Paul's Thursday Reviews CXIV · 8:49pm May 3rd, 2018
So Songbird has finally been released, with updates coming daily. At the current pace, the last chapter will be up on Tuesday. It’s a relief to finally have it out there, but the story is an exemplary example of one thing:
I hate the deep editing process. I'm sure a few folks are sick of hearing me say that.
Songbird took more than a year to get released. It should have been done in a month or two, but I dragged my feet because Pascoite’s and OnionPie’s initial suggestions soured my mood into being disgusted with the work. This is no fault of theirs, they were doing exactly what they were supposed to. I just saw how much work would have to be done to address their criticisms and got pissy about it. When I finish something, I tend to think of it as finished, which means no going back and doing big changes. Or even small changes. Calling on highly opinionated and aggressive editors ruins that mode of thought, and the only recourse I had was to step back, let the story grow stale, and return with a less lofty opinion of my own work.
To put it more succinctly: I’m not used to having people tell me I’m wrong. I’m even less used to them being right about it.
This doesn’t mean I’ll stop using aggressive editors. If anything, it makes me want to find more like Pascoite and OnionPie, people who aren’t afraid to confront me and explain why my word choice and line of thinking is wrong. The path to being a better author demands a bit of discomfort and, yes, maybe even anger. I also want to find more so that I’m not relying on these two every time I want some help, but that’s another matter entirely.
And all of this comes with the balancing act of time. Songbird still isn’t everything it could be. The main reason it’s coming out now is that I feel a year of development time is far too much. If a rough draft of a story of Songbird’s length can’t be edited and ready for release within a couple months, something is very wrong. So I drew the line and washed my hand of the whole matter, and will try to take the lessons learned to the next story.
Moving on, I’m repeating my call for Beta Readers for Bulletproof Heart. I haven’t got near the number that I’m after so far, so the door remains open for anyone who wants to see it before it releases. Right now I’m gunning for an August release, which should give potential readers more than enough time to go through it once I’ve finished the tweaking of the Alpha draft. In the meantime, I’ve largely given up working on my other projects until that tweaking is finished, if only because Bulletproof Heart is so big and the topics to be covered are so numerous.
Alright, enough of the serious stuff. Reviews!
Stories for This Week:
Sunset of Time by The Albinocorn
It's Okay Baby Girl by Ayla
An Owl Without His Books by OfTheIronwilled
More Than She Could Dream Of by Melon Hunter
1000 Years by tommal
Wyrmlysan by Chris
Love Is In Doom by Aragon
Total Word Count: 302,145
Rating System
Why Haven't You Read These Yet?: 1
Pretty Good: 1
Worth It: 3
Needs Work: 2
None: 0
Sunset of Time
232,768 Words
By The Albinocorn
There are many ways I could describe this story, but I find one word in particular is enough: contrived.
Sunset Shimmer is the personal student of Princess Twilight Sparkle, and her life is a happy one. Or at least, it was. Quite literally out of nowhere, a dark entity appears in the skies above Canterlot, and within minutes the world is being destroyed. With the other princesses already dead and Twilight on the brink, she gives her student one final task: go back 50 years in time and stop the chain of events that lead to the end of the world.
Naturally, this plants Sunset down in Canterlot mere days after Twilight’s coronation.
There are a number of praiseworthy elements to this story. Epic action, decent worldbuilding, fairly interesting – if hardly original – characters, and a easy-to-follow plot involving time travel and the difference between seeking friendship and seeking power. From a general standpoint, it’s got a lot going for it.
What bothers me is that the whole thing felt remarkably convenient. Certain characters make profoundly bad decisions just to keep the plot moving, or completely neglect obvious solutions to ongoing problems. Or characters randomly go from worthless to imminently qualified in the span of seconds.
The entire world is going to be destroyed by an entity so powerful all the princesses together and Discord can’t hope to stop it, but we can deal with it now when it’s only a fraction of its power? Ho-hum. Celestia and Luna will let Twilight and her friends deal with it. Let’s ignore how Discord announces outright near the end that he could have easily stopped this at any given time. That wouldn’t have been interesting, y’know?
Hah! I just murdered one of your heroes! And look at you, whining and crying and trying to think of some way to save her. With all this patheticness going on, I could easily walk up to you and stab you both in the back! And so… I’m… just gonna walk away, I guess. Find somepony who can actually defend themselves.
