• Member Since 27th Sep, 2012
  • offline last seen Apr 6th, 2019

BookyBrony


More Blog Posts17

  • 179 weeks
    A Couple Announcements

    I have a few things to bring up, and I suppose that first of all I should get to the one most people reading this would care about.

    Read More

    4 comments · 610 views
  • 236 weeks
    I did a Chapter for a Friend

    My friend, and Chains' editor, DarkPhoenix had me write a chapter for his story Discords Playground (warning, this story contains a lot of material that many people may find disturbing, including, but not limited to, coerced sexual activity, sex slavery, child(foal) slavery

    Read More

    0 comments · 250 views
  • 280 weeks
    Chains Universe Group

    So I made a group for the Chains Universe. So now if anyone wishes to write their own spin offs or fanfics based on the Chains setting, there will be a place to put them all.

    It can be found >>>>> here <<<<<

    0 comments · 371 views
  • 294 weeks
    Chains - Status Update

    Not wanting to get anyone prematurely excited, but I've been making leaps and bounds in the next chapter of Chains. So far I have about 4k words down for it, and I'm still not quite done. I've been lucky so far in that I've been getting a nice flow with it and I have to say I'm much more satisfied with how it's shaping out than I was with the last chapter. I hope to have it out for you all fairly

    Read More

    8 comments · 471 views
  • 306 weeks
    Chains: Nos Morituri te Salutamus

    Long ago, before it was banned, gladiatorial combat was among the most popular sports in all of Equestria.

    These are the stories of both combat and intrigue behind The Games.

    Read More

    0 comments · 387 views
Apr
20th
2014

About Chains · 12:33am Apr 20th, 2014

Let me start this by saying, No, I am not quitting it.

I do however need to rethink a lot about it for future chapters and the like. And again, No, this isn't about the poor reception of the events in Chapter 15.

To be honest, that was a problem I saw coming a mile off, but really it was going to be a problem from early on, and there was no real way of avoiding it without doing a major rework of the whole series, which I think at this point maybe a bit late.

Its just that I find that I have alot of plot points in the future planned, and stuff that I want to do that would really be much more worthy of their own stories all together.

One option I'm thinking of, is ending Chains, and making the next part a sequel to it, and divide the story into smaller pieces, having several separate fics.

I'm already planning a sequel to the story, because I already know when, where and how the story of Chains will end.

The problem I face lies in that I have a lot of ideas already, and I'm coming up with more and more. What I'm trying to say is, Chains is going to take a little while to update. Again, not because people dislike Ch. 15. I don't want anyone to think that I took a blow to my confidence or anything, I just need to make major decisions as to the future of the story as a whole.

I thank you all for your continued support of Chains, and your words of encouragement towards me. I'm lucky to have as many readers as I do, and I hope that a lot of you will take the break to look at some of my other works, which I will also continue to work on.

For the few of you who read An Unlikely Prince, you can expect a new chapter relatively soon, and for those who read Dark Pony Brotherhood, you can expect an update too, not quite as soon ^^

I hope to continue entertaining you all for a while yet.

Report BookyBrony · 594 views · Story: Chains ·
Join our Patreon to remove these adverts!
Comments ( 23 )

Take all the time you need, after all "one can not rush genius!"

2025806 Couldn't have said it better myself. :pinkiehappy:

Are you talking about the debate I started? I didn't intend on doing that. :fluttercry:

2026030
No, not at all, I knew from the start that things wouldn't be taken well, Like I said, there wasn't much that could have saved the idea of Celestia being good, yet allowing the slavery of an entire race. It was a shot in the foot from the very start, but its one that I have to live with.
No this is a problem of having too many ideas, and not wanting to bury the story in a bunch of tangents.

2026087 So people were pissed before I commented?:rainbowhuh: I thought that I stirred up a hornet's nest.

2026105
I don't think you stirred up a hornets nest. I just wanted to make it clear to everyone who may read this that my reason for putting Chains on hold was not because people may be turning their opinions on the story.

