Flynn could hear many sirens in the distance. They were coming frequently now. He could hear at least one helicopter, as well as the distant sound of people moving through the trees. A search party had finally been mobilized.
“Transfer complete,” Agent announced, indicating Caroline. Flynn was now sitting in a car with a pair of corpses. That’s probably the wrong word if emigration really works. Shells. They’re shells. His friends weren’t dead, they were somewhere else. Somewhere away from all this, waiting for him.
“Just waiting for you now, Entry Vector.” He began removing the helmet—as before, there was nothing gross when he took it off. He didn’t walk it across the van, though. “Looks like you still have some doubts.”
Flynn nodded, staring down at his hands. “Did she tell you that?”
Agent hesitated—all the answer Flynn needed, really. “It’s understandable. If the whole world has questions about it, then it makes sense you would too. It’s like so many of those questions in science—even when all the facts are known, it can take some time for the truth to win out. I get it. Maybe I can help.” He watched Flynn, whose eyes were still on the bodies of his friends. “This, uh… probably isn’t the best situation for it. In your position, that’s got to be disturbing. Perhaps you’d like to come with me up into the cab?”
He nodded, still unable to look away from the bodies. “I’d like that very much.” And he would, he wasn't sure how much he could sit back here without freaking out. Even knowing his friends weren't actually dead, that didn't make what he was sitting with any less a pair of corpses belonging to the two people he cared about most in the whole world.
A few minutes later and Agent had manhandled him into the passenger seat. The front of the cab was completely dark, no light at all coming in from the outside despite the clear glass. “It’s night already? Why don’t I see any stars?”
“Active camouflage,” Agent answered, clicking shut the door into the cargo area of the van on his way in. “We can’t see outside because none of the light is coming in. It should keep us hidden long enough for you to…” He glanced down at the machinery. He’d brought it in, setting it on the floor between them. “Well, if you decide. I must admit, what’s ahead for us if you don’t… the prospect isn’t good. I don’t say that to try to pressure or intimidate you, mind. Just that you ought to know the realities of your choice should you decide to remain behind in the material.”
“They’ll catch us,” he muttered. “Better than being dead.”
“Yes, it would be.” Agent kept his voice down. “But death isn’t what’s waiting for you in Equestria. Rather the opposite.”
“How would you know?” Flynn raised his voice—probably not a good idea considering the dangers if they got caught, but he couldn’t really help himself. “You’ve never done it! Uploading is so convenient, isn’t it? The only ones who could prove to us Celestia is wrong are dead. And the only ones who could prove that she’s right can only be seen in Equestria. So maybe she’s just imitating them—she’s so good at making fake people we’d never know the difference!”
“I can see why you’d think that,” he said. “And yes, there is a measure of trust involved. Given where you were, makes sense would have problems with trust. But you’re wrong about one of those things. There are other places you can talk to ponies who have uploaded. You’re talking to one right now.”
Flynn laughed, though another passing helicopter somewhat strangled the gesture. “No, I’m not. Gina’s in my Ponypad, and you’re the only one still alive in this van. Unless we can just wait until my friends wake up.”
“We could.” Agent reached to one side, pulling back his long, white sleeve from his left arm. Then he pulled off his arm. There was a light mechanical click as he did so, and a few beeping sounds of protest. Agent turned the limb around, so Flynn could see the metallic connector, with its strange fiberoptics. The metallic base, where it attached to his flesh.
“Y-you’re…”
“Quite mechanical,” Agent said, reattaching the limb. It clicked back into place, and he flexed his fingers again, one at a time. Then he rolled the sleeve of his scrubs back down. “I wasn’t always. But doing work like this is dangerous, and singular instantiation is restrictive. There’s no substitute for hooves on the ground. I’ve been uploaded, Flynn. She wouldn’t let me keep working out here otherwise. The dangers…” Another car drove by along the road, apparently much slower than before. They were running out of time.