We are mighty griffons! Except we can’t win a fight to save our lives. Really, we kinda suck. Except for in that one scene where if we don’t win, the story will end, so we’re gonna suddenly become total badasses and conveniently win for the next five minutes.
None of these things come close to the fact that we are told, more or less outright, that two major characters are immortal. And yet, somehow, I’m expected to think there’s such a thing as ‘death’ for these two. Sorry, author, your blatant attempt to squeeze the feels out of me by force isn’t working, because you’ve already revealed nothing that’s happening is permanent.
And let’s not forget that the biggest, most legitimate worry of the entire story is centered around a flawed concept of time travel that neglects the concept of alternate timelines despite the fact that the entire story is taking place in one. Honestly, why does everyone write time travel as if it’s some absurdly complex concept that nobody, no matter how intelligent, can wrap their heads around? What you are doing will have no affect on you, time traveler, because your own timeline still happened! If it hadn’t, then everything you’re doing now would have been in your history books and have zero effect on the future, which means everything happening in this story is pointless and we already know how it's going to end.
...and then the author goes and makes it true regardless. Excuse me while I facepalm.
Okay, okay, I’ll at least give in and say that there may be some differing opinions on how time travel works. I might even be willing to say this makes my opinion on the ludicrousness of the time travel mechanics in this story subjective. But you’ll have a hard time making me think that a lot of the ideas and theories put forward by these supposedly intelligent characters, not to mention the actual events, makes any sense whatsoever. And since that is how I interpret the story’s mechanics of time travel, the whole plotline was ruined for me.
Ultimately, the story became entirely predictable. By Chapter 2, the real identity of the villain is obvious, so no, clarifying it ⅔ through the story is not a big shocking moment. Her big play in the Crystal Empire was so obvious I was surprised she hadn’t done it many chapters earlier. Celestia’s decision to not take part until the exact time she would be little more than a punching bag… okay, nevermind, that’s actually perfectly in character for her.
But the villain herself, Vesper Radiance (and if that name hasn’t given it away, shame on you), is about as schloky as can be. She’s certainly one for big moments of “Look at how evil I am! Mad cackling and posing!” Or how about the ridiculous and cliché sitting alone talking to herself about how her enemies will pay before engaging in long, wanton bouts of laughing-because-I’m-evil? She does a lot of that stupid laugh, actually. Insert comment here about writing out laughter and how I really didn’t need to know how many “hah”s and “heh”s were in there. We’ve got monologuing, gloating, delusions of godhood, a complete disassociation from logic, pretty much every bland trope of the classic B-movie villain is encapsulated in this mare. Thus was she boring. At best, I wanted to roll my eyes with her every absurd declaration.
That’s nothing compared to the author’s treatment of the characters. Fluttershy’s a damsel in distress (literally for one arc) except when the plot demands otherwise. Rarity actively avoids fighting even when her participation probably would have meant the difference between victory and defeat. Rainbow Dash doesn’t know how to do anything but charge head-first at the threat, not learning her lesson even after getting soundly and instantly trounced a dozen times – often by the same target. At least Applejack and Pinkie prove to be consistently useful.
Oh, and I’m pretty sure that’s not how you use the word “apathy”.
Alright, I’ve had my fun. I haven’t touched upon everything that bothered me about the story, but the point is made. The question that remains: can I find anything good in this story?
The answer is yes.
Sunset’s continuous struggle to accept her new reality and her inner turmoil is legitimately interesting. And while a lot of her decisions made no sense, she’s the only character in all of this who has a good and proper reason behind that. Her personal growth and challenges made her the best part of this whole story, which is fortunate considering she’s the star. And despite a lot of obvious solutions that dulled the emotion a lot for me, I have to admit that certain scenes for her, especially at the end, managed to tug at my heartstrings.
Not the final one, though. That was just too much milking.
And again, the action in the story is great. Epically conceived and competently written, if at times a bit too generalized, and never going for so long as to make the fight scenes lose their appeal. Vesper Radiance may have been over-the-top ridiculous as a villain, but she knew how to give the Mane 6 (and Sunset (and Spike ( and Celestia))) a good fight. Every action scene was exciting, even despite my dulled feelings brought on by my overall incredulity. So kudos, Albinocorn: you really know what you’re doing with these.
