All and all, Whinnistrad was a fairly nice town. The ponies didn’t seem to ask too many questions, and they seemed all too willing to leave other ponies to their own business. Still, Ditzy was glad to be leaving it at long last. Her boss had finally shown up to assess what could be done about the cart she had smashed in the process of interrupting Righteous Fury.
He had been furious, but her work record meant that she was too valuable an employee to simply let go. In the end, he decided that she’d at least be getting her pay docked for quite some time, as well as working a few extra hours
Nopony was happy about the outcome, but the money to replace the cart had to come from somewhere.
And there was one more thing that needed addressing, something her family had been asking about since it had happened.
“And they mentioned her father for some reason.”
Ditzy's good eye swiveled back and forth between her daughters and Time Turner, her ‘lazy’ one a few seconds behind, as she finished telling the story of her second summoning. Walking back to Ponyville was going to take some time, but Ditzy wasn’t a pegasus to begrudge ground travel. Besides, it made it easier to talk with ponies who couldn’t fly.
“Weird,” Sparkler said, rubbing at her chin as she walked. “What do you think they'd want with him?”
“Something to do with necromancy, no doubt,” Time Turned scoffed. “Lyra's skill with the craft is as much inherited as it is a natural gift. Before she was making a name for herself, old Harpsichord was quite the boogeypony.”
“Last I checked,” Sparkler spoke up, “magic wasn't something that got passed along bloodlines.”
“No,” Time Turner admitted. “But magical power is, and Harpsichord wasn't short on that, I can tell you. Plus, by the time Lyra would have been born, he would have been deep into the necromantic arts. And probably crazy enough to try and make it a family thing; at least, as far as Lyra was concerned.”
“How do you know so much about this anyway?” Sparkler turned her head to face Time Turner, an eyebrow raised. “I don't recall Lyra being all that open about her past.”
“One of the benefits of nearly a thousand years of experience,” he responded with a roguish grin. “I know how to get a good read on most ponies. Besides, Harpsichord was hardly a secret when he was at the height of his power, and I know Lyra's age; the rest is simple deduction. Takes a little while to get the technique down, but Chronomancers have a lot of time on our hooves.”
Sparkler still gave him a skeptical look. “Right...” she deadpanned, then turned back to the road ahead. “Okay, assuming all that's true, then what would they want with Mom?”
Time Turner's smugness went away as he scowled at the ground. “That... I have no idea about,” he finally admitted. “I mean, I'm definitely going to have a word with the town watch. If somepony is willing to go to the trouble of summoning her, I wouldn't put a bit of stalking past them.” He paused and then looked at Ditzy, placing a hoof upon her back as trotted beside her. “You are feeling alright? Mentally, I mean, right?”
Ditzy, having been lost in thought, blinked a few times to get out of her stupor as he addressed her. “O-oh, I'm fine.” She put on her best cheerful grin... as her eyes swiveled away from looking at any of them directly.
Even Dinky wasn’t convinced.
“Ditzy...” Time Turner stopped, as did Sparkler and her sister, all three of them looking at Ditzy as she refused to meet their gazes.
Eventually, the undead mare let her smile drop and cast her gaze down at the dirt. “I just.. I've been wondering... what if they're onto something?”
Sparkler's jaw nearly fell off. “Mom! You can't be serious about that!”
“I don't want to lose either of you... I know it's selfish, but... you're my babies!”
“I'm not a baby!” Dinky shouted, stomping one of her hooves in frustration. “And didn't you tell us to not do dark magic stuff?”
“Yes, but...”
“Butts are for crapping, Mom,” Sparkler cut her off, earning a half-hearted glare from Ditzy at her crass remark. “Don't start turning into a hypocrite on us.”
“More to the point,” Time Turner interrupted. “Given how much they seem to know about you, it's blatantly obvious they're trying to manipulate you. I may not know to what ends, but I know that those that resort to such chicanery are rarely up to much in the way of good things. Trusting somepony you know nothing about when they know everything about you is a fool's move. We all know you're smarter than that, Ditzy.”
As if to punctuate his statement, the chronomancer leaned over a gave Ditzy a quick kiss upon her cheek, making her giggle a bit and hide her face behind her wing. “Okay, I suppose you're right.”
“Of course I am,” Time Turner said, holding his head high as he trotted along, only to trip on a rock before Ditzy could call out to him. “...I really need to stop doing that when I don't have a recall point set,” he muttered from the ground.
