(For the record): Applejack can be gay and have foals · 6:17pm Feb 24th, 2014
Among the shipping crowd, a semi-common reason people claim for Applejack being straight in their personal headcanons is that Applejack would want children.
I totally agree that Applejack would want children. There’s no question in my mind that would be a priority for her. So far, we’re all on the same page.
However, being lesbian does not mean that you can’t want and have kids. I’m going to explain this here, for once and for all, so anyone who wants to can link it to refute that argument.
I was just reading an article talking about the 2010 US census in the Bay Area of California (a part of the country with a sizable GBLT population) that stated that over half of the lesbian couples that answered the census in that area had children. In the area outside of the city of San Francisco, 60% of households headed by lesbians included children. I’m assuming that none of these are the result of magic, so even if magical babies aren’t part of your headcanon for Equestria, 60% of lesbians in Ponyville could realistically have children. There’s no reason Applejack couldn’t be among them.
(The fact that this is talking about the census in the Bay Area shouldn’t matter as far as the size of the population of GBLT identifying people is concerned, if anything that should make it closer to an overall average. The fact that the area is famously friendly to GBLT couples may make the percentage higher, but since the question of tolerance in Equestria varies widely between readers and writers, this is only to show that there are places in the real world where the majority of lesbian couples have children. The census also showed that only 30% of lesbian couples in the city of San Francisco had children, but this makes sense because people with children traditionally move outside of the city.)
The majority of women want children. Even lesbians. There’s nothing wrong with not wanting children, that’s totally fine, but having motherhood as a goal isn’t a strange thing, or limited to farmers or ponies. Whether it’s social pressure or evolution, many women care about having children. And, barring medical issues, it’s not that hard for us to have children of our own. Hell, it happens a lot on accident. And even among lesbians, there’s the option of sperm donation, either modern or old-fashioned, honest or sneaky.
There’s also adoption, and while I agree with people who believe that Applejack would want children of her own, that it would be important to carry on the Apple family line, I also could easily see her being happy adopting a foal from within her family (which is very large and connected, so there’s a good likelihood that some cousin might be having an unwanted foal and be happy to have Applejack and a partner adopt them.) She would be raising a new generation of Apples, and helping a pony in need at the same time.
One could argue that the Apple family is conservative, and Applejack would place some priority on having a male and female parent for her foals. But this would seem kind of strange, considering that she and her siblings were raised in a household headed by a single (presumably widowed) mare. I would think it would be more likely for her to say that her granny raised her (or Apple Bloom, depending on how old AJ was when her parents died) just fine without a stallion. In addition, if Mac was to stay on or around Sweet Apple Acres, she’d be likely to see him as a fine male role model.
I have no problem if people see AJ as straight. I’ve read at least one good fic with a straight-Applejack, and I support anyone who wants to read about her or write her that way. But can we please stop using this as an excuse? It kinda bugs me as an someone who ships AJ with other mares and shares parts of the same headcanon.
Bookplayer: 1
Whiners: 0
Your move.
Oh, absolutely. I'm pretty sure that if Applejack was in love with a mare, she'd want to marry her and by some means obtain children. She'd be honest about any sperm donations, because she's honest about everything of importance to her. She'd probably prefer medical insemination, because she wouldn't want to have sex with someone she didn't love.
There's remarkably little hint of Applejack's sexuality in canon, less even than we see with the rest of the Mane Six. She's the only one who's never been shown being sexually-attracted to anypony, stallion or mare. So it's pretty much open.
I don't understand the idea of having a headcanon about a character's orientation. I've always thought that someone's sexual orientation was decided entirely by chance. Why would you need an excuse to write her as straight or as a lesbian?
1870047
Depends on who you ask. If you said that in Norway, they'd laugh you off the streets, as they consider homosexuality a choice. That's what their LBG crowd believes, and what they want to gain rights for, the right to choose homosexuality. Truth is, it's probably more related to environmental factors, genetics, and population density, so I'd say it's a little bit of everything why someone turns out gay.
@Book
But that's not necessarily true. It depends on how long her father and mother were around. Canon doesn't really dictate when they died, after all. Or you could argue that, depending on how old you headcanon Mac, he was her father figure growing up.
