . I don't know Graham. My geek cred has taken a critical hit.
Good on ya. I'm working on one with Megan in it, too. I'm going with the assumption that Dream Valley was the unnamed original pony homeland destroyed by the Windigoes, as depicted in "Hearth's Warming Eve."
Blog when the first chapter goes up and I'll see it!
192456 I would THINK so, actually.
Oh, Graham's My character in "Friendship is a Miracle". :3
Also, if you're making one, lemme know when you post it! I'll support it easy! Megan needs more attention.
I mean, somepony called her "A Shitty character" and "A Dumb OC"
Idiots.
And DEFINITELY will. :3
I actually am working on one where:
1. He's NOT the first human, but humans were extremly rare. AND I WILL NEVER MENTION THAT STUPID MISTAKE OF A HUMAN!!!
2. He does get the girl, but everyone in Equestria is nice to them (because I can't imagine them NOT nice).
3. WHY WOULD ANYONE WRITE THAT ANYONE CAN USE THE ELEMENTS? Seriously, mine gets magic from ************** (spoilers)
It's not the best cause it's my first, but at least I'm trying...
192481 There you go! I'll support that, as long as he doesnt turn super saiyan! Hahahahaha!
iM wAtChInG yOu...