Keep? Toss?

I'd like to hear onlyanorthernsong's thoughts on this the most. Since I'm using his OC Valiant as Cadence's child (an alicorn son), it raises the question as to whether Valiant would be an only child, or if he would have a canon sister, Flurry Heart (also an alicorn).

It might be a bit weird for people to see references in the upcoming published prologue of Cadence having a colt but not a filly. To new readers, this might seem a really bizarre choice, given the fact that we've been handed an actual canon alicorn child of this couple.

Technically, if she's a season-six child, and Valiant were a season-three child, she could simply be three years younger, eh? I have Valiant being born on Week 42, 14 years before the main story. The prologue takes place 3 years ago, on Week 20 so that makes Valiant 10 1/2 years old. So if Flurry Heart was born 11 years ago on week... let's say 35? That places the prologue fifteen weeks before she turns eight.

It does raise the question though, whether the story's getting too many alicorns.

So I'll probably have to make a decision real fast since I'm hoping to publish the prologue within the next few days.

5050158 You're lucky that I'm a fast reader! Okay if I remember from reading the Road Home correctly, she still haven't birth yet at that time so she's still pregnant, I'm so sure if that's the answer you're looking for but I think that's enough.

As for the topic of putting Flurry Heart into the story... I'd say it's all up to you, you're the one making the decision. Whatever th choice is, I'll support it from her on out

5050158
I kinda like the idea of a male alicorn and Valiant has warmed to me in the prologue

I agree that two alicorns might be a bit much though, given what they are capable of.

Given this is a bit alternate universe I think we can let it slide and stick with Valiant.

I'll defer to onlyanorthernsongs judgement however with it being his OC.

5050158 Well you did day nothing from season five onwards was canon so.... there is your answer I think.

that was a vote for " toss" by the way.

5050333
5051195

Everybody still feel the same way? The Season 6 opener was pretty interesting. Not sure how prominent a character she will be in the show. Personally, I think they should have made the baby a colt to dispel the whole "all alicorns are female/princesses" thing. Plus, the whole line with "Equestria has never seen an alicorn born before" has stirred up the fandom predictably. Of course, none of this changes Nightmare Nyx or its alicorn canon. But if I recall, the Journal of the Two Sisters explicitly states that the royal sisters were born as alicorns. *shrug*

Regarding Flurry, I'm not as disappointed as I thought I'd be. I anticipate people will ask why she's not in the story, especially when a different alicorn child of Cadence makes an appearance. Oh well. I suppose one can never avoid fan questions like that.

5137991 I actually think the premier was interesting in the sense that it is now official that natural born alicorns are dangerous as all get out.... though in a much different way than in your version of this world.

Having said that, yeah toss her out. She complicates too many things, ESPECIALLY if she is now, canonically , the only Natural Born alicorn.

5138022 Well, the only one born in Equestria, anyway... The debate rages in several forums.

5138029 Trust me, I've seen those arguments, the inferno is strong and still going...

5138029
It's quite possible that the Sisters were born outside of Equestria or before it was established, of course.

5138048
Which is precisely the case in my story, as they founded Equestria after their parents were gone.

Tempted to put Flurry into the story for a couple reasons.

First, she's becoming more and more established in canon, which is good because honestly, she's turning out to be a cool infant character.

Though I'm still wanting to keep Valiant. This presents a dilemma.

Keep Flurry as firstborn? Would be less conflicting with canon that way. That would make Valiant the younger brother. What this conflicts with is 5138022 's story. Unless you're interested in rewriting some of the details perhaps.

Why bring this up? Because I'm rewriting the prologue right now and if Flurry exists, she'd be mentioned. I'd need to know the age of both children so I can depict them properly. The thing is, after this story is done and our heroes are transported through time into the future, the plan is to hopefully merge with 5050333 's universe which has spacefaring ponies some 1500 years in the future. And Flurry Heart is his protagonist. So... now's a good chance to lay the groundwork and not have to retcon anything later.

