)No Harm No Foul: Trixieverse Triage · 1:32pm Oct 19th, 2012
State Of Th' Trixieverse Address
(on account of bein' about halfway through the new book)
It's a real blessing having smart, thoughtful readers to challenge you. Not because they're so clever they can pick how the books will go- if they're so dang clever they kin write their own stories and I might just be a big fan- but because they can dive down to extremely fundamental levels, touching on themes you can't directly address.
Telling stories in novel form is quite a thing. You've gotta fill out the tapestry, build tension- pretty much make everything go wrong- and bring it all together in a wonderful ending that releases that tension and satisfies. In doing this, it shows what you consider satisfactory, and that's where they GIT ya!
One insightful pony confronted me on a thing that prompted this essay- saying one of the following must be true:
- Twilight is deeply broken. Like Cupcakes-Pinkie level or something and nopony can call her on it.
- Trixie's forgiveness is really that easy for Twilight to take without lingering scruples and this is normal because rape is okay.
- or because this really is a no-harm-no-foul moral milieu.
- or I'm misreading the whole situation, everyone's moved on, and I'm just being a prude.
This was mighty uncomfortable to read (the whole point of consensuality in kinky situations is that rape isn't okay) but it led to a deeper insight in what's been going on in Trixieverse. Let's have a look at some of the history so far...
Rainbow Dash tried to hook up her marefriend with lots of ponies while expecting her not to love them too much, just buck 'em and meet their dick needs
Fluttershy obsessively spies on ponies having sex and invades their privacy
Twilight Sparkle went mad with jealousy and tried to murder Rainbow Dash. Twilight raped Trixie brutally thinking it was a mind-game battle.
Pinkie Pie forced her way into Bon Bon's house and made them use her as a sex toy to fix their quarrel
Applejack kept bucking Twilight knowing she wasn't offering what Twi clearly wanted and needed, life-mate-ness
Rarity contrived to be watched during sex without telling her lover she'd done so
Trixie Lulamoon caused the deaths of multiple ponies through the cursed bits she had made...
And that's just in the first book.
Here's the deal.
Harm pervades the world, in Trixieverse. Harm is everywhere! It is terrible, it is popping up all the time through foolishness or inattentiveness or just lapses in vigilance! The ponies are terribly sensitive and easily upset, and every one has big weak spots, some of which can be hinted at BOOKS in advance and come out to prey upon them. Half the time the ponies are putting on bravado and covering up their vulnerability like mad, but it's impossible to hide. These are intense, emotional little ponies, many of whom are mighty unstable- the powerfuller they are, the more they wobble and totter and cling to what little stability they can find.
Much like in real life, in fact.
It's very simple, really. It's a triage thing. These ponies are frantic to take care of each other, protect and save each other, even though they're often silly and fail to pick up on what's really going on- that, in turn, because they're prone to try and hide their weaknesses even from their friends. Harm terrifies them on a very deep level, and they'll give their lives to protect their friends from harm.
They're so busy with harm, they throw 'foul' under the bus- EVERY time. And that is not such a bad thing, provided you don't run amok and go out seeking to foul all the time and get away with everything you can. Past fouls are what mercy is for- intelligent, wary mercy, perhaps. Applejack learned something about Twilight when she discovered what Twi was going to do for love. She can never see Twi quite the same way again, but still loves her friend. She's forced to let go of the 'foul', as huge as it was, because it was prevented in time.
Let's go back.
Rainbow Dash got caught in her own casual ways. Flamed out bigtime, came back to Applejack frightened and chastened. She'll think of how her actions affect others now- at least a little more than she had.
Fluttershy got a marefriend. She clings to her spying, but some of the pressure's off, and her jealous resentment can start to fade. She can start to work through her stuff.
Twilight Sparkle repented. She's careful to not hurt Dash and tries to shield her from the knowledge of what she'd meant to do, she recognized that she'd only aroused Trixie and basically enslaved her, and she promptly did her best to meet Trixie's strange needs- and was enthralled by Trixie's heroism, self-sacrifice and bravery. She's profoundly indebted to Trixie and will risk anything to save Trixie from further harm.
Pinkie had to see Bon Bon and Lyra break up anyhow. Her mad ingenuity couldn't overcome some of their issues. Might have taught her a little perspective. Pinkie is focussing on Fluttershy, and as usual has a very clear view of issues.
