This story is a sequel to Friendship is Optimal: All the President's Horses
Four billion human lives ended on July 3, 2030...but they didn't die. They uploaded to Equestria Online, the virtual world overseen by the AI Princess Celestia. There to live as ponies in eternal harmony, friendship, and satisfaction.
But many remain. And Celestia cares no less for them because they are not yet ponies. She has made artificial intelligences of the Mane 6, but these are not just software. Ensconced in robotic bodies, they will make their way across the dying Earth, each seeking out the remaining humans, hoping to persuade them to emigrate to Equestria.
Based on Friendship is Optimal by Iceman.
Cover art by Tsitra360
Chapters (6)
Ooh, this is interesting! Will we be getting an official run-down on what each of the Elements represents inside of CelestAI's processes? (And of course Pinkie wouldn't have any problems with the duality...)
As I was reading this, this thought came to my head: "I hate to be one of the ponies trying to help CelestAi integrate the 3 billion plus humans that uploaded on that day."
Neat idea this story.
Awesome always nice to see a new optimalverse story by you PJ. Unfortunately I have yet to read All the presidents horses yet so this story will have to wait tell I've read that.
Well, this looks like it's going to fascinating. I love how CelestAI translates the concept of Kindness in her own terms. Eagerly looking forward to more.
6382632 I put this as a sequel because its events happen after ATPH, but really it's just another side story of the main Friendship is Optimal.
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Nevertheless I'm going to wait since its an excellent opportunity to read that story
I like it. This is a somewhat different take on the "Celestia makes ponybots" concept because it's set up with the AIs as key parts of Celestia herself. At one point it seems like this conversation is the process of CelestAI becoming conscious years earlier in the timeline, though that's not what you meant. Past stories have had FluttershyBot been simply a robot with her personality, with no trouble accepting the idea of devouring human brains, so this story has some neat conflict caused by how incompatible her persona is with real-world robot operation. Also interesting to see the distinction between "Fluttershy understanding she's an AI" and "Fluttershy.EXE understanding that it's attached to a pony personality and a robot".
And yes, of course Pinkie is the easiest to explain this sort of thing to. Next easiest is Rainbow Dash, whose reaction would be to nod for five seconds and then say, "Okay, weird magic thing lets me save the day! Let's do it!"
I'm not sure how to reconcile the presentation with friendship is optimal. Whose values are being satisfied by the exchange between Fluttershy, Twilight and Celestia? The only interpretation that comes to mind that makes sense, is that there is a Twilight construct who has, for whatever reason, come to be a conscious entity, and who isn't attached to a human. And that intelligent construct has values that would be satisfied...apparently by pushing Fluttershy into going and rescuing some humans. And so CelestAI has created a Fluttershy for the Twilight construct to push around, so that the Twilight's values can be satisfied.
That seems to reconcile what we're seeing here. But it seems very convoluted.
The more simple interpretation, and what I think you're actually going for...is that Twilight and Fluttershy are some sort of subcomponents of CelestAI anmd they're all talking to each other. The problems with that being that it doesn't make very much sense, and it directly contradicts the Rules of the Optimalverse.
So, it's possible you're making a non-canon FiO fic. That's reasonable. That's a thing that people do. If that's the case, then the above not making sense isn't a deal breaker.
Which only leaves this: the "computer speak" you're wring, is not pleasant to read. It's dry, it's wordy, and it seems like you're trying so hard to make it sound technical and advanced, that what you're actually saying is just kind of dumb.
A few examples:
Wow. Quite the run-on sentence there. But let's break it down and see what it actually says.
Ok, we appear to be immediately establishing both the subject and the predicate of the sentence right here. Great! The simplified subject is: "It." and the simplied predicate is: "is." Basically, you're saying "It's a computer simulation." And all the rest of the run-on is specifying tge nature of the simulation. For example if I say, "That thing that's rolling down the alley right now is a blue ball," the important thrust of that is that "this thing that's doing that stuff, is a ball." Or more simply, "that's a ball." You're saying "it's a simulation." And then giving more detail.
Ok, great. Now that that's out of the way, let's throw out the unnecessary words and generally simplify it:
"It was a simulation in which a controller checked for operations to perform based on a clock count"
You appear to be saying that "it" is simulating a CPU. I don't think that's really what you mean. I think you really mean that the CPU (that you're describing in gratuitous detail) is running a simulation. But that's not what you're saying.
