Twilight Sparkle is NOT immortal. · 9:08pm Aug 28th, 2019
Written because I am sick and tired of Immortal Twilight fics. Sorry.
My thoughts on immortality are pretty simple. Immortality is not a blessing. It's a CURSE. I know some people might disagree, but that's what I think. Why do I think that?
Because you would remain young and handsome (or beautiful for the ladies) while the rest of your friends, family, other loved ones will continue to age and eventually die. That alone is a fate worse than death.
But then you add onto that that because you can't die, you would never be able to see them again in the next life. That is a fate so horrible that... I already used the "fate worse than death" so I can't use that again, but you get the idea.
Now, "What does this have to do with Twilight Sparkle?" you may ask.
I doubt for one minute that Celestia would ever force immortality on anyone, since she's lived for thousands of years and no doubt behind that smile of her's internally she's suffering because she can never see the thousands if not millions of friends and family she's had over the millennia. Considering her relationship with Twilight is almost on an "adoptive mother" level, do you really think for a single minute that she would ever inflict this curse on her?
(On another note, I don't think Cadance is immortal either. Because if she were, I highly doubt Celestia would let Cadance DATE Shining Armor, let alone marry him. Since, you know, Shining Armor would die and Cadance would live forever. Immortality sucks.)
And considering Twilight's friendship with the rest of the Mane 6, Spike, Sunset Shimmer, Starlight Glimmer, as well as the bonds with her family and every other friend she has had over the series, do you really think Twilight would ever WILLINGLY accept immortality if it meant that she would NEVER BE ABLE TO SEE HER FRIENDS AGAIN ONCE THEY DIED?!
The current answer should be: NO!
If being an Alicorn Princess, or an Alicorn period, meant she'd automatically be immortal then I have no doubt in my mind that Twilight would beg Celestia to make her a normal unicorn again. Either that or she would find a way to do it herself, possibly with Starlight's time travel spell.
I'm sorry, I am just so sick of seeing the amount of angsty Immortal Twilight Sparkle fimfics. I don't even understand why they're so popular. There hasn't even been any canon establishment that Twilight is immortal, so why is everyone acting like she is?! It makes no sense! Almost like the School of Friendship in Season 8 or now in Season 9 with Celestia and Luna are apparently going to retire and make Twilight the ruling princess of Equestria.
*Season 9 finale* Hold my beer.
I have to agree with you on that. People have started that way back during the season 3 finale and it picked up speed again recently due to the series finale.
I agree with you on a lot of points here, Celestia would never force immortality on Twilight, and many people would agree that immortality is a curse, not a blessing.
However, I can kinda see that Twilight (and Cadance) may have an extended lifespan due to being alicorns, not an immortal one. By that I mean they could potentially live for a long time, maybe a thousand years or so, but they will eventually pass away just like everyone else. That way, they can fulfill their duties to the fullest and be just as powerful as Celestia and Luna, but will still join their friends and family in Death one day. Whether this applies to Celestia and Luna too can honestly be left to a coin flip, since they seem immortal but everything I just described could also potentially describe them too.
5113194
Oh trust me, I'll be writing a blog on THAT at a later date. And no, it won't be showing up in any of my fanfics.
Out of curiosity, your thoughts on the School of Friendship?
5113199
An extended lifespan wouldn't be too much of a problem, assuming it was just like living to be a hundred or a hundred and fifty. But I seriously doubt they'd want to live for thousands of years like Celestia and Luna.
And my personal headcannon?
We don't know if Celestia and Luna were born alicorns or ascended like Twilight and Cadance. So for this, I'm going to assume that they were born Alicorns. As such, here's my way of it working:
Natural-born Alicorns (with the exception of Flurry Heart, because I wouldn't make a baby immortal) are immortal because Alicorns have a specific gene or strong magic that makes them immortal. BUT, so they're not too OP, they can be killed in battle by certain weapons and dark magics, or by another alicorn. Since Luna and Celestia are the only KNOWN natural born alicorns, the chances of that second one happening are slim unless one of them turns to the dark side. Also, Natural-Born Alicorns can only have foals with other Natural-Born Alicorns. This would explain why Celestia and Luna don't have any known children.
