The Conversion Bureau 769 members · 387 stories
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You see, one thing I can’t help but feel bothered by involving Conversion Bureau stories are these:

1. With many exceptions, the stories are often not the most developed, nor do they seem to be keeping themselves from getting too confusing.

2. The characters from Equestria often seem to become too OCC, particularly Celestia, Luna, and the Mane Six.

3. Many times, it seems like the humans lack development and depth, as well as intelligence, cussing being a particular example.

But, that is where I come in.

I’m interested in trying to create my own Conversion Bureau story. One that can give new life to the genre.

It won’t be done right away, but, I will formulate how I want to go about doing one. I’m interested especially in trying to incorporate Jesus into the mix, as well as give messages that are Biblical or relate perfectly with the Bible.

That is something I plan on doing somewhere in the future.

I hope you all like my thoughts.

6660888

Religion in stories?, not always the best idea. I can already tell the outcome of this, either humans win or the two sides are locked in a stalemate and an armistice will be signed that will be drawn up by Jesus Himself or some high level religious figure.

6660888
i wish you the best of luck in this endeavor. i havent found msny stories on this site like the one you sre proposing,
Just be ready for negative feedback when it comes out. i

It's a decent idea. Many, maybe most, conversion bureau stories are misanthropic to one degree or another. The ones that aren't are made in response to the above, and are anti pony.
The religion idea is going to be hard. It's a huge part of who I am, and I suspect it's the same with you. But as StormLuna says above, it's going to lead to a form of conflict. Battles of theology are going to happen in your story and comment section.
One story that did this in a successful way is "Founders of Alexandria" by Starscribe. The main character quotes from the Bible, The Book of Mormon, the Quran, and another holy book I can't remember at the moment. The conflict there wasn't who was right, is was against an otherworldly entity. The books were used as a collection of principles that are applicable everywhere.

6661111
There’s one thing I’m definitely plan on doing for all stories I make.

I want to make sure I don’t get too political or preachy in any of my writings, so, that’s something I’m definitely hoping to do: To incorporate Christianity into the mix while also not getting too preachy or political, kind of like what Dreamworks The Prince of Egypt and Disney’s The Hunchback of Notre Dame did.

...not sure what to say. For me it seems in 'our' part of the world (russia, usa, europe ...) Christiantiy long ago become ..a bit like Communist Party of Soviet Union in worst sense of it ..Like, something you supposed to learn and practicate, yet in very wrong-biased, self-contradicting way. Also, trying to _really_ imagine place and time ~2000 years ago is not easy, if you really start to think about all this. We _assume_ we really know how people (humans) lived and what they really believed, back then, but ...it seems more recent times sounds much louder than real 'voices' from the past. And voices from the past can be wrong...if you listen only to them.

For me big point about difference between ponies and humans was ..ponies can control, directly or indirectly parts of their own behavior, individual and collective, humans never mastered to required levels. May be because we really can't? I mean, if our behavior only partially defined by 'bioelectrical' half-part of it and patially defined by bio-chemical half of it ..No amount of will will able to change some aspects with ease. So, whole idea about changing ourselves must be re-thought, in much greater depth. become art , love , engineering and science (all-in-one) of humanity. So, if ponies actually were created by being(s) who knew ~as much as we know about ourselves today + some unknown amout of knowledge for actually trying to re-balance beings with decent success .... their story might be different from our. They might have their own social / magical evolution, even probably must develop some very dynamic way to rebalance themselves in dynamic world. And if such beings will theorize about different kind of psychologies..they can come up with theoretical humans, and even meet some examples of their worst thought experiments ... and try to explain what they learned to human(s). Will human(s) {Jesus or someone else from his era and surroundings} listen - is open question...How one can talk about biochemestry centures before even alchemy was born (i think i stealed this from Carl Sagan)? How humans can carry one desire to cure themselves via blend of art/engineering/science from just idea to actual results, without failing into power traps, as real humans in our history nearly always failed? How they can defend themselves from ..more dominant humans of their era? Can ponies be 'game-changing' (history-changing) factor, even in just our accurate enough imagination?

In short, i think 'std. Christianity story' is not very good idea today - but story with heavy thinking is always good one.... With all those debates about heavens and stars (and making wars and such) humans [or at least part of them, wanted to call themselves 'most progressive'] already wasted nearly 2000 of years ... this thought alone can [and should!] make you ..unhappy.

... addition: by 'little biochemistry problem' here I mean something along the lines from https://www.huxley.net/bnw-revisited/ :

But even the most stoical dog is unable to resist indefinitely. If the stress to which he is subjected is sufficiently intense or sufficiently pro­longed, he will end by breaking down as abjectly and as completely as the weakest of his kind.

