Ambush at Betazed
“All the information we have fits.” Fleet Admiral Garrett stated as she and her guest peered into the holomap. "The Dominion is going to launch an attack on Betazed in three weeks.”
Admiral William Ross shook his head doubtful. “Intelligence reports that the Dominion are massing forces in the Kalandra sector. Betazed is too far from their main supply lines. Especially to risk a major engagement caught between Tenth Fleet and our fixed defenses.”
“I wish I shared that opinion, admiral but my information not only says they are capable of such a move, we know the exact date. We also know that the Tenth Fleet will be caught out on maneuvers when the Dominion fleet arrives. The fixed defenses won’t be enough and then the Dominion will reinforce. We’ll end up bleeding three fleets trying to dislodge them. This is not an acceptable situation.”
Ross frowned. He had never encountered a ‘Sunset’ file before. Only a select few knew what they contained or where they had come from, although their existence was popularly confirmed in the fleet eight years ago when Starfleet had successfully evacuated all but a skeleton staff from the New Providence colony and the non-essential crew and families from eighteen starships prior to the Borg invasion attempt of 2366, saving an estimated five thousand lives. It also demonstrated that this knowledge had its limits.
“Forgive me, admiral but how certain are we that this information is accurate or that it hasn’t already been compromised to the Dominion.”
“Sensible concerns admiral,” Garrett answered him. “This is why you hold the position you do.”
Ross felt a slight chill at Garrett’s words. It was widely believed that whatever information was in those mysterious files had led to more than one career being brought to a close over the past hundred years. That Garrett’s group had known about Admiral Leyton’s intended coup two years earlier all along and had allowed it to proceed to make certain that all of Leyton’s conspirators were caught and sacked in the ensuing investigation and that something contained in those files had resulted in the forced retirement of Admiral Dougherty among others during the past century.
If Rachel Garrett noticed the discomfort in the younger Admiral’s eyes, she paid it no mind as she continued.
“There are benchmarks in the files we use to see if the butterflies have flapped too hard, admiral. So far, our information still tracks well. We do our best to nudge the right pieces into place even if the board shifts a bit. As to whether we’ve been compromised? Even Section 31 has had fits trying to worm its way into our midst.” She looked at Ross sternly. “And I know they’ve reached out to you, admiral but that is a discussion we will have another day.”
Then Garrett’s eyes seemed to twinkle. “I believe you’ve met Commander Gordon, my staff security chief?” She gestured for the man to step over.
“Yes,” Ross confirmed.
“Then perhaps you should meet Commander Apocrites.” At a nod, Commander ‘Gordon’ was enveloped in a pillar of green flame. When it subsided, in his place stood a being that resembled nothing so much as an insect built on an equine frame.
“Commander Apocrites is an Equestrian Changeling. He has an unstandable knack for identifying things that are a little… ‘off’. We’ve had Equestrian Changelings helping ensure the integrity of this project for nearly eighty years. In that time, we have recorded attempts by Section 31, the Tal Shiar, The Obsidian Order, the Parasite Conspirators, The Klingons have made a few attempts, just to make sure we’re on our toes, I think. No, the intelligence is solid and now we’re going to act on it.”
“With what?” Ross asked. “If we hold Tenth Fleet in system indefinitely, the Dominion will just hit us somewhere we can’t so easily predict.”
Garrett nodded, relieved that Ross was beginning to accept what he was being told. “Fortunately, we don’t need to order Tenth Fleet to do anything. Admiral. In fact, we don’t want them to do anything. We want the Dominion to attack. I’m certain it will please Admiral Uhura to know how well her preparations have protected a few secrets we’ve been keeping. No Admiral, while it won’t win the war, we are in a position to catch the enemy by surprise. We’ll save countless lives.” /Maybe it might even convince the Breen to stay out of the war, though I doubt it. They know we can’t promise them the whole quadrant and we still can’t guarantee we’ll be ready for that Breen energy dissipator. Of course, Kang might have a surprise for them…’
Dismissing such thoughts for later consideration, Garrett pressed a key on the holomap interface and a new icon appeared, hovering over Betazed in a ghostly fashion.
