- Member Since 20th May, 2021
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Captain Neckbeard
Creating prose through the power of majestic facial hair (Hey/Dude)
Captain Neckbeard
Joined 20th May, 2021 ·
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Probably as close to a Dishonored x MLP crossover without actually being one, lol.
Celestia technically exterminates and hates changelings for being predatory, but unlike gryphons, changelings don't completely kill their victims when all emotions are eaten.
11270402
Never thought about it that way, but you're totally right. Although I played the game, so maybe my subconscious had been at work?
11270467
But the 'lings shot first, so she is technically being in the right here. And she can't ask every single changeling individually to surrender, now can she? And I doubt she hates them, she's just kinda pissed.
Dear grid square and to whom may concern, prepare for Celestia.
this is the third story in a row where Celestia single-handedly exterminates the entire race of changelings.
The only difference here is that at the end Chrysalis survives.
11270607
maybe Celestia doesn't hate changelings, but in chapter 2 it really does feel like Celestia wants to exterminate them all. And yes, the first group did attack first, but the subsequent ones gave the impression of shaving pears that did not even resist. (The attempts to do something on their part were very pathetic.)
a clear example of the squirrel that Celestia imbued with emotions shows that Celestia sees no place for changelings in this world.
A funny detail is that the changelings did not kill any of the captured soldiers, but at the same time, Celestia killed hundreds of changelings.
Tracker: I'm scared, Rain Slicker.
Rain Slicker: Horseapples. You ain't afraid of no mare.
Tracker: There's something out there waiting for us, and it ain't no mare. We're all gonna die.
***
That scene came to mind when I read the synopsis and the story title. Ponified and language cleaned up a bit, of course.
Meh.
11270678
Well clearly her opinions changed once Thorax became king, but then then way changelings feed completely changed too, they started feeding on emotions passively allowing them to "farm" thier food instead of draining victims.
One issue some might bring up is "killing the solideres but sparing Chrysalis". That of course has to do with the diffrence between killing and murder.Killing is something you do when you need to, to protect yourself,to feed yourself etc Murder is killing because you want to, striking down defenseless does, killing something when it won't benefit you.
11270863
Thorax is primarily due to the fact that there were those who voluntarily wanted to share love with him.
But I can't imagine Thorax being in this universe. How many would-be Thoraxes died in this massacre?
After that, at least several generations must pass for the fear and hatred of Celestia to disappear.
11270673
Not true, she "only" killed a few hundreds of them, as you said in your next comment. Out of curiousity, which are the other two stories you implied?
Eh, she just wouldn't want them in Equestria, due to their predatory nature.
11270881
A lot
Good point, although nothing directly contradicts it, the S6 finale obviously wouldn't happen in this setting. If another person points it out, I'll probably slap the AU tag on the fic.
11270863
Pretty certain several gave up and went fleeing for their lives soooo yeaaaah pretty certain that would also be murder whereas Chrysalis straight up told her she's still fighting and would be back for revenge. She didn't give up she just knew she lost the fight. Ironically Celestia's decision to spare her is crueler and more likely to lead to deaths to both her ponies and the changelings as a whole.
Did Rainbow Dash write this? "And then she made all their heads explode and there was blood everywhere and it was so awesome."
This was mostly okay, in my opinion.
The idea of Celestia getting stuck in hostile territory and really letting loose and fighting her way out is intriguing on its own. I think the prose suffers from being a little plain, more of a list of things that happen than an engaging telling of the story. Also, it kinda bothers me in general when characters think nothing of mowing down dozens or hundreds of grunts and the like, but then let the boss go to show they're good and merciful.
As I said before, pretty okay. Please don't take this as discouragement. No writer is instantly great and no writer is perfect either. Every writer get's better as they write, so keep it up!
11271361
I admit, the prose is kinda dry, this didn't turn out to be my best work on the technical level, which is also due to the fact the story mostly lacks dialogue. I'll try harder next time, or just try to write the kind of story where my lack of skills aren't this apparent, heh.
>it kinda bothers me in general when characters think nothing of mowing down dozens or hundreds of grunts and the like, but then let the boss go to show they're good and merciful.
