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How do you tell a child that she will never be enough?
Proofing and revising help from Pascoite. The cover image is a piece by Silfoe that has been edited by me. Featured on Equestria Daily and selected as one of the Celestia Day picks for 2020! Contribute to the TVTropes page! Spoiler-filled review by The Red Parade of the My Little Reviews & Feedback group! Ghost Mike gave this a 'Pretty Good' in his spoiler-heavy review that you can find here. Buy this story!
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Oooo, this looks interesting! I like your characterizations. I look forward to seeing this progress.
Cadance is utterly adorable, as she rightly should be! I wholeheartedly approve.
Eager to see where you go with this. Cadance is indeed in a unique position being thrust into this strange new world with no clear direction—a princess in title only, if even that at this point. I'll be keeping an eye on this!
Mmm
The plot of this story is sweet, I need more of this.
Well, this is gonna be an interesting read!
Dunno if the summary really fits the story, unless the child mention is Sunset. Breaking news like "No matter how hard you work being a Princess isn't your future". Because I don't see Celestia thinking Cadance will never "be enough" simply because like this frost chapter lets us know Celestia doesn't even know what Cadance is meant for. Her "Faithful Student" is meant to bear the element of Magic, free Luna and be her successor. Cadance by contrast is an unknown, someone Celestia knows she must guide and protect but has no clue what the end game is, someone she has no plan for.
It leaves me confused. Is Celestia worried because Cadance is a young alicorn and there's a lot that needs to be done without any previous cases like Cadences to go by?
Oh wow, I didn't expect so many comments so soon!
10029968
Thank you! There's three more chapters scheduled and ready to go. You can check their release dates here!
10029978
It's always flattering to have an author whose work I enjoy start reading my stuff. (And now that you're back I'll have to be sure to keep tabs on you too.) I'm really glad you like Cadance. She's always a little ray of sunshine to write, and boy do I love writing her!
10029990
Gonna take that as a compliment?
10029998
The description is intended to come across that way; I hope you stay for the ride, though.
10030019
Sweet, but with a sad tag. Oh boy. I'm not sure it's still going to be sweet by the ending.
10030032
I hope so! Thank you for reading!
10030080
I'm not going to spoil anything, but you are partly asking some of the right questions. I hope you stay to see the story to completion. Future chapters do dissect the description and touch on some things in your comment.
10030239
I'd look at the above reply, but yes, that's partly why. She's worried because she suddenly has to deal with a very impressionable teen, among other things.
Thank y'all for reading!
10030668
Thank you! I try!
Good start!
10030702
Thank you very much! I hope you stick around!
10030080
Maybe a part of Celestia perceives Cadence as a replacement goldfish for Luna, yet at the same time, no matter what, she will never be good enough to replace her sister.
This is the reason for which in the Triptych Continuum neither alicorn sees the other eye to eye.
10030739
Aren't there a couple stories with that name? Which one would you happen to be referring to? I like your speculations, but unless I know which one you're talking about, I'm not sure I can say I've read it.
10030747
The Continuum is Estee's multi million word AU.
Try Total Eclipse of the Fun, perhaps.
Estee is my favorite fimficcer, bar none, full stop.
10030739
Thinking of a particular Estee fic?
10030779
I've added it to the read pile, the 'Total Eclipse' one. I've heard of their stories mentioned alongside the million-plus word club, so as a fellow member (haha my jokes are bad im sorry) I know of them. I've read a few of their shorter stories. The story I was thinking of was this one, which I have read. I haven't delved into many of Estee's longer works, according to my shelves.
10030782
No, I think is simply something the author commented regarding his verse. Not sure if any Triptych story deals with that particular issue.
10030803
10030796
Cool, thanks folks.
This is an almost illegally charming take on filly Cadance. My one problem with it is that it was over too early! Eagerly looking forward to more.
10031954
Oh heck oh gosh oh boy
I’m glad you like it! This updates weekly.
The mental image of Cadance going to Celestia's office and sneaking such a fantastically gaudy card into the piles of run-of-the-mill paperwork is too adorable for words. Your entire characterization of Cadance is, really, but that part stuck out to me. I am so on board for the budding friendship with Raven, too. And of course the one-sided rivalry with Sunset. Hoping to see more of that unfold, and not just in letter format!