2026124 Oh. Well, I actually think that the story is even better. I may hate Celestia for what she did; however, that only makes me more pumped for the next chapters. I'm really hoping that the hiatus is over soon; I'm just dying to know how it ends. :raritydespair: Btw, I've been following this story since January 2013 and was afraid that it was dead. Glad to see that I'm wrong! :pinkiehappy: I understand what you're going through; I'm currently writing a story that I've been planning for over a year and still don't know how to paste it all together. I hope that you find the path that the sequel will take soon because I'm dying for a council ass kicking Yu Yu Hakusho style. :raritywink: Until then, take your time and best wishes. :twilightsmile:
P.S. Putita lit. means "little bitch", and Yu Yu Hakusho is my favourite anime/manga. Just wanted to clear that up. :twilightblush:

2026183
Well, if you wanted I'd be willing to maybe brainstorm with you a little for your fanfic. As for the sequel, I'll be honest, I'm not even half way through Chains yet, probably not even a fourth of the way through it. I'm not kidding when I say I have a lot planned for it.

Honestly, the next couple chapters are one of the first places I could make a tangent.

2026200 I'd so appreciate that. :pinkiehappy: I'll PM you the link and passcode. :pinkiesmile:

To be honest, that was a problem I saw coming a mile off, but really it was going to be a problem from early on, and there was no real way of avoiding it without doing a major rework of the whole series

To be honest this isn't a very healthy outlook for a writer since there are always things that you can change and bend to your will even if you never noticed it until a certain point. Also what you need to do is when you have too many ideas you need to trim the fat and focus your vision. Using too many different ideas and going all over the map will appear scatter brained, so best narrow down your best ideas and go form there.

2026222
Which is the point of this Hiatus. And I know, It's not so much a matter of making a bad decision on purpose. It's realizing that there are going to be problems in the story, part of the learning experience is working with what you got. If I am a good writer, I can still save the issue, I can think of a few things yet that I can get to fix it, but would you not agree that if I throw in some random event that fixes everything with no effort I would be committing an even greater sin?

You could argue that I could have taken it another way than I had, possibly even kept the real reasoning a mystery for the entire story, but that would have been equally aggravating, for both reader and writer. While this plot point is an issue, a glaring one at that some may argue, it does present its own opportunities.

2026282
One way you could salvage the Celestia situation is by revealing that while she regrets betraying her human allies, however, she honestly felt up until recently that humans were better off indentured in relative safety to ponies (rather than be constantly subjected to atrocities by other races).

Oh wait, that's what you were already trying to do...

...shit, I don't have any ideas.

I think the part you really fucked up was when ponies were mentioned to abuse, torment, and humiliate their humans, such as the (now banned) gladiatorial fights, pony slavers torturing their thralls, and humans being fucking hanged for misdemeanors and victimless crimes.

I can sorta/kinda accept the idea of ponies keeping humans as sapient pets/indentured servants, but the level of violence and sadism displayed by ponies in this story is massively (and pointlessly) OOC for them. This wouldn't be an issue if this were a grimderp story, but it's not. You're trying to make the story as close to canon as possible, yet those story elements are blatantly incompatible.

To be frank, I recommend a rewrite, but it's your call skipper.

On an semi-related note, I've been imagining this story being crossed over with various other HiE stories, and some of these musings were pretty darkly humorous.

Does this mean the humans won't be set free by the end of this story?

2026736
At the risk of possibly spoiling things.
How on earth do you think the struggle would end for either side just with the humans being set free?

Dude, I'll be honest, the whole "Totally not Hilter" incident is going to be one hell of a project to salvage, but that being said, I believe it can and does work, and is probably the best path for the story, though it really should be reworked.


First of all, the political situation of post nightmare moon needs to be greatly expanded upon. While ponies would see humans killing a pony, something of a threat, and that of something to worry about, they wouldn't immediately just switch the NOPE button on the back of their keyboards, bring out the M2 flamethrowers, and burn down their houses. There needs to be a steady progression of events leading up to the council listening to TNH, one that shows how fear can drastically warp the perceptions and beliefs of any being. You also have to remember, the Griffon Empire and Equestria don't exactly have the best of relations, and it's not without reason to believe that there have been incidents where Griffons have attacked and consumed ponies. That being the case, why wasn't the Griffons on the top of the councils hit list? Sure you can argue that the horrors of the human attack are still fresh within the minds of the Equestrians, but that's still a pretty shitty reason. In addition to fleshing out the political situation, there is a noticeable lack of opposition to the idea of the complete eradication of Humanity. It just seems all too convenient, there should be at least one or two ponies looking at what TNH is saying, and looking at what Celestia is saying, and noticing that there is something seriously fucking wrong with what is being discussed. To be honest, there is a real lack of politics in this portion of the story, something that would seriously aid the issues with the story.