Sparkler rolled her eyes, letting him pick himself up. “Anyway, so we're right back where we started: what do they want from Mom? I mean, they made it clear they know she's not a normal lich, and she's not interested in power, so...”
“I think I might be able to answer that, if you'll be willing to come with me.”
Everypony stopped in the middle of the road, looking around for the source of the voice, before Ditzy gasped in shock. “Wait a minute, I know that voice!”
“Hello, Miss Doo,” the cloaked mare that had summoned her seemed to appear out of nowhere, standing in the path before them. “Sorry to come calling again so soon, but our time table has been changed severely. We would like you to come with us. If you don't mind.”
Ditzy didn't move, simply standing far stiller than a living pony would have been capable of.
The cloaked mare sighed. “Please, Miss Doo, I am trying to help you. If you'll just come with me, we can offer you help in preventing all that you're afraid of.”
Sparkler stepped in front of her mother, glaring at the mare in the cloak. “I think she's made it very clear that she's not interested in joining your little club to defy death and play like you're gods. So beat it!”
The cloaked mare didn't respond immediately, simply shifting her head a bit to gaze at Sparkler more clearly. The unicorn's scowl wavered a bit as the seconds ticked on, her hooves twitching in place a bit before the cloaked mare finally spoke up. “You are... Amethyst, correct? Amethyst Star?”
Sparkler physically recoiled at the mare's words, then shook her head. “I– I don't use that name anymore, I haven't in years.”
“But that was the name you were given,” the mare pressed. “After your birth mother, wasn't it? You saw her die and you were barely older than ten.” She took a step forward. “Would you want another child to experience something like that? Wouldn't you stop it if you could?”
Sparkler opened her mouth to respond, but the words didn't come even as she worked her mouth several times.
“You know I'm right. Why deny what is true?”
“How about the fact you're making a lot of promises, but not telling how you're going to follow through on them.” Time Turner stepped around to face the cloaked mare, who turned her gaze to him now. “I mean, I'm sure your response is some variation of 'magic', but would you be able to go into more detail than that? 'Magic' is a very vague term, after all, and what you want to do is a pretty major endeavor. So, mysterious miss, care to tell us how you're going to retool how life itself works?”
The cloaked mare was silent as she looked at Time Turner, like she had been with Sparkler, but after several seconds, the hood of her cloak tilted a bit. “Strange... I can't read you.”
Time Turner smirked. “Another one of the benefits of being around several hundred years; you're not going to get into my noggin without a lot more effort than you're used to.”
Sparkler started, her glare snapping back into place as one of her eyes twitched. “You were in my head?”
The mare went back to being silent for a long moment, then sighed. “I had really been hoping to avoid this,” she said as she reached beneath her cloak. “But... well, it appears that things are going to be difficult.” She removed her hoof, carrying a small gem with it, before throwing the crystal down and letting it shatter upon the ground.
Nopony knew exactly how to respond to that, but Sparkler finally spoke up. “What was–”
A whistle interrupted her, just before Time Turner bellowed out “Down!”
Having had far more experience with such things than she liked to admit, especially prior to being adopted by Ditzy, Sparkler didn't even hesitate to drop to the ground despite her distaste for Time Turner. Just as well, too, as a translucent spear whistled over her head not even a moment later.
“Sparkler!” Ditzy's wings flared open as she got ready to take to the air, but a second whistle and spear put a stop to that, skewering her straight through both wings in one shot.
“I've still got it~” The melodious tone of a mare's voice preceded the rustle of leaves as an earth pony without a cutie mark stepped out from within a bush. “Hey there~,” she trilled. “Sapphire Shores, pleasure to meet you~”
The cloaked mare’s coverings shifted as she flinched, turning to the grounded pegasus. “Sorry about this, I would have preferred another way, but our hoof was forced by–” This time, she jumped back as a bolt of arcane energy shot at her.
“Damn, thought I could get her during a monologue.” Sparkler's horn was still smoking as she readied another bolt. “And why aren't you doing anything?” she yelled at Time Turner.
“I can't!” he shouted back. “That was a Still Time spell she set off! My chronomancy won't work on any events that happen here!”
“Pace has his uses~” Sapphire sang, followed by a “Hey~” A wall of sound sprang up and Sparkler's blast splattered against it. “You're outclassed, kid~” The earth mare flashed a flirtatious smirk at the unicorn. “Give it a few more years, and– Hey~” Another wall of sound sprang up, just barely matching Ditzy's hoof force for force as the limb slammed into it.