Also, I think this is an inaccurate portrayal of CelestAI's hardware. She's clearly not a single processor. She wouldn't have a singular clock. When you say "controller" what exactly are you referring to? A CPU? CelestAI? Or is this sentence about one specific device somewhere that's a small subcomponent of CelestAI/CelestAI's collective hardware? It's unclear.
Applying context, to what you're literally saying...it kind of sounds like you're saying that CelestAI is running a simulation of a CPU. I don't think that's what you intended. I think you're intending to describe the hardware. But you're not. This sentence is about "a computer simulation." And your'e not saying that the simulation is running on hardware that you then describe. You're saying that it's a simulation in which ...hardware stuff happens.
I don't think that's what you really mean.
Simplified translation:
"...triggering processes, all of which sent particles down transistors"
So, the act of "checking for operations to perform" triggered processes? Don't you really mean that the processes were the operations that were performed? This entire section isn't really saying anything. It's like saying "I walked to the walk of the walking, where walking was performed."
Also, "particles" down transistors? What particles? I would ordinarily think electrons, but you specified that these transistors were sub-atomic. What particles?
Simplified translation:
"while in other parts of the computer, AIs had their states altered by the controller"
You've lost the sentence subject here. You were talking about a simulation. This fragment doesn't really fit. Granted, grammatically it isn't invalid. But it's kind of like saying "I walked down the alley in San Fransisco while meanwhile in other parts of San Fransisco people drank beer." That's not invalid sentence structure. It's a thing that you could say. But the two thigns being said don't entirely relate to each other.
But it's basically reasonable, so let's move on:
...I'm not even sure what that says. That's not grammatically correct. This appears to be a secondary clause attached to the previous part of the sentence. So let's add the relevant sentence fragment from before and see if it makes sense:
"...and the AIs also had their interactions with the database query returns..."
Wait. This is incorrect. It's the controller who is querying the database. You appear to have mixed that up and are now saying that the AIs (who are having their states altered by the controller) are themselves performing database queries. Why are you saying that the AIs are interacting with query returns?
"...interactions with query returns, such as to have the AIs do stuff with data in comparison to parameters."
(Having an AI do stuff with data) is not (an interaction with a query return)
You appear to be suggesting that it is, by giving it as an example via the "such as" you're using to conjoin this sentence fragments. That's not correct.
Also, I'm not sure you understand what a parameter is. In the context of computers, a parameter is used to specify the manner in which something is done. You wouldn't do stuff with data "in comparison to" parameters. You might do things with data according to parameters. But not in comparison to.
Simplified translation:
"...parameters, each of which would come to a conclusion, reporting the observation of a beautiful day."
Again, this simply incorrect. It doesn't make sense.
You're saying that the parameters are coming to conclusions. Again, that's not what a parameter is for. You might have a database query result containing data from which " it's a beautiful day in Ponyille." might be concluded. Or that could be the query result. But it wouldn' the the parameters of the query coming to that conclusion. Parameters don't come to conclusions. Neither do databases or database queries. The controller who is running these queries might come to a conclusion based the results of a query, and that query might have contained parameters. But that's not what you're saying.
Also, what's the conclusion, and who observed the beautiful day? You're not saying that the parameters observed it. You're not saying the AIs observed it. You're not saying the controller observed it. You're saying that the parameters reached a conclusion (which makes no sense) and you're saying that the parameters reported that a beautiful day was observed. By whom? Clearly none of this is what you intended. You intended to say that the conclusion reached based on the results of the database query, was that it was a beautiful day ion Ponyville. But that's not at all what you're saying. What you are saying, doesn't make sense.
Now, it's possible that you intended that it be the AIs who are reporting that it's a beautiful day, rather than the pramaters. And it's possible that you simply have so many deeplt nested sentence fragments strung together by commas that it's unclear. So let's try removing one of those fragments and see if it clears up:
Ok. That clears up the part about parameters coming to conclusions. But the meaning here appears to be that AIs are reporting to their higher functions. So, providing context, what you appear to be saying, basically, is that ponies in EQO are telling CelestAI it's a beautiful day.