Pavlov's findings were confirmed in the most dis­tressing manner, and on a very large scale, during the two World Wars.

well, why very basic (as it seems after fact) discovery about broke-ability of so-called 'human nature' only come so late?! May be it was formulated much earlier, but was lost .. somewhere? How science based and born out of real respect for various live beings may look? (imagine Descartes literally failing in love with dolphin, instead of propagating some hardcore belief about non-existence of non-human thinking). Imagine trying to come up with _any_ working solution to built-in disbalance in humans, knowing direct manipulation of source matter will not come until centuries later...

6660957
Or what you could is either

  • Have God abandon mankind leaving it Celestia if she's dumb enough to put up those ungrateful humans or even allow Equestria to expand into our world and forcing humans to get ponified or die as a punishment (humans collectively sinned too much=everyone lose their human form)
  • A story where all of the savior myths of the world religions is, in reality, the collective unconscious of humanity being aware of the future coming of Equestria and the Conversion Bureaus (a cross between Carl Jung and Joseph Campbell) but it's distorted by the preconceived notion of each religion (such as the need to make sacrifice to appease the gods, which leads to the belief that the savior must die and rise again).

6663521

Have God abandon mankind leaving it Celestia if she's dumb enough to put up those ungrateful humans

Celestia has enough on her plate already, I doubt she'd want to put up with us too. I think Cadence would be better. She could spread her love and light and cause us to become less warlike and maybe at least tolerate one another.


6663521

allow Equestria to expand into our world

Question, would Celestia really want to annex a polluted world.

forcing humans to get ponified or die as a punishment (humans collectively sinned too much=everyone lose their human form)

Death seems a bit harsh don't you think? If ponification must happen, at least let the human choose what type they would want to me.....personally I'd choose to be an Alicorn. If that weren't an option, then I'd choose unicorn. At least with magic you don't have to write with your mouth.

1. With many exceptions, the stories are often not the most developed, nor do they seem to be keeping themselves from getting too confusing.

You’ll have to take this up with the individual writers. Tell the writer what is confusing and ask for clarification.

2. The characters from Equestria often seem to become too OCC, particularly Celestia, Luna, and the Mane Six.

What is “OCC”?

3. Many times, it seems like the humans lack development and depth, as well as intelligence, cussing being a particular example.

This is an accurate representation of the majority of the human population.

I’m interested in trying to create my own Conversion Bureau story. One that can give new life to the genre.

That’s great, but do us all a huge favor and write your own world for it. You see, I’m tired of everyone copying the Chatoverse (the one with the expanding barrier and poisoned hyper corporate earth). Most people are not dedicated enough to do the research needed to pull that off, so if you can write anything else that happens in some other setting, that would be a great start toward that giving new life part.

I’m interested especially in trying to incorporate Jesus into the mix, as well as give messages that are Biblical or relate perfectly with the Bible.

Ok, Aslan… Actually, not ok. There is no need to name drop or make connections to biblical passages in any story. If you wish to inspire people to acts of goodness, you must do so by showing why such acts are valuable, and if these acts are valuable they must stand on their own without the need of “celebrity endorsement”. If, however, you wish only to demand that people believe in the same stories that you do, then stories of stories do not work well for that purpose, but without a change in how a person acts, why would it matter to you that others believe that these stories should be fact or fiction?

What is “OCC”?

“OCC” means “Out-of-Character Character”.

6670584

why would it matter to you that others believe that these stories should be fact or fiction?

I’m not wanting or expecting people to believe in the same thing I believe in. My real intention is only to share what I believe in, as well as make something really fun out of it through my writing.

Chatoyance
Group Admin

6672937
There are several problems with your notion of mixing Jesus and Christianity into science fiction such as 'The Conversion Bureau'.

Assume, for a moment, that the specific god of the Old Testament (and New!) is real. Assume also that the Christian bible is also literally the word of god, and not just a collection of bronze-age fables. Assume that god, being god, really has powers, and can not only shape destiny, make the universe and 'inspire' biblical authors - he can also accurately know the future.

Where in the bible is the arrival of Equestria, the introduction of intelligent, technological ponies, and the capacity to transform humans into them referenced? Any god worth the title should have been able to see that one coming. Indeed, it would be such an important and profound event that it should have several books just about this subject. And, honestly, they should be clear and not muddled poetry about vague notions. There should be a 'Book Of Celestia' in there.

I can see one way to do just that: you could have biblical scholars find new Dead Sea Scrolls in a jar that feature the missing books of the bible... but... that also presents a problem. How could god let an error like that happen? Okay, maybe god didn't want the books known until the arrival of Equestria happens... maybe that could work... but then there is the issue of having anyone believe that the scrolls are real and not fakes. There is that problem with the existing Dead Sea Scrolls right now... and some of the scrolls were fake - there's an ongoing lawsuit - so... that's a complex issue. Also, the content of the Dead Sea Scrolls pretty much changes Christianity in massive ways if they are true. So... kinda iffy.