Interesting insight into Celestia's dilemma, too. The fact that the prophecy is so specific as to single out a six-pointed spark for a cutie mark is equal parts kind and cruel, and seeing her try to rationalize Sunset and Cadance within the context of that prophecy is somewhat heartbreaking. Still, probably better than having to put her faith in either of them without knowing that neither are the hero she needs. At least we know that there are happy endings in store for all parties involved, even if it takes a lot of suffering to get there.
10044247
Thank you! Cadance is a wholly underrated character, and I love seeing people take note of the care I put into writing her. You're also the first comment on this chapter, so hooray. I was worried the sudden drop in comments compared to last chapter was because of people not enjoying the chapter, or something similar.
Vague spoilers: I'm not sure how much more you'll find for those in the next two chapters. Though, I'm always open to sequels and other ideas if suggested by my readers in comments, otherwise sequels and side-stories are done purely by my whim and on my own independent schedule, y'know? But I would be open to writing stories with more focus on the younger characters, and generally always have the start of a few ideas.
This is actually a bit of a tricky part in the story. The prophecy is only that little snippet that finds its way into storybooks. Celestia, having been a previous Bearer of the Element of Magic, knows that symbol of the Spark is significant and that she needs to look for it. A cutie mark is an obvious sign and generally one that is good to bet on holding that kind of symbolism, which is something she knows. However, she's being very strict in how she conflates them, especially when it's something she can't do conventional research on (and not just because the test subjects would involve children). She's holding out for a sign she's not exactly certain on the manifestation of, and in terms of "supporting evidence" she is trying to consider the behavior of Sunny and Cady.
You can say that again!
Interesting take on why Celestia sent the mirror with Cadance to the Crystal Empire, and just a heartbreaking scene in general. Looking forward to seeing how it progresses from here.
10060012
There’s only one more chapter left! Thank you for staying with it this long!
I can’t imagine her wanting to keep the mirror if she didn’t know Sunny was alive and well (though not exactly stable).
Nicely written, but this feels unfinished. The last chapter might have been better placed by moving it back one and having the mirror chapter as finale. As is, it feels truncated, as if something else should follow.
Solid writing and characterization though. Thanks for sharing this!
10065745
My intention was to build on emotion and theme with each chapter rather than the chronological order of the timeline. Sunset being physically present in this one does easily establish it as being before the third chapter with the mirror. This chapter also has no mention of Cadance, so where it is set in terms of the exact chronology is blurrier in comparison. I do see why a reader could see a more conventional order if things were changed up, though.
Fascinating subject matter—this is one of the best adjusting-to-Canterlot Cadences I've seen—but the prose leaves something to be desired. Sometimes it's stilted, sometimes it's so tangled in itself that I can barely make heads or tails of it. An editor would definitely help.
Still, great demonstrations of how, after untold Faithful Students, Celestia has little to no idea how to actually raise foals. But bless her, she still tries, even as the results drive her up a wall when they aren't stabbing her in the heart. And that same stubborness nearly doomed the world when she refused to believe a prophecy for centuries. Celestia is just as proud as Sunset; she's just had much more time to mellow... and to grow used to unquestioned authority.
10066315
Thank you! She's very fun to write at this stage in her life, and uh, I've had quite a bit of practice writing her. Though, in regards to the prose is there anything that stands out about it coming across as "tangled" and the like? This is the first I'm hearing of it, and nothing was mentioned in the first chapter about it. I can only assume that it's something I (somehow) missed in a later chapter, but no bits really stand out to me.
It's honestly hard to believe that so few stories really explore this kind of dynamic, especially considering the kinds of problem children Celestia surrounds herself with.
I admittedly didn't expect to jump backwards in the timeline in this final chapter, but I have no complaints. It's definitely clear that the seeds of Sunset's contempt are in vibrant bloom, and that final line is especially cutting. Interesting hints to Sunset's history, too, by mentioning her grandmother rather than her parents. Makes me wonder what's going on there.
All in all, a nice little exploration of Celestia's character as it relates to her unique charges, which is absolutely a niche that needs more exploration than it's gotten, and this was a lovely addition. Thanks for writing it!
