A New Apology I'd Like to Make · 3:54pm April 26th
A couple weeks ago, I made the following comment in response to a message by Perpetually Confused, which was in FiMFiction.net’s The Insane Creators Guild group in the I’ve Made the Count post. The comment in question being this:
I’ve been frequently making reviews on G5 installments lately, but it’s merely been to make a statement and take a stand against it.
Earlier this week, my good friend TheClownPrinceofCrime later called into question what I meant by that statement during a discussion we were having below my review of “Growing Pains”. He commented that most have interpreted this as a way of saying that my reviews on the various G5 installments are far from genuine, and that I was making them simply for the sake of basing it, to which I insisted that was far from the case.
But you know what?
As I thought back on that two-week old comment I made, I don’t even know what I actually meant by that anymore! Not to mention I don’t understand the meaning of it in general.
The only theory I have behind why I said it is that I was just happy to be talking to someone who wasn’t making me feel backed in a corner in the “I’ve Made the Count” thread, especially in contrast to others, but even then…I don’t know. Not only did I lose a friendship with The Blue EM2 over it, but the entirety of that comment appeared to be based on mere negative emotion rather than clear thought.
In fact, this sort of thing is why I decided to take a break from reviewing episodes of Make Your Mark for a little while. Especially in favor of analyzing other things, and turning my focus on non-review related stuff.
Whether anyone will believe me or not, my reviews on the previous G5 installments are 100% genuine. I’m not negatively criticizing them for the purpose of bashing them. It’s because I truly wasn’t impressed by the quality of the writing and direction thus far, or of the characters.
Why do you think I frequently stated that I’ve been rewatching episodes more than once before writing down the reviews?
I’m doing that not because I secretly like the show, but due to wanting to be absolutely certain on what I thought of the episodes. I refuse to let myself get too driven by biased-anger, and I’m determined to be as reasonable as possible. That’s what being a reviewer’s about anyway! Heck, I’m not even planning to give a reevaluation on the previous episodes I reviewed, or of A New Generation, because I’m certain over what I think of them.
Even so, I feel that analyzing the Make Your Mark episodes has taken a toll on my emotions, which is why I’m taking a break from reviewing the show for a bit. It’s caused me to get incredibly testy, and it’s led me into making comments that I now regret saying.
In whatever case, I regret having made the quoted comment now, and I’m deeply sorry for ever saying it to begin with.
If there are other things I said that are openly questionable, feel free to share them with me. If I can’t remember or understand what I meant by them anymore, then I’m sorry for saying them too.
Also, thank you TheClownPrinceofCrime for helping me realize the error I made. It was truly quite an eye-opener.
What the fuck kind of tween-aged middle-school mean-girl drama bullshit did I just witness, lol. Autistically posting about how many episodes are left in a show should never have caused that kind of backlash. And several people proved themselves to be the very 'aggressive G5 fanatics' that you complained about, lol.
You were just about the only reasonable adult in a thread filled with horrible people raging about petty nonsense.
On the subject of a lost friendship, if someone is willing to turn their back on someone over such petty bullshit, they were never a friend in the first place.
Also, unhinged histrionic Reddit mod is out of place, demanding a public apology from you for offending hisdelicatesensitivities, using what is effectively emotional blackmail.This was out of line, sorry.
Suffice to say, they do not deserve your apology, it will only convince them that they were in the right and embolden them to further crybully people.
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5778276
Give me a big fat break, dude.
Like I said before, you saw your mistake and owned up to it and that’s something to be commended. What you said was definitely harmful and there are ramifications, but the fact that you took my advice and took the time to apologize is something that I treat with the utmost respect as not a lot of people do that. Sometimes, people say things that they regret later. I know I’ve been there lots of times and it doesn’t get any easier, but making mistakes is a part of living and you’re gonna unfortunately run into road bumps like this, where something escalates into something you didn’t mean it to and you lose followers or friends over it. But you’re listening and you’re trying, so…thanks. Ultimately, you’re doing the right thing by taking a break from reviewing G5 and focusing on doing things you like doing. I can tell that it’s taken it’s toll on you and as I said, I hope you can use this time to reflect on them and emerge from this incident stronger.
Rest assured, I forgive you and I’ll put in a good word in with Blue for you. No friendship should have to permanently end over this, and I’m sure he’d be willing to give you a second chance after seeing you take responsibility for everything.
5778281
No, you were the one acting out of line in that conversation (along with a couple others), not AMU.