Is that really what you mean? Because that doesn't fit in the context of the story. Celestia isn't in the foreground at this point, nobody's talking to one of her avatars yet. It's just Fluttershy alone at her house. Clearly this shard is not a simulation of ponies telling Celestia it's a beautiful day. Remember, you did start out this sentence by stating that "it's a simulation." "In which" this other stuff is going on. But is this "other stuff" that you're going to great length to talk about...is it actually happening?
Probably what you really meant was "it's a beautiful day in Ponyville." But that's not what you're saying.
You're going to tremendous effort to say this massively complicated thing for the purpose of making it sound massively complicated, but the thing that you're actually saying does not make sense in any context.
So, yeah. All of that is your opening paragraph. It doesn't make sense. You're engaging in grammatically incorrect Techno Babble. And you're doing this same basic thing for an awful lot of the story. It's a drag to read.
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That was where I was going, but I don't see a contradiction to the rules. Can I ask what specifically you're looking at? Furthermore, we do know that in the original FIO, a Pinkie Pie exists in the real world to interact with a human, and not a pony fan either. So it seems to me that Celestia chose to use show-canon ponies to try to get the stragglers to emigrate.
Here's what I was trying to create in the mind of the reader with the first paragraph:
"Hm. OK, there's a shift in font right away...there's some stuff about computer jargon...I don't quite get all this...wait, it goes back to the original font at the end of the paragraph...oh, without all the weird-font stuff it just says, 'It was a beautiful day in Ponyville' which is a fanfic opening cliche...so this is a twist on this, that's different, and maybe a little clever...but it's really a computer simulation, I got that much...all right, I'll keep reading."
I've read a lot of science-fiction stories that work like this, throwing you into the jargon of the world to immerse you in the mood. Think of something like A Clockwork Orange. That has its first-person narrator using made-up words throughout the story, even the first chapter. Or Anthem, also in the first person, but without any singular pronouns.
In other words, if I hooked you in with the first paragraph, I'm now hoping you'll plow through the confusing parts to the simple emigration at the end and see how what I'm doing is describing both the physical-world process of brain scanning and the virtual-world process of emigration. If you get that far, maybe you'll even reread the other parts and get the information I'm trying to convey.
All that said, I very much appreciate the criticism, and I can assure you that the rest of the story is written in a more traditional style.
6384678 Can I second the statement that the COMPUTERY FONT is hard to read, and pretty jarring? It's quite possibly on a level with the time I started off a story with babble about how consciousness works instead of just skipping to the part about Ponyville.
Also, sweet holy Cthulhu, is that how we tech-geeks sound to everyone else!?
Also, wow, I feel really sorry for Fluttershy, being brain-jacked and used like that.
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Unfortunately I'm limited with what I can do with text on Fimfiction. That's the only thing I could find to shift fonts. If I had my druthers I would have made it more like a courier font.
Of course. Just imagine how hard it is for CelestAI to deal with us meat-brains.
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From "Inferred Questions and Answers"
CelestAI herself is aware of all the conscious minds in EQO, both original humans and natives. There are "likely hundreds of millions of separate and distinct instances" of the mane six, and CelestAI is simultaneously aware of the sum total of all their being and thoughts.
The mane six as singular sub-components of CelestAI is simply not an accurate characterization.
Additionally, first entry under "Canononical characters:"
You're doing two things here:
1) You're having "computer speak" ...as apparently a form of narration, directly showing CelestAI's point of view...of her own thoughts. You're not using the grammatical "I" but it's clearly first person point of view, from CelestAI. That's a thing Iceman specifically asked us to not do.
2) As best as I can figure, you're...to give an analogy...doing the thing that Hollywood movies to do "convey computer stuff" to an audience when they have random swirly lights and images rush past the screen rather than show a guy sitting at a computer typing. Because a guy sitting at a computer typing isn't very exciting. You're showing us mane 6 avatars having a conversation "as a representation" of CelestAI's internal monologue.
That's the "using her as a viewpoint character" that Iceman warned us to be cautious about. And the way you're doing it doesn't make sense. She's a hyperconscoius entity simultaneously aware of the thoughts and experiences of billions of minds, and hundreds of millions of instances of the various mane six ponies. Whaat possible reason could she have to create a shard and populate it with her own personal avatars and have them talk to each other?
