While enjoying a quiet evening at the bar, Bon Bon and Lyra are joined by two new faces. A changeling and a kirin, visiting Ponyville on vacation. The two ponies are happy for the company. After all, changelings are just like ponies, and apart from being all female, kirin are too.
Right?
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A nice little slice of life :)
this is such a sweet read, and you explore/explain the gender concepts and constructs in individual species' society's incredibly well! and rainbow's statement in the very end was a massive crackup. thank you for the read! :D
Ooooooh.
Ah, fun with fantasy biology. Always makes for a good time, especially when everyone can approach the subject respectfully. Nice work.
Interesting.
There are only two genders.
They're mine. You can't have any
A cute fic
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We don't need your genders! We'll make our OWN gender! With blackjack! And hookers!
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MOM SAID ITS MY TURN ON THE GENDERS!
And please note the two genders are bat or not bat.
....
i.imgur.com/p368xxK.jpg
GOD AND THE BABY JESUS HAVE FORSAKEN US! WHY DID THEY PUT THE WORLD IN HIS HANDS, HE'S A BABY, BABIES CAN'T HOLD SHIT!
Mm
Maybe it is, but "not in plain sight" enough to keep it "hidden" from most ponies.
I believe the second part. But only the second part...
That's the default explanation for almost everything weird in Equestria and beyond...
And the worst thing is it actually makes sense.
Good story!
I enjoyed reading it.
This was a nice story, and good job with those two OCs. It was an interesting exploration of how gender works with kirins and changelings, and you did a great job making things awkward but still recoverable.
Changelings are Geth confirmed
EDIT: Fixed the embed
"I'll bet you say that to all the mares."
I really like the idea of gender as resistance among changelings. :)
This is actually... incredibly confusing. I've never heard of a single-sex species, and can't imagine how one would work. If they have no fixed sex, what would be the point in having them developing any capacity for gender like a species where fixed sex (and gender correlation) is generally pretty important? While the changelings are well-explained and make a lot of sense here, the kirin biology is very hard to grasp. Is Holly supposed to be non-binary and intersex? Only one or the other? Something else? Are they genderless due to the nature of their species and only able to regard it as a costume of sorts others have that kirin do not?
As a trans reader, finding stories like this that either loop around or seem to gloss over whether a character is trans can really rob me of immersion because I tend up stuck on what the author is trying to convey about the character.
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All very valid criticism. I think I waffled quite a bit on how exactly kirin biology worked before deciding that I didn't really want to spend too much time on that aspect of the story. As necessary as it is, I think 'biology' is usually a bit of a bummer to sift through while talking about gender.
There are a few arguments I could make for kirin having gendered identities without any kind of sexual differentiation—they can communicate with other creatures on the show, which means presumably either their culture or language has history in common with ponies. I think I also originally speculated that their nirik forms were sexually dimorphic but those features only settle in after puberty, meaning sex follows gender for them rather than the other way around.
And on your last point, I definitely get that, and as a reader I'd probably feel the same. I conceptualized this fic as being a way to flip the script and put cis characters in a situation where they'd need to explain their identities to a status quo that doesn't understand them, but in the process you could argue that I ended up with an entire cast of cis characters, which is a bit unfortunate. As a trans writer myself, I've always found it difficult to find a balance with feel-good trans rep. Too realistic and it's hard to keep things cheerful, but too utopian and it's hard to even communicate trans themes because so much of queer identity and culture are explicitly in response to cisnormativity. Hopefully I'll manage that balance better in the future.
Thanks a ton for reading and for the feedback.
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One thing that comes to mind is Ursula K. Le Guin's novel The Left Hand of Darkness where the population of the planet is ambisexual and only display sexual dimorphism during a reproduction cycle.
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Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with that book. However, looking up that definition fits the intersex-ish depiction of kirin here, at least as far as I'm reading into it. If the author wishes to correct me on their intent, then that would be well-received.
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Considering how immensely helpful it is, I'd probably think about it before getting started on the next fic. The possibility of transness and other biological anomalies in other sapient species is something we aren't lucky enough to observe in our world. Knowing the fundamentals you want for your world-building, even if you don't always use them, is always something safe to do.
I've always found it especially helpful, but that sounds like it's more of a me thing. It helps me with understanding some fundamental Trans Trade Secrets while being able to shape where a character might be at in their transition.
I always took that to mean 'hey they can at least communicate' with ponies, but I don't recall more than a couple of kirin being referred to in any gendered sense. I'm sure all manner of reasons could be given why they don't appear sexually differentiated, or maybe they're a sort of third sex species. Maybe one without any real indicators. But yeah, I just was having a hard time trying to understand if the kirin were androgynous, since there are still ways to suggest a character's sex/transition/etc without resorting to being invasive or giving an unethical moral.