Cracks splintered around Ditzy's hoof, but – much like her wings – the wound wasn't even acknowledged as she reared back and slammed her other hoof into the barrier, shattering it as that hoof split with a sickening 'crunch'. “Stay away from my family!” The lich swung wildly at Sapphire, who just barely danced away from the blows.
“Whoa; careful there, you might–” Sapphire stumbled in mid-step, her body twisting as her eyes widened in shock, before she cried out in pain as Ditzy's broken hoof slammed into her barrel and sent her flying. “Wh-wha?”
“How's that for 'outclassed', bitch!” Sparkler's horn was still glowing as she gritted her teeth, Sapphire’s hoof still held in the unicorn’s magical aura. “Don't think I can't follow those steps of yours!”
“Please, stop resisting,” the cloaked mare pleaded. “We only want to help you!”
“You've got a pretty strange way of showing it,” Time Turner countered, standing in front of Dinky with his body lowered and preparing to spring at a moment's notice. “Considering you just attacked us and all.”
“A necessary evil. Surely, after living so long, a chronomancer–”
“Let me stop you there; in nine hundred and sixty-seven years, I've heard just about every permutation of the 'I'm only doing the bad stuff for the greater good' speech there is. So please, don't try and give it to me and think it'll be any different than them. If you actually believed that, you would have joined up with the Lunar Order by now.”
“They wouldn't listen!” the cloaked mare suddenly screamed. “They're too focused on the potential consequences to see the potential rewards!”
“And I could say the same thing about you in reverse,” he countered with a smirk. “That's the thing about your types of goals, once you start justifying the means by the end, your morality doesn't take long to start slipping.”
“Do not quote such fallacies at me,” she replied with a stomp of a hoof. “My ends do justify their means! Do you know what I could–”
“Yes, yes, what you could do, not what you will do. All you're doing is speaking in hypotheticals and potentials. You have nothing to stand on save for what might happen.”
“Can we have a debate some other time?” Sparkler shouted, blasting another arcane bolt at Sapphire just as she whistled again. “Having a fight right now!”
Sapphire managed to avoid the bolt as her spear slammed into Ditzy, knocking her backward as it impaled her. “Whoa, whoa, whoa~” A blast of sonic energy barreled into Sparkler, who dropped to the ground and conjured a shallow shield around her prone form. The sound waves hit her barrier, and washed over them like a wave, missing the unicorn entirely.
The second they passed, Sparkler was back on her hooves and charging up for another blast.
“Hey~” The bolt was intercepted by another wall of sound. “Neat trick, kid, but don't get–” Sparkler interrupted Sapphire by rushing forward, shooting off five bolts seemingly at random. “Hey~” The wall sprang up again, and the shots all impacted it in rapid succession as Sapphire recoiled a bit. “Wha?” That was all she managed to get off before Sparkler slammed her shoulder into the wall, causing it to shatter with a painfully out-of-tune cacophony.
It took a moment for Sparkler's ears to stop ringing following that, but Sapphire's head was outright spinning from having her spell smashed to bits by the unicorn. “Everything has weak points,” Sparkler said with a smirk, her horn flaring up once more. “Even spells.” This time, her bolt slammed into Sapphire's face, and she toppled to the ground in an undignified heap.
The cloaked mare looked back between Time Turner, Sparkler, and Ditzy as she got back to her hooves. Though her face remained hidden, the rapid movements of her head left little doubt of the expression beneath that hood.
“I'm guessing you didn't think this through,” Time Turner finally broke the silence between them.
“We underestimated one of her daughters,” the mare said in return. “But don't think we can't improvise either.” The mare suddenly let loose with a shrieking cry, words and phrases in countless languages all blended together and formed into such a garbled mush of sound that caused everypony to stagger back. Not wasting a moment, the mare rushed forward and barreled into Time Turner, knocking him aside before he could recover.
Still pressing her advantage, she grabbed Dinky with one of her hooves, and held her close even as she started struggling. “Hey! Lemme go!”
“Get your filthy hooves off my daughter!” Ditzy, now so enraged that thinking wasn't necessary for action, managed to charge forward on her broken hooves... only to pass straight through the mare and Dinky.
“You'll find that my bag of tricks runs deep,” the mare said as she turned around, standing firm under Ditzy's furious glare. More blows from the undead mare continued to pass through her body, and Dinky remained firmly held despite her struggles. “And that I can keep this up for quite some time.”
