It is seventy-five years after the HLF and human intelligence services defeated the pony invasion of Earth. Celestia is a prisoner of mankind, reduced to being a source of magical blood used to make ponification potion. Ponification has become the punishment for even minor crimes. Yes, humanity stands triumphant. So why are the HLF and the PER back? Is Celestia really so powerless? Does she have a plan? Or has the loss of Equestria and all that she loves simply driven her mad?
This story is a sequel to Chatoyance's Conversion Bureau story Brand New Universe: Chapter 7 - Mankind Triumphant - please read it before reading this one. When I first read Mankind Triumphant it shook me to the bone. It scared me, it kept me awake, it affected me. When she invited others to submit stories around her New Universe scenarios, I knew I could not refuse. I felt this story calling to me. Resistance was futile. So here it is. BTW I have Chatoyance's permission, for which I am very grateful indeed!
Artwork by Mythee AKA Glowball
Dear readers,
I again humbly beg for your feedback. Should I do more chapters in this setting? Any suggestions?
Dafaddah
Neat story but Yellowstone is still best setting.
651895
Might this have something to do with the upcoming contest?
BTW - the Azure Future / Code Majeste settings is one of my favorites.
652002 What about the fic that has the dude in it?
652002
Uhhh, thanks. AAF and LMS are more of the same universe than AAF and Code Majeste. No actual expansion until all (but one, rest in piece Isaac you magnificent bastard) of mankind is gone, than a single world encompassing burst.
Yellowstone is one of the best and most optimistic universes. No expansion. Earth just gained some neighbors and some magic crazy. Definitely worth a read.
The event? No, nothing to do with that. Event is TCB in the past.
I'm confused about the ending
652633
Dear Midnight,
I am not surprised that you're confused. It was my intent to make this story very ambiguous on multiple fronts (see my latest blog entry). Wilberforce believes in the righteousness of his position and is basically a decent person, although perhaps a bit manipulative - he is after all a politician! His feelings towards Celestia are complex: he was raised by ponies and to an extent has a somewhat fanboyish desire to meet her. What does he really want from her?
And why is Celestia being so casual about the meeting? Has she truly gone insane, or is she hiding something from Wilberforce?
So dude, be confused. But I hope it's a good confused. Let me know if I succeeded in my intent, or if you think I just screwed it up.
Dafaddah
652080
LMS is also one of my favorites. And I have read the Yellowstone series. Since I am more science oriented I have to admit the stories that I enjoy the most are the ones that explore the whole singularity combined with an inexorably expanding Equestria. The combination provides a well developed background with a lot of scope for conflict so I feel it is a very rich source of plausible plots.
To be perfectly honest about it, I wanted to write something in TCB setting since I first discovered FIMfiction, but I wanted to improve my writing skills on something else before taking the plunge. It's just my luck that The Good of The Many grew to 18 chapters, and so it took a while longer than I had anticipated. (I had way too much fun working out the science of magic!)
But I have to hand it to Chatoyance. What she did with Brand New Universe is awesome. I would never have had the emotional guts to write the original Mankind Triumphant. It hurt reading it the first time, but writing Relic really forced me to think hard about the characters and their motivations, so I'm really glad she did BNU.
652025
Do you mean Last Man Standing?
653949 no the other dude.
653445 Well, let me unravel the ending? It appears that you are suggesting Celestia's playing a game and putting on a show of letting the humans think they have won, when in reality their world is 90% pony, I just wasn't sure what "simulacrum" meant in this context...
654263
Or this just a self-delusion the damaged mind of Celestia has evolved as a way to cope with her disastrous failure?
654400 That's the alternative, and her sister is dead/not there. That ambiguity could have been enhanced with some muddling words from your omniscient narrator. A bit of the back-and-forth needs some work for flow, and for having the moral banter not be cliche or trite, but it was an interesting story. It's interesting how the worlds are converging - I was planning on having domestic helper ponies (you wouldn't have to pay them, you see), and that would be an interesting place to take it. You give your young to "the enemy" to raise them - but then that's what man has always done. Slaves then, maids now, often they are of a lower/conquered class. I see no reason that would be changed.
I am sorry I did not get to this sooner, Dafaddah. I have been so busy with my own writing and my home life. WOW! What an interesting twist, one that I did not expect. You kind of did for my dark ending what I did with Brony Of Steel's Ten Minutes, and I think that is SO COOL!
The notion that the head in the treasure chest is a lifeline to a sort of covert completion of ponification, the concept of Celestia's inhumanly superior intelligence having worked out that humanity would do all the work for her, themselves - brill stuff, chilling, alien, wonderful.
Plus, the alternative notion that Celestia could just be completely insane now... even creepier and more chilling. What delightful ambiguity!