1870047
That's another matter entirely. Discussions about that tend to be a little weird... having a headcanon about a character's sexuality is, in theory, fine-- it's just a matter of how that character pings your gaydar. Often that leads to people mentioning certian things that cause their gaydars to go off or not, and that often leads to things ranging from kind of understandable ("Twilight would be bi-curious at first, because of her experimental nature, even if she eventually settled on one or the other") to "writer" reasons ("I like to write Rainbow Dash as straight because writing her as lesbian is so common.") to... stuff like this.
People making Applejack a "Conservative Traditionalist", a thing that's kind of funny even without adding magic ponies into the equation, are more often than not just trying to use pony fanfiction to push some kind of political agenda. For either side of the argument.
Great points there bookplayer. Might use them to poke argumentative people.
1870060
Why would a gaydar even be a thing? Sexuality isn't as important as the character itself.
Okay, sexuality is important for setting up a ship, and can possibly introduce a few issues along the way due to pressure from others and what not... but it's the character that deals with those issues.
There can sometimes be too much focus on sexuality. We need more character building!
I love it, but sadly it won't matter. I have extensive conversations at times with the people of the Straight Shipping group, and the people who make these sort of claims really don't care about counter arguments. I have gradually learned to accept that the best solution is just tell them their head-canon is their own, and leave it at that.
1870055
True, but in any case at least Apple Bloom, if not AJ and Mac, were not raised in "mom and dad and kids" situation, so if AJ did have feelings for a mare, I doubt worries about traditional family units would stop her.
Even if AJ was conservative, that does not prevent her from being very supportive of LGBT individuals, or even being lesbian. Two reasons for this.
1) I myself am quite conservative in many ways. I am also a strong supporter of LGBT rights. Also, I myself am bi.
2) Who is to say that being conservative in Equestria is the same as being conservative in 'MURICA? Maybe single families are readily accepted there, as well as sexual orientation. Maybe she would be conservative in her values of honesty and hard work, and loyalty to her family.
I personally have no issues what-so-ever with a lesbian AJ having a foal, or many, however she becomes a mother.
1870076
Yeah, most of these conversations are among shippers, talking about why they like certain ships and dislike others. How you feel about a character being gay obviously has some affect on that.
The majority of shippers put the story first, though. If a character needs to be gay for a story to work, they're gay. If they need to be straight, they're straight. But there are some out there who have firm ideas either way, which is totally fine, but when they try to argue reasons for it that don't make sense, I get frustrated.
1870044
Wait, when was Pinkie attracted to somepony? I usually headcanon her as ace.
1870131
Possibly, to Cheese Sandwich. Though that may have been entirely non-sexual. So I could also justly say that neither Applejack nor Pinkie Pie have shown any canon sexual attraction toward anypony. Or anyone, considering the presence of Discord and Spike as potential love interests.
That last point, the idea of APplejack and her family being conservative, raises a point that I think a lot of people miss.
What is a conservative? Most people think "reactionary right-wing christian" (and usually attach "white" to it as well), but that's not what the word means. A conservative is someone who conserves - they don't change things unless they have to. If they do change something, it's usually because they believe that change will preserve the greater whole.
So what would a conservative look like in a society where homosexuality was the norm? They'd likely be normative by the standards of that society, and they'd want to preserve that status quo situation, because to their eyes it is how things are meant to be.
So if you assume a society where everyone is a magical lesbian, a conservative would also be a magical lesbian.
Just a point I like to make sometimes.
1870147
Did you not read the post, or did you decide to ignore the data?
1870164
Don't worry about Jake, he's my pet troll.
Another great blog post of bookplayer with a gigantic truth
I'm with you 
1870164 1870165 1870173 I'm pretty sure Bookplayer means that literally, too. I've seen a leash.
I hope you give him lots of belly rubs, BP!
Shipping gets people all funny round these parts I have noticed. One author I know, he does a blog post on religion, and folks are calm and reasonable. He does a post on Sparity, and (to use the meme) everyone loses their minds!