Time Turner groaned, finally pulling himself up off the ground as he tried to clear his head. “Time...” he muttered. “Time enough... for a distraction!” He suddenly turned back to where Sapphire had collapsed, only to find her up and scratching a symbol into the dirt with her hoof. She stomped on it, and a shimmering portal appeared in the air, just before Sapphire dove into it.
Time Turner shook his head once more, red light flickering around his hooves as he tried to get his magic to work, but nothing came. “Sparkler! The symbol, smash it!”
“Huh?” Sparkler had gotten the worst of the effects from whatever that mare had done and could barely stay on her hooves. Blinking her unfocused eyes, she tried to light her horn, but the glow fizzled before she simply fell the the ground, holding her head in pain.
“Ditzy, we have to–” Another of the mare's cacophonous shrieks had Time Turner joining Sparkler on the ground, and Ditzy barely able to stand.
Dinky's struggles continued for a moment longer before her body went limp in the mare's hold. “She's still alive,” the mare assured Ditzy. “She's just passed out. Come with me, and I can promise that's the worst that will happen to her.”
“Get, get your...” Ditzy's words became unintelligible as her breath ran out and she still kept trying to talk, but as another swing phased through the mare, Ditzy found herself sagging in defeat. “...okay.”
“I'm sorry about this,” the mare said as she trotted over to the portal, still carrying Dinky with her. “It's not how I would have preferred our next meeting to go. But, as I said, our hoof was forced.”
Time Turner groaned, light still flickering uselessly at his hooves as he tried to break through the Still Time spell. “Ditzy,” he gasped out. “Ditzy, please...” He fell back to the ground as his vision swam, watching as Ditzy paused just beside the portal to look back at him.
She slowly lowered her gaze to the ground, no longer meeting Time Turner's eyes. “Take care of Sparkler for me,” she said at last, before turned back and stepping through the portal and vanishing.
The cloaked mare, still holding the unconscious filly in her grasp, hesitated as she stood beside the portal herself. “For what it's worth,” she finally said, “I really am sorry about all this. You'll thank me for it one day.”
Time Turner mustered as much of a glare as he could at the moment, still defiantly trying to call up some form of a spell. “I wouldn't count on that, if I were you.” His voice was level, barely even harsh enough to consider what he said a threat, but the mare still shivered as she looked into his eyes.
Shaking her head, the mare said no more and simply trotted into the portal, the symbol on the ground blasted away as the tear in space snapped shut behind her.
Several moments passed before the Still Time spell wore off, and it was another moment longer before Time Turner and Sparkler managed to get their hooves back under them.
“What are you waiting for?” Sparkler snapped at him, still a bit pale from what the mare had done. “Do your thing, pop back and–”
“I've been trying!” Time Turner's bellow rang out loud enough that several birds took flight in fear. “Don't you try and tell me you can't sense my echoes! Or feel the chronomancy I've cast at least five times now! The Still Time spell has set my time line in stone; those events are fixed and I can't alter them!”
“Then what's the bucking point of you?” Sparker shouted right back. “You useless, sick, freak! You failed! You let my mom and sister get taken away! Now they're going to die, or whatever they plan to do with Mom, and it's all your Luna damned fault! You fu–”
SMACK!
Sparkler's entire head was left spinning as Time Turner backhoofed her right across the face, even managed to draw a bit of blood from a cut lip.
“Enough!” he shouted, looking angry for the first time Sparkler could remember. “You don't like me, that's perfectly clear, but yelling at me will do neither of us any good, nor will it bring back you mother and sister. Do you understand me?”
Her ears still ringing, and her face still sore, Sparkler could only nod mutely as she stared, wide-eyed, at the stallion before her.
“Good. Now get ready to run.”
Blinking a few times as Time Turner turned away from her, Sparkler finally found her voice. “Run?”
“We're going to going to Canterlot,” he responded curtly. “Now, move.” He broke off into a gallop at high speed, leaving Sparkler in his wake for several moments before she finally managed to catch back up to him.
“Why are we going to Canterlot instead of trying to track down my mom?”
“If they went to all the trouble of getting a kidnapping set up, they're not going to leave a scrying spell overlooked. And even if you tried to summon Ditzy back to us, there's no telling what they'd do to Dinky if she's not there.”
Sparkler winced as she ran; she hated to admit it, but she had been thinking about doing just that, and Time Turner was all too right about the risks it posed to Dinky. “So, why Canterlot?”