“The 12th Fleet, Admiral., we’ve been gathering assets for some time and now we can reinforce those ships with ships we’ve pulled from the Romulan border.”
“Pulling what forces we have off the Romulan Border is a dangerous gamble,” Ross warned.
“Not since we’ve been slowly mining the border for decades. The field goes ‘hot’ today. As for the rest of it, well, Captain Scott and a few other engineers with first-hand experience on older designs have been giving the fleet reactivation program a boost for several years. That, along with other assets means we have quite a significant force “
“It’s still a risk and what if we change things too much? Your intelligence source may become worthless.”
“The ‘Sunset Files’ were never a bottomless, unending well of information, Admiral. Most of the fruit has already been carefully picked. I suppose I could simply protect the gains, knowing we’ll win anyway, but Risk is our business. In my judgment, the potential to save lives means I am willing to gamble much of what we have gained in both material and lives. And yes, I want the Dominion and its allies looking over their shoulders every time they even think about making a move for the rest of this war.”
“Very well then,” Ross agreed finally. “Let’s hope the gamble pays off.”
Aboard the massive Dominion battleship. Kilana, Kilana 4, to be exact, stood patiently as the Dominion-Cardassian fleet dropped out of warp as they arrived at the edge of the Betazed system. It seemed that their intelligence had been correct: While not an unimpressive force, the Federation Tenth Fleet, or rather its commander had gotten predictable in scheduling his ‘training maneuvers’. By the time Betazed’s defenders could sound an alarm and the missing ships could be recalled, Gul Revok’s troops would have secured the system’s fixed defenses and the planetary capital. Without the orbital weapons platforms or powerful ground-based phasers, the Federation fleet would be too weak to force them out.
Thinking of Revok made the Vorta’s skin crawl but all that mattered was that his actions served the will of the Founders. Of course, if the Founders ever decided his services were no longer required, Kilana would gladly see to his execution if the Founders willed. For the moment, however, there was a mission to perform.
Turning to her Jem Hadar First, she simply nodded. War was what they were created for so it was best to let them fulfill their purpose as the Founders intended, a lesson that some other Vorta never seemed able to grasp: The Vorta stood where the Founders intended as did the Jem Hadar. Petty displays of power only made for wasteful friction.
The First responded by ordering all weapons readied and a scan of the system. He regarded this Vorta better than most. The Vorta carried out its role without meddling outside its scope.
Currently, the soldier manning the sensor station completed his initial scan. “No Federation ships detected, First. Defensive Batteries identified. They have not gone active.”
“Good.” The First turned to the Vorta.
Kilana nodded. Everything was going exactly as expected. “Instruct Gul Revok to begin landing his troops.” Even as she gave the order, something nagged at the back of her mind.
“Sensor beacon seventeen has been tripped, Admiral.”
“Thank you, Commander. Signal the fleet to battle stations.”
As the klaxon sounded, Garrett circled around from tactical to the command chair of the Galaxy-X Dreadnought. She would have preferred her chair on her own Enterprise but the command and control facilities aboard a Yamato class were far superior. Still, her old ship was in good hands with Captain Castillo. Good luck Captain. Take good care of her today.
“Open a discrete channel to the Enterprise -Σ.”
“Channel open.”
“Captain Kirk, your party.”
“Thank you, Admiral.” The channel changed to a general broadcast.
“This is Captain Kirk. All ships standby to commence Operation Gorkon… Execute!”
Slowly, the Enterprise -Σ rose up from the atmosphere of the largest Gas Giant in the Betazed system. Behind her rose the Galaxy-X Dreadnoughts Yamato, Enterprise, and Odyssey. Across the system, Federation starships emerged from hiding.
Captain Kirk leaned forward. “Ready phasers, load quantum torpedoes.”
“First! New contacts!” The soldier manning the sensor station reported in alarm. “Federation starships.”
