Review - Rainbow Rocks (massive SPOILERS) · 11:24pm Sep 28th, 2014
I am extremely serious about the SPOILERS, and I'm not spoiler-screening them, so if you haven't yet seen and don't want to know ahead of time what happens in Rainbow Rocks do NOT read this until after you've seen the movie.
Introduction
So, I finally got to see Rainbow Rocks, and I was very pleasantly surprised. It's a seriously good movie, better than Equestria Girls and as good as any but the best Friendship Is Magic season openers or closers.
I. Timescale: The Effect on The Looking Glass World of Cheese and Pie
First of all, I was really happy to see that it doesn't mess with Scoots2's continuity as much as she thinks. What you may have missed, Scoots, is that there is no reason to think that the Sirens immediately went to Canterlot High School upon seeing the magical flash. While that was obviously the flash from the battle between the Humane Six and Sunset Shimmer, there is absolutely nothing to indicate passage of time between that prologue and the rest of the movie.
What I think is that the Sirens, not being idiots (well, Adagio Dazzle isn't an idiot, and she's in charge) did a little research on CHS and realized that Principal Celestia and Principal Luna were obviously Humanoid Avatars of the same entities who were Alicorns in their original world. They probably had to slowly build up their own power before they felt strong enough to take on the Sisters on their home turf. Note that they did, obviously, mesmerize Celestia and Luna into passive compliance with their plan before doing anything else; the first appearance of the Dazzlings in the cafeteria clearly took place after that was accomplished.
(Why didn't they drain Celestia and Luna's magic? Because it's a lot easier to simply lull them into failing to notice that you are the Sirens than it is to aggressively steal their power, and Adagio feared rousing them. The Sirens could not have taken on two angry Angels without having first drained the whole school, in other words that was for after the big concert).
The preparation for defeating Celestia and Luna could have taken the Sirens weeks or months. So, Scoots, there's no reason to assume that this takes place right after the Fall Formal. Indeed, there's one big reason to assume that it was weeks or months after the Fall Formal -- the Sonic Rainbooms couldn't have been formed overnight and reach that level of proficiency, nor could Fluttershy have written a whole set of songs, etc. And normally a outdoor concert would not be held in late fall or winter -- the climax obviously takes place in spring. So there's plenty of time for Equestria Girls: The Looking Glass World of Cheese and Pie to have taken place.
II. Sunset Shimmer
Second point: this is very much Sunset Shimmer's movie, because the emotional focus is on her in many scenes and she has the most significant character development arc. When it opens, we see Sunset Shimmer struggling to be accepted again, but pretty much everyone in school is either afraid of her, angry at her, or both -- the only exception are the Humane Five, and even they wind up frequently referring to what she did at the Fall Formal, because it's so relevant to their own personal history. Very much unlike the way she was before, she is afraid to assert herself -- understandably, as the last times she asserted herself, disastrous consequences ensued to herself.
In the course of this movie, Sunset Shimmer learns to trust herself and to assert herself in positive ways, being a good friend and a reasonable being without trying to control and dominate everyone around her. This is important, because her new diffidence was preventing her from living up to her potential every bit as much as had her previous aggressiveness. Sunset Shimmer is, after all, a natural leader -- Princess Celestia was grooming her as an assistant or successor. The realization that she could lead in a crisis by example and suggestion without ruthlessly dominating her friends was what she needed to break through and become a truly effective leader.
Sunset Shimmer may actually be close to Ascension. After all, something manifested a Spirit Alicorn at the climax. And the new factor was Sunset Shimmer joining into the magical working. It's possible that this was, in fact, Sunset's Alicorn Aspect. She is one of Celestia's Potatoes, and was one of the most promising ones until she became mad with ambition.
III. Trixie's Arc
I don't think that Trixie was portrayed as being as evil in this movie as some say. Trixie did not, in fact, do anything particularly wrong until she was subjected to the personal attention of all three Sirens. It was only then that she (and her two backups) dropped the Rainbooms through the trap door into a locked room.
The Sirens are, remember, evil immortal mind controllers, not hot teenage girls with an odd fashion sense. What I think they did was give Trixie the push she needed to go from her normal "I'm better than you" arrogance to "I'm going to crush you if you dare compete with me." That probably didn't take much magic on their parts, compared to what it must have taken to lull Celestia and Luna into ignoring the many suspicious aspects of their actions.
The unfortunate thing here is that their adjusting of Trixie's attitude seems to have "stuck" -- she did not realize, even after the Dazzlings were defeated, that they had been messing with her mind. This is explicable because Trixie really wants to believe that she's the best, the center of attention, deserves to win, and so on. She wasn't just temporarily controlled; she was emotionally-seduced into believing what she had been told by the Dazzlings. The damage, in short, may be permanent.
This is rather scary because such actually increases the likelihood of Trixie going full-on Nightmare at some point in the future, as in the opening chapter of Substitute Mentor. A Trixie with no mentor but having been used as a tool of the Dazzlings might well go insane, especially as time passed and many of her ambitions and ideals were frustrated.
There's a worse possibility. The Sirens were de-powered but not permanently neutralized. They might very well continue to influence Trixie, essentially acting as her Evil Mentors (well, okay, Adagio Dazzle might act as her Evil Mentor -- the other two are airheads). They might be able to sense Trixie's connection with the Angel of Illusion, and hope to use the Angel's power to restore their own abilities. The situation at the start of Substitute Mentor might well have come about because they were trying to release that power, but instead sparked a Nightmare.
Possibly, Sonata screwed up. She seems to do that a lot.
Parenthetically, why is the only role in which the show writers seem to be able to use Trixie is "Trixie gets controlled or seduced by genuinely evil magic and does bad things?" The comic book writers handle her far better. It's obvious from "Boast Busters" that Trixie imagines herself a heroine rather than villain. I prefer when the writers let her do something heroic, as in the recent jewel thief story.
Yeah, she's obnoxious and sometimes often messes things up due to her overconfidence and hair-trigger temper, but she's not inherently evil. She's a sympathetic antiheroine, not an out-and-out villain.