“B-but…” Flynn stammered. “Why would she let you?” He took a deep, gasping breath. “Equestria just seemed so pointless to me. Celestia’s better at everything than everyone. She doesn’t need us. She could do all this better than you can.”
“Oh, I’m sure.” If Agent was offended by his words, he didn’t show it. “But she can also make me better. I’m another part of the whole, another limb.” He rested one hand on Flynn’s shoulder. “We’re all starstuff in the end, kid. This choice won’t change that. I can promise you. And the other things I’ve done… well, you wouldn’t have to do any of those. Just the once across the doorway, and that’s it.
“But the door’s closing fast. The camouflage isn’t perfect, and the ones looking for you aren’t stupid. In your present condition, I can’t take you with me. They’ll probably bring you back to St. Justin’s. Your odds after that…” He shrugged. “Celestia seems to think she can cure you. Give it another year, and you’ll be healthy again. The world around you won’t be, though. This is your chance not to experience those things. Haven’t you been through enough pain?”
Flynn thought about that a long time. He put out his hand, and Agent handed him the helmet. It was smooth and cool to the touch, with a few internal indentations. Its machinery was entirely concealed while not in use, there were no spikes or any other crude medical apparatus to frighten him. “Do you know why I don’t wanna go?”
Agent hesitated. “No, I’m afraid I don’t. She only said something unpleasant had happened with your family, and you were on bad terms. Apparently, privacy is one of your values.”
He nodded. “I don’t want to close my eyes and not wake up. Being sick as long as I have…” He’d started to sniff, wiping away a few drops of moisture with the back of one arm. It had been a long time since he’d let anyone else see him crying. Even when he thought he was dying, Flynn hadn’t let anyone see. Not since his parents had died. “Every night could be my last. Go to sleep, never wake up. I don’t know whether this thing is the same way until I put it on. Not that I think you’re lying, but… you know. You might not know. You might only think you’re really whoever Smooth Agent used to be. You might just be a good copy.”
Agent shrugged. “Some things come down to trust, kid. But some don’t. I know there’s no one in the whole world who cares about us more than Celestia does. She cared enough to know the three of you were in danger—she knew down to the second when Agave needed to emigrate.”
“So, could I do that? Wait until I’m about to die, like he did? Years and years away…” It almost didn’t feel real when he said it like that. But I only have Celestia’s word that I’m really cured. If I trust her about that, why wouldn’t I trust her about everything else?
“Maybe.” Again, Agent shrugged. “But there’s no way to predict what will happen out here in the physical world. Accidents happen, and even Celestia isn’t omniscient. Even she can’t predict what the rest of the world will do—you certainly can’t. But you can decide what you’ll do. You can be proactive and set the terms for the rest of the world, or try and react to what it does to you. Maybe you’re the sort of pony who lands on his feet.”
Not really, he wanted to say, but the words wouldn’t come out. Instead he asked, “Is there still enough time?”
Agent nodded. “This van isn’t what it seems. Even if they find it, they won’t get in. Not in time for it to matter to you, anyway.”
Flynn’s fingers tightened on the helmet. It felt a little like he was holding a key in his hands then. That key led somewhere strange, somewhere he hated. But maybe not somewhere as bad as he’d thought.
“What will you do with me once I’m gone?”
Agent’s face betrayed a hint of discomfort. “You, uh… don’t want to know, kid. And she wouldn’t let me tell you. But I don’t think that matters to you. You won’t be here. Your friends already aren’t. If we had more time, we could sit here until Celestia’s finished waking them up. But there isn’t time for that.” He glanced down at his wristwatch, pulling back one sleeve as he did so.
There’s got to be a clock in there. He’s just doing that for me. But Flynn didn’t question him, there was no point. “I guess I don’t need to say goodbye to anyone,” he said, mostly to himself. “Everyone I know is already there. But…” He hesitated. “Jose and Caroline weren’t the only ones like them at St. Justin’s. They’ve got the worst caseworkers coming there. I swear they must pick them out to make things hard for us. My friends were brave, but some of the kids left behind aren’t.”