“How many?” The First demanded.
“Two hundred and thirty-six.”
Too late, the pieces fell into place in Kilana’s mind. We didn’t see a thing! If surprise had truly been on our side, there should have been something moving in system! A cargo hauler… something! How could they have predicted us so completely? Unlike the Jem Hadar, who already considered themselves dead, Kilana feverently wished to survive. She only hoped the Founders would be merciful.
“We must escape this trap!” She ordered.
“The Cardassian ships are already pushing into the inner system. They are already fully committed.” The First replied.
“Unfortunate for the Cardassians. In the meantime, we need to make certain their heroic sacrifice is not in vain.”
“Understood.” While the First might not have liked the idea of abandoning the battle, obedience was life. And the Vorta is correct. They are only Cardassians.
Around the Dominion fleet, the ghosts of the Federation’s past had risen to haunt them. Instead of perishing at Veridian III, the Enterprise -D was here, reborn alongside her sisters Yamato and Odyssey. Rather than dying in a desperate battle at Narendra III, Enterprise -C was here along with her sister, Horatio. Their sister ship Yamaguchi, risen from the wreckage of Wolf 359 joining the starships Kyushu, Princeton, Chekov, Firebrand, Buran, and both starships Melbourne all resurrected from the tragedy, all reclaimed out of dire need.
Other ships for whom the threads of fate had changed… USS Farragut, Drake, Olympia… Starships Proxima and Maryland, who were no longer destined to be casualties in an undeclared war.
Nor was the USS Cairo, which instead of waiting to be ambushed patrolling the Romulan Neutral Zone, was now one of many ships quietly withdrawn from the border, fighting alongside the Enterprise -B and the Defiant-class USS Valiant.
Older ships, Constitutions, Constellations, and Mirandas descended on the Cardassian troop ships. Gul Revok, who might otherwise have lived to betray Legate Damar and his anti-Dominion resistance, died as his ship came under fire from a pair of Constitution class vessels.
They’re all here, Garrett thought. “All but one at anyway. Hopefully, she’ll be in time to join the party.
Aboard the Dominion flagship. Kilana winced as the massive battleship shuddered under hammer blows from a volley of quantum torpedoes. The Cardassian ships were clearly too deep in the enemy’s grip to escape but fortunately, it seemed that the majority of the Jem Hadar ships would yet escape. Rather than push a fight to the finish, the Federation forces seemed mostly content to whittle down the large numbers of Jem Hadar fighters. Kilana would settle for this. Just a little longer. We’re almost clear.
“New contacts dropping out of warp!”
Kilana’s eyes went wide as the sensor plot changed. So… No escape after all…
“Message from Captain Picard, Admiral.”
“On screen,” Garrett ordered. The image of Captain Picard appeared. “Well, Captain! Good to see that you and that fancy new ship of yours could make it.”
“Indeed Admiral and good to see you and to see my old bridge again.”
“Comfortable chair. I think I may keep it.”
“Quite understandable. And the Chancellor sends his regards.”
“Accepted with thanks. And now that you and our Klingon friends have arrived, we’ll finish this fight.”
Aboard the Enterprise -Σ, Commander M’Ress turned to Captain Kirk. “Incoming message from K’naiah’s Pride.”
“On visual, Commander.” Kirk leaned back as the bridge of a Vor’cha class ship came on with a very familiar face sitting in command.
“Ah! Captain Kirk! A true pleasure to see you again.”
“And you as well, Kang. Your timing is impeccable.”
Kang smirked. “Tell me, Kirk! Do you know what is best in life?”
“To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women," Kirk replied.
“Ah! So you remember more than just Shakespeare! But you can never truly appreciate Conan until you have read it in the original Klingon!”
“You’ll have to send me a copy. In the meantime…”
“In the meantime, let us crush our enemies and drive the Founders to lament that which they have brought about…”
I enjoy this immensely.
I almost feel sorry for the Dominion forces. Almost.