10071643
This is exactly what I was going for; so thank you very much for noticing it!
Two other stories (Her Own Sky and Atychiphobia) explore this some more. Sunset was raised by her grandmother, who later transferred guardianship to Princess Celestia.
Thank you very much for commenting so much and sticking with it! I'm glad you followed too; I hope you like more of my stories. I really like the genre too; it just seems like everyone writes it fluffy. Seeing Celestia had a bunch of problem kids, I can't see it being happy fluffy fic land like that.
I'll be catching up on your story when I have the time to spare.
10071677
I'll definitely have to check out those other stories! A lot of your stories actually look pretty interesting to me. We definitely share quite a few interests when it comes to characters and subject matter.
Don't worry too much about catching up on the story, haha. I'm a slow writer anyway.
10071722
Fixed that for you.
10071726
Got me there!
This seems more like an assortment of stories than a full story by itself. Still an interesting fic.
This feels incredibly disjointed. It seems like its about Cadance, only to pivot 3/4 of the way through and end on Sunset. Though the themes could arguably be cnetered around youth, thats a thin connection that doesnt seem to truly bring the parts of the story together. It also just seems... random and what messege you seem to want to say at the beginning is completely tossed out the window by the end.
Leaving me wondering what was the point of all those words if you were just going to switch focus at the last second anyway? Seems like you should have ended this story on the second chapter because as it stands right now it feels like a frakenstien story that started life as two seperate ideas which were stitched together at the last second.
Other then that things get stilted and rambly at points which wouldnt be too bad but because the messege is seemingly abandoned halfway through the story it leaves the reader feeling lost and wondering why Celestia is even pondering what she is.
10093684
The cover art and story structure being divided that way is a bait and switch and a half truth. The focus is on both the prophecy and relationship dysfunction in the story of both fillies. The question applies to both. Celestia is the ‘true’ central focus because she’s the only character that has their experiences and failures in each chapter.
So, it’s not really a Frankenstein story; if anything it’s closer to having a false protagonist. It’s not an uncommon idea, just one that isn’t used super often. It’s similar to the concept of a peripheral narrator in first person stories.
10093853
I see the truth to this, but that certainly isnt how it comes off when you read it. Because when you read it feels like the entire story and everything in it is dedicated to Cadance, from the description, to the cover art, to the first 3/4 of the story. That shift that goes from Cadance to Sunset feels like you driving around in third only to go straight into reverse.
It doesnt leave me thinking "This was an interesting subversoin and now that I see the ending it all makes sense." It makes me go. "What in the hell just happened, that answered nothing, why did we skip to Sunset out of the blue?"
I feel like your attempt at subversion also failed because the entire story feels incomplete. We, as the audience, know that Sunset is alive, and well (Presumably) in another world and is about to become a much better person. Yet Celestia is mourning for some reason and then the story just ends, having not answered the question it asked at the very begining.
That and the central tensoin is still there, Celestia still needs the answer to whats going on. Sunset is still lost, and Cadance hasnt been shown to adapt to her role. Leaving all three character archs incomplete. Yet the story, unlike their archs, is complete.
10093897
This is an entirely intentionally deceptive aspect of use a false protagonist, which Cadance isn't technically. I'll have more on that later. Instead, think of her more as a false focus instead of a protagonist.
The shift was planned, of course. Again, it's worth pointing out that concepts like and similar to the false protagonist are meant to jarring. Even though there's oodles of typical foreshadowing around Cadance's chapters.
The shift wasn't out of the blue. Even in the chapters with Cadance, there are multiple references to Sunset at the very least. At most, her relationship with Celestia and others is still elaborated on. The focus is never stated to be glued onto Cadance; the summary does not refer just to her either. The character whose perspective is followed throughout the story is Celestia, who also comments on both fillies. If Cadance had been introduced as the POV character and then been displaced in her own narrative by Sunset through something not resulting from other subversive techniques (false hero, peripheral narrator, etc) then this would make much more sense. But when the character the story is grounded in has their relationships explored with two significant characters close to them it feels less founded. (Especially when various titles/descriptions are meant to refer to both Cady and Sunny.) However, I can see why the chapter order might have muddled some of a reader's enjoyment in the story.