Ascended Alicorns (like Twilight and Cadance) are NOT immortal, but the immense magic they now have can boost their lifespans for a few more decades. Also, any of their children if they have any will not become alicorns. The only reason Flurry Heart has both wings and a horn is because Cadance is a natural pegasus and Shining is a unicorn. And while it's rare, there is a very slim chance that a foal of a pegasus and a unicorn can have both a horn and wings. They're known as 1 Percenters, because it's EXTREMELY rare.
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NO SPOILERS!
Also, HEY! I, for one, liked the addition of the School of Friendship if only because of the addition of the Young Six. Also, what the writers decide to do with Celestia and Luna's retirement remains to be seen.
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I don't have anything against the Young Six. I love those crazy kids!
It's the IDEA of the School of Friendship and some of the decisions with it that I find questionable, nonsensical, and just wasn't a good idea.
I will be doing a full-on blog about the School of Friendship and Season 8 as a whole at a later date.
And personally, I'm hoping they decide not to retire at the end. I'm sorry, it's just the idea of them retiring just... doesn't really make sense to me. But that's also another blog for another time.
5113206
Honestly, I think the school of Friendship on its own is a silly idea. It seems o me it would make more sense if the school had a brooder curriculum than that but friendship was an undercurrent
Too be honest I like the idea of Twilight and Alicorns being immortal and if given a choice I would prefer that idea to be canon, although I'm also a big fan of all the main 6 being immortal due to their connection to the elements but that idea, while fun, seems less likely to be canon.
I just like the idea of exploring the idea of her living this unending life after her friends are gone and exploring how that affects her. Yeah, immortality has its downsides but it would be really short-sighted to just dismiss the benefits as well.
As for Celestia being a dick for forcing immortality on her... well honestly I have to believe Twilight could give it up if she wanted too I mean if you can turn her into an alicorn then you can change her back, it would be silly if you couldn't.
Personally I find it far more likely she would try to find a way to make her friends immortal. Yeah, Twilight cares about her friends but she isn't so selfish that she would abandon her duty just so that she doesn't have to outlive her friends (which could still happen even without immortality fyi).
On that subject Mortal is one of my favorite stories.
On the subject of the school, I like the idea of the main 6 being teachers but the show obviously doesn't go into too much detail on how it works and the staff themselves have admitted to the fact that they didn't care about the logistics of the whole idea so I try not to take it too seriously.
5113210
I have to admit, on paper the School of Friendship is a very silly idea on paper, since in the real world you usually learn that kinda stuff in kindergarten. However, in the context of the show itself, since we have seen how other species have struggled with making friends, and even the ponies have constantly shown to fear what they do not understand, it makes some logical sense. So it kinda isn’t just about learning friendship but being more culturally diverse.
I admit, Celestia and Luna deciding to retire after ruling for over a thousand years seems ridiculous too, but I guess even immortals have their limit. We still have learned little to nothing about their past before taking the crown together, or if they really are naturally born alicorns, so maybe they have just been waiting for a worthy successor and it took much longer than they expected. I know that is going to be seen as a weak excuse for a lot of people, but I just try to enjoy whatever the show provides, while also mixing it with various head-canons and ideas I have read in fanfics.
- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
It's Twilight Sparkle's first night as a princess, and she can't sleep. Her thoughts are haunted by a question that will not let her rest. A question that only Celestia can answer.- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
I have heard ponies say that living so long would be a curse. That it is a burden. That it can break a pony's mind. There is some truth to that, but it's not the whole truth.- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
Princess Twilight Sparkle has something to say to her younger self.I don't expect to change your mind (keep doing you, man!), but at the very least, reading these stories might provide you with an interesting look at alternative perspectives.
Just a suggestion. Proceed as you please.
:)
Have you ever considered that perhaps Celestia is not as flawless as she appears, and has been grooming Twilight from day one to replace her as immortal ruler?
The evidence is there, like how she literally never once raised a hoof to do anything useful, barring against Chrysalis.
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I'm pretty sure I've been aware of that either since Return Of Harmony, A Canterlot Wedding (which were two terrible episodes, BTW), the Crystal Empire (wasted potential and a wasted villain) and Twilight's Kingdom (giving an inexperienced newly minted alicorn the power of three experienced alicorns instead of the many other options available). How Equestria has survived under her rule I will never know.