Yeah, good point, a mook's life sucks in general, but what could they do against the relentless trope gods? Seriously though, probably Celestia is a bit OOC in this being so nonchalant (even smug) about killing all them changelings, but I just wanted to write a pulpy power fantasy where Celestia is the demigod-like ancient being she is supposed to be, and not the joke she was written as in the later seasons of the show. Let's say this was a passion project for me, even if I couldn't give it proper justice (a better writer could have).
Thanks for reading, and thanks for the insightful comment as well, good criticism is always welcome!
11271592
Why didn't you do that then? Throughout this story I found myself thinking it would read better it were a power fantasy. As you've written this, she's constantly trying to remember spells, she's getting hurt, she's struggling with mere mortals...this isn't a power fantasy you've written. As you say, she was retconned as a joke in later seasons but instead of "not a joke" Celestia, you could have written about the unconquerable Goddess of the Sun Celestia. That was, after, the common understanding of her character back in season 1, before Lauren Faust was ousted from the show and the new staff decided to go in a different direction.
Common understanding with good reason. Remember that Celestia and Luna were first introduced in the show by depicting them as the contrasting elements of Yin-Yang, heavily implying that they're fundamental forces of nature. Notice that yin corresponds with the moon, and yang corresponds with the sun. This was not an arbitrary artistic choice. To someone who understands the symbolism, that was roughly as blatant as depicting them on a cross would have been for the western audience.
While we're at it, let's also remember that these characters' very names imply that they're deities. "Celestia" in particular is a play on words:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/celestial
"of, relating to, or suggesting heaven or divinity"
Both the Royal sisters were named after gods. "Sol"-estia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sol_(Roman_mythology)
"Sol is the personification of the Sun and a god in ancient Roman religion.
"Siblings: Luna"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luna_(goddess)
"In ancient Roman religion and myth, Luna is the divine embodiment of the Moon. She is often presented as the female complement of the Sun, Sol, conceived of as a god.
This is straight out of wikipedia. The Royal Sisters are a classic solar/lunar deity pair, named after solar/lunar deities. And in the case of Luna, Faust's original choice of name for her was Selene.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selene
"In Greek mythology, Selene is the goddess of the Moon.
So they were both given the names of solar/lunar deities, and when executive meddling said no, couldn't use Selene becase of some obscure legal/copyright issue, they changed her name from one moon goddess to a different moon goddess. Remember how was was the mare in the moon, not the mare on the moon, and remember how the entire moon took on her visage when she was confined to it. Which all makes a lot of sense, quotes from those wikipedia articles:
Luna: "Luna is the divine embodiment of the Moon"
Selene: "Personification of the Moon"
These aren't physical ponies. These are gods wearing physical avatars. Remember how astronomical bodies are associated with deities in mythology? "Mars" is the god of war? "Venus" is the god of love? That's exactly what's going on with Celestia and Luna, in their personally embodied roles as incarnations of the sun and moon.
Look at this and try to tell me it's not religious symbolism, her arms spread like Jesus on the cross, over the "sun" like the "son" of god.
Consider how Celestia is shown to be both omniscient and omnipresent plus not being dependant on a body at the end of season 1 episode 2 after Nightmare Moon's defeat, when Celestia casually responds to Applejack despite not being in the room with her, and then flying like the morning sun from beyond the horizen as a ball of light, and only then bothering to materialize a body to wear, while a choir of angels sing in the background. Consider how Luna routinely reduces her body to mist and then forms new creatures and objects with it. Here's Celestia flying around as a ball of light. These aren't ponies who depend on flesh and blood.
Everybody remembers Celestia's season 2 showing against Chrysalis, but these days so few people in the fandom remember just about everything that was shown about the both sisters in the first few seasons.
Remember how Celestia is in charge of Tartarus?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tartarus
" Tartarus is the place where, according to Plato's Gorgias (c. 400 BC), souls are judged after death and where the wicked received divine punishment.