It's going to take her a long time to be a better person. The first EqG movie is a long way into the future, Cadance isn't even a foal-sitter to Twilight yet, and Twilight is nowhere close to being Celestia's student or getting a cutie mark. The reader is going to be fully aware of Sunset's status in the human world, but Celestia has no idea about that. She couldn't, really. It's very straightforward dramatic irony.
Yet Celestia is mourning for some reason and then the story just ends, having not answered the question it asked at the very begining.
Celestia gets her answer through the show; Cadance knows her role by then too, and still gets to grow. Sunset's fate is solved by the Equestria Girls movie(s). Their arcs are only incomplete because it's a show prequel, and any story that falls into that subgenre isn't going to be complete if its setting remains grounded in the past. Aside from venturing into show re-tellings and similar stuff, continuing the story in order to cover all of those would diverge it so significantly from the plot it has into three different long-form stories. It would also no longer be the particular flavor of sad that it is, and not solely because each characters' story would be a different genre.
My author's notes did say I wouldn't mind sequels, requests for an additional chapter or two, prequels, and just other stories to attach to this one. This just isn't specific enough that I could (potentially) work with it or consider it a request for if I ever got around to that. If you really wanted a story that is short-ish and wraps up cleanly, I do have some of those. This just didn't happen to be one. Scrambled Serenity, Wishing Werelights, Follow Her Lead (admittedly not super short by any means but it comes to mind) are fit that bill fairly well.
10095191
All of what you says makes sense but ultimatly my criticsm comes down to two main things that I dont feel as though you've truly grappled with.
1. The 'twist' just doesn't work.
If you had focused on both Cadance and Sunset from the start to the end it would have probably felt like a cohesive, functional story with a point but without that it feels disjointed and messy, ending on a note that basicly says "Go watch the series, cus I aint explainin shit, but oh hey, maybe one day I might." This kind of reliance on secondary source material and nebulous sequels to explain the ending makes for a weak ending no matter how much sense it makes, it's simply not enjoyable. Even if you can explain why it exists there is no amount of explanation you can do that makes it into being a good choice that feels like a satisfying ending or twist. Its also a twist for the sake of a twist, its not like another story I read where it talked about someone with the assumption of it being person a, only for it to be revealed they were talking about person b. That narrative twist was exactly like this one but had meaning, intention and shocked me when I read it. This just feels like its two stories pressed together and the twist exists solely to branch the two. Not to amuse, or answer the fundemental question at the heart of the story, or to do anything other than serve as a shortcut to explain why it says nothing, does nothing, and answers nothing.
2. The over reliance on the primary and potential future sources.
This is supposedly serving as a prequel to the main series, yet it doesnt function well as a story in itself or shed any light on anything that we couldnt have guessed at. The dramatic ending of Celestia mourning Sunset also just straight up doesn't make sense. If the portal went to moon that lacked any atmosphere and any who walked through asphyxiated and died her sadness would make sense cus Sunset would likely be dead. But Sunset didnt die, she did the equivalent of running away from home and yet we are supposed to feel bad. Something that is made even less impactful by the fact that we ultimately know shes going to be completely fine. Yes its going to be a long road but our knowledge robs that reveal of any depth. So when Celestia's sad it is impossible to care about her feelings, and honestly I felt like she was really stupid in this story. Like, all she had to do was go look through the mirror and yet she does absolutely nothing. She feels bad but doesn't act one bit, and just writes Sunset off immediatly and calls it done, robbing the drama that should be in that scene. It feels like she was passed the idiot ball just to explain how this story fits with cannon while also making her sad at the end.
Ultimatly yes, your reasons make sense, yes their is a presecendant for all that you do, but no, the twist and the ending simply do not work. The story trips at the twist, and then falls down the stairs by the ending, having spent 7 thousand words doing and saying absolutely nothing.
10095272
Sunset is tagged from the very beginning. The only thing that doesn't feature her is the cover. Like I mentioned in my last comment, there's no drastic perspective switch. Though, the chapters are not presented in chronological order (3 is the last time-wise and 4 takes place at an unspecified period when Sunset is still the student of Celestia). Overall, the focus isn't explicit, but it's really not that much of a twist because the status as a twist depends on how unreasonable it is to believe that the different ponies in Celestia's life would be explored from her perspective. It's also natural to have characters show up after the start of a story; there's only four chapters, after all. I've used multichapter stories where each chapter resembles a semi-vignette before, and it's not the most uncommon style out there. My guess is that you probably haven't dealt with it much before.