Applejack continues to try to support everypony in need...
Rarity's machinations backfired spectacularly, and now she is trying to be the perfect exemplar of kinky consent, correctly distinguishing her own point of view from that of others even when she's being triggered for personal reasons. She's trying to be incredibly generous- even about things where she's entitled to a say.
Trixie cannot bring the dead ponies back, but has devoted herself to a stable relationship (or three). Rather than thrash around trapped in a curse where she must selfishly orgasm regardless of the state of her lovers (or doom them all!), she can now learn to care for others and is trying to do just that, something she's been out of touch with since her first lover Aftershock.
Every time, they've got something to focus on, some tangible goal, harm to avoid, support to bestow. The worse things get, the more they rally around and try to support each other. Sometimes their tactics are kind of the problem (hello, Scootaloo, you idiot filly!) but the motive is always this: never mind the foul, we have bigger fish to fry.
Going a step deeper than that, the ponies try to find situations that are harm-free or harm-neutral. A triangle between AJ, Dash and Twi proves explosive and dangerous? Boom, when the dust settles they've ended up as Appledash and Twixie, and they CLING to this- even Twilight, even against her own broken heart! All because they can sense that there's a stability there, a safety for everypony.
Their little lives are so turbulent (almost like they were stuck being the heroes of an episodic cartoon series) that they are constantly fighting for security against real or perceived threats. Because they're stuck in Trixieverse (or indeed the Hub), the threats become terrifyingly dire. Because they are themselves and they are the heroes, they always fight through and win. They fight off the harm, over and over, at great personal risk and sacrifice.
No, Trixie does not hate Twilight for raping her, even though rape is bad and part of her knows it was dirty pool hooking her guilt-driven libido that hard. She knows Twilight turned into a monster for a bit, but there are many sides of Twilight and Trixie loves Twilight for her good sides. If Trixie saw Twi being vindictive and setting out to rape or hurt somepony else... well, she did see exactly that, saw Twi setting out to punish and oppress Rainbow Dash, and Trixie would not let that happen again.
Twilight doesn't like to think about Trixie causing the deaths of many ponies. She feels that if Mistress-less Trixie gets up to things like that, then being Mistress is a heck of a serious duty. It's the obvious answer, so she tries to develop herself into a better Mistress in the belief that this is best for everypony. There is no room in this for retaining a sense that Trixie is a multiple murderess (or at least ponyslaughteress- but SHE made the cursed bit, on purpose, and remained its focus) and yet Trixie is. But to harp on this would ruin the stability that's keeping the herd safe...
Rarity's great kinkiness is itself her way of processing things. That, among other things, is her accommodation. They're all about latching onto an accomodation that'll get things stable again, and then clinging to it doggedly.
"No Harm No Foul" as it's commonly used, suggests a worldview where you sleaze your way through sketchy doings to come out the other side, having covered up your crimes, expecting to be considered virtuous. It's a rationalization, a method for justifying crimes in the belief you'll be able to get away with them.
What the ponies do is more, in practice, like "First Do No Harm (then, forgive all the fouls)". They simply can't get away from harm and foul, whatever they do. The fix is in. They'd go crazy if they had to sit around ruminating over their sins- so they don't. They forgive themselves and they forgive each other- and then they keep a sharp eye out, not wanting to make the same mistakes twice.
Applejack's an old-timey moralist at heart. Yet it is Applejack who wants to mend things with Luna, who committed kidnapping, a form of mind-job rape, and effective murder upon Trixie, and assaulted Applejack and her friends. Applejack considers it a priority to get back to a stability and friendship, as crazy as that seems, for the good of Luna and for the good of themselves. Celestia and Twilight know that's unrealistic (for different reasons- Celestia knows how Luna is, Twi knows how Trixie is) but it still doesn't sit well to see Luna punished and unforgiven. She wants to put the bad times behind her. Sometimes that's a lot to ask.
They'll all go to great lengths and do crazy, shocking things to win through to even a temporary pocket of stability. Not one of them will brood on their fouls and sins- holding them trapped in it (like Trixie, all those years) will drive them insane, but still they bounce back given the chance. Because they're ponies, and we love them, and as Celestia and Luna so well know, they've got today and a few tomorrows and then that's it. Ponies don't last- so ponies forgive, because they've got to get through the day without dark clouds hanging over them.
