I read some of these TCB fics, and I can only say this...

I am Disturbed at what happens in these stories. Forced assimilation, memory wipes, fake memories being implanted inside your head, the death of humanity as a species, the way our very minds and souls are forcibly changed, Celestia as genicidal maniac. I will be having nightmares for weeks now.

311691
If shit like that gives you nightmares, stay the fuck out of my beloved gorefics. -__-;

To be serious, though, TCB does suck. Fucking misanthropes. Oh, and clean up your English.

311696 I'm 19 and I can't even stand to play Code Varonica X for more than five minutes at a time. (I am a bit of a fraidy cat but I will try to look at something scary for the thrills it gives me)

311691

Welcome to one of my primary motivators for starting this group.

Keep in mind, however, that there are some good TCB fics. Ones that subvert all of those ethical issues that the others discard or even celebrate. A couple of them are listed amongst the stories in this group.

Also keep in mind that while disgust for some of the themes presented in many TCB fics motivated the existence of this group... our purpose here is more about reminding people that we (as a species) don't actually entirely suck. There's already an anti-TCB group. We're more of an anti-general misanthropy group.

Personally, I try to post at least one new thread about something I've found that rekindles the hope in my species that docs like those try to stomp out (such as "The Psychology of Disasters" or the Hans Rosling TED talks post).

I encourage everyone here to be as positive as they can, rather than dwelling on disgust for specific stories or authors. Because I want people to come here to feel good about themselves and their peers.

311700 Thanks.

311698
18, and more than willing to get my guts ripped out (vicariously) for fun.

311691 (I wrote this on the MLP Forum awhile back. I know how you feel.)

Just need a little reassurance here. I've started to read, the Conversion Bureau by Blaze. I must say, I'm a little disturbed by it. When I first became a brony, I thought I found a group of fellow idealists who believed in their fellow man. Then I pick this up and it sounds like "James Cameron's: My Little Pony." The amount of misanthropy in the first few chapters is very disheartening. I can understand the need to set off the plot. Why are humans ponifying en masse? Okay! I get it, but there's already a justification given. There's a magic plague that ponies are immune to. BAM! Right there. You still have all the outside resistance from the human hold outs, who now have believable reasons to resist Equestrian dominance. We're destroying ourselves? We've been doing that since the invention of the nuke, before that WWI, before that the Napoleonic Wars, before THAT the Sengoku period, before THAT the Crusades, I could go back to the Trojan War! (Don't fight a historian when it comes to precedence. ) Anyway. The story has, so far, failed to mention the Lunar landing, the American Revolution, the Renaissance, Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Benjamin Franklin, Mother Theresa, or any of human society's achievements. The main character states our species is driven by hate and greed and would buy and sell land in Equestria. (Private property?)
Lily: "The Horror! The Horror!" What nailed it was Twilight responding with "Very well put," what was?! That was an opinionated supposition at best! Then we had Rainbow Dash saying "Let them stay in that manure-hole they live in." and Pinkie's "Human bodies are icky and big and ugly and...and mean! Humans are mean!" . . . All right! That last one was just a slap in the face! Hearing the characters I've grown to love (and identify as human) loose such venom on my species is just hurtful and not a little bit out-of-character. When Zecora showed up, they were irrationally suspicious, but they didn't break out the torches and pitchforks!

Now maybe I'm jumping the gun a bit, since it IS early in the story. Not saying I'm gonna stop reading it. With a premise THIS kickass, how could I? (Plus a bit of human OC Fluttershy romance is never a bad thing. ) I just want to know if the story changes it's pitch about us later, or at least gets mentioned less as the plot picks up. So far, I just have to say I'm a little shocked. I thought the brony community was about hope in our potential to love and create. Can you honestly say a species of homicidal extortionists could create this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgNn8RLHrhk&list=PLB94D64777F760CD8&index=5&feature=plpp_video

311787

And there is the rub. If the original TCB stories were about ponies learning that maybe, just maybe, humans aren't actually so bad, then they wouldn't be so bad.