5778284
Delude yourself into thinking that if you want. I’m just here to offer my acceptance of his apology as I believe it and I forgive him, and I think others should too. He messed up in that thread, accept that and move on. You can still support him while acknowledging that. But I’m proud of him for taking the time to make amends. Regardless if we disagree, taking accountability into your own hands (or hooves in this case) deserves respect, especially in this day and age.
5778285
amen!
5778285
I am glad that you consider the matter settled, and the willingness to intercede on AMU's behalf with Blue speaks well of you. I am sorry for what I personally called you, I don't know you well enough to make such claims and should never have done so.
That said, your reaction to AMU was completely disproportionate to AMU's statements. You are acting like he committed some kind of crime against the Gen 5 fandom when all he did was make a fairly tepid (and as far as I can tell, entirely accurate) criticism against a subset of that fandom. Who are you to demand an apology on behalf of the entire G5 fandom when all he was doing was griping about how some of them act?
5778301
Thanks, I appreciate it.
That wasn’t what I had issue with. He could’ve gone all day calling us “aggressive G5 fanatics” and I wouldn’t have minded. Sometimes echo chambers be echo chambers and the way we fans treat G5 versus the hatedom speaks for itself on which side is really the aggressive one. No, what I truly took issue with was his reply saying that he only made reviews on Make Your Mark to make a statement and take a stand against it, a stance that I in good conscience could neither support nor condone. You should never make reviews on something with the sole purpose of tearing it down and mindlessly bashing it. It was inflammatory rhetoric through and through, which is what warranted his ban from my group. He and I disagreed on a lot of things, but that was taking it too far. Blue and I cutting ties with him following that was for moral reasons. It had nothing to do with him calling us aggressive fanatics. Believe me when I say we’ve been called far worse.
I never “demanded” an apology out of him. I only suggested that he do that so that people knew that he didn’t stand by that statement anymore as saying something along the lines of your reviews don’t come from a genuine place, rather coming from a malicious one, can have lasting ramifications on his credibility, and I didn’t want that for him. I gave him advice on how to handle the fallout of his situation, nothing more, nothing less.
5778303
Okay, understood.
Um, that isn't really better. Instead of acting to defend a fandom made of real people, you are acting to protect the IP of a 9 billion dollar company.
Someone hating Gen 5 is NOT a moral issue like you seem to think, even if AMU was doing his reviews purely out of hatred of Gen 5, that WOULD NOT constitute a moral issue. And even if it was, it really isn't your place to 'punish' him.
Bud, I lived through the Anti-brony hatedom of 2012-2015 (in fact it was the period I was most active in the fandom, nowadays I'm just here for the fanfiction), and it wasn't the haters that were the reason why I am still uncomfortable calling myself a 'brony' (thank God for Undertale and Steven Universe, they were the great filter that sucked out most of the antisocial creeps from this fandom).
The fact of the matter is, that if something is hated enough for a genuine anti-fandom/hatedom to develop, there's a reason, probably a good reason. The furry fandom deserves the anti-furries, the early bronies deserved the anti-bronies.
Assuming that I accept that the people who hate G5 constitute a genuine anti-fandom, why does G5 have an anti-fandom?
I would posit that the reason for this may be because the G5 fandom is a big echo-chamber, where anyone with less than positive opinions are deemed 'haters' and effectively exiled, like you and Blue did to AMU.
The thing about an echo-chamber is that it is extremely unpleasant and even destabilizing for people who do not hold that same position. And coming from a fandom that basically doesn't agree on anything, that is extremely jarring, and infuriating.
5778314
Hahaha, no. If I was purely acting to protect Hasbro’s interests of all companies, I wouldn’t be here talking to you. I’d get an actual job there. Think before you type, bud, as that makes literally no sense. I’m a fan of Gen 5 first and foremost, and I’ve been placed in a position where I represent the community, therefore needing to act in the best interests of the one group where the majority of other fans congregate. So I am defending a fandom made of real people. The corporate shenanigans of our idiotic blue square of a logo mean nothing to me at this point.
It’s a moral issue supporting someone who according to him at the time, only made reviews on something to bash it. At that point, it wasn’t solely about G5. He could have been making negative reviews on ANYTHING when saying that and I still would have cut ties with him because I support genuine engagement on a piece of media, whether it be positive or negative. As such, I forgave him when he said he took back that statement and promised to change. I had the right to kick him from my group because that kind of rhetoric should never be tolerated. You can’t defend someone who says that and I had given him so many chances up until that point. I tolerated his reviews, even if I openly voiced my disagreement with them. But that was taking things too far. I punished him out of my own discretion and for moral reasons so that something would shake him. It was never a permanent ban, rather a temporary one. If you don’t call that mercy, I don’t know what is. It was absolutely my place to punish him as a group admin as he outed himself as a mindless hater that night whether he realized it or not. My G5 group is a place for fans and/or people who are on the fence about this generation, but are still willing to give it a genuine chance. Notice how I bolded the word “genuine.”
