Starlight Glimmer · 5:29pm Apr 8th, 2015
Why is it that people seem to think...
That Starlight Glimmer actually believed in the "equality" she promoted?
I keep seeing stories where she honestly relishes the idea of no cutie marks when it's very clear that she's okay with others not being special just as long as she is.
I mean, she doesn't give any indication when confronted that she hates her cutie mark. In fact it is clear to me that she is nothing more than an underachiever who mastered a single spell and got her kicks out of feeling superior to others. She's, in short, a bully.
Stop aggrandizing her character by pretending that she actually would have given up her own cutie mark. If she had really believed that, she wouldn't have lost control of the situation so easily.
Edit: damn phone
Yes! Thank you!
You are best mod.
She's basically Amon, someone who basically says one thing is wrong, yet is a user of said who thing, and then is found out, both via water
I think she believes she believes in the equality she was claiming, if that makes sense. That she's not consciously a hypocrite.
I think she believed in equality.
As long as everyone was less equal than her.
The fact of the matter is, we don't know her exact motivations. Maybe you're right, and it was all just a power trip for her. Or maybe there's something else to it, which is the impression I got. I'm assuming she'll show up again at some point, and maybe then we'll get more insight into why she did what she did. If and until that happens, all we can do is speculate, which is exactly what people are doing. This is hardly a new phenomenon.
In other words: Fanons gonna fanon, maaaaaan. It's nothing to get bothered over.
Because, as I see it, there are two ways to write her (atm). One: She's a bully. This is boring. We've had bullies. If look at all TV, we've had SO MANY bullies. There are very few interesting stories that could be told of Starlight Glimmer the bully. At least, stories that wouldn't also work if you just replace her name with Trixie, or Gilda, or Diamond Tiara.
Two: she actually believes it. And this one is more interesting. It's more open to new story ideas. There haven't been a lot of characters like her. None in MLP, and few in any other shows. So if people are looking for new ideas for stories...one version of her character makes for more compelling ideas than the other.
Doesn't mean it's an accurate depiction of her character...but when has a little stretching and changing of someone's character ever stopped fanfiction.
2961095 I was thinking Trixie's and Twilight's evil daughter but that works too.
Ponies that are equal are easier to control.
(reminded me of neverending story and what the g'mork said near the end)
Once Starlight drops the mask, she still sounds like she drank her own Kool-Aid. Lines like "I gave these ponies real friendships they never could've had otherwise!" imply that she really is a believer... even though the philosophy doesn't seem to apply to her. Really, Starlight's whole character can be summed up in this diatribe:
Starlight sees herself as a messiah figure. In her mind, she's the visionary who will save ponykind. In that delusion, there's plenty of room for hypocrisy.
Of course, that's just my read on it. There's support for both sides. Personally, I think she's a more interesting character when she's sincere and insane.
To me, she reminds me of a communist, she believes everyone should be equal with the exception of herself, who she views as better than everypony else, in other words, she is a unicorn with a superiority complex and did what she did for power
Bravo! Bravo!
2961128
That seems to be more her justification than her belief. It was her own spin on being the good guy because no is the bad guy in their own mind. The issue is that her justification does not undo the fact that she does deem her talent more important than everyone else's. Her talent, and only her talent is what brings harmony. Everything else is a lie and chaotic by extension. She believes in equality, you see, everyone is equal under her.
2961097
Like the beginning of America?
I like you, WD.
2961095
Although as I recall, Amon did believe in the things he was preaching, but he had to use bloodbending to "fix" the world. The impression I got was that if he actually succeeded at depowering every other bender in the world, he never would have used his own again.
2961128
Especially for fanfic purposes. Most of the villains so far have had entirely selfish motives (or all of them, depending on how you interpret Chrysalis' invasion). It's much more interesting to see a villain that wants to help others, but doesn't actually know what's best for them.
2961181
Starlight could see keeping her mark as a necessary evil. After all, even if she does remove her own mark—which she may not be able to—then how could she remove anypony else's? It's a bit like Othar Tryggvassen (Gentleman Adventurer!) in Girl Genius, the mad scientist who believes the world will be a better place with no mad scientists. His suicide will be the capstone of his crusade.
Of course, Starlight could teach the spell to another unicorn, but her egocentrism keeps her from even considering that option. I never said she wasn't self-obsessed. I just don't think she consciously acknowledges it.
Yes, she is a bully who wanted power and control, but I think maybe she had plans for the stolen butt tattoos
Cmon dude don't bully that idea out of people. I mean as far as writing goes we can pretty much say anything given enough buildup or AU tweaks.
In any case I am more concerned about the fact that people confuse Starlight Glimmer's society for a communist society.
