Contradicting Beliefs · 12:18am Sep 23rd, 2017
Emotional Resonance vs Emotional Manipulation [Part Two]
I write this as a response and express my own point of view and of seeing things
We as storytellers have an agreement with our audience, to deliver what they came to expect.
We don't owe them squat. Writers never gave me what I wanted or expected (Mind you, I have very specific desires and expectations) and other fanfic writers hardly ever gave me what I wanted. That's what people make fan-fiction for int he first place. To have what THEY WANTED happen. It is our world, and our rules, if the readers can't respect that, and if they don't like how we make our stories, that is not our problem.
Supposing we disregard emotions, then what we are writing about is not a story, rather what we are writing about are events, text books, news articles or uninspired fan fictions
That's ridiculous. A Story is a story, no ifs ands or butts, even a one-shot is just a short story, but STILL a story. Even text books are story books in their own special way, or would you deny that some history text-books aren't relating to stories of the past, and how it affects our present and future (That is a story OF events)
these won't attract your target audience.
Sure they do, especially is most people are just mockers and flamers coming just to maul in a few laughs and be highly unjust. I post a story and I get stalked all the time by such lunatics. The stories will attract someone, and even if they don't... don't be intimidated by it. A true showman/author is never humbled by the size of his audience.
On the contrary, even memoirs have characters in it, despite being in the non-fiction genre.
So memoirs are like stories too, huh? Just like events and texts and scripts are.
We pick it up because we are interested in what happened in their lives.
That only depends on what YOU find AS interesting. The only real rules in stories are based around what people LIKE or WANT to hear about, but it's all in their own interest. I remember all the text books and events I read up in school, and I did not find them the least bit interesting, even in literacy, I was only reading novels because it was a requirement, I didn't enjoy it one bit! (Not even the first three Harry Potter books)
Telling a story is all about enthralling your audience in your world, and this is a performance in itself.
Yes, I can't deny that, but telling a story is also about telling it YOUR WAY... how you want it to be told... what YOU want in it. It all depends on YOU... not your audience.
Story telling is also used as a TEST, to find out what people like, or what they may actually be up to (Not really caring about improvement, but just being rude and obnoxious regardless of what is written and how it is done)
The best way to provide emotions, is to give your character humanity, and we as humans are naturally flawed. Even if your character is inhuman physically or psychologically, allow him to ponder on ideas he doesn't understand. Sympathetic is different from being empathetic, it refers to likability.
But what if you utltimatley don't like that stuff? What if you object to a character acting in any way you deem unfit?
-I want my character to be happy, and never experience sadness.
-I want my character to remain a jerk and never want to have friends.
If they do not meet your standards, how can you possibly like them? Naturally, if you don't like your own stuff, what are the chances that others will, or maybe you yourself don't even want them to like it.
There goes a message from the Power Rangers: "You've got to like YOURSELF before others will like YOU"
But creating characters and having them behaving in ways you completely disapprove of, that's not going to work, and if people find out you dislike it, they will turn on you, because a true author stands up for their OWN works. and doesn't let people push them around.
If you don't stand up for your own beliefs and desires when it comes to characters and plot... perhaps you she be regarded as worthless as they are.
The process of creating a story is messy, as a matter of fact, one of the biggest flaws of the writer, is outlining the plot first, thinking of the cool scenes they want to write; when in reality, to write a successful story, you have to pen the emotional side first.
Or you can basically just skip to the basic plot right away and cast everything else as just filling and padding. After all, people came to see the main plot, not what lies in between.
when I watch Yugioh, I hate it when they have long conversations and stories instead of dueling, and I beg of them to "Stop yaking and get tot he point already"
Why? Because the outer journey is a metaphor for the inner journey. Hence why concepts do not matter, but execution does.
Actually, both seem to matter, as I myself have been constantly insulted by both Concepts and execution, and after all, without concept, you have no bases... not formatting... nothing to make a story with at all... you're just staring a blank page not knowing what to write at all... therefore, there IS NO execution. (You can't make a move if you've nothing to move at all)
You can write a story about multicolored ponies living in a vibrant land, or a fantastical retelling of the War of the Roses, and still make it work, if you address reality properly.
And by properly means, again... based on what YOU desire, not the audience. This is your world, not theirs!
Reality is neutral, it's neither cynical or optimistic
If it really is neutral, then why do people go out of their ways to mock and deconstruct other peoples fics mostly for laughs, or denounce them simply because they wish to think for themselves (Be different)
Face it, writing and telling stories is not just a hobby, it can also be a real war... battling the forces of ignorance ,and revealing other sides and source of things that people seem to forget because they're too busy contemplating the same old thing.
-Always think postivie
-Be the best kid you can be
-Be kind to others and they'll be kind to you.
...NO, it doesn't always work that way, and just because you ignore it and try to deny it all you want doesn't mean it doesn't exist and won't happen. Everything in reality comes with a price, and life isn't something you can just script down and hope will change all the time.
People CHOOSE to behave the way they do, and no pen and paper or computer can make you make them change their minds.
Also, just because you may have the power to do certain things, that doesn't automatically mean you should, or you have to. It's your choice!
We have the rights to make our stories in our own way because we wish to THINK in our own way.
, those two view points are mindsets and none of the two are right, if you go to both extremes then you'd be giving your story more problems than providing a solution. More on this later.
If no two ways are correct, then why do many people still act the opposite. People keep telling me I'm always wrong, even when I AM being correct in some ways, no, I'm automatically wrong to them. That's being cruel and judgmental, hence why I give my own characters the same treatment. (The other people don't care for it, so why should I?)
Maybe going to extremes sometimes IS the solution to the problem, or maybe that's what the entire story is supposed to be about in the first place.
The Story Elements
A good story has a recipe, oftentimes beginners have the misconception that narratives (most importantly fan fiction for that matter) should be written on a whim, without regarding the fundamental rules of fiction writing. You have to stop and consider why you are writing the story, and when you finish it, ask yourself, will the audience remember this fondly or shudder in displeasure
Oh, so again, it's not both ways are neither right or wrong... it's one or the other again (One is right the other is wrong) again, I state, the stories and characters... the only rule about them is what people LIKE or PREFER, and if they are displeased, it's not your problem, it's theirs. You don't owe them squat. (If they want it done their way, they bloody well can do it themselves, only there is a right and wrong way to do that as well... as in NOT doing it to hurt people and make fun of them)
To give you an example, for the longest time, nobody can properly answer why My Little Pony was a good show.
- One reviewer pointed out: it was the best show of it's kind, the characters are well rounded and realistic, as if you can interact with them in real life and get to know them personally.
- Another pointed out: it has moral realism, that's why it's good. It's not cramming the Aesop down your throat, it has a structure on how they learn it.
- While another commenter said: it gives people hope, and that's why people like it. It has a fresh new perspective in life, that you can be an optimist and a realist at the same time, you are not mature for giving into too much cynicism, and this cartoon addresses it accordingly.
Well, well, well... those people may be entitled to their opinions, but so are others, including myself, and my view of MLP stands...
MLP seems to offer people a one-track view and a one-way solution of how to solve problems. Such things do not reflect realityt hat well. You cannot simply be always hopeful and optimistic, because sometimes no matter much you hope or pray or even wait... you still may not get it, maybe not ever, even if you try to work for it, you still may not get it.
