- Member Since 12th Dec, 2011
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Jest
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Jest
Joined 12th Dec, 2011 ·
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Damn I like this story a lot. I love the take on Celestia's radical ideas of mercy, as well as the 2 diplomatic circles where you can't harm or be harmed by spells. A lot of creativity and originality in this story
IF the Mane Six and Spike are somehow still alive in all of this, and learned of what happened. I highly doubt that any of them ( Including Twilight ) will ever talk nor ever forgive on what Celestia ALMOST did to everybody on the entire frickin planet they all lived in!!
Heck, I doubt many of her citizens/soldiers will "probably" forgive her either. Even if it's her "mercy" on her own ponies, that's just super F******* UP on immeasurable levels.
Heck, even if Chrysalis finally surrenders. The other races WON'T trust, trade, or ally with Celestia again, when they clearly know of what she almost did to everybody.
But, that's my opinion on thinking a hypothetical aftermath of this.
I mean, some war happening that has no effect on your life is like some abstract concept to most; Hell, even reading headlines "millions suffered" is like an abstract concept to my brain.
......
We're so fucked if this Celestia ever appears to us and sees what we done. lol
derpicdn.net/img/view/2020/6/21/2379994.jpg
Should've invested in that space program to escape to space.
. remember, they kill her sister and do a lot of bad thing. She also insult her race. I doubt Celestia would be good to the Changeling after the war
how about the ones watches but can't do anything?
yeah right, Chrysalis give her a resonable term, but she still want more
between going to be a slave for a madmare or death,i rather gone.
Well….that’s one way to stop a war
11309967
more like one way to win a war
11309957
We'll go to the one place uncorrupted by harmony... SPACE!
I cant follow this reasoning at all. evidently the ponies' problems are now everyone's problems, and somehow that's ok because chrysalis said the word ""win"" so she's wrong here?
To be fair, to have that kind of power and never get to use it is quite a shame huh
11310018
It simply illustrates Chrysalis' thinking, and how she veiws the total enslavement of billions as simply "winning" devoid of true context.
11310019
now upon rereading the story it looks like it was actually every single species that got enslaved and not just ponies, oops
(but what about the animals? undiscovered races/species?)
Made me think of this.
11309964
11309949
Coward, is what you are—trying to find a justification for everything. It's easy for those who have never suffered hardship to judge those with the hardest decisions.
The evilest thing ever is for good people to do nothing. There's always -something- that can be done, no matter how little. Take a gooooood look around at the town you live in, the tools you have, and the fact you are reading a fanfiction site instead of passing out from working a second job's third shift.
Freedom is the right of any sapient living being. Or did you just so happened to forget the 'BREEDING' line. Let's just take you and your whole family and rape them forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever .......
See ya you ignorant buffoon. You won't be missed. Notice all Celestia demanded was to set everyone free and to stop their lust for world domination. Hell, the quote's right here:
. No mention of slavery or anything for the loser.
Basically: Get rid of slavery, and get the fuck out, or you die.
Yeah. Yeah they will. Hell yeah they will. Let's analyze this:
Hey, your family and friends and even the neighbor's dog across the street just got saved from being worked to death, fucked to death, burst from babies to death, your babies aren't taught to be fucked to death,, everyone around the world got saved from a slow, and horrific death from being diminished into nothing more than a slave race, if not an outright extinction level event over the course of decades of not centuries. . . .
Or just ending the pain right then and there.
Yeah. Quick and painless would be preferred. They'll be lucky if the changelings aren't hunted to extinction after this anyway. Chrysalis has lost in every single possible way. Everyone dies, or every one of her species dies. . .
However, Celestia seems like the sort to . . . set things straight...-er.............. But hey, that's just a theory.
And this is an example of why no one messes with Celestia.
All the
s!
11310069
Such hostility. I don't know if your viewpoint here comes from hardships endured in your life, but I will say simply this. If this had gone the other way, an entire world would have been gone. It would have been the end of everything, including hope. Accept for apparently Celestia and Chrysalis.