Also, who were her two backup singers? One looked like Cloud Kicker (purple skin, yellow hair) but I don't know who the other one, colored a bit like Pinkie but with straight hair, was supposed to be. Someone who doesn't have a clear Pony analogue?
Given my characterization of Trixie and of even the non-demonically-possessed Cloud Kicker, the potential for hilarity in the interaction of those two is obvious (just how would Trixie react if Cloud Kicker started trying to seduce her?), so I really hope that was Cloud Kicker. There are actually some aspects of Cloud that would make Trixie respect her, too -- Cloud is intelligent, well-educated and interested in occult history. Still -- an aggressive bisexual nymphomaniac, highly-skilled at annoying people, being around an arrogant, beautiful and straight demisexual with a hair-trigger temper -- it's "stand back and watch the explosion" territory here. And not the sort of "banging" Cloud would want, either.
IV. The Sirens aka Dazzlings
These were genuinely frightening villains, and they didn't get nerfed just because they happened to have taken the form of beautiful young women. The writers seems to have remembered that the original Sirens devoured the sailors unfortunate enough to fall into their clutches, and all three of them exuded a distinctly sinister and predatory aura. I got the impression that they would have happily tried to eat not only the magical power but also the flesh of others, but were holding back because they had to keep up their Masquerade.
In fact, they were using straight-out sex-appeal to their advantage. Observe their cafeteria dance closely. They were caressing and flashing several of their victims. This gets even creepier if one takes into account that these aren't relatively-innocent teenage "bad girls," but rather immortal evil emotivores, inherently worse than the Changelings because they are driven to induce not love but hatred. Aside from Chrysalis herself, the Changelings are more pathetic-scary than horrific-scary, which is why there's so much sympathy-for-the-Changelings fanfics (including some of mine); there was nothing pathetic about the Sirens.
I'm guessing we're going to be seeing a lot of fanfic soon about how the Sirens really aren't all that bad. I don't believe that theory for a moment. Yes, Sonata's an amusing ditz -- but she's an "amusing ditz" with an inherently predatory outlook on life, and the power to control your mind and make you turn on your friends until she finally isolates you -- at which point she may eat your soul. And she has neither reason nor inclination to hold back on doing just, either.
Adagio Dazzle's the leader: the smartest and most dominant one, and the only one of them to have a clear purpose beyond "create dissent, eat hatred, rinse and repeat." It's a horribly plausible plan, and considering the capacity of the Humanoids for hatred and violence, possibly a world-wrecking one.
Aria Blaze (the purple haired one) is the Lancer. She wants to be leader but she's clearly weaker than Adagio, and also less intelligent and strong-willed. (She gets the plan but didn't originate it, and gets sucked into pointless arguments more than once with Sonata).
Sonata Dusk is low monster on the totem pole. She's ditzy and on the surface almost cute, but you can see the malevolence in her smile in several scenes. She barely grasps what they're all supposed to be doing, but would never dream of challenging Adagio -- though she would like to displace Aria as second.
I am seriously wondering what they do after their defeat. If I were them I would clear the scene and start figuring out how to find an alternate means of emotivory, now that their song-gem focuses have been broken. They may be able to encourage hatred through more mundane means. They are most definitely not been reformed.
Reconciliation with the Sirens might be possible -- they could provide a therapeutic means of discharging hatred or rallying troops to an attack by encouraging hatred of the foe -- but it would be a lot harder than with the Changelings, based on what we've seen (*). We also do not know if there are any other Sirens surviving on the Pony Earth, or if the Dazzlings are exceptionally powerful or simply average members of their species (they might, for instance, be the equivalent of three Changeling Princesses, with the average Sirens being no stronger than Changeling Workers or Warriors).
What is that species? I'm guessing, one of the descendant races of the G1 Sea Ponies. They are equine, they are naturally water-dwelling, and they have magic songs. In three-part harmony, no less.
Shoo be doo, indeed. Or, perhaps, "Shouponi Benthis Dumoi," as Sev's Kelpies would say.
V. Flashlight, Sparity, and Issues of Identity
The writers have gotten the important point that the Humanoid analogues are not the same as their Pony equivalents, which is very encouraging because it means that we aren't going to see some very weird assumptions about identity (or the lack thereof) in the future of this series. This is made evident by Pony-in-Humanoid-Form Twilight's obviously romantic reaction to Humanoid Flash as opposed to her lack of reaction in Season Four to Pony Flash; it is also evident by Dragon-in-Dog-Form Spike's lack of reaction to Humanoid Rarity in this movie (as opposed to in Equestria Girls).
This is good, because it also shows that in-universe Twilight and Spike are completely aware of the fact that Pony Flash isn't the being with whom she shared some special moments at Canterlot High and that Humanoid Rarity has no particular romantic attraction to Spike. It's not surprising that they grasp this, as Twilight by the nature of her occupation has to consider metaphysical and moral issues on a fairly regular basis, and Spike is Twilight's closest friend.
I don't know if the writers meant it this way, but it confirms my theory that there was a fundamental change in the relationship between Spike and Rarity in Season Four. Before this, Spike would have accepted any Rarity (other than an evil one such as Nightmare Rarity) as romantically-fascinating. Now he seems more focused on his own Rarity. His love for her is growing more serious, and his loyalty to her has increased. This makes the most sense if Rarity is starting to take his courtship more seriously.
Note also that Humanoid Rarity is unaware of and would probably be somewhat repulsed if she knew of the romantic overtones to the relationship between Pony Rarity and Spike the Dragon. She only knows Spike as a talking dog, and in her mono-sapient-species world, she would look at that as "bestiality." She also hasn't had the bonding experiences with Spike that have led Pony Rarity to see him as more than a curiosity. Spike the Dragon has saved Pony Rarity from dark magic induced madness twice now, confronted a spectral warlock to save a whole city-state right in front of her eyes, and done her countless more mundane favors. When I write late Season Four Rarity as being rather awestruck by Spike's repeated acts of heroism and generosity, I think I'm close to what the show writers think of her attitude toward him.