...That's basically all fanfiction. Episode response stories, sequels, fixfics, and any kind of fanfiction fits that to an extent. The particular canon touched on in this story isn't even anything that's from obscure/soft canon like the comics or expanded from one particularly forgettable episode. Everything is from season opner/finale material of the first Equestria Girls movie. I think you're mistaking what I would do for a sequel too. A sequel for this story would detail anything extra that readers wanted to see, not anything left to be explained. Anyone who has seen the first two episodes and the first Equestria Girls movie knows what happens next; there's no need to spell it out for them, especially when I'm not attempting to subvert canon or present an alternate version. Basically any story that acts as a prequel to a significant event in canon is going to have that abrupt, ominous type of ending. This story right here comes to mind as an example of the same thing:
- MLP: FiM
- Romance
- Slice of Life
It's taken a lot of time and effort, but Moondancer is finally ready to come out of her shell! Now if only she could find the confidence to ask Twilight Sparkle to come out with her...Overall, I feel like this point (your second one) would be much stronger if my focus had been on background characters and secondary ones. Instead, it's about main characters and main plot points across two of the franchise's series. That's not exactly an over-reliance, which is hard to have when we're all writing fanfiction about the same shows and movies (and comics).
If I had a twist for the sake of it, the story's presentation would have been set up in a way to be outright deceptive instead of ambiguous. I do think I could certainly have improved how I used the chapter order, but other than that, there isn't really an explicit twist because it would have required something truly unknown to have happened. Having Pony A be the focus of two chapters and of secondary importance in the later half of the story and Pony B have that but vice versa would have certainly been disappointing if Pony C weren't the main character.
That's because it's not trying to. The events in the series are a forgone conclusion, as are the stories of any character whose origin is more concrete and known in canon. This is much more of a matter of personal investment, and the same thing would apply to other material with that same characteristic. For example, reading retellings of Greek mythology is something I like to do, even though I know how most of them will end or play out. It doesn't make it less enjoyable for me because I know the material. I feel like you're a fan of extremely expansive pre-canon stories, which this wasn't meant to be. It's just a small supplement.
Celestia at the mirror is shown years after Sunset is gone. To get this out of the way: if that's a problem you have with this story, then that sounds like a problem you also have with the Equestria Girls franchise as a whole. I didn't change Sunset's backstory here.
Your other statements pose some problems too, instead of the supposedly easy solution. Celestia at the mirror in the aftermath makes it clear she didn't find Sunset. Running away from home is one thing, but Sunset didn't just do that. She ran off to another world, and one with limited access. Even though the opening/closing cycle of the mirror portal can be seen in different ways, we know that there was no way to force it open until Twilight tried in the second movie. There's also that the portal could have closed when Celestia realized where Sunny went. Celestia has the responsibility to rule a whole country, and heading off to a world she doesn't trust and know for an unknown amount of time to find a child in an unknown location isn't a demonstration of good thinking.
She has every reason to be in mourning when her student is missing, unable to be found, not within access, and Celestia has no idea whether Sunset is dead or alive. Not knowing and being able to prove if someone is okay can hurt just as much as clear proof of their death. Hence Celestia having a mournful reaction in the first movie - and in real life, why many people with missing family may be relieved to learn their relative was a cold case victim (or alive, etc) after so many years of questions and uncertainty. For Celestia, that's very much the case here.
Her immediate reaction to Sunset going missing isn't shown, nor is the search for Sunset. Considering Celestia's character, it would be inappropriate to infer that she just did nothing when she found out or was "passed the idiot ball". The scene that's shown is when the time of action has long passed and Celestia's resigned sorrow is more appropriate. She isn't even sure what she can do.
10096473
Very fair.