Life is very short, and there's no time
For fussing and fighting my friend
I have always thought that it's a crime...
Do no harm. Cling to no foul. Do your best, and forgive.
That was incredibly deep, man
And yeah that clears up alot of the issues I personally had with some of the relationships between the characters.
I had to skip most of this post because spoilers but damn, you've got me interested in these stories again. I'm only part way through book 1.
I've often felt while reading the Trixieverse that these were definitely a different species of pony from the ones in the show. Their antics are the sort of thing i see most often in high school students who discover BDSM a little too early. Believe me, it DOES happen...and it fucks them up bad.
Chessie
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I hope my ponies aren't too fucked up, that's sad...
Hope I can see them through safely to the end of the book, then!
Well, I think it's fair to let folks (Applejinx especially) know what decision I've come to. I'm staying on this ride to the end. Worst case scenario is I read some disturbing stuff and end up painfully disappointed. Best case, I get to see one of my favorite authors pull off (even more) impressive writing, out of a situation I couldn't write my way out of.
Speaking strictly about content, I've read a lot worse and liked it. I'm not trying to grab the moral high ground here. I like (the TV version of) Elfen Lied. I absolutely love Latias' Journey. For those who aren't familiar with these works of art (applying the term loosely) ...
Elfen Lied is a very sweet love story in which every major character is a complete monster who has done unforgivable things to the others. It has no qualms about tits, ass, gratuitous amounts of blood, dismemberment, decapitation, etc. etc. Plays definitional games to get away with a (rather wussy) rape scene on TV. Won't show animal abuse, though; the camera gets oddly shy when that scene comes up.
Latias' Journey is a pokemon fic about forgiveness and siblings' love set before an epic war between morally-ambiguous good and utterly depraved evil. Notable for not only having one of the few INFP-personality-type villains anywhere in fiction, but also for making the hypothetical lovechild of Adolf Hitler and Final Fantasy's Kafka look like a fluffy kitten. Makes Cupcakes seem utterly harmless. It's insanely long, too. Counting the sequel, it's something like eight times longer than End of Ponies. The prose is typical fic-grade, the pacing is awful, I have to take breaks for comfort food and snugglies while reading it, and I love the shit out of it.
So, just a heads-up: don't feel you have to write to please me. I'm probably not the ideal reader. But if there's any question of whether I can take heavy content, the answer is yes.
So what had me worried?
---
I wouldn't go near Trixie's sexuality with a ten-foot pole. Oh so not my thing. But you know what? I wouldn't mind having a few drinks with her. Under the right circumstances (dive buddies or somesuch), I'd even trust her with my life. Not sure if I'd let her babysit the kids. In general, I don't have more of a problem with her than I do with people in general.
Twilight, though... I have a hard time trusting anyone who doesn't show remorse. Ponies are happy, wonderful creatures who are quick to forgive each other, yes, but that really only works if they're not too quick to forgive themselves. In a nutshell, I don't think there's near enough of this:
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to win my trust. She scares me. Hide the kids. A character can seek absolution and find it or not find it, but Trixieverse-Twilight doesn't even start the journey.
Shit, in Latias Journey, to save Latios, she tears down the multiverse, rebuilds the whole thing, makes everything Latios did not have happened, takes all his memories, makes him a fairly major deity, and even still there's a fairly long wham scene (and this is key) where Latias has to prove her forgiveness.
---
"I am Arceus' sword, the Light which banishes the shadow of evil," Latias said. "Rayquaza is the great King who leads the forces of good, and helps rebuild the world that is devastated in the wake of evil's fall. And you…in many ways you are the most important of all, Brother, because you are Hope."
Latios blinked. "Hope? What's so good about that?"
"Everything," Latias said. "Without hope, what allows people to find the light to dispel the darkness? Without hope, why should anyone follow a leader, or believe that there's a chance they can remake what was destroyed? Hope is the fuel that keeps people running in the worst of times. Hope is the power that lets them survive, and to believe that one day, even the baddest of things can be amended. Without hope…what else do we have?"
"I…" Latios blinked. "I don't…know. That's…a really good question. And…what, you're saying I…I embody hope?"
"Pretty much, yeah," Latias said.
"…That's kinda gay."
---
Anyway, enough rambling.
