• Member Since 29th Jan, 2013
  • offline last seen 8 hours ago

Third Wave


E

How far would you go to investigate a scientific discovery that went completely counter to everything you ever knew? Twilight Sparkle is about to find out for herself. After a party at Pinkie's leaves her questioning the most basic laws of the universe, Twilight embarks on a journey that will put her at odds with one of Equestria's most basic tenets: the sunrise and sunset.

Chapters (1)
Join our Patreon to remove these adverts!
Comments ( 18 )

This should be getting a lot more attention than it is. I can safely say that both the concept (as it is scientific) and the execution are better than my own Celestia conspiracy story, which garnered something like 20 upboats. It's frustrating, because it would benefit so much from being put in the Sci-Fi group, but does it actually count as science fiction if it's just science and not technology?

:pinkiesmile: I look forward to your future work.

3138940 It's called "science fiction" for a reason. If it's a story focusing on science, it would fit better than most other stories using that label in that group.

I agree with Razzle, this is fantastic, and I'm surprised it's received so little attention.

Thank you all. :twilightsmile:

3138940
I'd say it definitely counts as science fiction.

“Aah! What is is Twilight?”

That should be "What is it".

She could pursue the letter and Celestial would ha e no suspicion about what Twilight was researching.

"ha e" should be "have".

going behind her hack like this.

"going behind her back like this."

He wiped an army across his eyes and nose.

"arm"

for another minute.looking up at

There shouldn't be a period in the middle of this sentence.

This was disappointing, to say the least. What, did all the pamphlets just poof out of existence? Did everyone who read them just forget and go about their lives? Are unicorns still so superstitious that moving the sun and moon is the only claim to legitimate rule, and if so did none of them read the pamphlets? And what of the now-widespread knowledge of Abraxas and his fate, which at this point seems like a more serious accusation than the millenia-old fraud of moving the sun and moon?

This started out well, but ended with what amounts to a diabolus ex machina that didn't even pretend to resolve the loose ends.

(That leaves aside the common theory that the Elements of Harmony only target evil, hate, and similar, rather than being an all-purpose weapon against anyone they're aimed at.)

At the very least, this is missing the "Sad" and "Dark" tags, as a warning against anyone who might expect a good ending.

3139067
3140411

Good, cause I put it in the group regardless of what the outcome may have been.

Twilight is Giordano Bruno!

Gotta say I like this story and see potential in it, showing Twilights examination of the course of the planets and how she discovered how the solar system looks is good to see in a fanfic.

Though, like any nitpicker, I've got a few questions/things that could be addressed to improve it.

1. What about astronomers in Griffon or Zebra lands? I'd like to think that Equestria isn't the only civilized nation on the planet (which is apparently Earth instead of a world in another solar system) and someone else may have tried studying the stars before. At the very least, Twilight could come across legends and myths from other races on how they think the sun and moon operate and could have made her observations to prove that Celestia and Luna move the sun and moon (instead of having the celestial bodies get carried by giant spiders or something like how other myths say they work).

2. Wouldn't Celestia and Luna have some kind of fall-back dogma after all these years? Maybe instead of lifting the sun and moon every day, they set the course of the sun and moon and gently "nudge" them into better positions whenever they go off course? Or that Celestia does move the planet relative to the sun and that Luna moves the moon relative to the planet? Or that there are multiple planets in the solar system and Celestia and Luna move them all... so this way she can "raise the sun" for multiple worlds and that Equestria is just the best of all those worlds since the Diarchy makes Equestria their home.

Basically, when you've been around for a thousand years and have to keep a lie going, its good to have a few buffers between the dogma and the truth if you don't like executing ponies.

3. What about when Discord was moving the sun and moon around like crazy? Was that an illusion or was he doing a helluva lot of celestial pinball to make them move like that without the planet ripping apart?

4. What happens if they need the Elements of Harmony again? Do they gather up all Twilights friends, have them free Twilight, explain the situation to her, and have Twilight save the day again several hours or days after the third Pony Apocalypse has started? I really think that Celestia and Luna should have considered how important Twilight is the the continued physical existence of Equestria in relation to her threat against one aspect of Equestrian Culture and politics.

5. How does this line up with Lunas turning into Nightmare moon? If Luna cannot control the movement of the moon or the day/night cycle then how does that change the existence of Nightmare Moon and her motivations? (One idea I can throw out is that Luna does actually have the power to enter into ponies dreams and thus does have an association with the night, and her time as Nightmare Moon was more of her terrorizing ponies in their dreams or bringing about an age of suspicion or a militaristic grab for power that Celestia had to end.)

6. Wouldn't Celestia prefer to negotiate with Twilight, explain the situation, and then hammer out some kind of deal to advance scientific knowledge without threatening the political situation? Jumping right to a trial seems a bit less manipulative than the Celestia we know and love.

7. ...why would Twilight build a printing press when she could probably cast some kind of scroll duplication spell to make a hundred copies of her pamphlets and then teleport them all over Manehattan and Fillydelphia? If Twilight is smart enough to know that this information could be considered a threat to Celestia and that she already executed one astronomer over it, I think she could be more careful with how she distributes her message.



But those are just kinda minor nitpick things and I gotta say that I love how Celestia mentioned Sunset Shimmer. I'm kind of a fan of Sunset Shimmer at least as an example of one of Celestias failed students (How she acted in the movie didn't seem that impressive, but I could blame her actions on being a unicorn who spent several years in a human body in some kind of High School universe. I would love to see a fic where Sunset is shown as a brilliant unicorn but after entering the human world starts going a bit nuts and bitchy due to losing all her magical powers and living in a sort of exile in a nonsensical mirror universe). It's little touches like that which remind the reader that it is canon that Celestia has run into problems before.