I refuse to believe that Celestia would ever do anything like that. Because as I've already stated:
Also, throughout the series we have never seen her discuss immortality with Twilight or the idea of Twilight (or Cadance for that matter) being immortal, and I also don't believe that Celestia would do anything so underhanded as secretly make Twilight immortal. Because the moment THAT little secret gets out, Twilight will more than likely hate Celestia for the rest of their eternal lives. And given how Celestia has shown (A Canterlot Wedding notwithstanding) to value and cherish Twilight's friendship, I doubt she would ever risk that.
But hey, if you like the idea of Immortal Twilight, then like the idea of Immortal Twilight. Just understand that I don't, and never will, like the idea. You do you, man.
I agree. Don't like the idea of Twilight being immortal and outliving her friends. I am planning on making a fic where she passes on her duties to Luster and then binds her lifeforce to her friends so that they all pass on together.
Also, I found a source (Journal of the Two Sisters), which says Celestia and Luna only stay young because they raise the sun and moon. If they aren't doing that anymore they could be gone by the time of the last scene. So I think Celestia only lived this long in the hopes of redeeming her sister and then finding a worthy successor.
5132006
Glad to see some ponies agree with me on this.
Honestly, the whole part about them having to raise and lower the sun and the moon has always confused me. The planet they live on, which I am not calling Equestria because Equestria is the name of their kingdom, does obviously have a gravitational field. Otherwise ponies and objects would just be flying around everywhere. Or exploding/dying since no gravity means no atmosphere. The gravitational pull of the planet would keep the moon in orbit, while both of them would be in orbit around the sun. There would be no need for Celestia and Luna to have to do what they do.
Yeah I know it's a fantasy kid's show, but it still bugs me.
So, did some Big Bad from the past curse the sun and moon so that they wouldn't rise and fall on their own? That seems to be the only thing that makes sense to me. Certainly makes more sense than the world they live in is flat or that harebrained idea that Celestia and Luna are using Illusion Magic to make it seem like they're raising the sun and moon so that ponies think they're goddesses. I seriously doubt either of those would make any sense.
As for the Journal of the Two Sisters, I've never read it and I don't know if it actual is canon with the rest of the lore, so I general take that stuff with a grain of salt. As it is I never take any of the comics as canon because of all the plotholes and inconsistencies. And because of the poorly thought out piece-o-crap that was Anon-A-Miss, which I regard the same way I do A Canterlot Wedding, but we'll get to those eventually. (Spoiler warning: They. Both. SUCK!)
As for that last bit... I don't know how I feel about that. Frankly because I'm still wondering why Luna isn't taking over for Celestia. Sure she's been gone for 1000 years but she's adapted well to the modern era and it would be interesting to see her as the reigning princess. And it would certainly make more sense than making Twilight the reigning princess. There's a difference between leading what is essentially a team of superheroes and leading an entire country. It would be like if Tony Stark suddenly became the President of the United States. Would anyone think that was a good idea?
A long post, but I'm just going to offer a simple refutation. Dying is bad.* Living is good. Twilight would want to live, her frends would want her to live (because not doing so is tantamount to them wanting her to die, which isn't very friendly), and certainly Celestia, who as you say has seen endless ponies she cares about pass, would want her to live.
Now, would Twilight prefer that all her friends live on with her? Of course and no doubt she has put a lot of reasarch into alicornization as well as other less abusable forms of life extension.** But if she can't save them... well certainly it will hurt her, just like losing Luna hurt Celestia, just like losing Shining Armour will hurt Cadance, Flurry and the rest of their family. But it won't break her, because she has a long time to brace herself for it, for them to prepare her, and for her to make new friends. (Really, the one you should be worried about is Discord.)
(Note that a few of your comments seem to imply an afterlife reunion as a possible motivation for death. However we have no indication of an afterlife or even pony belief in one in show - well, except maybe Sombra, and what was going on with him clearly wasn't normal. Twilight is also one of the least likely charactet archetypes to beleive such things.)
Oh, and just one last question: why is it so bad for Twilight's friends to die on her, but not for her to die on Spike, whose lifespan is probably greater than Luna's absence?
*Rare exceptions may exist in cases of irremediable suffering.