Different groups have different rules. I know: shocking. I could not allow him to remain in the group with that sort of attitude. Just like how different Discord servers have different rules, Fimfiction groups work the same. You join knowing there’s certain guidelines and a way you have to conduct yourself. And if all you’re going to do is spew mindless hatred, then you’re out. That’s just how reality works.
I still cannot believe this is the hill you choose to die on, and again, this doesn’t even make sense. A fandom is a fandom, meaning a group or community made up of fans of something. Yeah, those with less than positive opinions on that piece of media the fandom’s built on aren’t fans. What do you think “fandom” means? Did we call anti-Bronies or those who hate FIM fans back in the fandom’s heyday? No? Didn’t think so. It doesn’t make sense. Being a fan of something means you LIKE it, not that you hate it. But no, we do not exile people for having a “slightly different opinion” like you’re claiming. No matter how much I disagreed with his reviews, I never thought of banning him once. I only exiled AMU from the group because of his harmful statements that go against not only the rules, but the core values of a fandom itself. His statement was essentially “I only make reviews on G5 to tear it down” and “I’m making a bold stance against something I hate, so suck it.” If you’re making reviews with the sole intention of tearing down something, you’re obviously not a fan of that thing. So I asked him, why was he even in the group if this generation never brought any sort of value to him? It was an honest question.
I’m glad he’s apologized and I personally forgive him. But that doesn’t excuse what he did, and you’re sure not changing my mind with what you’re saying. He apologized and his ban sentence has long since expired weeks ago. I stand by my decision and he’s sorry for what he did. We’re both even now and I consider the matter settled. Let’s just leave it at that and call it a day.
I don't believe you owe anyone an apology.
5778316
From people who dislike something ...
It is not immoral to hate a piece of media, it is not immoral to make a negative review of a piece of media because you hate it. Also, there's massive gulf between 'supporting' someone and persecuting them.
Says you.
Oh, that must have been so hard for you, standing idly by while someone voices opinions that you disagree with.
What harm. Nobody was harmed by AMU's statement.
Do you know what a mature adult does when someone vehemently hates one of their favorite pieces of fiction?
No, it's not to go on a """moral""" crusade and cut all ties with them, that is what children do. The mature adult thing to do is to AGREE TO DISAGREE. Fiction isn't that important, if you are willing to fucking go to war with someone because they disrespected a piece of fiction you love, that's a moral failing on your end.
5778324
Well…you can’t reason with crazy, and I certainly tried my best. I already stated multiple times that this situation amounted to a lot more than just his opinions alone. I “agreed to disagreed” multiple times and only acted when he stated he wanted nothing more than to see tear G5 down and mindlessly bash it. If you still choose to be willfully ignorant and stubborn about a mistake EVEN AMU admitted to, then that’s on you. All I know is…the situation is over and I’m glad it is. History will ultimately determine the true victors of this situation, and I can say this…it’s not you as this drama was never about you or me. You are just someone who butted their nose into a situation that wasn’t ever about them. Thank you for proving me right though, that’s definitely appreciated. Ultimately, I’m moving on. Like I said, all I did was come in here to say that I accept AMU’s apology and if all you’re going to do is accuse me of “moral crusading,” then that reflects badly more on you than it does me.
5778326
Lol, 'everyone who doesn't agree with my self-appointed moral duty is crazy'.
Bud, you're the one moralizing about whether someone likes a cartoon. Nobody appointed you the thought police, nobody who matters actually cares about the 'purity' of AMU's motives in making his reviews.
Lol, pretentious much. History will say jack shit about this argument.
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5778327
I realize that this may not be my place to say this, but...
In a way, I think you're both right.
What I said two weeks ago was something that apparently caused a different interpretation than intended, and even if it was never meant to offend anyone, it was clear that many were incredibly hurt by the comment. And that I was too emotionally-imbalanced. However, what also doesn't make things any better is when the readers in-turn don't take the time to actually communicate further on the issue right away rather than immediately jumping the gun and acting with anger in turn. In my case, Blue EM2 had at one point given me a message via PM that was incredibly hurtful before declaring that our friendship was over, and I still feel sour because of it.
