Chapter 16 - In Which She Talks To Herself
Twilight reared up in surprise, letting out an agitated whinny. Quickly she weaved together a barrier of crackling energy and began shaping defensive magics in her mind. The other pony was brimming with untapped power, and Twilight could feel the pony's magic spilling over into the room around them.
A few years back she had received an amazing novel from Rainbow Dash as a birthday gift. In it, strange creatures were replacing ponies with look-a-likes. Now, she had come across what looked like a duplicate of herself. It had just been a story, but at the moment it was all Twilight could think of. She was not going to take any chances.
A second, more powerful, barrier snapped into existence before the clock had passed even a full second. The next spell Twilight began to lay out in her mind was a weaker, but wide-range barrier. She had looked the spell up in the month’s after Princess Celestia’s death. If a battle broke out between her and the impostor, the spell would hopefully protect the rest of Canterlot.
However, even as the spell began to take shape, Twilight knew it would not be enough. The other pony easily had enough power to shatter a wide-range shield spell. She could taste the magic crackling in the air. It seemed to be pressing in on her. Even Princess Celestia had never felt as powerful as the pony in front of her. She might be able to protect herself, but she doubted her ability to defend Canterlot.
Twilight briefly wondered how such an entity could exist in Equestria without her knowing. Twilight was reasonably confident that magically skilled unicorns across the country were sensing the presence in her tower. She hoped things did not come to a fight. Equestria’s ruler was uncertain if she would be able to win. However, even if victory was hers, she could not imagine the collateral damage. It would be as bad as the Great Tragedy all over again.
The alicorn shuddered as the clock finished ticking off the second.
Discord was wrong. She could not simply write her own rules for how the world worked. Even if there was any merit to his argument, it only worked if she was the most powerful creature alive. If anypony could dictate morality as Discord said, it would be the pony in front of her. Nopony should have that much power.
The smell of the magic was intoxicating. It’s sickeningly sweet aroma made her stomach nauseous and her head and horn begin to throb. If she was a normal pony, being in such close proximity to the torrents of unseen magic spilling out of the other mare would likely have left her unconscious.
It occurred to Twilight, that it might not matter who the other pony really was or what the impostor wanted. She might be forced to destroy the pony regardless of the other mare’s intentions. She could feel the other pony’s mere presence warping reality. Such power was a blasphemy against the world. Twilight just hoped she would have the strength to defeat the pony if things came to it. She would certainly need to extinguish the sun if she was going to have enough power to win. The ball of fire would be too large of a drain on her otherwise.
Could she win a fight against the pony?
Her hearts beat in a thunderous unison and the room faded away from her. She watched a possible path for the future. All of Equestria burned. Twilight had dropped the sun onto Canterlot in a desperate effort to defeat her foe. The burning orb, thousands of kilometers across, had come crashing down, incinerating the atmosphere. As it approached the capital, the ground tore itself into pieces as primal forces ravaged the planet. The air itself burned.
When the fires had subsided because there was nothing left to burn, her sun was left as a cold corpse of compressed ash lying in the crater that had once been Canterlot. Without the need to power her sun, Twilight was armed with an impressive magic reserve of her own. There was no more air, and when Twilight breathed in, the dust that entered her lungs was the remains of all the ponies she had sworn to protect. As the ashes of her kingdom settled, the ruler of the now dead kingdom gazed through the darkness towards a glowing form. Despite an attack that had transformed the surface of the planet into molten slag, the impostor was still alive.
Would their battle tear the remains of the planet asunder?
Twilight was grateful that she would never know the answer. The vision went no further. However, the last thing that Twilight saw was the look on the imposter’s face. It was a look of unmitigated horror as the other pony spoke a single sentence, “This wasn’t how it happened.”
Twilight drew a shuddering breath as the magic broke. It was a future but not the future. Twilight would not drop the sun on to Equestria and that end would not come to pass. Her nerves steadied a bit as she realized that, whatever happened next, she would not obliterate Equestria from existence. At least not for a little while at any rate.
However, the vision did bring with it a moment of horror. Twilight was now certain that Celestia’s death had been unnecessary. Perhaps it had not been Twilight’s presence weakening her mentor’s will that had sealed the alicorn’s fate, but Princess Celestia could have survived nonetheless. The dead alicorn could have wielded her own sun as a devastating weapon. She could have allowed her sun to wink out of existence and turned all of that amazing power on the monster that killed her. Instead she died for Equestria. She died for Twilight.
Twilight would not destroy Equestria, but she would defend herself against the impostor before her. She gathered her spare magic into a brilliant point, ready to strike. She was not looking forward to how exhausted she would be at the end of the day.