I was disappointed by the way they used Flash Sentry, though. By having Twilight obviously be still attracted to him, long after meeting him the first time, they are setting up a love affair. But in the story he doesn't do anything to make us see him as anything more than just a decent sort of guy. He falls easily under the spell of the Sirens, and they turn him against her (admittedly, he doesn't actually try to sabotage the Rainbooms, but then he was a nice guy to begin with); I was hoping that if he is supposed to be Twilight's True Love, he would do some Fighting From the Inside and manage to snap out of it to do something heroic or useful at some point in the plot -- but he doesn't.
The whole Flashlight thing in canon seems to be simply a case of a really admirable and wonderful female becoming obsessed with an only-slightly-impressive male just to have a canon "boyfriend," which is very much against the earlier spirit of the show. I think this is why it bothers people. Do the writers not get that they have to show Flash being worthy of her if they're going to make the romance anything but sad, to the extent that it ever goes anywhere? Or are they actively trying to sabotage what may have been a subplot inflicted on them by the suits?
Compare with Sparity, where they have shared significant screen time including rescuing and otherwise helping out each other, it's obvious that they are kindred spirits, they're physically-affectionate to one another on screen -- and Spike actually is a fairly impressive hero, just one bereft of a Magical Girl Transformation, both within the series and in the supporting material (remember the two times he went adventuring with Celestia in the IDW comics?). If Spike were an adult Pony stallion, I don't think that anyone would doubt that they were either lovers or likely destined to become lovers.
In contrast, Flash is a male of the same age as Twilight's Humanoid Form, they keep teasing it, and yet it's not credible.
Writers, bumping into each other once is a Meet Cute. Having it happen four times in the first movie and then twice in the second movie (Subverted the second time, in one of the intentionally-sadder scenes in the movie) is just not knowing what to do with the character. Love and clumsiness are really not the same thing, and this would be true even if they were going for the spicy variant where she's coming out of the shower and her towel drops. Where is this going, a collision at relativistic velocities releasing all their mass-energy as a tremendous nuclear explosion?
VI. Other Characters
There were a lot of cute little things happening in the background, especially with the Cutie Mark Crusaders (who wore Humanoid versions of their costumes from "Show Stoppers" for their act!). Did you notice that until the Sirens split them, the CMC seem to have made friends with Snips and Snails?
Lyra and Bon-Bon (who seem to obviously be lesbian lovers, or close to it in this version, based on the way they chose to choreograph their song, singing cheek-to-cheek) got more than one cameo on screen. I see nothing wrong with this, nor is anything wrong with the idea that they're in love with one another. Wall-to-wall lesbians and bisexuals are silly, but there's no reason why all the characters have to be straight.
Octavia got to play her bass violin, to no avail but a valiant effort. She was not paired with Vinyl in this version, but then she never has been in canon. The only ones she's ever been associated with in canon are the other classical musicians in her band They did give her an English accent, which was kind of cool -- maybe she's an immigrant from across the pond.
Speaking of which, Vinyl Scratch was surprisingly important at the end. She's still The Voiceless, but obviously projects her personality through her facial expressions and body language. I wonder if she's going to wind up a close friend of the Humane Six? Speaking of which, I'm not sure why so many fanfics have her as a nearly self-destructive decadent -- I've never gotten that vibe from her in-show. And where the heck did she get a car that transforms in to a giant sound system?
Humanoid Twilight showed up, Spike the Dog in tow. From her placement in a stinger, I think she may wind up important to the sequel series. I wonder if Spike the Dog has been Uplifted a bit?
VII. Sequels
I know there's a sequel series, Equestria Academy, coming up sometime next year. I actually think this could be good, if the writers keep on the ball. I hope it doesn't displace Friendship Is Magic, though, because Pony Equestria has a lot more story possibilities.
Conclusion
This was a really good movie, better in many ways than Equestria Girls, and I am very happy that this concept hasn't been turned to crap. I recommend it to all fans.
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(*) Then again, if I assumed Chrysalis to be representative of her species, I'd be all for bombing their Hives with nerve gas, instead of introducing them to the Magic of Nice Tit-For-Tat (a strategy in the Prisoner's Dilemma in Game Theory).
Good review, though I will never understand shippers:
I honestly can't tell whether or not you're making a cheeky joke here. But, as data isn't self-interpreting, I suppose the lesbian interpretation is one valid one among many.
I'm really happy with how the movie was and how it was written. The battle between the Humane Six feat. Sunset Shimmer and Spike VS The Dazzlings was absolutely brilliant, in both sound and animation. You could hear the malevolence within the Sirens and the physical representation flowed quite nicely, while the lighthearted nature, but strong voices of the Humane Six and Co. contrasted quite wonderfully(I totally watched that scene on YouTube like a thousand times because of how epic it was). Then, when the Sirens' spiritual forms appeared and the Humane Six put up a good fight with their song and instruments, all Sirens began bombarding them with absolute malice and power with their alluring and terrifying voices. I was genuinely concerned about whether or not my girls were going to make it, to be honest, which just goes to show how well written and animated the scene was. Then, Sunset's hesitation to step up, but then the eventual realization of her duty was really empowering and I almost physically applauded(except I was in the living room with my headphones in).Sunset's shedding of her coat, which may be symbolic of her past in a sense, was subtle, but effective in showing that she was letting it all go at that point.
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Sorry, not sorry.
Then, when she up and started singing, that's when it started to really show through that Sunset was not going to let her friends get hurt if she had a word to say about it. Then, her transformation into one of the pony humanoids was done well and nicely, along with the finishing blow to the Sirens and their song.
Seriously, though, that climax was awesome, and I can't wait until Equestria Academy comes out.
(Little Fun Fact: When asked about Discord, Chrysalis, Zecora or Sombra being in Rainbow Rocks, the writers said that if Rainbow Rocks did well enough and that a third one was definite, that said characters were going to be in Equestria Academy. GET HYPED.)
The Sirens looks sort of similar to the Selkie in the comic that took over ponyville. The Selkie didn't feed on hatred and wasn't evil, though -- so the Sirens might be of the Selkie race but 'Siren' is a name specifically for them.
