Alright, so I’m gonna talk about Stella. Not about her character or the divide of whether her reveal as a heartless piece of shit was handled properly. I’m talking about her relationship with her daughter, Octavia.

Simply put, she’s a horrible mother. And I’ll show you why I believe this.

Now I don’t believe she’s abusive to Octavia. If she was, we would know. But there are signs of neglect.

First off, in “Loo-Loo Land,” Stella doesn’t acknowledge Octavia in the midst of her tantrum against Stolas or even when she leaves the room. Now, Stolas didn’t notice his daughter either at first, but if someone was screaming bloody murder at me, I’d be a bit preoccupied too.

Next, in “Western energy,” she openly talks about the hit on Stolas at the dinner table, while her daughter is only a few feet away from her, which shows that Stella doesn’t consider Octavia’s feelings in the slightest.

Finally, in “The Circus,” when she’s talking to her socialite friends at the party, she refers to Octavia as “an egg”. AN EGG!!!

What kind of mother refers to one’s only child as AN EGG!? What kind of mother doesn’t doesn’t even bother using her daughter’s ACTUAL NAME!? I’ll tell you what kind!

The horrible kind!

Judging from what we’ve seen, it’s apparent that Octavia has no idea how much of a piece of shit her mother is to her dad. The evidence to prove this is found in this quote.

“Why does he hate her more than he loves me?”

Why would she ask this if she knew how awful her mother truly is?

Before you make an argument that says the opposite, think long and hard about this question.

Even if it’s revealed that they have a remotely healthy relationship, how do you think Octavia is going to react when she eventually finds out Stella is trying to kill her daddy?

While I can understand the point you are attempting to make in regard to this matter at hand, I'd like to throw in my two cents on the matter:

1. It is true that Stella was too focused on pointing out Stolas' flaws not just for cheating on her during that party, but because he chose to sleep with an 'imp' indicating the blasphemy that one of high class would willingly make love with the low class of society. Now true, Stolas was focused on arguing his case with his wife that he too didn't focus too much on Octavia and it proves the daughter's point that her own parents would rather spend their time 'screaming' at one another. However, that same episode, while Stella refused to comfort Octavia while her own daughter was having a nightmare, who was there to tend for their kid? That would be Stolas. All of this proving that she's more of a daddy's girl than a mom's.

2. It is true that Octavia was only mere feet away from her mother when she assigned the Norman Reedus guy to kill her own father. But how much did Octavia 'actually' hear about that threat? If we recall, she was listening to her music the whole time and as someone who wears headphones while playing music, you barely hear everything else. And 'even' if Octavia did hear glimpses of Stella's words, it can be assumed that Octavia was only hearing her talk shit about her dad again and wanted nothing to do with it... even at dinner. Otherwise, I admit I have no idea how else to justify the moment or how much Octavia knows how far Stella hates her own father.

3. If anything, the only reason Stella wanted 'the egg' in the first place is only to fulfill some form of business in her relationship with Stolas. To procure a 'precautionary heir' and nothing more. That's all Stella really sees in their daughter, a 'means to an end'. I'd be willing to bet they never really talked like a mother-daughter deal.

If I'm going to be perfectly honest, I don't think Octavia even thinks very highly of her mother. True, they spend weekends together as part of this 'arrangement' with the whole divorce proceedings (Even before the divorce). But I bet Octavia only appears along with Stella for appearances, and she'd rather spend time with her 'bridge' playing friends rather than asking Octavia how her day was. I don't know how much Octavia knows just how awful her mother is. But if in the event she does find out it was 'her' trying to get her own father killed, a father who embarrasses Octavia yet 'still' loves her genuinely, it's going to crush her. And to add insult to injury, when she finds out that she's going to inherit 'everything' and suddenly she's the big wig in charge while her mother gets 'nothing'... there's going to be a panic attack coming.

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Actually, there is only headcanon in regards to their relationship. And it is probably going to stay like that because anything Vivienne adds in that regard is going to piss people off. If I were her, I'd just keep drawing Octavia closer to Stolas and leave Stella in the corner being the awful foil that she is. I mean, if HB was trying to be a series about the politics of the situation, sure, but it really is about the shipping more than anything.

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Is that truly what you believe with this matter? The 'politics' of the situation? Not really my favorite word... not one of my favorite 'words' more appropriately.