The other pony yelled out, “Wait! I’m not here to hurt you.”
The new alicorn was waiving her hooves in the air, in what Twilight supposed was supposed to be a placating gesture. But it was the voice that stopped her. The voice, her voice, startled Twilight. The offensive spell disintegrated as one thought filled her mind.
“I don’t really sound like that, do I?”
“What?”
“Is that supposed to be my voice? I don’t really sound like that. I can’t sound like that.”
The strange look alike seemed to relax a bit. Some of the tension seemed to relieve in the room as she replied to Twilight.
“I... Yes, that is what we sound like. Get over it, there are more important things we need to talk about.”
Remembering herself, Twilight stomped towards the other mare while angrily speaking, “Just who are you? Impersonating the princess is illegal.... or at least I think it is. Still, who are you and why are you in my tower?”
Twilight was babbling and she knew it. Her vision had set her off balance, and it was surreal watching her face look back at her with a slight smile. ’Illegal to impersonate the princess.’ Twilight snorted to herself. Like that would matter to a pony as powerful as her.
“I’m you.”
Twilight stared at the other pony with no hint of amusement on her face. A moment later she began to reform the pinpoint of offensive energy.
“Really, I’m you!”
The point of light hovered in air twinkling as its energy growth was halted. It hung like a mote of dust, an ominous reminder of where the conversation might lead. Twilight wanted to believe the other pony, if only because it meant she would not need to deal with an insanely powerful impostor, but the very idea was absurd.
“Prove it.”
“OK, remember that time Spike accidentally sent your - my - our journal to the Princess?”
“Spike accidentally sent lots of things to the Princess, tons of ponies know about that. The tabloids were talking about it for weeks when he accidentally ‘mailed’ her that tree.”
“I suppose so. It could have been a lucky guess. Except I also know what was in that journal, how you - I - we wrote about -”
Twilight rapidly cut the pony off with a frantic wave of her hoof and an embarrassed cough. “OK, no need for us to talk about that. Even if you are me - I’m still not entirely convinced - we don’t need to discuss that debacle.”
“Oh, by the way. You are going to want to start a checklist. We have a lot to cover, and I don’t want anything to end up being missed afterwards. The first thing on the list is that you - er I - we need to contact Canterlot University’s Equestrian Language department.”
Twilight began to slowly pace around the other pony while she asked the obvious question, “Why would we need to do that?”
“Because these personal pronouns are annoying. We need somepony to come up with new ones. If you don’t think so yet, you will by the time we’re done here. We probably should also ask them to come up with conjugations for some new tenses. Trust me, it gets confusing.”
Twilight frowned, but levitated over a parchment and quill. The other pony liked checklists; maybe they really were one and the same.
“So how are you me? Have you come from some alternate reality, or are you some type of clone?”
“You know how.”
“No... No, I don’t.”
The other pony blinked at Twilight for a moment before screwing her face up in thought. Once again Twilight found herself wondering about the other pony’s voice. She also wondered if her face went through the same expressions as her duplicate while she herself was in thought.
“I guess you don’t... Well, I’m from the future.”
The last remnants of Twilight’s defensive magic shattered into mist. Twilight jumped back in shock as she began to ramble, “What! How is that possible? I’ve been working myself crazy just to get that stupid clock to turn backwards... But... Of course! You’re from the future. You can actually jump through time? I had hypothesized, but really it was just a blind hope. How long did it take you to figure traveling out? It must have been a long time. That explains why you are so powerful. Equestria ends up being fine, doesn’t it? So how long did it take you?”
As Twilight unleashed her stream of questions and theories, she pranced around her future self in excitement. It was not everyday that a pony got to see herself as she would look in the future. Twilight hated to be egotistical, but she had to admit she had grown very beautiful. She had not seen her own reflection in nearly a year, and so it made seeing her future-self even stranger. The traveler's feathers looked well groomed just like her coat. The other mare was slim with an excellent figure. She was definitely pretty.
Twilight blushed when she realized where her thoughts were going. ’I’m definitely not going there.’ she mumbled under her breath. Even though it would solve the problem of finding a suitor her age, it would just be weird. Still, she could not help but admire herself. Would Celestia have been proud? She hoped so.
She realized, as she was staring at her future self, that she was beginning to feel the same wistfulness and sadness she would feel while staring at her own reflection. It was strange that the Celestia construct which looked so much like her mentor did not inspire that sadness, but her reflection, which only bore the most superficial of resemblances, could bring her so much sorrow.
