• Member Since 27th Oct, 2013
  • offline last seen Yesterday

Jay David

Just a guy from Britain who loves MLP.


One some level, Celestia always knew that Twilight would one day as the question. The question that, understandably, the Princess would never want to answer. But, that day has come, and the mare of the sun must now explain to her beloved student why her predecessor, Sunset Shimmer, left her.

Part of the Night and Day Storyline

Chapters (1)
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Comments ( 18 )

"And she...she thought of me as a Mother ."

With the way that Celestia asked around ponies in the Main series, that's not a big surprise:applejackunsure:.

"But after all that...the last time we were together...that talented...innocent filly...looked at that Mother..."

There was a sharp intake of breath, and then, she finished.

"...and knew...that she had been betrayed by her."

That is the worst thing that any child would have to go through at the hands of their own parents, biological or not, besides abuse:applecry:. That was was exactly what Sunset felt when Celestia told her why she had been teaching her less powerful magical spells and abilities...she felt that the one and only person who she saw as a mother, who was her mother in all but blood, had betrayed her, and held her back from her true potential:fluttershysad:. I'm not blaming Celestia here, since she did see her sister inside Sunset, and she was afraid of what may happen if she continued to teach Sunset high level spells...but at the same time, like she said, she really should not have underestimated Sunset's love and thirst for learning magic:ajsleepy:. That, and not to mention that lying to her and keeping secrets from her didn't help things on the matter either. I guess it could've happened either way, but if Sunset was going to leave, she could've at least left knowing that the one pony who she looked up to, cared for her, taught her, and loved her wouldn't lie or keep secrets form her...which gets you nowhere in friendship by the way:pinkiesad2:.

Another wonderful one shot as always Jay:scootangel:! I look forward to reading more of this delightful series in the future:twilightsmile:.

Interesting. This is similar to how things played out with Sunset in the canon of the show, but instead of withholding information specific toward alicorn ascension, it was magic in general. As such, Sunset didn't know about the mirror, but she still went ahead and snuck into the library to learn about more powerful magic.

Honestly, the division between the sisters is sad, but even in canon you can see the differences, and in this universe, its far worse. Celestia does everything to shy away from conflict and when she is forced to deal with, she uses the least amount of force she can. Luna on the other hand goes all out, always with good intentions, but with a brutality and a finality that scares the crap out of a pacifistic pony like her sister.

Both are so far on the extremes of eachother, that neither can see the advantages to each style of rulership, only the disadvantages. If they could combine themselves, and learn to compromise, this version of Equestria could eclipse the canon Equestria by miles.

This is a better story than the one we got in “The Fall of Sunset Shimmer.”

Also, I bet Celestia blames herself for not telling Sunset Shimmer why she held her back.

Celestia made a choice but were forgetting one thing. The mistake she made wasn't a mistake. As the teacher it's her job to decide how to teach and what to teach. Yes. There could be more, but she choose to go with weaker lessons to temper her student. It was no betrayal, it was teaching the right lessons at the right time.

To be fair with hindsight, we as readers can see how Celestia created a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I’m not saying Sunset is Blameless, but if it’s 90% Sunset’s fault and 10% Celestia’s, don’t act like it’s 100% Sunset’s fault.

Fearing something, and taking action to prevent it, only for it to happen anyway. That's irony.

Aww come on, that's not fair!
You can't just end it like that! There'll be more chapters right!?

I hope they will eventually see what they do wrong and not just what they do right. A little humility can go a kong way if used correctly.

Didn't go as planned.

I'm sorry, but this just strikes me as extremely childish.

"My 'mom' didn't teach me everything she could as soon as she could! She betrayed me! I'm going to run away forever and never ever ever see or talk to you again!"

"Oh I'm such a terrible mother for being worried about my 'daughter' and her behavior, and for not assuming she'd turn out all sparkles and rainbows and give her everything she wanted when she wanted it! Boo hoo!"

Adults in general and parents in particular do not tell their children everything about the world. They hide things from their children. Mostly in order to protect them. And all children feel 'betrayed' by their parents at one point or another. Often at a LOT of points. (We call this period of time 'Being a Teenager.') If nothing else, there's the sense of betrayal when you realize that your parents are flawed individuals who make mistakes just like anyone else.

But at some point you grow up, and realize that your parents did those things for a reason. (Or that they were massive assholes.. But even then, they probably had a good reason for SOME of their actions.) Point is, Sunset's behavior comes across to me as moody teenage emo nonsense. And Celestia's behavior gives it far too much weight. You know, aside from the fact that Sunset never showed up again. (Cause THAT would be somewhat tragic... If that had bee their last conversation, and then Sunset was run over by a cart as she 'ran away from home' or some such.)

If you wanted to make it tragic, have Sunset die because she only knew the lesser Magics Celestia taught her, instead of the stronger spells she would have been capable of learning that could have saved her life.

Well, I think its because Equestria itself is childish, and as such, this fits in this context.

It fits. Celestia noted that Sunset was acting like Luna and Luna did create an entire nation based on her need for attention and jealously of her older sister. Both were motivated by pettiness. Celestia recognizes that she hurt Sunset, one thing that no decent parent wants to do to their child, but Sunset did nothing to relieve Celestia's fears and her reaction was completely overblown. This was true even for her canon self, who left for another world entirely when she did not get what she wanted.


Except Celestia herself admitted that she chose to undermine Sunset's education by teaching her less than she was ready for instead of actually addressing the attitude issues. That's a dereliction of responsibility simply because Celestia is conflict avoidant.

Can someone tell me which story Twilight met Sunset? I haven't been online for a while so I'm trying to catch up.

From the story discription:

Celestia always knew that Twilight would one day as the question

"Celestia always knew that Twilight would one day ask the question"


It's a terrible thing when trust breaks down between a mentor and a student, especially one as impressionable as Sunset. Celestia may have been the only pony Sunset ever knew who treated her as anything other than a burden or a statistic. I'm not sure what other thing to suggest, but Celestia needed to find a different way, some other lesson. Nice job.

I think if she really had feared for Sunset, she should have talked to her about her concerns. Staying silent and acting behind her back was definitely not the right approach to diffusing tensions. Whenever attitude and/or behavioural issues develop, one has to explain why these could be problems. Unfortunately, Celestia's the type of character who keeps her cards close so to speak.

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