I very much liked this story, and I really enjoyed your unique take on this alternate CB universe. Great job!
I give that the title is clever. I could even say that the story clever too, but you need the right mindset to get into it. That mindset has you ignoring Wilber's contradictive behaviour and the overly dramatic narration (as well as the strange "Mankind Triumphant" label that keeps popping up). I can't see any reason why he wants to slap Celestia around with his dick while hoping it would get bigger instead of being: "Look at this! It could have worked just fine from the beginning. This is much better than what you were doing."
Still, this is a nice fic, you have to actually pay attention, or you may end up confused. Though I might add that making ambigousness an end in itself often works against the story. For example, you could say the ending is ambiguous only cause of Wilber's "so great compassion".
659205
If you have not read Chatoyance's story on which mine is based the references to Mankind Triumphant, Sachs' cutlural baggage and view of Celestia (in this universe the HLF won and got to write the historyy books) and the origin of Celestia's situation (a head in a box) will not be clear. Sorry for the overdramatic narration, but most of this story happens from his PoV and this is how I imagine him thinking. BTW - thanks for the feedback!
659884
What is it with kids these days? So, so hasty... It would've taken you just one mouseclick to find out that I've not just read the aforementioned piece, but actually already wrote a one-shot based on it. I called it "strange" because Mankind Triumphant is nothing more than a story title, so why would Wilber keep mentioning it all the time? I suppose it has some actual purpose, but not even a passing mention is given about it (say, it couldn't have anything to do with Celestia's assassination since there were different projects). Strange is the word.
Dude,
You are absolutely correct. I will actually fix that in Relic. And I will give you credit.
And I am tickled to be called a kid, mostly because my adult offspring would likely violently agree. Rest assured that I am in no wise minded to change that particular aspect of my character! (But I am indeed very grateful for advice on how to improve my writing and my stories.)
Thanks again,
Dafaddah da kid (and who da ghost?)
This was amazing, creepy, brilliant and... wow. Just wow. I could not have imagined so much coming from one little story notion. Wow.
Good old Megan.
Well, Celestia that's what you get for sticking your neck out for people. Some may like it, but many will just want to see heads roll. Still the sheer amount of effort makes her stand head and shoulders above the rest. Such effort would surely help anypony get ahead in life as long as they face the facts.
Yeah I'm done now. Liked this story. The original story was by no means subtle and was quite the punch to the gut. I wanted humanity to win and push back that damnable shield, not completely annihilate Equestria. Here, I'm glad to see you explore Celestia's mind after that incident it is quite interesting.
818873
This story had the same effect on me. One of the great things about the TCB stories is the opportunity to really explore a bit more of the motivations behind Celestia's actions. But when I read Mankind Triumphant, after the initial horror, it dawned on me that finally this was key to "realistically" getting inside of Celestia's head, explore who she really is. Luna is way easier as she has gone through a redemptive process already, she is more human and more accessible, (see my story The Vacation Crew) but Celestia is still unsullied and thus far less approachable.
Anyway, I'm glad you liked it. More to come, but a bit more slowly as I am having to share limited writing time with another story I am doing on Equestria in the "pre-classical age" (Renaissance Pony)
Here is chapter three of Relic. Sorry for the longer than usual delay, but I've had to split my writing time between this story and Renaissance Pony. Get ready for some new friends and some old villains.
Bwa - ha - ha -ha.... er... 
Interesting. I must say 'm quite happy with this story so far. As bad as the punch to the guts the original provided, I loathe fixfics with a burning passion. And this story sidestepped that nicely.
854194
I'm glad you like it so far. The reason the original story bothered me so wasn't (just!) the kick in the guts ending, but rather the opportunity it presented to really get inside Celestia's head and get to know her at a much more fundamental level than is possible with the 'squeaky clean' Celestia. In one of my other fics ( The Good of the Many) I ultimately chickened out and had her unconscious most of the time. (But the Luna fans loved seeing little sister take charge for a while!)
I guess the reason this is so important to me is that the whole issue of whether Equestria is an utopia or a dystopia depends on Celestia's motivations - which are completely opaque in the canon.
However, I have to admit that as I plotted out what I wanted to do with this fic it became apparent that I could also have major fun with the HLF and PER along with some of the other tropes from the TCB storylines.
Brilliant. It was all a lie! Theres nothing wrong with her, and her plan continues unabated. And that is why she is Celestia the ever living or maybe that was mumra I don't know.
Oh, but you read just chapter 1. Celestia can't just get out of this nightmare that easily now, nor scott-free, can she? Maybe all is not as it seems...
BWA-HAH! Bwa-ha-ha-HAAAAHH!!!