Maybe MLP also reminds sad people of how bad they have it, and it hurts them to see how easily many others go through life, and feeling they should have it just as much but don't
MLP doesn't seem to address every single format there is,a nd that is one of their biggest flaws; denial... refusing to realize the possibility and the existence of unpleasant realities that can occur and perhaps cannot ever be fixed or helped, not even with friendship.
To be honest, I could look at the ponies grimly and say to them, "It frightens me to think of the state of the art of learning int he world if everyone had YOUR driving curiosity."
People... life isn't some bargain, and neither i progress. You don't just hope for things like this... you have to PAY for them, and hope is not something you can pay with. Sure you can hope to pay for it, but what good does that do? It doesn't actually make you DO THINGS, and it doesn't bring the PAY to you.
Everything comes with a price.
-You may have a cellular phone; but you lose privacy.
-You grow up from the physical small kid that you were, but now you can't hide in small places anymore (You're too big).
-You may try to conquer the air, but the birds will lose their wonder and the clouds will smell of gasoline!
Other writers like me try to take people to hilltops, where you can look down and see upon things that occurred or will occur or even could occur in reality and in fiction, and express in alternative methods and ways, but for this insight and for this knowledge... we must ABANDON these one-sided views and preaches about optimism.
Think with your HEAD... not your Heart, and realize the possibilities and probabilities of things. That's thinking realistically, not optimistically. Optimism only equals a small part of reality, but not the whole thing.
The Character
First things first, everything begins with creating the character, or in the case of fan fiction you have to know the protagonist's established personality, one big amateur mistake is composing a romanticized or demonized version of it, without regarding the source material. This is dangerous, because from the very beginning you are already biased, this will muddy scenes and the narrative onward, not to mention you will earn the harsh remarks of the fans by falsifying, exaggerating or simply despising their characterization. You have to work with the elements established, before you can subvert or repair it .
The source of material may not be of that much importance, as usually, people tend to rewrite the sources in ALTERNATE VERSES, this way they can easily design a whole new world and not have to contrast much of their own desires with the.
Some stories make it impossible, the way things are in the original verse, for things to happen, unless you go back and CHANGE how things were.
The Protagonist: is the main character, not necessarily a good guy, but the most important person in the story.
No questions here.
The Antagonist: is the opponent, that stands against the protagonist, not necessarily the bad guy, but a person who can change or learn something.
Not all evil villains are meant to learn something and suddenly reform. In fact there are far more villains out there who are KILLED than those who are reformed, and it seems to me to be the majority of what most people pine for.
A Round Character: is a person, who is multilayered with a life-like charm, has convictions and dreams.
But then, wouldn't that make them a stu, because characters who are Jacks of all trades or have many astonishing abilities and accomplishments are often subjected to ridicule (I speak form experience for having made a well-rounded character from my 7teen series, even provided him with full explanation, but the people refused to accept and continued to be rude)
A Dynamic Character: is a person, who uncovers a part of themselves, allowing them to change for better or worse.
to many changes in a character can lead to over-development, and therefore having to create too many new things, while and at the same time abandoning their past. (what they were no longer matters... or does it? You don't know because your have too many characteristics)
this is a problem I have with Twilight Sparkle: she is far too over developed, has too many personalities and traits, so it's hard to determine who she really is... JUST THE ONE THING. All I want to know is what she really is and KEEP it that way without much change over the course.
A Static Character: is a person who develops very little in the coarse of the narrative, they are the same from beginning to end. This is unavoidable if you have multiple characters, accompanying the protagonist, but a good writer can develop the whole team. If one is up to the challenge...
But developing the whole team would just make them all the same, same attitudes, same beliefs, same liking. and some times there may be far too many characters to balance out... you must keep them separate from one another. "One trait for ONE character"
A Flat Character: is a concept, not a person. It is one dimensional, and lacks a conscience between one or two traits. The thing is, we are told why this character exists, but the details on how it was sculpted is so incomplete, we wonder why it exist in the first place?
It exist because some people PREFER it that way, and some stories, the way they are written is focused on the background plot, not the character's development.
Like in Power Rangers, the overall concept of the plot is to fight the monster and save the day. What happens in between is nothing more than a mere subplot to FEED the main plot, but it doesn't really serve any other function than just be mere padding and filling.
Plus, again, you don't want to overdevelop the characters and make them hard to label!
The protagonist you shaped, whether original or borrowed, must come to life, give them hopes, dreams, flaws and a personality.
No, they mustn't... not really. They must act to YOU specifications. the way you designed them and the way you want them to be so the plot can flow the way that YOU desire it.
Doing otherwise, may not only destroy the plot and take away from it's coolness, but it can also take away your dignity for not standing up to what you believed in, and your inability to make things happen to your standards!
Creating a flat protagonist that lacks depth beyond one to two traits, will leave your audience wondering why the story is following him, when there are others who are more interesting than him.
Interest is another way of saying "YOU LIKE" it's all a matter of what YOU LIKE about the characters. You like it, you like it, you don't then you don't... it's as simple as that. Sometimes the development won't change your mind... you'll still either LIKE or DISLIKE.
This will mess up the narrative if the audience doesn't know him beyond a limited set of traits, there will be no engagement, and won't worry when the character faces adversity, or worse if the stagnant protagonist moralizes without a warrant of merit
If they can't figure it out, that's their problem. Maybe they're just not reading properly or understanding the actual things. Maybe they even missed a few parts (No one is perfect when it comes to reading) worst case scenario: they could be deliberately skimming and therefore missing or refusing to acknowledge the information given, or even ponder about it and CONSIDER what it means.
bottom-line... it's their problem, not yours! (If they wish to be ignorant after all you try to do to explain... that's also their problem, not yours)
The story should be about the transformation and the growth of the main character, which is more important than the desire of the character is “character development.”
No it isn't. All stories do not have to be that way. Transformation and growth of characters are just TWO concepts. Just two... they don't spell out the entire community, nor are they the center of attention. The charcters might even develop into something you don't like, and therefore will lose respect over, leading you to loathe the entire concept.
Sometimes, it only takes ONE ROTTEN APPLE to spoil the bus-shell.
In order to achieve this, you have to write about a character the reader cares about.
But then it's their way... not yours. You just went against your own beliefs and what you stand for... that costs you major points in the dignity department. It also proves what a pushover you are; letting other people tell you how to do things instead of listening to what you want.
It is your story, not theirs.
You will begin to evoke emotion once the protagonist earns the adoration of the audience, only then will they start understanding what the character feels.
Not always they won't. If the character doesn't meet my standards or doesn't do as I wanted it to, I will regard them as worthless. Begin to hate them, like being betrayed by a friend, and maybe seek punishment (Bash fics)
Some characters are only viewed perceived by merit and that merit only comes one source... YOU. How you see the character and how you view them (It's only your own opinion)
-It doesn't matter if the character gets good grades, has a job, or things like that. I'm more interested in his approach on things. How he behaves... only his attitude and the way he acts around other people and how he gets about in life. If he does something that displeases me, he loses points, maybe even gets an automatic fail... therefore I despise him, and wish him to be reprimanded for letting me down.