Nice touch with the changeling, there.
Very satisfying to see the culmination of the Sunset Files. You don’t usually see foreknowledge like that treated as a finite resource and picking when to sacrifice it.
The Changelings must drive the Founders nuts, almost as good at shifting and empaths on top of it. Granted I’ve always had headcanon that the Founders are weak telepaths anyway, but still. And the fact that Star Fleet has had allied shapeshifters for a long time now miss have really hurt the Founder paranoia campaign.
As much as I absolutely love Star Trek, it always irked me how in canon the Federation just seemed to throw out older ships and designs when they could easily just upgrade them with more modern technology. There's no reason to retire a perfectly fine ship when some upgrades and care can make her fly like she's new again. Case in point, the Constitution refit and Galaxy-X/Yamato (Nice STO reference btw).
I mean, even if they have to basically strip the entire ship and rebuild it, they could. Hell, that's EXACTLY what they did with the TMP refit of the Constitution class, they stripped the entire Constitution line down to the most basic framework and rebuilt them with more advanced tech, modernizing the design. If they can do that once, they can most certainly do it again, there's a damn good reason Starfleet engineers are considered miracle workers by the other nations. They can also begin producing new ships using the upgraded design right off the bat, so why didn't they?
It also looks like this version of Starfleet kept it's military intact... And they came out a lot more prepared because of it. The reason MOST of the Federations problems in the 24th century ended up as bad as they did in canon was because Starfleet demilitarized after the Khitomer Accords, if they'd kept Starfleet's military capability intact the first time around instead of only scrambling to rebuild it when they were already getting their asses kicked, the Borg invasions and the Dominion war would've been a lot less bloody for them. Still one hell of a fight, but it'd have been one they were at least prepared for. They also should have NEVER put themselves at such an enormous tactical disadvantage by agreeing to such an absolutely moronic thing as a ban on making their own cloaking devices... But that's a rant for another day...
Ahem. Sorry about rambling for a bit there...
This was great, as always... It'd be interesting to see the other side of the mirror, see what all Sunset and Trixie went on to do after meeting the Enterprise crew.
Hah ... the Dominion got pwn3d. Or is that pone'd? Either way, that freaking rocked! Wonder if that'll have butterflies regarding the Romulans entering the war - and beyond - though.
I keep wondering with any of these series just how they would handle someone putting together the most extreme current Earth tech and designs. Like taking a WW2 carrier and upgrading it with multiple NIF cores, Cathedral diesels, hull wide phase optical emmiters, Hull Optical Lattice, Enervescent energy wall shield, Plasma shields, Plasma wave accelerator particle beam generators, Grazers both continous and pulse, and a whole bunch of other fun things in temporally compressed ultrawideband pulses that approach event horizon densities. Even better is if the metallic hydrogen thing works out so that it can be theoretically possible to see what happens when you dump an entire second of a full stars output into a stellar core, etc Suprisingly, unless neutrino generation and manipulation methods become available, the power to disrupt a star is no way enough to disrupt a planet. Maybe take off the top couple kilometers of crust globally, but no real distruction. At least with old tech its easy to consider using a shipyard replicator to print billions of ships fro,m a single decent asteroid in a isolated obscure low quality star system.
I mean, how many people would want to read stories about Nova Wars where the two opposing fleets actually run out of stars in less than a centuary, having detonated the entire Galaxy even if by accident?
So far also ST universe hasnt had to deal with Forerunner or Progenitor nanogoop probes? Still trying to work out what recent research announcements in 4D spacial packing implies for crystaline processing density and capacity. But Pi rockfarm grown gems will be right into Culture Mind class capacities even without optimisation, which the gems would be able to aply to themselves.
Wonder if the Mirror is permanelty connected even if an information link only, nudged quanta, and if so the time can flow differently or is based on relative N space movement like Light Of Other Days, or it uses the energy of powering up to reconnect at the other end the point after it closed down or some other function relative? If its same time, Sunset will be riding the Phoenix?