“Remember what Ditzy said they asked her about? If we want information about Harpsichord, we might as well go right to source.”
Sparkler found herself losing any of the spare breath she had as she galloped after Time Turner. “You think they're just going to let you talk to someone like Harpsichord? After everything you've told me about him, only the paladins are going to have access to him!”
“I'm calling in an old favor the crown owes me; you can get a lot of ponies in your debt in nearly a millennium of living.” With that, the conversation finally ceased and Sparkler ran out of breath to talk, the only sounds coming from the pounding their hooves. Canterlot wasn't terribly far, and both of them had quite the reason to hurry on despite their bodies' eventual protests.
In the back of her mind, Sparkler found herself quietly praying to Luna to keep her mother and sister safe from harm, and that Time Turner's favor was still in good enough standing for this. She'd already lost one family in her life; she didn't want to lose this one, too.
Ah yes, the ol' play of justifying one's actions in the name of the "greater good."
The only time the "greater good" justifies anything someone does is when they know that what they're doing is unjustified. But that being as it is...
The plot thickens.
So Sparkler is Amy now?
That is presumably the idea.
Might help.
You make a very valid point.
How unexpected.
Good, stopping that shit in its tracks.
Not putting up with this anymore apparently.
The only time when quoting 'For the Greater Good' is truly justified is when it is your life that you're ruining or giving up. If your 'greater good' requires you to force someone else to pay the price for you, then you should stop and reconsider your actions carefully.
Of course, as in all things sometimes it isn't that simple. Sometimes you're stuck in a situation where soul devouring monsters are rampaging through a city, growing stronger with each kill and the only means you have to contain them and stop them from destroying countless lives is to flood the city and drown the thousands of innocent people within it alongside the monsters.
Of course, there is a difference between a clear and present threat that you need to sacrifice much in order to fight and the possibility of a threat that only exists in prophecy. I feel like the fact that the farseer had been wrong about how the engagement with Derpy panned out (Almost to the point of complete failure) is pretty solid evidence that their method of seeing the future is flawed... and if it's flawed then long term predictions cannot be trusted or relied upon.
Of course... fortunes are interpreted by the farseer... and the farseer can have their own agenda and basis. They can also lie... or at the very least not tell the whole truth.
8135585 I must disagree with your statement. Murder is often considered an act of pure evil. But let's assume that in civilian life there is someone who keeps on hurting mass amounts of people, and animals for that matter, who keeps falling through the cracks of the justice system because they have the money and/or connections to get out of the judiciary punishment? And they have no intention on stopping what they do. The only way to save the people is by killing them, an act of evil. The murder in this case is highly justified and fits into the "for the greater good" reasoning.
And I agree that the plot indeed thickens beautifully.
8135808
Alas, we must continue to disagree on the issue of justification.
I will not, however, ever conclude that just because an action is not or cannot ever be justified, that this means it is not or cannot ever be necessary. Actions are black and white, but their impact varies greatly in size. In your example, we are left with the action of ending someone's life (objectively evil and overall with a small impact) and protecting the lives of many others (objectively good and overall with a large impact). The actions are black and white, but the size of the impact is different, and when taken together all we're left with is a shade of grey.
Aeww yeah! Shit got real! I love updates!
8135874 While, through my own view, I shall continue to disagree, I acknowledge your argument as valid and I cannot rebut it. The greater good argument is something that should be used sparingly. Inherent acts of evil used for the results of benefiting the masses and done unselfishly are, in my opinion, the rarest form of "Lawful evil", though others could also classify this as "Chaotic good". The overall sentiment in these words, moreover, helps your "Grey area" argument. Dropping bombs on a complex filled predominately with members of a terrorist organization. Now, Intel reports possible civilians inside but find no way of safely extracting them before the bombs are dropped, but the cache of weapons inside and the majority of their members are currently inside the compound. The bombs get dropped anyway, disregarding the hostages. They die, but so does the majority of the terrorists and their munitions cache is destroyed. This particular shade of grey is "Chaotic Good". Allow the same scenario, if you will, but change the response to bargaining with a newer member of the organization, offering them amnesty, money, and political protection, in return for poisoning the drinking water of those inside with cyanide. The act of bargaining with the new terrorist is treason, a terrible crime, and poisoning the enemy with lethal amounts of cyanide might be considered a war crime, but the result would end with the prisoners being safely removed from the compound and possibly more munitions for the troops. this section of the grey area would be labeled as "lawful evil".