"I view you solely based on the merit I choose. Since you displeased me greatly, you are not worthy of my kindness, or bounty or anything I can provide for you. Not even your paycheck.
I only give characters breaks, rewards, and maybe A LITTLE development... IF I FEEL they deserve it. If I don't feel they deserve it... that's it.
(Beast Boy let go of Terra and moved on with his life instead of him and Terra ultimately getting back together)
*Me to Beast Boy*
I told you, you are judged strictly by merit, and as it stands... For what happened with you and Terra, I see you as garbage, and the entire Teen Titan series as well. (Good grades, saving lives, being a hero don't mean squat)
...You're worth nothing... you will receive nothing! (Nothing but my scorn and wrath)
The Desire
The decision is yours on sculpting your character's outward appearance, but if there's one thing you should know is that a character cannot come to life, without something to aim for.
But that which I character aims for is what YOU desire them to aim for. What you wish for them to have or feel they deserve to have, but then again why aim for anything at all. Sometimes it won't even given to you, even if you work it.
Look at Mooindancer, she was studying for no reason, not for jobs, not for interest, not for extensive knowledge... just studying. (Extensive knowledge is useless if you don't do anything with it. Even just wanting to HAVE it... so its THERE... is just silly and a waste of time.)
As Todd Mitchel puts it: “Characters must want something in order to be interesting.” But what is that something? There is no proper answer to this, that something is up to you.
aha, so it's agreed... It's not what the characters want... It's what YOU THE WRITER want.
The most important phase for this suggestion is step two: base that desire on an event that happened in their lives, it can be one defining moment that didn't feel substantial at the time, but it made them realize to recreate who they are.
Even if they realize who they are, it doesn't really change things for the better. Sometimes you can change too much that even you remember who you once were, you can never go back to that way.
Give your character a high stakes desire, that involves a lot of risks, but an intense reward. There has to be costs, that can perturb them to take action. They can either prevail or be overcome by the thirst, that they transform into another person entirely. This is what makes it interesting, your audience is at the edge of their seat, knowing that the cost is much greater then the reward.
That's ridiculous! It's only their attitude that describes who they are, and it's only when the obstacles RELATE to that attitude that can spark any interest. Other than that... it doesn't me on the edge of my seat, not interests me in the least! If anything it bores me... I want to get straight to eh point, not have it delayed so much that I have to wait so long for an answer (I can't wait forever... and neither can you)
Eventually we all grow old and we die... but sometimes, for some of us... the growing old part doesn't happen (Get the idea) Give me the answer... Get to the point, and get to it NOW!!
On the other hand, if they succeed in getting that reward in a believable way, that means they were able to see the rules, learn the rules, break the rules, remake the rules, and change the game. In real life these people are called the game changers, they are a lot more common than you think, they have inspired and moved people to take action. To achieve this result, you have to do A LOT of research.
Believable ways, as in repetitive boring old circumstances that are easily predicted, even in new characters. One illusion about certain stories and even life is "ANYTHING CAN BE POSSIBLE" Even if it's not likely, it CAN be there.
and sometimes, people have no say or no control of what happens to them, but that's life.
Kids didn't CHOOSE to become orphans, it's just HAPPENED to them.
You may seek help, but what if people just aren't feeling generous enough. That's a possibility, and there are people who refuse to help, or even provide the right SORT of help.
Put emphasis on the flaws, not their advantages. We as humans have that one personality trait that annoys others, including family. This one flaw can be the basis of the character's personality. Ambition is the highest form of desire, and we sympathize with a person who has big dreams and works to achieve it, even if it compromises their moral upbringing. Selfishness can be tied to ambition, so is stubbornness, or even bigotry, and many more. This can be a weakness and a strength at the same time. This is a reminder that we have similar flaws, that even if we achieve what we desire, but stepped on people to attain it, then what we're looking at is not a person, but something else, it can be a monster or a great empire builder that history vindicated. This is scary, but this tells us that ego can lead us to places, perhaps a firery pit in the afterlife. Again reality is neutral, it's up to you on how to weave your story. Your character is human, they make us admit the bad part of ourselves, but they can also make us realize who we are in the light, and this is equally as strong.
Perhaps, but the more flaws you have, the weaker you are, and it doesn't matter if you can overcome them. Sometimes, flaws are there to STAY, meant to KEEP you from advancing or achieving.
Sometimes, things are the way they are for a reason... and if you go making changes that shouldn't be made, you could end up in a whole mess of trouble
And then again, it can to over-development, or making it look like a trait was FORCED onto a character, decreasing their likability and coolness (for going against something they were)
IE: I liked Moondancer for being distant with Twilight and rejecting her. She forgave and reconciled with her... she's garbage. (even what I liked about her doesn't get her back on her feet with me. You lose= you lost, that's all there is to it)
If the character does not act on his goals, then it is not a desire, but an illusion, a wish, a mirage of the future. This is something that he really does not want to say under any circumstances, but never gets it done, or has never started on it. no to,
I pretty much just went over that, and besides... ALL FUTURES are mirages. There's no way to tell what will happen for sure... remember, ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN (Consider ALL the possibilities)
and maybe the character WOULD want to say it, because the character is supposed to be portrayed as... He just DOESN'T GIVE A DAMN
Think of it this way, say your character wants people to “believe in themselves,” and he shouts the concept, but he lazes around all day, without going to speech lessons or leadership training. You noticed he had many opportunities to get it done, then the instance he turns a blind eye to the imperfections, but will accept anyone who agrees, and moralizes to who doesn't.
That's called MOTIVATIONAL SPEAKER. (I myself was one once when I worked for schools as a reading actor before my supervisor retried) My just is just to TALK THEM INTO IT, not actual do it myself. Heck, what I was really trying to get them to do was not repeat my own mistakes so they wouldn't turn out like me.
Also, even if you HAVE opportunities to do things, that's just the first step. HAVING the opportunity, but being actually able to TAKE IT and MAKE IT HAPPEN can be quite another.
Again, Progress is not a bargain, you have to pay for it... but the question is, even if you're willing to pay for it... CAN YOU PAY IT?! Do you have the power to meet the proper price, or can you afford it without scumming to financial danger.
an opportunity is not a guarantee you will succeed and actually get what you came for. It's a chance to HAVE a chance for it.
You have to consider... ALL the obstacles, all the paths, and all the possibilities.
Remember, there is a difference between POSSIBILITY and PROBABILITY (Just because it CAN happen doesn't mean it will)
Twilight Sparkle even said this on Rainbow Rocks (Which I actually agree with) "Just because people expect something from you, doesn't mean it's guaranteed to happen."
Subconsciously, your audience will pick up that the message you're spreading is not about inner strength, but to submit to your fantasies.
DUH... that's pretty the whole main reason for all these stories in the first place; making your fantasies come to life in story format REGARDLESS of most believable things.
Know this, what you write, speaks about what you do, believe, and how you would act in real life. This is true in fan fiction or towards poorly written young adult novels, the key is to subvert your preferences, in favor of exploring new possibilities.
That is by by the absolute stupidest notion I've ever heard (And in my opinion... people who think like that ought to get stepped on) What you write does not truly portray who you are, what you wish and all other things in real life.
If this were true, wouldn't all those movie writers want what they write to happen?
