Fame in Equestria · 8:41pm Jan 6th, 2014
I’m currently waiting for my prereaders to get back to me on how the edits to chapter 3 are. I’ve also finished writing chapter 5. In the mean time, I’d like to discuss something else. Tagging just so that those who are wondering can see my progress.
I’ve previously noticed that in Equestria, fame seems to work slightly differently from how it does in our own culture. And yes, I played with that a lot in An Earth Pony’s Guide to Magic. But recently, I’ve been drawn to this point again. There have been a lot of complaints that in this season, Twilight isn’t treated like a princess. And the latest episode (which was great. I’ve been very happy with season four and this is the best yet.) has really forced me to refocus on Equestrian fame. The fact that Twilight isn’t treated as special may seem strange to us, but is it really out of character for Equestria’s culture?
Let’s look at what we learned in the past:
1. Luna went Nightmare Moon mainly because she felt like she didn’t get enough attention.
2. Star Swirl the Bearded, inventor of over two hundred spells when knowing, like, five is considered impressive. Who?
3. Cadance was able to walk around Canterlot, go to school and foalsit without being mobbed despite being an alicorn princess who redeemed a villain.
4. Star Swirl the Bearded, has his own shelf in the Canterlot Library and a wing (the most restricted one) in the Canterlot Archives. Who?
5. Jade Singer, popular author, was able to slip out of the public eye unnoticed.
6. Star Swirl the Bearded, mentor of Clover the Clever. Who?
7. The Mane Six have been repeatedly shown to be less famous than they should be. Most jarringly in Sweet and Elite.
8. Star Swirl the Bearded, apparently the inventor of time travel. Who?
9. AK Yearling can get away with living a double life as Daring Do while pretending that her work is fictional.
10. Star Swirl the Bearded, whose magic is so mind–boggling that an incomplete spell of his, can mess with cutie marks and destinies. Who?
11. Twilight never even knew Cadance’s real name before A Canterlot Wedding.
12. Star Swirl the Bearded, whose complete spell allowed ascension to alicornhood! Who?
13. Neon Lights apparently recently ascended to alicornhood and nopony seems to care (sure, likely an animation error, but let’s have our fun. Plutonia was an animation error to and no way am I regretting what I did to her as she’s my most popular character. Long live Prince Neon Lights! I just need to work out how he ascended.)
14. Star Swirl the Bearded. It’s impressive when you get his bells right. Who?
It really seems that Equestria has a kind of cultural attention deficit. If you’re not doing amazing things right now, why should ponies bother to care who you are? Celestia at least raises the Sun every day, but Twilight doesn’t do anything like that. Perhaps the annual celebrations of disasters that Equestria has are needed to keep such things in the cultural memory. In Equestria, things quickly fade into myth, like Nightmare Moon, or are forgotten, like Discord and the Crystal Empire. If you aren't important now, you're a has-been. Even Twilight who is less prone to this tendency has a currently publishing author as one of her favourites. What will happen when AK Yearling retires? It implies other things about their culture too. They don’t care about the best ever, only the best now. Innovation is common, but typically fails to take root. The fashion industry is even more fast-paced and fickle than our own. When giving up the Elements, the Mane Six where making an even bigger sacrifice than we suspected, because soon, very few will remember that they ever wielded them.
Just food for thought.
Just to nitpick:
1. Jade Singer only ever wrote one book, and she was reclusive to begin with. There's no reason for people to know what she looked like. For most people, even uber-famous authors like Tolkien wouldn't have been recognizable. Somebody might recognize J.K. Rowling, but other than that I can't think of any other authors that your average person on the street would be expected to know.
2. The Star Swirl thing seems a bit weird, but if you think about it, it isn't that strange because he was a specialist in a field that the vast majority of ponies have never studied. He was never a publically known figure; outside of high-level magical studies, most ponies will never have heard of him, despite what he accomplished. They might recognize the name as "that famous magical guy who was Clover the Clever's mentor" (note, it's not that they don't know who he is, it's that they don't recognize him when Twilight dressed up as him). For example, let's use a similar historical figure. Without scrolling down, let's see if you can recognize this guy:
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/03/JROppenheimer-LosAlamos.jpg/436px-JROppenheimer-LosAlamos.jpg
Know who that is? That's J. Robert Oppenheimer, father of the atomic bomb and pioneer in multiple areas of physics. He's had a ridiculous amount of influence on history, yet 99% of people aren't going to get it if you dress up as him for a party. He's famous and influential, but he isn't recognizable. There are probably a number of ponies who know of him, but wouldn't recognize the guy himself.
That said, everything else makes sense. Although now that Neon Light's is around, you could almost make a case that "natural" alicorns are a thing. They're rare, but not so uncommon that you'd occasionally see one.
1689713 Good points. Though, IIRC, Jade Singer had a photoin her book and I'm sure somepony would have recognised her in a culture more like our own.
As for Star Swirl the Bearded, I got the impression that they didn't know who he was at all, but that's just my interpretation.
Still, I probably AM overstating it as you said. Even still, it is interesting.
EDIT: Oh! And what's the greatest musical ever? One that's currently showing.
Y'know, that's actually a pretty good point. Thinking about it like that, I guess it really isn't that big of a surprise that Twilight is still rather unknown.
Well, as to nopony reacting to Princess Twilight. I think it's just, nopony notive she WAS a princess. Let's look at just what "Princess" equals in the mind of most ponies. Wings and horn, of course BUT, look at all the othe things that theother princesses, esspecialy Celestia and Luna, have that Twi doesn't.
-Larger then average ponies, or any pony in Tia's case.
-A massive need for some really really high end mane and tail care products
-Much larger horns and wings in proportion to their bodies then regular ponies. And granted twi's wings ARE bigger then other pegasi's, her horn is still the same size, and they aren't that much more noticeable unless you really really look and compare.
-Always have some royal bling on. Crown/Tiara, petryals, (Or whatever those hoof guard things are, the chest piece thing.
-Escorted by Royal Guards everywhere.
-Everyone know them, or at least Tia, Luna is getting there. By sight, regardless of any of that. They all know who she is. it's likely that few ponies outside Canterlot and Ponyville know about Twilight yet. Equestria doesn't have the same rapid communications we do. Even those the have heard the name Princess Twilight Sparkle, likely won't know what she looks like.
Given all that, it's not hard to believe nopony was even aware she WAS a Princess. The ONLY things, out of the long list of things ponies likely think of when they think Princess that she has is both wings and horn. And since she kept her wings tucked at her side the whole time, and never grew attention to her horn by using it, it's not that unlikely, given this is a busy city. That nopony even noticed she had both. Or if they did, it was so off hoofedly, it didn't register. The one event that had ponies even notice her period was the taxi thing, and that was in the rain, ponies already pissed at having to wait in the line, yeah they aren't going to pay much attention to other ponies.
Plus. beyond that, overall I'd say most ponies adoration and reverence for Celestia and Luna is less about the fact that they are Princesses, and is more due to WHY they are Princesses. It's not the title ponies love, it's the pony. Twi doesn't have that yet.
1689962
Oh, agreed. That's part of my point.
That said, you make good points with the other stuff.
Also:
1689962 Not to mention that Celestia has been around for hundreds of years; she's basically a fixture of the nation at this point. Of course she's going to stand out; she's been making herself a permanent part of the national consciousness.