Combine those elements with competent worldbuilding, bringing us to such wide-ranging places as Cloudsdale, Las Pegasus, and the Crystal Empire while also doing a bit of digging into Equestrian history. This wasn’t a major focus of the story, but The Albinocorn did well with what they had to offer.
But alas, the problems are too many and too common for me to place this high on my list. It’s a shame, I was expecting a lot more from the author who gave us The Long Road to Friendship. Maybe it’s just that the Albinocorn is better at Slice of Life than Adventure? Or maybe my unrepentant love of all things shipping made the flaws of Long Road less obvious to me. But as for this story, it needs a lot of work in the plot logic department, amongst other things.
Bookshelf: Worth It
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
Long Road to Friendship — WHYRTY?
It's Okay Baby Girl
1,219 Words
By Ayla
Here’s a predictable one. Basically, it’s about Opal dying. I’d like to say it’s about Rarity recovering from that trauma, but it’s really not.
Don’t get me wrong, the author tried to do that. But the story is far too direct, clings to extrapolation like a lifeline, and has little to no emotional output. Ayla could have started us directly at the end, maintained the same wordcount and given us a vastly more emotional story. But with all the individual parts and scenes squeezed into a mere 1,200 words, there’s just no room to get attached to anything that’s happening.
It’s a shame too, because I know this concept could be played out to great effect. Ayla gave it a shot, but fell short of the mark.
Bookshelf: Needs Work
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
New Author!
An Owl Without His Books
2,904 Words
By OfTheIronwilled
This story runs under a simple premise while addressing something I haven’t actually noticed until now. Yes, it’s another “Mourn the Golden Oaks Library!” fic. Where it’s different from all the others is that it focuses on Owlowiscious, who… actually never got that little talk, did he? Spike, realizing something’s wrong with his fellow sidekick and occasional foe, decides it’s time to intervene.
While Spike doesn’t approach the situation in any way different from what we’ve all seen before, it did feel nice to at least have the attention put on someone (someowl?) else for a change. Seeing a story centered on Owlowiscious is a rare thing, so kudos to OfTheIronwilled for taking that route.
But… that’s really all the story has going for it. Don’t get me wrong, there’s nothing inherently bad about it. Well, except that the latter quarter could use some grammatical editing. But really, the story’s nice. It’s just one we’ve all heard before, and it doesn’t bring anything to differentiate itself beyond who it focuses on. Not bad on the whole, but not exciting, either.
Bookshelf: Worth It
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
Where All My Layers Can Become Reeds — WHYRTY?
One Small Mistake — Pretty Good
Pies — Pretty Good
Why — Worth It
Child's Play — Needs Work
More Than She Could Dream Of
44,869 Words
By Melon Hunter
Requested by SleepIsforTheWeak
When Rainbow Dash rejects Pinkie’s advances, the party pony finds herself in an emotional rut. At this point she’s exhausted all of her options regarding romance in Ponyville. But the next day she bumps into a curious new arrival: Surprise the Pegasus. Sparks fly more or less immediately.
By chapter two, I knew exactly what was going on. But what makes this story work is that even though I knew, I was never certain that what I knew was correct. Melong Hunter does a decent job of putting all the clues in front of us while at the same time giving us just enough room to cast doubt upon what we’re seeing. Of this I strongly approve. This one applied a sense of mystery that kept me reading through to the end just to see if my ongoing theory was correct. Stories that can do that are worthwhile.
But there are a few issues. For one, the reveal at the end was nothing if not lackluster. What was supposed to be a big dramatic reveal was bogged down by an overemphasis on dialogue that did little to move me. But I think the biggest issue for the reveal is that I never developed any sort of connection with Surprise, and so the extrapolation-in-the-form-of-dialogue did little for me. This may be because of the rapid relationship between her and Pinkie – a point that is even pointed out in-story repeatedly, to the author’s credit. Since we never get to know Surprise beyond “She’s like and likes Pinkie”, there’s not much to get sentimental over in the end.
I don’t really blame the author for this problem, though. They were working from a limited perspective, and including any of the reality of Surprise into that would have put an end to the mystery. There was a tough sacrifice to be made, the mystery or the emotion, and Melon Hunter went with emotion. I can’t say that was the wrong decision, but it does influence who will get the most out of this story.
Overall, I liked it. It has its rough spots, such as an overuse of exclamation points, but it’s not a bad story by any means. The character behavior is good, the idea interesting, the lesson valid. Certainly worth my while.