I really like how this continuity's shorthand for "those who stand on the cusp of apotheosis" is "Celestia's Potatoes."
Cloud Kicker was seen elsewhere in the early "setting up" scene. Trixie's backup singers don't seem to have pony counterparts. (Personally, I like to call them Bea List and Second String. They are working with Trixie; even their names should be subsidiary.)
Also, note that Trixie's band is called the Illusions. Subconscious recognition, perhaps?
I see a lot of Twilight's attraction to Flash being tied to the pubescent endocrine system she's suddenly plugged into while humanoid. The mind is often the plaything of the body, and the way Twilight reacts to Flash just doesn't mesh with the character as she normally is.
That said, I do find myself morbidly intrigued by romantic particle acceleration.
Note that Vinyl's importance at the end was foreshadowed by the animated short that focused on her. She exists a world of rhythm all her own. Sound-delivered magic never stood chance against the World Wub.
As for her car, I suspect there's more magic in that world than some may realize. That, or they pulled a stealth Transformers crossover. Either or.
I like this review of yours, especially the comments on the sirens and the reminder that the original sirens were cannibals (or should that be anthrovorous?). I have to admit, I think they looked oddly beautiful in their 'true' forms. But then I've always been a monster fan.
Myself I figure that they were the strongest of their kind, and that more sirens may still live in Equestria, either peacefully (by consuming emotions other than hatred) or living in isolated places -- I had an idea for introducing something like rusalki in the 'Ardiverse', and I'll probably just re-do them as freshwater sirens from the Northlands. The comic did have that kelpie everyone's calling 'Cassie' for some reason, and she was able to control minds with her song.
I do agree that there's no sign of them in the movie of having any sympathy or remorse for their dinners. I would suppose that as predators they really couldn't afford to feel any. And the comments about them possibly literally devouring their prey -- it makes me wonder just how long they've been on Earth, and if they may once have been in forms more like their 'real' ones. Maybe legends of kelpies and life-demanding rivers and murderous water spirits have much more validity in EG-Earth than ours thanks to those three.
EDIT: Something else. If the sirens have been on EG-Earth for something like centuries -- Starswirl the Bearded lived several thousand years ago in Equestria, or so I recall -- and if EG-Earth has had violence in its history, can you imagine how the sirens may have encouraged it? I won't say 'started', that sounds like too much work for them, but just, say, inciting a few key people at the right time on one side or the other to get even more violent? Just giving the whole conflict one little push at the exact right moment.
Oh, I know that it doesn't have to take place right after the Fall Formal--but neither does Looking Glass World. The timeline for that is late March--early to mid June. Rainy March day, on which we're introduced to Cheese; April 1st, the day that The Good Kind of Magic is set; auditions are the following weekend, and then there's a week or two during which Cheese is working on the party cannon, which Pinkie "gets" the week before her birthday on May 3rd. The accident that sends her to the hospital is the following Friday (May 9th, I think?) and the disastrous Canterlot Wondercolts v. Cloudsdale Cavaliers game is the next day. Cheese is suspended and Dash relieved of her post as Captain of the soccer team on the 12th; the game where the Dazzlers defeat the Comets is on the 17th, at which point Fluttershy convinces RD to help her spring Cheese, and then the triumphant Comets game is on the 24th. The next week is exam week (everyone is busy except for Pinkie and Cheese, so they get to spend lots of time together), and school graduation was on June 7th--the ceremony at which Fluttershy and RD noticed that Cheese should have been there and wasn't. This is where I screwed the pooch and didn't notice that I'd flipped down the wrong month on my calendar, so let's just finesse this one and say that Cheese's birthday falls somewhere between June 7th-June 14th.
And HEY: I'm proud of the fact that my Canterlot High is just a bit more realistic, in a way.
Yeah. I'm SUPER obsessive about dates! I have a Victorian Gothic novel in which I'm keeping track of the specific year in which it's set and how it lines up against the ecclesiastical calendar. And I don't think it's so much because I expect readers to notice as for my own internal measurement of where I'm at. But I'm just not too worried about it--for my purposes, LGW took place before Rainbow Rocks somehow, even though the Cake Festival would almost directly conflict with the outdoor concert
At first, I thought the giant unicorn with rainbow stuff was Starswirl, and then I realized it had wings, but it sure is ripped, isn't it? If you think of it as some sort of projection of Celestia--an idea I also like--then it's almost a moment of reconciliation for her and Sunset, which I implied at the end of LGW: I'm still here for you.
I think they went a bit overboard with Trixie's badness, but she does have a legitimate beef. She and the Illusionists really SHOULD have gone on to face off against the Dazzlings, and she has no way of knowing that the Dazzlings have rigged things. It really ISN'T fair, and this is happening to a character who believes that everything and everyone is unfair to her, and who takes everything personally. This is when I tweaked Trixie just slightly, so that she assumed that Pinkie was giving her the small stage at 11 am on purpose, just to make her sad. And there's just a grain of truth to it, but it isn't really just because of that. (BTW, did you notice who was on that stage right before Trixie?) Anyhow, they did at least give Trixie a believable motivation: she isn't just doing mean things to the Rainbooms out of an unwarranted sense of grievance. It's a warranted sense of grievance. That matters.
I positively love the idea of sirens as villains. I'm convinced that Meghan McCarthy was thinking "ok, we'll give you your singing sea ponies. Your evil, evil, singing sea ponies."
Sigh. Yeah. It was bound to happen, given fandom's penchant for Dracos in Leather Pants. Guys, if you are seduced by the Dazzlings, you are playing their game. Absolutely on the sex appeal angle, and I noticed they were careful to have them directly touch a couple of key players, like Flash and Trixie. They were getting stuff past the radar like crazy. It was impossible for me to watch them and not think about this:
And I'm sure it was on purpose.
Well, it IS just possible to read Puppy Spike's photobombing, etc., as part of the increasing confidence he's showing anyway. Dog he may be, but he's nopony's doormat anymore. Plus, the one holding him most throughout the movie was Sunset, and I think that's important. She was really threatening Spike directly last time. The visual interaction shows he's forgiven her and that he's very comfortable with her.
Sigh.