The older alicorn looked out the window and then glanced at the clock. Twilight could recognize her own awkwardness in the pony, and Twilight could not help but sigh. She would have hoped after however many decades it must have taken to unlock the secret to jumping through time, she would have become more confident.
“About an hour.”
“What?”
“It took me about an hour to figure out how to travel into the past.”
The silence between the two ponies was almost palatable as they both stared at one another. Twilight must have misunderstood her future self.
“You mean... Once I make - you made a breakthrough it only took another -”
“I mean I’m from about an hour into the future. Well less now.”
“How? What?” Twilight was spluttering, “I thought I would be lucky to just get that clock to turn backwards. There is no way I - er you - could have made such a discovery in just an hour... You're right about the pronoun thing.”
Twilight circled the item on her checklist to add emphasis while the time traveler rubbed the back of her head.
“Well, I’ll admit that I had some help. The same help you’re going to receive.”
“Oh no.” Twilight backed up before continuing, “You’re not saying...”
“I’m going to teach you how to travel through time, or into the past at the very least. I haven't tried to go forward yet. Not sure if that is possible. I’m going to teach you, then you’re going to go back and be me. Then you will teach... you?”
The future Twilight gave a frustrated growl and grabbed the checklist, underlining the circled item to add emphasis. Twilight just watched in confusion as she tried to process what had been said.
“So wait... We’re looping then? Is that even possible?”
“Apparently so.”
“Now hold on a moment. If this is all happening, why are we wasting our time... Though I suppose with you here we have all the time we could want - But that’s besides the point. Why don’t you just open a portal and -”
“Who said anything about portals?”
Twilight was beginning to get slightly upset. She really hoped she was not always so annoying. Did she always go around interrupting and correcting ponies?
“Ok fine, no portals then. Well however time travel works, you can take us back to help Celestia. We can stop the fight. We can save her... together.”
“You don’t understand - you won’t understand. Not until you actually make the time jump. But we, I, have no idea how any of this all works. I’m here because I know that this happened, er happens - is happening! Ugh, this is annoying. But going back to save Celestia... That didn’t happen. I know that for a fact, otherwise she would be here. So if we ever attempt that... If we want to even make an attempt to deviate from how things are... We need to be absolutely certain we know what we are doing.”
“What are you talking about.”
“What I’m trying to say is... We can’t just do whatever we want. Not yet, anyway. If we're not careful... I’m worried we might break something.”
Both ponies were now sitting down staring at one another only a few hooves apart. Twilight thought over the visitor’s words but eventually decided she needed to ask the question, “Break what?”
“Time! Or the universe... Or I don’t know.”
And Twilight was forced to look at herself with incredulity. “Is time something you can even break? How would that even happen? How would that work; I mean, what does breaking time even mean?”
“Look, I know that this is all new to you. Trust me, it will make more sense the second time around. I can’t describe what it felt like to touch, and then to pass through time. You’ll need to discover that yourself. We can cast these spells, but do you really understand what they're doing? I certainly don’t. But all I can tell you is that I’m filled with a sense of dread that we will... break time, or something. Like I said I don’t really know. If you want to go back to Celestia, you can after you’ve tested the spell by going back an hour... But I know you won’t.”
“How can you possibly know what I’m going to do?”
“Because this has already happened for me. This entire conversation is going exactly like how it did the first time. When I made the jump I was determined to do something different... To prove that things could change and that things can be changed. But now... It's exactly the same. In a moment I’m going to hop up and down. There is no good reason for it.
“I really don’t want to hop. I really just want to sit here. I wonder if I could just sit here. Could I choose to deviate? But I won’t. The reason is because I’m afraid. I’m afraid of what it means as much as what it could do. So here it goes.”
And future Twilight hopped up and down with her face twisted into a heavy frown before she continued her explanation.
“If there was any moment of choice, that was it. Now it has passed and gone. Maybe I could have chosen differently, but I didn’t... Now I’m certain the rest of this is going to play out as it did before. Maybe when it comes back around to you, you will decide not to hop. But I don’t think you will.”
“Wow... I’m sorry if I was angry earlier... Twilight... I - OK that’s it. We need to come up with another name for me to call you in my mind.”
“What’s wrong with me being called Twilight.”
“We both can’t be Twilight. You can be Other Twilight.”
“Why do I need to be Other Twilight? That makes it sound like I’m some sort of fake or something.”
“Fine, you can be Future Twilight.”
“Well, but I’m no longer in the future. I’m here now. So we might want to save that to refer to ourselves in the future.”
Twilight wanted to scream.
“All right then... What would you like to be called?”
“How about Older Twilight?”
“But you’re not older!”
“I’m an hour older!”
“An hour is nothing.”
“An hour is still an hour.”