It would be super interesting to see a story handle how a species like that could work and really ground them in the world. Is there any hope it could/may get written?
I wouldn't say that is the case. If the kirin are meant to be read as third sex/third gender in their makeup, they really skirt the line between cis and trans, especially because being trans is dependant on biological mismatches occurring. I mean, isn't it only 1 in 200 people who has an intersex condition? At least, I think it was the last time I remember reading so. That would mean that most people have pretty good wiring, so to speak, and that an evaluation of the sex makeup of a nation would show a cis majority just because of how sex would work, and that intersex conditions in humans/sexually dimorphic species tend to be flukes/anomalies/non-functional, albeit harmless ones (if I am remembering this right). I'd say justify was the wrong word to use here, since this story really combines themes of alien biology and also trans characters on top of that. Lyra and Bonbon are best explained as the former, since they exhibit no indication of the latter. Seeing foreigners being fascinated by it makes for a wonderful slice of xeno-fiction, but the way you might have mentally framed it sounds like it might have been in need of some ironing out? Still, calling kirin and changelings "cis" in here doesn't seem to make much sense, and if they were, it wouldn't be a problem. The story was still well-written, the confusion being the only issue aside.
At least, that's just if I'm reading things right.
Oh cool! Lad, lass, or enby?
I think there are really good ways to convey personal anxiousness and struggles inherent to the individual that is guaranteed with dysphoria without venturing into total real-world cut and paste. If you need some fanfic recs here, I could probably find some. Even then, I've seen some more creative examples for why ponies might have certain prejudices humans have, but to different extents and for different reasons. Though, it probably wasn't what you were going for here, in a positive bit of short fluff and fun.
Thank you for writing this! There aren't a lot of enby characters that are in pony stories, and this was a blast. I'm so used to seeing "trans = mtf" both online and off. Seeing something different really makes my day.
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I've actually read The Left Hand of Darkness. It's an interesting book, and surprisingly relevant considering when it was written. I believe Ursula K. Le Guin is on record saying that she would have written the aliens in question with they/them pronouns if she'd been aware of that kind of gender neutral language at the time. That wasn't really what I was going for here, since that species is both genderless and sexless, but definitely along the same lines of speculative fiction about alien gender.
I'm nonbinary, and relatively recently cracked (a year or two ago) so I'm still figuring myself out. You know how it is.
I personally find the social aspects of transness more interesting than the physical. The 'why's more than the 'how's. That probably reflects how I feel about my own place in the community more than anything.
But you're right that I should have at least mapped it out internally. You probably wouldn't know it from this fic, but I'm not much of a world-builder usually, so I've mostly let those lessons pass me by.
They all share the same basic model (except the big one) and I believe there's some behind the scenes audio where the voice director says that they're all female. That was part of the inspiration for this fic, since I heard that and thought, "that sounds like some cis shit, let's find a more interesting interpretation."
I don't know if you came to this fic from PresentPerfect's review, but he's dead on about this narrowly avoiding being a headcanon-dump. I still like the final result, but it is pretty tell-y and I'm not confident in my ability to pull the same off again. I'd be thrilled if someone else took that bait and handled it better though.
If you're interested in some lit that's sort of along those lines, you should check out Neon Yang's The Black Tides of Heaven. It's an East Asian-inspired fantasy novella where everyone is considered genderless until toward the end of puberty where they decide their identities and effectively receive magical confirmation therapy. It's a quick and fun one, and written by a nonbinary author.
I guess it depends on how you define being trans. I'd argue that saying it's dependent on your identity being at odds with your birth sex only really makes sense in the context of a species where the default is that male = XY and female = XX. Changelings (at least in the canon of this story) can just change their entire bodies however they want, so does someone stop being trans when they transform? And in kirin society, gender is entirely identity based and they have only one sex, so what biology are they transitioning away from or towards?
If you instead define it as not identifying/transitioning away from the gender you're assigned/expected to perform by society, then no one in this story is trans at all. Kirin are expected to pick their gender however they please, and changelings are expected to be genderless. In that context, Thorax and Ocellus and any other changelings who identify in any kind of binary way are the trans ones. Holly and Sternite are only abnormal from the ponies' perspective.
You're still very correct about kirin not quite making sense either way, but maybe I was subconsciously avoiding doing the same thing as Le Guin and making them both sexless and genderless. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Like I mentioned up top, I'm an enby, and a fairly comfy enby at that. My own physical dysphoria is fairly mild, so I'm really tentative to write that kind of fiction since I only really know it second hand. Almost all of my dysphoria is social, and in a less sexist, less binary world, I genuinely think most of that would disappear.