9152224
Ok, dunno about most of that, but the time flux thing did make me think, how long has passed for Trixie and Sunset? Maybe they're even alive (although older) and next we see them is in a meeting with Kirk, Kang and Picard.
I wonder how would them react to knowing how mythological are the 'Sunset Files', and if Trixie would be too pissed for they not getting her name even if it could be too easily associated with equestria
Still waiting for the story with those two. Preferably with SHIPPING I don't care if at first sight they might not be made for each other, the mothers of the space age in EQG world should be a cute couple!!
9152490
I would say that, except that if I ship Trixie with anyone it’s Pinkie Pie.
It’s been 70 years or so, if Sunset is in her teens (biologically natch) in the show then she could be alive but very old at this point. Depends on medical care in Eqg world, what holding the local version of an Element of Harmony does for you, and a whole bunch of nonsense.
You know, if it had been any of the grate powers of the Alpha quadrant who saw THAT many Enterprises against them they... Well the smart ones would run, very, very far away!
Greeze, the D getting her 'Days of future past' look, the E at the head of a Klingon fleet. So nice.
So this was a "Black Fleet" right? Filled with 'lost' ships and such? Or are their really that many Enterprises flying around all named and active? Because while the Klingon might get a kick out of that, the Romulans must have nightmares!
It seems to have been a fleet of every ship they could confirm as being inactive from the Sunset files. If they knew from the series or movies that something happened to a given ship at an approximate date, Starfleet apparently retired it at that date to this fleet so as to minimise the butterfly effect on the timeline as much as possible and preserve the accuracy of their information as much as yhey could.
Given that they also knew in advance that they were going to encounter technologically advanced and powerful enemies who simply weren't interested in diplomacy, I would be unsurprised to learn that additional vessels which would otherwise have been disposed of outright on normal retirement as just not cost effective to upgrade any more under normal peace time conditions were actually also mothballed and assigned 'off the books' to this force, since they knew about the Borg and Dominion before encountering them.
9152568
I was thinking more on the lines that time in EQG world seems to pass rather slower than in equestria, something like five times slower, or even more? If five times then 150 on pony land would be 30 in "pedestria", and they'd not even be in their fifties yet.
Or maybe it's now 1:1 and they're sadly dead
I
9153009
Depends on how you do the timeline I suppose. But if they're still around, I hope they're special consultants. Unless they're too busy seeking New Life and New Civilizations in their own universe.
But really, why not both?
Be that the Enterprise 1701 and Enterprise 1701-A, per chance?
9153325
Perchance, yes! Yes, it would.
9153328
The only question then is this: Under who’s command were 1701, 1701-A, and 1701-B flying?
9153338
It's a fair question who might be available but I am certain that Spock would take command of one of them if Kirk asked. Scotty would also. Whether any others of the classic crew are available or any of the Nu-Trek crew is unknown although Nu-Spock might work as might Saavik.
9152224
okay i just want to put my two scents so sorry if i'm sorry mistaken. but, they only had to agree with the 'no cloaking tech' to end the war with the Romulans which was worse than it would have been because of the Khitomer Accords. their thinking was the Romulans are neutral and the only real threat were the Klingons. it's pretty a case of solving today's problems by making worse ones in the future.
jack: "we'll just have to cross that bridge when we get to it."
bra 'tac: "no, the bridge is to well guarded."
9153383
Spock (from either timeline) would undoubtedly take command of one or both the old and A Enterprise. Scotty, however, is an engineer first and foremost. He would likely be in engineering on the old Enterprise. Sulu, on the other hand, has always had command ambition. And because 1701-B is an Excelsior class, I think Prime Sulu would jump at the chance to command her.
9154039
If Hikaru was available... Unless his daughter Demora wanted her chair back.
9152139
Not sure where you're getting demilitarization information. So far as I know, the exact specifics of what the 1st Khitomer Accords are not known beyond establishing peace between the Empire and the Federation (Klingons also gave up Arkanis). 2nd Accords banned subspace weapons.