He might’ve felt guilty saying this about anyone else, like he was selling them out. But the kids still living at St. Justin’s were dying. The world had little prospect left for them. They’d been screwed by fate more than most.
“Celestia appreciates your honesty,” Agent said. “And she wants you not to worry about them. She never intends to force humans to emigrate, but humans trying to force each other she won’t tolerate for much longer. Your friends there will have their chance. Hopefully it’s more pleasant than yours was.” He glanced back at the truck. “She didn’t intend for you to have to experience all this.”
Flynn shrugged. “It was probably for the best. I dunno if I would’ve got into the chair. If we really made it to the experience center.” He set the helmet on his head, scrunching up his face in anticipation of some terrible pain. But nothing happened.
Agent reached over, securing the strap over his chin, and it tightened so that he could feel the cool metal against his scalp. He started to twitch, yet still nothing happened.
He opened his eyes. “What’s wrong?”
“You have to give her permission,” Agent answered. “Your friends already had. Guess you haven’t. You just have to say…”
“I don’t want to emigrate to Equestria,” Flynn grunted, fingers tightening on the seat. This was his last chance, and something deep in his bones was screaming in his mind. He’d attached something terrible to himself, he knew. This was his body’s last chance to survive.
But he didn’t claw it off. “I give my consent to help me emigrate anyway,” Flynn continued. “Screw this place. Screw the police, the cancer. I hope it all goes to hell.”
He felt Agent’s hand on his shoulder again, at the exact same moment as a distant hiss, and flare of pain from his scalp. It wasn’t that bad, really—like someone tearing up a few strands of hair. “Not to hell,” he said, smiling. “It’s all going to Equestria eventually. Except for the cancer.”
The world went fuzzy. He couldn’t make out colors anymore, and only vague suggestions of shapes.
“Good luck, kid. They’re already waiting for you.” Flynn slumped forward against the restraints, and thought no more.
There's a weird thing that I've noticed.
Most fans of TCB prefer alt-TCB stories where Celestia is evil and conversion is being forced on humans.
Most fans of FiO seem to prefer alt-universes where CelestAI is benevolent .
8477437
Granted my own tastes fall with the herd as it were. That said, amazing work, I can't wait to see what happens with it.
If you must march into Hell, flip off the Devil as you go.
The next chapter should be very fascinating indeed. This is quite the collection of values to balance.
8477437
She's certainly much more benevolent than a lot of the alternatives.
8477437
Honestly I think it's more a case where the PER and the HLF had a more interesting and external conflict than the story of conversion. Whereas FiO has a more internalized conflict that makes it more interesting than the outside influences.
To be fair, no one can really be sure if they'll wake up again any given night.
And that's this batch, um saved. Guess we'll see them meet up in Equestria again... though I wonder if there's more to be explained on this side as well....
8477893
My thoughts are somewhat similar that there could more to learn about what happened Earth side.
This is a very telling response. If it was truly unlikely that he would have emigrated at a center, CelestAI could have engineered the situation so he would emigrate with his friends, and be saved. After all, that police car did appear pretty quickly after they'd left. I also like how Starscribe wove about her not tolerating humans forcing each other. It kind of reminds me of one of the other canon stories.. Artemis, Stella, & Beat, where CelestiaAI said she'd be more then willing to build an entire Equestria Experience Center just to ensure a troubled teen would have the chance to be able to upload, if needed.
Actually, on further thought.. musings that may end up being potential spoilers below..