I don't need world-class mythopoesis to like a story, but if it's going dark places a little certainly wouldn't hurt. Take a stand, darn it! This story is too big for realism.
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Out of everything I have seen in the Trixieverse, Twilight's little episode with Trixie always seemed to be the one of two things that was really OOC. (YMMV, this is just me personally.) That said, she does seem to be genuinely remorseful. Aside from her breakdown, she is phenomenally protective of Trixie, to the point of defiance against her own mentor, and she literally attacked a goddess to save her. It's beyond simply being in love with her, and it's something Twilight is going to carry with her for her entire life.
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I have you to thank, Eustatian, for the soulsearching that led me to this blogpost, and I'm really REALLY grateful of that because it helps me refocus what I'm trying to do, and got me out of a real nasty depressed slump. I guess I'm saying it was worth it and I owe you one.
I think you're right that Twilight is scary, too. I feel her as perfectly comfortable 'taking her independence and PONYDOM independence' from Celestia, something the Lulamoon clan was never able to do, and yet singlehoofedly Twilight decides she'll do it. Bouncing back from the show Lesson Zero, taking a little more distance from Celestia, then taking on first sexual awakening with Applejack and then that in-at-the-deep-end relationship with Trixie, and Twilight seems to think she IS another Celestia of a sort.
I wonder if I'll get more perspective on this in S3 if she grows wings. I might simply be ahead of the curve. I'd thought it would be shattering to lose the special relationship as friendship reporter- maybe I'm sensing that if this is not shattering it tells a story of what the hyperpowered HAX-icorn is like on the inside. Also some of Tara is rubbing off on her- Twilight is like the Brony Queen, seems to know she is a star and is now head of a chain of BSDM mistressing, and unlike Rarity she has no experience with it but doesn't seem bothered... they treat her as the natural leader because she is that powerful magically, there's no denying that, but she keeps doing things like trying to turn herself into a heartless weapon to take out a full-grown alicorn.
You ARE right. Twi IS scary. I don't picture her BDSM family clueing in to this, and some of the other ponies (Applejack, Pinkie) who could spot it are absolutely preoccupied and busy, and rightly so.
And you know what? ALL I really want is that if you are reading it, you are finding some way to enjoy yourself. It is absolutely okay with me if you deconstruct it or tip me off to burgeoning psychosis in my merry little cast of crazy ponies- especially if it keeps opening up big mysterious areas of additional story like your take on Twilight has! I don't know where that's leading and I'm almost certain it won't be resolved in this book- but I can no longer be sure I'll be done. (yeah, like folks would let me produce Rainbow Dash's foal and then NOT watch it grow up...)
Thank you for sharing your thinking- even when it knocks me off balance. Balance is overrated
Like other posters, I'm not caught up, so I jumped around and didn't give this a thorough read.
Still, the very beginning expresses something interesting. Plenty of bad stuff has happened here, and to focus on one particularly horrific aspect is to ignore the larger theme of redemption and healing. I'm not one of the readers who did too much dwelling on that; I moved on and didn't let it take away from what I did enjoy.
Even if I wasn't morally comfortable with it at the time, I ended up understanding it as an in-universe thing; bad things are allowed to happen in-universe and characters are allowed to forgive each other for them and have different ideas about it than the readers. Maybe it's just that the characters are more consistently forgiving than the readers that gets people concerned. I think Trixie even addresses this when Twilight expresses her feelings about what she did. Something along the lines of "oh, you mean the single most erotic experience of my life?"
If this comes up again, I'm looking forward to reading it... though I wonder if it was prompted by reader concerns such as what you're addressing here?
On that note: To what extent was the "spirit half" concept done because of reader analyses re: Mac's seed? Sure the cultural aspect was there way before readers got to it, but now there's a literal spirit half.
I'll be very, very happy if you tell me that such a thing was planned from the beginning, and the readers were just too damn sharp. Still, the literal spirit half was never addressed before that, which is sort of odd.
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The thing with the spirit half is pretty simple: it really seemed like a raw deal to have Rainbow literally bearing 100% Mac's foal and leaving Applejack to take all the responsibility for it. That seems unjust- and since they're all magical creatures, the mechanics of it sort of evolved. I'm not sure at what point exactly it became 'two stage process for unicorns and pegasi' but I'm pretty happy with it now, and it's an extra blessing for lesbian couples in that they can literally breed with a bit of assistance, and that will turn out mighty endearing. AND it gives a strong motivation for pegasus/unicorn racism which the ponies must therefore work through and deal with- can't just handwave it away, gotta really engage with that stuff.