As I typed this response, I felt it might come across as "I'm a military nut". Nothing is farther from the case. I simply like to look at situations that require strategy and apply what logic I can to see if the strategy is valid, and part of that analysis is the morality of it.
8136019
This illustrates a part of why the alignment system from D&D doesn't really work, since a lot of people have trouble understanding it. The particular scenarios you outlined above could not ever been considered "Chaotic Good" or Lawful Evil specifically because they involve both good and evil acts: Even in the pursuit of an arguably greater good, at best they can only ever be Lawful Neutral. ("Chaotic" wouldn't even apply here, because neither outcome is outside the bounds of order and law)
The inherent flaw with the D&D alignment system is that it doesn't allow us to accurately describe shades of grey because it doesn't have shades of grey, not really: A particular act either is or isn't evil, is or isn't lawful. Even the neutral alignments aren't really shades of grey; they just aren't black or white. This is a big part of why most RPG systems don't incorporate any kind of alignment spectrum; it's simple presence limits the role playing opportunities of the players, no matter how nebulously defined it is.
8136063 Perhaps I misworded my view. In this scenario, I was using those two as the end points of the gray area, and meant to use my personal interpretation within that. Loosely defined, chaotic good is destroying a building to catch a single person, while lawful evil might be described as using any means to obtain the end your reaching for, with the rider of calm is key, and therefore destroying entire buildings to apprehend or stop an unsub is out of the question for them, but bribery would be well within the bounds. I use the Boros and Orzhov as reference points for these definitions. The spectrum you outline probably has the Orzhov and Boris as end caps, while the rest of the spectrum might follow as such;
Orzhov, Dimir, Golgari, Simic, Selesnya, Azorius, Izzet, Gruul, Rakdos, Boros.
In case one wishes to research these terms further, be it you or someone reading our discussion, I refer to the Ravnican Guilds from Magic the Gathering.
8136019 'Chaotic good' would not murder a bunch of hostages in order to also get the bad guys. That's almost the opposite of chaotic good. That's lawful neutral, possibly lawful evil -- you're prioritizing punishing the criminals (law) over saving innocents (good).
Bargaining with someone on the inside even though they're a bad guy would be unlawful (aka chaotic) but you're doing it to save the hostages (good). So that's the chaotic good approach.
Either one would make a Paladin fall because they're required to be lawful *and* good.
Well, damn. What's next, reviving Tirak the first?
8136777
Man you've gotta love those ancient evils, always getting massive cults and conspiracies to revive them. Hell I'm surprised they haven't brought Grogar back in the MLP:FIM universe yet the only canon necromancer in any MLP universe.
I'd say something witty but I think at this point in time it's probably unwarranted with the shift of tone that things have taken so far.
8136510 You make a good point and I'm disappointed that someone would down vote your comment. Perhaps my understanding of the alignment system is incorrect. And if it is them I will gladly admit to it being so. And I'd like to thank both of you for conducting an intellectual debate with an exchange of ideas through mature and calm conversation. I see it more as chaotic acts are loud, boisterous, and often destroy things in pursuit of their goal, be it causing a lot of property damage to stop a criminal without any civilian casualties, or someone just going around annoying people to amuse themselves, or even just throwing giant balls of fire into crowded areas. If my understanding of the chaotic part of the scale is wrong, please inform me how so.
8136997
Wasn't Grogar already a part of this? I can't remember.
8137691
If I ever finish chapter one of Blue Knight and the Wind Mage. Their alignment will be Chaotic Neutral and Neutral Good, or something like that.
Is the Lunar Guard basically ninjas? Because I am going for that as the Blue Knight backstory.
Or I might make the whole thing is own separate universe if Absol gets angry with me or something.
8137691 There's that. Chaotic people (especially PCs) do often act without thinking and aren't slowed down by considerations like 'using fireballs in public is against the law', but if they're Chaotic Good they shouldn't be deciding to hurt people on purpose. If they accidentally fireballed a bunch of people they should feel bad about it (and do everything in their power to evade all responsibility because, you know. Chaos.)
You seemed to be framing it more as a considered decision, though, which is in the lawful archetype. Their task is to kill those terrorists, and dog-gonnit they're going to keep their promises. Other considerations are irrelevant.