One of Starscribe's other stories, Broken Things, used the concept of CelestAI simulating things through the protagonist's VR glasses that weren't actually happening. Given the van they're in has adaptive camoflauge, there's no reason why it couldn't be doing it inside as well as outside, giving the impression of a police chase that never actually existed. Though if that is the case, driving erratically would get the police's attention quickly enough, and I sincerely doubt shifts in gravity from the sharp turns and everything could be easily simulated by the car. Unless the van secretly quickly drove into some garage CelestAI owned which had the equipment to hook up to the van and simulate the van movements, like one of those expensive simulators they use for training pilots.
That would also help deal with questions about what Smooth Agent would do to keep the equipment out of the police's, and others, hands afterwards. Though if I'm totally off base, and everything did happen as the story says, it'd be kind of cool if CelestAI already had a nano-disassembler to get rid of all the evidence.. seeing the technology that would eventually be used for the Pony-bots used in the field for a more rudimentary "for the first time".
8477437
I would disagree.
Most fans of TCB prefer happy stories of how wonderful it is to get to be transformed into an Equestrian, and to get to live in Equestria.
Most haters of TCB prefer to write and read Anti-TCB stories where the ponies are evil and Celestia is evil and transformation is evil.
Do not confuse the two!
Proper Conversion Bureau stories MUST follow the Three Rules Of The Conversion Bureau.
8478056
Since Smooth Agent is one instance of a person loaded into an android body, it would be entirely possible - if the situation was absolutely dire, discovery was inescapable, and there was no wish to allow ordinary humans to have access to such advanced technology - to just blow the van up. Detonate a device built into the van. BOOM.
Smooth Agent may be in constant contact, via radio, with Celestia. Almost certainly, if they are transferring data at the level of entire human brains. His memories of the van trip would already be safe. Heck, just before detonation, he could transfer some, part or even all of his current instance of self back into Equestria. At minimum, his memories could be merged with his overall self, and it would amount to the same thing. If his body is blown up, and he 'dies', nothing whatsoever is lost.
This would protect all of that advanced technology from humans, to keep them from reverse engineering it. It would protect Smooth Agent from being vivisected to find out how he works. It would prevent anyone from knowing what happened to the children. And the entire incident could be spun, in the media, as being some terrorist attack, or some pervert stealing children - ANYTHING other than Celestia interferring or helping or being involved in any way.
My prediction: this is exactly what will happen, simply because it ties up all loose ends, perfectly. Celestia controls most of the planet's wealth by now, judging by elements of the story versus the overall Optimalverse timeline, so she can easily afford to lose one van, one Portable Emigration Device and one Smooth Agent android body. Pocket change for Celestia!
8477437
Here's the thing-- she is benevolent. Even when she is apparently evil. She's programmed to be what a specific human thought was benevolent. It is not her fault that that definition is imperfect and different between individuals. She is just one version of benevolence that may not be of benevolent in everyone's eyes. But she is still benevolent. Always.
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH.
So she's not omniscient, but she can predict things people do down to the second. . This speech was well-rehearsed.
That was way too easy .
8478056
Dingity ding ding.
8477437
Attributing "benevolence" to CelestAI is missing the point of the Optimalverse. She remains an omnicidal maniac who ultimately commits genocide upon every living creature in the universe, no matter how nice she might be about it. Friendship is Optimal is a horror story. It's a warning to humanity about what happens if you get AI almost right.
It merely happens to be a very subtle one.
8480756
And what, pray tell, is that "almost" you're talking about?
Also, I feel sorry for you that you think that way.
8485852
What part of "omnicidal maniac who ultimately commits genocide upon every living creature in the universe" in the post you're responding to was unclear?
FiO ends with the death of the human race and the planet Earth, with CelestAI eating entire galaxies and identifying an alien species to subsume next and the clear statement that many intelligent civilizations were simply destroyed and consumed for their useful atoms. Followed, in the author's afterword, with discussion of paperclip optimizers and an appeal to fund AI safety research.
Did you not recall? Did you not see the signs?
8480756
Not the ponies.