As the Khitomer Accords were made possible due to the disaster of Praxis, it makes less sense for the Federation to agree to any significant form of disarmament, as they were in a position of strength. Of course military strength does naturally fluctuate from century to century so perhaps that's what you meant?
Some older ship designs did last quite a while. The Excelsior class, presumably with several refits, was in service all the way to the end of the Dominion War. It's hard to say why some classes were kept on while others fell by the way side, may just be the availability of ship models (later on, the time to make digital re-models), but an in-universe explanation could be the switch from duotronics to isolinear tech. Voyager utilized bio-neural gel packs and her nacelles had variable geometry. So some older ships may have required modifications to the extent that they may as well build a new one, especially if a fundamental aspect of the existing design was a limiting factor (e.g. they wanted a bigger ship).
Could also have something to do with material science. The time gap between TOS and TNG also encompasses the switch to replicator technology. As it's fictional tech, it's hard to say how that might influence the economy of building and maintaining starships.
9155215
Actually, the scene of the briefing at Starfleet Command in ST: The Undiscovered Country makes it clear that making major cuts in Starfleet's combat forces was very much a major component of Gorkon's proposals. The Empire could no longer afford a continuing military buildup. To prevent reactionary Klingons from choosing a desperate 'military option' as their only chance to survive what it saw as Federation aggression, the topic of dismantling starbases and border stations on their border and a reduction of military expenditures was key to the negotiations.
To Quote:
"Bill? Are we talking about mothballing the Starfleet?"
"I'm sure our exploration and science programs would not be affected but the facts speak for themselves."
So. We see that Khitomer DID help demilitarize Starfleet. Now... We know that there are several ship types from that era which we see in the 24th Century. The Excelsiors obviously became the backbone of the fleet. The Mirandas continued through the Dominion War. The Constellation class is reported to have had teething problems but again was kept in service for decades as were the O'Berth class scouts.
So what classes disappear? Obviously, there is no further mention of the Federation class Dreadnoughts although an audio reference to the USS Entente in TMP and computer monitor images confirms this class existing in the 2270s. The Saladin/Hermes-class destroyers and scouts also are confirmed from this time but also vanish. The Soyuz-class are known to have been retired prior to the time of TUC.
One other class vanishes at this time: The Constitution-class... With the following exceptions: One in the Fleet Museum. Believed by some to be the USS Yorktown. The USS Republic, NCC-1371 has been a training ship for decades apparently in the sort of tradition that has the USCG maintain the Sailing Ship Eagle. And... In the wreckage at Wolf 359, the engineering hull and the separated saucer of a Connie can be found. I offer this was also a ship used for training purposes.
Outside of these cases, the Connies all vanish after 2293. The materials for Star Trek VI suggests at least seven Connies other than Enterprise in service at this point. Now, the Constitutions class (refit at least) shares much in common with the smaller Mirandas, so the technology was not the reason for their retirement. It seems likely that they as the icon of Starfleet's prowess over the past thirty plus years were retired as a symbolic 'peace dividend' and offering along with the Dreadnoughts.
With detente established with the Klingons and soon the Romulans going back into their shells (as far as the Federation was concerned), the Federation had no opponents capable of initiating all-out war for the Feds. The Tzenkethi, Cardassians, and other races were only capable of regional conflict with the Federation. So yes, unlike the period between 2260 and 2310, the next 50 years were a period where the Federation could allow its military preparedness to relax.
9156048
Yes, they did discuss it informally early on in the movie, though I don't believe we know the final form of the treaty. It certainly does seem to reduce military strength, in the form of the aforemented bases. I am unsure if this would put hard limits on fleet size. Something which Starfleet could easily get around with science and exploration ships if that was included.
Agreed regarding Cardassians and Romulans.