“Fine you can be Older Twilight.”
Twilight huffed as she threw her head in the other direction. The Older Twilight smiled and nudged Twilight.
“That makes you Younger Twilight, or maybe Little Twilight. Oh, Little Twi!”
“You’re having way too much fun with this.”
“I’m sorry, it’s just that having all this magic to tap into is a little bit intoxicating.”
‘Lil Twi’ whirled on the other alicorn. The comment reminded her of some of her earlier thoughts.
“How is it that you - I’m going to get so much stronger in just a short amount of time?”
“Listen. While we are both here we have a unique opportunity to utilize our collective brain power to try and reason out how time travel works. I’ve heard the conversation before, but am hoping that it will make more sense from this perspective.”
“Fine... Whatever, ignore my question. So we’re going to figure out how this all works then?”
“Yep.” Older Twilight’s smile was infuriating to the younger Twilight. “It seems like we are in a time loop.”
“But how does that happen. Wouldn’t it have needed to start somewhere, or rather somewhen,”
“And it probably did. The Twilight that taught me about time travel did not start a loop, but maybe a Twilight from the far future was responsible for starting things. Of course once the loop was started, that Twilight would have been erased.”
“You’re saying?”
“That when you travel back in time, everything that happened since the moment you arrive in, never was. It’s like you’ve reset the universe to an earlier moment. When you travel back, I will cease to exist. At least that's one way it might work.”
“If that is the case, we can change things. Causality is preserved even if it’s only in the reference frame of the time traveler. You had the option to hop, you just didn’t. Everything is the same as when you first went through the time loop, just because its settled into a sort of equilibrium. Things are the same, not because they need to be, but just because they are.”
Their exchange back and forth was speeding up as their conversation began to enter rapid fire mode. The two ponies began to circle one another and an outside observer could easily lose track of who was who.
“But that doesn’t exactly work. When I traveled through time, I could have either gone to a moment before my Older Twilight arrived, or the moment after. Even if I arrived the moment of, it doesn’t change things. Either the number of Twilights needs to increase with each iteration of the loop, or the start of the loop needs to slowly move back earlier and earlier in time.”
“So it’s not really stable. Eventually, one way or another, we will break out of the loop. But because the drift might only be by fractions of a second each jump, it could require thousands of iterations to change significantly. Even once it has changed, the difference from loop to loop would be so insignificant such that the Twilights in the loop wouldn’t notice.”
“But eventually the loop will break. Of course, that is assuming we’re on the right track with how time travel works.”
“Oh, you mean that there is a chance that we are both the same Twilight. The same pony simply existing in two points at the same time. When I eventually time travel, I’ll come to the exact moment you arrived and become you. The number of Twilights will remain at two and the start of the loop won’t drift. Things will remain stagnate.”
One of the Twilights began to wander towards the balcony.
“Of course, that means there is no future.”
“What do you mean... You came from the future.”
“If we are dealing with some sort of perfect time loop, we’re never going to get beyond that. You’re going to revert time and become me, and the process will repeat adinfinitum. Time will never be able to get beyond the point in which you travel back in time.”
“Whereas if this is only a temporarily stable time loop we will eventually have a future once the loop is broken, but not before then.”
The other Twilight went and joined the one at the balcony. They were both looking out at the skyline as they continued to exchange words.
“I should ask before I forget. I could not quite see it, but I’m assuming the anomaly of light is an effect of time travel.”
“I think so. The question, though, is if all the older anomalies were started by a future Twilight that no longer exists or a future Twilight that does not yet exist.”
“Wouldn’t the Twilight that caused them have ceased to exist the moment one of us traveled back to continue the loop? Assuming that is, that we started the time loop and not some other time traveler.”
“That’s a disturbing thought. However, there are some other possibilities. For all we know the first couple times through the loop spread Twilights throughout the time line. If another Twilight has existed before the start of my arrival in this tower, she would be unaffected by the loop. For all we know there is a third Twilight out there somewhere. She could be a remnant of a timeline that has long since ceased to exist. There could be dozens of Twilights hidden all over Equestria.”
“Or we are completely off about how this all works.”
“I was waiting for you to say that.”
“Of course you were, miss future. Perhaps we’re not simply rewinding the time line. Maybe we are creating an alternate parallel time line. Each iteration through the loop simply creating a different reality.”
“Of course, if that is the case, it is impossible for us to change anything. We could affect change for ourselves personally, but traveling back in time would be abandoning our own Equestria. If that is the case, when you travel back in time you will be leaving your Equestria to me. However, it means whichever Twilight started all of this left behind a kingdom without a ruler. It also means that only a Twilight who abandons her Equestria could end in a time line where Celestia is saved.”