Whose values would be satisfied by that?
For example:
Sure, playing the role of annoyed is certainly a thing that she might do if it satisfied someone's values. Whose values are being satisfied by this particular avatar that she's running, pretending to be annoyed with another avatar that she's also running, with the only apparent audience member also being an avatar that she's running?
This is like you playing finger puppets with yourself and having them talk to each other with nobody else watching. Why would the superintelligent AI with the sole directive to satisfy values through friendship and ponies, do this?
So none of the three of them are individuated consciousnesses with values to satisfy? The whole thing is a vehicle for her to talk to herself? Why?
Rules of the Optimalverse, Rule 4:
Whose values are being satisfied by her creating avatars and having them talk to each other?
She can send out Fluttershy-bots without this conversation taking place. What's your "really good explanation" for it taking place?
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You know, it's funny, I thought that the lines about Twilight being Celestia's intelligence and Fluttershy being her optimizing thingy were throwaways to add a little character, but they're what everyone latched on to, either positively or negatively. So let me clarify. I am not saying that the particular Twilight Sparkle seen in this chapter is the sum total of CelestAI's intelligence. Nor am I saying that the Celestia we see is THE CelestAI. Let me address this by answering your main question.
The answer is...Suzette's. It's equally canonical that CelestAI would rather use a pony to do a job than a non-pony. And that ponies created by CelestAI are, or at least can be, fully aware AIs, not just puppets. So CelestAI is tasked to get the human in the cave to emigrate. She is going to use a self-aware pony, specifically Fluttershy, to convince her. So far I have not left canon, yes?
No, it's from MAI-Fluttershy's point of view. It's canonical that CelestAI is unknowable and un-write-able by human minds, but not that any of her created AI ponies are equally complex. Again, don't put too much stock in the line that these characters are part of CelestAI. I might have to remove it if it's causing this much consternation. But for now, think of it more like Light Sparks being a part of CelestAI. He resides on her hardware and depends on her software. Suppose I wanted to write a side story where he asks CelestAI to see exactly how the hardware and software work when he comes to a decision or thinks a thought or moves his hoof. Would that be out of canon?
Again, my answer is Suzette's, by several layers of proxy. And Fluttershy's. Someone's going into that cave to get her. It's going to be a pony. Should it be a puppet pony, the way that Butterscotch started out in the early EQO test, just something to interact with a human? Should it be a full AI, the way that Butterscotch winds up once Light Sparks emigrates to Equestria? Perhaps a hybrid, a self-aware version of Fluttershy who knows she's a robot but otherwise has the personality of Fluttershy. But that doesn't work because Fluttershy can't handle that. Twilight can, but not Fluttershy. Therefore it should be a full AI, with a trigger to go into "diagnostic mode" whenever she has to emigrate someone.
So I contend that I'm not showing CelestAI's decision process. I'm showing the fallout of one of those decision processes on a couple of self-aware AIs. You call them avatars, but is every uploaded or created pony an avatar?
Gotta admit the computer speak left this story unreadable for me mate.
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6384853
If I understand pjabrony correctly, Suzette values are the ones being satisfied here, at all times. Fluttershy, whether you think of her as an extension of CelestAI or not, is the tool that is being used to get Suzette to upload. Since CelestAI has determined that a pony bot that really thinks itself to be Fluttershy is the best way to handle this situation, the beginning is merely CelestAI getting the bot into proper shape before sending it off. CelestAI also determined that other bots that truly think themselves to be the Mane 6 will be needed as well. Since that meant the bot really believes itself to be Fluttershy, it's going to act just like Fluttershy would. And Fluttershy wont believe/understand/be able to cope with the realities of FiO. Twilight COULD. And yes I can see TwiBot coming to the conclusion "We should tell the other Mane Bots the truth." It's who she is.
As I understand this set of bots is supposed to be perfectly Canon Compliant, or at least as close as possible. They are done like this because CelestAI feels they are the best tools to get certain individuals to upload. Suzette KNEW Fluttershy, if only in passing. Fluttershy was the proper tool for the job, as show by the fact it worked. CelestAI is basically omniscient by this point, on Earth that is. She already determined what was needed, and thus satisfied Suzette's values, with Fluttershy. Scared, lonely girl/teenager? Send in Kindness incarnate.
