qtip6
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Gotta say, I really enjoy where this is going so far!
Aw, Twilight...
You have a good understanding of the major conflict within Divided Rainbow. Just this alone makes me eager to see how you handle The Swapped when they're awake!
Ha! Should've thought of this one, myself!
Ooh, exciting! You're taking things in an intriguing direction with this "Shift" thing of yours...
Loving the description! And Trixie is so cute, the way you handle her! Jacob is pretty cool so far too. A lot yet to flesh out, perhaps, but not a completely featureless "Anon," nor a Mary Sue. He's likable!
I love the comedy of all this. Poor Jacob! And Trixie just continues to be adorable in her own way. The whole chapter's well-written, it ends on a good cliffhanger, can't wait for more! Bravo, Qtip!
whoa! a new leroverse story outta left field!
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orig15.deviantart.net/7219/f/2012/358/e/a/sad_trixie__animation__by_pinkkirbz-d5p10wy.gif
I like this so far :)
All I could think was, "We got this guy 'Not Sure' who's gonna fix everything!"
Interesting start. I wouldn't worry about the whole 'another human in the Leroverse' thing. It worked well with Gus' story. If this character has something to offer (and it looks good so far, once he recovers from the concussion he just unwittingly earned) he'll do fine. If anything, I've always liked the idea of Lero having another human to compare a few 'wtf happened to us' notes with. I was actually hoping he'd see his family again somehow, like when Discord took him 'home' in Divided Rainbow (though probably just a dream sequence, still with Discord it could have been both...) Whether this story goes in that direction or not is fine though.
Trixie... well I'm on the fence about her canonically speaking. It doesn't seem like her contrition for her actions is genuine here; that would be unfortunate since it would make her a bit of a flat character, incapable of growth. But it's too soon to say. Also, out-humbling Jacob was adorable and hilarious, so she gets a pass for the moment.
There's a few minor errors and such, but I'm not going to nitpick about them here. Overall, the writing's good. There's little touches of humor and it flows well. I'm looking forward to the next chapter.
6925853 You've hit the nail on the head! One of the biggest advantages to a second human (like Gus) is to give Lero a commiseration buddy.
I've always thought Trixie to be a villain character from the show with tremendous room for growth, actually. To me she is a very 'human' pony: insecure, prideful, flawed, and lonely. She's not a villain by her own design, she's just at odds with the world.
Compared to some of the more recent show antagonists (*cough* Glimmer *cough*) that go from incredibly evil (for very lame originating reasons) to being friends with everyone (for equally lame resolution reasons), I've always though Trixie would have been one of the best characters to get a little more time, if not a redemption arc.
Thanks for the comment! As I mentioned, the rust should hopefully continue to shake off as we go along, and I can't wait to reveal more of the plot as we go along!
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I completely agree with you, about Trixie... and Starlight. That whole thing was an ambitious project, Harrison Bergeron in FIM? Kudos to the writers for trying something like that, but yeah I just didn't buy into that character at all. And then her lame excuse? Yeah really didn't buy it... especially since magic of her level obviously required leaning heavily on whatever talent came with her own mark. Paper thin hypocrite... boring. http://www.fimfiction.net/story/305811/thats-it More or less summed up my thoughts on that one.
Trixie is much more interesting. She could have learned after her first appearance. But the truth is she didn't do much wrong, really. Okay, a little overly harsh in dealing with her hecklers, by pony standards (though George Carlin might have applauded); as a performer knowing your audience is key. Sets like that one, even without the monster rampaging later, would eventually sink her career. Humiliating pillars of communities (and national heroes in this case) isn't the best idea in the long term, whether they've got it coming or not. Still, not that major a thing. The humble pie in the end could have taught her something. It didn't, and that's actually fine, because again, she wasn't really too far in the wrong. It all came from a fairly innocuous lie; the kind of thing a performer might use to get themselves over. Her second appearance... yeah less defensible, but also more contrition afterward. Plus not really knowing the Alicorn Amulet would corrupt her (I assume... if she just didn't care that's less interesting though it does bespeak a certain determination) is a point in her favor. So yes, she is definitely set up for a worthwhile character arc. I look forward to reading it; enjoy your weekend!