In addition to this, TNH needs to be developed more. You can't just say that he's ambitious then do a 360 moon walk, and have him advocating for the genocide of an entire sentient species. It would be much more believable for him to have, say, been attacked by a roving band of human bandits, or something that could give him a reason to hate them, one that would also allow him to play off the sympathies of the council members.

Also, there is a funny thing about genocide. If you want to play entomologist, the word 'Genocide' was conceived after WW2, when NATO needed a word to describe what the Nazi regime did. That being said, the same thing should technically apply to Equestria as well, since the word carries so much weight. The idea of genocide shouldn't be the first thing that pops up in the council's mind, because such a concept shouldn't technically be around at all, given how the Equestrian's are.

Finally, Celestia needs back story, desperately. Its reasonable to believe that after losing Luna, truly, the only pony who could ever understand her, that she would be beaten to the curb, not just physically, but mentally and emotionally. But if we're to believe this, we need more story to it. We need to see it with our eyes. You can't just say that Celestia rolled over on the prospect of genocide, and decided the enslavement of an entire race would be a better alternative. We need to see how low Celestia has sunk, and how high the fears of the ponies have risen. Celestia is not infallible, we can all agree on that, but she isn't pushed down by the faintest of breezes. It's just too unbelievable to say that she advocated slavery as the next best alternative to genocide. If Celestia created the game, lets see her play it, lets see her use her authority as the Solar Monarch, not the Princess of Equestria, to present her position, and try and help Humanity. It should take years upon years of debating, fighting, and war, for the council to come to the agreement that Humanity will be enslaved, not eradicated, and even then, if this is Celestia's victory, this should be her Hail Mary, literally, her last chance, because everything else was blown. It should also be elaborated upon as to why she never sought to change the laws, because really, she can outlive all those who put the laws in place, take back her place as princess, and just change everything back to what is used to be. If the situation was something like the civil rights movement, where even though slavery was made equal, and there were anti racism laws passed, slavery continued to happen, and what not, then it would make sense, even more so if Celestia would have faced a revolution if she tried to free Humanity from the bonds of slavery. Nothing should be as simple and set as was the explanation Celestia gave, and that's the entirety of the problem, for having such a strong plot element, the reasons and actions behind it are about as weak as motel instant coffee, not only making it a terrible plot device, but offensive.

If you were able to make out what I described in the wall of text, BookyBrony, then I applaud you. And just see what I mentioned as things to consider. I highly enjoy the story, and if anything, I don't want to see it canceled, to be honest, the prospect of it being canceled pissed me off more than anything I can imagine, pertaining to the content of the story. I think I had one or two more points, or suggestions, but to be honest, this is a lot of content, and there isn't really much more I can elaborate upon.

Good luck dude. I know what it's like to write yourself into a hole. I did it with my pet project story for the site. I've had to rewrite it about 6 times now. took me 6 times to learn from my mistakes, and holy hell is it paying off. Right now I have about 15+K words worth of notes, and framing. Truly a first for the story. So keep at it, if anything, I'm living proof that if you procrastinate enough, maybe, just maybe, you'll finally work up the commitment to finish what you started, and create a plot that works. This coming from a guy who has a terrible habit of making plans, or coming up with ideas, only to not follow through with them.

2026282 Ah, but that's just the thing, realizing and resolving a major problem in an already established plot line is never an easy thing to do, but I guarantee you with enough creative thinking can almost always be rectified or molded into something else wether before it happens or down the line. However it does require change.

The "random event that fixes everything" you are talking about is just a deus ex machina, which is just about the worst thing you could do and is a writer's biggest cop out. So don't do it no matter how enticing it seems.

2026841
Unless used for comedic effect, and seeing as how Chains is not a comedy outside of some lighthearted comic relief, it would be unfitting. However, I have my own plans for Deus ex Machina in another story I'm working on.

Really there need be only three minor changes to chapter 15 and I could accept it.

First enhance the reason for action, like so.

“Celestia” the head of council shouted and slammed his hoof “there are dozens of confirmed cases where humans hunted, killed, and ate ponies, they are a threat we can’t let run loose”.

“But locusts wiped out their crops, hundreds starve for every one that turns against our people” Celestia was struggling to keep the panic out of her voice, how could she not of anticipated this possibility “and there government gives no leniency to those who do”!

“The members of this council simply cannot allow this to continue” the head of council spoke once more calm “and frankly we believe your personal felling may have clouded your judgment on this matter”.

