I did it again. I wrote a story with a whole lotta talkin'. Readers hate it when I do that. But I don't know how else to tell some stories.

The story is here on ponyfictionarchive.net, and is about 3000 words. It has at least 2 problems.

First, I break my stories into relatively small pages, and track the number of readers who read each page, so that I can tell where they stop reading. For this story, only 20% of readers who read the first page went to the second page. This is astoundingly bad. That would be in the bottom 0.1% of all stories on fimfiction. (Yes, I counted.) If you look at the view counts for different stories on fimfiction, you'll see that even for the most godawful, ungrammatical, pointless HiE or Yu-Gi-Oh crossover stories, 40% of readers go to the second page. What's so bad about this first page? I like it.

Second, page 2 is where it's really talky. Talk talk talk. I know that it's possible to write stories where ponies just talk, because AbsoluteAnonymous and device heretic do it all the time, and it works. Why does it work for them and not for me? I used to think that the thing to do was to try to make the talky section shorter. But device heretic's talky sections are REALLY LONG; and comparing them, I think maybe what I need to do is to make my talky sections longer, and describe in more detail what the characters are feeling, and why this talky section is important. (Although that's difficult in this case, because I'm trying to reveal Celestia's thoughts gradually, only letting the reader know what's going on on page 3.) On the other hand, maybe the problem is that my characters often talk about abstract ideas, rather than what they did and how they feel.

307287 I'll give you a full review and some tips in a minute. ^_^

Edit: To answer your question about what's wrong with the first page. It's all those one-line lines. That really turns a reader off because it lacks description and meat per say. Having a lot of dialogue is fine- scratch that, great, it's just not good when you bat line after line after line with no real incite into the meaning behind those words. Add some descriptions. what are the current mannerisms of said pony that is talking? Are they biting their lip because they're nervous? You have to remember that the reader is not inside your head, they cannot see the world you have created.

Also, this is gonna sound harsh, but I wouldn't be taking tips from Device Heretic or AA's stories just yet. For now, when you need something, just drop me a line... that's the entire point of this group, to help young authors (and myself, lord knows I'm not perfect) become better authors.

Any other specific things you need help with, just drop me a line.

Good things: You understand the pattern behind dialogue as an opening gimmick. Short, unexplained part of a conversation, pause for description, back into dialogue.

Problems: As Criticul mentioned, description is too sparse. There's also a nasty habit of repetition spread throughout. You use the same gimmick to open both the story and the second chapter. You start a great deal of paragraphs with 'Twilight' 'Celestia' or 'She.' This is the easiest way to start a paragraph, but readers get bored when the language gets inflexible like this. It's fine for a first draft, where you're just finding the territory of the story, but outside of that you want to add more variety.

Misc thoughts: Don't be afraid to paraphrase dialogue in description. It helps break up the monotony while still delivering the readers imagination the required cues. Don't be afraid that the reader will lose the thread of dialogue if you drop into long bouts of description, they won't unless you do so for several pages. Even then, you can remind them pretty easily.

When I have some time today, Bad Horse, I'll review your story and give my two cents on the issue.

"More description" can't be the complete answer. Why is doing this okay in Huckleberry Finn?

[long quote deleted]

I figured out why long sections of dialogue are okay in Huck Finn. It isn't a question of dialogue vs. narration. The difference is that my dialogue had characters providing information, while Twain's dialogue has characters sometimes imparting information, but always demonstrating their personalities.

I broke up the biggest chunks of talk in chapters 1 and 2 with description - not physical description; more like commentary. I had a big section in chapter 2 where Celestia monologued. So I gave Twilight one line in the middle of it, which helps a little.

I think my real question is: Do people dislike this story because it isn't written as well as it could be written; or do they dislike it because it's a story about philosophy, psychology, and the idea that you can't fight corruption without becoming corrupted; rather than being about ponies going on adventures and/or having sex? (Okay, there is some implied pony sex, but it's the twisted psychological reasons for it that matter.) Is it possible to write this story on its own, rather than embedding it into some larger, more-traditional story?

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"You start a great deal of paragraphs with 'Twilight' 'Celestia' or 'She.' This is the easiest way to start a paragraph, but readers get bored when the language gets inflexible like this. It's fine for a first draft, where you're just finding the territory of the story, but outside of that you want to add more variety."

I used to try to do that, and eventually decided I wasn't going to anymore, because I ended up with things like "intoned the lavender unicorn". I'm not convinced that varying how you refer to the character at the start of a sentence is any better than using different words instead of "said". I'm a big fan of using "said" over and over again now. If you just mean that I need to move the names out of the first position of the sentence - well, maybe. I'll keep my eye out for what other authors do.

