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TCC56
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” - Patrick Rothfuss
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Stories like these, I can’t help but think of two songs that encapsulate what it means to be immortal. Naturally, both of them are Queen songs.
Also, perhaps Twilight’s problem is that she doesn’t know the question.
Well, I have to say, I love the emotions and messages of each of the participants. All characters, especially Rainbow at the end are very in character and have perfect answers for Twilight's question.
It's a beautiful message, however, as a story, I feel that it needed a bit more set up.
I could tell very quickly that Twilight was in a dream because there's no reason given for why they're meeting, and Twilight's question comes out of nowhere since we don't get any previous insight of her thoughts or feelings. This made me search for the reason of her question, so the mention of Rarity didn't escape me.
This could all be intentional, but it leaves the story feeling more like a lesson to the reader than a moment in Twilight's life.
Even so, it's a very good message for both.
Very well done :)
(42 or something edit: dangit, didn’t actually read title)
10928010
The long description starts with "in a shared dreamscape" so at least one part of the spoilered bit was in fact not supposed to be a surprise.
10928036
True, I was interested after reading the short-description so I missed that. Still, is less of the "surprise" and more of how it works as a story.
I personally agree with Cadance, but all five answers presented are equally valid. I imagine that, had they asked other mortals, some would also have responded with 'having faith in and serving a higher power'. Which I generally believe is no way to live.
10928055
And then Twilight explains that she was asking about her life, and they have an existential crisis because we haven't seen much hint that ponies believe in a power higher than the alicorns.
I wonder who's the love, again?
10928154
That last bit with Discord seemed to strongly imply that it was Rarity.
A very thought provoking story. My answer to the question asked would be: purpose. Life without it is meaningless. As to what it would be, well that would depend on the person.
10928036
10928048
If it helps any, in the original draft it was a surprise and I didn't give that reveal until the very end when they woke up. I eventually weaved some bits in earlier to hint at it/say that because it felt like an unnecessary twist - having that be a surprise didn't really add anything.
10928154
Purposely left vague-ish (because in the context of things, does it matter?) but yes. my two default Twilight ships tend to be either RariTwi or TwiBurst as a 'when in doubt' sort of thing.
Ooooh! Beautiful analogies, it was a pleasure reading
10928208
Ponies are better at this than humans, because cutie marks. The fact that immortality changes absolutely nothing about the equation is why Manehattan has a background alicorn (who showed up again in the clip show without fixing it, so he's canon now).
This was a very good one-shot.
Hmmm, 'greater than the sum of its parts', rings for me.
Or maybe just 'creation', this could be Rarity's IDEA moment, any foal (conception and/or birth ARE creation moments), Pinkie's party cannon going off, and more. The creation of art (or well done work) being admired by the viewer. It's all of the above and even more.
Like the Mane 5 or even the immortals, each slice given is true in itself but ... mix it all together and one approaches the real truth (maybe) ...
Or forget that destruction is also part of it, the circle of life ... to play ones part ... (there's a song there, isn't there, or more than one) ...
It was very interesting how you made Discord actually mature in his response. Not in a "speaking serious now" moment, but in the answer itself. How he used to see the world was pure hedonism, his own joy for joy's sake. But the addition of him admitting he was wrong in thinking only his moments that counted actually evolves that thought into an almost utilitarian approach to life: maximizing people's experiences (through joy). Very good stuff.
I sometimes wonder why people (Cadance, in this case) that subscribe to the usually comforting thought of the butterfly effect don't feel any bit of dread from it. Because, the inverse is also true, isn't it? Some actions can die forgotten, affecting absolutely nobody at all. It's unlikely that an act will affect nobody else, true, but as was said, "everyday a million things happen". It would be incredibly egotistical to think the only things happening in this vast number are all in-line with what you'd prefer happened.
Could just as well be that a stallion gives a slightly larger than normal tip, but the barista is so occupied with the other orders that she barely glances at it. That's not even touching on the worse alternative: the barista thinks on how her boss will take her tip and frowns unconsciously, leading to a string of negative events.
Celestia's ego-death is downright fantastic. Because it managed to both evoke a sense of eerieness, and comfort. She outright states that she is fundamentally different from her little ponies (which is chilling when taken at face value), and yet she completely relies on them to give meaning to her own life. It's a daring assertion, considering she has immortals who she considers family sitting right across from her, and yet she still puts the meaning of her life on mortals. Luna's total disagreement of that opinion makes a lot of sense.
Ah, and Luna. It's difficult to comment properly on her, because this is a topic that is inherently subjetive in nature. The "right" answer is not something that can be settled, and the story touches on that later on. However, even though the answers themselves are personal, the aspects that an answer needs to have... are not ("What's your preferred taste?" "Purple."). What you derive the meaning of your life from should at the very least be consistent with, well, life. To base your life's meaning on something that is incoherent with life is to open yourself to an array of future problems (especially when that meaning is challenged by the problems of our day-to-day. Inconsistency invites defects).