-Would Stephen King WANT people to get attacked by demons and ghosts and be bloody murdered?
-Would writers of disaster movies WANT meteors to hit Earth and wipe us all out?
Absolutely not! There is no excuse for that!
What you write in FANTASY does not reflect you in REALITY. They're JUST STORIES, and things YOU PREFER to have happen to characters rather than real people, but in real life is that how you would really behave?
I hate wedding in real life, but I don't want to hurt anybody. I don't want to crash the wedding, sick monsters on them or shoot up the place. I don't want any of that (Those are just stories I write up, and what other people write) In real life, I don't want to hurt them, and it be best if I KEPT AWAY from all that.
-Or that I don't use gays or lesbians in my stories. I got nothing against gays, I just find it a little strange that's all, but I would not taunt them, call them "Weirdos" or try to outlaw what they do.
...Seriously, judging people from what they write is pathetic. It's even worse than taking the BIBLE so literally.
The desire can become real by observing history, ask the question: how did the great men and women achieved it? And you'll hear stories like, from humble beginnings to upper-class living; from no name commoners to conquerors of nations; from hopeless sinners to anointed saints; from nobodies with agendas to tyrant rulers.
I'm afraid such a method does not work all the time. History can be looked, but it's more for ACCURACY, and you have to understand some stories about worlds OUTSIDE of our own. Our histories were not THEIR histories.
and just because you change yourself doesn't mean you'll earn my respect. If anything, I may regard you as worse! (It depends on the situation though, and it depends on my interests)
You have to pay attention on how people express themselves, look back at your past and write about what hurts, but also write about overcoming the pain.
And if you have to pay attention on how people express themselves, doesn't that clash with "YOU ARE WHAT YOU WRITE"
Remember, if the audience doesn't buy the emotional truth over it's decisions, then you'll lose their interest.
Actually, if the audience doesn't buy it... they're just morons. (Especially those who refuse to even accept it as fact)
Here is an example of reader's ignorance or blatant disregard for understanding...
By the way, only now did I realize that Talon was the older brother.
Really, but the story clearly said... She and her older brother Talon-Ted used to be really close growing up,
a. He's so pathetic that his little sister has to beat him to stop him from wasting his life
Oh, he may seem but pathetic, but sister is being an overbearing control-freak, wanting him to live up to HER specification. She wants HIM the way to live SHE WANTS HIM to live. That's not right under any circumstance.
Or his complaints about his little sister makes him incredibly petty, since he abandoned her alone in Ponyville, to fend for herself. Keep in mind the fic ended after he verbally smacked her, guilt-tripped her and then he furthered his manipulation by uttering he'll provide for her. *cough* narcissistic abuse.
The sister brought it on herself for begin so pushy and overbearing. In my view she deserved everything she got handed to her and more. Heck, I wouldn't want to live with her if she tried to keep controlling me. Just like I don't want to accept people's helps if...
a: they refuse to listen and understand
b: do not provide the CORRECT help I desire.
No, the sister got what she had coming to her, especially when she insulted him after he kindly donated money to the charity, but I guess that just wasn't good enough for her.
Just like when Mr. Collins discovered Wes' identity...
All his father cares about his money, and he'll do anything to get more, even if it means people might get in danger. He is blinded by his greed and stupidity. He even tries to get Wes to join his company, intent on using his ranger tech to boost profits. Natrually Wes refused and stated that he wouldn't have any part of his father's business, or his father in his life until he could learn to respect finer things! (which he eventually did, and that's an acceptance in development I can make)
As for Talon, it seemed all his sister or ANYONE cared about was what THEY WANTED, but what about Talon, what did he want? He wanted to keep his pride HIS OWN WAY. Without it he would hate himself and be very displeased even with any progress and fame he could've made.
The READER must be of sound mind... INTELLIGENT enough to be reasoned with, but I think I've already proven in many ways that some people REFUSE to properly read, or even read the fic at all, even if it's been changed and revised a little.
-You post up information easy enough for a 5 year old to understand, they don't give a damn. They either skim right over it, deliberately ignore it and the facts, all just to maul in a few laughs and hurts your feelings.
-You explain tot hem dozens of times how they are wrong and the truth being the things you wrote... and they still don't give a care in the world. Sounds like they don't care much for improvement or change themselves...
Just continue to ignore him and down-vote his works
It doesn't matter if he becomes a nice guy, I will continue to riff his works because I CAN and its FUN
Well, well... how will your story-telling methods help you now? the people don't care what you write or how you write it, they'll just poke and prod at you for the hell of it.
they're not readers, they're breeders! Breeders of hate, and discouragement, and you want to take advice form them even though they're trying to just set you up and won't care about any changes or improvements... they'll still mock you?
I don't owe my readers a THING, and if they have problems with my stuff... TOO BAD!
As for you honest readers... (If any)
The story writing methods just presented (both mine and said in quotes) they are just SOME ways of doing things, but they are not THE ONLY WAYS. There is only one true way to make a story... and that's YOUR WAY.
(Some acceptations apply, mainly due to mocking and flamming... AKA making the FALL OF STARLEET... or other versions of my own series. That's not right. they were just made to mock and flame me as a human and my characters. It's just a big setup for ignorant dummies... especially seeing as they are the only ones who actually care about it and comment it... also throwing in unwanted remarks about me.)
I don't really owe my readers a THING!
Case closed!
Hmm, doesn't really look closed to me.
Let's see...
Thing is, you're partly right. Anyone can create any story and no one has a right to disrespect it or give review.
At least, until it's published. When an author makes their story public, when he makes it so anyone and everyone can read it, then readers will criticize it. And if you can't forbid writers to write what they want, then wouldn't it be hypocritical to forbid critics from writing what they want? Trying to dismiss their opinions is only going to create conflict.
Then, you've just admitted defeat. Look, ignorance will last as long as humans do. You, on the other hand, are mortal. you'll die in less than a century. The winner is obvious. I'm sorry for you.
I haven't made my writing a war. I can't lose since I'm not in any conflict after all. I'd also like to point out, there are thousands of fics which don't get people going out of their ways to mock or deconstruct. I mean, it doesn't happen that often in fact. Either that, either I somehow keep finding all the fics that don't suffer from this (that includes the one I posted on fanfiction.net It's actually gotten about 40 likes and 20 favorites! I'm happy about that!)
When things stay the same, it's called stagnation. Stagnation was the downfall of many great empires. Sure, change can fail, but lack of change is certain doom.
On an individual scale, trying, while not a guarantee of success, it mandatory. You can't ever succeed anything without trying.
Not an insult, but, you've gotta be the first person I've met who has this opinion. I'm seriously wondering if you might just be the only person to have this view in the world. Really curious about that.
Well, you have this very pessimistic view about life. I'm not judging it or calling it right or wrong. But your view is all over your fics. I'm a very optimistic person. If you look at my favorite stories, they're either cheerful or possibly get dark but with a true happy ending. You write characters the way you believe real people would act. If they don't, then there goes your enjoyment of the story. And, for example, you consider Moondancer a loser for reconciling with Twilight while others (me included) view her as a winner for that. This is one indication of how different we are as people. Those differences can be seen in the way we write.
Of course, if you write horror doesn't mean you're evil or want to see people suffer. But it does indicate something about you... (and just to act all mysterious, I'm not going to say what!)