Interesting. I look forward to seeing more. I always enjoy to see new stories in the Leroverse.
People do not like change. But provided the human is of actual purpose to the story and not a waifu stealer, its usually fine.
Both Chimera and Xenophilia: Advanced brought new humans into the Leroverse and they are both seen to be positive stories amongst the vast majority of the community.
Okay, Wow, this is getting amazing- We've got, what, a side-story, a crossover, and now two spin-offs? Impressive!
So, just some of my own observations:
While I can definitely see Dash, Rarity, and even Lero being late sleepers, but Lyra's been well established as an early riser, as she goes out training early in the morning. I understand if you don't want her to have her in the following scenes/conversations, but that's easily resolved by having her, well, leave to train. Though you might want to consider keeping her for the morning conversation at least- she's a terribly underutilized character a lot of the time, and she is in the know about the swap.
Ok, this strikes me as a bit odd, as it's clear Trixie's aware he's not a pony- specifically citing his "Special Talent" is kinda- racist? I dunno if that's the right word. Griffons, Minotaurs, and plenty of other races exist with no equivalence to the pony ideas of Cutie Marks and Special talents. Perhaps she could say after his confusion something to the effect of, "Oh, please, even if you don't have a cutie mark, you must have something you're good at!"
Those were the big things that stuck out for me. Good luck with the stories!
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Great feedback Rikmach, and exactly the type I like: clear, concise, and with concrete examples.
I do admit I kept the bulk of the girls asleep for simplicity, and I wasn't aware of Lyra's tendency to train early... I knew she was a Grand Master but didn't know if that translated to having a rigid discipline as well... I do like that thinking though, and don't worry, Lyra is one of my favorite Divided Rainbow characters, and she'll play a part in this story.
On your second point, I had meant for Trixie to play a bit of a 'sticks to the script even when it makes no sense' trope. I saw her as expecting a pony crowd and not deviating from that expectation. I considered her possible experience with minotaurs and other non-ponies and how that statement could come off as a bit species-ist. While Trixie is a bit oblivious and rude, I wouldn't want her to have too negative of an impression either.
Hope you don't mind if I use your edits. :)
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Thanks! Mike brought me on as an editor for a reason, I suppose. :)
Yeah, Lyra embodies allot of the "Wise Master" tropes, but in a good, fun way. (Being young and female breaks a lot of the cliches, after all.)
I got what you were going for, but Equestria is pretty multi-ethnic with Donkies, Zebras, and other living among the populace- and one assume Griffons and Minotaurs would show up on towns near the border- so one assumes her default script allows for them.
Of course not, that was the point of offering them.
All I can say is that I like where this is going. Well written, well paced, and you've managed to capture the essence of characters. Heck I like the way you managed to portray Luna.
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Many stories have her using way too many thee and thou and not actually speaking correctly at all.
All in all, I give this a 9/10 :)
can not wait to see where you go with this story
I agree with the first poster; this really is a solid start. When I get annoyed that I'm getting close to the end of a chapter in a story that's really not even off the ground yet it's a good sign. I will say I'm a bit worn thin of the 'ye olde butchered Englishe' approach with Luna... she hasn't talked that way in several seasons. But you're hardly the only writer to go that route with her, so it's a minor gripe, a smirking eye roll at most. She certainly speaks formally in canon to this day, but most of her original patterns just aren't so pronounced. Other than that her portrayal was good, no issues with the content of her role here.
I like how Trixie talked about mastering healing spells without apparently offering to cast one; instead she lets Sweetie knock herself out... literally. She's nice enough to try and get Jacob to a hospital after almost braining him but she hasn't left behind her character, flaws and all.
The humor here was good. It really suits the DR Leroverse to go with a reference like Alien for laughs, just as one example. Worked for me. On a related note, the other characters came in well in terms of being on point to how I see them in this verse. That's no small task to take on, and so far you look to have a handle on it.
The upcoming meeting definitely has me looking forward, nice work all around here.
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Thanks for your comments! They mean a lot, definitely brings a smile to know the story is being enjoyed even at such an early stage.