2961095 i would have liked to see Starlight Glimmer thrown into a lake from a window, though
2961282
Reminds me more of Animal Farm "All animals are equal. But some animal are more equal than others."
2961297 Haven't seen it.
2961128
FOME is right. Starlight Glimmer doesn't believe in it, but she does believe she believes in it.
2961266
Problem with that is that it's implied that having their cutie mark removed removes, or surpresses, a unicorn's(or alicorn's) magic, so the only unicorn there'd be any point in teaching it to is onw whom still had their mark, which defeats the whole point.
Thank you! I'm glad someone else realized that too!
There was also the time, when she was mostly alone and not talking to anyone, when she said that if Twilight gave up her Mark, everypony in Equestria would finally realize what they were trying to accomplish.
I think it's like FanOfMostEverything said, that she sees herself as a messiah figure. I think she mostly believes in the equality she was talking about, but I had a feeling that after everything, she would continue to lie about her Mark, probably to make her feel better about herself. She seemed to have an inferiority complex, at least to me.
This is the only statement I can't agree with here. For whatever reason, I've heard several times she's just a one trick pony when in actuality we know far too little about her. She's performed her other less unique spells with relative ease and clear intent, so I don't see why she can't be much more knowledgeable than that.
As for her actual views, I think she's got the sort of mentality I'd expect out of a kooky cult leader(even if she's now on her own, she can still try and implement her ideas elsewhere) that may paint a pretty picture, but ultimately just ends up screwing with others.
Not sure about this bit
But I completely agree with everything else. Is just that everyone knows that it would have being a lot more controversial and for mostly everyone more interesting if she did believe in her cause and got ride of her mark.
Is also safe to say that such story wouldn't have being as well received by families and young children as the actual episodes were.
~Leonzilla
Funky green magic aura, obsession with making everyone else the same, while vaulting herself above them as an authority figure; the center of their adoration and appreciation.
She has Changeling-gone-weird written all over her. Maybe she doesn't even know what she is.
Have you ever heard the quote "ALL ANIMALS ARE EQUAL. BUT SOME ARE JUST MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS." That quote came from the story Animal Farm by George Orwell, who, despite being a socialist, very much hated the Soviet Union, and believed that in the end it was no different than the Imperialistic form of Capitalism he had come to loathe.
Starlight Shimmer in all honesty really was based on Communism if you asked me: says that they promote equality and a better society, all while behaving exactly in the behavior that they had told the masses was sinful.
Starlight Shimmer was nothing more than the very type of pony she taught others to be wary of in order to be in control. That's what Orwell warned in people, not just from Communism, but that any person can use fear, disinformation, and scapegoats in order to create a totalitarian society that benefits only their own self-interest.
2961282 Well, think about it, everyone in the society is. "Equal" except the government, they don't seem to have any sort of currency,mthe government brainwashes and has close sure alliance on it's citizens, the only thing missing is everything being owned by the government
It's just more entertaining to believe that she actually believed, it allows for a much better back story. Dictators who don't believe in what they do are much more common than Dictators who do believe, and much more disgustingly hypocritical, although usually more sane. Believing means that she has an interesting reason for being that way, not believing just means that she's a bitch-queen. She's still a hypocrite either way though.
I personally couldn't help but slightly sympathize throughout, as I really don't like the Idiot Savant image that cutie marks give off. The idea that someone who is naturally talented at something will always be better at it than someone else who isn't, even if they practice it a whole lot more, just rubs me up the wrong way.
Then again I could be wrong. Who knows? C'est la vie.
2961978 Dude... the fact that I have communist friends clearly makes me more knowledgeable on the subject. So I will say this... what Starlight Glimmer presented with her propaganda isn't Communism. AT ALL! You can't call uniformity communism. In fact I have asked my friends what communism would do with talented people. Easy... put them in the service of the people... share their talents. Despite what you may think communism has no intent of killing individuality. Its' main concept is about putting the major resources of the land ((which includes factories, industries, corporations, e.t.c.)) in the service of the people, handled BY the people, working FOR the people. Why? Simple... because if 3000 people are working for 100 who does most of the work and in the end deserves most of the credit? The 3000. Your name might be up there in some plate but in communism TRUE communism position doesn't grant you power over those below. The people grant you power which grants that position and you are simply... "The voice". This is NOT what Starlight Glimmer did. In any case this was not about politics NOR economy... so you can't really claim that this had ANYTHING to do with communism. So the point is invalid from the moment it begun.