“I’m not sure if that theory works. Creating an entirely new universe... That would require a tremendous amount of energy. It also has interesting philosophical ramifications that I'm not entirely happy with.”
“Unless those other universes already exist. Time travel could simply be jumping into a universe that is running a little bit behind time-wise.”
“There would need to be an infinite number of universes for that to work, and if that is the case, probability would dictate that all possibilities exist. In that case, its impossible to really change anything. I’m not sure I like that theory. You might know better. It probably depends on how the spell is compared to the other temporal magic we have been experimenting with.”
“I don’t think there are multiple realities... But that’s just my opinion. However, I’m also not a fan of the earlier time travel theories we discussed either. If going back in time is reverting the universe... Does that mean it kills, or unmakes, everypony who has been born since the moment we travel back to?”
Both Twilights went silent as they looked out at Celestia’s statue.
“Would you mind... Would you mind if we talked about her. I would like to talk with someone who understands.”
“I understand... I wanted to talk about her too. But we don’t have enough time. I’m going to need to start teaching you how to weave the spell soon. The thing is... Even if time travel would wipe out everypony born during my rule... I would do it. I would go back in time if it meant I could save her. It doesn’t even matter whether or not we would be saving Equestria. All that would matter is that we would save her.”
“We can’t just throw Equestria away.”
“We could... If it was possible. You know that it's true.”
“I don’t like talking to you... You know what I’m thinking. You have the advantage in this conversation.”
“We can talk about Discord if you would like... I think he was telling us the truth, hallucination or not.”
“What? You can’t be serious. You may be Older Twilight, but you also seem to be Stupid Twilight.”
“There is another possibility.” The time traveler turned back towards the clock in the center of the room, ignoring the other pony's words. “That clock and its twin... They are both ticking at the same time. They are both separate entities, but in a way they are the same. Time... Time might be like that. This could be the first, the last, and the only iteration of this time loop. All time might be happening simultaneously. This loop could be a paradox, but a paradox that causes itself. It might exist because it has always, and will always, exist.”
“Would it be possible to change anything then?”
“I don’t know. I wouldn’t think so, but maybe it is possible. If its not possible to change the past, beyond how it has already been changed, then time is probably an illusion. Reality is just a static unchanging thing. If that is the case, does choice have any meaning? On the other hoof, all of time, all of existence could constantly be in flux. We can make choices, but once again, do they have meaning? If everything can change, any choice you might make could be undone and you would never even know it.”
“Older Twilight... I think I want you to teach me the spell now.”
The ponies both moved back towards the center of the room in silent agreement.
“Alright. But it’s not so much a spell as it is a manipulation of reality itself.”
The two ponies sat down staring at one another as the lesson began. If Older Twilight had been teaching another pony, it might have taken weeks to teach the magics. However, the two Twilights thought exactly the same way. Their minds worked identically, and Older Twilight knew just the right words to say in order for Younger Twilight to learn as rapidly as possible.
Younger Twilight thought she understood the magics and looked at the clock. She saw that nearly a full hour had passed since the traveler entered her life. She didn’t care what the other Twilight had said. She would do things differently. She wouldn’t hop up and down just because she was worried it was her destiny to hop up and down.
She would forge her own past and future.
“I don’t have enough spare energy to pull off this magic, not even to go back a single minute. However this magic really works, it requires a tremendous amount of energy.”
“I can fix that. Pass me control of the sun, and it will solve your problem. It will also answer your earlier question.”
Twilight did not understand what the pony meant regarding her question, but touched her horn to Older Twilight’s horn. She had obviously never transferred her spell before, but she had once thought out the process when bored. Magic began flowing between them and Twilight gazed into her own eyes. She felt the breath tickling against her own. Twilight felt herself gasp. She was beautiful. She did not miss how much her face now looked like Celestia's.
Twilight felt her hearts beating faster. The magic was jumping between them with tiny bolts of electricity. She took a small breath and then another. Twilight continued to stare into unblinking eyes. Her mouth was open just the tiniest fraction as she licked her lips. She leaned forward with bated breath.
And the sun was passed.
Twilight gasped as the burden of the sun was removed from her. Over the decades she had lost track of just how much power it consumed. Suddenly her magic had no outlet and she desperately tried to bring it under control before it destroyed her. Twilight felt like screaming as her power surged throughout her body with nowhere to flow. She did scream.
Now she understood why Older Twilight was so powerful. She had not had the heavy drain of the sun. Twilight quickly began channeling her excess magic into the air around her and could feel the room begin to ionize. The power was incredible. For the first time since Celestia's death, Twilight truly believed that Equestria's salvation was within her power.