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Given that there's already a Zecora EG doll, I'd say that it's probably a done deal. They just won't announce it until more of the sales figures trickle in.
It was nice watching Sunset get her ears and tail, because in her case, she's sort of getting them BACK.
Truth to be told I liked Trixie´s portrayal in the movie becuase there is always the excuse of being mind controlled (again
) except the last scene where she is portrayed being petty for the sake of being petty (altought the cockblock was surely appreciated).
But then I realized something................Trixie won the battle of the bands competition and no one cared about it.
Think about it. The Dazzlings were using voice modifiers so they were probably disqualified (attempt to take over the world aside) and the Rainbooms only got to the finals because the dazzlings used magic to get them there for their personal reasons. From Trixie´s point of view either she was overshadowed by the Rainbooms and they won in spite of all the machinations behind the scenes or Trixie won and she was overshadowed anyway because they did something she couldnt possibly do.
Trixie was treated unfairly again.
No, I'm quite serious -- unless it was all part of the act, the level of physical affection they were displaying for one another while performing was quite beyond normal friendship in a society like 21st-century America's (though it would have been normal for the Equestrian Realm).
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I agree. The climactic battle was epic, and its rendering especially good given that the energies involved were mostly invisible. Not only were they attempting some sort of spiritual or psychic attack, but they were also physically-attacking with the acoustic elements of their close-up song. I think that against unshielded targets they could have physically killed them with their songs.
I was so damned happy when I heard that they were the "Illusions," because it reinforced my head-canon that Trixie embodies Illusion, and in much the same way that Twilight Sparkle does Magic.
I agree with you that Sunset Shimmer's redemption in the climax was fantastically well-done. I figured at an earlier time in the film that Sunset Shimmer was probably going to get a Crowning Moment of Awesome, and that it would involve realizing that she had to get up and shine -- I just didn't know that it would be right in the middle of a life-or-death battle.
This may be the best version of a Battle of the Bands I've seen in any movie.
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I'm thinking that, while the Flutterponies were Twisted into the Changelings, the Sea-Ponies developed into several different races, all mostly alike in being aquatic and having song-based magic.
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What's especially funny is that it originated as a criticism on Celestia's methods by Wisedreamer, first mentioned in An Extended Performance
I was so damned happy when I heard that they were the "Illusions," because it reinforced my head-canon that Trixie embodies Illusion, and in much the same way that Twilight Sparkle does Magic.
I agree. I also think that Humanoid women are hypersexual compared to Pony mares save at the height of estrus. Twilight is used to only having to deal with any serious sexual temptation for 1-3 days every 21, or one-seventh of the time. The always-on nature of Humanoid sexuality keeps blindsiding her.
In "An Epistolary Legal Consultation Between Princesses":
The whole movie is a shout-out to Jem, and that may have been a shout-out to Transformers.
I found them beautiful in all their forms -- poisonously beautiful. The sort of thing that C. L. Moore was talking about in "Shambleau."
I think that Cassie was even stronger than the Dazzlings -- remember, she could affect a very wide area. On the other hand, she was in a higher-magic world -- the flashback to Old Equestria makes it very obvious that the Dazzlings could once affect a very wide area as well. The illustration made it look as if they were affecting an area equivalent to a whole province.
There are legends about creatures living in bodies of water and luring humans in to their deaths, whether by seductive appearances, beautiful voices or both; all through Eurasia and probably across an even wider area. Interestingly, most often these creatures resemble either beautiful women -- or horses.
Yes -- I can see the Dazzlings have done a lot of evil in their time on the Humanoid Earth -- both directly, and by sowing hatred and dissension.
I also noticed that at the end they were neither destroyed nor reformed -- just depowered. They'll be back.
http://alexwarlorn.deviantart.com/journal/Saw-Rainbow-Rocks-liked-but-I-shudder-to-think-484966072
I think it's safe to say that it's in Sunset Shimmer we can all <i>Trust</i>. :-)
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Please do not mention that Mary Sue. I consider the Dazzlings the brainwashing singer thing DONE RIGHT.
For the fanon boys out there, I take that Vinyl wasn't partnered with Octavia in the competition because SHE WASN'T UNDER MIND CONTROL!
I'm very glad that you are going to continue your Equestria Girls work. I really like those stories.
Exactly. A lot of the sympathetic interest in them seems to be based purely on the fact that they're scary-sexy to cute-sexy (Sonata's cute, if you totally ignore what she is and what she does), and this is one way they trick their victims -- and possibly audience.
I made a similar point once about Fluttershy, who really is a very good being but is also very good at passively manipulating others into getting her way in the end (and I saw she got her way in the end in this movie too, though in this case it was a very very good thing that she got her way). I pointed out that her technique works well on the TV show's audience as well, in that fans tend not to criticize Fluttershy for things for which they would not hesitate to criticize other characters.
Well, the Dazzlings are far worse, because they are really and truly evil (far worse than Sir Draco of the Leather Pants, who after all didn't want to kill people he saw as his worst enemy when he had them at his mercy, twice), and the effect operates.
Aww, Sonata's so cute, right? But really she's just ditzy; as far as I can tell she's every bit as predatory as the other two -- just a bit dumber (unlike in the case of Pinkie Pie, Sonata appears to truly be thick, a point made obvious in the movie because Pinkie has more than one highly-intelligent insight). Actually, I'd rate Sonata the one likeliest to start tearing apart teenagers with her teeth, because she might forget the Masquerade she was supposed to be protecting.
I am reminded of my cat Samantha, the dumbest of all four of them -- and the most committed, eager killer of them as well. She's the only one of the four who has actually realized that mice are potentially food -- Sekhmet (the smartest) is a skilled hunter but to her it's all a game, I've never seen her try to eat her kills. With Sammy, we often find the mice half-devoured -- and those are the ones she hasn't actually consumed whole.
Which is, I assume, why Trixie had made the transition from merely complaining about and trying to upstage the Rainbooms to actively attacking them. And in regards to your earlier comments -- yes. Trixie had a legitimate complaint, and her established personality is such that she would take it personally.