Come to think of it, Celestia and Luna could have shoved Twilight into the Equestria Girls universe as punishment for her slander and then posted guards (and maybe a thick slab of metal) around the mirror so she doesn't suddenly pop out the next time the portal opens.


Anyway, love the story, can't wait to see your other work, and hope this criticism is suitably constructive.

3140590
Thank you for the criticism and pointing out the typos. The story was a focus more on Twilight than on the wider ranging effects of the discovery, so what happens to Equestria after the fact is left vague intentionally. Sorry the ending was disappointing for you. I was on the fence on adding the dark tag, but I will now. I figured the tragedy tag would be enough for there not being a happy ending.

3142339
Thanks! Your points are very constructive. Some of the points are things I just didn't think about while writing the story, like using magic to duplicate the scrolls. The printing press was just the first thing I thought of. And going straight to the trial was an impulsive move for Celestia, plus when she got to the town hall she needed a show of authority for the rest of the ponies there.

1. What about astronomers in Griffon or Zebra lands? I'd like to think that Equestria isn't the only civilized nation on the planet (which is apparently Earth instead of a world in another solar system) and someone else may have tried studying the stars before. At the very least, Twilight could come across legends and myths from other races on how they think the sun and moon operate and could have made her observations to prove that Celestia and Luna move the sun and moon (instead of having the celestial bodies get carried by giant spiders or something like how other myths say they work).

I thought about that a bit since in Dragon Quest the dragons don't seem to respect Celestia as the demigoddess she is, so other species probably have their own myths, but I didn't really think about Twilight finding them. When Twilight is at the archives she's specifically looking for books about Abraxas, and there wouldn't be many books about it in the Ponyville library. There's probably some information on the gryphon myths in the archives, but little if any from other societies outside of Equestria. And I just called the planet Earth for simplicity's sake.

3. What about when Discord was moving the sun and moon around like crazy? Was that an illusion or was he doing a helluva lot of celestial pinball to make them move like that without the planet ripping apart?

Discord was either an illusion or his chaos magic is actually powerful enough to move the sun and moon (or just making the planet spin really fast).

4. What happens if they need the Elements of Harmony again? Do they gather up all Twilights friends, have them free Twilight, explain the situation to her, and have Twilight save the day again several hours or days after the third Pony Apocalypse has started? I really think that Celestia and Luna should have considered how important Twilight is the the continued physical existence of Equestria in relation to her threat against one aspect of Equestrian Culture and politics.

Basically, yes. That's partly why they keep the statue close by, in case the Elements are needed.

5. How does this line up with Lunas turning into Nightmare moon? If Luna cannot control the movement of the moon or the day/night cycle then how does that change the existence of Nightmare Moon and her motivations? (One idea I can throw out is that Luna does actually have the power to enter into ponies dreams and thus does have an association with the night, and her time as Nightmare Moon was more of her terrorizing ponies in their dreams or bringing about an age of suspicion or a militaristic grab for power that Celestia had to end.)

Ooh, I like the dream theory! I've heard some theories that Nightmare Moon's return takes less than a day, Within the context of the story, I'd say NMM was bluffing or that they actually do have the power to move the sun and moon, but don't.

And I like your theory about Sunset Shimmer. It actually makes a lot of sense.

And thanks again for the comment, glad you liked the story.

Interesting idea. The delivery needs work though.

3155989

Another theory on Nightmare Moon. It could be that Luna has a degree of mind control (sort of a combination of hypnotism, being an authority figure, and the power to enter peoples dreams) and could make people 'think' that the night was lasting forever. Just like how a hypnotist can make people forget the number eight exists which results in them thinking 3 + 7 = 11, Nightmare Moon could have brainwashed ponies into thinking it was constantly night time.

Basically, Nightmare Moon uses mass brainwashing to make ponies forget that the sun exists, causing them to erroneously believe that it is always night outside (even when it's a really bright night, you know... the kind where the moon gets so bright that that you can't see the stars as well and all the animals come outside?). This would have no danger of destroying the ecosystem but would result in alot of ponies not being able to recognize how the world actually works.

The things we do for science. Never test a theory if you're not prepared for a surprise....

This story is underrated.

There's only one thing that bothers me.

The truth is already spreading, within a few weeks every pegasus will likely know of Abraxas fate, if they don't already. Since we know from Hearth's Warming Eve, Pegasi are warriors at heart, then no matter how this story ended, the end of the peace between races is inevitable, there's no way for it to end without either the truth, the ENTIRE truth, coming out... Or a civil war that will destroy Equestria forever. What Celestia doesn't understand, if that in a case like this, a symbol and matyr, are one and the same. This is a fact that depeserately needs recognition in this story... You cannot stop the truth, for eventually, all shall be known.

It's good, as far as it goes. But it badly needs a sequel/fixfic. :twilightsmile:

Twilight should have blasted Celestia and Luna with the elements. They literally gave her them.

Alright, this was bad enough for me to leave some rhetorical questions I had while reading.
If Twilight managed to figure out that the planets revolve around the sun, why didn't she do the same with the moon?
If she had this much breathing room after Celestia heard about the pamphlets, why didn't she focus on spreading more?
If this many ponies heard about her theory and believed her, why weren't they ever mentioned again?
Why does the trial read like you have no idea what a trial is?
And why are all good ideas doomed to be wasted by a half-assed execution?

Login or register to comment
Join our Patreon to remove these adverts!