But then something she had not been expecting happened. The part of her mind that was always occupied with the sun was free. The orrery was silent and the furnace room was locked tight. With nothing to distract her, without the constant ticking in the back of her mind, Twilight’s attention turned entirely to the Everfree.
The beast roared. Twilight shrieked.
She was lost in a blasted world. It had been destroyed by some horrible cataclysm, and she was surrounded by darkness. The shadows around her pulsed with intelligence. It flowed like a malevolent force attacking her. It threatened to overwhelm. It felt familiar.
“No.”
She spoke the words and it was so. She was her own master.
“I have no need of you. You will return to your prison.”
Slowly the darkness receded. It coalesced into her own shadow. The light source casting the shadow was her memories of her most precious pony. They would guard her against the darkness. She could see the wasteland of her mind now that the darkness had vanished. It was a ruined Equestria that had been transformed to a desert. She knew that the Equestria was her hopes for the future. Did she really have no hope? Twilight stepped out of her mind, and she was back in the tower. Twilight was once against the master of her own mind.
The older Twilight was holding her singing the lullaby. Twilight extracted herself from the other Twilight’s hooves and wiped the tears from her face.
Without another word she cast the magics and with a tremendous roar she disappeared.
The magic was intense. She had understood the spell - if it could be called that - but had not understood what it would be like to harness the power she needed.
She was - Older Twilight was - right. Time travel meant ignoring the rules and making her own. 'A' happened and then 'B' would happen. Things occurred in a proper order. Perhaps time travel preserved causality. Maybe causality was only preserved in the frame of the traveler. Twilight did not care. She needed to ignore one of the most fundamental laws of all existence. She touched time and tore at it. It would obey her. She was the last of the immortals and she would dictate the rules.
For the briefest of moments she existed outside of time. Twilight was not even certain if she actually even existed during that moment, or if it was even a moment. It could have been an eternity. It was like everything was an infinite maelstrom but also an infinitesimal point of calm all at once. When she rematerialized in a bright flash of light, it was a struggle to remember the experience of the jump. She was not even certain if there was anything to remember. The only thing she was certain of was that time was far more complicated than she had first thought.
Ultimately it did not matter. She had traveled back in time. She could change things. Twilight was determined to prove that saving Celestia was a possibility. As the the telekinetic burst of force that had marked her arrival died down, Twilight took a step backwards.
She winced as she felt her rear bump against something and then flinched as she heard her vase hit the ground.
As another Twilight entered the room all Twilight could think of to say was one word.
“Oops.”
This chapter was confusing and awesome.
Holy Crap that was one of the deepest conversation on time travel I have ever read. It was thoroughly enjoyable. You must have really done some some research or something for all that information. I will admit I had to read it twice to get my head around it but I really really enjoyed it great job.
tys for chap
Cue Author repeating this Chapter forever? You wouldn't do that would you? You aren't that cruel
Cue Author repeating this Chapter forever? You wouldn't do that would you? You aren't that cruel
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Not sure if ironic pun...
Or accidental double post...
"It will include diagrams."
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in my headcannon
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Godamnit Fimfiction sent me SEVEN emails about this update! It was more excited than I was!
I'm going to try to explain why this time travel is possible to work outside a loop, but my attempt at making a graphic was in vain.
Ok, so Original Twilight learned how to time travel and went back to communicate with herself as Older Twilight. That part, you have down. The next part is the fact that now Original/Older Twilight is going to go back in time to become Older Twilight, while the Twilight that was Older Twilight becomes that world's Younger Twilight, therefore, to an outside observer, there was never a moment that lacked a Twilight and there would continue to be a Twilight in the world. If you need me to try and reword this, I can gladly do it.
My brain hurts...
Oh, wow, my head. Ok, that was awesome, and yet confusing at the same time. Yay for pronoun trouble.
out of curiosity, you wouldn't happen to be familiar with qntm.org?
Good chapter. Nice thoughts on time travel, I do believe though the the loop would never be broken because, even a slight deviation, and we can invoke chaos theory.
Being able to time loop is all you need to save Equestria. Just have however many Twilights you need to cooperate and fix the sun. Yeah, that means living each day N times over, but you're immortal. Deal.
234964
Ha! Only one Twilight needs to hold the spell; all the others can focus on boosting the sun back to normal levels, and then hey presto! We're done!
