Correcting the Critics #2: "Save MLP" · 11:43pm Sep 25th, 2023
It's been a while since I did my last part in the series. But recently, I saw something that encouraged this installment. A tweet pointing out what someone said 10 months prior. On November 25th 2022, Fluttercheer made a blog post on this site about Save MLP and sent a message about how supporters of that group don't deserve to read his fanfics. On September 24th 2023, the leader of the Save MLP group posted a tweet in response to Fluttercheer's blog post.
I will not name specific names of that group, nor will I post links to them because they don't deserve the promotion, and Twitter as it is now can go suck my [REDACTED] for all I care. Twitter is a breeding ground of toxicity on the internet, and that was even before the "new management". And that's why Twitter is the perfect place of members of Save MLP.
There are a few claims that Save MLP makes that are BS. And by a few, I mean nearly all of them. But we'll start with the tweet that started this installment off.
Lol, Fluttercheer thinks Save MLP is a harassment campaign and its members are terrorists! They even block followers who support it! This is what a toxic fan really looks like!
Because tweets are short by design, I'll just jump right in.
Fluttercheer thinks Save MLP is a harassment campaign
Fluttercheer thinks Save MLP is a harassment campaign because Save MLP is a harassment campaign. If I were to list descriptions of Save MLP the way products will list ingredients from highest quantity to lowest quantity, the second thing that would be on the Save MLP ingredients list would be "a harassment campaign" (the #1 spot being given the description of "obsessed").
and its members are terrorists!
Honestly, I don't like Fluttercheer describing them as terrorists. But this marks #3 on the groups ingredient list, misrepresentation. Fluttercheer wasn't directly calling Save MLP terrorists, they were using terrorists as an analogy.
Imagine the brony fandom's own, little pariah group of terrorists who try to force their will on everyone and you got it just right and know what Save MLP is.
I could be mistaken about Fluttercheer's intent, but that's how I interpret it. As an analogy.
They even block followers who support it!
This is an example of the group's hypocrisy (#4). One of my accounts has been blocked simply because I disagree. I'll grant that maybe I got a little too passionate with my wording. But it's another count of misrepresentation (I'm wondering if misrepresentation should be #2). Yes, they blocked members of Save MLP. But what the tweet doesn't tell you is that Fluttercheer gave them the chance to stop following their channel first. They only blocked them if they failed to comply with that warning.
Six followers of mine are supporting this campaign by being members of its group here on FIMFiction.net. I also know that some users only joined the Save MLP group to protest the campaign and to tell its members to stick it somewhere, after which they either left the group again or got banned from it, but these six members who happen to be my followers are not among those. They joined the group and stayed there and they are obviously keeping track of updates about the campaign.
I know exactly who you are. Unfollow me and if you haven't done so in a couple days, I will take initiative myself and block you. I will do the same if any of you comment on one of my stories or blog entries or on my userpage and if you ever refollow me, I will also block you. If I have already blocked you because you didn't leave yourself, I will momentarily unblock you and then block you again right after to remove your follow once more
The members of the group should consider themselves lucky that they were given this warning. That's something that Save MLP doesn't do. Do you know how frustrating it is on Twitter to be in a conversation with someone, and then suddenly, without warning or explanation, to be blocked? What's also annoying is if you are warned, but not given enough time to see the warning before being blocked. That happened to me once too (unrelated to MLP) Someone warned by to stop replying to their tweets. Fair enough. But by the time I saw that warning, I had already been blocked.
This is what a toxic fan really looks like!
If what Fluttercheer did is considered being a toxic fan, then what would being worse than toxic look like? Maybe they were right in describing Save MLP as terrorists, because that would be a level beyond toxic. And what Save MLP does certainly is worse than what Fluttercheer did. Alternatively, if I'm not calling Save MLP "beyond toxic", then if Fluttercheer is what a toxic fan looks like, Save MLP must be different in the sense that they aren't fans.
But it's simpler than that. This would be, I believe, #5 on the list, projection.