Challenges are in that it could seem like too many alicorns. Especially considering what natural alicorns are like in my 'verse. However, with the disappearance of the Crystal Empire, it neatly gets rid of Shiny's family for the duration of my story anyway. This decision only affects the prologue as far as my story is concerned.

5987968
this just completely decanonizes my never complete ( someday, really, I swear I will finish it ) story. Valiant, as adorable as he is, is not really more than a magguffin... his whole REASON for existing is to be the FIRST young alicorn... that is what Draws Nyx to him beyond the fact that he is her cousin. Nyx feels less alone now.. but at the same time that makes her even more hypersensitive to the fact that he might be afraid of her. The entire point of Valiant is he is the first natural born alicorn of Nyx's generation. In fact the story is not really about anypony named valiant at all, his role is merely to be the offpsring of Cadence and Shining Armor and to be the first natural born alicorn of Nyx's generation.

Which means that my story gets fixed very easily : you take out valiant and put in Flurry Heart instead. I have never seen an episode with Flurry heart in it , but I imagine she can literally do everything Valiant does in the story which again is really just 1. exist as a baby that is the first natural born alicorn in who knows how long and 2. Be brave and actually fond of Nyx when Nyx thought the baby would be scared of her. That' is it, all the characther does. Completely blank slate. No reason Flurry Heart could not do it instead.

So what about Making Flurry heart the older sister. Yeah no. Again Valiant is not really a character... he is a maguffin. A simple plot element, and that plot element is completely founded in him being the first Young Alicorn Nyx meets. If there is another Young Alicorn before him he literally has no reason to exist. he cannot be the younger brother, he has to be the older brother or he is completely superfluous.

Look , think back to Past Sins itself and the " characther" of Spell Nexus. I put it in quotation marks, because all due respect to Pen Stroke, he wasn't a character at all... he was the engine that kept the plot moving. We know next to NOTHING about Spell Nexus as a characther apart from the fact that he is an academic and other job info, and that he does have something of a self sacrificing nature when it is revealed that he used himself as the vessel to contain as much of Nightmare Moon's " blessing" as he could. But even that revelation only highlights how not a character he is.... the big reveal is that all the actions we see him perform in the story are not truly his.. he is quite literally a tool and an empty vessel.

Same with Valiant. but even more so He exists merely to be the first young alicorn Nyx meets and to give her hope and encouragement when instead of rejecting her he instantly becomes fond of her. that's it . Not reallly a characther, just a plot engine.

The easiest way to put Flurry heart in your story is to drop her where Valiant is. Have her have to be restrained so as not to go off fighting the zebras in the assasination at the ceremony. Instead of Nyx visiting her memory of the time she met Valiant, have her visit the memory of the first Hearts Warming eve Flurry Heart spent at her paternal Grandparents . Easy peasy, no hard feelings from my part and this makes your life easy. At least my references to tea will remain woven in the story ( I just realized I am actually drinking a mug of chamomile tea as I type this to ease my day out.)

The other Way is to put Valiant in the story.. but he must then remain the older brother. Of course this means that we also have to account for why he will be nowhere to be seen in duvet of reason's story. Pretty simple solution there.... KILL HIM. Yeah just flat out murder him. Not by the zebras mind you... but By hyperion as a great " kick/ shoot the dog" moment. OF course this would mean that he would not disappear with the crystal empire, but would stay behind, to train to fight... something that the royal sisters may have agreed to despite Cadences protest that he should go with them to the crystal empire. This would enter some complications for example... he would have to develop a personality, but we would also have to come up with a reason why he has so little contact with Nyx in the story. We might be tempted to make him a special forces soldier deep in zebra territory, but that would undercut the reasons why Nyx could not fight. On that note, the royal sisters would have to worry about tow alicorns coming of age... wait no... Valiant would biologically be eleven or so years younger than Nyx, so he would be in his midteens he would not bea soldier and he would not be gaining his powers.. maybe he is just a cloistered student at Celestia's school then? Whatever.. this is a very interesting idea because if we turn Valiant into a characther a lot of very emotionally resonant things could be done with him... but he would have to stay behind in Equestria and get killed in the story line.