Empires rise and fall. Civilisations arise, grow and disappear. Even if there is countless suffering, at some point the suffering might end. Or at the very least there will be a lot less of it. It might take many, many generations but no empire exists forever.
If Celestia had gone through with her threat though, it would definitely have been the end of the line. At least for this world. Of course, I can't know what my decision would be in this scenario. I have no clue what's it's like to live for millennia or have to make decisions on this scale. But with my current viewpoints and knowledge it seems to me that Celestia was the one to give up hope here. She was the one to decide, for every living thing on the planet, that there was no point in fighting had Chrysalis not surrendered. And from her own words it seems she was actually counting on that. In a way, isn't that the easy way out? Maybe she is the coward in this scenario.
Fuck me sideways this is what I like to see. You can make a great story out of this. A really great story. Maybe have chrysalis replace Luna now. Hundreds of years later the ponies forget the old one. But Celestia doesn't. I want to see what this world looks like after this plan works
Fantastic
Paul Atreides would have destroyed a star-faring civilization rather than surrender into slavery. This story scales it down to a planet, then cranks it up to 11. Celestia would destroy all life on Equus rather than surrender into slavery... It's jarring to see this sort of ruthlessness from Celestia.
It's a well-told story. Almost needs a Horror tag, but it's a well-told story.
Feels like this could be an offshoot of "Friendship is Optimal" in Celestia's win at all costs attitude, Like I get the fact of a protective mother being one of creation's deadliest foes, and this is probably just a "taste" thing rather than any comment on your actual story or you as a writer, but a complete destruction of everything feels a bit ham-hoofed of her. Like maybe after Chrysalis has gotten herself "cozy" in victory, she'd likely keep Celestia around as a toy, someone to brag at. Celestia could start a subtle campaign to get the quote-unquote "good changelings" to split away from the bad (like Chrysalis). I dunno, it's your story, this is just an idle thought,
Wow. Talk about Exterminatus. She was willing to wipe out all life as a last resort because she lost the war.
What's more terrifying is that other races and kingdoms don't know about it.
Equestria has a gun to there heads.
"Waaaaaaaaah no one will trust Celestia after this!/How could she do this!"
if you're thinking this or anything similar after reading, then you missed the entire damn point of this nice little story.
"Never compromise, not even in the face of Armageddon."
This story shows just why one should never compromise even in the face of certain death and defeat, either you die or you win against all odds, simple as. Although having access to magical invulnerability "diplomatic" circles certainly helps to take the risk out of staring downing the apocalypse.
I can tell why you wrote it like that, but it does feel like it cheapens Celestia's resoluteness by relying on this contrived plot device of a magic circle, even if I'm not certain as to how you would otherwise be able to explore this aspect without something to enable it as hard as the diplo circle did.
There's a comedic version of this concept Celestia vs. Garble. As for the breeding camps; very much like illithids (Mind Flayers) in D&D lore. They keep sapient species as cattle for a steady supply of brains/hosts. Changling ruled ponies would probably be plugged into love reactors Matrix style, kept drunk on love potion and illusion magic. Depends on how dystopian you want to go.
11310147
Yeah, admittedly a bit ... aggro. Long week dries up inhibitions and heats conversation. (Cooler heads and all that.)
You may be correct, but we've all been exposed to the heavy "never give up never surrender, freedom and liberty" and all that, from mass media, fantasy and fiction. Having been insanely fortunate to have been exposed to the world at large from a personal perspective growing up, it really depends on where you're from. Some would capitulate after a token resistance, others would fight to the last.
Hope, is both a powerful motivator... and a powerful poison. Dead to the last man, or death to a culture, a race, an identity. Would you rather lose your life, or have your identity stripped from you? Going from John Jacob Jingle Helmer Schmidt the 4th, to It. And letting your family becomes It. Or Its brood.
In the end its how much we as a people value the identities and society we hold up either as magnanimous truth, and from my heated tale, its obvious im biased to what side I'd be on.
Edit: The other guy down there got it. If I got down voted because if the aggressiveness, then fair, and justified.
I myself have never gotten the taste of such downright evilness, but I have assisted in pulling people FROM it and the fallout of such a thing. Indentured servitude turned slavery still very much exists, people.