I admit after rereading it and reading your comments I've come to the conclusion that I simply don't like the story. It doesn't do anything to truly hook me other than promising me a more of Cadance which we don't really get in the show and when we deviate away from that focus I'm left bored and annoyed. Sunset Shimmer's character requires a lot and the brief 'shes rebellious' blurb we get here doesn't make me give half a shit about her. Plus an overreliance on cannon means you are left with massive glaring questions like "Why is Celestia such an idiot" which simply can't be explained if you are sticking solely to cannon. I also just simply don't think that this style of "story which isn't actually a real story" ever truly works. All of them that I've read feel too long to be a slice of life style brief look into their lives type of thing but not long enough to say anything meaningful or answer any of the questions they pose leaving us in a lurch where it just feels like I wasted my time.
10096543
I mean, I don't think Celestia is an idiot in this any more than most parents with "problem children" are idiots. She couldn't know about what was going to happen and dismissed a lot as teenage rebellion when she saw signs at all. I'm less of a fan of some of the long-winded woobie Sunset narratives, not that there aren't any good long-form stories that give her depth. She feels like a distraught teenager with an extra level, and of course, an extra world. I have another, longer story with her still running but it's also one that uses a much weirder narrative style (free verse poetry spliced with some prose style journal stuff) that probably isn't your thing.
If you wanted a long form story featuring these two (with less Celestia), I'd suggest this one. The plot is similar, the writing is fantastic, and by coincidence it came out around the same time as mine. It's incomplete, but it's quality is top-notch and it might be more your speed.
- MLP: FiM
- Drama
- Slice of Life
Sunset Shimmer is assigned to be Princess Cadance's private magic tutor. Surely this can only end well.10096567
I think she comes off as stupid because she has resources out the wazoo, the absolute control of an entire nation and the ability to call every branch of the military, yet when someone she loves runs away she does literally nothing. She finds out about it fairly quickly in your story as well yet she gives up immediately. She doesn't think "This is a child in a whole nother world, she might die, or worse. I should go after her." She just lies down and says "She's gone." And gives up, making no attempt to follow, help, or go after her.
And in the face of that, you have two options to remedy such a response. Either Celestia doesn't give a shit, and shes silently glad that she doesn't have to deal with Sunset anymore. Or she's an idiot.
10096611
That didn't really happen in the story, though. There's one scene with her at the mirror, and it's established to be years after Sunset left. Celestia is aware of her student's destination in the loosest sense (the other side of the mirror) but nothing else. She doesn't find out quickly or give up instantly because Sunset's initial disappearance is not covered, just Celestia musing on the loss of Sunset long after the fact. Celestia refers to Cadance's wedding being soon, which places it farther into the present, not close to either the first chapter or when Sunset would have initially run away.
10096618
Ahh fair. I could have sworn there was also some line in the show that mentioned that she knew it happened relatively quickly. Still, even then it feels like she should have done something, anything to try and help even if it was just to send a few guards through in order to sleuth out her location. Making absolutely no attempt feels like she just doesn't care, or she wrote her off completely. Even if she only found out years later where Sunset went, it feels a bit insincere to read her waxing poetic and mourning her death when she's done nothing to try and discern if she's even alive or not. If she truly cared about Sunset an attempt should have been made.
Even if it was a throwaway line like "I tried everything short of sending the army and still nothing."
10096640
Sending guards through the portal brings in the whole layer about giving away the fantasy world's existence and all that. It's not a bad idea, but it's one that would have calculations and complications of its own.
Many people who lose relatives via missing persons situations will often presume that they've died after a certain point. A child on her own in another dimension... it's not an unreasonable conclusion for Celestia to make that Sunset might have died if she has no proof of Sunset's survival.
It's kind of why I asked in my A/N if sequels would have been wanted. These four scenes are already tightly woven around one theme, so something like a search for Sunset, the inter-relationship between the kiddos, and other situations could be their own stories.
If the scene had been her talking to another character, this would have been perfectly appropriate. Since it was just Celestia on her own, it didn't feel right to have her tell herself that.
Oh god. Sunny please tell Celestia how you really feel
and boy, do I wish Luna to be there, she’d at least talk her sister into some sense. Great chapter!
10166406
Thanks for the comment! I’m glad this update got noticed so quickly.
oof
10166687
Thank you for being the first person I can remember to comment on one of my stories with ‘oof’.