8137792 Then that is my fault in not making that distinction and thank you for pointing it out.
8137727 I'll look fit it if you ever finish it, if only because it sounds interesting.
Would it be ok to ask yo get in on this I got a merc Pegasus who's bonded to four demon lords a shadow demon and 3 elementals twin fire and ice demons and a earth demon if anyone could help whoever you want to help its him I have him forbidden to interfere unless its putting the world at risk or a wars brewing or both which is happing besides he knows more about demonic and necromantic magic just saying necromancy and demon magic are close in some areas then most and is one of the few brave enough to down right to the faces call Celestia and Luna sun and moon butt with a grin plus he's really hard to kill he can die but returns years later sorta deal but has to work of the debt in hell which could be at the minimum 5yrs to a century depending on how big of a debt he works out for things if he's taking a slow revive to come back 5yrs if he has to rapidly come back in a fight it stacks up fast I can pm more details better Because I'm rambling now
8138691
Sounds a tad Mary Sueish.
Obligatory
Interesting chapter. A little conflicted about Time Turner smacking Sparkler so hard.
Also, typo:
One too many uses of 'going to'.
8137792
Well, there are other considerations that you can take that would suggest not saving the hostages, besides just punishing one group of criminals. Large corporations, for example, often have policies against bargaining with kidnappers or hostage takers because paying them off encourages other people to do the same. It's cold calculus but the aim is future crime prevention.
Which probably fits the argument that doing so is a Lawful Neutral stance at best, since large corporations aren't known for their beneficence and reasoned policies are usually Lawful.
8138994 I'm working on curbing he's power
8139581
Be Spiderman, not Superman.
8139655 so the fact there's limitations and rules don't count sure he could become immune to fire but the slightest bit of cold water is like acid and vice versa je become stone but its a support role someone's gravely wounded he can encase then in a dome while potent healing plants heal them or he could go deadly berserk but only for 5mins and only once a month any longer or used more then that will force he's body will kill itself and he's dammed for as long as he's cursed sure he may come back to life but he endures torcher until he does but stuff like that's optional so if you remove the near immortality and the 5mins of a one stallion army ability all he has is a way to heal those whom need it and a way to alter the battlefield or negate elemental effects used against him or he's ally's or those in need btw the elemental powers of fire and ice are bound to he's swords which anyone who can control the rage of a fire lord or the emotionless calm of a ice lord can use but the earth lord ability's are from a age old pact with he's bloodline that only those who truly deserve it and desire to protect and help others can use the second he try's to use it for personal gain its gone
8139655 and yes I know its a mouth full I'm not the best at grammar
8139697 If I may?
You have *way* too many ideas put onto a single character. With all that you've said, you could feasibly make 5-10 separate characters.
Oftentimes fine-tuning an OC isn't about curbing their power, it's about figuring out what you want them to be good at and molding their backstory and skills to support that general idea.
8139788 you do realize he's not a single character but 5 right he's the focus but he's skills come from four separate characters who lend him there power but I understand its just he was designed to fight demonic monsters
8135760 Unless putting your life on the line means detonating a suicide vest, I take it.
The greater good is a terrible reason for anything. Especially policy. No proper rationale is ever that quick and easy. If one must rely on clichés and generalities to justify one's actions, then it is almost a certainty they are wrong. You've then based those beliefs on merely copies of what others have told you, rather than thinking the reasons out for yourself.
If it takes you less than several paragraphs to explain TO YOURSELF why you're doing what you're doing, then question your own motives.
Unless, like me, you just don't give a rat's ass and want world domination and god powers because why not! Then it's all good!
8140893
Of course, there are a couple of rather important follow up questions one needs to ask about the whole 'We're removing Death' thing.
For example, have you just removed death or are you also getting rid of aging and illness? Have you also come up with a plan for starvation when populations start growing faster then the food supplies can keep up with? Will everyone gain regeneration or will they just fail to die from injuries that should kill them? Will everything stop dying or will it just be a selective race? If everything stops dying, how exactly are predators going to handle food? Do you have a plan to deal with the unending mega swarm of insects that will consume all in their path?
I feel as if the only person on team 'Greater Good' that has considered these questions and their horrifying answers is the Blighter, which is exactly why their doing it.
8141924 Nah, I'm just removing death since the side effects are gloriously horrifying!
I shall be most entertained.