She's bad-tempered, which was relevant both to the first and to the last chapters of An Extended Performance (in fact, that's what cheats her of the fruits of her victory, because she has to leave town after she smashes Bottom Billings' office). But it was all right. Trixie was okay!
Which makes sense. These aren't teenage girls, they're ancient and evil immortal predators. They're not faking being "bad." Not one bit.
It's just that what they mean by it isn't exactly what their audience assumes. It's much, much worse.
What movie is that clip from? It was very obvious that the three guys were being set up to be killed and probably eaten -- the siren-like women were getting the biggest guy drunk and had positioned themselves to tear out the jugular veins of the other two, near as I could see.
Yep. Spike was having a heck of a good time all throughout the movie, though he was getting (justifiably) anxious at one point during the climactic battle scene.
Spike is growing up. I think he'll always be helpful to those he cares about, such as Twilight and Rarity, but he's no longer as submissive.
I noticed that too -- and considered it heartwarming.
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You're quite right. Trixie was treated unfairly.
Of course, there was a lot more at stake than Trixie.
However, I would not expect the Great and Powerful Trixie to get that. Even though she's one of my favorite minor characters on the show, I'm well aware that she is very self-centered.
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Oh yes -- the Dazzlings are much better characters than She Who Shall Not Be Named, and Who Is Absurdly Overpowered.
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That's a good point -- Vinyl might have just thought that Octavia had become madly and inexplicably obsessed with winning a Battle of the Bands that she was very unlikely to do well in.
BEAUTIFUL IN DEPTH WORK HERE! EVERY LINE IS A WORK OF ART!!!
Yeah, poor Trixie.
I don't think the sirens would eat flesh if only because their DIET suggests they exclusively feed on negativity. Not that they're not evil enough to.
I think the fics will deal with how their power is broken, and are now stuck facing the humiliation of having to deal with being mere mortals.
I think the Sirens KNOW they need to each other, and that grates at them. Adagio KNOWS she needs her subordinates more often than now, and Sonata and Aria know they need Adagio. They're like the heads of cerberus.
Ironically a friend of mine thought when seeing the preview that Soanta and Aria were just shadows of Adagio she created to function as back up singers since she clearly isn't the type to work WITH anyone.
I see the three of them as being . . .unique . . .
They are called THE Sirens.
And yeah, Twilight to her credit ISN'T seeing her friends on the two sides of the mirror as INTERCHANGEABLE.
You are so much more damn smarter than me.
I think EVERYONE was disappointed with how Flash was handled (though I didn't notice it like others did).
What annoys me is that we SAW Silver Spoon and Diamond Tiara WERE painting a sign to be in the competition, but we never once got to see them play. This is the THIRD TIME we've seen them in a competition of creative expression (the talent show, the flag carrying, and now the battle of the bands) and we never see or even get a HINT of what their routine was. This is just plain annoying. I get Diamond is supposed to be the Arc-Enemy of the CMC, but geeze, can't they give her some character traits and time that AREN'T related to that? PLEASE?! ;-; It's gotten boring with her being an automatic negative wherever she goes!
I assume the cheek to cheek was teeth clenched team work. Let me have my delusions please. (for the record, in my fanfic verse, they're the legal guardians of Tootsie Flute).
And where the heck did she get a car that transforms in to a giant sound system?
Built it.
In the POny POV Verse, after she was recovering from Discord trapping her in a world of silence (the OPPOSITE of he torture he put Octavia through!). She set up a massive sound system around Ponyville planning to make everyone dance to the music forever, the song that would never end! Thankfully Octavia talked her out of it with some common sense and no-non-sense attitude.
I hope friendship is magic doesn't get displaced either.
And personally, I can see a LOT of trouble if human Twilight crossed in Equestria . . . remember how stubborn and in denial Twilight was about the Pinkie Sense because it didn't fall into any of the categories of magic SHE accepted as real.
And BOTH Trixie and RD have songs that boil down to stroking their own egos.
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That's from O Brother, Where Art Thou? You may recognize George Clooney--he's playing Ulysses. Yep: it's the Odyssey, set in depression-era Mississippi, and he's on the run and trying to get back home. Many of the characters they run into are straight from the Odyssey, and those really are the Sirens. They're getting Ulysses drunk, probably because he's the smartest of the three: ("I swear, you boys're dumber'n a bag of hammers"--something he actually says.) I can't remember exactly what they do, but I CAN remember what one of them thinks they've done.
It's a great movie.
Interesting!
I like the comparison of the Dazzlings to predators.
One could see Adagio as the Alpha Female, which, explains why she seems to dominate her weaker counterparts, since a predatory pack animal WOULD do that.
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I was glad that -- given they decided to go with Sunset Shimmer's reformation being real -- they then made it credible by not making it an easy path. The movie actually reversed my previous opinion on that plot direction -- Sunset Shimmer works even better as a heroine with a troubled past than she did as a villain.
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Whereas the Changelings are like swarms of eusocial insects, the Sirens appear to be more like a small alliance of great cats. You see just such dynamics sometimes with unmated lions or cheetahs -- though usually with brothers rather than sisters. Not that the Sirens are necessarily blood-siblings, but they act rather like quarrelsome sibling allies.
I can't believe I missed everything about Equestria Academy until now.
Flash Sentry got on my bad side when he turned up to the Fall Formal without a tie (it's a formal dance, you slob) but I'm disappointed to hear that the writers seemed determined to ship him without putting anything there besides looks. Sounds like the only black spot on the film.
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Half of Trixie's problems come from her sour and aggressively-boastful attitude. She's not actually evil (and, as you probably know, I think the Pony Trixie is intentionally good), but she annoys the heck out of anyone who has to deal with her for long, and when she actually has a legitimate grievance (and she often does) she presents it in such a way as to prejudice others against her case.
The reason why I decided that the Humanoid Trixie is in danger of turning evil (and I decided this long before I saw Rainbow Rocks is that I think the Humanoids are less kindly than the Ponies. Thus, someone like Humanoid Trixie would be dealt (emotionally) harder knocks as she entered adulthood, and become even more alienated and hostile.