2961938 Refer to my previous comment.
2962000 Fair point, I mean, they didn't have collective farms or the like, or wait, I'm thinking of Stalinism, my bad, I tend to get the two bunched together. Well, they did both promote equality, in different ways, in Communisim, everyone gets paid the same, no everything belongs to the government! I mean, it isn't a good form of government, but it isn't bad, it depends on who is running the show
2962025 I've talked with my communist friends a LOT about this during universtity. We all agree that the times communism failed where the times the few got power-hungry. They understand their mistakes and often deny the extremes of communism. In any case in communism the government IS the people. You know how you have syndicates of workers e.t.c. nowadays? Well imagine if those syndicates ruled a country. THAT would be communism. Yes people would be paid the same, but that doesn't mean the lazy would be paid... nor that you would give your private property to a homeless person as many fool you to believe. Trust me I've heard the extremes that people use to fool you into choosing the capitalistic model... All in all I'd say that Greece's former Prime Minister Mister Samaras ((who was defender of the current capitalistic system I'd say... or at least the system of the EU that demanded continious decreases in pensions e.t.c.)) used more propaganda and fear that anyone ((Eu or bunkrupcy... YES THAT WAS THE DILLEMA!)). Now let's not forget that communism was actually hunted down like the devil and "One nation under god" was made just to go against the "Godless Communism" that suggested that religions are tools of the government to manipulate the people ((not too far off I'd say... past the fact that they weren't created by the state or intended this way. That's said by a Christian mind you)). In any case while I don't believe that each system is inherently bad the people are looking for a new kind of system, a system that will stop leading into these false cycles of crises like today's system does.
What Starlight Glimmer suggested is what FOME ((comment in the start)) said... she was delusional and had a singular vision. I wouldn't put it past her to be absolutely crazy... or fool herlself.
In fact I understand her motivations. When we're low we want others to be low with us because they can empathize with out situation. We want to bring them down to our equals so we see ourselves as not-so-bad. But the thing is that as the "You're not special" speech there's the "You're special" speech. Because if everyone has no talent then one can easily get up and feel superior. It's like the ponies in the beggining said it... the more in common you have with a person the more likely you are to talk about stuff and be friends, but at the same time you don't have to be EXACTLY the same because that becomes boring fast. Starlight Glimmer is the example of a noble and well-intentioned idea manipulated or turned into extremes.
2961301
I think if that were true, she wouldn't have hid her cutie mark from others. If the greater good were really her thing, she would have worked around that rather than hidden it.
Yes, well, you still blame me for ponemurdered.
2961625
Levitation is basically the thing everyone can do. I didn't really recall doing anything that's actually, you know, significant in a way that just about any other unicorn can't do.
2961655 What I meant by that was mostly that if she had had that zeal, she would have been convincing to her ponies as well instead of backtracking or trying to make up excuses. She wouldn't have needed to hide her mark.
2961938 Yeah, I read Orwell.
2961128 If she weren't struggling to come up with reasons, I would have believed it more.
2961282 It's just like, my opinion dude, I'm not bullying anyone
2962106 You have a point, let's just say what she's done is more cult like. And yeah, I mean, there are some bad versions of any government, like the Soviet Union was for Communisim, or the Bush Administration was for Capitalism. I mean, there is a reason people wanted to escape the Iron Curtain
2962169 Maybe I didn't phrase it correctly. I am sorry. In any case what I'm suggesting is that likely when you write stuff you set the rules of the universe and the motivations. Basically when you're a writer you have the right to say "My way or the Highway" which is what I abide with because there are too many people who just outright reject ideas first glance like a knee-jerk reaction.
2962175 True true. Though the iron curtain wasn't made with communism or capitalism in mind... but more like the fact that those two systems can't simply co-exist with one another and that brings a clash. The two sides thought that an "Iron curtain" would fix stuff by giving the two sides a time out. Time and again the world has proven that this simply cannot happen. We see it nowadays in North/South Korea... it simply leads to BAAAAD results. Thanks for the discussion.
2962176 Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but did t, and I forget if it was.Lenin or Marx who said this, that "Relion in the opiate of the masses?
2962187 If only we could just learn to get along, I mean. In Russia, they are building a church where all faiths can come and worship
2962191 Marx. Religion is the Opium of the masses. And about the church thing... that's really cool. I didn't know that! I only know that our current prime minister is visiting Russia these days.
2962207 I think it's Russia anyway, it's a country in Eastern Europe at least. Russia also has a cult to Chip and Dale's Gadget Hackwrench
2962213 Dude there's a cult to Harry Potter, the Spaggeti monster, and lots of other stupid shit. The egregore, tulpa, godhood shit comes and goes. I really don't want to get into that... Trust me. Oh just so you know... Tulpas are imaginary friends made real ((for you)) with the power of mind and there are perfectly sane people with tulpas. It's simple alright... the religion issue is reaaaaaally twisted sometimes and I don't like to joke with it. So for the most part I keep to myself not being a dick and that's that. Let's not continue this convo... not to mention it's derailing the blog post.