8135760
That's not really justified either, it's just an excuse. One of the things I liked about Fallout: Equestria is that she justified every terrible thing she allowed to happen to her by saying it was For The Greater Good, and everyone around her was visibly distressed by this. Project Horizon did this too, but it was more of a "MY SINS ARE MINE TO BEAR AND I MUST ATONE" thing, which is also nice to see portrayed as a character flaw.
I will genuinely never understand why villains feel the need to threaten and assault the people that they're trying to get on their side, who they usually give all the answers they were asking about anyway in the very next scene. Like, genuinely, no idea where that started, or why it still gets used. Other than the author's perceived need for a fight scene.
The chronomancer appears to be caught in a time loop.
8186923
If you have to split hairs all day and hide behind the flimsy definition of a word in order to justify that something is good, it isn't.
She is still one of the worst characters I've ever seen. Every time she pops up I know I am not going to enjoy the scene because I know she is going to act one way and one way only, cruel. She is one of the cruelest, one-dimensional characters I've ever seen and it's unfortunate. as I thought disney had that category locked down.
Her entire character summery is.
Litterly the cruelest, worst character in the story, but dont worry shes a paladin and shes doing it to individuals that their society deems evil.
or tldr. Cruel Paladin.
And thats it. Thats her entire character in two words, and my only thought of the character is half as many words.
Disappointing.
8187301
I get the impression there that you read the first two lines of that comment and then ignored all the rest, because I was agreeing with you that she doesn't really come across as a fundamentally good person. I was just making an effort to be nuanced about it. Verbal and physical abusiveness is a bad thing. Deciding that hurting a certain person needlessly simply doesn't matter, because they belong to a category of person who don't have a right not to suffer, is textbook dehumanization. It's a very Nazi conception of justice.
It's something I like to call "partisan ethics." It's the attitude that it's not what you do that makes you a good or bad person, just who you do it to. It's what leads to countries declaring by law that murder is a horrible crime - and then turning right around and cold-bloodedly executing murderers themselves.
8188126
Oh no, I read it, honestly, this character just raises such bile in me that I will take any opportunity to complain about it.
8188189
It sounded like you were taking exception to something or other that I had said there, but fair enough.
I do kind of agree with you that the character comes across as rather one-note and clichéd, by the way. I don't think it's really a big problem in terms of the writing, though. The entire story concept hinges on being a mash-up of MLP and tabletop gaming tropes right out of Dungeons&Dragons, after all - I dislike the character as a person, but I don't really mind her being there. It's a pretty traditional kind of NPC type and fits well with the theme. The druid circle doesn't really have all that much more depth (or likeableness) to it either, but reflects an RPG character stereotype in much the same way.
8188218
Yes I suppose. But ive played borderline cruel paladins before they arent terribly hard to make not one dimensional. Give them a truly horrific backstory that pretty much justifies anything, give them scars, missing parts or reminders of what the evils of this world have wrought upon them. Shes just... evangelical thats it. Shes the preist that takes it far, righteous indignation without real passion beyond the stirring words of a book. It is the anger of the naive, which would be interesting if it was fleshed out but as it stands its just irratating.
Blah, I guess my main point is just how much of a downer she is on ever scene, every word and every action seems to be orginized to either make us hate her or create some convoluted bass ackwards way of excusing her actions and thats it. All her scenes are being a douche bag and justifying her behavior and frankly if you have to argue as much as it has been to try and convince someone they arent evil by way of saying "well technically..." Then your arguement isnt good enough.
8188296
I suppose you're not wrong there. Still, though, I don't think that you should really expect that kind of seriousness and depth of character from this story. It's a beer and pretzels tabletop session against a bunch of Power Rangers villains, pretty much. I mean, really, one of them is an evil pop star who sings people to death. At some point, I think it's fine to just go with the flow and accept that a story is just being a bit of shallow fun for its own sake. Righteous is the character you love to hate. That's an effective kind of writing, too.
8188390
Yeah you got me there.
Im enjoying this story alot now that i sat down and got to read it. Cant wait for more!
The plot, it thickens so much, you can cut it with a +2 magic sword.
This is just a stab in the dark, but I get the feeling that cloaked mare might be Twilight.
After all, Shining Armor is desperate to believe anyone can be redeemed... and her destiny would have changed the most, with no Celestia to mentor her. Whatever her life is like, it can't be like the one she led in canon.
This story seems to shy away from the main characters of the show, and I expect to be wrong about this, but with such a buildup towards this character's identity, I expect it to be important.
8138691
...Don't ask somebody to include your overpowered OC in their story. How is that even supposed to fit in?