) That's not to say EVERYONE who ships straight couples is like that of course. It doesn't even mean most. As in many cases like this it's usually just the noisiest. But usually, if you have to argue in favor of something, the people you are arguing with aren't going to be convinced, and everyone else doesn't need to be convinced in the first place, if that makes sense.
Straight shipping seems to attract a certain reactionary group of people, who hate lesbian shipping and refuse to hear anything for it. Another author I know once expressed a desire for the entire mane six to get boyfriends in canon, just to stop all the lesbian shipping. (As if it would.
1870164
He did, after all, just write a story for bookplayer where Twi and AJ are married and AJ is Twi's baby mamma.
1870044
I must have a really bad eye for these kinds of things. When have any of them aside from Rarity expressed any interest?
Keep in mind, Applejack is also very independently minded and leans towards self-sufficiency. Remember how she wanted to go to the Grand Galloping Gala so she could make money to buy her granny a new hip? Remember how her friend Rarity can find precious gemstones, with her mind? Recall how Applejack initially flat out refused assistance in Applebuck season?
Were Applejack to be lesbian, and want children, she might be torn on the matter because of her desire for herself to be self-sufficient at the familial level. She might view the assistance that would be required in such a situation (artificial insemination, IVF, sperm donor, etc.) as cheapening herself.
But yes, sexuality and maternal instinct run on separate circuits, so one can be lesbian but still want children.
1870391
Twilight has a crush on Flash Sentry in Equestria Girls.
1870429
She also went around to Rarity, Pinkie, and Rainbow Dash to collect things she'd need for the Family Reunion. I don't think she'd see needing some material implanted as a problem with conceiving a kid. I mean, if she's straight she would still need her husband to do it, do you think she'd feel bad about that?
I do think she'd be very self sufficient when it came to a pregnancy and raising a kid, and probably give a wife headaches every step of the way, but only those headaches that come from being in a relationship with Applejack.
1870447 Exactly, only one pony has shown attraction to a mare or stallion. She liked Human Flash, Pony Flash would be a replacement goldfish
1870458
There was a bit at the end with his pony counterpart, and he never had much characterization beyond "potential love interest" and possibly "not a total jerk", so it's more like replacing a goldfish with another goldfish.
Also, surely you mean only one of the mane 6; there were a lot of couples (all heterosexual, grr) in Hearts and Hooves Day.
1870481 Yes, I caught that but decided not to edit myself. Its still would be wierd as all hell for them. I personally hate FlashLight mostly for..umm...reasons, but even then most stories seem to avoid the fact she fell for the human version first. It would be a major hurdle...plus he wasn't really a character more like a two legged plot device..
1870488
I edited my post before I saw yours but after you saw mine.
I feel that there's not so much a reason to hate Flashlight as a conspicuously thorough lack of reasons to like it.
Heh heh, plot device. (Because he's eye candy.)
1870497 Oh lord almighty...I swear it wasn't a pun! I swear...damn. I would like to see background couples or more variety on the show though. Its just me wanted Equistria to be better though. I've started to avoid stories that make sexuality an issue do to those feelings.
In Flash's defence he seemed a very nice beefstick...
1870504
Agreed, he was quite adequate for his role.
Twilight should temporarily turn Rainbow Dash into Rainbow Blitz so that he can donate sperm for his marefriend before becoming Rainbow Dash again and ending up a female daddy.
I say "donate" assuming that Applejack wouldn't want to do things the old fashion way even if it is her marefriend temporarily turned into a stallion.
1870506 I enjoyed Equestria Girls but it was still just odd.
fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/357/a/1/2_hoofs_up_by_comeha-d6z0lto.png
And personally, I've always headcanon'd that Equestria is a matriarchal society, as opposed to a patriarchal one. So there's also that.
Really, even the need for this discussion is amusing to me--"neck deep" in ponishipping, for me, was like six months ago. The very idea that people have problems with the Mane Six being gay--or think about orientation at all--no longer even occurs to me. It's like, six Cuils off. Hecka abstract, yo.
1870620
Everyone in Equestria is gay. In a century, it's population will be in the tens. Not the tens of thousands. Just . . . tens lol.