I subscribe to the character theory that people revert to their comfort zone when stressed. Luna, for all her modernizing is still a mare brought forward from 1000 years in the past, especially at this point of the chronology where DR is set. When the chips are down, her old accent and even ways of thinking may come out.
I am so glad that I'm getting the right feel on the Leroverse/DR characters thus far... so essential to be able to carry over the feel.
I'm also happy the humour is carrying over. I never want it to feel cheap, but the little crossovers are such a fun part of DR and pony fics in general.
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Yeah, that's the excuse everyone uses, even if the Tantibus episode more or less sinks it at this point, for us, if not within this fic's chronology. Still, I'm debating just to debate, no malice in it. My question would be though: while that's an in universe reason for her linguistic reversion, why make that choice as an author? It's difficult to properly write in that style, 9 out of 10 bungle it. I won't spoil whether you did, since it's not that important, but I'm curious what drives the decision to use it.
6966255
No worries, nothing like a friendly debate.
I think that by season 4/5 Luna has had a bit more time to modernize her speech. For me the Luna of Nightmare Night, reaching back out to society for the first time in millennia, unsure, hesitating, awkward, struck a very true chord.
As an author, there's no big reason as to why to use that inflection. Early on in stories one of your biggest risks is that your characters have the same 'voice'. Masterful authors can create that different voice easily... but for myself, in a new story, posting for the first time in this community... I'll take the easy way as much as I can get away with. This means Luna goes Shakespearian, Applebloom gets a drawl, and Rarity gets flighty and posh. It probably feels cheap to readers like you, but with the majority it should feel comfortable and familiar (I hope). When I'm a bit more confident in my ability, I can put those more junior tools aside.
Do let me know if there are any errors though, I'd rather they are pointed out and corrected than stay in the text!
Cheers!
6966303
Nah, I wouldn't call it 'cheap'. It's a stylistic choice and a valid one; I just wanted to hear the reasoning. It's not a mistake, especially if her early characterization has meaning for you. That's as good a reason as any; this is a fanfic, after all. As to searching for errors... well I don't normally do that. I'm actually a professional editor (sales magazine... not the most exciting work), so off the clock, as it were, I prefer to just discuss stylistic variations and light literary theory as opposed to harping on typos. That said, I'll keep my eyes open.
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Ah gotcha. Well I appreciate the support!
Another good one!
Let's see, the prologue was called "Illegal Immigration," this one is "Assault and Battery," I'm starting to pick up on a theme in your chapter names... whatever could it mean...
Oh, Scootaloo. So close and yet so far.
I love whenever someone's able to make fun of this cliched old line!
Ooh, visceral. And it's such an image: Jacob on Trixie's back while he's bleeding and unconscious like this.
<--
<-- First he's mistaken for a minotaur, then for Lero, himself! Nice touch!
Awww...
. <-- This really IS so Rarity; she really would get irked to see Lero hurt. Plus, I love the image of her beating him while on her hind legs, so serenely.
Wonderful; really does feel at home in DR.
Dr. Lero, MD. THIS is gonna be quite the conversation!
Well done! Can't wait to see the next one!
6968627
Thanks MT!
Was a big relief to see you approved of how I voiced Rarity, and that you enjoyed this chapter.
Let me know if you ever think I'm missing any important DR themes!
Ok! time to get my review on! *Cracks knuckles*
On days like these, kids like you should be burning in hell.
...Sorry, couldn't resist the reference.
"Well... yeah, maybe, sometimes!" Scootaloo snapped defensively.
Arterial blood? From a head injury?
I mean, don't get me wrong, there's going to be a lot of blood from a head injury, but the arteries are buried inside the skull when it comes to the head. Arterial spray tends to come from neck or limb injuries.
Is this a reference to the Cross-Race Effect? (Well, I suppose it'd be the Cross-Species Effect, here), where people have difficulty identifying specific members of other races? (Well, species, again here.)
I see Lyra's been taking lessons from The Sphinx.
"Pain is, after all, an excellent teacher."
Well, not since Gus vanished/possibly died.
Not good enough to actually offer casting a spell, I see, Beatrix Lulamoon.