Seconded there is no talk of genocide or complete enslavement, they simply go to war, and all the humans are killed or captured and forced to serve their captors has the natural outcome of ancient warfare. All though this would still be stretching believability most all stories must do that at some point.

Alright the last one deals solely with Celestia. If she where betrayed has defiant and hopeful in the past, yet completely desperate in the past it would make her character more believable. The greatest thing that bugged me was you saying she didn’t go against the council was because she didn’t want to cause a civil war then turn around and ask Luna to fix it, when I couldn’t imagine her doing it (in a timely fashion) without causing a civil war.

This blue print makes the story much more believable (for me at least), though it doesn’t address the OOC of the ponies that seems to really bother a lot of other readers. It also leaves Celestia has unredeemable. She could be used has some sort of martyr, and be remembered with some fondness.

To be honest I am really conflicted about posting this comment. I want to push artists I like to do their best, but telling them what to do is crossing the line in my opinion. Its gest shocking how quickly the story became broken and that they seem such miner details makes it so much worse. I really hope I’m gest making an ass of myself and you can fix the story while ignoring everything I said as that would be best for me has a reader. If not well I would love to help. Thinking in terms of large overacting plot points is something I genuinely believe I’m really good at.

No matter what I wish you luck.

How's about more editing? Editing looks like a superb idea.

Or maybe taking some time to learn the basic rules of English as a written language? Why, I think that's an even better idea than the first! No need to edit if you get it right the first time, after all.

...Plus it would make me feel better about my tax dollars funding your education.

2027383
Ah, Din, It's been a long time since I had you around to comment on Chains.
How you been?

2027390

Ah, not too bad. Alive and still complaining at fanfic authors. You know how it is.

You?

2027396
Working, writing, gaming, wishing some of my other stories would get the attention that Chains does. You know how it is.

2026555

I think the part you really fucked up was when ponies were mentioned to abuse, torment, and humiliate their humans, such as the (now banned) gladiatorial fights, pony slavers torturing their thralls, and humans being fucking hanged for misdemeanors and victimless crimes.
I can sorta/kinda accept the idea of ponies keeping humans as sapient pets/indentured servants, but the level of violence and sadism displayed by ponies in this story is massively (and pointlessly) OOC for them. This wouldn't be an issue if this were a grimderp story, but it's not. You're trying to make the story as close to canon as possible, yet those story elements are blatantly incompatible.

That more than anything else is something you need to address if you want to make this thing work. You can have a slave owning version of the Equestria we see in the show or you can have the one Branagain described, but you've been trying to do both and that on its own will make the entire story fail. Trying to sell "brutal, often arbitrary punishment for little to no reason" being a part of the land of friendship and understanding is too much. At the very least, you should tone down the cruelty of the ponies--they're actually worse than most of the slave-owning societies from actual history, to my knowledge. I second his suggestion that you do a rewrite, and I'd suggest finding prereaders that haven't read this version (because the rewrite should stand on its own without any knowledge of prior versions required, much the way a story must make sense to people that never saw the unfinished, unedited versions).

To be honest, that was a problem I saw coming a mile off, but really it was going to be a problem from early on, and there was no real way of avoiding it without doing a major rework of the whole series, which I think at this point maybe a bit late.

If you're willing to do it and you think it would improve the story, then you should do the edits. The thing is that while you seem to be trying to make Celestia sympathetic, she really isn't for reasons that have already been discussed at length. I mean, maybe we're supposed to see her as weak and incompetent but the impression I got was that I was supposed to read her justifications and feel sorry for her being forced to do such a horrible thing (and for the loss of her friend-possibly-lover). If we're supposed to hate her, then you might want to do some minor editing to make it clear that she's really not all that broken up over it, even before chapter 15 rolls around (that way, we're used to the idea that this Celestia doesn't live by the friendship and harmony she preaches).

If that is what you're going for, it's important to set that up early because even if you meant for us to have this "Celestia, you total fuck-up!" reaction it doesn't look like that was the case. If you want to stay with the idea that Celestia really had no alternatives, you need to show how the council is able to disobey her legally, how they convinced society to embrace or at least accept it, and why the military was willing to go through with it--it's too large an operation to say "they left out the units that would have refused" and don't justify it with "the military does what it's told" because that would be really, really lazy. If you're going with that it's important to note that the army would have had to have their sense of morality shifted to "obedience is the only good" at just about every level of command.

2026744
Do you mean the end of the first story or the sequel/series as a whole?

Login or register to comment
Join our Patreon to remove these adverts!