That's the mistake Luna makes in her universal assertion that "the work is lesser without the artist". Cadance, bless her smart thinking, spots an inconsistency in that line of thought and presses it. Luna justifies it again with "there is a bond between an artist and their work that no observer can replicate". But with that answer, Luna just moved the inconsistency to another step in her logic. And that step is demonstrably untrue:
"An artist is bored. They pick up a couple of paints and slather them onto the canvass. It entertains them for a while, but ultimately, they get bored again. The painting is thrown out the window, completely forgotten by the artist. A passer-by, however, happens upon it and is just floored. They adore the painting. They pick it up and spend the next year of their life analyzing it. Documenting it. Restoring it where it flakes and fixing it where it breaks. They bring it to a museum, and get a job explaining that piece of art to newer generations. The original artist, unknown to everyone else, died long ago."
Now, is the work lesser without the artist that forgot it even existed? Was there a bond between the artist and the art that this observer could not replicate? Or did the bond the obrserver forge on their own become even stronger and deeper than that of the artist?
Funnily enough, in that hypothetical, the observer is the one who Luna would have to admit is "pouring their soul into a piece of art". The original artist, though? Irrelevant. Could be anyone, any name, any face, any background, any philosophy, any soul.
These are questions that, no matter how subjetive the end-goal, Luna's meaning ignores.
However, it satisfies her, so it's not a problem... except this type of satisfaction edges too close to "ignorance is bliss" to be healthy. You could say Rainbow is also doing an "ignorance is bliss" bit, but on her side, there are no assertions. Rainbow does not dare give, nor seek, an answer. Luna, however, does.
Basically, having no answer is an acceptable stage of life. Having an answer that ignores its own flaws in reasoning would be a stage you want to move away from as fast as possible.
***
I don't know if it was intentional or not, but having the two most "mature" opinions on the meaning of life be given by the two most experienced beings in the story was a very nice touch.
This was a very pleasant read that tickles the brain just right. Very good job, TCC.
I honestly thought this was going to have a comedic ending with twilight simply responding with, “life is… 42.” Leaving the rest in stunned silence.
This was (in my opinion) a better and more introspective ending but nevertheless it took the wind out of my sails to not hear anyone answer with, “42.”
Regardless, beautiful little story! I’m glad to have read it!
10929669
Hello. Why "42" ? Is it a reference ?
10929837
It’s a reference to Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. Where the underwhelming answer to the question of the meaning of life is just that, the number 42.
10929867
Hello. Okay. Thanks a lot, I understand now.
10929905
This is found unsatisfying by the civilization who built the supercomputer that figured out the Answer, so (at its suggestion) they build an even bigger supercomputer to figure out the Question to which the Answer applies to. Shenanigans ensue.
10929981
And similarly, Twilight reaches the end of this story unsatisfied with the answers she's gotten.
See, I can do subtext damn it!
10929981
Okay, thanks. I didn't know that at all Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. I think I'll do some more research.
Here's my question. Why Rarity? I get Twilight asked because she was in a relationship. But the pony shaped marshmallow seems to be the one who's in that spot the most.
10931273
You have no idea how hard it was not to insert that joke somewhere in this.
Brilliant meditations on that fundamental question, each wonderfully true to the speaker. And Discord may have the right of it. Who you are tomorrow may not be who you were yesterday, and each may live for a different reason.
Thank you for a fantastic read.
There are also two that have their own questions inside them to answer in this:
Discord has the hint of it. The grey hairs. The coming end of the one pony that had the greatest influence on his constant of a life. The one that trusted him, when no pony else would...
Cadance. Who will one day stand, and know the stallion she grew together with like that apple and pear tree on the Acres has passed on to the shadowlands; and has to support a sister without a brother, and a child without a father...even while her own division is raw and painful, and the support she had grown together with is now missing...
The worst curse you can inflict on anyone...
Immortality...
I'm making my very first attempt for Comment Club, so here we go!
So! Wow!! What a heavy read! This wasn't heavy in the sense of emotional heaviness per se (death, suffering) but it felt very heavy in a more academic sense, if that makes sense. It felt like several senior professors pontificating on their various fields of study, and so it was a little stiff to get through at times, simply because it kept going. But I think that was purposeful, because it felt very serious, and very weighty. So you succeeded in that! (And Discord's little highlights of silliness helped to break up the lectures!)