Except for the fact that if she went back five times to have six Twilights present, (five for the boost and one to hold the original sun spell), by the time she's made five loops in time she's contributed five lots of energy to the sun boost. How much energy does she actually have, while not maintaining the sun? Not that much, I'd think. So there has to be practical limits to how many times she could use that gimmick to try and help herself.
after reading this chapter i can't help but think: What would doctor whooves say in that situation? he'd probably find a solution... and time travel is a pain to figure out :/
Time travel fics are so fun to read.
... and admires her own good looks. (addition to title)
Will she be be wishing she had 'fun' with her doppelganger?
I have only one thing to say:
Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey...Stuff!
That is all.
ps. Good chapter.
234481
I like the clever use of a double post (assuming its intentional). There was a particular anime that did this and while it was clever, it was also super annoying.
234460
Twilight says that it makes more sense the second time around.
234488
I'm interested to see how long it takes for someone to poke some holes in the stuff I wrote about. Luckily since it was all in character I can just claim that I intentionally made Twilight get something wrong.
234524>>234757
Yea that's probably my fault. It seems that I never have any problems with FimFiction, except when I go to post chapters. That's when the server derps. I would click publish, it would show as unpublished, so I would click again. Obviously it was publishing and unpublishing.
234751
That's basically how one of the graphics will look like. Also, mistakes fixed.
234786
As long as Twilight never travels forward in time there should always be at least one Twilight around at any given moment.
234843
I tried to make the pronouns amusing for the reader rather than just annoying.
234859
I was not until your post. I will check out that time travel post however.
234964
At least she would have good company while living those days over.
A new chapter!
mfw the time travel stuff started to make sense:
partner-ad.photobucket.com/albums/ac11/sophie0hp/GIF/vpu801.gif
Jesus, you lost me less then half way through that... Was still pretty good though :D
this chapter reminds me of trying to understand the film Donnie Darko. Instant mindfuck, just nod your head and pretend you know what the fuck is going on.
At a certain point I kinda just started reading for the sake of reading, it got a little too complex for my tiny brain. From what I can tell it made sense, I just wish it were simpler.
Not like it's your fault or anything, Sapidus. Time travel is certainly strange territory to explore.
234964 & 234989 But how would she get more than 2 of herself there? If we have the situation in the fic with Older Twilight and Little Twi and then have Little Twi go back the usual hour involved in this time loop, even if Older Twilight doesn't do any more time traveling I don't understand how Little Twi can meet up with Older Twilight and keep the loop intact (since I presume breaking the loop would mean Little Twi never learns how to time travel).... CRAP. Never mind, I was going to debunk you guys but than I got way too confused.
Oh wait actually... If Little Twi purposely traveled back to the exact moment Older Twilight traveled into the room then they could both appear simultaneously, and another Little Twi would appear, except this time there would be two Older Twilights. Rinse. Repeat. BAM! Instant sun fixing solution.
Nope, never mind. Who is minding the sun in the future? Or wait, does that even matter since by damning an alternate timeline they can all save one? If in the end they restore the sun, does that make up for the multiple other worlds left in darkness? Of course, is it even allowed for there to be so many Twilights in one reality? For some reason it seems... I don't know, immoral for there to be multiple Twilights. If they do all converge to one timeline and fix the sun, how would the public react to 6 Twilights, as you suggested? That just doesn't sound like it would end up well to me. Better not to mess with time like that I think.
.... GAAAAH!!! I'LL NEVER UNDERSTAND THIS!!!! NEVER NEVER NEVER!!!!
img.ponibooru.org/images/3d/3dfee7f83691e81c51562a7133987784
236174 Definitely what I do.
236208
It would work by the one from the future sitting around for a length of time and they jumping to the past such that now there are three. The 'younger' Twilights cannot add to the number since their jump is preset, but the 'older' ones can go back again.
Simple version of how there can be more than two: time loops within time loops.
236219 Right, that's the conclusion I was slowly coming to. But then I started musing about the morality of abandoning alternative worlds and whether or not it's a good idea to have so many Twilights in one reality. I don't know. It all just seems too sketchy to me. I'm pretty content to just see where Sapidus takes it.
236229
It really depends on how time travel works, whether they're abandoning multiple timelines. It might be that they can't add to the first time loop because they didn't, but after older Twilight 'falls off the end' of what she remembered, five other Twilights could appear and they could do the mega-sun-fixing time loop. That only really works if there's only one universe and time is stable -- you can only go back in time to do what you already did.
If they're splitting off new timelines and abandoning the old one every time they travel, then they'd be sacrificing multiple doomed timelines to save one. Which might still be worth it if (say) nopony was going to survive the ice age anyhow. Usually, it's best to wait until everypony is dead before going back in time to fix the alternate timeline though.