I will be paraphrasing the next few claims that Save MLP made because I don't feel like tracking down each and every tweet to quote from. And that's assuming they haven't deleted the tweets, because they've done that before.
Save MLP has claimed that it's just a matter of time before Hasbro listens to them and revises G4 Season 9 and retcons G5.
I don't even understand this reasoning unless they honestly believe that if they harass Hasbro long enough, they'll get their way. Do you know what other group had this mindset? MAGA. Do you know what group still hasn't gotten their way because no matter how much they harass, they can't change reality? I'll give you 3 guesses, and the first 2 don't count.
But even with a group as obsessed as Save MLP, they can only continue to harass Hasbro for so long before they realize that when Hasbro says that they're done with G4, they mean that they're done with G4.
On that note...
MLP is making G4 references in G5. That proves that Hasbro isn't done with G4
Just because G5 makes G4 references, it doesn't mean G5 is G4. If making reference to a previous generation means that they're not done with that generation, then that's proof that Hasbro isn't even done with G1.
The characters are OOC in G4 Season 9
I'm not aware that character growth equates to being out of character. You know, there's a certain anti-brony who thinks like that.
Lauren Faust's original plans were bad.
(For context, this is in reference to the fact that Twilight becoming the ruler was Lauren Faust's original intent.) First of all, this implies that the group speaks for the entire fandom, which they don't (#6). Secondly, that opinion is in such a minority that even extremist groups will claim that the show got worse AFTER Faust left. And finally, assuming Save MLP was objectively right on this inherently subjective topic, that doesn't change the fact that everything you love about G4 absolutely wouldn't have existed without Faust taking the reigns in the first place (heh, horse pun).
When Hasbro retcons G5 and revises G4 Season 9, the fans of the show will love the revision just as much as the original.
This is another count of Save MLP claiming to represent the desires of the people.
The Majority of Bronies are wrong for liking Season 9.
If it's a majority consensus, perhaps the side who's wrong is the minority that says Season 9 should be revised.
And here's a favorite of mine...
When we buy a controlling share of Hasbro, we'll order that MLP G5 be retconned and G4 Season 9 be revised.
The reason this is a favorite of mine is that it demonstrates just how deluded the members of this group are. Hasbro's net worth is $9.25 billion. In order to have a controlling share, the members of Save MLP will require a minimum of $4.625 billion. And assuming every single Brony in the world chipped in to buy Hasbro, that would still be approximately $500 per person. But if I were to look at the petition as an example of how many people actually support Save MLP, then every single supporter of Save MLP on average would have to be a multi-millionaire.
Though that may be my favorite, it's not the last.
G4's ending doesn't make sense.
G4's ending is bad.
G4 needs to be open ended.
I've grouped them together, and I'm sure that every single Brony who gives a damn will agree with me that there was no other way G4 could've ended than to close the book. But I've heard variants of all 3 of these arguments from Save MLP. But the one I want to address the most is the first one. The reason they say the ending (the closing of the book) doesn't make sense is because the book at the beginning wasn't the story about the Mane 6, it was the book that Twilight was reading. My counterargument is "What's your point?". Because the book closing was supposed to be symbolic for us as the viewers. The first thing we saw was the book opening up. So it makes sense that the last thing we see is a book closing.
Here's a fan theory to consider. Save MLP said that eh opening of the book wasn't the book of Twilight and her friends' adventures. But what if the entirety of G4 WAS a story? Perhaps the voice of Celestia at the beginning is Celestia's narration of the book that she herself wrote about Twilight and her friends. This would actually be a good way to explain some continuity errors between G4 and G5. G4 was based on a true story, but written by Celestia, who now and again took creative liberties. This could even explain some continuity errors within G4 itself. That way, the opening and closing of the book can both be considered literal (as well as symbolic for us the views).
I wouldn't personally subscribe to this fan theory. But what are fan theories for other than to add your own interpretation to the lore? And considering that I made it myself, and I do like the idea, it's a theory that's I'd honestly love it if others adopted the idea just for the sake of speculation. (It's also my way of giving Save MLP's claim of the closing book to making sense the middle finger.)