I'd say, respect. Mostly because it goes both ways. If you don't owe them respect, then neither will they.
Btw, I'm kinda one of your readers, and I do believe I have been respectful in my views so far, so, don't I deserve some respect in return?
Your words don't really show any exception, which would indicate you don't respect any of your readers, regardless of whether they do or not. Pretty sure that's not what you intended though. Might wanna correct that part.
It is. But as soon as you publish this story to random strangers on the internet, you implicitly allow them to give their opinion, regardless of how nice or rude or how well or poorly written it is. And critics have existed since as long as stories did so ending them is impossible.
4676533
Very well...
Objection: There is no room for being partial right or wrong in that situation. It's either ALL one or ALL the other.
And if you can't forbid writers to write what they want, then are there rules and regulations to follow? Or why even, regardless of site rules, why do people still act like they have the right to tell you how to write?
Trying to dismiss their opinions is only going to create conflict.
And not dismissing it will STILL lead to conflict in judgment. (You're letting them control you, tell you what's right and wrong. You didn't up for your beliefs= You are weak)
And again, there is a difference between criticism and being a jerk. (I've gone through that before)
Then I guess that means you lose as well, you're not perfect either, and no I haven't admitted defeat. I'm gonna keep going and do my share of the eternal battle as long as I can. I will not give haters and morons to satisfaction of quitting.
Then I'm afraid you have already lost. This is war where neutrals and pacifism will not be tolerated. think of it like this. In the old days. If you were drafted into the army, either you fought, or you were thrown into jail. Well, this time I'm stepping it up a notch. This is a war that will not end by any peace treaty or negotiation or things like that... it doesn't end up every single soldier on one side has been obliterated. Anyone who tries get in the way of that (Not wish to fight, or try to break it up) will most likely be destroyed (There is no safe place to run in a battle of this proportion.)
It's the way war goes... "Kill or BE Killed"
(Keep in mind I'm just using this as a demonstration example. Don't treat it like a threat)
Which makes no difference so ever. It doesn't matter if some fics are spared, the fact is others are hit. End of story.
I'm sorry, but certain kinds of change in my view are highly intolerable, sometimes unnecessary. I'll quote for you from a fanfic I wrote called BOUNTY HUNTER BEAST BOY.
More and more changes were happening. All of Jump city was soon to be made into the biggest BUSINESS RUNNING TOWN in America. The skate park is gone, the Arcade and Movie theaters are gone, even the Mall is being replaced with factories and business,
and the city park itself is bulldozed down to make a new parking lots. In fact, soon, no one under the age of 14 will be permitted to live iin Jump City as it is a WORKING TOWN. You must have a job, but not if you are too young
7 years later, all the changes left the city in decline and devastation, because people left, not liking the all work rules, and having no place to have fun.
Beast boy warned everyone "The city was fine before all these changes happened, but now you're costing the city it's soul." they wouldn't listen to him, so they got what they had coming, and I say well-served.
"Just because you Can doesn't mean you SHOULD It is not mandatory if it is a CHOICE.
There's a whole Anime based on this "Classroom of the Elite" They just put into words my feelings and wishes.
No, they act in ways that I WANT them to act, realistic or not.
It doesn't change my resentment to Moondancer, or how I feel about those who side with her (Not sure if I can trust them or not)
Oh, please... goth, punk, hobo, slob, neat-freak, wealthy, poor... they're still all humans, and all are capable of such thoughts.
Why should I give them respect if they never gave me any, and won't even if I try to give respect? I'm not the kind of guy who acts SUPER DUPER generous all the time.
It is they who must make the first move, not me!
Well, I don't insult you, and I don't wish hostilty on you (and unlike LegendBringer, I don't insult your mother) Does that count?
I gave proper explanations of why? Their bad attitudes and ignorance leave much to be desired or deserving of any respect
So the battle continues, and it will continue for all time...
4676592
I understand your points.
That said,
I object your objection!
Ok, I don't have much else to say, but I smiled while writing that sentence so I'm leaving it there!
No safe place?
Yet even you agree some fics are spared! I'd like to add, it's not some. It's the vast majority. Because flamers are a incredibly tiny fraction of readers, and even tinier fraction of humanity. A laughably tiny amount. Making it into a big war just gives them importance and makes them feel powerful.
That's why I refuse to fight. I refuse to play by their rules or give them any importance and I strongly advice you to do the same.
Of course they are! But, there will be variations in each of their stories. Such differences are due to the difference in each person. That's why, writing says something about the writer.
Your writing told me you were a pretty unique person with a point of view I'd never met before. After talking to you, I see it's all correct.
An eye for an eye makes the world go blind. Also, I do find that upsetting. I mean, why do people believe showing respect even to an enemy is a sign of weakness?
Respect is a sign of strength. I believe one who can respect everyone no matter what would be the strongest person in the world, and I'd do my best never to end up against such a person.
Besides, I remain convinced of humanity in everyone. And since flamers are human, they can be made to understand. Perhaps they won't agree, that's fine. I disagree with a lot of your opinions, it hasn't stopped us from having cordial discussions so far or showing respect to one another. I believe some patience and respect are the key in making people understand. Even flamers.
And if I can't, I'll just have to respectufully tear them a new one!
I meant that your sentence seemed to blame ALL of your readers, including me. I can see I'm not, in fact, one of the targeted people so I suggested correcting that sentence to make it more clear.
4676677
Objection sustained (Just to keep you smiling)
That's right... picture it like this... (this is not a threat, just an example) missiles, crashing planes, big explosions, they're going to go all over the place as the fight is that heated up. Most likely, town villages, whole metropolises will be destroyed either collaterally or maybe even deliberate.
The war does not end until one of an ENTIRE SIDE is defeated, and anyone who gets in the way, if they perish... so be it.
There is no safe place for you to be with the war going on. Kinda like in season 6 when all the prisoners were loose "You will not be able to perform the simplest task outdoors without being exposed to danger"
(I think I made the point, but again, it's just a fictional example)
If even ONE fic gets hit... that's the spark, and the fire is lit. (It is on)
Nope, the rules of war are just like even the wars of the past were fought, "Kill or BE killed" and like I said up there, this time it is worse... the soldiers will take no precedence of mercy for civilian life.
Example: Starla's father, he refused to fight. He refused to play by the rules, thinking he could make things better his own way... Result, he was instantly shot in the face and killed.
That's why I refuse to fight. I refuse to play by their rules or give them any importance= You will be destroyed (either shot on sight or by accident in an explosion)
Again, it's just a fictional example, but that's what I mean by, "There is no safe place... and pacifism will not save you this time" (If there is to be war, we must prepare the battle field... and the Neutrals will be the first things go)
...Pretty evil, huh?
Still doesn't make a difference to me. You are what you are by your attitude and your real life actions, not your thoughts. Thoughts, (No matter how pleasant or crazy or violent) they are just thoughts. You cannot condemn a person for thinking.
What you saw was a sign of my tastes and desires of fictional entertainment; things I prefer to watch or read about, or have happen to characters I know. Still, it is only a SMALL portion of me, you cannot define me entirely based on my tastes.