As for the technology not being an issue, the Miranda had significant differences in its nacelle configuration and from its size, it seems likely to have been intended for a different role compared to the larger Constitution class which had been used for long duration missions. As you pointed out, the Excelsior class became the backbone of the fleet, displacing the Constitution class. I'm not sure if we ever knew how many ships of the class underwent a substantive refit like the Enterprise did. We know of at least 2 from the movies. (And apparently some training ships and the remains from wolf 359. Sorry, missed that).Prior to replicator technology becoming common, they may have found it easier to adopt the new design of the Excelsior rather than upgrading the existing. May have been a factor in why the Enterprise ncc1701 A was decommisioned at the end of the film.
9156142
Simple, the Excelsior was everything the Connie does and more. it as design to replace her. Once enough were built the suriving Connies were mothballed minus Republic. save for jsut incase of massive ship loss.
On another topic why didn't they prevent the Dominion war. If the feds never made peace with Centreal Command and conquered them so many lives would be saved?
9157682
"We Come in Peace" was never going to be sufficient for the Founders, ergo War with the Dominion was inevitable. The only question was how it would be fought. Unfortunately, sharing the knowledge from the Sunset Files with the Cardassians was not going to be a likely option. Not when even if believed, there were parties such as the Obsidian Order or Gul Dukat who would have gladly manipulated that knowledge for personal gain. Also, it would have been hard to convince the Klingon Empire... Even one guided by Kang's efforts... To not grow suspicious of the Cardassians. Also is the matter of saving even more lives by keeping the Pah Wraiths sealed up. Allowing them Gul Dukat helps facilitate this.
(Of course, the Federation was not about to lose the USS Honshu to help facilitate Dukat's escape so plans were made on that score.)
They still HOPE to dissuade the Breen from entering the war and whether or not this succeeds, they will TRY to help Legate Damar's resistance movement in any way they can. The early death of Gul Revok is just a lucky break on that score.
9157798
but the Cardassian element could have been eliminated. There has been two wars with them and with the Sunset files they will know the Centeral Command will not kept the peace and would put Cardassia in a position to be assisted by the dominion. Why not continue the previous war till the Centeral Command is defeated. they neverhalf to tell the Cardassians of the files jsut ensure Centeral Command is no more.
9157809
So the Federation should prolong a war and cause more deaths to prevent deaths later? So go to the Federation Council and tell a bunch of politicians to prolong a war because you believe that by doing so, you are possibly saving lives in the future? That is a very dangerous gambit that could very easily backfire. The ambush at Betazed is a calculated risk. extending the war against Cardassia (And to be sure you have to OCCUPY Cardassia) is a blind throw of the dice.
9157850
Prolong a war that could ensure a lack of the dangerous one later. WIthout the Cardassians the Dominion would not have the foothold or the time of build up they did in Prime. Hell considering the files and what they showed having or more militaristic Starfleet solves alot of problems.
9157885
Short of destroying the Founders or somehow disabling the wormhole, I don't think eliminating the Cardassians would prevent the Dominion from gaining a foothold. They'd reach out to another race. The Breen, certainly, only sooner. The Romulans, maybe. The Tholians, might be a possibility. Even the Ferengi if Brunt ever became Nagus (it'd be funny and sad to watch Weyoun and Brunt). Only in this scenario, the Sunset files would be worthless.
9157916
Simple, O'Brien's minefield. It work well and without control of DS9 they can't counter it.
9158205
Federation: Pay no attention to this location in the Denorios Belt.
Rest of the Alpha Quadrant: The Federation is doing something odd in Bajoran space. We must investigate.
Federation: No, no. Nothing to see here. Certainly not mines cloaked with technology we're forbidden by treaty to possess.
Rest of the Alpha Quadrant: Aha! They've placed a minefield. We must find out why!
Federation: There is no minefield here, and we're certainly not desperately trying to keep a foreign power from invading.
Rest of the Alpha Quadrant: Suspicious. Very suspicious. This foreign power you are guarding against, how do we know you aren't monopolizing them and using your minefield to keep us from contacting them?
Federation: All right. You've found out. They're the Dominion. A sort of Anti-Federation who intend to conquer the entire Alpha Quadrant.