Please read on and chapter 2 will disabuse you of that notion. And then chapter 3 will make you doubt again.
But let me tell you this: we still have not seen the real conflict that will test our Celestia in her new circumstances (yes- foreshadowing!!!!)
You have truly added so much to this concept, I love the way you portray Celestia in the Treasure Chest, it rings true for me, and has so much power.
You are doing a magnificent job.
I like this. I'm glad you feel my story is interesting enough to add to your own and I approve of where you're taking it - my own works may differ quite a bit, but I'm glad to inspire others. Keep on with this, where it takes you.
Needs more of Celestia doing "stand-up" comedy and barraging people with head jokes.
Wow. Just wow. Equestria as magical simulation. A growing resistance. This is so good.
I am ever being impressed by 'Relic'.
So we find us once again in the face of Solaris, this time in the form of the severed head of a pony princess, how droll.
Wilberforce makes the obvious mistake to assume some kind of common ground with Celestia. He only realizes that when he notices how alien her eyes are. And for exactly that reason I won't even start to speculate about whether Celestia is actually sane or not, the only way to think inside the box is through her head. Not a good place for a human mind.
The part that got me most was the idea of a newfoal alone in the conversion dream. That must be quite like the ultimate nightmare of loneliness. The whole point of the conversion was reaching a bond with the rest of the world, the herd of ponies. Being all alone in that dream is about the saddest thing.
And I have to confess to smiling at the dream about Celestia waking up in Canterlot as just a head. Am I a bad person for rereading that scene with he voice of Marlon Brando?
In 2035 she is aware of Luna being imaginary. When she talked to Luna in chapter one (2100 A.D.) she did not appear to be. Either she has found a way to reopen a "channel" to Luna or she is losing it.
A Mr Hood who is an agent of chaos? Great classics Batman, this is priceless!
And Discord! Well it was to be expected, they stole him from Canterlot. He would not twiddle his thumbs (paws? claws?) in a universe that is ruled by entropy. I wonder if this may be his endgame: Leaving the controlled and confined Equestria for more chaotic pastures.
And my usual warning to you, as with any story that might go down this way: Think twice before you include recursion, that path leads to madness.
1116436
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I am concerned that the storyline is already pushing the encelop for complexity, so no recursion! And I fixed the erroneous complete flag.
When we left Celestia in AD 2035 she was beginning to adjust to her severely reduced circumstances. Twenty years later, she is beginning to have sufficient resources to take action and selects an agent from the outside world: a newfoal member of her herd. This chapter begins a new story arc, one that will see Celestia's will and heart severely tested. Can she ever be happy after her loss? Should she risk what little she has to again meddle in the affairs of humans?
As usual please leave me your comments about this chapter, what worked, what didn't and how I could improve things.
And so things are set in motion. Looking forward to seeing what comes next
Oh, this is exciting and splendid. I have loved your Relic work, and this had me on the tip of my toes. It is also quite interesting to see Celestia beginning to take initial steps to solve this situation.
Your elite corporate nasties are appropriately ruthless, and the story was well told. If I have any complaint it is that - perhaps - I would have liked to see Victoria during her initial few days of adapting to being a pony. I am a sucker for poignant tragic innocence and it draws me. On the other hoof, it is very arguable that doing such a thing would have slowed the pace of the narrative for purely indulgent reasons, and I see that, so... take my minor complaint with a large Siberian salt mine.
I am very eager for more of this. You asked me for advice, and frankly, I have none, because what I am reading here is just plain great. I can see about six, maybe seven directions offhoof that this could be taken, some tragic, some various shades of tragic right up to happy, and I would not dare to suggest a one of them. I want to see what you will do.
This was just tasty.
Excellent. About time Celestia did something about that whole brainwashing BS which was very apparent in the original story. TCB is one of a few universes that would argue that getting completely brain-panned is a good thing.
I'm enjoying this - the trapped princess, whittling away at her prison. The corporate bastards who don't know and wouldn't care if they did... it's interesting to see the world taken in a different direction to my own
I find it really interesting that you're going with the software oriented style Equestria. Hope to see more detailing of the hows and whys in future chapters
1331249
Yup - there will be more, but I can't reveal much here without getting into spoilers!
This may be the programmer in me speaking, but how can Equestria be a simulation? So they discovered the underlying magical structures that governed their magical universe. Humans are now working on the discovery of the fundamental physical rules of our universe. Knowing these would not make our universe any less real.
This may be (ok, it is) a discussion about semantics but this really bugs me!
1333140
Think of it like a virtual machine. Programs running on an ideal virtual machine can't tell whether or not they're being virtualised or they are running natively on the hardware. But, if there are flaws in the abstraction then it is possible for a program to communicate outside of the virtual machine. To continue this analogy: Discord broke the sandbox and discovered the developer documentation lying around.