But uh-oh, I started speculating about the nature of gender in the comments of a My Little Pony fanfic again, which means it's time to stop.
I would appreciate those recs though. I've gotten terrible at actively looking for good stories on this site over the last few years, since the ratio of good fics to absolute dreck is only getting smaller the more I read.
My pleasure, and again, seriously, thank you for the thoughtful comments. Writing trans fiction sometimes feels like talking to a brick wall, since at best cis commenters are still relatively poorly equipped to critique the meat and bones of that aspect of the story. This discussion has been a brighter highlight than just about anything else about this story to me.
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I suppose that either way, a dual-sex species and a sexless one would manage to be a 'they' either way, but yeah it's not as though they're the exact same. Different flavors would probably be the best comparison, but I don't exactly want to eat sapient beings.
Wow, that's so poggers! I'm so used to this fandom being filled with trans sisters, next to no trans misters (sadface), and a smattering of thudes. It's nice to see another trans author around!
I'd say that a great way to work with your world-building ability and desire to focus on social aspects would be to write stories centered around characters who have reached a point of comfort in (or have completed) their transition. I'm sure it would also save a lot of second-guessing too, especially if you're as worried about discovery trans aspects, dealing with the medical aspect, and so on.
I mean, it's clearly more reasonable than how underdeveloped and hastily delivered they are in canon. So yeah, I'd say what you've done here is definitely a huge improvement over what show viewers got.
I don't know if you came to this fic from PresentPerfect's review, but he's dead on about this narrowly avoiding being a headcanon-dump. I still like the final result, but it is pretty tell-y and I'm not confident in my ability to pull the same off again. I'd be thrilled if someone else took that bait and handled it better though.
I don't think that's a reason to stop writing trans fics, it's just a sign to improve upon some things. I came here cause this was one of the few Pride and Positivity entries I hadn't read. Since it's both easier and my entry was one of the longer ones, I decided to save the longer and more complex-looking entries for later. I only have a couple left to go now!
Man, not only does that sound like some gigachad title skills there, the idea of such well-thought-out representation is some extremely poggers stuff. Fantasy is my jam! I'll be picking up a copy when I can.
It sounds like the changelings change, well, everything with them when they shift. Brain and body. So while I could see them functionally being considered non-binary (they clearly do not live in a gendered society beyond having queens in the past) in purely social aspects, they're probably best seen as 'sort-of' cis here in the sense that they transform any parts that could possibly be at odds (if that's even biologically possible within their species for them to be trans). Ocellus and Thorax sound like they could probably be considered trans. If there is no sex for them when they're hatched, the fact that Ocellus and Thorax are examples of trans changelings.
As for the kirin? Well, a third sex and third gender character at least is a queer character and what could probably be considered intersex. Instead of worrying that you didn't write representation here, I'd go back and look more carefully. It seems more likely that you just ended up surprising yourself with the representation you ended up writing! Still, the non-binary nature inherent to the kirin's physicality and the fact that some show that they aren't always 'they'... well, I'd say what you see as 'cis' kirin occupy a gray area between trans/cis while the latter kind are trans.
So... Sternite would probably be cis, just a different flavor, based on what was yielded in this discussion (and the story) while Holly skirts the line of both.
Even if I'd been more familiar with the book and you had decided to take that route, I don't see what would be wrong about being inspired by her concepts.
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Sorry for the double comment, I felt that the last one was getting too long. Also, I'm gonna be spamming stories.
I would appreciate those recs though. I've gotten terrible at actively looking for good stories on this site over the last few years, since the ratio of good fics to absolute dreck is only getting smaller the more I read.
I find that joining groups and following a wide variety of people helps. The way the site is designed, it's encouraged since relying on the front page for stories is a really bad idea.
(Note: I've written some stories that would fit the criteria here, but am not shameless enough to clog up your comments with them. It'd be rude.)