However, it is a constant theme that the only way humans are redeemable is through ponyfication which, if you recall, makes fundamental alterations to your personality when you go through with it. Throughout, the message remains thus: the only way to be good/better is to just plain not be human at all.

I also agree that the setting has a lot of potential for character development and moral complexity... and am thoroughly infuriated that most stories do nothing with it or, worse, use it as an excuse to say "ponies good, humans bad". if you want more detail, go to the tv tropes page for a good overview.

Again, though, I want this group to focus more on combating general misanthropy (not just TCB) and emphasizing the good points of humanity. A palette cleanser, of sorts, for when people run into something exceedingly misanthropic.

Also, there are good stories based off of the TCB universe. Heck, we have a few listed here.

Why do those authors hate their own race so much?

312062

I think it's less about hatred and more about a lack of hope combined with an overabundance of cynicism.

The thing is, most cynics tend to question everything... except their own cynicism. Like everything else, it requires a balance. And hope for the future allows us to continue striving towards a better one.

At the risk of becoming an object of ridicule, I actually have had a Conversion Bureau nightmare.

I know someone mentioned gorefics, but honestly those never bothered me much. Covering everything in buckets of blood is easy. Accidentally making a work that endorses genocide and all that other "fun" stuff, then having that take off and become hugely popular with some authors dedicating hundreds of thousands of words to it and saying "yeah, this would totally be a good thing" is a different beast entirely.

312479, if you don't mind, what was that nightmare?

312065 For an example of a balanced cynic, or rather, a man who codified what it means to live practically. Look no further then Niccolo Machiavelli. Despite believing in the good of people, I often find myself agreeing with his lessons on policy. At least the man lived by his principles and fought, wrote, and governed with a grand purpose. Not like most of these guys who just complain about how much they hate all mankind has achieved.

312479 I know exactly what you mean. Cupcakes, Rainbow Factory, etc. shook me up a bit, but I wasn't traumatized or disillusioned by them. TCB comes along and I think "This is such a cool idea!" *proceeds to read original* . . . . What . . . the . . . . HELL IS WRONG WITH THIS GUY?! Others such as Purple Prose's "First Contact" weren't quiiiiite as bad but those still had some pretty eye rolling moments. I was truly disheatened, for the first time about our community. I felt like the ones who brought me such hope for my generation had betrayed me. I felt like the collective drive and talent of this community showed that the world was on the verge of a breakthrough because we believed in what we did. To hear my fellow bronies renounce their world and species with as much repulsion the haters gave us broke my heart! Ironically, it was this sentiment of outrage that inspired me to begin writing my own. It's my very first fanfiction! My thoughts were something like. "I can't believe this kickass setting is being wasted with this self hating garbage! What about the mix of sci-fi and fantasy? How does ponification remove that which makes humans human? Putting Barry the Chopper in a new body didn't make him less of a serial killer! (Fullmetal Alchemist reference.) I oughta do something about this." And that's how I started writing my first creation. (Still working on it an could use some help.)

311990 I know there are good stories. I'm writing one! It's my first and while I want to try and tackle moral issues, I'm mostly trying to tell a story of the hero's journeys through both worlds and how the merging of both is benefiting all. The HLF (at least the ones running the show) exist because they hate the power the Conversion Bureaus have. Equestria has no quarrel with them, it's influence is widespread but peaceful and optional, yet they take hostile and hateful action because the ponies' mere existence is an affront to them. Sound familiar? I also expand upon the Conversion Bureau mythos by adding elements from the Equestrian side that rarely get brought up in most versions. Lastly, and more to the point of this topic, the story is meant to exalt bronies as the leaders of our generation! The best of us will soon be the leaders in art, business, and science!

Hilariously correct here!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yb2Dxqt1oag

312968

Hehe, I have that same video linked on the front page of the group. It's a goodie.