That's just what Trixie said, yes, and it's not so much a tactic to soothe Twilight- it's Trixie laying claim to her own twisted perspective. She means it and she insists on Twilight validating that- Twi must acknowledge that Trixie wants this stuff, and deliver some more, and in a very real sense Twi was set up from the start. Trixie's mighty capable and devious and her rules are pretty strange, and far from 'forgiving' Twilight the rape, some part of her was in fact like 'HAHA I WIN, now you get to be my domme, that was fantastic'.
Maybe this too is underlying the way Twilight's getting strange for Eustatian and others. She seems very well adjusted but there are many odd things about their perfect relationship.
> finding some way to enjoy yourself
Clopfic: now approved for off-label use.
> Twilight's getting strange for Eustatian and others. She seems very well adjusted but there are many odd things about their perfect relationship.
Something like that. I figure she's pretty good at self-deception (maybe not as good as Rarity), so there's a definite sense of the other shoe being about to drop. But I feel like I'm starting to repeat myself, so I'll hold back for a while.
One of my long-standing goals has been "get Jinx to take my advice even once" and I'm just beside myself with pride right now. Not pride at being right; that's not really me, but seeing that we have different perspectives and mine leads to
> soulsearching
is... wow. "Encouraging" would be a good word. Everything I see in the characters is transparent to me, so it's a little strange to think I can see something that a much more accomplished writer misses.
Like that I do believe that characters can be deeply nice, well adjusted, not do all that terrible of things, and still generate significant conflicts. I just didn't think that seeing those situations was particularly special, but perhaps it is. In any case, I'm encouraged to write again and that's all the thanks I need.
Speaking of writing, you need to write a pony spy thriller next*. We all know you have the skill to at least make a good showing at it, and a T rating would allow you the audience you so rightly deserve. Please don't be afraid of success; it's absolutely heartbreaking how shy you can be.
(*That feeling when you realize that names are significant. You clever bastard you.)
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I don't write shy, or pick topics shy, or respond to critics all that shy, or sound shy when I sing and play music as I've just done- and on the surface it would seem oatmeal-crazy that I'd be afraid of success seein' as I gripe about having never, ever got a feature or the kind of publicity and attention that comes to countless writers of all skill levels every day. Yet I do understand what you mean, and I can only say this: I stick to what I know because I'm scared of being trapped and made to pretend to be something I'm not. Which I think is a wise fear to have...
Eep! What are you, Pinkie Pie? Do I have to watch out for Eustatian Sense now? I hope there aren't too many ponies with THAT specific goal or I will be thrashin' around taking different advice and spinning like a weathervane...
You do have Rarity all wrong. She's not 'good at self-deception', not a bit of it. She's scary good at self CONTROL and acceptance of things beyond her control and there's abundant reason for that.
And hell yes you should write more! You're the one that did that watchin'-paint-dry fic that wasn't a gag or a stunt. I just went and re-read it (and the Pinkie one yours got compared to) because I remembered there was something there. You will write more, of whatever pleases you, or I will kick you in th' plot
I do not know how you picked up that I'm shy
I'm happy that you're happy, and go write things consarn it!
wow.....that was....very deep
awesome applejinx!....your put very much feeling and relfexions in your stories
Oh absolutely. Trixie didn't just egg Twilight on; she requested it. From the start, it was disturbing to Twilight (and some readers apparently) but not Trixie.
Fug. I need to go write. I also committed myself to de-ponying what was going to be a changeling fic for a major grade... why did I ever do a thing like that?
433190 "alot" is not a word
436981 You just jelly of my swagger.
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Is so!
As a friendly local /pony/ regular and characterization connoisseur, I would just like to mention that while raping somepony may or mat not be OOC for Twi given the circumstances, forgiving herself for it is not. At all. The ends justify the means, and even in canon, without the Trixieverse desperate, clinging forgiveness angle, Twi doesn't seem to feel guilt until caught with her pony-pants down and faced with repercussions. As Trixie forgave her, no repercussions presented themselves.
Everything else I wanted to say has been said more eloquently than I could hope to.
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437466 Bitch, please.
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It's... BEAUTIFUL...
440010 Indeed