Viv has been pissing us off no matter 'what' parts of the episode are delved into, yet still we follow the series anyway. We hated how Blitz treated Stolas on their 'date' yet we still watch the series hoping there is still a way to mend their relationship and to prove Blitz is not a complete jerk. We were pissed when Loona didn't immediately come rushing to Blitz's call when Stryker was beating the shit out of him and Moxxie... and still we watch the series because eventually we get to see Loona proving she's not 'all bark, no bite'. We did not approve of Moxxie's choice of words toward Millie when all the attention was suddenly on her, but we still watched the episode to the end to see not only Moxxie acknowledge how wrong he was, but he 'proved' how sorry he was by helping Millie have the attention she rightfully deserves.

Now this topic of Stella... anything more added such as the relationship with her daughter will piss us off 'regardless' of how it's done. On one hand, Stella seems like a one note character. An 'Angry Bird' who's been a bad egg since she was a hatchling, constantly treats Stolas like trash, tries to have him killed... but she is so driven by her negative emotions, she doesn't think 'anything' through. It's not to say that Octavia should stray from a loving parent in that of Stolas, but there is a matter of whether there is consideration that Stella is truly as bad with her kid as she is with her ex-husband. Or perhaps, all the other scenes where they hardly interact speak for themselves. True, the girls get together on weekends... but I doubt it's for tea and biscuits.

Is that truly what you believe with this matter? The 'politics' of the situation? Not really my favorite word... not one of my favorite 'words' more appropriately.

Please, don't think that I'm talking about 'gender politics'. I'm talking about politics as in the place of the Goetia in Hell and what is it that they actually do, and how they interact with one another.

Viv has been pissing us off no matter 'what' parts of the episode are delved into, yet still we follow the series anyway. We hated how Blitz treated Stolas on their 'date' yet we still watch the series hoping there is still a way to mend their relationship and to prove Blitz is not a complete jerk. We were pissed when Loona didn't immediately come rushing to Blitz's call when Stryker was beating the shit out of him and Moxxie... and still we watch the series because eventually we get to see Loona proving she's not 'all bark, no bite'. We did not approve of Moxxie's choice of words toward Millie when all the attention was suddenly on her, but we still watched the episode to the end to see not only Moxxie acknowledge how wrong he was, but he 'proved' how sorry he was by helping Millie have the attention she rightfully deserves.

Really? That is not my reading of the fandom at all. But then again, most of my interaction with it was through Reddit. So, forgive me if my take is a bad one.

- Blitzo has no reason to be nice to Stolas at that point because the whole thing was about the grimoire to him. He's also constantly lying to himself that he has feelings for Stolas, if he does. The show has been good in throwing ambiguity in that regard. One of the biggest attractors in the show is how flawed the characters are.
- About Blitzo, Moxie and Stryker, what episode are you talking about?
-The only thing I really agree here is that Unhappy Campers (I assume it is the episode you mean) was unpopular. And not because of that.

Now this topic of Stella... anything more added such as the relationship with her daughter will piss us off 'regardless' of how it's done. On one hand, Stella seems like a one note character. An 'Angry Bird' who's been a bad egg since she was a hatchling, constantly treats Stolas like trash, tries to have him killed... but she is so driven by her negative emotions, she doesn't think 'anything' through. It's not to say that Octavia should stray from a loving parent in that of Stolas, but there is a matter of whether there is consideration that Stella is truly as bad with her kid as she is with her ex-husband. Or perhaps, all the other scenes where they hardly interact speak for themselves. True, the girls get together on weekends... but I doubt it's for tea and biscuits.

The reason I say that whatever the show does with Stell a will piss off people is that the fandom just doesn't like Stella and is deeply polarized about her. Anything that the show tries to do with Stella that adds depth will be called 'relativization of domestic abuse'. Stella was written into a corner and that is why Andrealphus showed up.

So, I don't want to break out the retcon topic, because there was no retcon, but the cartoon has a very annoying tendency of character building by flashback that really rubs on the retconning. And the point is that you don't know what they meet for, but if you want to extrapolate, there is no reason to assume that it is for something bad either. And it shows how poorly planned the whole thing was because Octavia was very upset her parents in their trip to Loo Loo Land. And this another reason why I think Vivienne will not touch this: it would be tone-deaf to have Octavia blatantly take a side. And at the same time, I believe Vivienne will also not show Stella in any favorable light through interactions with her daughter.