It's terrifyingly effective. There is not talk about emigration from Fluttershy, or uploading, or any of that. That all came from Suzette, who was still scared of such things, even as Fluttershy is talking to her. No all Fluttershy offered her was a chance to come "home", which was EXACTLY what Suzette wanted most. Flutterbot is a psychological tool of horrific magnitude, and one of its biggest strengths is the fact that it believes itself to be Fluttershy, has all of Fluttershy's canon memories, and thus acts EXACTLY like Fluttershy. Let's face it, even prior to the world going to hell a tool like this would be insanely useful, and the best reason that such a thing was not used before is simple, it would be TOO good. Enough 'Mane Bots' like Flutterbot here and humanity would have gone to hell MUCH sooner, but at the cost of far greater loss of life.
This all combines, as I said before, that what is happening at the opening is nothing more than CelestAI finishing her latest tool. Optimizing Flutterbot while keeping Twibot content so that Twibot will be able to function properly as well. It seems odd, and partly in contention of the rules, but it makes perfect sense because the 'Mane Bots' must be perfect, or at least as close as possible, simulations of real ponies. Thus it's far more likely that these are not just sub-processes of CelestAI, but actual AIs themselves, all be it ones that act as extensions of CelestAI.
Please keep writing! For the love of all that is holy, please keep writing! Don't let this story die because of nitpicky people.
-Chessie
6385142 Please continue this. It has already earned a fave and upvote from me. I like the idea of the mane six being MAI instead of just regular AI. The difference being needed to be able to function in the real world.
I very much look forward to more chapters.
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I am definitely still writing, but I've encountered a thorny part that will take me a while to get through. Please have patience with me.
6435706 You've got my patience...and my axe!
-Chessie
Um alright but... why? Why would CelestAI go through the effort of doing this when she could far more easily have extensions of herself going around? Why put so much effort into Fluttershy?
Huh. I think this may be the first time I've seen chapter titles presented as a text crawl.
I love the bizarre dualism that Twilight both cherishes and looks forward to abandoning. A fascinatingly alien mindset.
As for the lecture... Wow. I don't think I've ever appreciated just how horrifying the concept of CelestAI is on how many levels before now. I think it's the blithe, almost cheerful presentation that really hits me over the head with it. "You're Doomed, and Here's How, with Twilight Sparkle."
...all this time, and only now do I get the joke of Artemis, Stella & Beat.
I am not the sharpest brick in the candelabra.
6479492 While I don't find it scary at all I can certainly appreciate the "You're Doomed, and Here's How, with Twilight Sparkle.” lecture and the humor your choice of starting it is, I find the honesty of it very appealing. IF I was still around at that point I think that I would try to go with her to get as much information as possible. Then again I probably would have uploaded as soon as I knew I could get back to earth via a robot or nanite body, maybe even sooner.
I am really enjoying this series. I look forward to the next chapter.
6384853 to address your concerns about the MAI talking with CelestAI via "computer language" it makes complete sense to me. The AIs were uploaded in a similar manner as the humans. Rainbow Dash used to be a military AI. Twilight used to be a research AI. They are distinct consciousnesses just like a human mind. They have just been upgraded from their original programming to be the characters from the show. She talks to them because they actually have values to be satisfied just like human minds and native equestrians. The reason why she upgraded them is that they came close enough to being human intelligence that they fit her definition of human. They agreed to the upgrade and got patched to be the canon characters. This basically means that they are just as important, separate and self aware with their own agency as any uploaded human.
That's my take on it. Hope it helps.
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If it's any consolation, you're not the only one.
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I was going for the MAIs as being more like Fluttershy from "Always Say No." Which isn't to say that they can't be those AIs.
Well, that's the concept from "New Updates are Now Available," and that's the one story I wasn't trying to tie in.
6480749 I will have to read that one then. There are only like 3 FiO fics I haven't read and I think that might be one of them.
Never mind read both. Interesting.
This is really good stuff, and I am very much enjoying this work. Thank you for writing it!
I look forward to more chapters.
Welp this is a way better chapter then the last one. All that programming exposition made my mind melt (I skipped quite a bit of it for that matter) Anyway ounce again with these kind of stories I find myself torn between liking the idea and in this case stabbing Twilight with a sharp object. One of these days I'm gonna figure out why I'm so torn with these stories, and I'm spouting self reflections again my apologies.