If you're writing your own TCB fic, I highly recommend you go to this thread and watch the TED talk videos posted there. Particularly, the ones by Hans Rosling and the "Single Story" one. Hans Rosling will give you a good overview of the current state of the world and where it's headed (there are a lot of common misconceptions on that point) and the Single Story is just plain incredible.

It's an ambitious endeavor, writing one. Just keep in mind the essential humanity of your human and your pony characters. I don't see enough Trixies and Flim Flams and asshole Canterlot Nobles on the pony side a lot of the time, while the human side often has half of its characters as either misguided or terrorists.

You should also keep in mind that a lot of people just plain wouldn't choose to give up their human shape, regardless of benefits (I'm one). People, even the destitute, often take pride in their achievements and wouldn't want them rendered moot. Just creating the option would generate massive amounts of patriotic fervor. Nationalist movements would gain a lot of traction in many countries.

Lastly, I would personally be very interested in seeing someone cover the Equestrian side of things. How would they handle a sudden influx of, say, 2 billion new citizens? Any modern country's economy and infrastructure (such as housing and food production) would be utterly devastated by a quarter that many (even Europe, China, or the US).

And it's not like the show has shown us that they can magically produce food and shelter. In fact, it's been very clear that they don't even have particularly efficient farming and crop growing techniques. They make constant commentary on Applejack's farm never having enough bits to get new equipment, so they have an economy based on scarcity, just like we do. And they have shown a disparity between the rich nobility and ponies like Pinkie's rock farming family, who basically lived in a hovel. So they have a wealth gap and an upper class.

I would venture to say that Equestria would be quickly torn apart by the influx of so many ponified humans, unless they're constantly gathering new resources by expanding the barrier and taking over human territory. But then they're the bad guys of the story, because humans are now getting displaced and they're aggressively annexing land that doesn't belong to them. Essentially, fixing the problem they created for themselves by pushing it unto the nations from which they choose to steal valuable land and resources.

My prediction? Mass starvation, recession, and poverty. It's what always happens when to put far too many people (or beings, in this case) in a place that can't possibly hope to support them.

In the end, they'd probably require a hell of a lot of aid and funding from the very nations whose land they'd probably have to steal in order to support their new populace. A heck of a mess, no matter how you slice it. But, in the end, I'd like to think that we could all come together to help a foreign power in need (assuming they didn't expand the barrier), helping them overcome the disaster and leaving the world, as a whole, a better place for it.

Also keep in mind that, while I love this community and the things it does, there are plenty of brony assholes out there. Just because you like the show doesn't make you a better person... Heck just read some of the comments and stories that get posted on this very site. Yes, we're one of the nicer fanbases, but we're still human. In fact... just apply the "but we're still human" principle to all of your groups (yes, even the ponies). Dualism is universal and the key to good narrative is complexity and diversity in your characters.

And all of that is just scratching at the surface of the massive complexity of the issues at hand.

So... yeah... good luck. Seriously. And let us know when it's finished, I'd love to take a look-see.

313062 Yeah, no pressure. I may not be able to live up to everypony's expectations, but the least I'm going to do is make an interesting story. As for the "Equestrian side of things" let's just say ponies aren't the only ones interested in Earth. Equestria strikes me as a nation in the midst of an industrial revolution. Look at Flim and Flam, their whole sales pitch is essentially magically operated steampunk! The scientific advanced the setting often brings are put to good use in Equestria. I also like to site Fancypants as one of the wealthiest and most powerful ponies in Canterlot, yet notice he has no title. Not "Lord" or "Prince" or "Duke" he is not nobility, he is a self-made man. I've read a fanfiction that portrayed him as an entrepreneur of various trades. (Starting with textiles and moving up to airships.) I admit, it's had a heavy influence on his portrayal in my story. He sees our history as something to be preserved and capitalized upon, thinking that to simply throw away an entire civilization and all the potential it still has to be a criminal waste!

312942 The short version is, I was running away from the Equestria barrier so it couldn't kill me.

The easiest way I can describe it is comparing it to this game. Except instead of mutant dogs and men with guns, I kept running into people saying I should get ponified.