The world was blind many many years ago... now it's just Irreparable
Because, doing things like ignoring and refuses to fight are weak powers, they do not work as effectively as you want them to. Do you honestly think you can stop someone wanting to fight you by choosing not to fight? That doesn't mean they'll stop fighting, it just makes you an easier target, nothing to worry about. They'll still attack you or beat you up just for the fun of it... and you'll be in a real mess because you chose not to fight.
Also, people who show me respect get mocked as well. When Nicole Oliver LIKED this artwork I made
img00.deviantart.net/6420/i/2015/106/a/6/two_lost_lovers_by_dakari_king_mykan-d8pwfrb.jpg
My mockers and haters gave her a whipping (On the net) for supporting me.
It is A SIGN of strength, a SIGN, meaning a possibility, but will it even work... will it be strong enough?
It is NOT the only strength.
They can be made to understand, but the fact is they refuse, and I feel they are not deserving of respect of any kind.
As for your patience (Not-withstanding) they are admirable I must say, but I've had my share of people even like you losing their patience (You are not invincible, and you could very well break like the rest did... not that I'm trying to do that)
I doubt that's respectful...
There usually are no exceptions in things like this. It's very rare that an exception can or will be made, depending on the severity.
Well somebody is ALL at fault in some situations, and I doubt very much it's me, because I told you, I gave enough explanations (even A five year old could get some drift of things) but they choose to ignore, mock, riff and skip over things.
Brassboy212 thinks Celesto has sparkles in his hair (They're not sparkles, I gave the explanation, but he refuses to read or acknowledge it) It's not my fault as a writer, it's his fault for being a lousy reader and a very bad person.
4676734
I haven't see this war you speak of. I'm only seeing negative comments and flames by a handful of people. They're not soldiers, they're armed and they're not dangerous. They're just keyboard warriors whose fake bravery is due to their trust in their anonymity. A quick IP trace and their precious cover is blown. I won't dox them, that's disrespectful, merely present them their private information and threaten to sue. Here, I've ended the attack without fighting.
As for a real war, the treat of nuclear devastation is enough to keep everyone capable of starting such a war not wanting it. So I don't need to care about such a possibility because all the people who could trigger such a war have every desire to avoid it. War prevented!
Let me counter with a real life example: Switzerland in World War 2. They were as neutral as neutral can be. Guess what? They weren't the first to go, nor the second, third... They weren't even the last to go. Because no one dared try.
Based on my own real life example? Yes! I forced a bully to attack me in plain view of teachers. I didn't fight back. I didn't play his game. I even took a mean blow. One to the face, which couldn't be covered up. My wound healed in a few days. He was expelled permanently.
I refuse to fight, but I don't lose.
Of course not. I've never claimed to be able to judge people or know them completely simply by their writing. But it will show some clues to be interpreted.
Yeah, I can lose my patience as much as anyone. Knowledge of it does help reminding me I'm no better than others. Luckily though, I haven't really met much that could break my patience these days.
I don't need to kick them once they're on the ground nor make it seem like I despise them. I can just make it clear I assume there could well be a valid reason behind their own attitude but I cannot accept it when it harms me. Defend, incapacitate and show some pity/politeness.
Might even make them rethink their position. I prefer to remain hopeful
4677206
Which can be viewed as acts of war...
They might as well be, they seem to deem themselves as some self-appointed public avengers...
My point proven (A Warrior/Soldier of any type is just as SAME)
No it's not...
you think that'll scare them?
Actually you did was delay the oncoming, and besides, that doesn't mean they can't rebuild and strike again, and evading one attack does not end the war itself you know.
Kim Jogn Ill (Puppet) "Congraurations Team America... You have stopped Nothing!!!"
Changes nothing
Hence why I said/implied, this kind of war will make THOSE kinds of wars look like child's play
Well what if it was your LIFE on the line, not a simple beating?
No comment to that
Well I'm afraid I disagree... showing Mercy will only get you destroyed faster.
Either that, or it still doesn't change things... no what good intentions, great possibilities and potential lies ahead, protocol must be carried out. No ifs, ands or buts.
It doesn't matter if BB has the Titans as good friends, is willing to be happy, and is loved by many whom he saves...
He loses Terra... He loses his life (end of story)
Or even Esroh Dab in my Season 4.
It doesn't matter what he is learning about friendship, no matter what supposed feelings he is developing. He was sent to destroy them... and that's it. (Failure to carry out this order is punishable by execution)
anyways... why don't we stop it here. It's obvious we just can't agree (And I don't understand why you still have hope for a hopeless cause... Don't reply to that)
4677318
A child with a stick, or in this case a keyboard does not make a warrior nor a soldier. Saying they are like an actual soldier is one of the best compliments you could make for them. I prefer reminding them they're just children pretending to be more mature than they are.
I don't need to. Check law cases. I know for a fact I can and will win should I sue them, costing them quite a lot of cash. If they push the insults to far, they can even get jail time.
If they're scared, good for them, they'll avoid plenty of legal problems. If they're not, too bad for them.
Please do!!! I'll make enough money suing them I won't even need to work anymore! Besides, if they spend their whole time trying to attack me online, they can't be spending much time working. They money supply will run out. At that point, no money, no computer, no internet. There! I won!
And I'm saying I don't see that kind of war anywhere whether online or in real life. It doesn't exist yet and the situation of this world we live in ensures it never will (Mutually Assured Desctruction and all that).
North Korea is a puppet to the chinese. The reason they exist is because china, a nuclear power, will defend Kim if the US attacks.
And if Kim actually launches a nuke, The US THAAD defence will shoot it down and gleefully counter, since now the chinese, fearful of MAD, will stop defending north korea.
So there we have it. A pseudo conflict in which the first one to attack is garanteed to lose. They'll insult each other plenty but none will dare do anything against the other beyond that.
Make sure that recorder I have has it all on tape, run for my life, go to a police station and have the bugger arrested and sue his ass till it rots in jail.
We're different people who went to different lives. Disagreements are par for the course.
4677337
Rather respond to that (As we're just going in circles, it's not me admitting defeat) how about we stop here... It's obvious we just can't agree (And I don't understand why you still have hope for a hopeless cause... Don't reply to that)
In other words: “I don’t want a story with character development, plot development, substance, or happy endings.” What do you want out of a story?
There is a right way and a wrong way to write a story. There are certain rules that you have to follow. You cannot just have whatever you want happen. If you write a story that has no plot development, no character development, no substance, and is written poorly and has no editing, people will hate it.
You do realize that all stories contain conflict, right? The conflict can be external or internal. Internal conflict usually involves emotions. So you’re basically saying that all stories should only contain external conflict or no conflict at all because connecting to a character emotionally shouldn’t matter.
No, they won’t. No one is going to read a story if it has no character development, plot development, substance, and if it’s written poorly and looks as if it hasn’t been edited.
That’s because novels, especially the Harry Potter series, contain things that you don’t like, for whatever reason, such as plot and character development. You basically want a story that is all action and no substance.
Wrong. Again, there is a right way and a wrong way to telling a story. No matter how well a story is written, people are not going to be interested in reading it if contains nothing but filler and has no substance. It doesn’t depend on you the author. The audience plays a very big role as well. Your audience should be at the forefront of your mind when you craft a story. Write something that you know your audience is going to want to read, not just something that you yourself would want to.