5988822
Hmm. Interesting.

Well, replacing is probably the easiest. Having him miss the Crystal Empire's disappearing would require a fair bit of character development, especially in regards to how he'd react to losing his parents at that age. That'd be something which would almost demand a fair bit of attention.

Regarding Duvet's story, I'm sure he'd be fine including Valiant in the universe. By the time all those events happen, ponykind has spread among the stars and only the immortal characters from the old times would still be around. We also think it would be good to have Nyx be the mother of several children by then, most of which would be alicorns, and probably all but one would have found their virtue and not become "wild alicorns". Having one go through with the transformation would be an excellent turn of events, especially in a universe large enough for wild alicorns to exist and not be ridiculously overpowered. One wild alicorn would probably be as powerful as say... three or four Mass Effect Reaper Dreadnoughts. Plenty of power but not an insta-win when it comes to space-armada scale conflicts. Definitely "Babylon 5 First One" tier stuff though.

But I digress. If you honestly don't care whether Valiant is developed as a character, he could be replaced with Flurry. Maybe in your story too if you'd like. The thing is, MLP has been developing her anyway, and the fandom has instant recognition with her. Personally, I'd prefer a colt, as MLP is way too female slanted in terms of demographics and focus. And it's like nobody even notices. It's truly bizarre. But yeah, they made a big deal about how Flurry was the first natural born alicorn in Equestria* so it might be a lot easier to just run with it and save Valiant for another side of the story. Heck, maybe he could be Nyx and Rumble's son even! I'd totally go for that.

* This fits well with my timeline if you take it literally, in that Celestia & Luna were born before Equestria existed.

5988835

Heck, maybe he could be Nyx and Rumble's son even! I'd totally go for that.

Now that's a good idea!

5988835

But I digress. If you honestly don't care whether Valiant is developed as a character, he could be replaced with Flurry. Maybe in your story too if you'd like. The thing is, MLP has been developing her anyway, and the fandom has instant recognition with her. Personally, I'd prefer a colt, as MLP is way too female slanted in terms of demographics and focus. And it's like nobody even notices. It's truly bizarre. But yeah, they made a big deal about how Flurry was the first natural born alicorn in Equestria* so it might be a lot easier to just run with it and save Valiant for another side of the story. Heck, maybe he could be Nyx and Rumble's son even! I'd totally go for that.

Lol No, I am not turning Valiant into Flurry Heart, heck no. Again nothing against Flurry Heart. Like I said, for your purposes, you are probably best served by Ctrl+F and replacing " Valiant" with Flurry Heart. And yes, if you want to use his name and likeness, why I would be flattered if you used him as a kernal to base your own character around ( just like you used RC's rumble and Flitter to create your different and much better fleshed out characthers of the same name). And yes I would rather he be used as a basis for Nyx and Rumble's son (!!!!!!), than as Flurry Heart's brother.

Again, nothing against FlurryHeart, but one of the reasons why I would rather have my story be fully decanonized rather than swapping flurry in for valiant ( though again, I think such swapping is precisely what you should do) is that Originally I DID intend in eventually giving valiant an actual characther, remember all that stuff about bloodlines in the story ? That was going to be relevant in a future more novel length story that I was planning on writing depicting Nyx's days at Celestia's school, and all the attending intrigue... it was all really hogwartian and harry potter but even though I had a setting well established in my head, the plot never materialized. In that world Nyx would occasionally babysit Valiant whenever Cadence and Shining where in Canterlot, at which point he would have a character . It is not to be , but that is kind of what I had in mind and why I will keep my Valiant instead of flurry heart.

But dude, i would squee a thousand squees if he was Nyx and Rumble's son ( or more accurately the basis for that characther)

5994843
Sounds like a plan then. I'll put Flurry into the prologue and also update any further references later in the story. And any future sequels will take Nyx's future family into account. Definitely want to do that one day, but I have to focus on this story for now.