1333445
But that's my point: It's irrelevant to the actual programs whether it is a real machine or a virtual one. Discord and Celestia can access and manipulate the underlying rules of Equestria. For all practical purposes they are gods, simple as that.
The whole simulation-thing is superfluous magical technobabble!
... unless Dafaddah has something in store that requires and redeems it. Like maybe it's how Discord managed to become a sentient computer or how Celestia can survive as a head in a box.
1333550
I'm sorry I misunderstood your original point and you're right, it is at some level largely semantics.
Taking a shot in the dark, I'd say the reasoning has to do with how Equestria survived the thermonuclear warheads. If the physical manifestation of the universe is only a side effect of the thaumatic simulation then perhaps the destruction of the physical side has no/little impact on the simulation as a whole.
1333550>>1333445
This discussion is exactly what I was hoping might be generated by this story!
There are some similarities between thaumatic simulation and electronic simulation, and some major differences, one of which is that thaumatic simulation creates objects that are tangible in the real world (Electronic simulation is already in 2012 starting to catch up on that front - the Enterprise Holodeck is not an much a fantasy now as it was back when TSNG aired.)
The major similarity (in the TCB universe) is the practise of artificial intelligence as simulation of naturally grown intelligence. Both systems (magic and electronic) have achieved the ability to create objects with complex behaviours (spells/programs) some of which have become sufficiently complex to pass the Turing test (agent spells/artificial intelligences) including a category that has reached autonomy and self-awareness (personalities/Autonomous AIs).
Celestia, Luna and Dexter (Discord) were three such self-aware AIs, who were being groomed by a political entity called the Consortium to actually run a whole universe (if perhaps a small one). This was a job important enough to make sure it was done right before the real citizens moved in hence running it as a simulation first. And if this simulation didn't come out stable, press the great big reset button in the sky, and start over fresh.
This "expendability" is the basic difference between a simulated universe and for example, humanity working out the underlying rules of our universe (unless by this process we find out that our universe IS a simulation - which is actually a possibility being considered by physicists.)
Back to Celestia, Luna and Dexter. They were NOT aware that they were simulation. Although it was not detailed in the story, the intent was that they be gradually introduced to the full set of powers they would possess and their roles in the new universe. When that milestone was reached, the Equestria simulation universe would be separated from the parent universe of the Consortium, and the huge amount of energy needed to fully flesh out the new universe would be expended.
BUT - Celestia, Luna and Dexter were excessively complex AIs, and hyper-intelligent. Dexter found out about being a simulation before he was ready to be told, and he took it very badly indeed. His whole mentality at this point is: "It's all fake anyway - so who cares." What he did was get access to the keys of the part of the system that controls the substrate (physics) of the Equestria Simulation and separated into its own universe before the Consortium could react. Now, perforce, the new Equestria universe is much smaller and energy poor than was originally intended, which will have its consequences (foreshadowing!!!!)
Also, I wanted to create a scientifically plausible rationale for Discord's ability to warp reality and affect ponies, and the reason the Elements of Harmony can in essence re-set Equestria back to normal, as shown in The Return of Harmony. I agree it is still technobabble, but I find that easier to swallow than "hey, it's magic" as the explanation to everything.
HOWEVER: the real objective of this story is to examine the concepts of identity, self and belonging. Celestia has already once in her life faced a sudden and severe re-evaluation of her own sense of self and her role in society. She came to the conclusion that no matter her origin "Cogito Ergo Sum". She is a real person, and that her duty was to her herd - the survivors of Discord's depredations on the nascent Equestria (more about them in later chapters.)
The challenge Celestia faces in 2100 is no less momentous. She is separated from Equestria, perhaps permanently. Her current abilities and thaumatic energy come from the Equestrians left on Earth on Judgement Day, and the newfoals created from her blood (It was implied in the original Mankind Triumphant story that newfoals left on earth on judgement day all died.) At the end of this chapter, the memory of the birth of Equestria allows her to see that she is no longer Celestia of Equestria, but Celestia of Earth, and her duty is to all the earthly ponies (like the term?) who comprise her new herd.
One last disclaimer. I've been programming for over thirty years. I wrote assembly language for Zilog Z80, PDP-11 and IBM System 360 mainframe. Of course this will make me see the technical solution as more "rational" than the magical one. But as Arthur C. Clarke noted: "Any technology significantly more advanced than ours is indistinguishable from magic."
1334467
1334900
As an engineer, I see no real difference between physics, programming, chemistry, mechanics, etc. and permutations of magic. The only real difference is what happens in our reality and what doesn't.
Also regarding programming this story is sure making liberal use of GOTO commands.