If it works like in FF XIII-2, then by travelling back in time and killing Celestia, the mysterious assailant broke time, and only by finding the swirly energy pool representing the paradox can they restore the future and change the past as a side effect.
I think I understood how this works! Twilight will probably never jump in time again, because she needs another self to take the sun for her, allowing her to use her full power. I still don't know how this started, but every 'Older Twilight' was visited by self from the future, who then took the sun and allowed her to jump.
This right here sums up why I hate time travel in movies. I had to reread some of those paragraphs to try to keep everything straight.
Will the next chapter be the same thing, but from Older Twilight's perspective?
I'm sad to say I don't like time travel. I think its a cop out, making the problems of reality, choices and events meaningless. It gets confusing, paradoxes all over the place and having too consider and remember all the possibilities is annoying.
Prince of Persia WW really annoyed me for this reason, the plot got really convoluted. The only time travel story I enjoyed l was in the game Bastion, the moral of which i really enjoyed.
"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect when actually from a nonlinear, non-subjective view point it's really a big ball of wibbly wobbly..timey wimey....stuff" -the Doctor
If we just go with the infinite multiverse theory, then it becomes a lot simpler. We can just follow the Twilight from our universe, and time will go on, even if the event is technically always going on in a different multiverse. Although, I'm not exactly sure with what type of time-travel theory you are going with.
The way I see it, there are two types of time-travel: One where you can travel and change anything, but there might be repercussions(I.E. Back to the Future). The other is that time is fixed, and no matter what you do, your action has already been performed and you can't change anything. This means you can consciously try to alter the past, causing the event in the first place. This one incorporates the multiverse, cause and effect wreaking havoc everywhere.
There can be Hybrids of both types of time-travel, with some important fixed points while others are changeable, but this usually means you can't change events from your own past(I.E. Doctor Who).
Unless of course you decide to go into a tangent of "magic makes the rules", and you shift from theory to theory. That would cause some delicious messes. That is why I love MLP fan fiction, magic makes things so unpredictable.
I think I need an ice bag for my head...
I find it strangely ironic that you had to rewrite your chapter about time loops, then had problems with repeated resubmissions.
This chapter makes me want to toss around some stupid meme jokes, despite the fact that I never ever ever say those, ever. Like, "I see what you're going to have done there."
Also, this needs to have an "in before time travel" joke somewhere. I don't care where, in the summary, in a chapter name, in the story itself, in the tags if it's ever on EqD, just somewhere. And "in before" is another one I have never once said before.
Mind blown. (begins to pick up the pieces) Anyone have tape or glue?
I love time-travel theories, they're always so fascinating! Always fun to confuse friends with it~
(You could always pull a page out of the 'endless 8' arc of 'The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya'. Repeats with slightly different details, or at least more revealed.)
...
while (Twilight == Twilight)
{
Twilight = Twilight;
Universe.out.println(Twilight);
}
someone need's a (break;)
Holy Crap... so many big words I don't understand... you make me feel stupid...
But I love this fic anyways!
I don't understand the problem. it makes perfect sense to me. Most of what Twilights said about 'breaking the loop' or moving the start point of the loop is just rubbish. There's only one iteration of the loop.
"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but *actually* from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint - it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly... time-y wimey... stuff." - Doctor Who, Blink
This is a fixed point if twilight does something different all of history and the future will happen at 5:02 p.m. on 22 April 2011.
Also twilight can loop any number of times before passing the sun to her self thus repeating the loop (and creating another instance of herself) as long as the earliest version of her does not pass the sun to any one of her iterations. The final iteration gets passed the sun and the rest go back to start their next iteration. Problem solved.
*head explode*
uuuhhhggg. Head hurt. To much time travel stuff. To much smart.
Round and round and round we go...
234751
Sweet Celestia, this!
Wibily, wobly, timey wimey stuff. I'm going to lay down. My head hurts.
Is it weird how I was able to follow exactly which Twilight was talking and, stranger still, what the flipping... flying... FUCK they both were talking about?
I mean, don't get me wrong, existential discussions about time can be annoyingly, confusingly exhausting, but I tend to do a lot of thinking on that particular train of thought. In fact, I frequent that train so often, the conductor knows me on first-name basis and my ticket stub has been punched and replaced so many times, I've turned collecting them into a hobby.
260613
Not necessarily. See, if each iterration used just a little more power with each jump, one could assume that the extra power would be enough to send each iterration further and further back in time, thus pushing the exit point of the jump to an earlier period in time each... well, time.
Welcome to the Yet.
5466635 Every tiny fragment of my gaming soul wishes that the game system math for Continuum had been more viable.
Hit Ctrl+F ans search for 'hand'. Then fix.