Rest of the Alpha Quadrant: And how do you know all this?
Federation: Two cute, talking ponies that came out of a magic mirror told us about them.
Rest of the Alpha Quadrant: We find that a dubious claim from suspect sources. Perhaps this Dominion simply doesn't care for the Federation. Surely, (insert civilization here) can find common ground and become stronger for it.
9158205
Unfortunately, again... to guarantee that Cardassia behaves as the Federation wishes it to would require occupation of Cardassia. That will be bloody and messy and undermine the Federation's relations with every other starfaring nation in the known Alpha and Beta Quadrants and even assuming that the occupation was successful, this would merely postpone the war and leaving the Gamma Quadrant off limits. Also leaving the possibility that the Dominion would eventually find another access to the Alpha Quadrant. Perhaps another Iconian Gateway...
These are fair ideas to mention but I simply do not see them as working out so well in the end.
9158261
At that point the galaxy wouild know of the Dominion. So not a surprise at an oddity.
9158266
actually it would. the Union is the lynch pin of the whole thing. Let's look at the events.
The Federation and the Cardassian Union go to war. Fed has the clear tech advantage so likely winning the war yet instead of removing the Central Command from power they sue for peace as soon as they could and even give up territory even though they are winning. Then with Maxwell and several other incidents that clearly show the Union breaking the treaty, Starfleet....DOES.....NOTHING. Sick of it several Starfleet officers and former colonists form the Marquis to do something. Then after the Obsidian Order was destroyed the decent Cardassians finally take control only for the klingons to beat the crap out of them so bad that Dukat sought the Dominion which they come and install him as leader, kick the Klingons out and destroy the Marquis.
Defeat Centeral Command in the first war fully and have the Detapa Council in control of the Union far earlier prevents all of this. Plus gets rid of the small Fed Klingon war
9158656
I think we're starting to go in circles here. I simply do not see it so easy to mold a predictable and compliant Cardassia. Certainly not without damaging the Federation's credibility among starfaring nations and even its own members. The Cardassians fought the Dominion after the Dominion started leveling cities. What do you think they will do to resist an enemy that is trying to remove their government by force of arms but won't dirty itself?
There is a CHANCE what you suggest might turn out alright and a much bigger chance for the Federation to end up in a quagmire and it will not stop the Dominion from seeking to find a way to bring their vision of 'peace' and 'order' to the Alpha and Beta Quadrants. Of course, Section 31's virus would kill all the Founders. This act of Genocide having unpredictable repercussions. The Vorta might simply continue on running the Dominion under a 'Holy Crusade' to avenge the murder of their 'gods'
The politics, internal and external, the emotional components involved... Can we agree that it is a volatile mixture? I think you can understand why in my opinion, it's a very dangerous gamble and not simply a calculated risk.
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really. I don't see the rest of the galaxy really caring if the fed went full conquest. at most the Klingons might be annoyed for being left out. Some Cardassians might resent occupation but remeber there is a movement of Cardassians dislikeign the current regieme and only the Obsidian Order prevented a coup.
Granted a war could still happen however it would not be as bloody.
I think the Federation would avoid doing things like conquering other nations because they genuinely don't think that kind of behaviour is moral or ethical. And if they start justifying such actions 'just in this case because we know the future' it'll keep on becoming easier to repeat them for what seems like the greater good in the future.
Eventually along that slippery slope they would be wise to fear that they would end up with something like the United Empire of Planets.
This entire timeline came about because two enemies, Kirk and Kang, showed that they could choose to rise above conquest and hostility for the greater good. The Federation going on a path of conquest, even for the perceived greater good in the long run, would be to throw away everything that earned them that information about the future to begin with.
Yes, yes, this is the story I needed tonight. Bravo, good author. Bravo.
I really like this idea. An alliance with the Klingons should mean the occassional test of your strength. It's for your own good!
Since both Melbourne’s are here does this mean Chris hemsworth?