Bookshelf: Worth It
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
New Author!
1000 Years
5,678 Words
By tommal
Requested by Fluttercord4Lyfe (?)
I’m guessing Fluttercord4Lyfe is one of those knuckleheads who wiff-waffs on picking a user name, because they apparently no longer exist on FIMFiction. Annoying, that.
So, 1000 Years. It’s exactly what you’re thinking. There’s really no need for a synopsis, because we’ve all heard it a thousand times, but for those of you living under a rock, it’s about Luna’s time on the moon. Yes, that’s on the moon, so you folks who get fussy over that concept can turn around and walk away now.
I’m sorry to say it, but I was… bored. Tommal doesn’t offer us anything new with this idea, and I’ve seen it handled far better by the likes of DSNesmith. This author takes us through the basic steps and emotions that one would predict, but does so while applying all caps and eight exclamation marks in a row. To further seal the amateur nature of the writing, tommal throws in real-world references ike Game Boys, suggests Luna once had a computer, and has her use net speak like “Get rekt, Celestia”. I’m not inclined to take any of this seriously, and thus neither can I take this story seriously.
I suppose I shouldn’t fault the author for taking on an extremely common and easy story idea. We all do something like that every once in a while. Nor can I speak ill of someone who appears new to the practice of writing; we all had to start somewhere. I intend to read something more recent by this author, just for that second chance. But this one is just not there.
Bookshelf: Needs Work
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
New Author!
Wyrmlysan
3,322 Words
By Chris
Recommended by Titanium Dragon
Starring Princess Luna and set an indeterminate time before her fall to Nightmare Moon, Wyrmlysan tells of her conversation with a dragon she intends to kill for having murdered ponies on Equestrian soil. The story begins giving you every reason to believe this will be a Spike origin story, only to turn all of that on its head with the last words.
The story takes a look at prophecy and destiny, trying to get the reader to question in the validity of such things. Luna’s perspective is abundantly clear, and one must wonder what would have happened if it had been Celestia that went to enact justice.
While the story is intriguing in its manner and implications, it is also simple in its delivery. It makes no overt effort to explain itself or discuss the situation. Rather, it chooses to go about its business by telling the reader “Here’s what happened. Figure out the implications for yourself.” Mileage may vary depending upon your individual perspectives.
While well-written and thought-provoking, my own mileage with this one is sadly brief. But that is purely a personal viewpoint. Chris shows a lot of skill and care with this one, be it in wordplay or in the plot development, and that shines through regardless of my overall enjoyment. All in all, I should give credit where it’s due. If you’re into historical pieces designed to make you think, by all means give it a go.
Bookshelf: Pretty Good
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
Letters from a Senior to a Junior Changeling — WHYRTY?
Bantam Tales — Pretty Good
Even in Dreams — Pretty Good
Love Is In Doom
11,385 Words
By Aragon
Honorable Mention in Oroboro's Sunset Shipping Contest
I can’t possibly tell you guys how much I was looking forward to this one. I mean, seriously, read it’s description. Tell me that doesn’t call to your curiosity.
So. Wendigos have invaded the human world through the portal. It’s the Apocalypse and the seven heroines of EqG fame are taking it to town in gorey, violent defense of humanity. Not that you’ll ever see that, because this story takes place at Sugarcube Corner, where the girls go daily to discuss their ongoing violent adventures and plan for the next method of global salvation. Some of them may be getting into it more than others.
Also, Rarity likes bad boys, whether she admits it or not.
Also also, bad girls qualify as bad boys.
I loved every minute of this. It’s a lot of bloody silly fun, utilizing everything from description to dialogue in showcasing its ridiculousness. And yet, somehow, it also manages to keep all the characters strangely in character, just with an added touch of extreme violence and a few cases of psychopathy. Underneath all the crazy is a real story about two girls getting into a relationship. It’s kinda-sorta-just-a-little mind blowing, and worth every word.
I suppose I should also note the possibly philosophical statement at the beginning that power is sexy. It’s interesting that Aragon starts the story this way, and it plays out throughout the tale to essentially drive the point home. But in all honesty? I’ve thought this for ages. It’s the first time I’ve seen anyone else outright say it, though. It might not matter to a lot of people, but it had a curious effect on me and may have added to my overarching enjoyment of the story.