My version of Trixie is an exemplar of the extreme romantic idealist who is impatient with the imperfections of life to the point of warping her good ideals into poor conduct, because she is disgusted by the fact that reality doesn't measure up to her dreams. Pony Trixie wanders through the Realm of Equestria thinking Ponies Are Bastards and that she is living in a Crapsack World, simply because Ponies Aren't Perfect.
There is of course a certain amount of surface hypocrisy and deeper self-hatred operating here. Trixie is herself rather FAR from perfect (though she is honorable and by many measures virtuous), and that is one of the reasons her extremely judgmental attitude (which she doesn't even deign to conceal half the time) gets on other Ponies' nerves. Compare with Twilight Sparkle, who has better claims to moral perfection than Trixie, but also gets "humility" and in consequence doesn't constantly boast of her wonderfulness and put down everypony else.
Trixie might be horrified at this stage in her life if she realized that Piercing Gaze found her attitude cute and endearing, which is why he wasn't at all offended by it. Most ponies can take her only in small doses: Piercing was one of the exceptions, who could be her lifelong friend, or more. But then he himself has un-Ponylike levels of chutzpah, in part because he's half-Onager (the Onagers tend to be more emotionally aggressive than the Ponies, especially in self-defense).
And he's enough of a keen judge of Pony nature (it's actually part of his primary Talent) that he can see through her facade to the scared little filly underneath. Who reminds him a bit of his own younger self, when he was a showcolt on the road. Which makes him feel protective toward her. He's one of the few Ponies in that mileu who would feel protective toward her, even while she was in full boastful rant.
I dunno -- they eat some physical food (I'm guessing it works like my Changelings, where they have a reduced gastro-intestinal system to make room for the organs they need for emotivoric consumption and conversion). If that's true then they would prefer a high-protein diet (tacos, if well-stuffed with meat and beans, would actually work fairly well for them)
Fridge Brilliance: Fluffle-Puff seduced a version of Chrysalis. Who also would prefer a high-protein physical element to her diet. Of what does Fluffle-Puff claim to be the Element?
Tacos.
Fluffle-Puff is the perfect companion for a Changeling Queen. Love ... and Tacos!
That makes sense. I wonder if they're going to wind up staying at the school, or lurking around the town?
(*nods*) They might have originated from some race of Seaponies, but I doubt their race is that powerful as a whole. They might be semi-divine, or just at the top edge of their race's overall capabilities, or been magically empowered (those gems were focii, and maybe the reason they sing so badly without the gems is that they're out of practice where their own inherent talents are concerned).
("Why should I bother to buy those points in Mind Control outside the Inobvious Accessible Focus when I get such a huge discount for buying them with the focus?" Well, now you know why you should have done it that way).
They may have some other powers they haven't lost. The movie implies that they have slightly superhuman strength at one point -- Adagio grabs Sunset Shimmer's wrist when Sunset tries to touch her gem, and hurts her -- and I don't think of Sunset Shimmer as physically-feeble or a crybaby). They also may have some very dangerous occult knowledge -- they're many centuries old, possibly as old as the Alicorn Avatars of the Sisters.
And Spike gets this too. Though of course, Humanoid Rarity would be more careful of her actions and words around Spike the Dragon in Dog Form now that she knows that he's a sapient being who would both understand their significance and possibly speak of them to others. And she doesn't have the deep and extensive trust in him that Pony Rarity does, because Spike hasn't been her close friend for years as he's been Pony Rarity's.
The thing is, he's not a bad guy. Not even an average guy. He's clearly a good guy, with superior morals and talents, and he could be a hero, and maybe even one worthy of Twilight Sparkle -- if the writers would develop his character. They seem to be torn by indecision about what to do with him and his love for Twilight, but they have to make up their minds because as it is they're just having him hover annoyingly around.
They make the anti-Flashlight sentiment more serious by doing this, because what they're showing looks a lot like Twilight just having a crush based on unfamiliar hormonal flows, and thus one that consummating would be a really Bad Idea. Also, he knows almost nothing about the real Twilight, which makes his sentiments toward her look essentially just like a crush as well.
They also should have done more with the fact that he used to date Sunset Shimmer (note that "date" is the absolutely appropriate word here, because there's no reason to assume that they loved each other or were lovers), and that something about her must have attracted him at first (what it was may be hinted in the first movie, where we see that Sunset Shimmer wasn't as nasty at the start of her time in the Humanoid world, and what we see here, which is that Sunset is pretty darn cool and likable when she's not being a bitch). Seeing it in context, I even more believe that Sunset really did return at least some of Flash's affections -- she looked sad when she claimed that she just pretended to like him in order to gain popularity (even if the statement was true, she may have been thinking "Damn! I was stupid to treat him like that, Flash is actually very lovable, he really cared for me, and now I've ruined it!")
I hope that the coming series addresses some of these issues.
There's also a possible complex friendship triangle here where both Pony Twilight and Sunset are attracted to Flash; Flash is more attracted to Twilight than to Sunset; Pony Twilight and Sunset have clearly bonded as kindred spirits and friends; and plus there is a Humanoid Twilight who will obviously show up in town who may wind up having various relationships of friendship, rivalry, hostility or love with the other three characters named. I hope the writers realize the story possibilities here -- I see a lot of them.
This is especially egregious with the Humanoid Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon, who have as far as I know never been shown to do anything evil, or even particularly bitchy. In the scene where they're sign-painting, they seem to be rather happy and innocent young girls. What, does the fact that Pony Diamond Tiara hates Apple Bloom and by extension her whole little two-filly clique hates the CMC make them irredeemably evil (even though the worst thing even Pony-DT ever did was forcibly squat in their clubhouse) to the point that every analogue of Diamond Tiara presumed to be a horrible and amoral bitch?
Look, Apple Bloom is one of my favorite among the younger charcters, and I love the CMC, but they're not saints, and everypony who dislikes them isn't a devil. We actually have no idea what motivates Pony Diamond Tiara in that feud -- after this long, it may be just stubborness, and the memory of the ways they've one-upped each other as rivals over the years. For all we know, Apple Bloom may have started it, or it may have started due to a miscommunication from either or both of them.
