What are your views on the Kobayashi Maru?

It's something that needs to be used in real life cause there are often no win situations in life so it should be in some form a regular part of education

6478847

Got a commendation for original thinking.

And to help find those who can beat it.

6478857
I figured out how to beat it, but I'm going to put the answer in my Silver Star Apple fic.

i think that if a captain irl shows fear in that type of simulation they have no bussiness commanding a ship ....like kirk i dont belive i n a no win simulation

6478840
It's a dick move. Just make normal simulations that are hard enough that people fail sometimes if you want to see how they handle failure.

Why do you even care how they react in an actually unwinnable scenario? By definition they can't win, so does it really matter if they fail gracefully or not?

6478973
Maybe they think they'd rather see "Shit, that didn't work. Try plan 3! 4! 5!" than "Oh shit, my plan didn't work. We're all gonna die and it's all my fault and REEEEEEEE"

I think the KM specifically is silly, mostly because it's infamy defeats the point entirely. If a cadet goes into the simulation already knowing there's no way to win, there's no point in the exercise at all. Even if everyone who runs it signs an NDA, you know rumours are going to leak out.

As for unwinnables in general, they're only as good as whoever wrote them.

And as for Kirk specifically, defeating it by hacking is not original thinking, it defeats the entire purpose, proves nothing, and would probably land you a month of latrine duty.

My opinion on the Kobayashi Maru: It worked better when it was something of a Noodle Incident. The reboots showing us exactly went down made it completely ridiculous.

I do believe in the usefulness of the K M training scenario, although I don't believe that cadets should go into it with their eyes open. Let's see how they react to severe stress, while also testing whether they will risk their ship in order to retrieve a doomed ship.

On the other hand, if cadets went into the simulation with their eyes open, it could test their resourcefulness. I would personally ask Engineering to make me a harpoon with a replicated Kevlar shoelace, a ginormous magnet (or something else that would stick to the hull) and a bunch of guidance thrusters: it would take a while, but the Maru would be retrieved without my ship having crossed the line. And yes: the scenario says that the Maru is loosing its life support systems, but, unlike Start Trek always tells us, the Maru would still have hours to days of oxygen in the air.

6478857
No so people learn you can't always win sometimes you lose and don't get a Participation award. In fact those should be removed all together. Fist place winner gets a trophy second place a medal third a certificate saying get better and any worse you get nothing.

There's no such thing as a no-win situation. There are only situations where you need to define what sacrifices are acceptable for what victory condition. Kobayashi Maru is an example of a situation where the ideal conclusion is not tenable. That doesn't mean there is no victory condition at all.

6479932

There's no such thing as a no-win situation.

I'm sorry to tell you, but this a completely false statement.
Just off the top of my head:

• 1945. The Pacific War. Washington. Problem: The Pacific War is irrevocably decided, as the Japanese are without allies, without supply lines, without war industry and the US military is decidedly making ground. Thing is: the Japanese emperor is an absolute bastard that doesn't care at all for the lives of his own people and has decreed to the military to not surrender alive, while brainwashed the civilians into thinking that death was inevitable at the hands of the Americans and that killing themselves would be so much quicker and pleasant. And it happens that, as the US makes way into the Japanese isles, Japanese soldiers cannot be taken prisoner because they will stab you in the back, and Japanese civilians are opening the guts of their own children and jumping off cliffs rather than accepting being occupied. And not even the fire-bombing of Tokyo, which killed over 120,000 civilians in their sleep, will impress the top fucker. And of course, American soldiers are extremely demoralised by them having to summarily execute every surrendering soldier, plus the civilian self-genocide. Solution: The atomic bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was actually meant to save the Japanese population by scaring the top fucker into surrendering. And it worked.

Honestly, I don't think I need another example. There is such a thing as a no-win situation.

6480654
You just described a bloody victory. Emphasis on victory.

There's no such thing as a no-win situation. There are only situations where you need to define what sacrifices are acceptable for what victory condition.