I'm not saying this necessarily to agree with any of you. I just wanted to add my 2 cents on the matter.
5778330
That’s honestly the best interpretation of this situation, honestly. I don’t know what went down between you and Blue, but from what he told me himself, it tore him up inside to cut ties with you. Even now, it still hurts him. But he did what he thought was right in the hopes of shaking you out of that mindset. Even now it still hurts him, so much to the point where he told me there wouldn’t be any point in attempting to reconcile because that bridge has been burned. I’m gonna be honest, I do feel responsible for this in a way as I was the one who showed him that thread to begin with. I never thought it would end in you two leaving on bad terms and I still hate the fact that was the outcome of things. But I do understand why he did it. What you said was awful and it was something that neither of us could stand by in good faith. There were consequences to it.
But you’re trying to make up for that, and I commend you for that. At least I’m willing to give you a second chance as you’re taking all the right steps to be better. I admire that, and I want you to know that you can come back from this, even if some things can’t be repaired.
5778331
Unfortunately, he broke our friendship off because of more than just that.
In the same message, he also stated that he didn’t want to be my friend anymore because he thinks I’m homophobic and transphobic, which I’m not. And, he also doesn’t like the fact that I support a certain American politician, which I won’t give the name of. He went on to say other hurtful things like “Twilight Sparkle would be very disappointed in you”, and he even went so far as to say that I’m like Sprout! SPROUT! And that’s despite the fact that I’m nothing like that character and openly loathe Sprout to the point of wanting to kill him!
I’m sorry if I’m going into a rant, it’s just…I wanted to give you more details on the message as a whole.
5778332
I think I know the name of said politician you’re referring to. I won’t go into my views on him here because we don’t need to, but…I think I understand why Blue would think of you as at least transphobic. You know that…not all of us are over the whole MysteryMuffin situation, and he ended up taking the things you and Brady said to them more personally than I did. I think if you apologized for the situation a lot sooner than you did, then that could’ve been salvaged, but you didn’t, and your stubbornness (i.e: fighting with other users on your user homepage) was something that stuck with Blue in a negative light. I’d know because he talked to me about it on more than one occasion, and I could tell that what he perceived as anti-trans rhetoric coming from you really hurt him. To top that off, this situation…it’s no wonder your friendship came crumbling down. You may not be aware of it, but some of your inflammatory statements do reflect that of Sprout, whether you realize that or not. The same anger, that same tone…the same sort of arguments…you get the idea. It may seem outlandish to you as it’s hard to see how low you stoop when you’re just so caught up in the moment (something that I again relate to), but both of us saw that reflected in you, and it was something we were genuinely concerned about.
Ultimately, I’m sorry that happened. I know you and he were close and I never wanted to get between you two. I guess sometimes things don’t always work out the way you intend them to and that really sucks. It does, and if I was him, I would’ve forgiven you. But I get why he didn’t, and it’s his choice. Thanks for letting me in on more of the message.
5778335
You’re welcome.
And to be honest, I’m not sure if our friendship can ever repaired. The things he said to me, and his judgmental accusations despite not knowing me face-to-face, were hurtful enough to leave me feeling scarred on the inside. Maybe if he apologized, things will be better. But if not…the animosity will just persist.
And that is where I disagree. I’m not some manchild who thinks he’s above everyone and acts as though he lost his toy, and unlike Sprout, I actually learn from the mistakes I make once I realize what I’ve done wrong.
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With friends like this, who needs enemies?
I would reiterate that, if Blue wants to break your friendship for such reasons, you're better off without him.
Lol, if it means anything, the Twilight Sparkle from my fic would disagree with this claim.
5778330
Don't thank people who genuinely mistreat you for the lessons you learned from interacting with them. They are your achievement, but not these people's intent.
Admiral is a self-righteous fanatic who will be nice only when you don't disagree with him and will be the first to "jump the gun" as soon as he sees something he doesn't like. He continues to prove it right here. He called you crazy for what you said about G5 and then acts like nothing happened and he's very glad that you apologize. His reactions should not be a measure of appropriate behaviour.
5778316
You exiled him for "engaging in the spread of misinformation in an attempt to deceive others about a piece of G5 media", using a rule you created specifically to fight "haters". And you didn't bother to prove to AMU that it has been broken. No, you didn't even bother to pretend that you aren't de-facto banning him for the things he said outside of your group. Here is the post, if anyone wonders. And then you went into The Insane Creators Guild and shamelessly repeated that you ban AMU in your group for disliking G5. So yes, G5 fandom is an echo chamber and what's more important, you are making it one.