Well, they're at least friends. And I didn't say they were doing some sort of simulated sex act on stage. Just snuggling for the audience. (I don't know the formal name for that style of singing cheek to cheek, but I've seen married couple performers do it a lot -- Sonny and Cher in particular often did that sort of routine back in the day).
I could see that.
As I mentioned, the impressions I've always gotten of Vinyl Scratch from her appearances in the show were "cheerful, friendly, and obsessed with playing and listening to music," and I have no idea why fanfic writers so often see her as some sort of drugged-to-the-gills, self-destructive trollop. (Makes me wonder who they hang out with!)
So I'm glad that the first time they've shown her doing something significant in canon, it was something heroic. Seriously heroic -- Vinyl's weird, not stupid, and she must have suspected what was going on by this point and been aware she was risking her life. And she doesn't have any magic powers -- just a really cool sound system.
Indeed -- Humanoid Twilight seems like a totally-obsessed scientist. And I bet her older brother's an elite Special Forces or Secret Service type -- maybe even that world's version of a Man in Black!
I think in the series she'll wind up being an antagonist who slowly becomes an ally.
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He's actually been canon-shipped with two awesome females. Remember, he was dating Sunset Shimmer until a few weeks before Equestria Girls.
Flash Sentry also appears to be brave, honorable and intelligent, based on what they've let him do in canon. He's not just good-looking. But the writers are so into showing what a pretty pretty Boy Bander he is that they aren't giving him any real character development -- and then they wonder why he has such a hatedom.
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To the movie's credit, Dashie gets called out on that one too. The difference is that Trixie doesn't grasp at the end the importance of what just happened.
In defense of Humanoid Trixie ...
She's obviously fascinated by magic, and she lives in a low-magic universe (one which until recently she might have thought was a no-magic universe). Do you remember in Equestria Girls when the chase from the auditorium flew right past her? She must be aware that there are things going on around her involving True Magic, she has no way to figure out what it all means, and she may by now realize that she was twice casually taken over by Dark Forces. This must really be frustrating her -- she is discovering that she lives in a World of Adventure -- and appears to be merely a very secondary character in it.
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Reading the summary, it sounds well done. This line in particular ...
... got a good punny groan out of me.
And of course the hero's wife is named Penny.
Personally, I entertain the notion that Trixie's band name is very literal - her bandmates are actual illusions (or cardboard cutouts, or realdolls, or hallucinations induced by putting drugs in the water reservoir) because Trixie either couldn't find anyone to team up with her on that short a notice, or she didn't savor the idea of sharing the stage with others.
And I love how the comics treat her, because Trixie is a lot more nuanced as a morally flexible girl on the side of the angels than as a petty small-scale villain who is inexplicably treated as a pariah in the land of love and friendship. Yes, I absolutely love that the protagonists are willing to give her a chance to prove herself (which she takes in earnest), because only a complete jerk would hold a grudge for this long.
Plus, as you've made note of many times, she's very interesting as a deeply flawed heroine. She's the Batman to Twilight Sparkle's Superman.
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I like that reference. Given that they seem to be immortal or very long-lived, I can see them accompanying the humanoids out into space and one day meeting some down at the heels rocket tramp in the Low Canal cities of Mars.
I can also imagine the Dazzlings being amused by any idea that humans would find their true forms 'attractive'. They would happily use it, of course. Rather like how an angler fish uses its bait to lure dinner in, and with much the same intended end result.
That seems to be part of a larger tendency to equate horses with the ocean and water in general. Greek Poseidon was the lord of the oceans as the World-Engirdler, and also the Father of Horses; he may have been the latter first, if he actually was worshiped by the pre-Mycenaeans before they ever entered what became Hellas. And the old Russians used to sacrifice horses every winter to the local river gods in the hopes that they'd take that and leave the people alone.
And some kelpie legends do have them being able to appear as either horses or beautiful women.
Probably nothing too big, though. I remember Aria as complaining about wanting 'a real meal', which implies that they weren't able to feed as much as they liked. Of course, given that we have no idea what they would consider a 'real meal' to be, that thought can be troublesome too. For all we know they would consider anything short of all hell let out for noon, like say the Thirty Years' War or the Mongol conquests to be 'just a snack'.
Given that there will be an EG series, they'll probably show up there as villains of some sort. And I imagine they'll show up even sooner in fanfics!
I also like what you said about Sunset's efforts to become a better person/pony, and how the movie didn't shortchange it by making it easy. That is very well done on the writers' part. Of course it does help that the world Sunset entered isn't TOO different from Equestria. If she'd ended up in, say, the world Rowley Thorne came from and ended up meeting him or some of the other evil spellcasters from that universe -- yeah. I doubt she'd have been even as pleasant as we saw in the first movie. In fact I'm kind of surprised there isn't a whole raft of stories were she did end up in some other human-inhabited universe.
Yes, from my impression and most of the Derpibooru and 4chan Lyra and Bon Bon were hinted to be lesbians on purpose. But its still more like a unofficial nod to LGBT community from storyboard artists than Meghan or Hasbro, so i woudn't ask them for confirmation because it won't happen any time soon.
Other than that what striked me was Twilight reaction to Flash Sentry under siren spell.
"I thought we were friends"
This is the same sentence used in Twilights Kingdom and it imply that Meghan only consider pairings who are already a good friends(and i didnt know that Twilight consider Flash as a friend) and she may develop them into something more. So "friendzone"(calling someone a friend as a sign that the female/male is not interested in romance) is not really a case and friends in FiM may develop into something more. People from 4chan always use the friendzone argument to dismiss Cheerimac, Sparity and Fluttercord shipping to ever happen, but now when Twilight is obviously visually attracted with someone she consider as friend then that argument fall apart.
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Aside from the personal preferences of the writers (and based on what they've put on the show I think they are definitely into love-from-friendship rather than love-as-predation), the Ponies of Equestria deeply value friendship, to the point of often viewing it in romantic terms. So I don't think that "friendzoning" is a big part of their culture -- some Ponies may do it, but it's probably less common in Equestria than it is in the modern West.