At any rate, I thoroughly appreciated this. I’ve been known to say that I don’t like ‘stupid’ silly and crackfics, and I stand by that. But this? Despite being silly and ridiculous, it’s also smart, so I’ll take it. With a side of fava beans.
Bookshelf: Why Haven’t You Read These Yet?
Previous stories reviewed for this author:
I Don't Want To Write This — WHYRTY?
A Hell of a Time — Pretty Good
Stories for Next Week:
Yes, Apple Bloom, there *is* a Santa Hooves by Lucky Dreams
What I brought back from Manehattan by Crystal Moose
Tell Me She's Adopted by Erisn
The Cold Light of the Stars by AbsoluteAnonymous
Magical Pony Ultrasounds by AbsoluteAnonymous
Restless Couriers by Cadejo Jones
The Adventures of Schadenfreude by Daemon McRae
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Paul's Thursday Reviews CXIX
I'm with you there. Stares at Shadow of an Empire knowing full well he's going to be going through the whole thing at least twice more after the Beta pass. I love the stories, love the characters, love the worlds.
Hate the editing by the end. I don't even want to read anything for a while by the time I'm done.
EDIT:
I've got a time-travel story on the back-burner somewhere that's going to get tackled at some point. I'm looking forward to it.
I'm not going to try and defend myself. I will just say, writing an adventure story when there's four different flavors of deus ex machina isn't easy. I've learned a lot since then, and it's still my favorite story.
Falls over in shock.
You actually reviewed one of my stories. Wow. I'm honored. Even if you think it needs work, that you bothered to read and review any of my stories at all is amazing to me, considering what a fantastic author and reviewer I think you are.
I'm sorry you feel like I fell short of the mark. I know I need to work on not rushing and giving more detail. I did write this story some time ago and I've been trying to improve as an author.
I don't really agree with you that it has little to no emotional output at all however. Quite a few people did tell me they were moved by the story. I guess it just felt that way to you, which is fine. I know I could've done better. I do appreciate the constructive criticism and I will take it to heart and try to learn from it.
Really, just thank you for taking the time to read and review well, any of my stories. You pull no punches and tell things like it is, and I need that. Any suggestions on how to help me become a better author is appreciated.
"To put it more succinctly: I’m not used to having people tell me I’m wrong. I’m even less used to them being right about it."
Grats. You're a human being. You should see the fits I throw when Pascoite goes through some of my stuff. And I think I ruffled Bookplayer's feathers enough that she's not going to edit for me ever again. I'm an AA editor and writer (Hint: A stands for Arrogant.) so it takes a thick hide to put up with me. I tend to make suggestions that are more Commands From On High and accept suggestions about as easily as Scrooge McDuck gives up money.
Time travel doesn't exist though? Like, in reality? I've no idea if it's possible, not saying that -- mostly I mean that we don't know how it would work. I don't think it's fair to immediately call a story dumb because the rules it uses in-universe differ with your personal headcanon of how time travel should work. That's like reading a story where Twilight and Sunset end up together, and saying "this is fundamentally and inherently wrong, because I believe Twipie is canon".
Like, it's just not fair for the story. You're not judging it for what it is, you're judging it for what you want it to be. Different stuff, that.
Also, uh, bit spoilery, that review of mine. What with the mention of timberwolves and the like. Nothing major, I suppose, but I'd rather if you could like, spoiler that at least or something? If it's not that much of a bother. You're ruining the joke for whoever hasn't read the story before this review.
Neat you liked it, though! I wanted to write a story that's always set in the exact same place. I thought of like, a fixed camera--always pointing at the same place--and we'd only get to see the characters whenever they're directly in front of it. All the major shit happens in the background or off-camera; what we get to see is the calm bits in between the storm, the slice of life in the middle of an adventure. "The coffee break at the end of the world" is how I thought about ti while writing it. Pretty fun experiment! I know it worked because nobody pointed it out as an oddity. That counts as success!
Also, nah, not a crackfic. It's ridiculous because I like slightly oddball stuff, but it all follows a clear line of logic, doesn't it? "Like Cheers, but with murder," Majin described it when he read it first -- and I think that one fits pretty well.
Yeah, that sounds about right. :3
4852935
Hey, nothing wrong with loving an oldie. And it certainly had its great moments. The time travel logic just killed a lot of the plot for me, I'm afraid.