5778361
Hmm…”self-righteous fanatic” is a very strong term, wouldn’t you say? I’d more so refer to myself as a defender of what’s right. Of course, you wouldn’t see that because it brings you so much more joy to be mad about something rather than support it. I know what I need to do to accomplish true harmony in this fandom and if people like you get in the way of that by accusing me of stuff I didn’t do…well, stuff like this happens. It’s just the sad truth of how things are. But like I said, I’m always open to giving people second chances, so if they apologize to me or others, then I consider the matter settled. I’m not a monster like you claim. I’m simply a product of the climate I’ve been in. Everything I do exists to serve the grander whole and nothing else. My mission is to protect the G5 fandom and see to its growth, even if that comes at the expense of the hatedom. Nothing more, nothing less.
Why would I need to prove to him at length that the rule’s been broken? That’s not the admin’s job and members are not infants. He knew what he was doing. We exist only to moderate, keep watch, and warn. The person doing the offense should already know what they’re doing wrong by rereading the group rules, which I always provide. And if they still don’t understand, they’re always welcome to PM me for additional clarification. It’s a fair system here.
Oh look at you. The brave and glorious SMT5015 is attempting to expose me for the supposed “fraud” I am. Well newsflash. Unlike you, I have principles and I stick to them. I could not in good conscience let them be a part of the group while they were saying horrible things like this. And I’m not the only person who thinks this way, believe me. And the ban was temporary because I’m a nice person and I believe others should be forgiven. Where are you on the forgiveness spectrum, eh? Ah yes, attempting to expose a fan for doing his job to keep the community he’s responsible for safe, as well as calling me names. That definitely shows you’re the one in the right here.
All fandoms are echo chambers by design, dude. It’s just a matter of how good you are at concealing that fact.
5778383
I really do have to set the record straight. AMU had been repeatedly told that what he was saying was incorrect, and yet he continued to post it.
5778361
Yes, so much this. I cannot even comprehend a moral standard that holds 'hate-reviewing' a children's tv show as a cardinal moral sin that actively """harms""" people ... somehow.
Honestly, I think it's all just self indulgent cope to justify bad behavior. Like bullying a lonely autistic man for disagreeing with the hivemind.
And the gaslighting is unreal.
I'll be honest, this entire event makes me glad that I am a FiM enjoyer and not a G5 fan.
5778403
Yes, yes, AMU is 'guilty' of Wrongthink and Heresy against Progressive [current year] politics.
5778338
Wear their hatred as a badge of pride,
5778410
Also got to love the instantaneous downvotes on all comments that push back against the Admiral. Can someone say botting?
5778403
And I do have to set the record straight. AMU has been banned for what he said outside of the group. Admiral had no right to do that, unless the rules say that every member of the group has to follow a code everywhere on this site. And if they say, he should have referenced that part and not the "no lying about G5 in this group" rule.
5778410
Not the case, actually. There's a different between wrongthink and saying something that's objectively false.
5778413
He wasn't kicked out due to something outside the group, he asked to leave.
5778415
Look up my link. In fact, you mentioned this thread first, that's how I learned that Admiral declared ban twice. Yes he did. And AMU requested to leave only after that. And why would he need a request anyway if he could just press the button at any time (unless being banned blocks that option, it makes no sense)? Then, read why exactly Admiral banned AMU. In both cases he stated that it was for what happened in The Insane Creators Guild.
5778416
That conversation happened a day after the incident in the Official G5 Site. They weren't at the same time. And a temporary ban removes the ability to leave a group specifically to prevent ban evasion.
5778417
According to the site both ban declarations and the request to leave happened on the same day. And why does it matter anyway? Why does it matter so much that you ignored everything else in my answers?
5778414
And what exactly did AMU say that was 'objectively false' oh Arbiter of All Truth? And why did such 'falsehood' demand this response.
5778415
Nice shifting the goalposts there, lol. SMT did not say 'kicked out of the group', he said 'banned' and yes, our dear Admiral did ban AMU from his 'Official' G5 group for some things AMU said in the Insane Creators Guild. HE EXPLICITELY STATES THAT IN THE FORUM POST LINKED IN THIS BLOG POST.
Also, didn't you cut off all contact with AMU, what are you doing here in his blog posts, lol.
5778410
Sneed incel to you too, fellow 4channellerino, brah.
5778497
lol