1870451 I think Applejack might ascribe a bit more to the means by which she will conceive a foal as "material", seeing as how the 'material' will have lasting impacts on her foal.
1870858
I don't think the two ideas are mutually exclusive. If Applejack was starting a new farm, she'd want the best land with the best soil, the finest apple seeds, and the strongest wood for a barn and house she could get... but she wouldn't consider it "help" to buy or get these parts from other ponies, and when she was done she would think of it as a farm she built.
The part of a foal she can't do herself is important for the quality, but that doesn't mean she would think she needed "help" to have a foal. If she's lesbian, she needs some good, quality material she doesn't currently have. If she was straight she needs that stallion of hers to do his job.
1870391
Twilight Sparkle (in humanoid form) crushed on Humanoid!Flash Sentry.
Rarity was attracted to Prince Blueblood, Trenderhoof and possibly Spike.
Pinkie Pie may have been attracted to Cheese Sandwich.
Fluttershy may be attracted to Bulk Bicep and/or Discord.
Rainbow Dash seems distinctly attracted to Soarin (straight) and possibly Applejack and/or Fluttershy (gay).
Rarity is the only one of them who seems to be actively pursuing any of these attractions, but it's the thought that counts.
1870155
It's highly improbable that homosexuality is the "norm" in Equestria. However it seems likely that homosexuality is traditionally more socially-acceptable than it has in our world.
One would assume that the majority of the Equestrian population is straight simply because that's how one gets foals. This has been true for every human culture, and it's difficult to see why being Ponies would make a difference here. If we assume that there is a sex skew toward females in the male:female ratio, though, female bisexuality might be more common than pure female heterosexuality, but lesbianism would still be less common than bisexuality, again for this obvious reason.
1870155
It's highly improbable that homosexuality is the "norm" in Equestria. However it seems likely that homosexuality is traditionally more socially-acceptable than it has in our world.
One would assume that the majority of the Equestrian population is straight simply because that's how one gets foals. This has been true for every human culture, and it's difficult to see why being Ponies would make a difference here. If we assume that there is a sex skew toward females in the male:female ratio, though, female bisexuality might be more common than pure female heterosexuality, but lesbianism would still be less common than bisexuality, again for this obvious reason.
A much better question is who Applejack would want to have foals with. I'd actually consider Applejack wanting foals to be a perfectly valid reason to discredit ApplejackxMane 6 pairings. Not because she physically couldn't raise foals with any them, but because I'm not sure she'd want to.
But yeah, using it as an excuse to discredit Applejack shipping in general is pretty weak.
Skipping all the comments on this journal, I just want to say the "Applejack would never adopt" argument is kind of ridiculous.
It's entirely possible it wouldn't occur to her at first, and thus cause her some distress, but I've read numerous fics where she's just vehemently opposed to the idea, and I think that's painting her as a little too traditionalist. Like, past the point of what I'm willing to believe ponies are capable of believing.
Plus, she can always do the artificial insemination thing and adopt, to have the best of both worlds.
1871601
She does deeply respect Twilight. I never saw any hint of sexual attraction there, but I think of all the Mane Six she'd trust Twilight most as a co-parent.
Okay, so I understood and agreed with just about all of your post, but one part has me lost.
Like, I have no idea what's going on. What?
... oh wait, I already have!
1871285
There's a lot of "may be" attracted to's in there.
Honestly, most of them fall short of Applejack's little "Good things are better when they're, you know, a Rarity" in the season 3 opener. Now that there was flirting.
Also, Rainbow could be argued to be distantly attracted to Spitfire as much as Soarin'.
1871762
Basically, unless a woman has medical issues, it's fairly simple for her to become pregnant. It often happens by accident, from having unprotected sex or not using birth control. And once we're pregnant, there's no reason we can't do the whole kid thing on our own.
I agree with everything in the post but, dammit the mention of sperm donation and Applejack's love of family makes me want to read a Twijack fic where Twilight has the awkwardly try and ask her brother to be a donor for Applejack
1871912
You know, I was really, seriously thinking about that earlier today. It would be hilarious.
1871792
Well, I'll never consider that by "accident."
But I think I get what you're trying to say here.