Now, I understand, you could argue that the bible never predicted the moon landing, or the internet, or world war two, or the atom bomb, or... pretty much anything real about history (wild poetic interpretations of animal symbols and 60-foot high women riding giant dragon-snakes aside), so why would god bother to include Equestria arriving?

Because it changes the entire world and the nature of mankind. That is important enough by far.

Let's say you are not an Anti-Bureau troll, and you actually care about, and value, humans being transformed into ponies. Let's say you are here because you actually appreciate, like and enjoy Bureau fiction and the dream of getting to live in Equestria as a pony. Surely, having the human race become ponies would be something the bible should talk about. Jesus should have mentioned it. But he did not.

Let's say you are some low Anti-Bureau troll trying to write a 'destroy the ponies' story. You have even more of a problem. Defeating an invading universe, is difficult, and is a god-level-intervention event. That should be a biblical prediction! Also, by biblical standards, Celestia would be offering humanity a choice of paradises - that means she is the competition to god's heaven, literally Pepsi to god's Coke. She's Burger King to McDonalds. God is, by his own words, hella jealous "I am a jealous god!". He said that. So... Celestia and ponies would be the single greatest threat to god in that case, far worse than any satan. Celestia, with an alternate heaven, would literally be encroaching on his turf, offering his customers a very attractive alternative. God should have mentioned this danger in the bible!

Put bluntly, there is no place in proper science fiction for Jesus and god. Because: science! But more importantly, because: ponies! Science has no room for god, because there is no evidence of his necessity. But the bible has no room for all of humanity transforming into ponies because there is no text supporting anything even vaguely like that. Or space travel. Or computers. Or the internet. Or the atom bomb. But especially alien ponies from another universe with different physical laws and super powers human call 'magic'.

And that is the problem with trying to cram Jesus - or Allah, or any earthly god or goddess - into a Bureau story. It becomes impossibly ridiculous the moment you consider the bible. Either the bible is wrong and/or incomplete - in which case god isn't doing his job well - or god deliberately didn't think to mention the single biggest event and/or threat to his cosmos in the only book he ever wrote... in which case... is god senile? Afraid? What would make god forget to mention such an important thing?

I've considered this a great deal, because I consider everything I can. One possibility is that being converted and getting to live in Equestria literally is god's big reward for mankind. Equestria is heaven, and god made Celestia, an angel, to do his work on earth. It's the end times and salvation is being transformed into a pony. That's one thought I left for the last, because it was the only one that I could come up with that might work at all. Maybe you could try that route: it is true that Lauren Faust specifically envisioned and described Equestria as 'the Elysian Fields', which - apart from the original Greek religion - has become an allusion to any heaven. Indeed, that is why, in the cartoon, Tartarus is literally appended to Equestria, just as it is to Elysium in the myths. I myself have played with this notion of Equestria as heaven in my short story Brand New Universe: Six - The Deserving Ones. You might want to give it a read to get some ideas along this line.

6673897
If it’s all the same to you, I’ll be working out how to make it all work myself.

Clearly, you really also don’t understand anything involving Jesus, the Bible, and Christianity.

Yes, the Bible never talked about any wars happening after its completion, but it does talk about what can cause them to happen, such as greed, ambition, and lust for power. And yes, it never talked about Equestria, but I do plan on working how they can fit. The Chronicles of Narnia were certainly able to work how to make a parallel world, as well as build up so many things relating to God, such as Aslan and his sacrifice for everyone.

And no, I’m not some sort of Anti-Bureau troll. It’s just...in every way, I find there to be so many flaws in the genre. My only real intentions are just to try to build something different and give new life, as well as to only share what I believe in. To me, Jesus’s lack of involvement is the biggest flaw, which is why I want to include him in some way.

Chatoyance
Group Admin

6673970
Maybe you could have Jesus come back as a pony. That would actually be pretty cool. He could use Christian magic to transform people so they could join Equestria!

I did a web search for Jesus Pony. I got this:
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Jesus%20Ponies
It's slang for dinosaurs. The closet thing I can recall in MLP that are dinosaurs are dragons. Spike is a dragon. Spike is a Jesus Pony. Fuck yeah. Kiding aside I think Spike would make a good Jesus. I mean he was raised by Celestia and Twilight's parents. One of them could be considered a god. Twilight raised Spike and she become kinda of a god in training. Spike could be said to be son of god.
Pardon this tangent.

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