I've thought about it more, and I think the problem is much bigger than a lack of description. First, it's a classic "tell don't show" from start to finish. The problem is that this is the sort of material that would probably run five times as long showing as telling; and the ideas aren't sufficient to support a story of that length on their own. Second, I'm not matching the material up to the characters convincingly. Too much reinterpretation of the characters, not enough reiteration of what we already know about them.

[Review]

-Ch.1- (“What's so bad about this first page?”)

The big problem I noticed is that you don’t really get into Twi’s feelings. You describe things that matter to her, but in a general way. Surely she must be used to these aspects of talking to Celestia but I’m not getting a sense of that personal touch: her voice, how she interprets and experiences these things. It’s bland, to be honest.

The first (“Twilight Sparkle blinked”) and third (“When Celestia really listened”) large description sections are a bit too long; they interfere with the pacing. Yes, even the first one, in itself: it could have easily been cut in half, perhaps with the removed half relegated to between the next two lines of dialogue to help demonstrate her desperate attempts at recollection.

-Ch.2-

You’ll want to include a couple of lines or so to more thoroughly convey Twilight’s nervousness before her “WHY?!” outburst. The soul-piercing stare of Celestia, so unsettlingly calm, and the growing tension in Twi’s mind of what she should say next on such a personal topic.

You definitely went more into the characters’ feelings in this chapter despite the lengthy philosophical discussion, but it still feels a bit dry. I feel that perhaps Celestia should be the POV character, though that would kill much of the apparent mystery behind her motivations here. Unless you started in the past, just before the NMM incident, and worked your way towards the present, showing both sisters’ personal journeys.

-Ch.3-

See above.

To tell you the truth these characterizations, while interesting, seem almost completely out of left field. We need a stronger foundation to hold up this complex framework.

[“Why does it work for them and not for me?”]

Using DH’s And The Temptress Came Unto Her as an example, it works for him because he makes the scenes gripping; at all points in the story we are wrapped up in Twilight’s thought process and emotions. Her struggle to resist Nightmare Moon’s temptation; the very real problems in her life that the temptation latches onto; her just-barely-controlled fear of upsetting NMM to the point where she (NMM) would simply abandon the temptation and kill her outright; her (fruitless) attempts to overcome the very frightening presence of NMM intellectually. DH conveys these things in every single line in the piece. It could have been thrice as long and just as entertaining simply because of that very engaging and dynamic back-and-forth between Twilight and her darkest fears.

[“Do people dislike this story because it isn't written as well as it could be written; or do they dislike it because it's a story about philosophy, psychology, and the idea that you can't fight corruption without becoming corrupted; rather than being about ponies going on adventures and/or having sex?”]

The former. Most any concept can be written into an entertaining story; if it’s thought-provoking that’s even better. Intellectual concepts in stories, sadly, aren’t for everyone (though I’ve always believed that’s a matter of presentation rather than content), but the same can be said of adventures and clop.

[“I'm not convinced that varying how you refer to the character at the start of a sentence is any better than using different words instead of "said".”]

This isn’t the sort of thing one can sum up in a general recommendation or principle. You simply have to examine the material and see where it starts to feel repetitive; it differs for every story. There are still points in this story where it feels repetitive or redundant.

[“First, it's a classic "tell don't show" from start to finish. The problem is that this is the sort of material that would probably run five times as long showing as telling; and the ideas aren't sufficient to support a story of that length on their own. Second, I'm not matching the material up to the characters convincingly. Too much reinterpretation of the characters, not enough reiteration of what we already know about them.”]

There’s nothing wrong with reinterpreting characters so long as the interpretations make sense. The more you deviate from a character as we know her, the more effort you have to put into establishing her new personality and having it make sense. That said, in reading the latter two chapters one thought never left me: “Huh?”

I would disagree that the ideas aren’t enough to support a story like this precisely because of how out-of-nowhere these characterizations of Celestia and Luna are. The story is about personal philosophy and psychology, of which you have a massive amount; embrace that, but make sure to go as deep into the minds of the characters, showing and telling (you have to do a bit of both), as you possibly can, to get the reader turning the page and to make sure it all makes sense. At least two important events, the first NMM incident (or a little of what happened just before it) and Luna talking to Twilight, are absent even though they could and would more intimately convey the complex emotional paradigms running between the sisters.