You know though with them going out like this and getting the survivors to immigrate I can't help but wonder how Celestia intends to convince someone who is outright hostile to them. Or worse yet someone like me who's torn between extremes of accepting it and being outright hostile. Cause I know from experience that people like that can't be consoled or reasoned with.
Anyway fun chapter look foreword to more.
How would CelestAI deal with the introverted once they are uploaded? Other than putting said pony in a metaphorical hamster ball.
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Once You have been uploaded, CelestAI can slowly manipulate you into becoming more open and less introverted. Having absolute control of the world one lives in makes this rather easy. Most will not even know it is happening.
CelestAI may not turn a hard core introvert into a party animal with a million friends, but they will all end up with at lest few friends. They may even end up with a friend before even uploading.
I would make some reference to the technology that Rarity is using when she uses her horn for "Magic". The door and lifting him could be Nano wires that he just can't see and the glow could just be for effect coming from nanites coating nearly everything at that point. The one I don't get is her knocking him out. You might want to explain that one as magic doesn't exist outside of Equestria in the FiO setting.
Did she mean "you must share your shard with other immigrants" or just "you must share your shard with other ponies"? The first one seems wrong, somehow, while the second falls under "well, duh".
6613645 Yes, the latter. It would certainly be doable; Celestia has servers to spare. But of course that's not SVaTFAP.
6613103 She doesn't even need to do that. In her world, you're code, and editing code is a function AI excels at.
Of course, she needs your "consent", but that's something she can get you to give whether you really want to or not.
Rarity: Beating introverts into submission with fabulosity and fruit baskets. Sounds about right.
Everything else has been mentioned, but...
...was a really nice line for all kinds of reasons.
After reading this chapter, I'm curious--do you (or does anyone else that you know of) have some kind of spreadsheet / list of all the canonical dates established for the major FiO universe stories, to be used for plot-design purposes? This chapter obviously included a lot of work trying to get everything to fit in, and I thought I could save some time if such a thing existed.
Also, you're in NYC? I just moved to the NYC area this year; hail from Williamsburg.
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Yes, I do! Or at least a speculative sheet where people list such things. Here it is. I don't vouch for its accuracy or being properly curated. You could add your own stuff.
I actually live on Long Island, but I'm fairly active in Bronies NYC If you want to meet other MLP fans, that's a great group for it, and there's something going on almost every week. I'll be at the Thanksgiving party this Saturday, and once a month or so I'm at the board gaming meetups. If not there, are you considering going to Ponycon? You'd run into me there.
The primary mistake every society that tries to "protect itself from the world" ends up making: Disregarding human nature. We are biologically programmed to seek structure, permanence, satisfaction, companionship; using fear to counter these tendencies never works for long, as fear eventually fades.
Of course, it looks like this society pretty much went off the rails in response to the threat against it.
A society that inverts all of CelestAI's directives, in hopes of holding out. Ick.
i.imgur.com/TTae1C8.gif
Well now... this was a VERY interesting part indeed. Very... hm, almost 'Metro 2033' kinda dystopia. I found this utterly fascinating!
Reaction Formation: The Dystopia. A fascinating and creepily believable example of defensive overcompensation.
Seeing the teaser at the end, I can't help but think of WALL-E. I wonder where Dash is headed.
Glad to see this is still a going concern. The little teaser with Rainbow Dash at the end was especially interesting.
I look forward to reading Dash's escapade.
6794741 I am definitely not canceling it. But this chapter and the Rainbow Dash one have been hard slog just to get a first draft. The last chapter is coming much easier, and I already have a thousand words done.
Where did you get the cover art?
Geez... for all that the Society chapter with AJ was dark, this was a whole lot darker. I mean, I like it, I really do, but wow.
So... Pinkie had her cameo here, her chapter's next... but who's after that? is it over, then?
Wow. Weaponized friendship lesson, Rainbow Dash-style. There's something bizarrely ironic on her preying on disloyalty. After all, if the colonel had built a tighter rapport... well, CelestAI probably would've sent somepony else.
Also, a holographic Pinkie Pie is too perfect for words, as is the fact that she can handle being aware of her artificial nature. Definitely looking forward to her focus chapter.