11310069
Who are you calling a damned coward!?
Oh, and just NUKING the frickin world is a good idea? Look, I do get the whole world domination and the nasty slavery down on my head.
But, why didn't Celestia find a way for the sun to specifically target the Changelings!? You know, like a sun laser beam?
Or make a bio-weapon to specifically targeted them or something?
Oh, Hell No I didn't! You can't just say I "got it", when I haven't even responded back to you yet.
Don't think of me being unresponsive ( Until now. ), that I will just agree to what you're saying. Right after you made a mediocre "deconstruction" of my old comment, and also insulting me!? I'm definitely not on your side, after what you had said to me at least.
11310498
I was referring to Shimonsays...?
Also, another thing that I mentioned in my follow up response as well:
Pride. Just like hope. Another powerful motivator and an extremely powerful poison. Pride if anything is whats keeping a lot of society from advancing, never willing to accept if they're wrong because they don't want to accept a possibility like that. Like how you'd you'd rather disagree with someone because of an insult, versus taking logic and understanding.
Ex: Neil DeGrasse, he's a freaking assailed, but he's also one if the most brilliant foremost scientists in the world, but he'd tell me to my face im a fucking idiot. He'd point at you and say the same thing.
So if he found a cure for Cancer and premature death syndrome for babies, you'd rather he stuff it back into his throat because he insulted you?
(Hes not that kind if scientist but its just an example.)
11310578
Hmm? Well, you quoted my last comment. So, I thought you included me.
This was good. It wasn't great, but it was a good few minute read.
Funny how immortals do not need to follow the morality of mortal creatures.
Eh, this was more using two characters as vessels to carry out a moralistic argument.
11310713
Morality changes when viewed on a macro level.
11310714
I bet you're real fun at parties.
11310713
"Time not important only Life important" - The Fifth Element
There's a reason the dragons thrive where they live. Essentially heat proof and with a diet of basically rocks, older dragons like Torch probably looked up and said, "Ah, some dumbass pissed off Celly... again."
11310714
So, I may not be reading into it deep enough, but I don't think the story is trying to pontificate or argue a moral position at all. There are certainly Lessons, like don't piss in the Cheerios (or murder the sister) of the being that controls the sun. Don't play your hand when the enemy has an ace up their sleeve. An ace that ends the game in such a way that there is no winner.
You, the reader, are free to have an opinion on the behavior of the characters. You may even be free to have an opinion on the behavior of the author so long as you don't make it personal and keep the discussion about the story.
As for me, I hate it when the comments section is more incendiary than the story itself. Good thing this story gets a pass due to setting the world on fire.
11311736
LITERALLY... at least for a few minutes.
11311736
In some situations it's not about a choice between right and wrong, simply the lesser of two evils.
Guys, it IS entirely possible that both sides suck. Celestia and Chrysalis could both be bad ponies. There doesn't HAVE to be a "good guy" in a story.
11312366
this
Just because you oppose the bad guy, does not make you the good guy.
That said...there are some limits that cannot be tolerated, some lives that are better tossed aside, if only for the chance to spit in the eye of the one who put you there, knowing it would be your end. I'm not certain this is one of those times, but talk of camps certainly make one think...
11310018
In the end it isn't about good or evil. If the Changelings win everyone looses. So might as well pull the ultimate "Scorched Earth" approach and flip them off as you blue-ball them with the mother of all asset denials while getting everything to die, including yourself.
11309949
To a truly unselfish person... that is a fair price.
Again, the fate the Changeling's would have subjected the rest of the sapient species of that world IS worse than death. Being reduced to cattle after building cities and crossing oceans is an ultimate ironic HELL!
Seriously, there is a reason why the phrase "Death is better than bondage" is thrown around a lot. Because if history has proven anything to us, it is that being reduced to a RESOURCE will make you WISH they would let you die.
11312924
As much as I hate to say it; Good point.
Good story!
The premise reminds me remotely of this one:
- MLP: FiM
- Adventure
- Drama
There's a reason why Celestia never uses her true power.