I can't say I loved Discord stepping in at the end to be all 'oh, you silly ponies!', give a head pat, and then teach them the final moral; but then, I kind of lowkey hate Discord and his pretentiousness, so you made him more tolerable than normal! I loved the references to his impossible drink, the lips being shushed by an extra hand, shrugging too many shoulders, silly little touches like that!
The only thing that confused me a little bit was Cadance pontificating with the other immortals; three of them have been immortal for at least a thousand years, but Cadance is considered equally greyed and wise because she became an immortal like, a few years ago? (Even though we are clearly having this conversation several years past the series end, it sounds like.) I liked that it finished with her hugging her sister in law (a reminder of her status as a young immortal), but it did feel a little bit out of step, knowing how young she is comparatively.
I think overall this is a wonderful read, and it's a very interesting take on what a round-table discussion might be like between many immortals. You really nail the very 'senior statesmen' type of writing voice for them! I like that it doesn't drag on and on into tens of thousands of words; they each make their point, very elegantly, and then they try to help Twilight Sparkle with her conundrum. (And then her friends try too, in their much sillier ways!) And if the answer turns out to be something as simple as 'Try Again Later', then that's an acceptable answer, too. Great job!
Howdy, hi!
Okay, so the setup for this is really interesting. I love how you characterize each of the characters in such a way that how they feel is the "answer" is radically different from each other and feels canonically like what they would say should this ever be asked of the characters in canon. Each was a truly unique perspective and one that really gets you to think over their answers and wonder about the possibilities.
This was an absolutely delightful philosophical read that I am blessed to have had the opportunity to indulge in. You really surprise me every time with how meaningful your fics can be TCC.
Thank you very much for the read!
I read this once.
I am proud to say that as of this reading, I have read this story six times. Seven, if you count this one.
A delightful read everytime I come back to it. Musing on the meaning of life, giving the characters something new for us to think of them about.
I also do love the shared dream idea - it was never explored after that Tantabus episode. It's really an intruiging idea that leaves me to wonder - can it be used in some other manner?
you do a really great Discord here and throughout, as i expect from you at this point!
ooh, i really like this line by Luna. it's the kind of line i would like to write for her
i definitely feel this a lot, after my experiences of writing fanfic and seeing how it was received. there were a lot of precious moments of deep connection with some of my readers, but by its nature none will be able to understand it as fully as i do because then they would be the exact same person as me. it's something that's given me a lot to think about.
oof, love this bit too. the perfect level of understatedness, very well done
and a really nice melancholy to end on. not a resolution, because there is no such thing for this, and no easy answer. just the inevitable loss and pain that we all have to deal with, if we are so lucky.
i am truly honored that a work of mine had even the tiniest hoof in the inspiration of a piece as beautiful as this. thank you, Tempest!
A thought-provoking piece.
Twilight’s dilemma hits very close to home. No, I’m not having late-night existential crises. It’s more of a thing that I’m searching for that will not come overnight, but will only come through tears, fears, regrets, and doubts. Much like Twilight finding her life’s meaning.
Beyond that, it provokes even more thought- an answer from each pony and draconequus, four respective, all with varying degrees on an intangible spectrum. To wrap it up nicely, a setting crafted from the moon princess herself, so as the question could go unhindered and undisturbed.
No doubt that the deeper concern that Twilight must’ve had while pondering this question is the realization of her friend’s mortality- since she has picked a meaning, friendship, does that mean that when her friends pass, that her meaning is lost? Only she can answer that question.
But I feel like I’m only scratching the surface of the many meanings that one could take from reading this. A droplet in a bowl, meaning nothing and something, if you will.
For me the meaning to life is to record. To capture the moments as I understand them so the future may also understand now fully and hopefully that helps them create Thier tomorrow better. So in a way it is to be a teacher, in a way it is to be an artist, in a way I am a bowl filling others enjoyment and growth of my work (even just the potential) is meaning, and also in a breathe it is carpe diem with recording and capturing tiny moments of life to relive, and I pray my existence is a butterfly wing for a distance future being created. 42 is just to find the equation at all.
A must-read. Luna (and to some extent, Discord and Cadance) resonated with me the most on this. The deviations into more haunting prose were very much appreciated. Not enough stories on this site carry the kinds of unsolved, existential elements that drive me to keep reading. Each character offered a fantastic, true-to-them piece that helps -- but it isn't an easy solution or a definite one. Discord points this out well. This mythic edge is why I write and read pony stories, and it's something absent in many fics on the site lately. Thank you for capturing that.
11523786
That's probably the thing that made me the most happy about this story and the biggest sign it was a success: in both the comments and in discussions, I've gotten a wide range of which characters people agree (and disagree) with.
11523847
Mhm, I’d honestly be surprised with people who agree with Celestia or see her as the one with a beyond mortal understanding of life when her view has some (fitting) codependent undertones.