As a final note, I'd like to take a note from Fluttercheer. If anyone is from Save MLP, though I won't just ban you, I will ask you not to start anything. And I will ask any members of that group to NOT follow me. Because like Fluttercheer said, you don't deserve to read my stories. This will also be your one and only warning. If any of you do in fact start trouble, you will be blocked.
Hello king!
I'm not in the group and I have negative percentage of intention to do so.
so I hope you don't mind if I start a conversation at least.
If you don't agree with it that's fine.
But I ask that you remember that I'm not defending Save MLP or Lambasting you or FlutterCheer. I'm giving my points of view.
An analogy for comparison. And people generally do not like to be compared to terrorists. Also, FlutterCheer has "#terrorists" in the blog tags. I would definitely say that this all feels more like implying they are terrorists than simply just comparing. Is that right or wrong? No clue... but im sure it upset someone.
That's great, i even saw that someone reaserched the group and saw that Fluttercheer was correct and left the group. A soul has been saved... yay!
But here is the thing... thats still asking someone who follows you and likes your stuff not to follow you and enjoy your content because they follow something you don't agree with, and there obviously CAN be people in that group that don't know about the harassment.
Any way you slice that, there are people that don't agree with that kind of reaction.
Who is the follow button for? Does anyone have the right to tell you what you can and can't follow on a legal public platform?
On places other than twitter? Yes... and it is awefull. And whoever did that should be ashamed and lambasted.
But I still don't think that excuses blocking individuals in return or threatening people to unfolow you or you will block them. Unless they are harassing you and you have to block them to get you to stop, then that's what you gotta do.
Are you sure the individual deserves that treatment? If you are sure, then fine. You would know better than I, and I must conceed that it is your prerogative to do as such. I do not know anyone in that group. Hell, I follow 10 things on Twitter and I don't even remember what they are but I know none of them are this.
Or, hear me out, toxicity begets toxicity.
In every single group there are extremists and passionate people that can border or evolve into toxicity... but what causes the extremists to grow and multiply: is adding more extremism to it.
But again, I don't know these people better than you, I'm just giving an opinion based on my own experience. So if they are all really that bad, then fine. Just make sure you know what you are standing against.
Also, I don't think this makes her a toxic fan, just being a bit toxic in return on this particular situation.
They probably believe what is on the tin...
If they voice their grievances enough someone will think about it. At the very least they have a group that they can hang around in.
After the first season? I mean, it felt diffrent after she left... but most i know say the first season is the hardest to rewatch with a few episode exceptions.
I dissagree. Kinda... I could like it either way. I dissagree with you also saying every single brony that gives a damn agrees with you.
But I can see an argument for open ended.
It's better for the imagination and continuing fanfics. Now canon is locked into what it is and that's that.
The problem is, Gen5 is actively messing with Gen4 and I see a bunch of people now HATING twiggy sparkles and saying that the world of Gen4 was DESTINED to fall. And that friendship was destined to fail. This is terrible. It destroys much of the magic and fun of Gen4.
Honestly, this would piss me off.
Like how Flashpoint upsets me by getting rid of everything that happened before and makes all that we saw before and got invested in pointless. Leaves me feeling hollow.
I CAN agree with EVERYTHING ELSE... but this.
It makes you sound arrogant. Perhaps find a new wording? Or not... it's not like I'm important or anything.
I'm just a dumb schmuck that saw this blog in my feed and decided I was willing to choose death today.
If anything I said upset you for any reason, I apologize. I dont do things like this often.
.
.
.
But seriously though...
Sigh... come on man... Now you go and insult some of my friends and family by bringing polotics into this. Keep polotics out friend. People vote for any dork that waves a sign like Obama's "Change" or Trump's "MAGA." I hate Trump for my own reasons, but I suggest you remember that these are people you so callously disregard like that.
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Fair point. I personally disagree with Fluttercheer's use of the word "terrorists". But just because people wouldn't like to be compared with them, it doesn't mean the comparison can't be made.