Remember Flutterhy swearing an oath with the phrase, As Celestia is my witness? What about Rarity swearing that same oath? Have you ever wondered where that expression comes from?
https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/The-Witness-Of-God
It's all over the Bible. The idea is that God is omniscient and omnipresent, and no matter where you are and what you do, God is witness to it, because God is all-knowing and everywhere. Rarity and Fluttershy's statements are an affirmation of their belief in Celestia's divinity. An idea that is reinforced in several places throughout the show. Consider for example when Twilight ascends, after she disintegrates her body into a pile of soot...and then they meet in a heavenly starscape and Celestia shows Twilight her entire life. Gee, that sounds an awful lot like an end of life review in Heaven doesn't it? A review that happens while Celestia sings about having "watched you since that very first day." As you would expect an an omniscient, omnipresent divinity. And then she ressurects Twilight from the dead in a new body.
Oh...you thought Starswirl's spell did that? No, go watch that episode again. Twilight's body is shown being reduced to ashes, she talks to Celestia in Heaven, Celestia is the one who performs the ascension, and then Twilight is shown descending from a new star in the sky in a brand new body.
Back in season 1 it was commonly undestood by the fans that Celestia was a god. Her name implies that she's a god. She's depicted on religious iconography. She's shown in-universe to have the role of gods in human mythology. She's shown to be immortal and doesn't age in time travel episodes. She's shown to not be dependant on a physical body, the avatar she wears, like Luna's, is shown to a have a non-physical quality to it in the form of their hair. Characters in-universe make religious statements about her that are biblical references casting her in the role of God, and both symbolic and literal depictions generally back this up as more than idle belief. When Twilight disintegrated herself and met with Celestia in the floaty non-material starscape which depicted Celestia fading in to join the scene while angelic harps played in the background to signal her arrival...where was that event happening if not in pony Heaven?
It couldn't be more clear what the original intentions for these characaters were. Some people just don't recognize or understand the near-constant symbolism and references, and later show writers apparently didn't care for this interpretation and retconned it. One of the comic book writers in particular commented about The Sisters at point during a Comic Con panel that she "thought it was boring to write for omnipotent characters."
Anyway, if you want less speculation and something more concrete, you could always head over to Space Battles and read her documented powers list. She's demonstrated a lot more power than most people seem to realize.
If you want to write a wish-fulfillment power-fantasy about Celestia, nothing's stopping you from writing one.
11271806
I like her struggling a little here and there. Makes it more believable and fits Celestia's character. As far as we've seen on the show, she well, well, well out of practice when it comes to actually fighting. Of course, it seems here that it's like riding a bicycle and it all come back after a bit.
11271858
That's the thing though. You're talking about her later season personality. She was heavily retconned. Most of the characters in the show were. Celestia was never shown to be particularly bothered by anything in season 1. This is the character who pranked ponies waiting on her too closely to fill her tea, laughed at the parasprites, and describes the utter destruction of the Grand Galopping Gala as the "best" Gala ever. Then season 2 rolled around and with Faust gone, suddenly she was angry at Twilight, angry as Discord, and by the series end she was a flightly ball of emotion less stable than a fairly average 12 year old. How in the world did she go from being an immortal goddess who moves the stars in the sky and calmly tells Twilight to 'go make friends' on the eve of the return of thousand-year-old civilization-ending menace...to throwing a hissy fit over people not liking her pancakes?
Remember how in season 1 she'd been moving both the sun and the moon by herself for a thousand years? Then in later seasons the writers forgot about that and had her swap cutie marks with Luna to "learn" what it was like to do what Luna does?
Remember how in season 1, nopony had any idea who Luna was? And then, suddenly in a later season there was a national holiday about her? Remember how in that same episode, it was a joke that Twilight dressed up a Starswirl, because he was a completely obscure historical character that nobody had any idea who it was, and Luna was the only one who recognized it because she was 1000 years removed from time? And then in a later season he too gained his own national holiday that everyone knew about and celebrated?
What about Rarity? Remember how she was abducted into slavery and slapped into chains and forced to work in a mine...and yet completely kept her cool and remained calm and collected and dignified? Contrast that with later season depictions showing her with a fainting couch freaking out over every little thing.