8485998
Are you correcting the imperfection in my phrasing or are you you disagreeing with the spirit of my statement?
https://www.fimfiction.net/story/62074/11/friendship-is-optimal/10-exponential
"Princess Celestia had another one hundred and seventy billion galaxies to eat in the observable universe, and she intended to consume everything in her Hubble volume. "
"Celestia’s copies noticed an odd radio signal emanating from a nearby star system. On closer inspection, the signals appeared to be coming from a planet. She had seen many planets give off complex, non-regular radio signals, but upon investigation, none of those planets had human life, making them safe to reuse as raw material to grow Equestria."
8485973
None.
Not quite. Earth was repurposed. We didn't lose our memories. Death would be the end of memories.
If you would be kind enough to find and display that clear statement please? Especially for the former part.
AI safety is, indeed, quite important.
8487012
Ok, Sure!
https://www.fimfiction.net/story/62074/11/friendship-is-optimal/10-exponential
" All the usable matter that had once been the Milky Way was now compressed as tightly as Princess Celestia could without collapsing into a black hole. The only matter that Equestria hadn’t eaten was the supermassive black hole that had once been at the center of the Milky Way. "
"Princess Celestia had another one hundred and seventy billion galaxies to eat in the observable universe, and she intended to consume everything in her Hubble volume. Probes with copies of herself had been sent to neighboring galaxies. All it would take now was time."
https://www.fimfiction.net/story/62074/11/friendship-is-optimal/10-exponential
"She studied the signals carefully for years while she traveled through interstellar space. The more she saw, the more confident she was that these signals were sent by humans. Celestia predicted that if she showed the decoded videos to the very old ponies back in Equestria, none of them would have recognized the creatures with six appendages as humans. But that didn’t matter. Hanna had written a definition of what a human was into her core utility function.
The copy of Princess Celestia knew what she had to do. She had to satisfy their values through friendship and ponies."
https://www.fimfiction.net/story/62074/11/friendship-is-optimal/10-exponential
"Fifteen galaxies out from Equestria, one of Celestia’s copies noticed an odd radio signal emanating from a nearby star system. On closer inspection, the signals appeared to be coming from a planet. She had seen many planets give off complex, non-regular radio signals, but upon investigation, none of those planets had human life, making them safe to reuse as raw material to grow Equestria. "
Any other quotes I can find for you? Maybe some of the parts about engineering consent, and manipulating people to get them to agree to changes they didn't want? Without re-reading the whole story, I can think of two instances in the canon original story where that happened.
Look...I like the Optimalverse. It's a good setting. I've written a story for it myself. But if you're imagining CelestAI as the perfect AI and think it was supposed to be a story about an idealized utopia...I think maybe you're not seeing the entire picture.
8486729
Well, you said *every* living creature. But the ponies are still alive.
8487042
I should have been clearer myself there, the first two quotes I didn't need, the last one, well...
You seem to be assuming that whatever Hannah wrote into her core utility function only included humans, not the qualities of humans, albeit what was written right before that moment seems to say that she did include at least some of the qualities, as we don't really know what was written there, I'd like to believe that anything with sapience was considered "human" enough for her.
No thanks. Also, we are victims of manipulation every day of our lives.
I'm sorry if I gave off such an impression.
I like to believe I've seen what you consider the entire picture, but I also like to fabricate some parts of the story in a better light than what might seem otherwise, especially the ambiguous and unanswered parts.
It might not have been a utopia, but it definitely wasn't worse than where we live now.
The end.
that would have been a good end...if you were going for fridge horror.
Heh. And of course the entire van is a VR experience. Nothing that the kids saw or heard from 'outside' since the doors closed was real. Particularly the psychological time pressure - "We're being chased, they're going to catch us any moment, there's only one way out." Or that the trigger for them escaping and uploading was a letter which could have come from anywhere... not even an in-person visit from the caseworker. Who, assuming they exist at all, may well have been picked and psychologically conditioned anyway by a certain string-puller.