You literally just said writers shouldn’t care about improvement.
You yet again showcase perfectly that you don’t get how characterization works at all. You’re basically saying that characters shouldn’t have humanity. How, pray tell, is your audience meant to relate to your character and root for them if you don’t give them any humanity? How is a character supposed to grow and develop as a person if they are happy all the time and never experience any sadness? Why would you want your character to be an asshole who shuns others and wants nothing to do with anyone because he doesn’t want friends? How, pray tell, is that a story? Where is the conflict? Where is the plot development? Again, all you’re saying here is that you want a story that has no substance, no character development, and no plot development. These things being absent does not a story make. These things being present within a story are what make a story a story.
A better question would be: “If you don’t give your characters any humanity, how can you possibly like them, let alone your audience?
Here’s a a crazy idea. If you don’t like what you’re writing, REWRITE IT! That’s all part of the writing process. You write, rewrite, edit, revise, and finally publish the final draft. My God, this is basic common sense stuff. Did you happen to sleep through school or what?
Why in the world would an author not want their audience to like what they’re writing? What would be the point of writing in the first place if you didn’t want your audience to like what you were writing?
What?
Do you know anything about writing whatsoever? Writers shouldn’t have their characters do horrible things if they personally disapprove of it? That’s basically what you’re saying, correct? What sense does that make? And, no, your audience will not turn against you if you disapprove of what your antagonist is doing. That is the point of the antagonist, to do things that the audience and by extension the author finds irredeemable. It’s why we love to hate villains like Darth Vader, Voldemort, Doc Ock, or basically any villain within the My Little Pony universe. That doesn’t even have to apply to villains. For example, The Green Mile has characters on death row for doing horrible things such as raping and killing little girls, but we come to like them because we see how remorseful they are for their actions. James Cameron’s Titanic has the villain trying to kill the two main characters at one point. By your logic, James Cameron should’ve taken this scene out of the picture because the audience might have disapproved of it, yes?
Wait, so suddenly you care about plot and characters? You’re basically saying that writers should only have their characters behave in ways that they approve of. Again, I have to ask, what sense does that make?
Uh, no. Crafting a story does not work like that. Before you can have a plot, you need to have characters. In order to have characters, you need to give them humanity in order for your audience to care about them. If your audience does not care about your characters, they aren’t going to be interested in going on the journey with them, regardless of how good the plot is. The plot does not matter in the slightest if your characters are crap.
In other words, things like Star Wars, Dragon Ball Z and the Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies must be a borefest for you because they contain a lot of dialogue and exposition and not enough action. Again, you seem to want a story that is all action and no substance.
Yeah, shit happens. Embrace it and deal. You cannot expect anything to get any better if all you do is walk around with a pessimistic attitude. Having a positive attitude and doing everything in your power to change your circumstances is the only way things are going to get better for you in life. If all you do is look at things from a negative attitude, things are never going to get better.
So, in other words, you’re saying that one should ignore the rules when writing and just write however they feel like regardless of established rules when it comes to writing.
Once again, there is a right way and a wrong way to write a story. You’re saying that one should ignore the rules when it comes to writing and write however they please. You have rules and guidelines that you need to follow when writing a story.
This is completely and utterly false. Where you got this idea, I have no earthly idea. Yet again, there are certain guidelines and rules that you have to follow when crafting a story. If your story has no plot development, no character development, no substance, is written poorly, and has no editing, people are not going to like it.
In other words, you feel you have no obligation whatsoever to fix problems in your story when your audience brings them up to you. That’s a great mentality.
It does? Really?
I don’t recall the series ever indicating that. Oftentimes problems were solved by talking things out (such as in “Amending Fences” and “All Bottled Up”), a simple explanation (such as in “Party of One” and “The Last Round-up”), going to an adult for help (such as in “One Bad Apple”) or not at all (such as in the episodes “Griffon the Brush-Off”, “Boast Busters”, “The Best Night Ever,” and “Feeling Pinkie Keen”, among others). Other times, the problem is solved with friendship lasers, particularly when there’s a world-ending threat on the loose.
And? So what? At the very least you tried like hell to obtain it. Yeah, sometimes life doesn’t work out the way you expected it to. Again, embrace it and deal.
On the contrary. This show has been responsible for preventing several people from committing suicide due to clinical depression. But people end up ruining that for them because they want to do nothing but bully and harass them for liking this show.
Again, were you paying attention to the show? This show tackled the subjects of death, depression, anxiety, war, stress, bullying, child abuse, self-harm, suicide, terrorism, racism, prejudice, peer pressure, among many others. And it didn’t showcase “the existence of unpleasant realities?” Bullshit it didn’t! We have a scene where a little filly is verbally abused in public by her mother. We have a little filly who’s no more than eight years old having to cope with the fact that her parents are dead. We have a scene where a young dragon feels disconnected from his species because he knows next to nothing about them. We have an entire episode where a yak struggles to fit in with pony society and ends up humiliating herself at a party. We have an old stallion having to face the fact that he disowned his daughter because she married someone that he didn’t approve of and both she and her husband died before he could make amends with either one of them. We have an entire nation that is struggling to rebuild itself after been terrorized by an evil dictator. We have a terrorist not only who’s most definitely a rapist, but who’s also guilty of kidnapping a pony’s friends and holding them hostage. We have an episode where a little filly struggles to come to terms with the fact that she’s physically disabled and may never ever fly like other members of her race do. We have an episode where a young princess goes against the established education system. We have an episode where a young mare struggles to overcome her stage fright, but doesn't. We have an episode where a young stallion struggles with depression and tries to find any amount of joy in his life. We have an episode where a young stallion struggles to become part of a family with a young mare and her daughter after their husband/father presumably died. We have an episode where a young filly is put in a serious situation that easily could’ve gotten her killed due to peer pressure. Hell, we had an entire season finale dedicated to " the existence of unpleasant realiteis." What was that again about how you said that this show didn’t showcase “the existence of unpleasant realities?”
Technology in Equestria is very limited. Your point?
No shit, Sherlock. Not a single person thinks that way. That isn’t realistic. If you want to be successful in life, you have to work your ass off in order to do so. This is one of the very first lessons we are taught in life, from the time when we are toddlers and learning to walk for the first time, to when we are in school and equate studying and working hard with good grades.
You talk as if optimism is a bad thing. You can optimistic and still have a realistic view on things.
See my above comment.
This only applies if you are writing strictly an alternate universe story. This does not apply to stories as a whole.
Uh, no. Did you not pay attention to what the author was saying? Having a multi-layered character means that said character has many facets, or sides, to them. The author said absolutely nothing at all about Gary Stus or a character having multiple talents.
If a character looks back on their past and decides that it no longer matters due to character development, that is a good thing. And I’m certain you meant to say “changes” instead of “characteristics.” “Characteristics” refers to a character’s features and qualities that define them as a character.
How is she “over developed?” Why? Because there are different qualities to her character? You’re basically saying that you want her to be a flat character. And since when does she have too many personalities? I don’t recall that about her character whatsoever, except for those couple of times she went cuckoo ala Pinkie Pie. I can define Twilight Sparkle in one word: bookworm. She has an extreme love of books, hence why she is billed as the smart one of the group. This is the biggest feature of her character. However, she is also neurotic, organized, anxious, dorky, nerdy, obsessive, yet she is also level-headed, a quick thinker, loyal, kind, and friendly. How does that make her a bad character?