Doesn't contain transphobia as a theme:
- MLP: FiM
- Adventure
Winter Wheat enters Discord's castle hoping for a favor and finds himself trapped in an adventure- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
- Slice of Life
When Yona invites Sandbar to a Yakyakistan festival, Sandbar's past history experiencing transphobia rears its ugly head. Can he win against his own intrusive thoughts and enjoy his Hearth's Warming with the yak he loves?- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
Not every journey needs to be taken alone.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Slice of Life
Twilight has something on her mind and needs to get it out.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Sad
- Slice of Life
Reflections show you what you most want, but what you envisioned cannot always be seen. Dinky learns this the hard way.- Equestria Girls
- Drama
- Slice of Life
Vice-Principal Artemis is visited by a student with a problem that reminds him of his past.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Slice of Life
Princess Luna knows that things are what they are. Fish do not fly, birds do not swim, and she cannot be other than who and what she is. Or can she?- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
Applejack is finally ready to transition and become a stallion, but not everyone is behind the decision. Will he be able to overcome and be true to himself?- MLP: FiM
- Drama
- Slice of Life
He's finally summoned up the courage to buy himself that pink dress. But Thunderlane soon finds that what he wants--or who he is--isn't as simple as he once thought . . . .- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
A pony, caught between two conflicting desires, contemplates who he wants to be.- Equestria Girls
- Drama
Sometimes it can be very, very hard to remember --or believe-- that you're awesome. Fortunately, that's what friends are for. (Sunset Shimmer checks on Rainbow Dash.)- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
In those early days, when she first moved to Ponyville, one must imagine Pinkie Pie happy.- MLP: FiM
- Equestria Girls
- Slice of Life
Sunset Shimmer recounts her first time in the human world.- Equestria Girls
- Romance
- Dark
Rarity and Twilight are trapped underground.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
Your dad is out of town, and that means you and Berry Punch get the whole house to yourselves.- Equestria Girls
- Romance
- Slice of Life
Rarity and Sunset go on a very important trip.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
- Slice of Life
When Applejack moves back to Ponyville after living with the Orange side of her family, she wants to pick up where she left off with her best foalhood friend, Matte Palette. Something seems different about him, though.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Slice of Life
Transitioning was the best thing Caramel ever did for herself and her boyfriend was completely supportive... But since she transitioned, something feels off about their relationship.The Sum of Her is also a fantastic trans story by Gay for Gadot. I helped edit the SFW parts, which are complete in themselves, but it's got NSFW content too.
It's too been too since I read it for me to remember if that specific content is there:
- MLP: FiM
- Sad
- Slice of Life
Princess Luna has been going through a bad patch in the last thousand years or so, to put it mildly. Now, at this time in her life, she is finally ready to answer the difficult questions. But there's one thing she's never thought to question ...(This one 100% contains self-harm but no death)
- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
"There's that face looking back." She doesn't feel like it's hers. She never has. Maybe there's something to be done about that.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Slice of Life
Applejack has gone through a lot in her life. She's lost family, been a primary caregiver, even had a few massive shifts in her identity... And she's still standing. She's still here. But is that enough?- MLP: FiM
- Drama
- Slice of Life
A gender-dysphoric pony tests the waters at the expense of his, or her, classmates.- Equestria Girls
- Slice of Life
Rainbow Dash needs Rarity's help for a rather personal matter. Luckily, Rarity is always willing to help a friend, no matter how awkward the situation.- MLP: FiM
- Slice of Life
Rarity finds that success is hollow.There is transphobia (internalized or otherwise) as a theme:
- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
- Slice of Life
Despite everything going well for her, Scootaloo can’t feel comfortable in her own skin. She just can’t figure out why.- MLP: FiM
- Drama
- Slice of Life
When Starlight approaches Sunburst the night before he returns to the Crystal Empire, she inadvertently discovers something about her old friend that explains a bit about their past—and present.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
- Slice of Life
Although they live miles apart and rarely see one another, Amber Glow and Luna both find themselves plagued by a similar feeling. While they appear whole and happy on the surface, underneath neither is sure of who they are.- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Drama
Ever since Rarity knew she was a filly, she knew what it meant to be a lady. Her prince would sweep her off her hooves any moment now, if only she were a little more lady-like. That's what she tells Twilight, anyhow.[Unpublished stories cannot be embedded]
- MLP: FiM
- Dark
- Sad
- Slice of Life
[One-Shot] A not-quite-mare named Glitter Shell goes on a trip to find some acceptance and maybe even some affection; for ponies like her, hate is far more common.I try and do what I can. It's always hard for me to find really good trans content too, and even among professionally published stuff. Still, I hope to see more trans stuff from you.
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Fantastic. I might go ahead and make a special read-it-later for that list, just to keep a nice dripfeed of trans stuff coming. And sounds like I definitely need to check out your bibliography as well. Thanks for the links!
And I have at least one more trans story in the works. Maybe not quite as Interesting as this one, but hopefully overall better executed. After that, who knows. I always feel like I'm just a few months away from packing my bags and moving on from this hellsite, but I guess I haven't yet ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I remember Sum of Her. Great story, real nightmare of a comments section, as you've kinda got to expect from Fimfic. It's stuff like that that keeps me haunting these parts.
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Darn, it’s always a bummer when folks head out, but best of luck if you do.
Sequal please! Dont have enough stories of kirins and changelings interacting with one another.