This is why I have mixed feelings. Just like how the follow button exists for a reason, the block button exists for a reason too. Fluttercheer's reaction was a bit too hard in my opinion. But the idea of not wanting to be affiliated in any way with the group makes sense, even if that affiliation is simply through the followers.
Fluttercheer is certainly being far more strict than necessary. As you said not everyone in the group are aware of the harassment. But that's why I wouldn't rely on someone simply being a member of that group. The higher-ups who know what they're doing though, I'll most certainly block them if they start trouble.
Twitter in a nutshell. Even I can become toxic on Twitter, and I don't like who I become when that happens. So I try to keep it to a minimum these days.
I don't know everyone in the group either. But I have interacted with Mixmaster before, as well as at least one other member.
My point was that I don't think she's a toxic fan either. I was pointing out that Mixmaster said "this is what a toxic fan looks like"
Mixmaster isn't just a member of the group. He's the leader, or at least one of them. So he's not buying into what is on the tin, he's the one making the tins.
Well, some people tend to connect Faust with the first 3 seasons. And she did stay on for a bit after the first season in the background.
Fair enough. But I think when compared to other ways it could've ended, I think the closing of the book was the best option.
I think that kind of mindset is the result of a lack of imagination. Just because the show wasn't left open-ended, it doesn't mean that fanfics can't continue where it left off. There are plenty of shows with close-ended endings. And yet fanfics are still made of those shows. Perhaps there can still be adventures for Twilight and the group to go on in the future. And let's not forget that there's that time-skip that can easily be filled. And there are always AUs. And Equestria Girls was left open-ended.
The problem with that thinking is that Gen5 has absolutely no impact on Gen4. Any lore that Gen5 adds to the events and characters of Gen4 is still exclusive to Gen5, because that's not Gen4 lore, that's Gen5 lore.
Besides, Gen4's continuity has been questionable anyway.
I could understand that this would piss people off... if I suggested that the entirety of Gen4 was a work of fiction. My idea can be as simple as the events of the show being what happened, but the opening and closing of the book being Celestia transcribing the event into a book. Star Trek: Enterprise did something similar. In the end, it was Will Ryker on the holodeck learning about the past. But that doesn't mean that the entirety of the show took place on the holodeck.
In hindsight, I do think I should've worded that better. The fact of the matter is that when I say "group", I'm not referring to the group on this site. I'm referring specifically to the higher-ups in that group who are responsible for the harassment. I also don't intend to specifically comb through all of my followers and search through the Save MLP group to weed them out. And I don't intend to take any action unless they want to start trouble.
But in relation to Mixmaster, the leader of the group, I will act at the first sign of trouble. But I'm also not as strict as Fluttercheer. If they simply want to take part in a discussion, that's fine. I said that they don't deserve to read my stories. But I did post my stories for the sake of having them publicly viewed, so I won't just stop someone from reading my stories either.
Don't worry. I'm not that easily offended.
Again, I should've been more specific. Like when I referred to the Save MLP group, I meant the higher-ups like Mixmaster, when I refer to MAGA, I'm referring to the type of people who would take part in, or support the insurrection attempt. I'm comparing the higher-ups like Mixmaster, who take part in the harassment, to the insurrectionists. Like how the insurrectionists believe that they could threaten the government into changing the vote, people like Mixmaster think they can harass Hasbro into changing Season 9.
Also, the comparison is for the sake of comparing the similar mindset. And though I apologize for insulting your family, I don't apologize for making that comparison. I'm sure your friends and family wouldn't actually take part in violent acts like the insurrectionists did. (And technically, I insulted members of my own family as well.)
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That's fair, but one should always ask if it's a fair comparison. And also to be fair, the answer in this case could very well be "yes."
True. And I understand, but that's a difficult thing to control...
I understand and even agree.
Life in a nutshell if I'm being honest.
If I am to be honest with you, this is not my first attempt at this post that I wrote out for here.
And also, same. I spend a great ammount of time revising some things.
Fair. But that part where it extends on the "if she is then they can more easily be seen as something worse like terrorists" bit is... odd.
Fair, and you can absolutely say he and the other leaders should be leading the group better and are at fault here.