2962230 fair point, it was nice discussing with you
The world is full of people who believe the label on the box, and never look closely enough at the stuff inside...
Even while they're swallowing it.
Best I figure. they started writing them when the trailer hit and they didn't bother to check accuracy don't care because they like the idea.
or most likely watched halfway through pauses wrote the story and resumed watching.
Or Starlight figured she had to hide her cutie mark because the other villagers wouldn't believe her, and she would never be accepted as an equal friend of the others if she kept her cutie mark, even if she went on about her "noble sacrifice."
We see Starlight living in the same type of house as everyone else, and as far as we can tell, eating the same crummy food and having the same crummy possessions as everyone else. She doesn't give herself a title like "Glorious Leader," even though she clearly could. Think about Trixie taking over Ponyville as a good counterexample of what Starlight would look like if she was just another megalomaniacal bully without any kind of ideology or "greater good." This is clearly a villain who has drunk her own Kool-Aid.
Hopefully, in the end, we'll all see just what Starlight Glimmer is all about... if she comes back, that is.
Also, what if when she said "Everypony in Equestria will finally realize what we're trying to accomplish." she wasn't talking about the town? Maybe she's part of a team or organization and she's referring to the other member(s)?
There may be more than one "Starlight Glimmer" out there...
2962169
You'd think that... But we only ever really saw Twilight do it regularly, not most other unicorns(aside from levitation, but that's the least of what I'm about to point out to). We've had many a pony, named or otherwise, do impressive feats of strength, seen various pegasi fly swiftly and show how they rule the skies, but as far as unicorns go, we have Twilight, Rarity, Trixie, Shining, and... Starlight. That's it. There's hardly ever been another unicorn seen in the entire show(Note: Show, not the movie or the comics) to make much of an impression aside from those five as opposed to the other two main Equestrian races that make AJ and RD seem not that impressive, and most of those few unicorns have been in at least 2 episodes while Starlight is brand new. Plus, in a world full of magic, not every magic user is strictly a Mage by comparison.
Twilight is Twilight, so she's self explanatory unless you're new to MLP. Trixie is a showmare, not a Mage; Her best attempt at magic was hardly threatening when it needed to count, and her return had her wielding a magic steroid. Shining's only claim to magical fame was his barrier on Canterlot, but since he's a Captain, there's probably more to him that hasn't been shown... in which case it hasn't been helping him much either that he's been in very few episodes himself. Rarity has exquisite control of her magic when it comes to moving things around delicately, and there was the incident where she got to mess with the weather(poorly, if broadly) in MMC as well as the time she used Dark magic Spike found for her(again, no real control over that once it took effect), but outside of that, she hasn't really been shown to possess any particular inclination to be a prominent Mage either when her focus is on fashion more than magic, and she's had a LOT of episodes to show what she's made of. Rarity made more threats with her hooves than her own horn. And no, I didn't forget her precious stone finding spell, but then she taught it to Twilight.
Starlight, however, pushed aside nearly a dozen ponies effortlessly in an instant with a barrier, spent part of her time shooting away at some parts of the mountain and even destroying a section of it to avoid pursuit -rather accurately and effectively I might add-, and when she was pushed to a corner, she charged what looked like a beam that might've actually hurt a lot if Twilight hadn't cast a barrier... and then escaped with a flashy teleportation spell that makes Trixie's first escape with magic smoke really look like a parlor trick without ever breaking a sweat.
There are some that think I was belittling Twilight to defend Starlight. That's not the case at all. I aim to put things into perspective in that Starlight is likely more like a pre- alicorn Twilight than a Trixie. She blatantly claimed she has spent actual broad time studying magic instead of anything else, hid the fact that she was using a normal stick for reasons known only to her(in other words, aside from trying to convince others it served a purpose when she probably could have been just fine without it) when you'd think she'd be relying on something to be more powerful with her magic for getting things done(Trixie and Alicorn Amulet anyone?), and since she looked like she could have done much better since she didn't look too tired, I'd like to think I'm making a fair assumption in believing she's an actual threat... Yeah, she's no NMM, or Discord, or Chrysalis, or Sombra, or Tirek... But she sure as hell ain't no Trixie, nor Flim Flam, nor something for Twilight to simply magic away at the risk of it backfiring on her like several of the problems she tried to deal with(or create) alone have, hence why I think there's more to Starlight since she did get away all on her own to come back another day... Maybe.
TL'DR, Starlight is not that bad, we just need to see how her story really ends. Cause I'm sure she'll come back... Or I eat my own words.