Well, third contact, now. You'd figure Twilight would have started taking notes after Gus's arrival, since it proved Lero wasn't a Fluke
Especially since that's the route Gus, took, too.
Honestly, they're lucky the Princess showed up and interrupted, so they didn't get a dressing down from Lyra, after all, she's the Guard Reserve in charge of Ponyvlle. Honestly, you'd expect the guard to recognize her and give her a heads up instead of treating her like a Civvie.
Once again implying Lero's tougher than your average human.
One assumes this same protocol was in effect for Gus, but since it was first-person, and he was unconscious for weeks, he never saw it, and he was probably announced before he woke up.
Thankfully, there's probably a couple in Gus's old lab.
anyhow, man, that's a pretty good chapter, there. The only real problem I can point out is you forgot that Jacob is the third human to arrive in Equestria- since Xenophilia: Advanced is in-continuity to Divided Rainbow.
Hope this helps!
6997750
Hey Rikmach!
I've been waiting on pins and needles for this review!
Great points as always! I especially liked your feedback on how I'd handled Gus.
I think I need to reread Xeno:advanced so I can refamiliarize myself with that story and reference Gus appropriately. You picked up on the hints I pointed out, but I chickened out of outright mentioning Gus's story.
As always, incredible feedback! Can't wait to show you more!
Isn't Lyra's rank Seargeant?
First: awesome work, man. Second, whoops, run a quick check, you didn't change all of the times you used 'Doctor Horse' or 'Tenderheart' to the correct names.
7045614
I'd have to go back and read the older stories to be sure of her rank, but that sounds plausible.
Pacing is good. I am enjoying this immensely! The only thing we need now is for Celestia to assign Amicus a partner so we can have Tango and Cash moments <chuckles>
Can't wait to see what ya have in store for us :)
7053332
Thanks! Caught them!
I feel like Amicus is closer to Lawful Neutral than Lawful Good. Good is relative to a society in question, not an absolute. For example, many humans would consider polygamy a sin, but it's perfectly acceptable in this universe. Traditions, really most societal mores in Equestria, would very likely be heavily influenced by Celestia's outlook. He clearly hates her guts, implying a more personal code that drives him. Sure, he's all about punishing criminals, but no real sense of mercy. I don't buy that Red's family is safe; I don't think Amicus cares. Further... that little bit of near entrapment was on the deceitful side. Insinuations are pretty close to lies, and with Honesty being a paramount virtue in Equestria... I can expound on that if needed, but that's my first look take. That said, he looks like a lot of fun. A hero antagonist has great story potential; I'm looking forward to seeing how he plays out... as long as he doesn't go all author soapbox. I really liked that Celestia snarked back at him. Mutual antagonism is way more interesting than anything one sided could have been.
First, wasn't that guy's name Red Ledger? Amicus keeps calling him Mr. Books; what am I missing? Is it just his nickname for him? Second, that was slander... libel is in published works such as newspapers. The Spider Man movie from 2002 did that one in reverse:
Nice work on this chapter, and thank you for the save. I had just closed a story that I couldn't get past chapter 1 of, and then I saw this had updated. You saved my first break at work from being spent browsing. Looking forward to Jacob waking up and joining the party.
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My pleasure Sun Sage! Great feedback as always!
On Amicus, that's an interesting take on the Lawful Neutral... you are actually probably correct on that; he is a character who is not passionate about good or evil so much as right or wrong (the distinction is subtle).
Thanks for the catch on 'Books'... it was the result of a late character name change and some missed replacements, originally Ledger's name was going to be Cooked Books, but that's a bit too on the nose.
Amicus will definitely be outspoken, and he definitely has issues with Celestia's rule, but I'm only using it to develop his character a bit - no soapboxes if I can help it!
Glad I could save you from a reddit browse or - God forbid - actually doing work for a bit!
7054099
Hah! Work... this guy... nah I meant browsing for another story to read... hey it's a 15 minute break, dammit man, there's no time! As to reddit... I mean... I read clop fics but I do have standards. Lastly... Cooked Books was exactly the other name I was assuming was happening there. I actually went back and looked for something like Amicus saying 'So then, Mr. Cooked Books, or whatever name you're using these days...' so yeah I hear ya there. Have a good day!