That would definitely be something important
to have said. Lol.
Very well. Honestly it would be kinda creepy anyway.
And you absolutely should. Heck, I wouldn't judge you one bit if you outright blocked him now.
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I unironically often prefer open ends.
However, those fics are often still built on and effected by cannon, and many even the ending.
But it does. Maybe not directly, but it does.
I know an author that canceled his entire story he was writing because of it. I miss that bug...
And I know another person that has considered canceling because of the new canon and the fact Gen4 is over and closed.
It also does effect people's opinions on the characters. The author Ocellus The Changeling admitted to one of the main reasons Twilight is her least favorite (was originally most hated before a bit of backlash) of the main characters was Seasons 6, 8, 9... and that G5 made it even worse.
To be fair they said they didn't even like them from the start
but this is the only instance of this I have a link to right now... I need to find the that really long one... it was a whole blog about how the world of G4 was destined to fail.
So regardless, it still effects the fans.
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The point was that Mixmaster is worse than Fluttercheer. But I get your point. And I suppose there is a jump from "toxic fan" to "terrorist".
I'll make an edit to make that clarification.
I might just do that.
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Well, if it means anything, the Season 10 Comics were left open-ended. And not just that, but unresolved. Not only did it end with villains promising to come back, which never happened, but the final panel of the last comic had Chrysalis starting to escape from her stone prison.
The thing about pointing out that it affects the fans is that that's a different discussion entirely.
From the context of what is canon, nothing G5 does can affect G4. Just because G4 is canon to G5, that's a one-way street. G5 is NOT canon to G4.
I get that stuff like this happens, and I get that it sucks. But I don't even have to point to G5 to argue for why feelings like this are temporary for a lot of people. How many people hated it when Twilight became an Alicorn? And compare that to how many people still hate it to this day. There are plenty of fanfics that stopped fitting with canon just because of that change alone. Not many forms of media are willing to make such a bold change like that. Just look at the Simpsons for what happens if you don't change. The Amazing World of Gumball does this in a clever way by acknowledging the episodic nature in a way where in one episode, they had the whole world end, and the next episode was like nothing happened. They acknowledged it by satirizing the idea. That's also why I respect what DBZ does. It's one of the few animated shows (not just anime) that shows characters growing up with time (and then Super gave character aging the middle finger). When the CMCs got their cutie marks, how many people were annoyed that their fanfics no longer fit with canon?
Simply put, I'll use the two words that Mykan hates the most. Things change. When it comes to G5, you either have to accept that there would've been a significant amount of time for change to happen between G4 and G5, learn how to distance G4 from G5 and enjoy them as separate entities, or be miserable about it. (I don't mean to imply that there are only three choices, but that's all I could think of. And I don't mean to sound crass, it's just my bluntly honest opinion.)
I suppose that mindset makes sense if A. you consider your fic to keep in line with the canon of the show, and B. you consider G5 canon to G4. If you want an excuse to have a fic that's no longer canon be able to still fit with canon, G4 gave us an excuse to do just that. In fact, there are 2 excuses. The first would be the mirror portal in EQG. That makes alternate realities canon (this was also expanded upon in the comics). And the second was the Season 5 Finale, which shows that alternate timelines are canon. So technically, G4 gave fanfic writers permission to do whatever we want to still allow it to potentially be canon in some form. And because G4 is canon to G5, this applies to G5 as well. And that can include tiny tweeks to canon like perhaps Opaline never existing. That way, you have a G4 world that's NOT doomed to failure (I disagree with that "doomed" mindset anyway, but you get the idea).
I actually don’t think I’ve heard of Save MLP.
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Simply put, it's a group that hates FiM's Season 9 and has been harassing Hasbro to have it revised. Or, to put it simply, they want their own fanfic to be canon. What they have in mind isn't that bad of an idea. But harassing Hasbro to make their idea canon, and claiming that everyone who likes Season 9 as is is wrong for liking it... if there was one way to do thing wrong, Save MLP (specifically Mixmaster) are doing it wrong.
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Oh ok. Now I get it.