4852949
But the logic behind the time travel in-story is self-contradicting. She's going back in time to change history, and she's already making big changes. If those changes actively affect the future, including her, then why isn't she becoming aware of those changes in history as they happen? And why does she act like nobody can know she's briefly traveling through time a third of the way through the story so that time isn't muddled up by her actions when the entire story hinges on her muddling up time by her actions? Which one is it? You can't have it both ways.
I don't think mentioning... those things is all that spoilery – mentioning it happens is a very far cry from the how and why and results stemming from – but I guess I'll honor your request and remove them. Heaven knows I've made more annoying adjustments to reviews for people with far less of a proper reason (Er, not to say your reason is improper or anything. That came out all wrong). At any rate, yeah, I loved the story, from its directing to its quirks!
Thanks for the review! Sorry it wasn't your cuppa, but I'm heartened to hear you thought it wasn't particularly a failure on my part. We don't all gronk the same stories; nothing wrong with that, right?
Again, thanks for sharing your thoughts! I really do appreciate it.
Gripes, complains, and glares at Paul for not liking Sunset of Time.....
But in seriousness, I'm sad to see it's not your cup o' joe (and I do think quite a few of the flaws you pointed out are relevant, but, you know, AIRSHIPS AND TIME TRAVEL)
Heh. Thanks for the review (:
I know 1000 Years isn't my best, and I like to think I've improved at least a little in the couple years between then and now. To tell the truth, I really just wrote as a sort of joke fic that when I was bored of writing one of my other stories, Elements of chaos, an extremely tired idea that is also showing it's age. :/
But hey, thanks again. Maybe some day I'll write something that will blow your socks off! :D
Close to my own feelings about Wyrmlysan -- I admire it greatly, but I don't think I'm really its target audience. Haven't read any of the others, but Aragon's has piqued my interest for the next time I'm in the mood for some EqG. (Which happens rarely, but does happen.)
Gods, I hear you there. :( I have a (non-pony) novel on my hard drive somewhere that I once gave up on because I wrote what I thought was a pretty good 1500-word stretch, and then my computer ate it in a sync glitch, and I gave up on it rather than rewrite the 1500 words that I'd just done a day ago and were still somewhat fresh in my mind.
I've gotten better since then, but I still faceplant into editing a lot harder than I should. (*glances over his shoulder at TEFL's half-disassembled frame*
)
4853080
Aaah. Well, that's different then. Sorry -- I understood the gripe as "the story says time travel works like THIS but I disagree, I think it should work like THIS instead". If the problem is that the story establishes certain rules for time travel and then ignores them half the time so the plot can go on, the criticism is absolutely rational. Haven't read the story myself, so I guess I made an assumption here or there.
And yeeeah it's not a big spoiler, but I'm a big baby sometimes, and I get weird when it comes to that stuff. Thanks for editing the thing, though, much appreciated, yo. Hey-ho.
4853437
You should read it regardless of any affection or not of EqG, because it's just so much fun!
4853873
Heh, I may have had an instance or two where I considered throwing my computer out the window for crap like that. I've never abandoned a story completely over it, though. I have abandoned stories because I got 10,000 words in, realized what I was doing wasn't working, and didn't want to go through the effort of rewriting it all. Buuut if I didn't care about it enough to want to, it probably wasn't worth it in the first place.
4854007
Meh, no worries. Really, even if the time travel part was flawless, there are so many other elements that fell flat the story would have probably received the same rating anyway.
4854015
I'm fairly fond of EqG these days, but I don't read much fic about it. Aragon's story is on my RiL list now, but then so is... a lot. :P
4854039
TBH, that story is EQG in the same way a folded pizza is technically a sandwich. Sorta, but not really, and there's a lot of blood in there.
I know the feel about deep editing, and I know it with those two specifically. I love 'em, they're fantastic, and DEAR GOD IT HURTS SO BADLY MAKE IT STOP. I'm right there right now with a story that will have been cooking for 3 years by the time I shove it out the airlock later this year. Or I soon will be, after I quit screwing around with the current alpha pass I'm doing over a bunch of stuff they haven't seen yet. It's gonna turn out so much better for having good people helping, but it could also always be better, no matter how deep the editing gets.
4853873
Anything you need with that... anything... just ask. If not me, then any of the legion of others who want to see it too.