I'm really digging Amicus. He could almost be the hero of his own HBO cop drama. He's crafty and knows the law, and he's clearly big on punishment. Plus, "two-bit whorse," in human terms, that'd be like calling someone your queen a cheap ape-whore. And his frustrations with her are not entirely unwarranted.
I can't wait to see what Jacob's like when he wakes up.
I certainly enjoyed the transitions here. Reminded me of Archer and I love that show. Amicus is pretty grating for me, but I fully expected that and it's not a knock. He's simply not the sort of personality I get along with, so I look forward to rolling my eyes at him more as we go along.
It's funny, I started re-reading Divided Rainbow a couple days ago because I figured either it or this would be updating soon. So thanks for proving either my intuition, pattern recognition, or sheer coincidence right.
As to Jake, I like him. I'm sure he can sort things out with Twilight after a rough first meeting. His somewhat juvenile humor, intentional or not, plays a nice foil to Lero's generally more serious outlook on things. That riding comment was just too good... Although it's too soon to really draw an opinion on his characterization, so far there's plenty to work with. Keep him grounded would be my advice... figuratively speaking. He's got a lot going for him in terms of his manners, observational skills, and life experiences, so there's a lot to build on while he's figuring out what to do with the craziness of Equestria. I look forward to seeing his reactions... both the good and the bad ones.
Also, kudos on the Bon Bon thing. I was wondering why she was tagged, or rather how she'd play a part in the story since the tag tells me to expect her. Working in that Slice of Life bit is a nice touch, much better than randomly entering the story just 'cause... or getting dragged in by Lyra.
This was a fun chapter, see you next time!
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Always awesome to hear from you Sun Sage, I always look forward to your comments!
It's funny, I didn't even think of Archer when I wrote some of those transitions but you're totally right: it is absolutely in that style!
Well I think he'll definitely be that way with many readers, hard-nose types tend to be, especially if they are doing so without seeing the bigger picture. Do let me know if that grating feeling ever seems to be expanding beyond the character to just how he is written in general though. The plan is to have Amicus be the type of antagonist that you shake your head / roll your eyes at.... until every once in a while he has a point that makes you a bit uncomfortable because you don't really want to agree with him but you almost have to. My favorite villains are the ones which fall into that gray area, but t can be hard to hit that note!
Nice! First dialogue scenes are always a bit awkward as you have to find that balance between establishing a character without going so far as to make them seem strained and over the top. You're right in spotting the counterpoint between Lero & Jake, I'm hoping that will let them play off each other, nothing like having a foil for variety!
So far, I'm really enjoying Jake, and I'm excited to see what it'll be like when he meets more ponies, face-to-face! I also like Amicus too, in his own way, though it's clear he's being set up as the antagonist.
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Thanks MT!
Glad you like Amicus thus far!
As I've mentioned, my favorite antagonists are relatable and even seem to make sense. Amicus has a lot of fire in him, even when dealing with Celestia, which is quite rare in a native Equestrian pony. He's fun to write, as any character with the courage (or foolishness) to accost a demigod is!
Jake will start needing to deal with ponies quite a bit, and I hope his character shines through!
It's been awhile since I read Xenophilia. IIRC, didn't Lero have to learn Equestrian? Also, wouldn't a Canadian know that we Yanks don't eat horses? So he would have known Lero was a Yank. These quibbles aside, great story.
I've seen enough cop shows to know local cop vs fed is pretty common. This is a promising start.
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I never saw it addressed, if he did need to learn or get a translation spell let me know so I can tune Lex Divisia up.
On the horse meat side, though uncommon, it's definitely a meat you can still obtain in North America.
I've never tried, but I understand it is quite tough and not flavorful.
I think Lero's brought it up with the girls before, so it shouldn't be too surprising or shocking to them at least.
Sorry, my memory is as reliable as a campaign promise. Rereading Xenophilia, it starts several months after Lero's arrival. Several side stories assume Equestrian= English.
I was thinking of Advanced Xenophilia. Gus can't understand them at 1st. But Gus has brain damage & can't understand ANYONE until he is healed.
Darn shame this seems to be over.