**Sudden idea of burials in Equestria being replaced by last-minute cockatrice petrification, for similar reason as cryogenics in our world. (Why cockatrices? Because they seem to render the target unconcious, can all reverse each others effects and can probably be bred and trained more easily than mages capable of casting a reliable Stone Sleep.)
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Look, I'm just giving my opinion on the overabundance of Immortal Twilight fics that seem to revolve around her being miserable and sad about having lost her friends to the wheels of time. And I'm also just giving my opinion on why I think Immortality as a concept sucks. If you like the idea of Immortal Twilight or the idea of Immortality, then like them. As one guy commented:
I am not trying to force my opinion on you. I am not trying to get you to change what you think. Again, I'm just giving my opinions. That's all.
5141512
I also dislike those fics, but for the opposite reason. Not dying isn't something to be sad about.
And I'd still like to see your answers to my questions.
1. Why is it OK for Twilight to leave Spike, Celestia and so on, but not the other way round?
2. How much of this is based on your assumption of an afterlife, and would your opinion change if one was verified as not existing in the setting?
5141513
Well in order:
Celestia and Luna have ruled Equestria for well over 1000 years, not counting Luna's absence because of the entire Nightmare Moon debacle. And from what I've been hearing, they were probably trained from day one for this job, meaning they probably had time to get used to the idea of immortality before they took the job. And even then, we don't know for sure if they can't die. Who's to say some villain won't slit their throats while they're sleeping, or poison their food or whatnot? We don't know for sure if they're truly immortal, or just have infinite lifespans.
As for Spike, just because dragons can live for a long time doesn't mean they're immortal. And even then, we're never given an exact lifespan for any character or creature in the show besides Celestia, Luna, and Discord. For all we know, Spike could live anywhere from 85 to 90 years to well over a thousand. We don't know because the canon lore never tells us. And nowhere does it say that Spike or any of the characters besides the aforementioned two alicorns and one dracqoneques are immortal. So Spike will probably eventually pass on as well.
As for your second question:
A lot of this is heavily based on my opinions and views on life, death, the afterlife, and my beliefs. I may not go to church every Sunday, but I believe.
And honestly, no. It wouldn't. And that's probably what a lot of fanfic writers would tell you if you were having the same conversation with them. Because we're not bound by the canon lore or canon events, or by censors and studio mandates. If we want to change something because we either don't like it or don't agree with it, we will change it. If we want to make the story more for teens rather than little kids, we will. If we want to make the characters anthropomorphic ponies rather than the four-legged ones the show gives us? We will. If we want to write two characters we like in a romantic relationship even though they're not in canon? We have whole groups dedicated to these pairings.
So if they ended up saying that there was no afterlife for the little ponies, dragons, griffons and so on of that universe? Then I would make one. Simple as that.
5141527
Well as regarding 1, if the Princesses count as "not immortal" then I'll certainly agree that Twilight Sparkle isn't either - but somehow I don't think that's what most people mean by it. (Altough looking at the Tirek fight, I doubt that killing an alicorn is easy.)
And as for 2, what I'm seeing is an admission that your whole theory is indeed afterlife-dependent, correct? That if Twilight's death brought her nothing but oblivion, avoiding it indefinitly is preferable?
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No, what I'm admitting is that if in the canon show and lore they say there wasn't an afterlife, I would ignore it. And I would make sure to put an afterlife for the creatures of My Little Pony in my fanfics.
5141542
Yes, but if there wasn't one, would you feel there was any reason for Twilight not to be immortal?
5141544
...
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I honestly don't have an answer for that. I'm not agreeing with you. But at the same time, I can't argue with you.
But the absolute, honest truth in all of this? We'll never know. The show played the final episodes on Saturday. So we'll never find out if Twilight is immortal or not. We'll never find out if there is an afterlife for Equestria. The only answers we'll get to those questions are the ones we create in our fanfics. So, if you want to write an Immortal Twilight fic where she's happy with her immortality, then go ahead and write it. You do you, man.
5141554
OK then. And if you want to wrte one where they reunite in the afterlife, then go ahead.
(It may be that they do in mine too - time means less there, so her friends won't resent the long wait. Then her only problem would be finding time to hang out with the thousands of friends she's made in her life - but she's Twilight Sparkle, I'm sure she can organise something.)