Later seasons completely retconned both characters and continuity. When you talk about Celesia's "character" it makes a big difference which season you're talking about.
11271872
I don't recall her being angry at Twilight, but I also haven't watched every episode of the show and I tend to forget things so... shrug
11271806
The problem with writing actual godlike characters is that if you want to really keep them in-character, they should be able to mop the floor with everything, but other gods. So this story would've been over in about a thousand words, after Celestia burned down the forest to ashes using some "solar nuke" kinda spell. I was already told (someplace else) this is too much of a low-stakes story, cause the changelings prove very little challenge to Celestia. That's the point, but also capping her power level somewhere I think makes for a more fun character, at least from a narrative standpoint.
Equestria having two very literal Gods would break most stories, including the ones in the show. Of course I rather would have had that instead of the Celestia who's afraid of chickens, but a healthy middle ground is the best IMO. That's why I probably think of the Sisters as very powerful elves in terms of fantasy power levels and not really gods (or even demigods, as I erroneously stated in my previous comment). That makes for a more fun story IMO, you can still throw overwhelming odds at them, and they will prevail, but they might have to struggle some. No shame in that.
Also, I think you overplay the implications of her godlike nature in the first seasons. She is still an immortal pony who controls the Sun, and that's a big deal. But remember how Hearth's Warming Eve established that once unicorns controlled the Sun and Moon, and the Sisters apparently came into view at a later point in history. That story still had Lauren's approval, most season 2 scripts had. So I don't think even she intended C&L as gods, but who knows. I know there's a tweet from her that says she imagined them with parents, and also one that says she'd really like the idea of a spin-off series about their early/childhood years. So that implies an alicorn race, perhaps?
Lastly, and we're in pure personal headcanon territory now, I like the idea of alicorns being an obscure, lost race, and Celestia and Luna are the survivors. Why and how I'm still establishing, but that also sways me from making them gods. I also dislike the idea of alicorn ascension. I think at this point you could tell I'm kind of a disciple of Lauren's ideas, but she herself kept things so vague that I have to fill in the blanks somehow. But if I do, why not in a way that makes for a fun story? Even if it didn't turn out as much of a power fantasy as I thought.
11271979
I think he meant A Canterlot Wedding, where Celestia scorned Twilight for accusing Cadence of being evil. Eh... Not Celly's brightest moment, sure, but one could still handwave that away somehow if one likes the "pure, omnipotent Celestia" headcanon.
Woah, bad ass Celly.
Hm this Celestia will come to regret how casually she is exterminating changeling left and right that are doing nothing more than living under the heel of their crazy queen and can't do otherwise... and can turn on a new leaf relatively easy.
Additionally even if this are somewhat not "redeemable" they seems to be incapable of living without love and can get it from animals, that, as Doctor Den said, aren't even killed by that, So she should go on a crusade against ANY meat eater around. [And horses can and do eat meat.]
coursing
Bof... this Celestia is quite hypocrite...
Why does she not kill all wolves lion, manticores and so on?
They prey on others.
And changelings are just completely irrelevant fodder and faceless being that aren't worth any consideration and can be killed without any after thought. But Chrysalis, the one who IS controlling them has the right of redemption.
Hm.
11279151
Thanks for catching that. A few mistakes always slip through.
11279153
Well you see, Celestia initially wanted to execute Chrysalis, but throughout the story, she always spared downed foes, who didn't show anymore resistance. So that's why. Also, the trope gods were always unjust towards the Faceless Mook™, and I'm afraid the changelings count as that.
Celestia: "Hey proto-queen, what about that? You help me take down Chrysalis, and in turn I let you keep the hive!"
Proto-queen: "Sure, sounds good! Let's do it."
I thought this was Predator-MLP Crossover. oh well!
11538629
It seems I successfully tricked an unsuspecting fimficer into reading my story, hahaha!
Okay, not really, but I hope you enjoyed it anyway.
11538629
Well, when Celestia got to the Hive, it sort of became Aliens.
11800907
Believe it or not, I thought of that when I wrote the fic, or when I think about the power level of the alicorn sisters in general. Good comparison, well done!