No, it wouldn’t. Again, I have to question whether or not you have ever taken a writing class in your life. Developing your characters gives them different personalities, beliefs, attitudes, likes and dislikes. By making them all the same, you are not creating characters; you are just copying the same exact characters. And if you give your characters one and only trait, you are creating a flat character. This is why flanderization is seen as a bad thing.
Yes, because giving your characters one and only trait certainly wouldn’t make them hard to label at all.
Yes, you must. Giving a character hopes, dreams, flaws, and a personality are what allows the audience to connect to your main character, relate to them, and root for them. All you’re saying is that you want a character who has no hopes, dreams, flaws, fears, or personality. In other words, a flat character.
And a character behaves in a way that is connected to their hopes, fears, dreams, desires, flaws, personality, etc.
No, it doesn’t. Yet again, creating characters before you develop the plot is crucial. If your main character is someone that the audience can’t relate or connect to, they aren’t going to be interested in going on the journey with your character. By developing the character so that they feel like a real-life person, you encourage your audience to go with them on whatever journey they set out on.
You are literally the only person who cares about that. No one else does. According to you, characters don’t matter as long as the plot is “cool.” Again, no one is going to care about how “cool” the plot is if they don’t have a main character they can relate to and root for.
Again, I have to ask if you paid attention to what the author actually said. The author said nothing at all about gauging a reader’s interest. They clearly stated that creating a flat character is going to leave your audience feeling bored and wondering why they should care about said flat character.
Wrong. It is the job of the author to make the audience care about their main character. If the writer creates a flat character, then the audience is not going to care about anything that happens to him. This is why you need to develop your characters beyond just one trait. This is why you need to give your characters depth by way of giving them hopes, dreams, desires, etc.
[quote[No it isn't.Yes, it is. This is what’s known as character development. If your character goes through no development, there is no change. Thus, you end up with a flat character and no story.
Wrong yet again. How anyone would lose respect as an author or loathe the concept of character development simply because the main character developed into something the audience wasn’t expecting is beyond me. This is like saying that Stephen King should’ve abandoned Carrie because she went from a shy, quiet girl who was abused by everybody to a psychotic mass murderer and an arsonist.
What on Earth are you even talking about here?
Writing about a main character that the audience cares about is storytelling 101. If your audience doesn’t have a character that they care about, you have a flat character. When this happens, your audience is naturally going to get pissed off and complain. When they do that, you should take the time to listen to what they have to say and decide if what they say has any merit. Chances are, they are giving you constructive criticism and just trying to help you become a better writer. Again, I highly suggest you actually take a class on creative writing. You clearly don’t have a clue as to what you’re talking about whatsoever.
In other words, “This character should do what I want.” You literally just contradicted yourself. You literally just said right above this comment that an author should write the story their way, not the audience’s way. But that rule need not apply if said audience is you and only you. If an author does in fact do as you suggested and doesn’t do things the way you want, you get pissed off. Great hypocrisy and double standard you have there, mate.
And right after making a correct statement, you go right back to making stupid ones. So, according to you, a character should have no flaws whatsoever and should never ever make mistakes. If they do, they’re as good as dead to you. Do you have any concept at all as to how characters, or hell, people in general, work? You clearly don’t if you think characters shouldn’t make mistakes or have flaws.
In other words, you want flat characters that don’t develop.
And this was deliberately pointed out by the characters within the episode itself. This is exactly what Twilight’s problem was at the start of the series. Once she got out into the world and started to experience true friendship for the first time, she began to see that there was more to life besides just staying indoors and studying for the sake of it. Sure, we saw her studying from time to time, but we saw her interacting with her friends and the denizens of Ponyville much more often, such as in “Fall Weather Friends” and “Winter Wrap Up.”
It’s not supposed to. It’s supposed to be the character’s first steps towards their transformation.
And? How is that a bad thing? Why would anyone want to go back to the way they were before their transformation?
Wrong. It is not only their attitude, but their actions that also describe them as a character.
Please pay attention to what is being said. The author clearly said that it is the desire of the character, not their attitude, that relates to the obstacles in their way that prevent them from obtaining their desire.
In other words, you’re saying that you’re so impatient that you can’t be bothered with suspense, tension, build-up, plot development, or anything of that nature. You don’t care about plot or story or character. Yet again, all you care about is action.
Again, shit happens. Embrace it and deal.
Yeah, that’s life. Not everybody is going to be able to help. And what do you mean by “the right sort of help?”
So, in other words, if someone is an abusive asshole and they realize that they were an abusive asshole and they go against that flaw in order to better themselves and become a better person, by your logic they’re a bad character.
Moondancer had every right to be pissed off at Twilight. However, Twilight owned up to her mistake and apologized for it. You’re really saying that you think the episode would’ve been better had Moondancer rejected Twilight’s apology, slapped her across the face, screamed “Fuck you” in her face, and then proceeded to rape and kill Spike, her parents, her brother, her sister-in-law, and all of her friends, just in case it wasn’t clear enough to the audience that Moondancer is done with Twilight’s shit? If you truly believe that, then you have absolutely no business telling anyone what they should and shouldn’t be doing when it comes to writing. Your views on writing are as bad as Lily Orchard’s.
Yes, because that would make for a great character.
Based on your views, I shudder at the thought of you being a motivational speaker to a bunch of kids.
Why are you equating making progress to money? Progress is not something that you pay for.
No. Paying attention to how people express themselves allows one to write better dialogue.
No, but it’s perfectly okay for you of all people to tell authors to have their characters behave the way you them to. The hypocrisy is strong with this one.
In other words, you refuse to listen to anyone who doesn’t tell you exactly what you want to hear.
4676592
You care so much about what others think that you consider them giving you their opinion as “letting them control you?”
You’re really equating writing fanfiction and people giving their opinions on said fanfiction as war? I hope you realize how stupid you sound.
Yeah, because who cares whether or not a character acts realistically to any given situation? No. Just have them do whatever regardless if it makes sense or not.
4676677
Exactly. The best thing you can do is just ignore them.
4676734
No, it really isn’t.
Sure they don’t. Let’s not be the bigger person and ignore the people deliberately saying things to get a rise out of you.
4677206
Neither have I.
Same here. All this is is yet another sensitive snowflake blowing something out of proportion simply because their feelings were hurt.
4677318
No, it really can’t. Someone saying something that hurt your sensitive little feelings is not an act of war.
4677337
No, you woldn’t.
No, they can’t. They won’t go to jail simply because they posted something that you didn’t agree with because it hurt your feelings.
Exactly.
5649101
Hey, you started it, and you're escalating it with all these unnecessary insults... but you didn't have to. You didn't have to start commenting me back and forth, being rude, and demanding me to roll over and play dead because YOU'RE dissatisfied with the way I live, think, and breathe...
So don't blame me for it. It only makes you exactly what you tried to label me as.
Now, if you want stories with YOUR idea of 3-dimensional characters, with long arcs, and complicated backstory and emotional triumph... then you go right ahead and write them that way. You go accept all the praise, and glory, and so-called "benefits" they may bring you...
...But get off me!!